Valerie / The Hogan Family Chosen As The WORST Case Of Retooling A Show

[RetroGuy2000]

Originally Posted by Anna Karenina

Laverne without Shirley may have been the worst one for me. The show was just holding on by a string at that point.

I'd forgotten that one. Thanks for the reminder. Once Shirley was gone, the show lost what had made it work. That last season was terrible.

[Anna Karenina]

Originally Posted by RetroGuy2000

I'd forgotten that one. Thanks for the reminder. Once Shirley was gone, the show lost what had made it work. That last season was terrible.

You're welcome.

I agree, that was the pits. They should have just wrapped it up as soon as possible.

[mets82]

I do think that the series finale for Laverne and Shirley was bad. That was a backdoor pilot for Carmine?

[RetroGuy2000]

Carmine was the worst character on L&S anyway.

[TMC]

Originally Posted by TMC

This article perfectly summarizes what Valerie Harper wanted/expected to do and what Miller-Boyett were used to doing. To put things in its proper perspective, if you were looking for sophisticated (like what Valerie Harper was used to when she was on The Mary Tyler Moore Show and later, Rhoda under MTM), "smart" sitcoms that didn't aim to the lowest common denominator and weren't inherently cheesy, then Miller-Boyett's kinds weren't for you. They were arguably the Chuck Lorre's (if Chuck Lorre did family-friendly comedies) of the mid '80s-late '90s:
http://www.macleans.ca/authors/jaime...-dispute-ever/

To add a bit, Miller-Boyett's sitcoms had three basic fundamentals in their formula: Be cheesy as hell, catchphrase heavy, and hokey. Full House, which debuted a year later on ABC is the biggest embodiment of this formula.

[king of comedy]

This shows that these shows have aged well.

[Sonny Carson]

I've really liked a lot of the episodes post-Valarie. I still think the show was better with her, but it was still good when she left. Some cheesy moments, but some that still hold up.

Like the episode where Dave hires a lousy waitress to be the Hogans Housekeeper because he likes her and Mark tells Dave
"Dave I know what your thinking about, and I know what your thinking it with", LOL. And when Mark and Willie get the x-rated tape stuck in the VCR.
Mark: "Desiree Dujour, what else has she done?
Willie: "With a name like that, probaly everybody", LMAO.

[king of comedy]

Originally Posted by king of comedy

This shows that these shows have aged well.

My mistake, these shows haven't aged well is what I meant.

['80sSitcoms]

Originally Posted by Sonny Carson

And when Mark and Willie get the x-rated tape stuck in the VCR.
Mark: "Desiree Dujour, what else has she done?
Willie: "With a name like that, probaly everybody", LMAO.

That one aired just yesterday; I was surprised at how much entertaining physical comedy Michael and David had together in this episode, and then at the end they had a poignant touching father-son scene.

[vampirevsrobot]

What a ridiculous thread.

The show actually peaked without Valerie Harper and survived for 4 more seasons with Duncan in the lead role.

[Sonny Carson]

Originally Posted by vampirevsrobot

What a ridiculous thread.

The show actually peaked without Valerie Harper and survived for 4 more seasons with Duncan in the lead role.

Ratings got better because the controversy of Valarie being fired from her own show attracted more viewers. The show was still good but got more commercial and a little bit more cheesy(Dad sees a UFO, David falls in love with a princess). And you have to admit Sandy was not as strong of a lead as Val!

['80sSitcoms]

Originally Posted by Sonny Carson

Ratings got better because the controversy of Valarie being fired