|
Member
Forum Idol
Join Date: Jan 09, 2001
Posts: 125,090
|
https://web.archive.org/web/20070225...ptheshark.com/
- Other Thoughts:
The Daphne/Niles thing is too open and obviously never will be consummated. It can no longer be played for laughs
Hasn't jumped yet alot of life left with ol Marty
This past season, when every episode seemed to be a "Three's Company" episode with everyone involved in a "misunderstanding" that led to "wacky situations" A once brilliant show is still darn good, but "Seinfeld's" time slot? What is NBC thinking. "Friends" just came off their best season yet.
The very last Niles and Daphne episode when she "clearly" heard him in Frasier's kitchen talking about how much he loved her just for her to assume he was talking about being totally in love with another woman. While I still think the show has a lot of good episodes, I'm tired of this thread. If Daphne doesn't know that Niles is in love with her by now, she's just been a zombie all these years. I'm not going to break my neck trying to rush home to see this anymore. It fell out of grace with this episode.
Fraiser is one of the few that has retained its freshness. Yes, they have had a few bad episodes but hell, we all have bad days. The question is, will they pull the plug before they reach the shark tank? My feeling is that it lurks in the not too distant future.
It's a great show , and I wish that Niles and Daphne would stay subtle yet blatant as before or just get together to end the whole thing .
The arrival of the Three's Company plots --they're horrible!
When Roz got pregnant.
Why did Roz have to get pregnant???????? The only character I could relate to, but now it's gone, just gone!
This show is saved by some very good ensemble work - the plot work is nothing special at all, pretty much standard sitcom fare. Niles virtually holds the show up by himself. The writers are very good, however, at witty bon mots. They need to realize that a lack of strong and consistent plotting is their Achilles heel.
When someone thought Frasier Crane would make a good spin-off from Cheers. Niles and Daphne getting together? Oh now they're reaching at straws, aren't they?
The plots&cast became really short and empty after Fraiser lost his job at the station.
Too much of Niles and Daphnne. ENOUGH already. He is not with his wife, so why don't they let him and Daphnne get together. A whole new twist to the show.
Last show of last season - Frasier and all at the radio station lose their job. Although the station played a small part in the physical structure of an episode, this year's episodes seem to be missing the contact with Bulldog, Giles, Roz etc. as well as the 'fame' the radio programme gave Frasier. Roz seems to drop in for her token 30 seconds per show - the baby being a forgotten story line - but otherwise, ... Meanwhile, Frasier seems to be living awfully well for an unemployed person. Has Niles lost his infatuation for Daphne? This seems lacking this year, too.
The show desperately needs a change. I realize that sex between main characters is often a shark jump, but how about Daphne and Niles getting it on? Then Daphne has an excuse to get another job, instead of her long useless job of caretaker. niles uptightness would play off well with easy going Daph. Daph not knowing about Niles is old and silly. (And please stop the poor writing and get some sophistication back into the script instead of silly misunderstandings and overhearing the wrong thing, like Three's Company)
When Frasier lost his job at the radio station, I miss Bulldog and don't like Frasier being unemployed and Niles being poor.
Using Lilith once is ok, but she's been on at least twice, and Sam has been on once. The show must exist on it's own. I almost expect Norm to be in Frazier's apartment when he comes home.
Niles' constant lusting after Daphne has gone from cute to creepy -- if this was real life, she would have taken out a restraining order years ago. I can't watch in anymore.
When each episode started being a farce, when one person would overhear and misunderstand another then all wackiness would ensue a la Three's Company.
Truly Funny!
When it moved to Thursday nights this season. I was so rooting for it, too, but I just can't take it anymore. I can't even look at any of them anymore without getting a rash. All that kvetching used to be funny, but now it just makes me want to rescue Eddie the dog while there's still time.
Frasier has never tried to do anything interesting or to say anything new, and is watchable only by virtue of occasional decent writing and good acting. It is a catalogue of every sit-com cliche in the book -- spin-off, intergenerational conflict, inter-cultural conflict, unresolved love, singles not getting enough sex, singles getting too much sex, workplace, etc., etc., etc. If they tried to cram one more cliche, the show would have to be an hour long. The problem is, this show could very easily have pushed the envelop, but it just leaned back and rested on its laurels. Now there is no chance. Time to stop watching.
This show jumped as soon as Frasier lost his job and wasn't on the radio. All of a sudden, they had to fill a whole show w/ plot and they couldn't do it - the jokes were forced, the plots were repetetive, and it was just boring. Frasier on the phone was the funniest part of the show! As soon as Frasier was off the air, this show jumped. However, he's back on now so maybe there is still hope that it will come back.
This is a prediction, when Daphne finds out that Niles is in love with her, Fraiser will jump the shark.
I use to love "Frasier"--- I saw every episode in its first four seasons --- but when Roz became pregnant it clearly went downhill. I think Peri Gilpin probably demanded more of a storyline than saying, "You have a caller on line 4" every week, but the producers should have said "No" to a baby. It pains me to say this, but I think it's time to put "Frasier" out to pasture.
the moment Roz got pregnant. whatever happened to the witty jibes between the characters?
When Niles divorced Maris. He was the best character on Frasier, but now he has turned Felix Unger.
Bring back Maris (as the shawdowy figure she is) in *any* capacity (? rival radio station commentator/Judge Judy/nutritional counselor to the stars/dog psychologist, whatever -- just don't give her a voice, please). Remember the benefit dinner (Frazier telling a tasteless joke while the Bishop has just died and he doesn't know it; Niles *describing* Maris' machinations as she stalked another socialite around the buffet table? I couldn't breathe.)
I hate to say it, but Frasier has unexpectedly jumped. They recently showed in England the episode where Frasier was dating a woman who Niles thought only wanted to be with him for free therapy. Frasier began to get suspicious and... Well, I actually switched off. Everyone over-reacted (no one in real life would behave that way) and I could predict exactly how the episode would go. I haven't watched it since.
The third time they used the "Somebody heard somebody say something only they misunderstood it and hijinks ensue", i.e., everyone thinks Daphne's pregnant when it's Roz, etc. I wish they'd put this show out of its misery. I'm not certain what could possibly redeem it. And we've already had to suffer the appearance of Shelly Long.
Fraiser really made two jumps. The first was when Niles lept with Lilith. The occasional Lilith appearences were funny. This ruined everything. Niles would have never slept with Lilith because he knew how much Frasier still loved her. The show also jumped when Fraiser and the rest of the staff at the station lost their jobs.
Let's take a supporting character from a great show, make him into a lead character and surround him with clones of himself (irritating, self-righteous, etc.). Frasier was great as a character on Cheers, but is just annoyingly AR now.
Frasier wasn't interesting enough to build a show around in the first place, then they made him more boring by taking out Lilith. The rigid formula that the better educated a character is, the more he's a total dweeb, is dull and disgusting.
I don't think Frasier has jumped yet but it's a close thing. The writing is not as on the mark as it used to be. Roz's baby!!!!That was a real no-no! Niles is still the best thing on that show but he needs maris back in some capacity, so does the show.
I agree with an above comment-- it's now only worth watching for the occasional snappy banter. The plots have gone the way of typical sit-com situations and stereotypes. Almost every episode contains this formula: They get into a situation where they make fools of themselves or they anger someone because they forget how pompous they are. It's been a very stale show for a while now. Not "appointment TV" anymore.
The most overrated show in sitcom history. To work, a show has to have funny characters. "Frasier" has only one -- Niles. There's never been an episode of this show that resembles anything close to real life.
Didn't they say on Cheers that Frazier was an child and his both his parents were dead? Did the producers get the disease that researchers have discovered, you know, saundrahuxtableitis?
While not actually "live," Frasier jumped the shark when it filmed on location in Seattle for the first time last season. In particular, the show lost me when Frasier and Niles did a laugh-track accompanied "Planes, Trains & Automobiles"-style tour of Seattle's tourist attractions on the way to "Frasier Crane Day" at the zoo. Everything about that show was unfunny: Ros's intro, Marty's jokes, etc. etc.
THANK YOU!!!! I thought I was the only one who noticed that "Frasier" is the closest thing on T.V. to "Three's Company".
The writers totally changed Frasier around. On Cheers, he was always in this grungy old bar with a bunch of losers. Now, Frasier wouldn't be caught dead in a bar and he's turned into this huge pompus jackass. If you ask me, Frasier is the weakest thing on this show. Niles and Marty are funny. The arguing between Roz and Bulldog is good for a chuckle. The whole Niles and Daphne thing was funny about the first 3 or 4 times but not anymore. Doesn't Daphne notice?? I thought she was a phsycic!! Can't she see it!! Spinning off Frasier was a very stupid thing to do in the first place.
Frasier's father has the worst fake limp I have ever seen. What a putz!
The "special" teaser where Niles burns Frasier's couch and commits other pratfals with out uttering a line was an obvious stealing of Rowan Atkinson's Bean character.
It's a great show and very popular over here but Daphne having to use American idioms is patronising to US viewers (it assumes they won't understand her otherwise) and insulting to British audiences. A Brit would never talk like that. I know she's English but her North of England accent is phoney too. That being said, it's still a better show than anything done in Britain.
Frasier hasn't done the jump quite yet- but it is definately pushing boundaries. Its still funny at times, but not like the older episodes. Personally, I think Niles and Frasier keep it funny- you have to laugh at their yuppie ways--- how can you not???!!! I watch Frasier every nite when I come home from work and it always makes me laugh, even tho I have seen most of those old episodes many times. Plus, I still watch the new ones to see a glimmer "funny" like the past episodes- its not as frequent, but it does happen! Bottom line is, I'm more in to the repeats (just like any series out there) because the beginning of a series is usually the best. For the entertainment, I say Frasier still rocks in my book.
This show was fantastic until Frasier lost his job. Then the show REALLY jumped a lot! It just turned into an unfunny series of episodes with him moaning about not having a job or girlfriend. Got tedious real quick. He got his job back, but all the momentum has been lost. As people above have pointed out, each episode is like an episode of "Three's Company"! I'm still watching hoping (against hope it seems) that this show will regain its footing. Let's hope so.
Please, no more Woody!!! At least come up with a decent storyline if you insist on resurrecting "Cheers" characters. Though, Norm & Cliffy might be fun.
When Frasier and Niles bought the restaurant and had to do all the cooking. It went from witty to slapstick. When they killed the eels by slamming them on the counter, it was over.
When Niles (Frasier's brother) finally won the heart of...Frasier's father's home nurse ( I can never remember their names!!!) the show really took a nose dive. It was funnier before when she was totally oblivious to his tortured affection!
The show jumped the shark when they started focusing on Crane homelife and almost giving up on the radio station. I always liked when the show started out with Frasier on the air and trying to guess who the mystery caller was.
The show officially jumped the shark when Frasier lost his job, but it was heading sharkward the umpteenth time Frasier got dumped by some really nice or really pretty woman due to a stupid misunderstanding. The Sela Ward episode really did it for me. Give him a girlfriend already and get him laid! Another thing...how come Frasier's girlfriends go all psycho whenever there's a misunderstanding? They start out sweet, intelligent, understanding, then the big mixup occurs and suddenly they're screaming like banshees and running for their lives (again, see the Sela Ward episode).
The Niles/Daphne date show when Niles was supposed to reveal his true feelings. NBC overhyped this episode and it bombed. Frasier has been moved around so frequently to prop up NBC's line-up, that this poor episode made me unwilling to adjust to the old Seinfeld time slot. I found better things to do on Thursday nights.
This show became like Three's Company. One episode had Daphne attracted to a gay ski instructor, who was wanted Niles, who wanted Daphne. Meanwhile, Frasier wanted a different woman, who also wanted Niles. It all got started by each character overhearing parts of a conversation as they walked into a room. I am waiting for Jack and Chrissie to show up.
A few episodes back when Fraser blew the big Niles secret to Daphine (while doped up)
Getting too phony and repetitious.
daphne & niles switched places: daphne looks on longingly as niles gets on with new love (who is a case as in NUT w/no class, no sense, no poise, no NOTHING---she bites; i like the coffee shop server better!) Let's face it, niles is too stiff & stuck up for daphne & daphne is ill-matched w/the savvy lawyer/sucky fiance they put her with. I like marty, roz, the radio station & cafe nervosa. I suggest they bring maris back and give her ACTUAL appearances; slowly have her change into a decent, remorseful human being that can appreciate niles & she can join frasier & niles on their high society hob-knobbing.
I THINK THE SHOW JUMPED THE MOMENT THEY CAST KELSEY GRAMMER AS FRASER. AND THAT GOES ALL THE WAY BACK TO WHEN HE WAS ON CHEERS. HE DIDN'T ADD ANYTHING TO THAT SHOW AND HE UNWATCHABLE ON THIS SHOW.
The heppest show EVER! Niles and Daphne should definitely get together already - the tensions killing ME, and I'm not even (fictionally) involved. Everyone's hilarious, and I love Martin to tears.
Clearly, the writers on Frasier wanted to go a whole new direction when he lost his job a season ago. They obviously felt it would also get rid of Roz who had a child and that plotline didn't work with the adult nature of the program. When Frasier and the the radio station gang all of sudden get their old shows and jobs back halfway into last season, it was beyond belief. Something like Bobby on Dallas popping out of the shower after Pam's season long dream. The Frasier writers obviously realized their new direction was going no where fast and quickly reverted back to the old format. Several shows dealing with Niles and Frasier's snobbery and obsession with high society also mark a new low point for the program. Next season should be it for this show.
One of my favorites still. Has gotten better.
First I want to say this is STILL my favorite show on TV. I have never missed an episode. Second, to the person who said the episode where Niles and Frasier buy the restarant was bad, ARE YOU KIDDING!? That was on of the best episodes ever! Third to the person who said that no one acts like the people on the show act, could that be because its JUST A TELEVISION SHOW!!!!! Of course the characters get into a bunch of far-fetched situations, they're fictional characters. They're not real. The people in the "magic box" aren't real, they're actors!
The second episode where the cast goes away for a weekend at a rustic cabin/ chalet, with lots of slamming doors and confusion about who's supposed to be involved with whom. The first one was brilliant, the second time it was just tired and repetitive.
The show jumped when the writers made the central female roles sluts and or air heads. Should we all see women this way? It`s disgusting to think that they could only make women on this show interesting and funny by making them degrading and insulting to woman everyware. Some of whom are my favorite people!
I don't think this one has jumped just yet. I still find it to be one of the funnier shows on (maybe that doesn't say much for what else is out there). My biggest gripe though is - how many times can the previews make us think "Oh, this is the week Daphne finally finds out about Niles love for her". It makes me think of when I used to be suckered in by ER's promos of "This week, one of their own (insert tragic situation here) - I would tune in like a chump and the person having the big tragedy was always some bozo they introduced the week before that had 2 lines that you didn't even know about. I can only say one thing about how Fraiser should end their run - and I agree, it should be soon - otherwise we might see Roz's kid become the painful and not funny "lets have the baby become the plot line, because we're out of all others" (a la Mad About You, Brady Bunch [remember cousin Oliver], Family Ties, Growing Pains etc.) The last episode better be the wedding between Niles and Daphne that we've all been waiting for! Spinoff? Go ahead - but keep Eddy in it. He still can make me laugh. Where's Bulldog? He was the best part of that show? I like him almost as much as I hated the character of BeBe - Frazier's agent - wretch - she was old after she walked through the door.
"Frasier" is getting towards that point of no return...I have seen almost all the episodes from the beginning of the show, and the most recent ones really are not nearly as good as earlier ones. About Niles and Daphne: come on already. I know that the show will jump the shark when (if?) they get together, but sheesh. Mel aggravates me to no end (probably intentionally) and that Donny guy can jump his own shark, as far as I'm concerned. I still like some of the characters, I wish Martin had had a chance to develop more and Roz needs to be back in the show a LOT more. But the shark is approaching, almost everyone on the show just looks like they're tired. Except David Hyde Pierce, who cracks me up endliessly. It's been a good run, but I hope the show ends in 2001.
After 6 years, the comedy is still witty and the jokes haven't been simplified just so the layman can understand. The timing is perfect and now that Daphne knows about Niles's feelings, it looks set to continue on in greatness.
Well...they almost did it: Frasier and Roz! I could feel the shark circling this show all season, and last week it finally jumped. Frasier almost sleeping with Roz?! PULEEZ! And what the heck ever happened to her baby, anyway? She's such a great mom, always off trying to get laid instead of home with her baby. I loved this show while it lasted, but between Niles and Daphne and now this...it's over. (Plus, why didn't Frasier just RE-UPHOLSTER that stupid old chair?!)
The first season was well written. It had jokes for educated people. Now they've dumbed it down so much that they're even making potty jokes. Leave that kind of humor to Adam Sandler!
The Episode when Niles got the parrot stuck to his head. It was painful to watch and remnant of some tacky 70's sitcom story. A sophisticate like Niles would not "hide" in the kitchen because of a bird on his head.. and the fact that the parrot suddenly and spontaneously "learned" every word that was said to him and spewed them back out at exactly the appropriate time was sad and pathetic! There have been good shows since, but this one really stank up the airways... and the ending, which had Frasier with the stupid bird on his head now, was a horrendous finale to a vile and extremely poorly written script.
When TV actors get big heads and decide to go Hollywood, the challenge of replacing them often brings out the best in writers - NYPD Blue is the best example. But all of Frasier's regulars characters have stayed...and stayed...and stayed, and that's made their stories stale. What if Daphne had left after the 3rd or 4th season, before her story with Niles became so tiresome? What if Roz had been replaced, or if Frasier had found a serious girlfriend? It would have given a lot of new life to the show.
Frasier's girlfriends remind me a lot of Joe Friday's dates on Dragnet - these stiff, anonymous, vaguely middle-aged women who drift on to fill up a hole in the male character's life/hole in the plot and then disappear like spring snow before the next episode, leaving absolutely no indication they were ever there at all. Mercedes Ruehl's character was an exception, but even she was never mentioned again once her 3-episode committment was over. Enough, already. This show is exhausted.
the valentine's episode was horrible. misunderstandings galore and leaning heavily on gay humour for straight people. niles pretending to be gay w his dad as his lover so frasier can make it with an opera singer who thought niles was gay when they met...this was a big groaner, i couldn't watch the whole thing. the actor playing niles is hilarious in stand-up comedy. if he ever left the show the whole thing would crash in a second!
When Frazier and Niles bought a restaurant at the end of one season. THey managed to quit their jos, buy a restaurant and burn it down all in the same episode. Also, I cnat stand the seemingly endless stream of "misunderstanding" episodes - brings back the worst of Three's Company. This show is too good for that
Really, every show this season jumps a nastier shark two memorable episodes are Marty hiding his sex partner and Niles oblivious to the outrageous behavior of his plastic surgeon girfriend, but it's just amazing how the writers have taken a hike on this show.
It was looking a bit dodgy when Frasier left the radio station but the hole Daphne/Niles will they wont they is keeping me on the edge of my seat and I'm practically falling off the seat from laughter
Same old lovers tension that has suckered TV viewers for years.
When Frazier was dating the two girls whose names he kept getting confused, I think it was last season. I can't even remember the names because those are the first episodes I couldn't watch and turned them off. The shows held no interest for me at all. I guess I told a lie. The first episode I turned off was when Frazier was having sex with a girl in some wierd looking bedroom and she started howling like a wolf!!
Since the beginning. They drug the Daphne/Niles thing for way to long. No one on the show even suggests that Niles stop acting so gay and maybe he'd have better luck. Watching 2 grown men talk about wine, coffee and cheese is so freaking boring.
It wasn't very good to begin with but now a lot of people have an excuse to stop watching: Niles and Daphne have finally hooked up.
This show jumped this past season. Although some plot lines should be carried on from week to week, the last 4 shows leading to the finale of this past season seemed like one giant continuation; adding to that the ridiculous trailers aired on NBC, Frasier became a weekly prime time Soap Opera.
It always bothered me that Frasier is a psychiatrist, and yet has a career that consists of hosting a three-hour radio call-in program. Shouldn't he be practicing medicine as his main job? And when he lost his radio gig, well, wasn't there something (like an M.D.) that he could fall back on? For a show that strives for sophistication, this stuff is awfully unrealistic and a little disturbing. Also, Kelsey Grammer's pompous acting style is too grating for words--I prefer to think of the show as being called "Niles," because Hyde-Pierce is the main attraction. The Frasier character on "Cheers" was far more tolerable than the star of "Frasier."
My vote is when the on-show radio hosts went on strike.
Its true there are some tiresome plotlines-sick of Niles and Daphne already. In fact the last episode (the wedding that wasn't) was pretty bad. But the good episodes keep me coming back. My favorite this season was Frasier dating an old high school prom queen (Jean Smart in her best part in years!). That was great.
Fraiser always has been, and always will be, the best spin-off of 'Cheers'... you losers who think otherwise are just unintelligent miscreants who can't comprehend what 'good script' is...
This show never jumped the shark, and hopefully never will. I love all the plots, and the predictable social situations when everybody jumps in at the wrong time and hears something they are not supposed to hear, HILLARIOUS. I was on my floor laughing for 5 min. one time. This show always comes up with quick witted, educated remarks that always makes me feel inferior to there intelect but i love it. Keep it up!
Frasier's still as funny as it always has been. The the show encompasses the conflict contrasting personalities beautifully - Marty, Roz, Frasier, Niles, Daphne...all opposites in terms of personality.
When Daphne's brother Simon appears. Daphne is supposed to be from Manchester, so why does her brother talk with a ridiculous Cockney (London) accent that makes Dick Van Dyke sound convincing? Daphne's mother's accent veered from Yorkshire to London in the same sentence.
This show never jumped and continues to entertain like the first season.
Daphne & Niles fleeing Daphne's wedding in a Winnebago. It's a sad, sad day in television land!
Just end the show now! It's always been my favorite show, but it's going to shark it bad now that Niles and Daphne are together. But hey, who can beat them running off in a Winnebago? They just should have saved that for the last episode.
This show jumped the shark from day one. Every episode is about miscommunication. Every damn episode has the same schtick. It's time to make more room on prime time. I've had too much of it.
First I must make a comment to all of you who commented on the Frasier=Three's Company thing. Get a life. Did you know that there are only 12 original ideas out there when it comes to sitcoms? To everyone who is reading this: please applaude all the people who think that they are brilliant to have equated Frasier to T.C. Yes, we all think that you are smart little consumers. Now go back to watching America's Funniest Home Videos. ANYWAY- Frasier remains one of the best shows of all time. It is brilliant, refreshing, the charectors are VERY well developed. I think the producers should be applauded for taking all of the brilliant comical ideas from the greatest shows in TV history: from The Honeymooners to I Love Lucy to Three's Company. Take what's good and build upon it. By the time this show nears the shark tank, it will be as big as the Space Needle, (or Frasier's ego! :>) ) I must admit, I was getting quite ansey for awhile there, waiting for Daphne and Niles to hook-up. BUT- I LOVED the ending of of this latest season (1999-2000)..."Buckle up Daphne" "You buckle up Niles" Oh my GAWD!!! I almost died to hear Daphne use Niles's first name!! Thank you for making this finale such a joy to watch!! When Niles came back from his weekend with Mel, and disclosed that he eloped, I screamed- "NOOOO"! And then when Frasier found out that Niles was married, but Daphne didn't know yet and she was started to confess her love for him. And then Frasier runs back up to the apartment and bursts through the door to shout, "NILES!!!!" I was rolling on the floor! And how about that neighbor gal who knew what was going on all the time because she happened to be in the elevator at all the right times, and then I wanted to cry out of gratefulness when she happened to be in the elevator when Daphne needed a shoulder a cry on...! I only hope that the writers don't deviate from the character's 'real' behaviors, and remain inventive and funny. The 2001-2000 season is going to be very exciting. I haven't waited for a season premiere like this in a very long time. Frasier brings truth to the phrase, "must see TV"!!! (And please, show more Roz!!!)
Every episode is predictable (I agree with the "Three's Company" comparison, but not in a positive manner). The Niles and Frasier characters are pretentious and, whatever happened to Daphne's accent?
You know what? WHY waste your time if you don't like the show? Is your lame, ludicrous opinions actually changing anyone's minds about watching the show!? No, they aren't. The only thing you are accomplishing is showing just how childish you actually are by assuming that others care about your pathetic outlooks on a television show. It's not real life, so the writers can do whatever the hell they want to; if you don't like it, just do us all a favour and shut it because no one cares what you have to say. ABOUT ANYTHING.
I never got this show. I tried to get into it because it was so popular but it just looks like a sitcom about gay men. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
This show never jumped! For seven years it has been well written, well acted, and generally well done. May it live on for at least a couple more years!
If you've ever spent any time around Seattle yuppies, you'll recognize what a barf-a-rama this show is. Frasier was funny with Lilith and the bunch back in Boston. Now, I want to see this show covered by a mudflow from a Mount Rainier eruption, followed by a massive tsunami that would wash away all traces of this pretentious piece of TV crap.
It was enough when she popped up for a cameo during Frasier's Club Med trip. For her second appearance, Shelley Long came across less like Diane and more like a bitter unemployed character actress. Frasier's character was stretched beyond belief when he was actually trying to score again with the has-been. Sorry Shelley, go pick up the bread crumbs at the Disney TV-movie set.
Frasier has jumped, and it hasn't. The first few seasons were fantastic. Since then, the show still has quite a few brilliant moments, but it has definitely become inconsistent. Hopefully the 2000-2001 season will be the last so that "Frasier" can go out gracefully, unlike "Roseanne"
This show jumped when some clever ******* decided to take a dying show, namely 'Cheers', remove the dullest character, and give him his own show. It was doomed from the start. Then, when the writers realised this, they quit, giving the script job to someone who doesn't understand the concept of humour.
GREAT CHEMISTRY WITH THE CAST MEMBERS MAKES THIS SHOW GREAT! PLUS DAVID HYDE PIERCE DESERVES EVERY AWARD HE'S WON AND THEN SOME! THEY NEED TO STAY AWAY FROM INVITING FORMER CHEERS CAST MEMBERS TO GUEST STAR. THOSE WERE SOME OF THE WEAKER SHOWS, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF BEBE NEWERTH SHE ALWAYS PUTS IN A GOOD PERFORMANCE. BRING BACK BULLDOG!
OK, so I watched all of the uneven (some say this was because of Frasier losing his job, but I say it was poor writing) "Frasier" episodes of the 98-99 season. By the time Fall '99 rolled around, I was willing to give the show another shot, after all any series is entitled to one lousy season. But the first episodes of 1999-2000 were just thinly veiled retreads of earlier plots. For instance, the one where Howard Stern-like morning radio shock jocks fool Frasier into doing horribly embarrassing stunts on the air, which was a near carbon copy of the episode where radio jock Bulldog does the same thing. That was when I knew that "Frasier" had jumped the shark.
Frasier has always been an excellent comedy and I don't think that it ever jumped. Admittedly it did go down a little when Frasier lost his job. Season 6 was probably the worst, but season 7 was better although not as good as the first five. But season 7 does have my Favorite episode of all time "There's something about doctor Mary". I'm not sure how they're gonna deal with Niles & Daphne though. I hope it ain't gonna turn out to be a dream. Frasier is a true classic and I could watch them all again and again.
WHO WOULD WATCH 2 MIDDLE AGED BALDING MEN TALK ABOUT WINE AND CHEESE?
Though this is merely a pediction from the summer of 2000: The season finale of May 2000! Niles and Daphne's lack of relationship was part of the show's greatness. They should in no way be together. The writing is arguably the best for a comedy show that I've ever seen(much more verbal wit than others), an they have an incredible ability to make hilarious episode even when they've cornered themselves with trite and cliched themes (case in point: The ski getaway vacation, where it started off with a love triangle, but they developed it into a hilarious love hexagon with a great gay ski instructor and people accidentally foiling the exploits of others. The scene where they all stand on the balcony sets up the show perfectly). I also admired the show's ability not to fall into traps of the other shows, like Friends joining Ross and Rachel. And now they threw that away! Never will Niles be able to go into that hilarious stupor every time Daphne speaks a double entendre! Sure, the wit is still there, but I think they changed for the worse.
Frasier might have its flaws but mainly it's brilliant. I'm delighted Niles and Daphne are together and they deserve more scenes. So do Roz, Donny & Martin. The show hops when the plotline is about Frasier! Daphne's relatives were also unwelcome. Next season can only be better.
Seven years is a tad too long for a will-they-won't-they relationship. However, the slapstick is also a big problem: the restaurant episode, the Bean-esque episode, the feeling that something awful will always happen to the main characters. . .
Season Finale - Spring 2000 Niles and Daphne are together - should be a series finale. The long-running, ever-present subplot that they milked for everything it was worth, is over. The series is over. Nothing ever, ever changes (permanently) for the sisyphusian Frasier, nothing ever will, and if HIS life turned out OK, it wouldn't even be the same show anymore, the emotional slapstick show that derives most of its laughs from watching this snooty-but-loveable man fall down. Anyway, the beauty of the unrequited love and the tension is gone. Break up the wedding, hop on the bus, cue "Mrs. Robinson," roll credits, and let the audience guess what the future holds for them. Whatever it is, it's not funny.
Frasier started out fine--the writing was much better than Cheers from whence it sprang. I especially loved the premise of two effette and snobbish brothers clashing with their no-nonsense working class father. This snootiness was what almost always got Frazier and Niles into trouble, and frankly, they usually deserved it. The show definitely appeals to those who love watching the pompous being deflated. Even so, one still feels for Frasier and Niles in the face of failure--one can hate their behavior, but still love them as people. Frasier jumped the shark when the episodes became lame miscommunication innuendo. This was almost as bad as Cheer's weak point--too many lowest-common-denominator booze and boobs jokes. Frasier seems in danger of repeating this same misstep as its parent show. One last opinion, though. I'm glad Daphne and Niles never became an item--she's simply too good for him. Daphne always struck me as a sexy and hip rock'n'roll-influenced adult (it's probably the mod British persona and her Jeannie Shrimpton hair), and Niles was the quintessential square yuppie. While opposites attract, these types (to my experience) are like oil and water. At least the show remained believable in this respect.
While this show had a rocky couple of seasons, it has managed to reclaim the charm and witty humor that made it the best written show on television. I hope this show never jumps! David Hyde Pierce is great as is Kelsey Grammer and the entire cast. The finale was great!
This is a really good show. I thought that Frasier would be the worst possible character to make a spinoff, but it turned out very well.
Definitely Roz's pregnancy. Now that Niles and Daphne are together, I think the rest of the characters should go the whole hog and ALL shack up together. Obviously after having Daphne's ugly brother be her escort at the wedding, Roz has definitely bit the bullet and lowered her standards. Here's how I think they should rescue the show : 1) Niles and Daphne set up a "psychic therapy" clinic. This could last for four or five shows until Niles gets his license to practise medicine revoked due to their unorthodox (and of course hilarious) methods. 2) Frasier and Roz end up in bed together. They both want each other but both think that the other would feel "icky" about it as neither is the other's usual type. 3) Martin hires a new home-help whom nobody likes except for Martin. She turns out to be a transvestite and BeBe signs her/him up to star in a transexual aerobics programme on TV. 4) Roz goes out of her way to spend more time at Frasier's and Frasier reciprocates by inviting her more. Roz becomes an unofficial home help to Martin and very rarely goes home. 5) Lillith is seconded to some university in Australia. Frddy wants to stay in the U.S. and moves in with Frasier. 6) Niles and Daphne buy Cafe Nervosa. Daphne runs the coffee-house and Niles writes a syndicated newspaper column called Shrink Rap. Ha! Ha! Ha! 7) Lillith quits her job in Australia as she cannot bear to be parted from Freddy. Freddy does not want to leave Seattle as he has become friends with some ginger haired girl who lives next door to Frasier. Freddy spends a lot of time there so he doesn't have to be in EVERY episode as that would just be too annoying. As Freddy refuses to leave, Lillith decides to rent the penthouse in the same building. All the other residents LOVE her and Frasier begins to see her in a new light. 8) Frasier and Lillith fall in love all over again. Roz has been living in Daphne's old room after a fire burned her apartment down. Frasier goes home to tell Roz that he has feelings for her but truly loves Lillith and he finds Roz and Martin in bed together!!! 9) They all enter into a triple wedding ceremony : Frasier and Lillith; Niles and Daphne & Roz and Martin. 10) Then they should finish it.
It's come close to jumping a few times (Roz's baby, Frasier losing his job) but always managed to pull back from it at the last moment. Could Niles and Daphne pull the rest of the show over the shark?
I love Frasier, I really do, but I think this show has got to have the record for most shark jumps. Let's see...Kate Costas, moving to Tuesdays against the sitcom of the great unwashed (Home Improvement), Frasier gets fired, Daphne gets engaged, Roz gets pregnant, Daphne and Niles run off in the Winny. And with the exception of the latter, which remains to be seen, the writing has helped the show unjump itself. Never has a sitcom recovered from so many careening nosedives. And I'll always come back, if only for the withering one-liners.
Although I don't think this show has jumped, I suspect it may with Daphne and Niles getting together...
As above-- has been on some thin ice. I never got sick of the Niles-Daphne plot-- I think David Hyde Pierce is an almost inexhaustible comic force-- possibly the funniest actor on television over the longest time-- and Jane Leeves has played it beautifully, too. This doesn't mean there are no problems, and I think a big jump could possibly come very soon. I'll be sorry to see it.
Being middle aged myself I don't find it difficult to empathize with characters who are likewise. I can enjoy shows about schoolkids or twentysomethings too - I've been there - but life doesn't stop at thirty. I love both the comedy and the sentiment, and I adored the season seven finale, which should have won the writers an Emmy. And I am looking forward with interest to the new comic possibilities than the Niles/Daphne elopement produces. If something hadn't changed there was the danger that the show would get stuck in a rut, but instead it has rightly taken the risk of messing with the original formula by allowing the characters, even though they are in a sitcom, to do something new. Those who decide in advance that Season 8 won't be worth watching may well be missing a treat. Those who jeer at the middle aged will be punished by life. You too will be middle-aged and, I hope, bald some day, unless you die young. Growing old is better than the alternative.
I don't believe that Frasier ever jumped. I think the show still has plenty more life yet to go. Infact, the 7th season has breathed a new life back within it. For those against my belief, I must say I almost never watched Cheers, never watched Three's Company, as well as most of the newer shows: friends, ER, etc, etc. They were never enough to catch my attention in a show. I normally don't watch TV, since nothing ever seems good. I watched an occasional Frasier in the past, but never actually got hooked until the 7th season. That had to be some of the best writing I have seen. Since then, I have watched the other seasons of Frasier, and I can honestly say that in season 5 and 6, it was waning, and showing signs of a soon-to-be death. But I think with season 7 came of a rebirth of life back into the show. Rarely have I known a show to cause such an anticipation for the next series, as the last episode of Frasier has. I also don't believe with the connection of Niles and Daphne it will kill the show. I think they can in fact use this to gain new ground on the show, if it is done right. Now all that needs to be done, is to wait and see what happens.
What an absolutely delicious blend of writing and acting! Frasier has been blessed by the most gifted prose - by far the most intelligent, clever wit - and an exemplary cast. Always fresh and crisp -- a standard more should strive for, though futile -- not to be duplicated or even a close second.
Not so much a jump, but a long glide that picked up speed. This show is a perfect metaphor for the 90s. Pick the trendiest town (Seattle), add two nouveau riche yuppies (how'd they get like that with Martin as their father?), have a show-within-a-show (like Tool Time, SportsNight, etc.), then be so hip that anyone not knowing the latte flavor du jour is left in the dust. This was funny and original at first and the writing actually had humor with intellect(!). Then it started sliding and plots never worked out: Niles and Daphne, Roz's baby, Frasier doing anything meaningful. Finally in true trendy fashion we get an onslaught of homoisms: the ski weekend, the fey brothers, the Three's Company plots. Bulldog and Niles are twinkletoes in real life. Why would Daphne - a vibrant and lusty woman - be interested in the limp-wristed Niles?
This show jumped the shark at the beginning of the 2000-01 season, after it had been moved from the lucrative Thursday night lineup on NBC, to Tuesdays, making way for the successful "Will and Grace".
About two/three seasons ago, there was an episode where Frasier tries to keep several people in the same house from finding out about the other/others by directing them in and out of specific rooms. Since that episode I swear that this same stupid idiotic gag appears in some form (sometimes he is hiding a thing instead of a person) every single episode.
The first gay episode (where Frasier's co-worker assumed he was gay) was hilarious, but then the second time around (where Martin pretended he was) it was just too "been there, done that."
I can't help but notice, having perused the comments for Frasier as well as a number of other shows, that there are significantly fewer spelling and other errors in the Frasier comments. Does this mean that Frasier attracts a better-educated audience? There also seems to be a higher-than-average number of "voters" who indicate, by spelling or by content, that they are "across the pond" (well, who over here would know a Manchester accent from a Yorkshire one?).
I can't say just one reason, the jump was achieved by a bunch of little things. First, Daphne's horrible brother has settled in and shows no signs of leaving. The addition of a new character hardly ever works, and I hope they deport his pissed arse. Second, Frasier has become HyperFrasier. The scene where Niles and Daphne yell at him for interfering or whatever and he bellows "I am outraged!" with his jowls quivering in indignation was just too strained to bear. This show is brilliant because the characters are parodies of pompous types, common in English sitcoms but sadly missing in American shows. But that scene was almost audibly forced. Finally, what's with Daphne? The 'romantic' ending, with a starlit dinner...awww...except Niles is fawning over a woman who looks run over by a truck, all hunched over to hide her burgeoning belly. Is she about to give birth to a full-grown rugby player?
THE MAIN THING THAT CAME TO MY MIND WHEN I READ YOUR STUPID COMMENTS WAS "DO THESE *******S REALIZE THAT THIS IS F**KING TV! AND NOT ART"! YOU DUMBASSES SIT HERE AND TALK ABOUT HOW THE SHOW "F**KED THE PLOT UP BECAUSE OF THIS" OR "BECAUSE OF THAT". HEY MORONS I GOT NEWS FOR YOU ALL. ITS ENTERTAINMENT! NO ONE GIVES A **** ABOUT PLOT TWISTS AND STUFF WHEN IT COMES TO TV. TV IS JUST A TOOL WE USE FOR ENTERTAINMENT I.E. A QUICK LAUGH, A SOB STORY, OR SOMETHING WE CAN NOD OUR HEADS AT AND SAY "THEY MAKE A DAMN GOOD POINT ON THAT DOCUMENTARY SPECIAL". ITS A WAY TO FORGET FOR A FEW BRIEF HOURS HOW BORING AND OFTEN TIMES POINTLESS OUR LIVES CAN BE AND SIT THERE AND FOCUS OUR ATTENTION ON SOMEONE ELSE'S PROBLEMS (EVEN THOUGH THE CHARACTERS OUR FICTIONAL OF COURSE, BUT ITS LIKE WHEN PEOPLE GOSSIP) AND FORGET IF U SIT THERE AND CRITIQUE IT LIKE ITS A F**KING PAINTING THEN YOU MUST HAVE AS PATHETIC A SOCIAL LIFE AS FRASIER DOES IN THE SHOW. AND FOR THE RECORD YOUR ALL WRONG WHEN YOU SAY THE SHOW ISN'T AS GOOD BECAUSE IT IS IN MY MIND THE MOST INTELLIGENT SHOW OUT THERE AND IF I WERE THE PRODUCERS AND CAST I WOULD BE PROUD OF THAT. SO IN CONCLUSION.... YOU ALL SUCK! PS I'M AWARE OF THE IRONY OF ME WRITING THIS EMAIL JUST LIKE YOU DID AND THEN BAD MOUTHING YOU FOR THE SAME THING BUT F**K IT IT HAD TO BE SAID.
Since 1993 it has been and still is the greatest comedy on TV. I find all of the comments about its jumping amusing. All shows have their down moments, and for "Frasier" it was the first half (only the first half) of the sixth season. For some reason, the seventh didn't start out too well either, but it has been terrific since Frasier let the cat out of the bag. It still speaks to an intelligent audience, The Ski Lodge notwithstanding. Acting is superb, and so is the writing. There have been some stumbles--big ones. Roz's Baby certainly; Frasier losing his job definitely. But I defy anybody t find a show that has rebounded from its stumbles as successfully as "Frasier" has. I know awards don't say it all, but five Emmys has to speak for something. It didn't deserve it for the sixth season, but this last season should have won again. This year's Emmy winner is the worst piece of trash on television today. "Will and Grace" is unwatchable, mindless drivel and I think it only won so that the academy could make a PC statement. It boggles my mind that anyone can even stand Megan Mullally's voice for three seconds or her character for one minute, and yet she gets an Emmy for it...anyway, my point is that THIS garbage is what beats the still well-written "Frasier" and dumps it from its spot??? I must laugh at those who call "Frasier" a "gay" show. Sure, some writers, producers, and stars are gay. David Lee, one of the creators, is gay. But for some reason they chose to make all five lead CHARACTERS heterosexual. So it's ludicrous to call it a "gay" show. There have been around three gay-themed episodes, but they have all been hilarious. It's too bad "Will and Grace" is so bad because a truly good "gay" show would be welcome, but "Frasier" is not that show! The love story between Niles and Daphne is the most beautiful and special in TV history. And they dragged it as long as they could and picked the perfect moment to bring it all to a head. How can so many people say "enough" to this well-handled and beautifully crafted storyline? You want an example of "How Not to Do It" with a love story? Check out Ross and Rachel on "Friends." Niles and Daphne are the antithesis of this. They didn't get them together too soon, as "Friends" did, nor are they likely to break them up and forget the whole thing. Bottom line: stop whining, it's still a terrific show and will last for at least two, probably more seasons because GUESS WHAT!!: it still has devoted fans and people watch.
We knew it was coming with the end of last season, but that was only the preview. Watching Niles' somber divorce discussion with his soon-to-be 2nd ex-wife and the foregone conclusion of his take-it-slow courtship with Daphne has major jumpage all over it.
I used to be a huge fan of this show but the last few seasons have really stunk! The only characters I find funny are Martin and Eddie - the rest are so predictable it makes me sick to watch. After the season premier last night - When Daphne and Niles run away after ditching the wedding, I am done watching this dog of a show. What is up with Daphne's brother? Do the writers of this show think anyone thinks he is even remotely funny? And another thing - where did Bulldog go? He was so funny - my theory is that this Simon (Daphne's bro) is a sorry replacement for Bulldog. Someone should put this show out of it's misery. After last night I would rather be watching whatever crap show is on the WB than this croc.
Niles's attraction to Daphne was a big part of the tension and suspense in the show. Now, they're a couple and dating and I say, "Who cares?" The show is dull now.
I love this show!! I think the writers did a great job evolving Frasier's character from Cheers. He was such a bore on that show that I never imagine his own show would survive, but so far so good. And about the Three's Company thing, mmm maybe but at least we don't have to worry about creepy Mr Furley from downstairs.
The previews showed Daphne giving Niles a sad smile, and I thought "they're going to screw this up" by not letting them get together. Both Daphne and Niles are idiosyncratic characters; the idea of the two of them together should be good fodder for a season or two of a show that was probably near jumping.
Frasier jumped the shark in the first episode of the 2000/2001 season--Niles and Daphne admit their love for each other and break up with their significant others. Niles is just too neurotic and prissy to be Daphne's type and seeing them try to act like a real couple is really awkward. The jokes seemed more forced and predictable as well.
when frasier lost his radio show, an interminalbly long season ensued before they mended their ways, and it jumped back only to have it on the brink of jumping again by getting niles and daphne together. possibly more jumps ahead.
FRASIER hit its best point when Niles finally divorced Maris. ("I've flushed out your secret!") It's been downhill ever since and it's picking up speed. There is still the occasional bon mot to savor, but this show is clearly out of gas. Time to give it a rest.
In the 1999-2000 season, when the Daphne-Niles story line started being promoted as a Romance with Woman Appeal. You can't turn a comedy of manners into an achy-breaky love story, guys! Ironic detachment or gooshy sentiment: pick one.
Daphne & Niles getting together has completely taken the charm out of the show. It should have been saved for the series final episode. I bet there will not be many more seasons after the plummet in ratings this season will experience.
Ever since Niles and Daphne got together, all the spark has gone out. There is NO chemistry between these two actors. Is Niles gay? I wonder because he shows no sexual tension between he and Daphne at all! It's not funny anymore.
There's too much junk about Daphne and Niles. More of it is Niles. It'll drive you crazy! Niles is such a dweeb, all he has to do is ask Daphne for a date or something. Sheesh! It may break his heart if she says no, but it'll save us from the agony we have to go through, watching Niles drool over Daphne every episode. Every couple of shows, okay. But, EVERY FLIPPIN DAY????? You can only take so much!
The first jump was when Fraiser started getting really prissy with the character of Niles. When the show was hot Fraiser would be seen rolling his eyes at the comments and silly antics of Niles. Then later in the show's life Fraiser is just as big or bigger pris than Niles. The second jump occurred this season when Daphne and Niles got together. Talk about bad timing and forced acting! This show is toast over the shark!
Yes, unfortunately this is shark bait. The show wasn't original in plots but did have good dialogue. When they lost their jobs it crashed though and the end of last season/beginning of this one just made sure we won't watch. The whole Daphne/Niles thing is ridiculous now. The show has a bitter flavor now instead of funny.
The first episode of the 2000-2001 season, when Niles and Daphne return after escaping the wedding in a Winnebago. I could only stand to watch about 15 minutes of the one hour season premier. It was total crap. The annoying brother was still there and there was some contrived storyline about Daphne being sued for breach of promise, with Niles and Daphne having to keep away from each other. I haven't watched it since.
It's starting to jump the shark now that Niles and Daphne are together, but they aren't, and she's so obviously about six months pregnant (??). Did they think we wouldn't notice her huge belly?!! Why didn't they just have Niles and Daphne come back from an "extended honeymoon" expecting a child? It would have added a whole fresh twist to the show.
"Frasier" finally jumped the shark this season when Niles and Daphne - after 7 successful seasons - began to get romantically involved. It has the feel of "The Nanny" all over again, this time Niles is the Mr. Sheffield character. Thankfully, the Shark Jumping is being done tastefully. The show is still pretty good, but it's obvious that the Niles/Daphne relationship issue is sort of the beginning of the end of the show. Anyone else notice Jane Leeves attempting to act like no one can notice her very obvious pregnancy this season?? It also appears that the producers have twice attempted to add new supporting characters (first Daphne's alcoholic brother and then Frasier's butler).
I knew it was heading south when too many episodes hinged on farcical misunderstandings. They did Wodehousian farce very well (and sparingly!) in the beginning, but now it's just become common and badly-done Three's Company.
Niles and Daphne got hitched, and now we're getting screwed.
Yet another show saved by it's supporting cast. Frasier is just one more tired sitcom made entirely for one character who cannot carry the show. The best thing that could happen to this show would be if Mr. Grammer would finally get put away for any one of his many socially irresponsible acts. The show would be funnier without him.
It seems like when they have these sort of hidden crush things on tv shows, they always mess it up by sometime finally having the girl and guy actually get together. Now on That 70's Show they were able to work it out well because Eric and Donna still have the same sort of relationship when dating as they did as friends, but on Fraiser, it just mucked everything up. When did it stop being so much about Fraiser and more about Niles and Daphne? The name is Fraiser, not the Niles and Daphne show.
I read somewhere that someone complained that the show was called FRASIER and that we should all stop obsessing about Niles and Daphne. But if you ask me, Niles and Daphne are the heart of the show. Frasier's bits get stale after a while, but the writers have managed to breathe life into the show in quirky new ways with Niles and Daphne's romance. I didn't expect it, but I love it and I think they are the most entertaining couple on TV.
THIS SHOW JUMPED THE SHARK WHEN THEY TRIED TO HIDE DAPHNE'S ALL TOO OBVIOUS REAL-LIFE PREGNANCY, TO ADD INSULT TO INJURY, THEY TRY TO PLAY IT OFF LIKE SHE HAS BEGUN TO EAT TOO MUCH.
This Show is so clever! i love the humour of it!! my only complaint is that NBC moved it to tuesdays so i never get to see it anymore!! they should move it back to thursdays in place of cursed! that show sucks, and it would be the perfect lineup if it was frasier instead!! All hail EDDIE!!
Appeared to have jumped last season, but bounced back; now with Daphne and Niles together, it's like watching Michael Jackson and Lisa Marie Presley. No chemistry at all. Maybe the writers can resolve it, but they all seem like they're tired of the entire show.
The very first episode of the 2000 season! At the end of last season, after years of tension Niles & Daphne finally declared their love for each other. The show immediately "jumped the shark" with the first episode of this season by having Niles "wife" insist on "keeping up appearances" and not granting him an immediate divorce. They have attempted to milk this for an entire season, of which I have grown very, very weary. Each time I try to view a new episode it's dull and predictable. This is the beginning of the end I am sure!!
Those horrible situations that you know no one could ever get into - Like a bad I Love Lucy routine. Even though the show's jokes are still funny, these people are so pathetic that it is painful. They have no friends but remain snooty. Do they have a reason to be pompous?
Although "Frasier" hasn't yet jumped the shark, it has been throwing chum in the water since Niles and Daphne professed their feelings for one another. Admittedly, a dilemma -- that question mark of a relationship had to be resolved before the conclusion of the series, but eliminating that tension pretty much equals the death of the series. // Two thoughts, after having read comments from other respondents: "Frasier," with its clear debt to the great screwball comedies of 20th-century American cinema and the great French farces of 19th-century theater, *can* in fact be considered art, as few television shows can. Unlike "Friends" et al, which mostly exist only to set up one-liners for the thinly drawn and uncompelling characters, the quips uttered during "Frasier" are usually character-driven and, like other works of art, reveal much about the characters who utter them, as well as about human nature and human consciousness. Similarly, no sentient viewer could think that "Frasier's" plots are just like the mundane plots of other television comedies. What other writers thought to take a character's dream and use it repeatedly, although with variations, to reveal conflicts in the character's life? Who else borrowed from "Rashomon" to show how each participant in a series of events comes away with a different story of said events? No other writers ever have brought to the small screen such honest, funny and deftly wrought examinations of sibling rivalry, father-son tension, and the agony of relationships between men and women. No other writers have developed the convoluted yet ultimately connected and resolved plots that are routine on "Frasier." // Its proximity to the shark is unsettling, but inevitable. P.S. for fans: check out the extremely funny novels by Joe Keenan, one of the writers/exec producers from the series' early days.
It never jumped and it hopefully won't for a long time. Like fine wine it gets better with each year, especially now that the Niles and Daphne relationship seems to be moving to the second level. The writing is still witty, the actors superb and the jokes hilarious.
Look, Niles is gay. He has no chemistry with women. The suspension of disbelief can only be stretched so far - the storyline about their love is absurd.
Trying to hide Daphne's pregnancy. The episode where she hides food in books and planters was the shark jumper. Enough already! Who would possibly believe that she was 'just gaining weight' when she was so obviously pregnant!
NILES IS GAY, BULLDOG IS GAY. Do your homework people!!! I thought everyone knew at this point. Come on, Niles is the prissiest guy on television - that was NO casting accident - and we're supposed to believe that he's all on Daphne's ****, for 6 years, watching her bend over and fantasizing about her all the time? And Bulldog, yeah guys, he's officially "out" too. The picture that was painted of him was he was every male stereotype in the flesh, not quite!!! Why do you think their characters seemed forced? That's what did it for me. The Niles / Daphne on-again-off-again, will-they-or-won't-they thing WAS getting tired, but once I found out he was gay, it REALLY wasn't believable anymore! And I don't care how gay you are, WHO GOES TO THE FRIGGIN OPERA THAT MUCH!?!?! NOT EVEN LIBERACE WAS THAT GAY!!!!
I don't think Frasier has jumped the shark although I do believe he has been on the pier .... It was a great idea ending a season with Nile and Daphne FINALLY admitting there love for one another. The very next season was iffy but that did have a lot to do with Daphne ballooning like a pig when she was pregnant and the weak plot of overeating to cover it up. But I must say the return of Daphne episode was GREAT and Frasier has since saved his shark jumping days for a while to come (I hope)!
Frasier is jumping the shark as we speak. Sending Daphne to fat camp and trying to cover up her "real life" pregnancy with obesity was dumb. I suppose that this kind of goes to the writing of the show, but they needed to be more creative with getting rid of her for a little while.
Niles longing after Daphne was cute and endearing at first. It was funny that she had no clue and he was shy and married. But then they dragged it out for eight years. Come on. This show needs to end. This week we saw Niles and Daphne finally do it. AND NO ONE CARED!! If they had had that episode like five years ago it would have been interesting and what everyone would be talking about the next day.
When Daphne and Niles got together there was absolutely no chemistry between them whatsoever. Then of course there was the whole "Daphne is getting fat" storyline to cover up her real life pregancy which was just a little awkward. It may have jumped the shark before that when Daphne got engaged to the fat, ugly lawyer that no woman in her right mind would be attracted to.
The idiot who wrote his comment ALL IN CAPS WITH ALL OF HIS POINTLESS PROFANITY JUST SO HE COULD BE NOTICED fails to realize something. Although I agree that "Fraiser" is the most "intelligent" show on T.V. it just stopped being funny. This happened somewhere around the six season (which is why it did not win it's sixth Emmy in a row!) People need to learn that when something is no longer good that it's time to move on. And, sadly, Fraiser is just no longer any good.
Frasier jumped last year, big surprise, when Niles and Daphne got together. This could have been done well, with a lot of funny mistakes and false starts, but the writers just threw them into a full sitcom relationship right away (and they're already sleeping together?!!). Give me a break. You can also tell that the show has now just generally run out of ideas, because the characters are doing and saying things that don't mesh at all with the way they've been established for 7+ years (like recently Martin saying he was going to Belize to fish -- Martin would never have even heard of Belize, and gee, what an unexpected coincidence that Frasier and Niles were both going there, too!) When the plots get that contrived, you know they're out of ideas. And they just signed up for three more seasons? Lord help us.
This show jumped the shark when Niles and Daphne's relationship was out in the open. All of the sudden the show was not funny, it was all this mushy in love stuff. And on top of that, they tried to hide Daphne's real life pregnancy by writing in a weight problem! You watch, it's downhill from here on out. This past season was the worst season and I bet it's not going to get any better.
When they started the farce routines. Some critics support farce (done very well) as being in the realm of Commedia delle Arte (see, I can be pretentious too), but farce may be fun to act, but it's too 'in your face' to watch. Bring back the radio scenario (Bulldog, Gil Chesterton, brilliant Roz) and scrap Niles and Daphne. If this show jumps the shark, it's because of Niles n' Daphne!
When Daphne (finally) found out how Niles felt. It was teased forever. Actually, there were some bad episodes before this, but that's the one that really did it for me. I haven't enjoyed it as much since.
It hasn't jumped. It's wobbled a bit, but still stands firm. After the roller-coaster ride of S7, the departures of Joe Keenan and Christopher Lloyd, and Jane Leeve's unexpected pregnancy, S8 was always going to be a tricky one. It started well, but then quickly started to lose its balance and I became worried that the shark was going to jump up and bite "Frasier"'s arse. However, it's still by far the best sitcom ever and I'm more than happy to keep Frasier, Niles, Daphne, Martin and Roz in my life for another three years.
Anthony la Paglia is a fine australian actor who's convincingly american in Murder One and Empire Records, so accents shouldn't be too much of a problem. But not in Frasier. Simon, Daphne's oikish brother is supposed to be from Manchester. So he speaks Dick Van Dyke "Mock"ney which is like having someone born and bred in atlanta have a brother who's speaks straight outta brooklyn. You think he could have watched a few tapes of "Coronation St" or an episode of VH-1's "Behind the Music" with Oasis's Gallagher brothers by way of simple research?
When Niles finally admitted he loved Daphne and they have the tension of being together and not being together to keep the audience watching to see if they will end up together.
It's just been on too long. After the first couple of seasons it did a slow-mo jump. That whole Niles and Daphne thing was too played-out and probably contributed to the show's general suckiness.
The eighth season has sucked so badly that it depresses me. It's my favorite show up through the seventh season, but this past season has bombed so horribly I wouldn't have believed it possible. For one thing, the writing is no longer funny - this on a show where the writing was always its strongest point and wittier than anything else on television. I think they needed to put Niles and Daphne together - they probably played Daphne's oblivion out too long anyway, she's not stupid, so how the hell could she not notice? I hope they explain at some point that she did notice but made herself ignore it or something. Anyway, so putting them together was wonderful (I thought "Something Borrowed, Someone Blue" was the best episode ever), but now it is dead, and all I have to look forward to is three more seasons of cringing wistfully. So many things have been wrong with this season. Mel's reaction to Niles' running away was all right, but Donny's magically falling in love with someone else and letting them all off the hook was SUCH a cop-out... Then there's the fact that the funniest thing they can find to do with the Niles/Daphne relationship is to have Daphne roll around too vigorously when she's asleep, or have Niles get jealous of a random guy in a dog park. Romantic interplay between someone as anal as Niles and someone as down-to-earth as Daphne could be hysterical, but these sad new writers haven't done a thing. Then there was that horrible obesity thing (she should have been pregnant with DONNY'S BABY!! Now THERE'S a plot line!!  ), and the episode where she comes back and they have sex and it's absolutely painfully unfunny. For Christ's sake, not only were they making fat jokes, the funniest fat joke they could come up with was "You were ginormous!" Sheesh. And I'm curiously observing how long they can drag out the Frasier/Roz thing in order to try to keep people watching. They'll do an episode where it'll almost come out in the open (the broadcasting conference, Roz's affair with Dr. Tewksbury) and then back off and not mention it for another ten episodes. I think it's really stupid to put them together, but if they're going to do it, do it already. (Personally, I think it would be much better for Roz to be with Martin.) On the whole, I'm really saddened by its sudden decline. The old episodes constitute the best show ever. David Hyde Pierce is still the most hilarious actor on television, however.
Never Jumped! Show is still fresh, funny and intelligent. Reminds me of British comedy (the best on the planet) and that is the highest compliment I can give. Kudos to David Hyde Pierce and Kelsey Grammer for their brilliant acting!!
This one chokes the shark. It is so full of itself and, by reading the favorable comments (should I say "favourable?"), it plays right into the pretentiousness of intellectual wannabes out there. There are people writing here who are seriously using phrases like "bon mots," "realm of Commedia delle Arte," and "Wodehousian." In my early twenties I went through a period when I also fancied myself an Anglophile ("humour and theatre" -- puh-lease!) and made overly loud references in bars/at parties to crap I memorized in college literature courses (a desperate cry for attention), but --here's the key-- I GREW OUT OF IT. Some people don't grow out of that annoying phase and "Frasier" is for those people. I hope they all develop a lactose intolerance that hits them full-on at their next whine and cheese party.
JTS last season with the Daphne/Niles get together, not together/she's too fat, etc. I was really disappointed with the ultimate lack of chemistry between these characters. I will very much miss Niles' mooning over Miss Moon, as to me this was the funniest continuous thread of the show (close second, all Maris references). If they get Roz and Frazier together, this will be the ultimate final straw. I am glad to see that others have noticed that Marty and Roz have more chemistry than F&R! And I'm not joking, I think Marty and Roz would make a great couple, despite the age difference!
Though it was still considered a great show at the time, i think this show jumped the shark when Sammy came to visit. Sam comes out to Seattle for a visit and I realized that he carried that whole episode. Frasier was just a supporting character on his own show. Frasier on cheers was a great character but only because he started out a pompous ass and eventually became one of the boys at the bar. Frasier on Frasier however is just really fruity and there's no coolness in sight. This is a Frasier who would never even consider "running with scissors" If you catch that reference, you win a cookie.
When Niles and Daphne became a couple that was the end right there. To the show's credit they managed to hold that moment off for years, but the temptation was too great I suppose. The chemistry of the show was destroyed right there and then.
Frasier jumped the shark at the end of the 2000 season when Niles and Daphne ran off in Martin's Winnebago. That would've been a good way to end the series; instead, the producers decided to keep the viewers in suspense by making us wonder if Niles and Daphne will ever tie the knot! At this point, I really don't care. I've also grown tired of seeing episodes about Frasier's angst and social ineptitude, as it has become rather repetitive and annoying. Frasier is a tiresome show that's been going downhill for the past four or five seasons. The earliest shark jump I can recall was when Niles and Frasier spent the entire show talking on their cell phones and calling their elitist friends to arrange a dinner party. Frankly, that episode was about as interesting as watching dust settle on my VCR! As far as I'm concerned, they might as well throw Frasier in the shark tank because it's not funny anymore.
This show still rules. I hate it when people say that it is bad to put the characters in silly situations and misunderstandings. That is part of the fun. Frasier and Niles are sort of uptight about things like that so it is funny to see them get into situations like they do. They mix more sophisticated jokes with slapstick humor. It is fun to watch them run around and hear their jokes. Besides it isn't art. Oh yeah, that episode were they owned the restaurant was brilliant and so was the one were Niles swordfights the funniest. David Hyde Pierce Rules!
Consistently clever and intelligent. Characters occasionally border on slapstick but manage to rescue themselves with real wit. Major plot development of Niles and Daphne has so far been a boon rather than a loss.
Yeah, this show has had a few losers (hell, nobody can be brilliant & funny ALL of the time!) But it's STILL one of the best comedies on the air. It was derived from "Cheers" (which was really good!) but this is even better! Yeah, I know, I'm sure I'll get some arguments on THAT one  Oh, by the way: who was the DIP**** who typed HIS/HER ENTIRE COMMENT IN CAPS JUST TO GRAB ATTENTION, & THEN PROCEEDED TO **** ALL OVER THE SHOW & ANYBODY WHO WATCHES IT? Gee, I think you were confused because Mommy didn't read it to you correctly; I'm sure you'd wanted to comment on "Romper Room" instead! Come back to me when you grow up! Bottom line is, this is a very funny, well-done show which is a blast to watch. Frasier, Niles (God, Niles!), Daphne, all of them! I'll keep watching!
While I do think that Frasier has lost some of it's original wit, I don't believe it has jumped anything. This show has the BEST characters on TV and some of the funniest one liners around. I have always believed that some people don't like this show simply because they don't get the jokes.
The writers have tried too hard to keep a dead horse alive. Once the Daphne/Niles situation was written the show looked pretty silly. Kelsey Grammar acts in in the styles of Hamlet and Jack Benny, this really started to grate on me the last few years. Although I still like Daphne and Roz's characters they are not as fun and original as previously done. I thought the accents at the wedding were really funny, even though I'm an American. Daphne's brother, who is really from Australia, tried to use a Cockney accent which came out as a strange blend of Cockney, Australian, American accents. I've always been suspicious of Daphne's accent (that has been confirmed by the Brits in previous comments.) The really strange thing is that the only person really from Manchester is John Mahoney who plays Frasier's father. I don't quite see how this plot and characters are going to work on the new three year contract. I feel that we've had about enough of them, I have enjoyed the show over the years but someone running the networks has to know when it's time to end a show.
I'll admit it; the last couple of seasons have had FRASIER dangerously close to jumping. However, there's been enough hilarious moments to keep it from jumping. Also, now that the Niles and Daphne subplot appears to have been resolved, the next season looks brighter. All in all, this show and BECKER are the only two sitcoms on the main networks worth watching.
Niles and Daphne getting together really seals this show's "jumping the shark" status. It's still a fine show, and very amusing, but I have a feeling that it's really a slow, downhill ride from here. I just hope the writers can land us safely.
It came close when Roz got pregnant by some kid. I think it is the best comedy on television. When Frasier and Niles went up to the ski chalet with Daphne and her boozy friend...that was the best I friggin roared for that half hour..Bulldog is great too..
Frasier jumped the shark when they couldn't think of anything to do with Roz so they made her pregnant. It totally took the jazz out of the character.
It's been jumping for some time now but it has not quite cleared the shark, thanks to virtuoso screenwriting...Having Daphne 'fat' while the audience knew all to well that Jane Cleeves was pregnant was such clever 'inside' joke that it was acceptable and we all went along for the ride. Is there a category for fans jumping the shark with their favorite show? Fraser Crane is already the longest running character in tv--will Kelsey Grammar find another vehicle for Dr. Crane? Hope not.
I still love this show, but my main problem with it is when every other episode is about some wacky misunderstanding. Not only is it repetitive and predictible, but it insults the viewers' intelligence when "Frasier" is supposed to be one of the more sophisticated sitcoms on tv. My favorite episode is the one where Frasier and Niles have to go to a New Year's Party with their dad and Eddie in his Winebago. Anyone who has ever been on a road trip with their family can see why this could be so funny. "Dad, Im begging you...."
The show "Jumped the Shark" once Niles professed his love for Daphne. There was a tension before..and now it is gone. They really have run out of ideas..it is just chugging along. The contrast between the "upper class" crane brothers vs. their working class father was great. But, that story angle was discarded for the focus on the "Niles and Daphne" storyline.
The second Niles nailed Daphne. Watching him squirm around her from much more fun. They should forget about Niles and Daphne and give Eddie more airtime.
When Niles and Daphne ran off together, the shark was looming. After they had settled into their oh-so-boring relationship, despite the occasionally amusing bits with former flames Mel and Donnie, the show became yet another happy-relationship with-the-occasional-crisis show. It's a sad day when the title character becomes a second-banana to his supporting cast.
It did a minor jump when Fraser's program mgr. had a kid. The major jump was when Daphne & Niles got together. That ruined half the premise of the show. I haven't watched it since. I think they split up & did Daphne have a kid too? Murphy Brown ruined her show when she had kid too. Several adult shows have been ruined because they put a kid in it & they still don't learn. Why can't the networks understand that not everyone on the planet wants or requires a kid in a show or movie. It's as if they imagine an adult living life without having a kid, like it's unnatural. I'm a adult & I want to watch intelligent witty shows with adults in them & no kids. There are many of us who never had kids, by choice, & enjoy shows that don't have them in them. We don't, & don't want to, relate to shows that have kids in them.
When Niles called Roz a bitch; I knew the show was doomed. About two years ago the writers must have changed. The urbane, sophisticated style of humor changed slapstick potty humor.Maybe it is true that 18 and 19 year olds are writing all the shows now.
The show is running out of new ideas, therefore, losing its humor.
When Niles and Daphne got together- the spark in their relationship just disappeared along with all the humour that went along with it and surely after all these years of building up our anticipation the writers could have come up with a better scenario than the cliched 'running out on a wedding' to get them together. And when they did get together they became SO boring. I loved Frasier- why couldn't they end it while it was at the height of its hilarity rather than dragging it out over the past couple of years.
On Tuesday Sept 11, 2001 at approx. 8:45 AM when American Airlines flight 11, carrying David Angell and his wife and many other victims, crashed into the North tower of the World Trade Center. Shows depend on talented creators/producers. When they are gone, as MASH proved, the show is lost. God blessed us with David Angell's humor. I just wish it had lasted a lot longer. God bless all the victims and there loved ones.
The 2000-2001 Season was stink-o. Daphne and Niles getting together? I'd rather see Maris! But Kelsey Grammar really jumped the shark a few seasons back when he quit being Frasier and was yet another tiring and not very good Jack Benny imitator.
Frasier has recently jumped the shark.The first episode of this current season had a wonderful show wherein Frasier was wondering why he couldn't keep a woman in his life-and ended up having all kinds of discussions with images of the important women in his life,including Lilith and Diane.(Hi,Shelley.) After this,Frasier seemed content with himself after going over all the troubles he had with different women and realizing his identity because of it. I feel any other show after this would be definitely anticlimactic.Niles and Daphne are together now as well.Their relationship has always been great-but it doesn't seem they can go anywhere from here except marriage or total breakup! The promos said that this year Roz would find love...with a garbageman?Hmmm.Remember the Cheers finale when Rebecca found love with a plummer?Sure sounds repetitive.I love Roz and admire her friendship with Frazier...but what will happen to her now doesn't sound too promising. It may be hard after sooo many years in one role,but Kelsey Grammer should really consider moving on. 'Nuff said!
Frasier jumped when the producers changed the show from being performed by the cast in front of a live audience to one put straight onto tape which was THEN shown to an audience. The original format looked fresh, as though we were actually there with them - the audience reaction was spontaneous and the actors were able to time their lines accordingly, just like being on stage. When it changed it became just another sitcom, with some guy in the control booth enhancing the laugh track when he felt it needed doing, often at the expense of the next line.
When Daphne's real-life pregnancy was explained as her getting fat! It either could have been written in very easily with her ex-fiancée being the father (Donny). He was a good addition. Or Niles could have been the father. Or they could have just not discussed it as many shows have done! Seinfeld shot around Julia Louis-Dreyfus' pregnancy beautifully!
The episode where Niles discovers his "wild side" and becomes Isand Niles is the worst episode I've seen yet. By the end even Niles gives up on it.
Frasier has had its ups and downs, but mostly ups, and has never jumped the shark. The latest episode (Bla-Z-Boy) is proof that Frasier still has it.
200 episodes of Niles and Daphne. Wow.
For me it never jumped, but the ramps are built and the Harley is revving. The Niles & Daphne thing did get old and Frazier out of work was dull, but the problem I have this season is that Frazier is not just highbrow, he is mean. All he does is yell at his friends and strangers. They need to introduce some additional friends for all of the characters. Not every show, but they need new blood. With the moving of Scrubs to Thursday, Frasier is out there on his own. The rest of the night sucks, which is why we watch Gilmore Girls before Frasier. On the plus side, Roz is wearing boots more often. The Halloween episode from several years ago when Roz announces she is preggers was a classical with her in thigh high boots.
When Bill Gates showed up on the 200th episode and was on there simply to advertise his new version of Windows. A show that stoops to getting guest stars that only advertise has shown that it is on the downfall.
I have to admit, the storylines of the last season or so of Frasier became tiresome (the Niles/Daphne romance), but recently Frasier has gained back its creative spark. Frasier is an intelligent show that is well written and well cast; each character has something for everyone. Things that I enjoy overall about the show: 1)The barbs that are traded between Frasier and his father; even through the insults, they end up patching things up and it shows a real bond between Frasier and his Dad. 2) Niles and his physical humor; I love the slapstick that he brings to the show. 3) Eddie is great! 4) The "working class" vs. the "upper class" exchanges between Roz and Frasier. There are many more items too numerous to mention here. I recently watched the 200th episode of Frasier (Wow, has it been 200 episodes already?). During the "outtakes" portion of the episode, Bob Costas interviewed the cast of Frasier, and asked Kelsey Grammer how many more seasons of Frasier are left. Grammer stated that he has played the character of Frasier for 18 years (amazing), and he foresaw Frasier going for 11 seasons before it would be laid to rest. I pray that the writing remains fresh and that whenever that inevitable day Frasier stops, that it goes out with a bang. Good luck to the cast and staff of Frasier--keep up the good work!!
The Bill Gates episode. An advertisement for Windows XP! I want to watch the show, not have some huckster hawking products.
Although I don't think this show has jumped, it is coming dangerous close. The episode with Bill Gates was nothing more then a commercial for his new Windows upgrade. The Niles and Daphne line is getting tired. Why doesn't Daphne move in with Niles? It is just silly that she is staying with Frasier. Come on...who would have their brother's girlfriend as their live in maid. The acting and writing on this show has always been first rate and I hope they bow out before it gets too bad.
Frasier jumped the shark when Frasier got fired from his radio show. Before that it was entertaining seeing the chemistry he had with his radio partners and it also made some great storylines then when he got fired and became friends with his coworkers it never bounced back.
Frasier just got old over time. Its still not a bad show or anything, it just gets too repetitive. The plots seem too recycled and the characters don't have the same effect that they used to.
A noticeable moment and visible even in the body language of the cast; these people are obviously ready to move on although it has been a great show.
When Frasier became so feminine. What's with all the Jack Benny moves and gestures?
The writers blew it when they shifted the focus of the show to Daphne and Nils. Suddenly, not only is the key comic element of Nils' character lost, but suddenly we're getting these "touchy -feely" episodes in a farce program that had once been free of them. An ominous sign.
Frasier has been a great show, one of my all time favorites. But all good things come to an end, and as most have noticed this show has jumped. It happened the second Niles and Daphne started to date. Maybe they ran out of steam, there was nothing left to do but put them together, but the fact is the magic the show had is now gone, please cancel it before it reaches bottom and our memories of what a good show it once was become tainted by how bad it may get.
Since Frasier will never find a steady love interest to match Lillith there's no more hope for sexual tension.
The cast members from Cheers have been on for a total of 5 or 6 episodes, out of 200+. I don't think it's lame. After all, Frasier is a continuation of the same character on that shore. Why shouldn't his old friends -- esp his ex-wife and ex-fiancee -- pop up once or twice? The problem is that in those episodes (except possibly the ones with Lilith) they seemed forced, like they were 'plunked down' the 'yanked off' without any continuity. Maybe because you hardly hear their names mentioned, whereas Lilith's name comes up more frequently (as it should). I also think the writers of this series did an excellent job of moving Frasier's character from being at the stuffy/pompous end of the spectrum on "Cheers", with Diane, to the middle of the road on "Frasier" with Martin at one end and the more pompous Niles at the other. Brilliant way to make a marginal character interesting.
The show JTS when the radio station crew lost their job, but the have recovered that fumble. After 6+ years, the writing is more erratic (and yes, repetitious), but what show doesn't? Even I Love Lucy and All in the Family lost some luster toward the end of their runs (in contrast, I think Dick Van Dyke did not). Still, the writing is still better than 75% of what else is on TV.
Since this show is technically a continuation of Frasier Crane's life after he leaves Boston and Cheers, I think it would be fair to say that this show jumped the first time it aired. On "Cheers," Frasier mentions not once, but SEVERAL times that he is an only child, both of his parents were scientists, and they are now both dead. Whatever convoluted formula that brought Martin Crane back from the dead and retroactively changed his profession and gave him another son is certainly tantamount to JTS.
Frasier jumped the shark on last night's episode when Daphne's mother moved in with Niles, yet Daphne still lives with Frasier and Martin. Classic shark jumpage. New guest star, weird tension because of a living arrangement that makes no sense, crusty new guest star 'shaking things up'
To the last contributor of this thread, I too was wondering about that inconsistency with Frasier's father but in the "Home Malone" episode, these loose ends are tied up as Ted Danson's character remembers Frasier telling him that his father was a scientist and had passed away. Needless to say, Martin wasn't too happy about it. Also, it was good to see Frasier grow a backbone in the January 16 episode in which he throws deadbeat Simon out on his gluteals.
This show jumped the shark at whatever point the original writers/directors/ producers departed. The two worst developments were Roz's pregnancy/child and Niles and Daphne finally becoming a couple. The show used to be a must watch for me. Now it's just tired and boring.
This show is supposedly set in Seattle, but I don't think any producer has ever been here. Nobody dresses that way here, or can afford an apartment like that just by being an overglorified dj. They should have stayed in Boston (Cheers). Also, the plot is such brainless crap; characters with grad degrees does not an intelligent show make. It is just an cliche i love lucy/ happy days sitcom with a line of poetry thrown in every once in a while. My wife watches this, but it makes me physically ill.
Definitely jumped when the Ropers and Chrissy left... oh yeah, right, this is Frasier. This show used several ramps to jump the shark: 1) dumb Three's Company miscommunication plots 2) Roz's pregnancy (the baby apparently now lives with Chuck from Happy Days somewhere in the Twilight Zone) 3) changed premises-- Frasier's mother was on Cheers, played by Nancy Marchand (Livia Soprano), and she kept threatening to kill Diane... but now it seems that she's been dead for years and was the sweetest woman ever 4) finally, that anniversary episode filmed in Seattle where Kelsey Grammar sang a jazzed up version of "Tossed Salad and Scrambled Eggs" with a bunch of idiots on a stage-- there aren't enough synonyms of the word "awful" for me to adequately describe that. I can't believe this show won 5 straight Emmys for Best Comedy when Seinfeld, The Simpsons, and Larry Sanders were all in their prime!
When they created the serious relationship between Niles and Daphne. In some way I believe this was to end rumors that Nile was gay, which I believe would have been a better storyline. I believe night time TV hire too many day time drama writers. They can't help going down the same old road of boy have sex with girl.
The only way to save this show is to have BOTH Niles and Frasier admit they are gay. Then make it all a dream sequence, where Frasier wakes up on the bar in Cheers and everyone is old or dead. Show sucks, my girlfriend makes me watch it.
This show jumped the shark on Feb. 5, 2002, when Niles proposed to Daphne and she said yes. Though there will be many funny shows between now and their wedding, this was the biggest shark jump since David Duchovny left "The X-Files."
When Niles and Daphne hooked up. Although Daphne's obliviousness to Niles' crush on her was ridiculous at times, Niles and Daphne are even more ridiculous as a couple. I cringe every time they act all lovey-dovey.
You just knew the show was jumping as Daphne and Niles got into that RV, but I think the official jump happened when they finally got rid of Mel. I'm pretty tired of the two pompous prigs who can't find happiness in their relationships, and I don't even mind that NYPD Blue competes with Frasier this season.
This show "jumped" when you expected a savvy, pop-culture audience to buy the Niles/Daphne thing. Everyone who is a fanatic about the show knows that he's gay, which makes it really hard to "get into" the characters. Although I love David Hyde Pierce, I watch the show for Kelsey Grammer. It's a shame their wasting creativity on useless story lines for Kelsey while entertaining midgets dressed as angels for some completely unbelievable marriage proposal. Perhaps Maris and Lillith ought to come back during the final wedding episode and declare that their having a baby with David Crosby.
Season one. As good as the show can be, it jumped because the Boston incarnation of Frasier would beat the living hell out of Seattle Frasier every day of the week and twice on Sundays. The infusion of sensitive male to the old school Frasier never jelled.
The 200th episode with special guest Bill Gates. A completely idiotic interview by Frasier followed by his tiresome fit when later realizing that one of his radio show tapes was missing. Stupid and annoying beyond belief.
'Frasier' jumped the shark when Niles and Daphne started dating. For some reason, this granted Niles the right to completely break character and become 'cool' and relaxed instead of being the uptight, foppish intellectual that we used to know and love.
"Frasier" jumped the shark when Niles and Daphne finally found eachother. Niles' longing for Daphne had an at least twofold function: Niles had his lovelife blurred not only by Maris' regular phonecalls, but also by the daily meetings with the fresh and simple, yet distanced and forbidden Daphne. After they "did it", both Niles and Daphne have lost their character. Niles is all too happy and sedate, and Daphne suddenly lost all her strange sex appeal.
Frasier almost jumped the shark in it's eighth season, but season nine has regained some of the show's greatness. The recent episode in which Niles proposed to Daphne was brilliant, with wonderful standout scenes such as Frasier and Niles choosing the ring. The season nine premiere featurning Diane, Lilith and Rita Wilson as Hester Crane was also fabulous, as was the episode when Frasier accidently destroyed Martin's beloved chair.
Frasier deserves the accolades it's received since it started, and I think some people are just talking crap. If the writers still had the Niles-secretly-loves-Daphne story in season nine, there would be loads of criticism about the storyline being over-used. Instead, the writers had taken the storyline as far as they possibly good, producing some of the best shows along the way (Moon Dance, First Date, Daphne Hates Sherry etc). The "will-they, won't they" stories were great, but the writers wisely brought the story to an end before it became repetitive. Criticisms? Well, Niles has definetly changed from being prissy, snobbish and articulate to being far more relaxed and acceptable, and he and Daphne have turned into a "double act" of sorts, in that neither has a storyline without the other being involved. Also, it would be great to see more use of some characters like Bebe Glazer. Bebe is brilliantly wicked, and every episode she's in has been hilarious (Agents In America, The Zoo Story). Sadly we see her only once every two seasons, and recently in the episode "Junior Agent" she's handed Frasier's affairs over to her incompetent junior agent. Bring back Bebe and soon! Also, more Bulldog now that he's apparently working at the station again, and where's Gil Chesterton this season? The only man able to out-snob Niles, Gil has been strangely missing recently. Finally, it would be nice to see Frasier go back to Boston for an episode, and maybe have him and Lilith reunite for a few episodes? Oh please, enough of these "Frasier gets a date and it goes badly" episodes. Bring back Lilith!
Frasier jumped when Daphne left the alter and joined up with Niles. Were we supposed to be sympathetic to the Niles character and root for him? You can root for a nerd or an eccentric character, but Niles was also a selfish character... and too over the top.
After Cheers the continuation of Frasier has long made the character dried out and boring, plus every station seems to show the reruns, we are overdosing on Frasier Crane and his family. Father Martin still uses a cane for a prop rather than for recovering from a stroke, Niles is always horny. And all they seem to do is bitch, bitch, and bitch. Please stop making Kelsey Grammer wealthy and put Frasier out of its misery!
The two-parter at a costume ball where the world discovers Roz is pregnant and believes Frasier is the father.
I never used to miss this show until it went overboard with the completely unbelievable Niles & Daphne rubbish. So when are Frasier & Roz going to marry each other?
Good Frasier news: the cast of Cheers will be reuniting on Frasier in May, in an episode called "Cheerful Farewells", in which Cliff is having a retirement party at the bar, and Frasier attends. However, Clavin is planning to leave Boston, so Frasier is given the task of convincing him to stay! This should be a great episode. Not only will we see the old bar again, but so far Carla, Norm and Cliff are onboard. Whether the rest of the Cheers gang will be on hasnt been stated yet, but surely they will.
Never Jumped -- I will say that with Frasier losing his job and with the relationship between niles and daphnie taking an unbelievable amount of time there are clear grounds for making the case for the shark jump -- but I still find the show funny and entertaining, as well as appreciate the characters and the role they play.
"Frasier" is a show that started out brilliantly but has jumped and jumped and jumped. The first jump was Roz's baby. The second jump was Frasier getting the whole radio station fired. Then it jumped again when Daphne started dating the ruthless attorney, and then again when Niles dated and married that women Mel. And of course once Niles and Daphne got together the writers ran out of any juice to keep it interesting. The problem is that "Frasier" was roughly a show that should have lasted no more than seven years max that keeps going and going and going. BEST EPISODES: Ice fishing, the radio murder mystery, the opening of the brother's restaurant, Niles and Daphne dancing, the RV trip to Canada, and the one with Jerome the mafia guy. WORST EPISODES: Any episode where sex is a major plotline and/or the humor is mostly double entendre.
Last few episodes (last one in particular) were so lame, I am canceling my TiVO season pass. Every time I watch this show now, I just start singing the Happy Days theme and revving my Fonzie motorcycle in reference to this site.
Well, this show jumped the moment Daphne climbed into that Winnebago with Niles. BUT... Frasier has a rare chance to unjump this April when about half the Cheers cast (Norm, Cliff, Carla, even Paul) guest-stars. The plot: Frasier is in Boston for a shrink convention and runs into the gang who are on their way to Cliff's retirement party. THIS IS NOT A RUMOR! The episode was taped about a week ago, according to a couple well-informed Frasier websites. This Cheers-aholic can't wait. I say if this episode is funny, Frasier has a chance to hit the "reset" button on its comedy half-life. Whatever that means.
This show jumped the shark about the time Frasier lost his job. I think the show really went down the tubes when they stopped inviting big talent onto the show: Sherry Mason, Mercedes Ruehl and Bebe the talent agent. Also the cast at the radio station was great: Bull Dog Briscoe and Gil Chesterton and that guy who did the Star Trek imitations, were hysterical. By themselves, the regular ensemble isn't too funny. Kelsey Grammar and David Hyde Pierce can play well off each other, but they haven't been given great material in years. It's a shame, but I think this show jumped the shark because it started taking its audience for granted and thought it could save some bucks by not inviting on any more top talent guests (which is the reason many of us started watching in the first place). Count me in as one of their many ex-fans. A friend of mine said it best when he commented that he won't watch a show any more when it turns sour - and in this case he was talking about Frasier.
I loved having Niles and Daphne finally get together. But talk about an ill-timed pregnancy! Just when they're supposed to get hot and heavy, she suddenly "gains weight" and has to go to a fat farm. Now she looks tired and isn't as bubbly and sexy as she used to be. Also, the episodes haven't been directed by some of the best directors from past episodes - Pam Fryman, Scott Shriner, Kelsey Grammar - and whoever's directing now is just plain bad. Who brought in the character of Kirby Lenley? NOT FUNNY! I hope they never use his character again. Don't get me wrong, I love this show -I am a Frasier Connoisseur - and will watch faithfully until its demise; but I have so many past episodes on tape and can compare them with today's shows, so I can definitely see the difference. And put Niles back into suits - Daphne can't have changed him THAT much!
Never jumped, but I wonder if it's time to put the show to rest before it does jump. Maybe it's me, but after 9/11, it's hard to get drawn into Frasier and Nile's peeves, worrying about purchasing a certain vintage wine, concerned about their parking spaces. It's getting more difficult for me, an average middle class guy to relate to the characters problems. I don't know how everyone else feels, and again, maybe it's me. The writing is still superb, but I wonder if the show needs a change of scenery, or a love interest for Frasier, because frankly, the relationship between Niles and Daphne really isn't that interesting. Comedy is funnier when the characters CAN'T get what they want. As Charles M. Schultz once said, whats funny about winning? Nile's lust for Daphne resulted in great comic tension (remember how upset he was when Daphne went out with that Niles clone?)which has now been deflated.
Managed to dodge some pretty close shaves - but then ... Daphne's brother!! And then, as if that had been a good idea, Daphne's family!! And they keep on coming back!!!
I thought it had jumped when Niles proposes to Daphne on the balcony the day before her wedding with Donnie. After that the shows seemed to have run out of clever plots and, much worse, Niles lost that edge he used to have, he would irritate the heck out of Frasier every now and then, now he seems very subdued, he is not clever anymore.
Never jumped! True, I feared the worst when 1) Roz had her baby a while ago, and 2) Niles and Daphne finally hooked up. It's so dangerous to put a longing love in a show, because eventually you'll have to get them together, and then, well.... it usually goes down hill. For example, Lois and Clark. Remember that show? Exactly. But back to Fraiser... I don't think they've jumped. Even though Roz is a mom and Niles and Daphne are deleriously happy, the show manages to stay intelligent and witty, and not cruise towards soap opera as it could. Even the Daphne is "not" pregnant, wink wink nudge nudge, deal was witty-ly played out.... I mean they could have actually made her pregnant, which would have been AWFUL. Instead they made it tounge-in-cheek, ironic even... and sent her off to a "spa." Which was good, although I think I would have preferred they simply hide it, as they did with Elaine on Seinfield. But still, never jumped. I think the reason that it's still great because they don't focus every episode on the ongoing dramas, but instead on isolated incidents, and on the little neurosies that have always made the show so amazing.
This show has gone through the bumps you would expect from any 9 year old show, but has generally remained quality entertainment. But what were they thinking adding that moron Kirby? Kirby is the type of idiotic, unfunny character you'd expect on some insipid tripe on the WB, not a show that was once known for being literate and witty. Frasier is still a strong show because of the great chemistry between familiar characters, but if jumping the shark is the moment when you know a good show is slipping, then the debut of the inane Kirby is a fitting example.
Although it's a great achievement for an actor and a character, I think the problem with this show is that we've known Frasier Crane for too long. There's nothing new to learn.
Daphne's 'English' brother had a completely different, completely faux English accent from her when she was going to marry the short guy.
The character of Roz Doyle sickens me. While she demands to be taken seriously in her profession, her nocturnal activities rival those of only the most meritricious of all nymphomaniacs. The episode where she gets herself knocked up is when "Frasier" definitely jumped for me. Asking us for mercy? Puh-leeze. Try being more responsible, you promiscuous little so-and-so. Then instead of raising her daughter properly, she continues her Roman ludi as though nothing happened. As if the show could not sink any lower, it jumped again when Teri Polo guest starred as that egomaniacal lawyer Frasier was dating.
The shark appears in jumping range whenever Frasier's revolting son Frederick appears (which isn't too often, thank god). There is NO WAY that this kid would ever be Frasier's son and NO WAY he could be a child prodigy. Winner of the Spelling Bee? What words did he spell? Pizza, Pie and Cakes presumably. By the way, I agree with the comments concerning Niles and Daphne - too devoted and too dull.
I thought, I wished, I hoped the Cheers reunion could somehow force this show back in time to its prime. But not even Norm and Cliff and Carla could re-ignite this show's soggy spark. It wasn't a bad episode, per se, just not the satisfying throwback I think a lot of people were really expecting. Actually, perhaps the only thing that would have met expectations would have been for the gang to be IN Cheers. OK, point is that if all this talent couldn't produce a really bang-up Frasier, nothing at this point will. Kill it.
The day K.G. signed one of the most lucrative TV contracts ever the character of Frasier lost some sparkle. Frasier seems more 2-D even since: there is a certain sparkle and lightness that I miss. Before I could believe the character, but now there is a subtle feeling that K.G. only cares about showing up, slamming out some 10-15 minutes worth of lines, collecting a 7 figure check and hitching the corporate helicopter back home. The K.G. of before is clearly not the K.G. of after. Watch an old Frasier-centric Cheers episode immediately followed by a 2nd or 3rd season Frasier immediately followed by any episode after the signing and you'll see what I mean. The money spoiled the character - it has unquestionably changed him and the show is suffering.
Well, it hasn't happened YET...but the boat is approaching the ramp. The shark is warming up. Promos for upcoming episodes imply a romance between Frasier and Roz. If this isn't just hype, this will be the big jump.
To the above poster regarding a romance between Roz and Frasier. It was bound to happen eventually. There's no one else left. He's already slept with everyone else in Seattle and so has she. That only leaves each other. And it jumped when Daphne found out about Niles feelings for her. No more tension.
If Frasier and Roz "get it on," you might as well drive a stake through the show's heart and have done with it. For all his faults, Frasier is an intelligent man who would find it hard to overlook the lack of self-esteem that Roz's promiscuity signifies, to say nothing of her deliberate ignorance of the high culture he values. Roz, for her part, would take Frasier's anal-retentive whining as a boyfriend for about a third of a nano-second before blowing him off for the nearest bar.
I really used to like this show, but I don't know why anyone wastes their time on it anymore. It's very, very tired. Nothing new or fresh.
Frasier Crane and Roz love interest- jump...jump...jump!
I totally agree with that last poster. After seeing the "Frasier" promo during the NBC 75th Anniversary show tonight, I can honestly say that all my respect for this great show now resembles a toilet bowl, and that toilet bowl is big enough to hold all the JTS sharks. DOUBLE WOW! So... now that Fras and Roz are in the sack, and we already had Niles and Lilith (!), there really aren't any plots left, decent or otherwise, that haven't been used... unless, God forbid, Roz and Daphne do it. Put this show out of its mystery now before the plots can get any worse.
Frasier has had a great run, but the ersatz "Cheers Reunion" marked its nadir. It was OK to have an occasional cast-member from "Cheers" stop by from time to time for Sweeps, but the gathering of that show's "lesser lights" not only pointed out how lame "Cheers" was at the end but that the folks putting together Frasier have finally run out of ideas. The Harley barely had enough gas to get down the ramp and unenthusiastically over the shark.
When Roz- she of the irritating "Shedd's Spread" whine, and Marty- who would never have limped like Pegleg after a hip replacement(I know from experience) suddenly became integral parts. Recast 'em & maybe I can see it. Over the years for example, Marty's character has turned into a selfish, shallow old clod. Roz NEVER belonged on this show.
The "Cheers" reunion was a BIG disappointment. Frasier has become a flat caricature of himself and I think it's time to put an end to this show. Here's a possible ending: Frasier wakes up one morning and finds Eddie doing his business on Frasier's prized Oriental rug. Enraged, Frasier grabs Eddie and throws him over the balcony. Martin enters the room just as Eddie is going over the balcony. Martin goes ballistic and attacks Frasier with his quad cane. Martin then has a heart attack and falls into his favorite easy chair where he dies. Frasier calls for an ambulance and Martin is taken to the morgue to be toe tagged. Distraught over his father's death, Frasier calls Niles and tells him what happened. Niles pressures Frasier for details about their father's death and, in his usual clumsy way, Frasier admits he was responsible for Martin's fatal heart attack. Niles is furious with Frasier and tells him he doesn't want anything more to do with him and that he should drop dead. Distraught over his estrangement from Niles, Frasier makes several more clumsy attempts to reconcile with his brother by contacting Daphne frequently and often. Alienating her in the process too. The next day, Lillith shows up unannounced at Frasier's apartment and tells him she wants to get back together. Lillith tells Frasier her life has been a disaster since their divorce and begs him to give their relationship another chance. She then asks him if he will consider moving back to Boston with her. Frasier then tells Lillith about Martin's death and his estrangement from Niles. Lillith tries to reassure Frasier that Martin's death wasn't his fault and that Niles will get over it. Meanwhile, Roz has finally found true love. Roz's new "soul mate" is an Episcopal priest who gives her the love and validation she's always wanted. Roz also gets religion and gives up broadcasting to start a home for wayward mothers. While trying to decide whether or not to give his relationship with Lillith a second chance, Frasier makes another clumsy attempt to mend fences with Niles. Frasier calls Niles and tries to explain that Martin's death really wasn't his fault. He then tells Niles he's thinking about going back to Boston and remarrying Lillith. After a few seconds of stone cold silence, Niles tells Frasier, "Have a good life." And hangs up. Distraught over Martin's death and Niles' rebuffs, Frasier calls Lillith at her hotel room and asks her to meet him for dinner at his condo later that evening. After dinner Frasier tells Lillith that his life is a shambles and he now realizes just how much he loves and cares for her. Frasier then tells Lillith he wants to move back to Boston with her. Lillith is delighted and the two start making wedding plans. In the final scene, as the movers are taking the last pieces of furniture from Frasier’s apartment, Frasier starts having flashbacks. As he recalls some of the things that happened while he was living in Seattle, he starts feeling very melancholy. He stands alone in his empty apartment for a moment and then heads for the door. As he’s about to leave, he mutters, "Will the last person leaving Seattle, please turn out the lights." He then turns and looks back at the empty apartment, turns off the living room light and closes the door behind him for the final time.
UGH. I can't believe they're going to have a Frasier-Roz romantic storyline. These two have absolutely NO sexual chemistry together. In fact, Kelsey Grammer has been terrible at pulling off chemistry with anybody. It's always annoyed me that all these beautiful women fall at his feet, too; he's not the most attractive man in the world, and he's very arrogant and verbose. But this thing with Roz... it was bad enough when they spent all that time poking fun at Daphne's weight while Jane Leeves was pregnant (why is it that overweight people are always portrayed as eating constantly?! I remember they had her hiding eclairs in different spots in the apartment... note to writers: OVERWEIGHT PEOPLE DO NOT SIT AROUND AND DO NOTHING BUT EAT ALL DAY LONG. Jesus.), but this is worse. This show has to stop before it becomes too embarrassing to watch.
It is going to jump in a couple days. I may have been close when Niles and Daphne finally got together...but Frasier and Roz? That's just lazy writing, especially in sweeps.....What's next? Martin and Eddie?
Never jumped, but incidently...Frasier will inevitably get back together with Lilith; remember that episode of "Cheers" when they flash forwarded to the future, to the reading of Frasier's will, with Frederick and the widow Crane, e.g. Lilith, present? You get the impression from the scene that Lilith and Frasier were married. Thus, they must reconcile at some point.
This show jumped the shark on tonight's episode. Roz and Frasier knocked the boots. Now, the show will soon be knocked off the air
The show jumped the shark when Frasier and Roz slept together. Or when Daphne and Niles got together. My favorite Frasier was when He and Niles took an Auto-Repair class at Night School. "Were not in trouble, we ARE Trouble..." incredibly funny episode. My Favorite Scene was when Niles was preparing for a date(with a man obviously) in Frasiers apartment and he found a loose thread on his trouser leg... The 5 minutes of hilarity that ensues is second only to a Fauly Towers episode. That was brilliantly funny to me. My main problem with Frasier is Niles Crane. David Hyde-Pierce is the most unconvincing Hetrosexual in Television History. Billy Crystal on Soap was more Macho than Niles. I watch frasier and just cant suspend belief enough to maybe possibly think Niles is NOT a gay man. It just doesnt work for me, never has. Overall, the show is brilliant with great, great writing-BUT Now that Frasier has jumped the shark I wonder if it can rebound into another stellar season of writing and situations... they are running out of steam for this show.
What Frasier has taught me is that the amount you date is somehow inversely proportional to how big of a loser you are(l=k/t, l=how big a loser you are, k=positive proportionality constant, t=frequency you date per week). The proportionality constant can be found by graphing the frequency of Roz dates per episode versus the amount of time Frasier spends with his son(this obviously approaces zero very quickly and thereby produes a verticle asymptote at t=pi/4). Modeling this with differential equations leads to a sink at the point(3, 6)(this neglects the added forcing equation sin(t)+t/4 which accounts for Eddie's sexual ambiquity). I have found the proportinality constant to be the irrational number e.
The show worked because of the will they/wont they storyline.There was great tension and suspense.We new nothing nice was ever going to happen to any one else in the story,esp.Frasier.Show is still great,but not quite the same.Still compulsory viewing on friday nights here in England.
"Frasier" was one of my favorite shows before the new team of writers took over when the show moved back to Thursday nights. Overnight, the show went from inspired to insipid. Not only isn't the show funny anymore, but the new writers clearly don't understand the culture that Frasier's character comes from. Frasier is supposed to be a cultured, well-heeled snob; now he just seems like a wannabe with very bad taste. I used to watch this show every week, now I never watch.
The relationship between Niles and Daphne is just ludicrous. It was more fun when he just appeared to be a lovesick teenager. One roll in the hay should have cured him.
It never has. It is still wonderful. We want to see Daphne and Niles together. And maybe Frasier and Lisa. She seems like a nice balance for him.I also would like to see more of Kirby!
For me, "Friends" jumped the shark when Rachel began dating her assistant at work, a couple of seasons after she dated her client at a different job. That episode really has given me a moment of clarity, when I realised that it just won't be the same anymore. However, generally speaking, "Friends" is made unique by the fact that it had many OBVIOUS "shark-jumps", and few people seem to mind.
When Roz and Frazier slept together. It was like the last trick they had to pull out of the hat. They both looked so unhappy. I love this show and hate to see this happen to it!
When Niles went to foggy, grimy Manchester to bring back Daphnie's dad. Apart from Daphnies on-going appaling English Accent (english actresses who attended RADA can never do regional accents) the "pub" had as much resemblance to a real english pub as Dick Van Dyke did for cockneys in Mary Poppins. It had the same feeling of termination as "Friends" when they "did" London, Englandshire!
This show jumped the shark when they started blowdrying Daphne's hair as straight as a sheet of glass. It has that "I go to the salon everyday to have this done" look and it just doesn't work with character she is (or was) portraying.
The show JTS when the entire ludicrous plotline that took Frasier to this make-believe family in Seattle was concocted. Didn't anyone ever see Frasier's mother on Cheers? Back when he and Diane are dating, his mother comes and keeps threatening to kill Diane, but only when no one else can hear, making Diane look crazy. Whatever happened to this Mrs. Crane - or was that episode a figment of someone's imagination? I hate it when the writers can't keep the details of shows consistent.
To the above poster who asked what other sitcom borrowed from "Rashomon", as a matter of fact, lots of sitcoms have done that, showing the same scene told from different perspectives. In fact, it's one of the biggest clichés in sitcom history. Just to name a few, "King of the Hill" did a Rahomon episode, "All in the Family" did one, too, even "Diff'rent Strokes" did one as well. But I do agree with you that "Frasier" is one of the best-written and best-acted sitcoms ever.
When Frasier slept with Roz. Pointless, unless they plan on the two of them beginning a relationship. Which would be a shark jump in itself.
This was an excellent, witty, well written show. David Hyde Pierce is a wonderful actor. This show JTS in I think the 7th season? The one where Frasier got fired from the radio station, and moped around his house for months. The worst show was the one where Frasier's dad's leg got better, and Daphne was looking for another job, and Frasier's dad was going to move out of his apartment. The ending of that show was awful and contrived. The show got better after that season, but it never regained the quality that it had before.
I hope an NBC executive or Frasier writer reads this...Frasier started out as a great show with intelligent writing. The first episode was the best pilot ever and the first 4 seasons were pretty much uniformly excellent. It was OK after that, but I believe the fifth season began a gradual decline into mediocrity. Then there were several "developments" that went nowhere: Roz becoming pregnant, Frasier losing his job, Niles dating Mel, ect. The final nail in the coffin was Niles and Daphne getting together. They are a very unrealistic couple; Daphne would never go for a guy like Niles. Now if you doubt the show has jumped, just compare an early episode to recent one. Niles used to make very witty quips, and he was more believable as a heterosexual. Frasier was a dignified intellectual with realistic concerns. Martin was a figure of moral authority. The show used to have clever parts at the radio station. Now, all the characters are 2-D buffoons. In a recent episode, Frasier didn't know how to ride a bus! In the same episode, Niles was afraid of a spider!! Like if you're intelligent you're also afraid of bugs and incapable of using public transportation? It's JTS and there's no going back...
Too much Frederick! Once the tension between Niles and Daphne was broken, they felt they needed a new focus. The spelling bee episode may have been written for the Brady Bunch. They've taken what was once the best written show around and made it another generic TV sitcom.
First of all, in answer to the earlier posting, I seriously doubt anybody from NBC or Paramount will read any of this...they probably don't even watch half the stuff that they put on the airwaves!! More seriously, I agree that the FRASIER show had good writing and believable storylines...for the first 7 seasons. May 2000 marked the beginning of the end for Frasier Crane and family. A lawyer that everybody loved to hate (Donny) coupled with our favorite physical therapist...as if nobody could see that split coming. Finally, to have Niles and the runaway bride flee in an RV...well, guess that I can watch the re-runs I like.
When Daphne got together with Niles's divorce lawyer is when the show jumped. That was just one obstacle too many in their love story for me. I know they're together now, but it's too little, too late, in my opinion.
A hilarious show,intelligent even after 7 years,but after a while the pattern of him not getting the girl is tiresome. Somewhere during a season finale in 2001, he said he didn't know if he'd ever be happy. That's an interesting thought, but he just realized that?! He's almost 50, thrice divorced,lives with his father, his son is 3000 miles away and it's just hitting him NOW???!!!
When NBC hyped a 'Frasier' episode as having the funniest first six minutes in TV history. The show then proceeds to have Niles wreck and set fire to Frasier's apartment while trying to iron his trousers. Since when does Niles behave this way? Why did he repeatedly faint at the sight of his own blood when he pricked his finger? He has had bloody noses in the past and he never even got queasy! I'll tell you why: Because the show is now inconsistent and it is out of new ideas, so they make up stupid **** like this for a Valentine's Day episode. If they must do stuff like this, at least make it a fantasy sequence that doesn't depend on what we know already about these established characters. I swear, it's as if the writers have no clue as to what we have seen these characters do over the years. Jesus Christ!
This show hasn't jumped the shark and it won't.The Niles/Daphne relationship started at just the right time.People complain on Friends that they tease the Ross/Rachel friendship too long,well the Frasier writers saw this complaint and felt it was time to bring Niles and Daphne together.Sure there are moments such as the abundance of cursing lately which seems quite forced or Daphne's mother becoming an almost permanent cast member but Donny keeps things fresh and lively and Martin keeps her mother in check.To the above poster,come on,it was hillarious!My only hope is that they eventually bring Roz and Frasier together for the ending.
Somewhere around the 4th season, it ceased to be a funny, smart show about two smart guys; and became an unfunny, dumb show making fun of two smart guys.
This show JTS when Sela Ward was a guest-star. I overlooked that a woman obviously in her late 30's was a super-model AND a marine biologist or some such endeavor (some would say that alone qualifies it for JTS), but the fact that once again Frasier would somehow unknowlingly sabotage his relationship within 22 minutes left me scratching my head and saying "never again". And don't get me wrong; Sela Ward is one good-looking woman, but she just ain't a super-model.
Niles does Daphne. 7 years in the making. Tired, or what? Show was brilliant when it revolved around the radio station. Moving to Tuesdays was also a big mistake.
The minute Roz said she was pregnant at that costume party I knew the show would suck after that and it did. If I tune in to the reruns and Roz looks bland and haggard, I just change the station because the entire show sucked after that. Roz really lost her looks and ruined the character after breeding. And who the hell cares about Alice anyway? What a wasted character. I then, if that wasn't enough, the show took another dive after Daphine got fat w/ her getting pregnant in real life. If I tune and see her looking like ****, I definitely turn the show off. Nothing is worth watching after that. Show producers should offer bonuses if the women don't get pregnant, because it ruins EVERY SHOW. This show kicked ass before Roz thing. I would actually stay home to watch it, now I can't run fast enough.
I dont watch this show when it runs on its regular schedule during the week. I catch it at 3 in the morning most nights and its charm has *ruined* my sleep patterns for about 2 years now! This show is fantastic and is my absolute favorite of all time. Ive read some comments before and true, David-Hyde-Pierce is extremely effeminate but im willing to overlook some of his character traits. Instead ill just say that i never thought any of the character developments this show has brought on were bad-- they all were funny! Roz and Fraiser should get it on!! There's chemistry and ive seen stranger couples! Daphne and Niles is fun so far-- id love to see how Niles deals with a kid??!! But i dont know how long Marty can last without Daphne around. Some bits i never liked: I never dug Daphne's lawyer husband, i never liked Bull either. I did, however, like Mercedes Ruhel, Jean Smart, and Daphne's sloppy Irish brother. He and Roz totally should have hooked up! Roz is still hot and that voice is very sexy of hers. I really love this show!!
Why? Why? WHY? Why does TV mock me like this? I waited, breath baited, on the edge of my seat for years. The mantra 'will they? Won't they?' was imbedded in my brain. I was so desperate to see Niles and Daphne together. Let this be a lesson to you - be careful what you wish for. Suddenly they were togetherr and the show was dull, unfunny and predictable. Niles and Daphne had so little chemistry that you could HEAR the director grinding his teeth! What I want to see is Niles and Rroz. That'd totally spice things up *evil grin*
I like this show and am so glad they let Niles and Daphne get together instead of waiting until no one cared anymore like Who's the Boss? did. I love that Marty isn't the constantly griping old person like that woman on Golden Girls. That would have been a great show without her. Marty has a nice sense of humor as well as being touchy which is endearing instead of irritating. Still a great show. This is one of the few shows left I actually laugh at instead of just chuckle.
I really liked this show for the first six years, but it became boring and predictable. How many disagreements can Niles and Frasier have, as well as Martin and his sons? What really irked me more than anything was that it took the writers forever to get Niles together with Daphne, and by the time they finally did, I had lost interest. Niles and Daphne are so completely wrong for each other. It would have been better if they had tried to make a relationship together and then realized that they really weren't suited to each other, and then each of them could have gone on to other people.
Even though Frasier is in my top 5 of shows, it got old REALLY fast to see every episode where Frasier gets a new girlfriend. You just knew by the end of the show he would do something to screw up his new relationship. You could just about set your watch to it.
After the whole staff was laid off for the Latin format during the Summer break, and then hired back the next season. Very little time was spent in at the radio station, which has made the show less sharper.
I don't really fault this show. I can see where people would like it but I'm not a real fan. My problem is with the abundance of Emmy Awards this show has won either for Best Comedy series or in the acting categories. Once maybe, but to consistently beat Seinfeld or Friends in some of their best years, or for Kelsey Grammer and David Hyde Pierce win year after year, and Jason Alexander goes empty handed for playing George?! I'm not seeing why the accolades continue. Although I agree that the Emmy-less John Mahoney is probably the funniest one on the show.
Although Frasier hasn't offed itself just yet, it has teetered on the plank quite a bit lately. The whole Niles & Daphne thing has strained the show--so far the writers have done a fine job with a situation that is the hallmark of shark jumping, but I just don't see how it can last, especially by killing off the running jokes from Niles' love for Daphne. Oh well, here's to trying to back off that dangerous plank.
Hasn't jumped, but getting close. C'mon, we've all known from the early days that Roz and Frasier would realize that they are meant for each other, because they will accept each other for who they are. That's a given. However, when it actually happens...there you go. And what makes the show work is how pretentious Niles and Frasier really are. And neither of them realizes it. The Auto-Repair episode has to be one of the funniest..."Does anyone here know French?" Or when they are trying to plan a dinner party..."You get the one, you get the other one"....still funny after all these years!
Sorry, I can't be that specific. But this I do know: as soon as Niles got Daphne, the show has been all down hill. We tried to watch a new episode tonight about the lovers getting married...it was so bad, I couldn't even make to the first commercials. First of all, they don't even look good together. Niles is a pale and bald; Daphne tall and beautiful. We don't buy into their relationship. They just look goofy together. It makes me cringe when they're lovey-dovey. The best part of the show was seeing Niles secret love affair with Dr. Cranes English care taker. Even Dr. Crane's character is transparent now. The writers are trying too hard to make him a glib, sensitive gentleman that he has been so go at playing over the years. My wife and I used to die laughing at the older episodes. The magic is just no longer there. Do the nation a favor and pull the plug...quick. Please don't make us sit through another season. If I had the choice, I'd rather watch a marathon of celebrity daredevils.
When Daphne and Niles hooked up the show jumped the Shark. The sexual tension between the two of them was one of the main dynamics... i mean the only thing worse is if Frasier and Roz hooked up.
Niles and Daphne got married. I so looked forward to his episode, but in the history of the show this season's premiere was the the flattest episode. Dreadful. Unfunny. Dead.
When Niles and Daphne got married. This is a ridiculous and unrealistic pairing. While I can agree with others about when Frasier jumped the shark, this really did it! Niles was much funnier when he was with Maris.
Frasier blew it last night. When they got married 3 times it was to much, and then insult was added a fourth time. The show could have saved it self by having a straight wedding with a few, and I mean a few laughs.They built it up for 3 years and this was a let down. The show died a painful 30 minute death. SAD VERY SAD
When Frasier and Roz did it, the show really went downhill. It's like the writers can't think of anything creative anymore. And Niles and Daphne are terrible as a couple - boring and mismatched. This used to be my favorite show because its humor was clever and intelligent. Now it's just stupid humor.
I loved the episode when Frasier told Daphne after he took the pain pills, but once Daphne gave in & left her fiance at the alter the show jumped......
this show definitely jumped the shark when daphne and niles hooked up. One of the funniest things on the show was his "secret" obsession with her. now they're all lovey dovey and shes moving out from fraisers place. i dont see how this is going to be any good for the show at all.
Not that the Niles and Daphne thing wasn't stupid enough, but all those complications with her obnoxious relatives. . .and she keeps trying to please them and put up with them. . pathetic and unbelievable.
For me the show definitely jumped the shark the first time Niles and Daphne kissed each other. The writers had built up this romance for such a long time that it was quite a let down. For people who are so madly in love with each other their expressions of affections towards one another are quite stiff and wooden. And as for the main character Frasier I believe they have done all they can with him. I think they should take a hint from the opening song and let Frasier leave the building.
The decline of this show has been painful to watch - like an old friend slowly wasting away. Because I know the characters for such a long time I don't want to turn away, but it's not something I look forward to the way I used to. If I have to be out on Tuesday, 24 gets taped instead of this, that's for sure. This was once my favorite (current) show on television. My wife and I would constantly laugh out loud watching it. Remember episodes like the restaurant the brothers opened, or the gay station manager, or the ski lodge? Or even later shows, like the costume party where Niles thought that Daphne was pregnant with Frasier's child? Or possibly my all time favorite episode, where Daphne's ex-boyfriend comes to town and everybody is putting on an act for him that backfires when Daphne wants to start seeing him again? (Great line as Martin is pretending to be an ex-astronaut and Niles says that Daphne's name is now Moon-Crane "I remember the first time I drove a Moon Crane. Damn near drove the thing into the Sea of Tranquility." Gosh, this was a funny show. Now if I get a decent laugh or two I feel lucky, because plenty of times I don't even get that. How about that dreadful episode earlier this season where Frasier refuses to pay the two dollars for entering the parking garage. Once he said he was going to stay for the entire twenty minutes to get his money's worth, was there ANYONE watching who didn't know that at the end he would have been there for one or two minutes too long and the "zany misadventure" would continue? I don't mind them getting Niles and Daphne together - if anything I think they took too long and dragged it out well past the point of our patience. I think the poster who said that "it ceased to be a funny, smart show about two smart guys; and became an unfunny, dumb show making fun of two smart guys" hit the nail on the head. The worst thing, though, is Daphne's mother. Are NBC and HBO having some clandestine contest to see who can have the worst character on one of their shows before their viewers rebel? (Janice from the Sopranos, of course.) Can't we just declare it a tie and have them both written out? Or give it to NBC, because it also has Daphne's brother lurking out there somewhere? It's gotten to the point where I leave the room when Daphne's mother enters it. She's annoying, not the least bit funny and takes time away from characters that we like. Other than that she's a winner.
I stopped watching when they started basing every other plot on someone overhearing part of a conversation and jumping to the wrong conclusion. "Three's Company" syndrome, as previous posters have put it.
With Daphne's and Niles getting together and this season's marriage. Their getting married introduced really bad storylines: their repetitive wedding ceremonies to please everyone was dreadful. When TV characters write their own vows, I cringe listening to them; and these vows were repeated several times. Daphne's mother is always around now. She is so unfunny, but the writers seem to think she is a laugh riot because she is placed in so many scenes. This woman should be shipped back to England pronto, to try to salvage something out of the show. Martin's former girlfriend was so much funnier; this lady does not compare to Marsha Mason's character. Daphne and Niles look more and more like really silly people; the strained "menage a trois" episode with Roz was extremely unfunny and the humor was so forced. The writers should focus in more on Frasier, Niles, and Martin; there are rarely episodes now on the rivalry of the rather pretentious Crane brothers (this provided much of the laughs on the show). The writers ought to re-examine the scripts; I'm wondering why they think Daphne's mother is so funny.
this show jumped the shark when Frasier's girlfriends stayed the same age as he grew older. Give me a break about the hot girl from lois and clark wanting some big slimy old guy. You can just tell by the sound of his voice he has plenty of back hair. And the sex jokes from the older frasiers is enough to make me honk! I do not need any motive to picture Kelsey Grammar's aged body naked. YUCK!
I agree with what a poster above said--the show jumped when it started borrowing plot developments from that worst of all successful sitcoms, Three's Company, and used overheard conversations to push story lines, as well as sophomoric double entendres and racy (if you're 85 years old) sex jokes.
When they had Niles & Daphne tell that they loved each other and become a couple because the underlying tension in Niles' character was gone which was one of the funniest, if not the funniest, parts of the show.
Daphne's ex boyfriend shows up with the worst English accent you can imagine. He was Australian maybe even Austrian! Don't they realise that millions of Brits watch the show?
Last night I saw an ad (is that what you call it for a T.V. show?) for an upcoming Frasier episode. David Hyde Pierce's contract must be up or something, because they're killing off Niles through some horrible disease or something. I think they're doing it for "sweeps", and if you didn't know what Frasier was you would've thought it had been a drama, the way the ad was done. One shot in particular was disturbing. Frasier and Martin were standing at the door of his apartment, Martin says, "What's wrong?" and then cut to an extremely disheveled looking Niles. But disheveled like we've never seen him before. We're talking (literally) about deathbed disheveled. And they did say that *something* was going to happen to Niles. I know that Frasier doesn't cheat on its commercial spots, and that it isn't afraid to make bold decisions. I think this is for real.
Still one of the best currently on, but definitely has declining quickly. What happened to the original writers ??? Suggestions - get rid of Daphne's relatives for good, in fact let the die just to be sure. More Lilith guest appearances. Less Niles and Daphne plots. More Frasier and Roz at work plots. Maybe expand him into a TV show... Heck even more shows about Martin and Eddie would be welcome !!!
A previous poster (just above) wrote "I know that Frasier doesn't cheat on its commercial spots . . ." Was this irony? Sarcasm? I've never seen a show that "cheated" more on its commercials than Frasier. In the first seven years there were approximately 187 times that the promos implied that Niles and Daphne were going to get together when they weren't. Once they even said "Their first date" when it was nothing of the kind - they ended up having dinner together because Daphne thought that Niles' real date wasn't coming over. There is no way they're killing off Niles.
Frasier has become anchioves (aka sharkbait). We are in for at least one- if not many "very special episodes." Niles apparently may have some sort of heart problem. The show survived "doing it" twice (Niles and Daphne and Frasier and Roz). It survived many "special guest stars" from Cheers. It survived "I do" (Niles and Daphne). It even survived "Birth" (mercifully, we almost never see Roz's baby). Alas, the shark repellent has worn off. I don't even have to see the "special" episode...the promo jumped the shark all by itself. I wouldn't be surprised if McGinley shows up as Niles doctor.
A very special Frasier...Niles faces a problem he never thought he had to face...a possible heart problem...This is a comedy, people! What's with the heavy plotlines? Stick a fork in Frasier cause it's done
Niles is dealing with a life threatening illness? Puh-Leaze! They even started the promo with "On a very special Frasier..."
I am sure it's jumped before Niles heart problem, but this is a clear cut jump. The show is still somewhat funny though, and I am not sure it needs these big drama events because they just seem desparate.
One of television's best ever shows with clever, intelligent writing, great directing and acting. I've loved it since day one. But, after several false starts at the shark tank (births, marriages, special guests), the show has finally gone air-borne. Niles' heart problem and the promos leading up to it are proof that the show has gone dry. The writers are forgetting the cardinal rule of sitcomery -- don't take yourself too seriously. Putting a main character in a life-threatening situation on a comedy is the kiss of death. Of course he will survive. Of course everyone will live happily ever after. But the laughter will not be as real because the show has now slipped into mortality. You want to kill off someone in a sitcom, fine. It's been done (i.e. Seinfeld) and has gotten laughs. But don't show me Daphne convulsed in tears and ask me to continue to think that the writers are confident in their laugh-getting ability. Sorry to say it, but look out below.
THIS SHOW HAD TO JUMP THE MINUTE NILES CAME DOWN WITH CANCER. HAVEN'T WE SEEN THIS MANY TIMES BEFORE IN OTHER SHOWS?
I used to be a fan of this once witty show but it slowly faded from my mind. First I didn't make a point of watching it, then I slowly forgot it was still on the air. Reruns of the show's early glory days made matters worse. I think the decline started with Roz's baby, so that's when it officially jumped. After that followed one crass stunt after the other (aborted wedding, Niles and Daphne fall in love, Roz and Frasier do it, The wedding and now this illness stunt). The promos about Niles's illness make me want to vomit. I hope Kelsey Grammer makes good on his threat to end the show, it's time.
Wanna prove to me this show hasn't jumped? Fine. Let Niles croak. WARNING: When watching a promo for an NBC show, if you hear even a moment of an Enya song or Chrissie Hynde's "I'll Stand By You", shut the TV off now!
When Niles developed blocked arteries. This type of plot is best suited for Passions or As the World spurns. However, aside from Seinfeld re-runs, it's still the funniest sit-com on the air.
I believe a great show should know when to quit (like Seinfeld). The entire premise of the show was based upon Niles's unrequited love for Daphne. Last season should have been the final season, and the last episode should have been their marriage.
The show is currently jumping. Nov 19, 2002. Fire up the boat! So Niles has a little angina. Big deal. Cut him open, get a vein from his leg, plug it in, and send him home. There shouldn't even be tissues available in his hospital room for someone that healthy. The set up from the previous week's show in the coffee shop with Ros was poorly done.
Wow, the "very special" Niles Crane heart surgery episode on tonight (11/19/02) was like a flashback to the very worst of those final season "M*A*S*H" episodes, where everyone is having those "meaningful" recollections of events in their lives that allow the writers to delve deep into the characters psyches and mine hidden truths about the events that molded their lives while the actors show off heretofore unseen nuiances in their roles -- in short, 30 minutes of pretentious BS that jumps the show way over the shark tank, taking it from a comedy with brief moments of drama to that type of "We're serious actors/writers/directors" stuff with only the lamest hint at forced, over-earnest humor that makes watching re-runs of the last three years of Alan Alda's show such a chore. If this is the best the show can come up with as a ratings grabber for sweeps month, and if the Grammer and the rest of the crew have decided to go the "M*A*S*H" route, it's probably time to pack it in by the end of May.
Frasier is currently jumping with the whole "Niles heart condition thing" The previews with Daphne crying and complaining look pathetic. I don't know at this point if it is bypass surgery but I suspect so. If it is, let me tell you coming from someone who has worked with post-bypass patients for 5 years: heart bypass for someone like Niles is no big deal. Fire up the boat!
okay so frasier has been on for 10 years, thats a long time for a show, and its popularity has stayed fairly steady, but considering the character "frasier" has been around for 20 years counting CHEERS...isnt it time to let go? How long can we watch two wussy brothers, slap fight their ways through the day? The only reason that i can see having this on still is the faint hope that a real reunion between the Cheers members happens...yes on Cheers-...Frasier was funny, but never entertaining enough for a show
When Daphne did a runaway bride on that Donnie (?) lawyer character and ran away in a Winnebago with Niles. This show used to be so witty when it was the Crane boys and their Dad at home with Daphne, and Frasier at work with Roz. They never ever should have let the two worlds combine. As George on Seinfeld said, "there's coffee shop George and there's fiance George - if ever the two George's meeet, it's the end." And now we have the heart by-pass. Daphne throwing a fire extinguisher into a candy machine just becase she's stressed out that she might lose Niles. What a rude, disgusting anti-social thing to do. Get a grip Daphne. This is so un-British.
November 19, 2002, when Niles was in the hospital with a heart attack. It was "A Very Special Frasier." TV Guide called it "a serio-comic episode."
Frasier has lost it's quality, but the show never completely jumped. Roz had a baby, but she's rarely seen. Niles and Daphne have "done it", but it was never a big part of the show (the build-up was). Frasier has never showcased big actors on their show to get big ratings. Their biggest guest stars were their guest callers. Frasier has never had singing that was used inappropriately. And none of the main five have left the show. And most recently, A very special plot was introduced, and I thought it was slightly sappy, but last night (11/19) was handled very well, with some touching moments. It's nice to see a well-established comedy be able to use such a plot so well, without going over the line.
This show has been courting the shark, but apparently the shark's not interested. They set up the ramp, revved the hog, and sent an engraved invitation to the shark. But it never showed. They did everything from "I do" to "very special" to "New kid in town"... but NOTHING can make this show jump. Now, to the ANGRY OVERWEIGHT person who ranted and raved in ALL CAPS about the unfair treatment that fatties have received from Frasier: STOP watching Frasier and go JOIN A GYM... To the idiot who posted a message about "Friends" in this category... You're stupid. Try sleeping at night. To all who moan about inconsistencies between Cheers and Frasier: they're 2 DIFFERENT shows!! One is based on the other, but they aren't real and they aren't the same continuum. And to everyone who complains that they've done every possible plot/love matchup (Niles with Daphne, Roz with Frasier, etc.).. They haven't. I NEED to see Roz give Daphne a deep, hard tongue kiss!! MAN, that Roz is a hot one. Even her voice is hot. You hear her selling cars and burgers on TV and jeez, I've never been turned on by the Big Bacon Supreme before, but... One last note... I'd like to tie Frederick to a post and chuck cinder blocks at him until he stops twitching. That is all.
I'm sorry. I love Frasier. But, Niles in the hospital for bypass surgery. They finally slipped on the leather coat and the skis and hit the water.
On a "very special" Frasier, Niles almost kicks the bucket. Yuck. Pure definition of this category.
I'm sick to death of melodramatic sitcoms. I suppose this will become a major trend due to the inexplicable phenomenal success of Friends. I watch sitcoms for a laugh. If I wanted melodrama I'd watch a soap opera.
Niles heart hurts... Niles' open heart surgery. A little too special, a little too dramatic. Grasping at straws.
Niles needs bypass surgery. OK, this is bad enough as it is, but....why NILES? If any character should be having heart problems, it's Martin. He eats tons of junk food and gets no exercise, and NILES is having health problems?!? The whole thing is just an attempt by the cast to show their "dramatic" skills. Only trouble is, it's a sitcom. Oh, and can't we please get rid of Daphne's mother?
Niles has heart trouble. Ok, that does it. I'm not watching this show any more because Frasier has gotten to be too much like a soap opera instead of a sitcom. A previous poster had it right. Frasier has taken the MASH route now so it's probably time to take this show off the air for its own good. Frasier hasn't jumped the shark, it's gotten MASHed!
"Frasier" offically jumped over a tank of sharks on the night of November 19, 2002. The episode in which Niles has his heart surgery had to have been a low point in the series' run. The episode took place entirely in a locale that was unfamiliar to most viewers (a hospital) since other episodes that isolated the characters in such places as the apartment and Cafe Nervosa were seemingly outstanding. Then there was the rare moment of tearjerker drama (Daphne sobbing) that seemed hokey and contrieved. And most of all, there was the pointless and unnessessary flashbacks to other moments in the Crane family's life that took place in the hospital. When they showed Daphne walk down the hallway with the camera titled ER-style, it almost felt like a metaphor for the oblivion that "Frasier" is headed towards. That great predecessor "Cheers" would never have done this.
Frasier jumped the shark in a big way with this last episode about Niles' surgery. I've always liked the show for it's insightful and urbane wit, but this episode was awash with maudlin syrup. It's as though there's a rule in television saying that, when in doubt, trot out some medical emergency that has all the characters looking so worried. It was an interesting touch to have the characters experience vivid recollections of their own experiences in hospitals, but that couldn't save this wreck.
What contribution does the character of Niles Crane actually make to "Frasier". It is so difficult to develop any real feeling (i.e. identification) with this prissy, neurotic, arrogant, egoist. Niles' only human vulnerability seems to be his attraction (I hesitate to use the word affection) for Daphne. It is just so hard to care at all about Niles Crane. I had always assumed that Niles' character was created solely as a benchmark against which Frasier, Marty, and Daphne would appear to be more "normal". The character has no dimension. Could it be that his illness is some weak attempt to create sentiment for Niles in the hearts of the viewing public. Too late! Niles is a prig. I often find it difficult to even perceive Niles as being hetero enough to have any sincere emotion toward Daphne. A more daring and interesting plot device might have been to let Niles "come out of the closet". This might have evolved some of the humorous, healthy humor exemplified by "Will and Grace". Suggestion. The show should reverse in mid-air it's leap over the proverbial "fin" by letting Niles die.
I really used to LOVE this show. It was one of my favorites due to the writing and the comdic timing of all the actors. That being said, however, the downfall began with the birth of Roz's baby. I haven't watched the show in at least 2 years for 2 reasons. 1. The show simply is not good anymore. 2. The most important reason: Smallville.
Last week, Tuesday, November 19, 2002. Niles is in the hospital for bypass surgery, and the show got all weepy and over-dramatized. Daphne damned near came apart, commiting an act of vandalism against a vending machine, so distraught was she. BOO! This is a comedy! We don't need to be so Alan Alda-ish!
I liked this show quite a bit, but always felt it was overrated. When Bulldog left it went downhill 'cause he was the only really funny one. ALso, now that Roz is entering dragonhood, using her as a sex character is stupid.
Niles heart surgery. Will he die? Hell no, its the middle of the season! This was always a show that could do better than the average sitcom. The fact that they chose to rely on the oldest sitcom cliche in the book shows they're losing their luster. Its a shame, I loved this show. My prediction for Frasier's next very special?-Eddy will die or be at death's door. Ho-hum.
Up till 1998, this was one of the most consistantly funny and well paced shows around. Then, the summer of 1998 happened, and for some reason, they decided to start acting like they were ACTING! "I am not playing Niles Crane, now I am ACTING LIKE I AM PLAYING NILES CRANE." Everything went south. Fraiser got boring, Niles and Daphne started feeling more of a crutch to lean on, Niles became less neurotic, and on and on. It was just such a definate drop, it is what this site was made for.
The show didn't jump when Niles was hospitalized for arterial bypass surgery, because health problems like that would be expected in men of his age. It jumped when Frasier admitted to "making a deal with God" and promised to treasure his brother if God would let Niles survive. Sure, with typical Frasier mannerisms, the character later attempts to "bargain" away his deal -- but why on earth would a character that was built on "rationalism" versus superstition suddenly resort to unsophisticated bargaining with a deity he had never mentioned before? With that episode, Frasier jumped right into "Touched by an Angel". Yech!
When I saw the commercials for a "life-changing" event for Niles, I thought he was finally going to come out of the closet. The heart disease storyline was too serious. This show is supposed to be a COMEDY. If the producers devised this latest storyline to get us to believe there is some kind of attraction between Niles and Daphne, it's NOT working!
The Winnebago started it! Great episode, but after that the show has not been funny, and it's very sad. Oh, but I have a comment for all the homophobic losers who have posted on FRASIER, CAROLINE AND THE CITY, and probably others about gay actors portraying straight characters: THEY'RE ACTORS! This is what they are paid for! Why shouldn't they play straight characters just because they sleep with people of the same chromosomal makeup in real life?? I suppose these are the same freaks who think Bert and Ernie are gay. Get a life!
Frasier jumped the shark really, as far back as last season when Daphne's mother came to live with them. Seriously, why won't they get her the heck out of there? But the show very specifically took a seriously bad turn and starting to stink the place up in the first episode this season. The three (or was if four) weddings of Niles and Daphne, all of them stupid, all of them tacky and all of them having not one sentimental-finally-they-are-together moment. Viewers were robbed of the opportunity to celebrate that Daphne and Niles were finally together. I am still disappointed. THEN they rush him to the hospital where she breaks a candy machine? UGH! It just PAINS me
It happened as soon as Dapne and Niles decalsred their love for each other it got worse when thye knocked boots and it died when they were married--all 3 times! One of the big things that made it funny was how Niles always was, shall we say, Mooning over Daphne. Without that edge it becomes pure dreck. And as the other person said, it also had a problem with the Niles heart surgery story line. Nobody ever explained HOW his heart got to be so bad or WHY this guy who is very scrawny and eats fat free food would have clogged arteries. Kelsey Grammar has obviously lost any sense of reality as has the rest of the cast. Once a good and witty show now dull and in need of a good NBC exec who will just rip the plug out from the wall.
Season 7 is when the whole Donny/Mel/Niles and Daphne finally get together thing started. The humor also started getting either wacky or melodramatic, much like the other NBC Thursday night lineup show that's gone on way too long and starts with an F, Friends. The show is painfully unfunny now (Season 9). I hope it ends soon. It used to be so good.
I can't pinpoint the show, but a few years ago the boys just started whining about everything. They both live in incredible condo's drive foreign cars, date or are married to babes and have wealth and health. Stop the bitching. The only thing that keeps my interest anymore is when they get Roz or Daphne to dress up a little sexy. Roz has no problem wearing a short skirt and heels. I live for when she wears boots. Daphne has got to work out or whatever and start wearing dresses or skirts. The pants have to go. A few seasons back, she did try on a wedding dress with white high heeled go-go boots. That was a very special episode. More legs, heels and boots, less whining.
That whole Niles/heart condition story arc was horrible. Hello!! This is a comedy!!!
When Niles and Daphnie got together. I stopped watching when they started dating. It was funny to see how Niles lusted after her with out her catching on. Why did they have to put them together? You don't always get what you want
The three part story arc about Niles heart condition was painful to watch. What are they jealous of ER's ratings? Hello this is a comedy! I watch it because I want to laugh. If I wanted 'Drama' I'd watch something else.
This show jumped the shark when Daphne moved out and Niles and Daphne got married. Of course, the writers couldn't continue Niles's crush on Daphne FOREVER, but I still didn't like it. Still, overlooking that fact, Frasier is a great show. It's really a Spin-off, but it's original enough that we're not seeing Ted Danson living across the hall from Frasier but we do see the cast from cheers every once in awhile and the show IS really good. Too bad it is aging, we will probably not see it much longer sadly.
I used to really love this show, but when the Niles-after-Daphne story began to drag out and the merry-mixup storylines got to be too numerous, I jumped.
This show was never one of my absolute favorites, but it had usually been pretty amusing. But the show skydived over the shark once Niles and Daphne got together.
I think that Frasier JTS when Niles divorced from Maris ... the funny part of the show was to see Niles loving Daphne secretly and the never-seen character of Maris was the most funny ... What's more I'll never believe that a man like Niles (rich and cultured ) will marry the maid of his brother ! Pleaaaaaaaaase !!
I don't think this show ever jumped. Sure, it's had a few stinkers but overall it has consistently cracked me up. The actors are superb (god, the expressions on their faces alone crack me up!) and the writing is spot-on. However, one thing I can say I didn't like was when Roz got pregnant. I just couldn't buy her character going down that path. I didn't see the episode with Niles and his heart problems because I live in Australia and unfortunately we are way behind the US in the series. I will be sad when the series inevitably bids farewell.
I cannot really say there was one moment when Frasier JTS'd == it has been more of a gradual decline over the past 2-3 seasons. Niles could only "moon" for Daphne for so long, and that was getting old. Their getting together seemed improbable, but not a death-knell. And as for Roz's baby -- a baby on a show does not automatically kill the show. Sometimes actresses get pregnant,and it makes more sense to work it into the show. And when it is with a minor character, like Roz, and the kid rightly get shunted off-stage, it is no big deal. (in contrast with the front and center baby from Mad About You). Now Niles' heart surgery -- a real cheap ploy and unworthy of Frasier's history. Hopefully, it was a one-time thing. If they try it again --- definite shark time. And for the poster who mentioned 'a very special' on Eddie's death --- don't even think it!!! There is not enough Eddie, never enough Eddie. Eddie rules!
Why is this show still on the air? As a devoted fan of this show, even I think it's been on too long and that’s why some of us are getting sick of it. Sitcoms were never meant to last this long. But it has been, overall, a great sitcom. The reason it’s still on is because it is one of the very few sitcoms available for intelligent people (a neglected demographic). Look at what’s out there these days: mostly crap with the same sexually oriented story lines. That gets boring to most intelligent people. Most sitcoms are made for the adolescent audiences who are experiencing a rise in hormonal activity. I can watch great porn flicks if I want to see nothing but sex on the tube. I wish Hollywood made more sitcoms on the level of Frasier (or what it used to be in the earlier years). All I can say of real value is that if you live in the LA area or are visiting, you should try to see this show live. It’s performed in a small and intimate studio at Paramount (the original sound stage of Cheers and I Love Lucy). Watching Kelsey act is a sure to treat. He messes up his lines frequently and curses like a sailor. All the actors are top-notched, and watching them at work is more entertaining that the taped show on TV.
They've done it all: had a crush on each other, loved each other, Daphne overcame obesity, both overcame Daphne's relatives, got married... wow, only two things left, death and divorce, and technically Niles was dead for several minutes of that episode where he had surgery. There's only one way they could jump back, and I'll spell it out: D-I-V-O-R-C-E!
I would say Frasier "Jumped the Shark" when it became overly reliant on pure farce - such as the episode at Niles' beach property. The show still has its moments but they are increasingly few and far between. It seems the way with such programmes in the USA - they simply outlive their effectiveness and remain on-air, one presumes, because the network can rely on a large residual audience who will watch "Frasier" until it is finally cancelled.
When I could no longer distinguish between the repeats and the new series other than looking at Kelsey Grammer's and David Hyde Pearce's rapidly receding hairlines.
Episode 1. These guys are supposed to be psychiatrists and yet they misunderstand everything that's ever said on the show. I'd hate to be one of their patients. They're supposed to be intellectuals, not blithering idiots. Martin is the smartest person on the show, how did Frasier and Niles ever get a degree in anything? I do find Niles to be a rather funny character, but Frasier needs the axe.
When David Angell died, the show didn't have the creative juices it used to have. No matter what happened on the show, David Angell could make it lively and funny.
I think it started 3-4 seasons back. The lines just stopped being as sharp and every episode seemed to be some sort of misunderstanding, every one of which could have been solved with the asking of one simple question to the right person. Also, while the show was pretty good the first couple of years, they didn't do their homework on the Seattle area very well. A couple of cities in Washington were mis-pronounced (where callers were supposed to be from). Also, a caller whose supposed to be a student at the University of Washington doesn't refer to it as U-Dub, which just about every student that ever went there refers to it as. Pretty minor, but trust me people in this area really noticed that.
Frasier has been known for many great things, and one of the lesser known qualities I love is their clever episode titles, of past seasons. But, last week's episode, and next weeks episode are simply "Lilith Needs a Favor", and "Daphne Does Dinner", respectively. I know to many it isn't important, but to me it shows the writers can't even come up with clever titles, so the writing itself is obviously getting bad, just I didn't notice. The episodes are reminiscent of the titles for All in the Family, but hopefully we won't have an episode entitled "Frasier Sits Down" or "Niles Takes the Bus." I can only pray on that one.
This show makes me wish I were dead. It is so boring I rip out each individual arm hair while watching it which feels better then watching it.
Used to be a great show with wit but as someone above pointed out it has become "Three's Company". Tonight it reached a low. Daphne's mother and an artist are having sex and the bed comes through the ceiling. I didn't realize that Niles' mansion was condemmed. A stupid pratfall that falls short (pardon the pun) of any comedy,cohesiveness or logic. This show used to be based on verbal wit and not ridiculous sight gags. Are these the same writers?
Frasier jumped the shark at the 10th season. Heres why: Niles and Daphne get married multiple times(along with a Three's Company Misunderstanding. Niles thinks he has a heart condition and he does! Frasier sounds british. This weeks Frasier episode also features Frasier dating the woman of his dreams but he see his old gym teacher. Where have I seen this before? Hmm...I know Saved By The Bell! They did the exact same thing when Zack was dating Slater's sister.
I don`t know what series it was in,but the ep where Frasier DOESN`T appear at all was dire. The lead is taken by Niles and the main plot-line was his attempts to cure a baseball player of a jinx or something which stopped him winning. Maybe because I`m British the baseball-whatever it was plot passed me by but it was a truly awful ep. If Frasier was unable to be in the show,and Bulldog and the radio staff were still in it,they would have been better as the `stars` of a Frasier-less episode. In fact why did Niles become such a major character? He would have been better as a way down the castlist character. Sometimes shows jump when they get the order of the cast-list wrong. Frasier should have always been Frasier,Martin,Roz,BullDog,Niles,Daphne. That is Frasier and Martin do a Steptoe and Son (like in pilot) he goes to work at the station--where characters like Gil Chesterton were under-used--and occassionally the two zanies Niles and Daphne pop in and out,but don`t have a romance. First four series were FANTASTIC,maybe the rest couldn`t match the brilliance. Should`ve stopped at four.
The very moment I saw a preview of the most recent episode...Frasier dates a normal attractive woman who happens to be a gym couach, and then can only see Bob Hoskins standing in her place. First of all, no one that disturbed as to totally see someone else that is not there would likley be functional enough to live a normal life. Secondly, what an assinine, witless plot line. 95% site gag. A big hairy man massaging Frasier in the bath tub. This could not have possibly involved any wit to concieve. There are fifth graders in my family do would not find this concept funny.
Frasier seeing his old gym teacher as his girlfriend. Nice to see a psychiatrist need a psychiatrist.
Frasier made a monumental flying leap over the shark in the split second that the producers decided to make Niles and Daphne a couple. Without doubt, this plot development has been utterly disastrous for the show, and I think its fall in ratings can be solely attributed to this very poor decision. As other posters have noted, Niles and Daphne have absolutely no chemistry whatsoever as a couple, which robs their relationship of any credibility. It is simply too irritating to watch them together. The fall in the quality of the scripts has been very alarming, as, I suppose, the scriptwriters face an uphill battle to make this woefully dull couple appear even vaguely humorous and appealing. Frasier will always remain one of my favourite ever sitcoms, but its glory days are in the past, as it stumbles on to a very dreary finale next season. Very sad, and one of the most notable shark jumps in recent television history
I'm from Australia and we are slightly behind the rest of the world when it comes to Frasier. Frasier never JTS. Yes, I admit that the later seasons are slightly flat and not as funny as the earlier seasons. Niles and Daphne getting together does take away some comedic elements of the show but it was always going to happen. Roz getting pregnant took nothing away from the show. Many people seem to think that Roz getting pregnant was the moment the show JTS. The episode where it is announced that Roz is pregnant is in my opinion one of the funniest episodes of any TV show of all time!! The misunderstandings were superably done!! That's what makes Frasier such a brilliant show. The misunderstandings. The two Mrs Cranes episode and the Ski Lodge episode are simply brilliant. Although they are so sophisticated, they are at the same time also the stupidest people you can across. One thing I enjoy about the later seasons is that Frasier seems to get stupider with age and shows less tolerance. In Australia, we havent seen the 10th season and if I have a concern it would be that they may try to get Frasier and Roz going out. Niles and Daphne getting together switched the emphasis of the show, but this was exceptional circumstances. If Roz and Frasier get toghether, more elements of the show will be taken away and it may spell doom. But this is my favourite comedy along with Seinfeld and I hope Frasier continues for years to come!!!
I really can't find a defining moment Frasier ever JTS. I have watched from day one (having had been a Cheers fan also) and have to admit I am surprised this show is still on the air. Didn't I hear recently that Frasier is the longest running character in prime time TV right now (if you add his Cheers' time in also)? Sounds about right. I did forgive the writers for some obvious mistakes early one (Frasier's dad was deceased on Cheers, no mention of being raised in Seattle) and grew to love this show. The Niles/Daphne thing took way too long IMO to wrap up. Now that they're happily married it would be nice to have a child. If the show is going to wrap up soon, that would be a treat for N/D fans. I've just about given up on Frasier ever finding his one true love. The writers really blew it there, the contant parade of women Frasier invaribly hopes to have futures with and then blows it, has gone on too long. And the constant competition between Niles and Frasier is beyong old. Let's write some new material there also, please. The fact that those two are always trying to finagle their way into the newest "men's club" is old news. Sometimes you honestly think both Niles and Frasier must be gay, the way they behave is quite comical for two characters that claim to be hetero. Not that there's anything wrong with being gay..... What else....they should ship Daphne's mum back to England, where she belongs. I love Roz, she is the perfect friend for Frasier. And finally, I adore Marty - he can put Frasier and Niles in their places like no one else can!!! He alone is worth watching each week. It's a wonder he is their bio dad!
Niles and Daphne made the mistake of getting married, without telling anyone else. The writers mistaked me for someone who cares.
We all know the Frasier creators made a HUGE mistake not making Lilith a regular. The best episodes (and now that the show's losing steam, the only ones worth watching) are the ones where she comes back. Hopefully, there'll be a reconciliation between Frasier and Lilith in the end, because even though she's only on roughly once a season, she MAKES that show!
Although this show is very good, the pre-2000 episodes are defenitely the best ones. I really thought it was a poor move for the writers to make Daphne fall in love with Niles only AFTER she discovered he liked her. It's like, if he didn't like her he wouldn't qualify. Some of the episodes after 2000 are very good, for example a recent one where Niles and Frasier go to a health club and become obsessed with going through the silver door, the gold door, the platinum door, until they wind up in a back alley with a dumpster And the show defenitely has not become as funny after Niles's heart problems. Martin and Roz, or Martin and Daphne, when they get together as a sideplot, are really good though (forty dollars?)
When Niles and Daphne became a couple. That isn't really the event that did it, but it was sure-fire evidence that the writers ran out of ideas. Frasier's still a better-than-average sitcom, no doubt about it. But it's not as good as the first several years. I think the show is at its funniest when Frasier and Niles are together. Those two play off of each other perfectly. Martin has some funny lines.
I loved every episode of Frasier until Daphne and Niles became a couple. Then the show just became another so-so, not-so-original, unimpressive comedy with mediocre writing, like Friends. Don't even get me started on Daphne's horrible, pushy, overbearing shrew of a mother! Even pu**y whipped Niles should have kicked her shriveled butt back to Manchester! The show had already jumped when Frasier and Roz did the deed. It's almost as if the writers KNOW that the show's on the way out. Too bad. A few of those early episodes had me in hysterical fits of laughter. Remember when Niles nearly destroyed the apartment when he was getting ready for his Valentine's Day date?! Or the episode when Frasier fears he has an obsessive fan stalking him so he hires a personal bodyguard to protect him during the annual awards show. Also when Niles and Roz drive out to the cabin in the woods and everyone mistakenly believes they are having an affair. "Niles, have you seen my nipples?!" The closing scenes at the end of the show are priceless. Bulldog, Noel, and the other supporting characters at the radio station are always hilarious. Too bad we don't see them more often. I have loved Frasier since his days on Cheers, but now I find him to be irritating, dull, and depressing to watch. Enough already!
This show jumped during the episode wit special guest star Christine Baranski as "Dr. Nora," a take-off of Dr. Laura. Yes, Dr. Laura is a mean-spirited female, but the producers should have been bigger than she is and not tried to put her down. Many people believe in what she believes in. The producers dirtied themselves with this episode.
frasier DEFINATELY jumped yesterday when the craptacular flavor of it seems the year dr. phil popped by. it just shows NBC lost all of its integrity, well they lost it before this horrible incident.
Fraiser has jumped during the 2002-2003 season. There are too many plotlines about what Fraiser and/or Niles can't do. They can't ride a bike, Niles can't do yoga. And how many failed relationships is Frasier going to have? Plus they have made Frasier too effeminate. He has always been a snob, but he is far too prissy now. Characterization, which had alway been constant, is now tossed for lower comedy. It's exactly the same situation that happened with the show "Wings." By the end of its run, all the characters had become stupid, different from their original selves. As both shows have the same production company, it's easy to see the similarities. Both shows stayed on the air longer than they should have.
This show is sharkbait. I rooted for Niles and Daphne when Niles had the unrequited love thing going on. But now they are together they have ZERO chemistry. It is embarrassing to watch. I guess they can't help that with the Niles actor being gay, but why force the romance? Just end it with dignity, stop trying to convince us that these people are right for each other. It insults my intelligence. And as a "Brit", as you guys call us I am tired of the sentimentality that plages so many Yank sitcoms. Frasier with it's dry, almost nasty humour was a refreshing change of pace in the beginning. When I watch a programe to be amused I don't want to see weeping and people telling others how much they love each other. Gooey nonsence. End Niles and Daphne, and what the hell was the point of showing Niles at death door. Maybe I missed the joke? And no decent Brit would vandalise a vending machine as Daphne did lol. Why do American shows get streched out until they are no longer funny. I've heard because of the profit made from advertisements so no one wants to end the sweet deal they have going. Too bad as Frasier was genuinely funny at one time. It should have ended in season 7 with a decent wrap-up for Niles/Daphne before the world realuised they were unsuited and lacked chemistry.
It started out as a witty and clever, but soon the writers got M*A*S*H syndrome--they forgot what the characters were all about. Frasier was a confident, stuffy, but generally nice yuppie; he's now a whiny, selfish, ultra-prissy clown. Niles was a quiet, super-fussy little nebbish who always had an acidic comeback. Now, his attempts at being macho are pathetic; the rest of the time he's even more of a basket case. As for the 'classic' opening scene where he ****** his finger and faints, starting a series of events that trashes Frasier's condo--never mind he's bled in earlier episodes and didn't faint--he didn't see any blood in his years of medical school? There's also a little 'Simpsons' syndrome in there: don't Frasier and Niles ever work anymore?
When they introduced Daphne's brother, played by an Australian putting on the worst 'cockney' London accent since Dick Van Dyke in 'Mary Poppins'. Apart from anything else the character is supposed to be from Manchester at the other end of the country. It's a pity John Mahoney, who is actually originally from Britain, couldn't have given him some voice coaching. Even better why couldn't they hire a real British person to play the part?
When Niles and Daphne finally got together it was terrific...until the next episode! Then the show completely fell apart! The entire dynamic of the show changed, and the loss of sexual tension between the two has left the show with nothing to build on. At one point, several seasons ago, when Kelsey Grammer was in rehab, and several shows focused on Niles and the rest of the cast, the shows were so funny, I almost expected to see a spinoff called "Niles". But, instead of continuing with that line of writing, they went in the other direction and cultivated this romance between Daphne and Niles- HUGE MISTAKE! The ratings will keep this show going for a few more years, but it's already over.
So many of you are on target. After a so-so start, this turned into a smart, acerbic, non-sentimental sitcom. It's middle years are priceless, but it jumped when Niles & Daphne married. As for the actor being gay, well MAYBE that accounts for the lack of chemistry, but I've seen gay actors play straight believably. No the problem here is the writing. They've just run out of ideas. I've watched less and less since the wedding. I agree that Dr. "Phlegm" as I call him, was yet another jump (I refused to watch that episode). The subplots with the now-married Niles and Daphne make this comedy writer cringe. I'm not saying I'm Neil Simon, but I wrote better stuff than that in HIGH SCHOOL! I hope they DON'T keep 'Julia' played by an actress I was in college with--she's more polished than she was then, but still grating. But........just last night.......on the 10th season finale.........did I see a "shark retreat"? This was one of the best Frasiers I've seen since the wedding (if not THE best). Hopefully they will let next season be the final--and I ALSO would love to see Roz and Martin hook up!! (and I'm pissed Mahoney and Peri Gilpin have never even been nominated for an Emmy while Niles and Frasier have won several--saw Mahoney onstage about FIFTEEN years ago, and I STILL remember his fine performance).
The "I Do" category doesn't exactly apply here, it should be more in the "I Don't" category. When Daphne was supposed to get married ..... but didn't and instead chose to run away with Niles in Marty's RV .... but they didn't. Guess I just got tired of the whole Niles / Daphne / Maris relationship NEVER getting resolved one way or another.
When we first met Frasier in the fourth series of Cheers, he was a well meaning, but out of touch young man who had clearly, for one reason or another, been isolated from other children as a child. over the next nine years in the bar, he seemed to be toughened up, he became more street smart, he could fit in amounst the other charactors in the bar whilst still maintaining his dignity, wit and sophistication. This was the Frasier who was presant when 'Frasier' first aired. His charactor contrasted nicely with niles, who was clearly still in the state of isolation from the 'hard knock' world wich Frasier had been in 10 years earlier. But over time Frasier changed yet again, he is now over dramatic and makes every little thing an ordeal. that is annoying
FRASIER JTS from Day 1! As another post accurately wrote FRASIER on CHEERS spent his time in a bar with a bunch of losers to whom he revealed his true self; a grasping, clinging, pretentious, psuedo-intellect whose only saving grace was his awkwardly aggressive fixation on Lilith. His willingness to humiliate himself for a woman who was his superior in every way redeemed him. Now he is just another 50 year-old man trying to band women 15 years younger than he is. Pathetic and stupid. Unfortunately I used to be subjected to this show, with the sound on, at the place where I tended bar
The problem with Frasier is that it was always a one trick pony. Niles and Daphne's failure to get it together was hilarious, but as soon as the joke started to wear thin, all the writers could do was marry them, thus destroying the one joke that made the show really funny. Sad really, it used to be the best thing on TV.
Frasier falls into a special category. It didn't jump the shark. It fell on the ramp up, fell into the water and was devoured by the shark. A show has to have been good at one point to fall into this category. Then it must become dramatically horrible. The kicker for me was the one where Niles and Daphne were having a party. Frasier came to the culinary rescue. The travesty was that Daphne's mom hooked up with a man and went upstairs for sex. Later, they come crashing through the ceiling in the bed. First of all, I didn't realize that Nile's mansion was condemmed. Moreover, this sort of prat fall would have been ridiculous on Three's Company but on a show that developed around witty dialogue, it is downright embarrassing. It's time to pull out the rifle and put Ol' Yeller to rest.
When Niles and Daphne did it was not really the "shark jumper," as much as it was the "FINALLY" moment. It just got repetitive and dull that he could go for so long and not tell Daphne how he felt, or maybe that Daphne was just too blind to take a hint. One of the above posters was right. The Will They or Won't They plotline DID get a little creepy after awhile. Niles became too obsessed with Daphne. You almost expected Daphne to open her bedroom door and see Niles there, chewing on a pair of her panties. This show only needs to hang around long enough for Frasier to break Matt Dillon's record from Gunsmoke, for character longevity. I can already see the end of the show. Niles and Daphne finally have a baby, and Frasier will realize that Roz was always the girl for him, and in the end, the only ones left in the apartment will be Martin and Eddie. That would probably work.
Do I even have to say it?...50% of the shows brilliant comedy was crucified when Daphne and Niles hooked up. Why, oh why would they do that? That sort of big finale should have been left for the series ender. They probably wrote it in because it had to beat Monica and Chandler's engagement. The old one 's are still sensational.
What I loved watching about this show was Niles' pursuit of Daphne - it was so heartbreaking to see him go after something that was so close, yet so far away. As much as I loved seeing them finally confess their love for one another and then escape her wedding in the Winnebago, I knew that was the point when it would start going downhill. I pretty much lost interest after that season.
The brothers are too gay. They are so self absorbed. They focus on things that nobody else cares about and do not care about the people that care about them. Roz is great. They should focus on Roz more. Her character is from Wisconsin, which is always a plus and she wears high heeled boots, which also helps.
I just watched the rerun of the episode in which Lilith comees to Seattle to ask Frasier to inseminate her. How come every time Lilith appears on the show they portray her as a pathetic loser who can't get over Frasier? Give me a break! She is a doctor and has a hot body, she can't meet a guy? I hope Lilith stays far away from Seattle, because the shark is a comin'!
I hate to say it, but the show really did die the day after Niles & Daphne hooked up. I was avidly rooting for the writers to finally do it - after all those years, it was just getting ridiculous to keep stringing it along. But they got in the Winnebago and - BOOM - that was it. The thing is, I don't think it was the "loss of sexual tension" that killed it. Since they weren't the main characters, that could have been abated by having Frasier get into an interesting relationship (don't even get me started on how boring those plots are). What killed it is the writers' desperate attempts to keep them from being happy. I thought Daphne's brother was the lamest character they'd ever trotted out ... until her mother arrive. Give it up! These people are not funny. And watching two characters you really cared about end up miserable just steals the heart from the show. Let them continue to be happy and crazy about each other. There were enough laughs to be had in their odd-couple relationship. You've got one season left, Frasier folks. Stop the bleeding.
Frasier never fails to amaze me. Having been on the air 10 years now it should have jumped the shark some time ago. I was sure it had when Frasier was fired from the radio station back in 1998 and was going around all depressed but that dilemma was resolved. Then Niles and Daphne finally got together but even this hasn't (yet) ruined the show. I think what keeps Frasier going is the excellent writing. The writers never seem to rush into any situation; it took 6 or 7 years for Niles and Daphne to get together! Everything that happens on this show seems to take time. The misunderstandings between characters that frequently occur sometimes seem to be getting old and predictable but they are hilarious nevertheless and have become the show's trademark.
Niles and Daphne finally hooking up marked the end of this show's hold on me. The plot lines and writing was wearing thin up to that point, and once they crossed that line it fell into the typical desparate trap of so many other shows. Its unfortunate, because it was a terrific series. Cant they make a rule that all sexual tension does not have to get resolved?
There's a reason Frasier wasn't nominated for any Emmy's this year. This so-called relationship between Niles and Daphne stinks. Niles should either go back to Maris or come out of the closet already.
Jean Smart. Their romance was totally unbelieveable. Even worse than Frasier and Roz together. The Jean Smart character was cheap and vuglar. I realize that Pat Clarkson had other fish to go fry, but what would have been so terrible about giving the poor guy an equally intelligent, attractive woman. I fear that the final season, whenever that may be, will end up with Frasier and Roz going off hand in hand.
The Niles/Daphne relationship began on the ancient and rickety premise of Will They or Won't They. Which probably meant the show was doomed from the start, because any show based on Will They or Won't They must eventually answer the question, and pretty much after that all interest drains out of the show. Most of the time interest drains out of the show long before that, actually, since viewers stop giving a crap pretty quickly. After a seven year wait, instead of an inventive or interesting resolution, the writers relied the old, old device of having the bride, or the groom, decide on her, or his, wedding day that she, or he, is really in love with somebody else and calling the whole thing off at the last minute with obvious comic consequences. The wedding episode and the those immediately following it were just silly, frankly and unashamedly unbelievable and way over the top. Now it's Seatle 90210! The subtle, repressed passion of the earlier seasons has been simplified to high school relationship levels. They kiss, they say "I love you," Niles throws a hissy fit and gets jealous of a male friend of Daphne's. The couple play off each other in such obvious ways that we're reminded of the Screenwriting 101 rule of "show, don't tell." Niles and Daphne never look or act like two adults in love -- and no amount of gushy language can cover up that fact.
Personally I think Frasier jumped after the Season 5 Finale after Frasier got fired. But when I heard they might cast Maris this was the last straw. One of Frasier's best gags,Maris is a person that never shows her face.We always heard Niles' bizzare descriptions of her and everyone has their own image of Maris in their minds. Thats was the whole point of Maris!!!!!!!!!!! She can't exist in real life,she's like a character from a novel. This just proves how the writers have ran out of ideas and are just cannibalizing every storyline out of Fraiser. As a Fraiser fan this is the last straw.Even though I don't watch the show right now even the idea of casting Maris is almost blasphemous to the show.In fact this show has fallen so far that I almost forgot how good it use to be. I went to a website and started reading Frasier scripts.Just reading the my favorites "Ham Radio","The Innkeepers" and "Matchmakes" made me laugh more than any of the recent episodes. It makes me angry and sad how far Frasier has fallen.
This wonderful series jumped the shark when Mrs Moon backflipped over the shark as the token well-bred English actress put in to give kudos to a show that worked perfectly well without her. It could be said that Niles & Daphne's consumation of there feelings tickled the fin, but it may have grown tiresome if his yearning and her blindness went on much longer..and lest we forget we would have had to put up with Mel (the living embodyment (sic) of Maris. This would have been worse and the episode where Niles stood up to Mel (and in essence his past life as Maris' punchbag) was so moving, the only down side being the excellent character of Ferguson had to depart! This guy was great - a ready-made replacement for Daphne in the cleaning sense, and a perfect miror for all of Frasier's stuffy and pompous failings. The way Martin reacted, getting him to buy a foam-finger, make sandwiches, etc, was hilarious! For me the simple plots are the jewels now, the one that had Frasier and Niles ina car park refusing to pay the tab was a classic, back to the old school of a simple idea expanded on wildly, farcical yet never unjustified, and NO MRS MOON, she is not funny. I am English, we are not remotely like this...it is not funny in the least. Plus, all of Daphne's charm is undermined. The whole fact that it was a tight core of people and you never got to see either Daphne's family or Maris,etc. It will always be good comedy, better than so much else. But before the real Ginger Whinger moved in and curdled the milk it was golden.
The trip up the ramp: Three's Company-style "misunderstanding" plotlines, replacing the previous episodes which were written around clever wordplay and strong characters. The launch: Frasier gets laid off, taking away the workplace atmosphere which had provided many of the various wonderfully hilarious characters who worked at the radio station. The point over the shark: Niles and Daphne, who have absolutely no chemistry with one another onscreen, drive off together in a Winnebago (how...romantic?) to escape her wedding. The landing: Niles and Daphne do it, showing that the writers have absolutely no ideas left. This was about the time I stopped watching Frasier, a show that had previously been appointment TV for me. However, as the journey over the shark progressed, I stopped watching little by little. Fast forward to 2002, in a student union at the university I attend. Someone's watching Friends (that's another rant for another day), and I hear a promo for "a very special Frasier" with a shot of Niles lying down in a hospital bed. Somehow, I know that I absolutely cannot look back...ever!
Here's my opinion on unrequited love in sitcoms. As I see it there are two kinds. One is the type where A has the hots for B, but B can't stand A (example: Steve Urkel and Laura). That is a cute storyline that is OK to draw out for the lifetime of a show, and when B does an about face and falls for A, that is Jumping the Shark. The other type is when A and B are friends and we're supposed to know that they would be just perfect for each other, but they're afraid to reveal their true feelings or one of them is tangled up in a dysfunctional relationship or whatever (example: Niles and Daphne). This is a STUPID plotline and the longer they drag it out, the worse it gets. When they finally drop this awful idea and get the characters together, then the show has the potential to Jump Back. Of course, then they have the burden of finding fresh ideas for the show.
It's really hard to tell with this show. The first five seasons are perfect written comedy. Even during season 6 and 7 the show was still pretty good. During the 8th season the show really started to slump. I haven't even bothered to catch anything from season 9 or 10. I just see all these really bad characters (Daphne's family, Kirby) and horribly unfunny episodes that make me wonder why I bothered watching this show at one time. But watching the season 1 DVD reminds me that for about 6 years, this was the best live action 1/2 hour TV show.
I think the Niles and Daphne hookup destoryed the show but other things happend a bit before that occured. First, Niles is supposed to be stuffy and concerned with his place in society and his only attracted to thin cold women who dominate him and tell him what to do. This starts to change though. Suddenly Niles is wrapped in being macho and he dates a few women who aren't even closet to being his type like the blonde girl who works at cafe nervousa. They should have left him with Maris and eventually bring her out. Perhaps Calista Flockhart could have played her or Lara Flynn Boyle from the pratice..? The only girlfreind he had that made any sense at all was the last one who was doctor too, the one who broke up for Daphne.And then Niles decides to become macho which made no sense at all. They dumb down Niles's alot. No longer does he wipe off chairs or seem to have cute little quirks either. Then have him attempt physically comedy, trying to make him the next Jack Tripper which was just plain awful. David Hyde Pierce is NOT GREAT at physical comedy. By the time they put Niles with Daphne, his feelings for her were all but threw from what I could tell. He had had serval girlfriends and his longing looks at Daphne and boyish crush had all but been eliminated when he was happy with the doctor he married when suddenly Daphne finds out he used to adore her very much and suddenly, he decides to drop everything for her, later regretting it apparently. Look at their lack of chemistry, Niles was over Daphne years ago. And what's happend to Daphne anyway? At the beginning of the show, she was Martin's best pal and was exactly like him. She dated good looking average guys who like simple things like she did. Then she fell for Donnie which was disgusting because he wasn't the type of guy she had went for in the show before and they looked weird together. Daphne also became quite timid and her hair got shorter and shorter. Even her voice on the show sounds more dainty and less like the tomboy Daphne who we met at the beginning of the show and who grew up with lots of brothers. She used to laugh at the Crane brothers and their behavior and now we're supposed to believe she has fallen for one simply because she found out about a crush? Please.
I am born and bred in Manchester, UK however i have never, ever, ever once, understood any of the references Daphne has ever made about Manchester and the UK. What makes it so worse is that the writers of Frasier have gone on record to say that they are the 1st American sitcom to have an "authentic" British character in it. However, the show guest starring Derek Jacobi entitled "The show must go off" is the finest episode in sitcom history, bar none. Daphne was no where to be seen in this episode, incidentally.
I can only cut an paste all the brilliant posts about the Will They Dilemna (perpetual contrived obstacles or 'they did it'). That, and that we only got there by a supporting character munity (I submit that this should be a new category). Same with Frasier devolving from street smart Cheers guy to crypto-gay. The JTS moment actually comes when watching other shows. Unrequitted love has been overdone should never be elevated to the plot level anyway. You watch Good Morning, Miami or Friends. You see a promo for Frasier and you think, "No thanks, I'm full." Don't the writers know that we watch other shows? Didn't they see "Caroline in the City" pay for this miserable mistake? Same with re-runs of Cheers. One late nite viewing and we are back to "What the hell happened to Frasier?"
Frasier jumped when the Niles-Daphne subplot came to fruition as the major plot of the show. There were sightings in the previous season or two, such as the oft-mentioned Three's Company type misunderstandings, repeating episodes (Carlos and the Chicken repeat of Bulldog), Donny-Daphne, and somewhat thinner stories. But the Niles-Daphne situation boasts less laughs, less believable plotlines, and ridiculous character behavior. That said, this was probably the second or third best sitcom of the last twenty years (after Seinfeld, maybe Cheers) due to its excellent writing and acting of its first 5-7 seasons. I tend to like the episodes where Frasier and Niles are into something together. Here they can either have a sibling rivalry, conflict with other 'snobs' or make fun of 'the commoners' Which is one nice facet of this show, that intellectuality and subject like opera, theater, wine, and classical msuic are not only referenced and praised, but are also made fun of along with its followers. There have been occassionally decent episodes since the first 6-7 years, its more hit or miss (and wouldn't you know our local TV affiliate has been stuck on showing only season 7 and beyond for like three years now. Where's the more consistent older Frasier's ?) And I actually thought that some of the much criticized characters here, like Simon Moon and Kirby were funny; yes they were more broad, but they provided good foil to Frasier. I could really care less if Simon's accent isn't on target. And Kirby provides at least one more or less realistic younger generation character for Frasier to interact with, which isn't often done (though thank goodness) in this show. Another thing, concerning the fact that these two psychiatrists are constantly hitting the sauce. Is this done consciously on the part of the writers to show that Frasier and Niles look to alcohol to deal with their lives? It seems virtually every time they bond with their father its over alcohol (the ice-fishing trip, tearing down of McGinty's, the Antique Roadshow bear clock). I wonder if the writers see this.
Well the way I understand it JTS is when the show started it's decline. I am certain that it began when everyone at the radio station was let go. The show was still good but not as good. For those who think Niles/Daphne was when the show JTS, you are wrong, that is when the show became painful to watch, it was outright crap after that.
As numerous other posters have noted, Frasier definitively jumped the shark the moment Daphne ran off with Niles in the Winnebago. In fact, I noticed that the aroma of salt water and rotting shark flesh began wafting from my television set during that episode. A crying shame, really, as Frasier has been without peer as far as sitcoms go. Exceptionally well written and performed, it was an absolute classic until the producers caved in and brought Daphne and Niles together. Very bad move, as their chemistry together is approximately 40 degrees below zero, and it has affected the entire dynamic of the show. Thank heavens this coming season is its last. Also, one thing about Frasier that has always bothered me is his made up family. I swear that Frasier mentioned several times on "Cheers" that he was an only child, that both of his parents were dead, and that his father had been a scientist. Am I imagining that, or am I mixing him up with another character? If I'm not, where did Marty and Niles materialise from? The planet Beetlejuice?
It wasn't "several times," it was ONE TIME on CHEERS that Frasier said both his parents were dead and that he was an only child. He explains it in the ep where Sam Malone comes to town, it's not that difficult to let pass if you've bothered to watch the show before judging it. Reminds me of the people who say Monica and Rachel "could never afford that place" when it was Monica's grandmother's. Granted, there were those lines on CHEERS, but hey, the writers didn't know then that there would be an 11-year-running spinoff that I, for one, don't even consider a spinoff anymore. FRASIER was better than CHEERS for those first seven seasons, and even in the last four, it's been better than most of the crap out there. Just IMHO.
I couldn't agree more with the poster who stated that it's kind of silly to be worried about the fact that Frasier said he didn't have a brother, etc on Cheers. It's a TV show, I don't think we are talking 100% realism here. I agree that Frasier isn't as brilliant as it was during it's prime, but mediocre Frasier is still better than 90% of the other shows that are on TV right now. Maybe Niles and Daphne aren't as funny as they were when they weren't together, but that storyline was played out. And the show isn't about them anyway. I still enjoy the show. It still makes me laugh. And a few points .... 1) Maris is NOT going to appear on the series. This was a rumor which was debunked by one of the producers on the Frasier newsgroup. 2) Original producers Christopher Lloyd and Joe Keenan are returning for the final season.
Frasier has to have a MD's license to practice psychiatry. Also, he's a Harvard grad. Wouldn't it dawn on him to prescribe a hip replacement for his father?
Frasier jumped when they decided to make it into a drama instead of a comedy. They also did this with Wings. I watched a episode of Frasier last night and it was about Roz telling Laura (the girl who works at the station) get lost and she demands Frasier chose between them. The other subplot was about Niles and Daphne telling her mother to move out. Where's the funny in this? Is supposed to be a drama or a comedy? It was the lamest episode ever, not one single laugh in it. I guess when the writers drag out episodes like this, it means Frasier has jumped the shark. I'm not watching anything else from this group of writers. They make me so mad, they delvope wonderfull charactors and funny situations and then around about the 5 or 6 season, they force charactors to fall in love, to become stupid and to try to use hip phrases like "Awesome" and "buzzkill." They did it to Wings and now Fraiser. It's really sad to witness this.
I agree that Niles and Daphne really have no chemistry, but the two are really quite a good comedy team. They're hilarious together, which I think makes up for the lack of chemistry. Most of the episodes that centre on them are very good. I think the show has jumped now that Roz is supposed to be in love with Frasier. That's just a cop-out so they can go another season.
Watching Frasier the other night, I was impressed that it still seemed fresh. Even though it's been through just about every bad sitcom cliche in the book (pregnancy, marriage, divorce, heart attack, characters sleeping together), I have to hand it to the writers for still keeping it funny. Even the most recent - Niles' low sperm count - which was a recycled Cheers plot. Still had me laughing.
Just saw the previews that Daphne and Niles are going to have a baby. UGH! That's The Shark for me! When ANY show goes on so long that the characters get to the point of having a baby together, it's through and has definitely jumped the shark. UGH, all that fertility talk, "trying" to get pregnant, the drawn-out pregnancy, the never-funny antics of delivery, and then all that damn baby talk, new parents waxing on about how profound it is to have a new baby, UGH!
Is there something beyond jumping the shark? Frasier has turned into the Karen Quinlin of sitcoms. Karen went on for eight years in a coma after they finally pulled the plug and Frasier may beat that record.
When Niles and Fraiser admitted they never learned to ride a bike. At the end of the show Fraiser crashes into a tree/lampost etc. 4 or 5 too many times. My heart sank. I can no longer watch with the same respect I used to
The show has become offensive this year, particularly with the GAY THING...they can't do their own thing anymore, they have to jump on the gay wagon with all the other shows!!!!! Isn't anyone straight any more?????????
Frasier JTS'd on day 1. Has jumped repeatedly since. Inconsistencies with Frasier's character's background on Cheers. Niles and Daphne - predictably sickening. The Cheers former cast members guest appearances - hackneyed . Roz character possibilities wasted. Niles character gets more annoying with each passing year. Frasier character is almost unrecognizable from the good years of Cheers. Lousy premise... the last half dozen years of Cheers was horrible, to continue with one of the characters in this way was an abomination. Please ... just let it die.
When Jane Adams joined the cast, it all went down from there. After all, she was just the Maris that we, the audience, actually got to see.
Frasier jumped when Niles and Daphne became mutually aware of their affection for one another. I had wanted them to get together for years. Once they did, I didn't have to watch anymore. I certainly didn't want to see them go on to break up, like Sam and Diane.
I admit I longed to see that day, but once it came, I completely lost interest in the show. Yes, the season finale in 2000, when Niles and Daphne profess their love for one another and become a couple. I was at the taping, I was glad I saw it, and I thoroughly enjoyed the episode, but what was left to care about?
I believe in Santa Claus,the Easter Bunny and alien abductions, but I don't buy Niles and Daphne as a couple!!
Maybe Daphne and Niles had trouble conceiving because they are both about fifty now. God, this thing has gone on longer than the Drew Carey Show and that's not good. The "sexual tension" went out of the show about three seasons ago. It has jumped the shark and the shark's spawn. Frasier has pretty much worked his way down to San Diego from Seattle in search of a relationship. Maybe he should have an episode where he romps with Dr. Laura or Joy Brown and they can create a Him\Her on air psychiatric power couple. Sort of like a hermaphroditic Dr. Phil. HMMMM? If it goes on any longer they can start going into incontinence and senility plotlines. " Frasier is embarrassed when his date discovers he is wearing Depends." A verry special Frasier, indeed.
I have always loved the Dr. Frasier Crane character on Cheers and I was really excited when I heard he was doing a spin-off. However, I don't think the TV show, Frasier, has ever really lived up to its hype. I always thought that Wings, which was created from the same people who created Frasier, was a lot funnier and more enjoyable and that show never got the praise, attention, and respect that Frasier gets. While I watched Frasier all the time in its early seasons and enjoyed it, my interest in it dwindled after Wings ended its run in 1997.
Frasier was good on Cheers because it was a great ensemble cast and his neurotic intellectual fit into that group of misfits. As a lead character where he was supposed to be the voice of reason, it was never going to work. I watched it early on hoping it would be better, and although it started with a lot of promise, it quickly became a clone of bad 70's sitcom Three's Company. Besides, Cheers already established that Frasier was the only child of a widow. Suddenly he has a brother, and it is his mother that is dead and his father is alive.
Niles? and a...woman? Niles and Daphne? Niles and practically-a-member-of-his-family-Daphne? He's a great, great actor, but...eeuuw. Not just "no chemistry," but anti-chemistry. Like brother and sister getting the warmies for each other. >From then on, the shows were heavy-handed and Dramatic stuff kept intruding. Niles had a health crisis, I saw in a promo for the show last year -- but I must say I stopped watching primetime Frasier so I don't know what the "health crisis" was - but, man, that's comedy! I stick to Frasier reruns -- if they are from the first several seasons. Pre-Niles and Daphne; pre-Donny; pre Roz having a baby.
When Niles & Daphne hooked up -- has been said, sure, but you need to note this on the "They Did It!" page that's noted in the sidebar.
Frasier definitely jumped the shark when Niles and Daphne became a couple. It was amusing for Niles to lust after Daphne from afar, but the two characters have absolutely NOTHING in common. Making them a couple was ridiculous, and making so many plots revolve around their romance was the kiss of death for what was my favorite show. The absolute worst moment was when Daphne became pregnant, and Niles, a psychiatrist and doctor, said "We're pregnant." No man has EVER been pregnant, even though many modern couples seemed to have missed that chapter in high school biology. But to have an erudite character who is also a physician use that silly expression was the last straw for me. Right into the shark's open mouth! Too bad such a great show was betrayed by its own writers.
when Niles, the closet case homosexual marries the nanny. It would have been much funnier if he would have come out in some way and the nanny was not so intricatelly involved the plot at the end.
This show reminds us that some things ARE perfect. Frasier remains the classiest show on television. It is the only successful spin-off of any kind. It got a bit rocky in season 8, right after Niles and Daphne eloped in the unbeatable season 7, but it jumped back slowly in season 9 and redeemed itself fully in season 10 and beyond. Frasier rules! Roz rocks! Daphne is sweetness! Martin is the man! And respect for Niles!
Great comedy and sexual tension prior to that, after the wedding, it just became that it was all pretty ridiculous.
When Niles and Daphne got together. Originally one of the best, a fantastic, witty, entertaining show had become obsessed with Niles hankering after Daphne. There have been good episodes since, but not as many, and not as good. Too much of the misunderstanding storyline usually with another fly-by-night girlfriend of Frasier. In truth the show has improved in later years, though will never reach the heights of it's first 2 series. Niles carries the show, great timing and gets most of the good lines. Frasier is pretty good too, but can be a bit one dimensional. Also Marty does his thing well. Roz was great until he had the baby (why do script writers do this?), and Bulldog could have been used a lot more. The descriptions of Maris were hilarious and much missed (Niles to Daphne: it's like being trapped in a dull and listless Maris!). Daphne should have been written out when they had her set up to leave before Marty injured himself again - it would have paved the way for fresher storylines. Also the Cafe and Radio station became underused, with most of the action taking place in Frasier's apartment. A special mention for the rest of the Moons though. Maybe it's just because I'm in the UK, but they are TERRIBLE. Daphne is OK on her own, but her brother, father and in particular her mother (all with very different accents by the way, despite all being Mancunions) are annoying in the extreme. The series where her mother stayed in Niles apartment left me wishing for a good murder scene!
the 2/3/04 episode of Frasier!! It had two of the worst signs. Dream sequences and sing & dancing. It's sad that such a great show had to come to this end with so few episodes left.
I agree with the writer who said that the closet homosexual marrying the nanny was atrocious. But there were two other shark-jumping instances I can think of: the one where Frasier (Harvard educated MD!) acts like a 3-year-old and refuses to pay $2.00 for entering a parkade accidentally, then being a rude classist pig to the hapless attendant; and when Roz quits the station to take a promotion elsewhere and she is replaced by a woman in a wheelchair. When she changes her mnd and wants to return to her old job, she charges into the office and violently wheels the woman out of her space and down the hall. Both of these scenes were offensive, either by their classism or "able-ism". I expect more from such a refined bunch!
I have tried to be patient with this show, because all long running sitcoms have their ups and downs. I could live with Daphne and Niles getting together, and I could live with the tiresome attempts at Frasier trying to score with a beautiful woman. But a recent episode in which he agreed to get together with his married ex-wife was the last straw. The Frasier Crane that we have watched and loved for some twenty years would not consent to infidelity. Period.
When Fraiser's first wife Nancy G was introduced on Cheers, she was played by Emma Thompson. On this episode, she's played by Laurie Metcalf. Both times, Nancy wants Fraiser so badly, she kisses him passionately. On Cheers, however, she does it in public, which upsets then-wife Lilith. In Frasier, only Fraiser's family sees them embracing while making sure Nancy's husband remains clueless to the affair! Both were hilarious performances. However, I usually prefer it when the original creator of the role returns. Still, I loved when Metcalf complained about playing the same character for twenty years in front of Kelsey Grammer-who played his Fraiser Crane for that exact amount!
Enough with the theatrical plots - dream sequences a few weeks ago and now Frasier's ex (Jackie from Rosanne) coming back. The end with Frasier in a baby outfit was absolutely too much. This is not funny! I cringed watching that scene, cringing with Roz!!! Why a show like Frasier has to go out like this is beyong me. I'm sure all the final eps are filmed by now but it would be nice to get back to the normal Frasier-format. Skip these elaborate sets - please!!! This is one show I won't be sad to give up next year. I've watched from the beginning, but it's time to say farewell. Now if only the writers will stay true to the characters and go out on top, remains to be seen.
I am very angry that so much attention is being given to ending the Friends series and so little attention is being given to the Frasier program. This has been a magnificent program for many years! There are lots and lots of us Fraser freaks who are grieving at the thought of this program ending! We need some special air time too! Why can't they air the six best Frasier shows? Why can't there be a few hour long time slots? I'm really angry that so little attention is being given to the wrapping up of the program. I think it would be a blast to start a new series focusing on Niles and Daphne. I also think that Frasier and Roz should end up together. This has been classic TV for a long time. I am really going to miss it a lot! This is such a great group of actors. They give the impression that the chemistry among them is very positive and they truly enjoy working together. Why not have a special program that features the bloopers from Frasier? I think that would be a blast and give us viewers some insights into the behind the scenes action. Let the cast host it and have them all on. What to do think? I'd really like to know.
I don't know why more attention isn't being given to Frasier as it nears the end either! Very good points to the recent poster. Not to compete with Friends and the top 6 fan favorite episodes, but something similar in a creative way should be in the works for Frasier. Perhaps have the entire cast comment on their favorite shows or reminisce about their favorite moments. Or have a favorite one hour clip show, with the cast present narrating it for us? What we've been given are bizarre plots lately - the dream episode, Frasier's ex coming back (the only ex we all want to see is Lillith!). Heck we might even take Diane at this point!!! Wait, maybe not but what I am saying is the writers need to return to what works here - the entire cast, together, no theatrical moments please. That's what Friends fans want - the entire 6 in main plots as they bow out. Why can't the Frasier writers see that also? Finally, I think I've come up with the perfect Frasier finale: Martin will remarry and move out, taking of course Eddie and the chair with him. Niles and Daphne will be so busy with their new baby that Frasier suddenly, truly feels all alone once again. Sure Frasier still has Roz as a close friend but the spark they have had once, is gone. It's best to just remain friends with Roz. He then finds himself missing a specific group of people at a place where "everyone knows your name." Cut to a scene with Frasier opening the door to Cheers. We see Sam tending bar, drinking his coffee as usual, muttering something about a crazy dream he had the night before, in which he was a cranky, miserable doctor in NYC! Carla is waiting tables, zinging sarcastic comments all around. Norm is resting on his stool, still running up his bar tab, Cliff sitting there in his mailman's uniform, spouting off about some obscure segment he saw on the Learning Channel. Woody pops in for a visit with Kelly, and promptly shows Dr. Crane pictures of his kids. Everyone is so happy to see Frasier! Suddenly as the camera fades away, Frasier realizes he's come home again.
The show has finally jumped back with that same hilarious writing that made the show popular in the first place. Just too bad it comes about five years too late.
Frasier jumped the shark shortly after conception! Any Cheers fan already knew that Dr. Crane had a dead daddy but a very live, very bitchy mother who wanted Diane Chambers to have nothing to do with Frasier. As soon as the basic premise of the Cheers spinoff was revealed and the dead parent was reversed the show jumped. It didn't stop the show from being very enjoyable, but it was tainted AND IT JUMPED.
Part of the charm of this show was Niles' unyeilding infatuation with Daphne. Whenever the dork finally gets the chick (Ross & Rachel on "Friends", for example) a show typically takes a turn for the worse because it was the only creative script twist the writers could come up with. Nevertheless, "Frasier" is such a strong show that even this Jump The Shark moment does not entirely take away from it's unlikely 11-year run.
I agree with a couple of the most recent writers, that Frasier never really jumped the shark. Although it has had its "moments" over the years, there is no question that from season one through season eleven, it has featured some of the best writing, plot lines, and character development of any comedy series in the history of television. The level of comedy writing in general has reached new depths season by season, but Frasier was able to maintain an incredible with about it that kept its viewers watching from week to week. It is a shame that it isn't getting much of a sendoff from NBC, especially in light of the almost hysterical sendoff NBC is giving Friends. That said, I agree with the other writer that a classic farewell would have been Frasier returning to Boston rather than apparently going to Chicago with Charlotte, his newly discovered love interest from this week's episode. The scenario would have been easily written: Frasier gets a call from an old Harvard classmate. Harvard was looking for a visiting psychiatry professor for one year and the classmate thought of Frasier. Frasier is intrigued by the proposal. His father is to be remarried and will be moving out. His brother and Daphne will have a new baby and Niles won't be around to do things with him as before. After 11 years at the radio station, Frasier is looking for a change. And most importantly, his teenage son is in Boston and Frasier realizes he's missed so much of his growing up years. Frasier opts for the one-year visiting professorship while maintaining to his family and friends that he'll be back...maybe, maybe not. In fact, the possible story lines if ever there was to be a special would be quite compelling. Frankly, introducing another love interest at this late stage and expecting people to buy it is too contrived. Besides, there really seemed to be no chemistry between Frasier and Charlotte. He's had so many girlfriends, so many dates through the years that you just want to see the writers skip that altogether. Maybe Roz should have been the one, but she wasn't. Moving back to Boston makes sense, and it could have been a great sendoff to a great series.
When I saw the Fraiser promo with Jennifer Tilly, I thought she would play Candi-the woman Fraiser went out with when he was trying to get over Diane on Cheers. Instead she's playing Kim-a woman Fraiser's going out with to not think about Charlotte. The difference between Candi and Kim is that while Candi didn't seem too aware of how desirable she was, Kim seems all too aware and dosen't even care! Fraiser liked Candi so much that he wasnted to marry her while Kim, to Fraiser, is just someone he wants to have fun with. In the end, both Kim and Candy are spurned, but Fraiser, in both cases has no regrets about the whole thing. While it's nice to see someone play someone different when interacting with the same actor it does get a little distracting when you know she/he had played someone similar or different before in this show or spinoff. Still, it was nice to see Kelsey Grammer and Jennifer Tilly team up again before Fraiser ends for good! Thanks for the memories, Dr. Crane.
I know 'Frasier has only a few episodes left, and after the April 6 episode, good riddance. Niles and Daphne were barely in it, and with a moronic subplot about Niles getting hooked on fast-food burgers. A physician who recently had a bypass? It's OK to suspend disbelief if it's funny, but why even bother having them in the episode? Oh, I know why--to spare viewers the other moronic (and disturbing) subplot of Martin all over his sons' former babysitter (Wendie Malick, the plastic surgery poster girl).
It seems as if Frasier is going out with a whisper. Frasier is STILL trying to find his one true love or at best, just find someone who's female that he can occasionally find companionship with. Perhaps that is accurate. I have several friends well into their 40s, who cannot for various reasons, find someone. They are doomed to be alone. Happily married, female and 48 myself, so I can only imagine what this feels like. Frasier is a fictional character but perhaps someone who speaks for many baby boomers in this country. On one hand, it would have been a real treat to have him FINALLY find someone, after a dizzying list of hopefuls for 11 years now, but the writers can't rush this to seem sincere. Will I miss this show? No, it's time to ride off into the sunset. I still think the best finale would be for Frasier to return to Boston and Cheers (as stated above). His apartment will be very lonely once Marty moves out and when Daphne and Niles will be consumed with taking care of a newborn..... Returning to Boston/Cheers would be as if Frasier is coming full cirlce. A logical next step honestly. Sure wish we'd be given a glimpse of what is really coming in the finale. Very little press about Frasier ending, which is sad really. Next.......
I don't feel that Frasier has ever really jumped the shark...the writing and plotlines for the most part have been consistently excellent for all these years. As a 40-year-old female, though, I have found it a bit frustrating as to how Frasier has had so, so many failed relationships and now, as the series comes to an end, he seemingly has met his new found love. Yes, Frasier is a flawed individual, so apparently the writers have introduced an equally flawed character who will become his "soul mate"...I know there has been a lot of talk about Frasier and Roz, but I don't really see them together...maybe Charlotte is truly the "one", but at least it appears Frasier will go off into the sunset with a contented air about him. He came in with Diane and left with Charlotte, with scores of women inbetween...
I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned more, because while I started out in the mid-late 90's as a Frasier fanatic, I now, even as it draws to a close, completely avoid any episodes of it written after 1998, and particularily after Niles and Daphne's marriage, for one reason and one alone: DAPHNE TURNED INTO A BITCH! She started out sweet, goofy, lovable and a laugh riot... even somewhat awkward with her enormous hair and psychic-isms. Now when I tune in, she never has a smile on her face, she bosses Niles around (and I can't get over her calling him "Niles" anyway... figured she'd still call him Dr. Crane even after they were married.) and acts like a total drama queen. What the hell happened? In the "Niles heart operation" episode, she crossed the line from "concerned wife" to "Niles, you made a huge mistake". I can not see the old Daphne pulling that crap. And even Niles himself isn't the same. He's so mainstream. I remember one time, he made a crack about a guy Daphne was seeing, talking about how the guy wasn't good enough for her because he saw a t-shirt as an outer garment... but I'm seeing Niles wearing, yes, T-SHIRTS and SWEATSHIRTS every other episode! What happened to Mr. Rigidity, wearing a $1200 suit to the gas station? The writers took all of Niles' pretention and culture-shock and piled it all on Frasier. Daphne having a baby, too... don't the writers remember the episode where Niles carried around the bag of flour? He'd make the worst father ever... but since he's changed so much, I wouldn't put it past him at all to accompany his kids to the baseball game and eat franks with them. I will watch the finale of course, but I'm going into it with incredibly low expectations. It honestly should have ended a long time ago.
Frasier's been jumping from Season 6 onwards. First the radio show was dropped, then Niles got a divorce, Daphne's obnoxious relatives were introduced, Daphne & Niles got married.and worse of all it stopped being an ensemble show. Kelsey Grammer has turned into a prima donna. All the elements that made this show stand out have been removed. The Niles-Daphne-Maris relationship was the best part. This show is dead & is stooping to plot recycles. After the dire Season 8 I stopped watching altogether. I'm glad the nightmare is nearly over, providing they don't spin it off, help us.
Of course, when Niles married Daphne. It's become "The Daphne Show" I'm sick of her goddamn accent!("He's the one I loove...") And could she destroy her hair any more? Another demi-jump was when Roz chopped her beautiful hair off and stopped wearing make-up. If these pampered co-stars are so sick of the shows that put them on the map, they should quit and sink into deserved obscurity, as they will when the show ends. And, there wasn't enough Bulldog. Good riddance, Daphne.
This show jumped a school of sharks when old White Socks and Ballantine with a Limp (Frasier's dad) began dating the Wendy Malick character. If you find this story line remotely plausible then I have a giant wheat farm in downtown Providence for sale.
As soon as Daphne ran out on her wedding and she and Niles started marching towards theirs, this show went downhill fast.
If it did JTS, it was after Daphne and Niles profess their love. After this there was an entire slew of bad recurring characters introduced. The worst, most annoying, unfunny, grating character was Daphne's mom. But there was also Kirby, Simon and others. It seems to have taken a reverse jump and has gotten better for the final season. I am not British so the accents don't bother me and I think Cheers is the most overrated crock of a sitcom in the history of television so I didn't have any preconceived notions about what Frasier was supposed to be.
I'm happy to say that Frasier managed to live for eleven seasons (as a spinoff, mind you) without jumping. I haven't seen the final episode (it's on tonight) so unless that episode is a REAL jumper, Frasier has managed to remain jump-free. Cheers!
I still think it jumped the shark when Niles and Daphne got together, but Kelsey and crew really pulled it together this season and had a classy finale worthy of the hype of their Friends got.
You know, it's funny: The "Frasier" finale had all of the signs of a bad sappy last episode, but somehow they rose above all of the cliches and made a very satisfying and yet emotional show. While I rolled my eyes at first when Daphne's brothers appeared again, I was laughing my ass off at Robbie Coltrane's face when said, "Cannon?" The baby situation in the vet's office was a little strange, but it spared us the usual woman-screaming labor that finales usually have and just jumped nice simple little scene with the new Mama and Papa Crane. (Nice touch naming the baby David, presumably after the late David Angell.) Martin got his bride, good for him, and Roz got promoted, great for her. And Frasier? He went after the girl. I could kind of see that coming, but it was cool nonetheless. All in all, this finale was twenty times better than the last "Friends" could ever dream of being. It was a brilliant ending to one of the funniest and most intelligent comedies ever written. And so what if it had fewer viewers than "Friends." The true fans were watching and we'll miss it terribly. Now, if you'll excuse me, I hear the blues a'callin'......
Now that it's finally over and my local outlet has cleverly put on the syndicated run from episode one, I have to say Frasier just went on too long and evolved into a less funny show. Someone likened Frasier at its best to Noises Off the movie about a play. There was no jump event that signaled a decline in quality just the characters losing their quirkiness. At the start Daphne was supposed to be "a bit psychic" and was more of a fish-out-water. Later she was just this boring woman hanging around the house for no credible reason, doing light housework and speaking in an odd-sounding accent. I guess Jane Leeves had forgotten or lost her Manchester dialect when she married (a producer for the network?), and though I loved her drunken brother character by LaPaglia (sp?), it didn't seem like any of her family had the same accent. I know to most people in N America all Brit accents probably sound the same but imagine Archie Bunker, Cliff the mailman, Flo the waitress and Aretha Franklin being passed off as members of the same American family. Others have already noted the changes in Niles and the absence of Bulldog. Frasier started as a show with dissimilar people thrown together by circumstances (work and home) then over too many years the characters evolved into something more like a family...good news for people but bad news for a once-great sitcom.
It either jumped when Roz had her baby or when Niles and Daphne got together, but it jumped back with a classy finale that captured some of the show's magic.
The final show was fitting, funny and hopeful. Most show endings make you sadder than this one made me. You can just imagine the characters getting on with their very happy lives. The only two things I would have added would be getting a better look at baby David, and some mention of Eddie's future.
The Finale blew geez. Frasier already left a good life in Boston because of a woman and now he leaves a better life in Seattle and e goes to Chicago because of a woman. Kelsey Grammer said one day he would like his character to come back and all they did was set it up for another return. Lame
Applause, applause, applause for the finale! This show had jumped, for all reasons already listed, BUT IT REVIVED LAST NIGHT with the finale! The clip show was awful - Frasier at its worst - Kelsey Grammer reading off cue cards?! - and artificial set-up for each group of clips. And the clips were way too short, many were just a few words, then on to the next clip. But - the episode itself was sharp, the characters lovable and familiar, the storylines tied up satisfactorily, even leaving the door open for a "FRASIER IN SAN FRANCISCO" show?! Bravo, and farewell, dear Frasier, et al! Thank you for a wonderful time, and we will continue to appreciate your work in reruns forever!
The one bright spot on the finale was the scene where Frasier has moving pick up the tatty chair his dad sat in and he and Niles realizing Dad was comfortable in Frasier's modern Chair. The rest they could keep. I didn't like Charlotte, Frasier's love interest, and I was hoping he'd go for the doctor on the plane instead of flying to Chicago in hopes of winning her. Charlotte seemed rather ditzy and there was no chemistry between her and Frasier. Daphne was annoying as ever either with her big stomach which she continually rubbed or towards the end forever carrying around an amazingly still baby in a blanket. The wedding was so cliche taking in the vet's office where Daphne just gave birth. Daphne's brothers (except Robbie Coltrane character) drove me up the wall. I for one am glad it's over and no spin offs please! This show jumped the shark when Daphne and Niles got together and has gone downhill since with a low point of wailing Daphne in the hospital during Niles' heart surgery (a very special Frasier). I also wish Martin Crane had ended up with the Marsha Mason character he dated instead of the grating one they set him up with.
It's kind of been losing steam for me for a while, but two moments-- no, three-- really wrecked the finale for me: one when Daphne's water breaks and she has the baby right away. News flash for the writers!: when the water breaks the baby very rarely follows immediately after-- especially for a first-time mother; usually there's about 12 hours of hard labor before the actual birth. Second, the scenes in the apartment were no more than a week later and Daphne already has her figure back... WHA?!? Since when does THAT happen? Even a slim person takes about 6 weeks, and if you remember Daphne has a history of weight problems, which means it would take her even longer. Third was all the promos on TVLand where Frasier Crane was touted as "the longest-running sitcom character in TV history": WRONG!!! That distinction goes to Cleggy from LOSTW, which is in itself the longest running SITCOM in TV history-- 31 years and still filming.
While I agree that this show jumped with Niles and Daphne getting together, the finale was totally puzzling. I'm a former DJ, and I can tell you there's no money in it (unless you're at a Howard Stern type level or in a major market). Why would Kenny give up a management job for that? I know far too many out of work DJs and people who work several other jobs just to stay in the business. And Roz - she would never be considered for Station Manager. She's considered "talent" (even though she didn't have an on-air position). The worst was not knowing Eddie's fate. It wouldn't have been funny if he died, and yet they could have had a line in there that Eddie was with Martin on his honeymoon or with someone else, etc. In any case, it's not making me wait for the reunion movie.
I think Frasier was starting to get bad about three or four seasons ago but I chose the defining shark jumping moment to be when niles and daphne got together. It would have been awesome if they had gotten together sooner but by the time the writers made them a couple, niles's feelings for daphne were pratically over. He had basically stop fawning over daphne and had serval other girlfriends. I think the doctor girlfriend that Jane Adams played suited niles much better than daphne did and they should have left niles with her. Another thing I didn't like was how drastically the characters changed. niles was supposed to be very stuffy and sort of quirky and odd but i noticed they took away alot of from the niles charactor. it was probably because david hyde pierce complained about having to wear a suit all the time and act so prim. i believe this because in interviews he's given, he's said he is a total slob in real life. in later years, his homosexuality (in feal life) was more apparent especially when they had niles divorce maris and enter the dating scene. i don't know what happened to daphne but it makes me sick what the writers did to her. she was also very quirky and charming when she was first interduced to the show but when she got with niles, she became a dominating bitch just like maris probably was. she also kept ruining her hair and it seemed like she changed the way she did daphne's accent. the ending of the show was terrible. the cast totally rush threw the scenes just to hurry up things and finish it. marty ending up with the boys former babysitter was just nasty. it would have been nicer if he had somehow got back together with sherry, a girlfriend he had from the past. i also would have liked to seen frasier end up with diane. that would have been a brillant ending. after all these years, he still secretly loved diane and she secretly never stopped loving frasier. instead, frasier has another so so romance with charlotte who is a complete bore and runs after her like a stupid stalker. it doesn't say whether he ends up with her or not. it seems just like another episode where he finds a girl he's allegedly crazy about but then he gets her and something happens and the relationship is over. there's some serious doubt whether frasier could live happily ever after with the dull average charlotte. watching the ending of frasier really made me feel sad because i so loved how frasier was in the first four or five seasons and it was sad to think how the cast and characters had all stepped out of their personalties and lost their magic.
Never jumped. John Mahoney's Martin Crane was always the pin in the Crane boy's pretense balloon. The right man for the right job.
I think the finale worked almost completely, except here and there. For one thing, when Roz said goodbye to Frasier, she said, "You've been just like my brother. Which is weird, since we slept together that time." It's not that it was a sex joke, it's that it was such a pointless one in a scene like that. And after all, it was their last one together, so it didn't need a sore thumb kind of line. On the other hand, there was Daphne's line, "My water just broke." Comedies have gotten so pushy that when I heard "my water broke", I half expected the actual sight and sound of it (luckily I was wrong). There's one thing that has really left a bad taste in my mouth, though, and that was the third-to-last (?) episode, or at least the sub-plot with Frasier and his fiancee staying with the weird country family. To me it was an utter waste of three good actors (the most obvious one being Stephen Root of NewsRadio). I know I've said this half a dozen times on these boards, but comedy writers nowadays have a near-obsession with dark comedy, even when it means coasting along on the DARK part, without any real COMEDY or ORIGINALITY. And I'm afraid there are plenty of times Frasier hasn't been above that. But I hated seeing what was probably their worst example of it, that close to the finale. Still, the other sub-plot (nurse mistaken for stripper, stripper mistaken for nurse) took some of the bad taste away, as did most of the finale itself.
When Niles and Daphne got together. His longing for the untouchable beauty was the best part of the show. after that...Welcome to Averageville.
Although Frasier is now off the air, I can only state now that it jumped the shark at the very beginning of the show. Here's why, bear with me a moment. I recently watched parts of the Cheers marathon on TVLand this past weekend. They aired an episode where Frasier was talking about his "late" father. He continued to state his father was a scientist of psychiatry and did lots of expreiments. I am sure I saw this episode in its original run but forgot about this scene. So to this end I have to state that the Frasier spinoff jumped the shark from the first episode. I know a lot of sitcoms are notorious for their continuity problems, Friends was bad at this, but resurrecting a dead father then shooting him inthe leg and crippling him, that constitutes a big JTS in my book.
This is just to correct the last post about a perceived discontinuity. Episode 16, season 2 explains the discrepancy about Martin's bio, and in a very funny way at that. I guess I just get annoyed when people vent w/o seeing all the episodes. This is from the episode where Sam Malone visits, and meets Martin: Sam: Oh, yeah, you I remember. Um, he told me you were dead. Martin: [turns to Frasier, stunned] Dead?! Frasier: Well, we had had an argument. You called me a stuffed shirt and hung up on me. I was mad. Sam: You're a cop? [to Frasier] You told me he was a research scientist. Frasier: [off Martin's glare] You were dead, what did it matter?
When Niles was broke and living in the ratty hotel. Frasier's character was also quite shrill at that time. This was supposed to be a comedy!
Despite what many ppl have said, Frasier JTS when it ended without Frasier and Roz ending up together. They were complete opposites, but they were PERFECT for each other. Whenever he got caught up in some other woman, Roz was there for him and vice versa. Couldn't even watch the whole last episode...
This show has been steadily growing weaker over the years and I've only been watching it off and on but the thing that did it in for me for good was the episode where Frasier and his girlfriend's car breaks down and they have to stay with this really weird family. The father of the family's mother has just died and he's grief stricken over it. They make Frasier and his girlfriend spend the night in the living room with the dead mother's casket. During the night the griefstricken son comes into the living room and cries over the casket of his dead mother and that jerk Frasier and his twit of a girlfriend actually start LAUGHING during this. Like, how totally funny, a son crying over the casket of his dead mother. Big LOL moment there *sarcasm* I know that the guy was weird but that doesn't make his grief funny. Totally tasteless and lame comedy there. It made Frasier and his twitty girlfriend look like big elitist jerks. You'd think what with being a psychologist and all Frasier would be more sympathetic to the pain of others. Incredibly dumb episode and a definite shark jump in my view. Just shows how lame the writing has gotten.
Frasier's Daphne was a tomboy who grew-up with seven brothers, and a slight kook, but as the show went on she became daintier and girlier and blander. Niles dropped the suits and snootiness and mannerisms. Roz went from wise-cracking slut to caring single mother. Frasier had the opposite problem: instead of his character being flattened and tone-downed, it was exaggerated to absurdity. At first he was a dignified, had ego but also intelligence and a sense of proportion, but given the burden of carrying the show he become an utter clown, who existed only to be humiliated again and again. And this classy verbal comedy turned into an unwatchable farce.
Frasier started to jump the shark the moment he cut his mullet and Niles and Daphne started to date. There would be several episodes dedicated to just Niles and Daphne and they would forget about the other characters. The other problem is that when they did start involving other characters there were too many plots involved in the show. Frasier would have his own plot, then Martin, then Niles and Daphne, then Roz, when back then a couple of characters would share the same storyline. Good show, but they tried to change it too much i guess to make it hip. Niles became more annyoing and Frasier became a total diva, he never acted this evil to his family before the dating of Niles and Daphne. And it completely lost its spark when Roz had the baby. It completely changed her character. K.I.S.S.
The story arc leading to Daphne's aborted wedding and driving off in the RV with Niles was grating at best. BUT THE FACT THAT THEY COULDN'T JUST LET THESE TWO DRIVE OFF INTO THE SUNSET????? THAT WAS THE PERFECT FINALE!!! WHY ANOTHER SEASON?! WHY?!
I loved the first several years of this show and still enjoy the repeats - I never get tired of watching Niles expressions and the physical comedy David Hyde Pierce is so good at. But like a lot of viewers, i lost my enthusiam when Niles & Daphne became a couple. One unrelated episode that really grated on me was the one where Frasier & Niles spent the whole show sitting in a parking garage holding up an unknown number of drivers becaise Frasier refused to pay a $2 parking fee. Self-envolvement and arrogance had become the theme of a lot of episodes and I finally got fed up and turned it off. Hope the last show had them all living happily ever after.
This show jumped whenever they brought in a special guest star, who inevitably took over the entire episode: like Micheal Keaton (who makes a complete fool of Frasier simply because HE'S MICHAEL KEATON!) or the one with Bebe's new tiny blonde assistant (whom Frasier claims had been there for years, despite our never seeing her before) who becomes the star of the episode just because the actress was some famous singing performer in real-life. I guess the studio execs at NBC were either figuring the guest star would boost ratings or else they were trying to snag a contract with the celebrity by throwing them a few episodes-- in either case it's an insult to the audience (especially of what they call an "intelligent humor" sitcom). But also, the character Frasier changed entirely from at Cheers, where he evolved from an insecure, naive snob, to becoming more "one of the guys" (unfortunately AFTER he married Lillith). Then me moves "back" to Seattle (despite being originally cast as a New England upper-class erudite) and we learn his dad turns out to BE "one of the guys" who would fit right in at Cheers (or "Duke's" or WHEREVER). They could have worked around this, but instead it just kept becoming a re-make of "The Odd Couple" with the prissy neat-nik rooming with the macho slob. They also couldn't decide whether Frasier wanted his place to himself, or whether he wanted to bond with his father after his mom kept them apart all those years-- one episode he's ecstatic that he moved them all over to Niles' place, then in another instance he It's really sad when, like "Friends," characters on a series are only stuck together because they're afraid to grow and change as individuals-- like "Norm" Peterson, who in one episode they revealed hadn't changed even his barstool in over 20 years; for this reason, "Cheers" made sense since it was just a bar, and old-town bars don't change much as long as they make money; but other sit-coms tend to "take up roots" that keep everythign stagnant, and so any change becomes gimmicky and gratuitous-- and hence completely unbelievable.
I can think of two episodes where Frasier JTS, maybe three. The first that comes to mind was when when Niles and Daphne married -- I would have been happy if the series ended with Niles and Daphne riding off in the RV -- but the couple of episodes that really irked me was one, when Niles and Daphne actually did marry, the producers cheated us out of the grand wedding they deserved. The couple married not once, but three times, in an episode that was hard to watch due to it's monotony. I realize that in the Frasier universe, there was always a misunderstanding fowling up the best made plans, but this was ridiculous. I found myself thinking "Marry her already!" Frasier had steadily started it's decline with this episode. I didn't want to believe the critics when they pointed out that a wedding usually wrecks a show, but they were right. My interest in the show started to decline at this point, and I cared less and less about it. In another episode that was hard to watch, Frasier was immensely depressed after losing his job. It was so bad that I didn't care if he got better or not. The worst of the worst Frasier episodes was when Frasier insisted on spending the ten minutes he paid for in a parking garage while his co-workers were waiting for him. If I remember correclty, he went on and on throught the whole episode about his rights, keeping all the drivers behind him waiting, and it was just wretched! It's not like he couldn't afford $10! How could any writer think that watching someone whine and complain and bitch in a parking garage for most of a half hour would be entertaining? It really died for me after that. I did come back for the last few episodes, and I know I missed at least a whole season after that episode that I may never see again, but it's no loss to me. Critics agreed that Frasier regained some of its dignity in it's final season, but to me, nothing equalled the series just before Niles and Daphne married.
Frasier JTS when it decided to become a political statement instead of a sitcom. Generally, most shows JTS when this occurs, like The Simpsons, Roseanne, and Will and Grace. Specifically, Frasier showed signs of Jumping the Shark when the characters began to spew anti-Republican comments. In real life wouldn't Frazier and his brother--NOT to mention their retired police officer father!--be more on the conservative side? When the writers forego the characters in order to use them as nothing more than mouthing pieces for their political philosophy, then shows JTS. The ratings on Frasier plummeted once that happened.
Niles & Daphne getting together not only caused 'Frasier' to JTS, it was also ludicrously unrealistic & implausible. Upon learning that Niles has yearned for her for 6 years, Daphne suddenly decides she feels the same? Yeah, RIGHT! Has this ever happened in real life, or even elsewhere on TV? It would have been OK if Daphne had been pining for Niles too for all (or even some) of that time - as with Ross and Rachel - but she didn't. I agree with other postings in that the lack of chemistry between N & D didn't help, and especially with Jane Leeves getting pregnant at such an unfortunate (for the show) time. The way they dealt with that was absurd too. Fat Camp? Puh-leese!
FRASIER was one of the funniest, smartest, sophisticated sitcoms ever made that often teetered on the edge of brilliance and also gets my vote as the Best Spinoff in television history. I can't recall another television spinoff that worked as well as this one. This show had way too intelligent writing, probably too intelligent for the average couch potato and one of the best ensemble casts on TV; From the flawless comic timing of Kelsey Grammer, the manic eloquence of David Hyde Pierce, the sardonic witticism of Peri Gilpin, the wide-eyed yet not-as-innocent-as-she wants-you-to-think sexiness of Jane Leeves' Daphne and the world weary everman, Martin Crane (I can't believe the actor's name has escaped me). This show was fresh, original, and beyond clever. I enjoyed the visits from CHEERS with Ted Danson, Woody Harrelson, Shelly Long, and especially Bebe Nuewirth. The chemistry between Nuewirth and Grammer was magical. It was magical on CHEERS and remained so here. I even loved Dan Butler as Bulldog. Talk about an actor playing a character who he was the just the polar opposite of. Each character had their own hang-ups and their own little personal grudges against one other character. Niles hated Roz and Roz hated Bulldog and Martin hated Lilith and it went on and on. This show even impressed me with their attention to detail and continuity. I was pleased that Maris was introduced as an "invisible" character and stayed that way. I was also impressed that when Sam came to visit and Martin asked what Frasier had told him about Martin, Sam told Martin that Frasier had said Martin was dead. I remembered the episode of CHEERS when Frasier said that and I always wondered where the instant family came from and it was finally addressed through Sam. We just learned that Frasier lied, that's all. It was a simple thing, simply addressed and dealt with...no fuss, no muss. I think you really had to have a brain to enjoy this show because the humor was VERY dry and extremely subtle. The writers did not go for belly laughs as a rule. They went for the wink and the smile, which is so much harder to do and for TV audiences to comprehend and appreciate. This was 100% quality television that the shark could never find.
When Niles and Daphne consumated their relationship. No more tension and no more sexual ambiguity with Niles.
"Frasier" definitely JTS when when Niles slept with Lilith. Did they EVER stop to think about Fredrick, who was Lilith's son, and Niles' nephew? While it might be funny that Frasier asked Niles to help him avoiding sleeping with Lilith, only to have Niles end up doing so instead-- that's only when there's never any child involved; after this, "funny" becomes "sick." Did they ever stop to consider how Fredrick would be affected, if he ever found out that his mom slept with his uncle? That's INCEST as far as he's concerned. Seriously, how could any of them look at him the same way, knowing what they did? Would Lilith and Niles still be able to psychobabble their way out of it so casually, like they did to Frasier? If they could, they're even sicker than this joke. And even if Fredrick didn't find out, it's always going to be a dread secret that stands between them. But no, Fredrick simply ceases to exist for this episode; Frasier and Lilith get together, but never ONCE mention their son!!! He just disappears so they can make this cheap sick joke! This type of burlesque humor is typical of when writers run out of ideas, and so they just get lazy and go too far for a laugh, and ignore the ethical side of it. This was definitely the big JTS moment, regardless of anything that happened after.
I agree that one specific moment in which Frasier JTS was when Daphne and Niles got together. But the show also JTS when it became a vanity project for Kelsey Grammer sometime late in its run. Instead of being a capable albeit egomaniacal shrink whose dates and mates put the 'D' in dysfunctional, he became a one-note, pretentious blowhard on whose arm was always - and inexplicably - a lovely (and usually much younger) woman who played intelligent straight man to his bumbling foolishness. I didn't get it: Beautiful women fawned over and regularly ended up in bed with a local radio talk-show host whom I could never see as being anything but unattractive, no matter how many episodes included a lovely young woman referring to him as "handsome."
This show jumped the shark when season 5 came round. First we had Roz's baby, which wasn't even properly exploited. Then we had endless episodes such as the "Ski Lodge" where endless contrived misunderstandings were intended to be funny, but weren't because there was no soul in them. There were a few hiccups in the first 4 seasons, but you could tell that there was a genuine warmth to the show at the time, not so in the 5th. What was particularly unbelievable about Frasier was the fact that he'd meet a woman and then she'd leave him by the end of the episode - they should have made them last at least 3 episodes or so. Lastly, the series would have been FAR more interesting if Frasier had been shown working at the radio station more often (as those were the funniest bits); and characters like Bulldog and the guy with the fake English accent had appeared more.hey were far funnier than the core characters.
When Sam leaves Boston, flies half way round the world, runs through some English manor owned by a duke, and crashed Diane's & Frasier's wedding. The hot sparks of flirting were ignited and the fire burned up the show.
I have loved Frasier more than most sitcoms. It was classy, very clever, the acting was impeccable. The characters were loveable and 3 dimensional. The last series of Frasier is when it jumped the shark. I live in Australia and it is Sept 05 and they are still dragging out the last series, so I havent seen the end of it yet. So far, the last series saddens me how the characters have strayed far from themselves in the writing. It seems to be coming back now and I think they are half way through, although there were a couple of shows which made my skin crawl how bad they were. I could notice a definite incongruency with each character. All of them seemed to be doing things that were completely out of character like Roz giving Frasier an ultimatum. Like the new desperate housewives character who was one dimensional and nasty. I could sit through some of the first episodes of the last series barely raise a smile. I think one more season would have totally killed it. The last season was definitely enough, but all in all, I love it, and I still laugh at the earlier seasons even though I have seen them many times. Its definitely my favourite sitcom and I was sad to see it end, even though it was definitely time.
My favourite character in Frasier was the one we never saw, Niles' wife Merys. My favourite bits were where Niles would come in and talk about the latest preposterous thing that she had been doing or saying (one of my very favourite episodes is the one where he suspects her of being unfaithful with the fencing teacher). After they got divorced it was never so funny. Also while Niles was still more-or-less happily married to Merys, his crush on Daphne seemed funny, whereas when he was sad and alone it just seemed pathetic. And it got much worse when Daphne and Niles finally got together and started wallowing in sentimentality. The shark was really being jumped though when Daphne's dreadful and deeply unfunny family turned up. I mean, she's supposed to be from Manchester, but her brother's a Cockney, how did that happen? (it makes about as much sense as a girl from Texas having a brother with a Bronx accent), and where their mother is from I can't imagine. Wherever they were from they should have gone straight back there, because funny they were not.
When Niles and Daphne hooked up. They had no chemistry and more importantly, Maris went off the canvas.
Frasier was an excellent show. Really great. But to me, it JTS when Frasier's dad, Martin, started becoming more and more effeminate. In the beginning, the concept was that Frasier and Niles were educated, stylish, snobbish, nerdish, and artsy. This was supposed to clash with their father's macho, blue-collar personality. But around the fifth or sixth year, Martin started acting effeminate as well. There were times when he seemed to be channeling Sophia Petrillo from Golden Girls - say something smart and prance out of the room. The original take on the character was much more entertaining.
I love this show, but as Lifetime just began showing the episodes where N/D became a couple, I'm starting to cringe. A HUGE part of the show was watching Niles' attraction to Daphne from afar. And once that was gone and they got all mushy mushy (with her towering over him at that), it just became a "who cares?" thing for me. Also, with us never seeing Maris: I think anyone they could have gotten would have ultimately been a letdown b/c the description of Maris over the seasons was so hilarious that whatever actress they got would have had her work cut out for her. I wouldn't, however, have minded seeing Lara Flynn Boyle give it a shot.
It was going down hill for a few years before, but the appearance of that fraud and hack, "Dr." Phil, put this show in the gutter.
Technically,I dont think this show has jumped,but it has come close several times.Maybe the cloest was when Jane Leeves got pregnant,and the producers explained it away by suggesting that Daphne had developed an eating disorder.That is the only time I ever actually stopped watching this show because I found it insulting.But I returned because it is still one of the greatest sit-coms ever,and it actually came back strong with one of the greatest final seasons a sit-com has ever had. A lot of people on here have suggested that this show jumped the shark when Niles and Daphne finally got together,and they felt Niles crush went on too long.Well,I disagree with both of those things.I think the producers wanted to develop the relationship between the 2 characters before having them jump into bed.That way,it wouldnt ruin the chemistry between the actors,which by the way,I dont think it did.Other shows were ruined by the consumating the sexual tension,because thats all it was.But with Daphne and Niles it was more than sexual tension,and I think the producers were trying make that point.There was a real bond between them,and I felt it only got stronger in the later seasons.I do think Frasier did sag at times,like when he got fired,and Daphnes mum seemed to stay around too long,but the producers managed to find ways to get the show recharged.
The show hit the jumping point around the middle of the series when Frasier became an all out snob. In the beginning he was more masculine than his brother but then things changed. Watching the later episodes in reruns makes me wonder WHY I ever developed a crush on Frasier. Then again, I think I fell in love with the Frasier of earlier seasons, when he was more normal.
This was an excellent show but definitely jumped the shark when Daphne and Niles became a couple. It really wasn't believable and the show stayed on past its prime.
I have to say the show jumped when they kept on bringing in new "quirky characters" who are all straight out of the peanut-gallery, but have no appeal whatsoever, under the mistaken impression that "weird" is automatically funny. This is a JTS indicate that they simply ran out of ideas, and are starting to phone-in ideas: There was the annoying boss "Kate," the ditzy "Poppy," Frasier's loudmouth high-school crush Lana Gardner with the annoying son son "Kirby," the bitch-from-hell Julia Wilcox, the Frasier-wannabe Cam Winston (the episode with the giant American Flag was a JTS moment in itself) and any other new characters, which were all the Simpsons-equivalent of "Poochie--" and played by incredibly annoying and insufferable actors. And the one woman who was the perfect match for Frasier, was simply FORGOTTEN when he broke up with her for no apparent reason-- but then he realized that it was only because he was afraid of losing her. So why didn't he even TRY to get her back, once he realized this? The answer is simple: deus ex machina, i.e. because the writers needed him to remain a desperate boob who's always bungling romances. Another big JTS was that many of these "New kids in town" kept changing their personalities; one moment they'd be Frasier's enemies, then they'd be his friends-- they were annoying either way, but the inconsistency was simply obnoxious... Frasier might be a "pleaser," it's not funny unless it backfires with a character who's funny rather than just annoyingly caricatured.
Roz gets pregnant. Morning sickness and hormone gags. That's fun. Niles and Maris divorce. In the early episodes it's clear Niles really does love Maris in his own warped way. Daphne was just a lust-object for a husband who wasn't getting nearly enough. (In "My Coffee with Niles", Frasier once aked him if he wanted to leave Maris and he said no. "So you want to stay with Maris and just have an affair with Daphne?" "Yes. Can I do that?" "NO YOU CAN'T DO THAT!") And remember early Daphne the spacey, lusty, big-haired, tomboyish buddy of Martin's? Well, the writers didn't when they made us endure boring, generic, teary, anxious, vulnerable, virginal, cypher Daphne. I guess she "grew." By the way, could you tell any of these characters apart by the end? Niles was wearing sweatshirts for Christ's sake. Daphne was lounging around in silken robes referring to salads as a "melange". Roz oh just loooves her adorable little daughter. Awww. The wild slut has been tamed. I'm not even going to mention what happened to my beloved Bulldog. THIS SUCKS. THIS IS TOTAL BS. THIS... oh, here are my 1-4 season DVDs.
The show is great. A classic that should never be forgotten. So many great episodes. It never jumped. If you followed the show, the last episode really touched you.
|
09-26-2013, 02:33 AM
Frasier Boned the Fish When...
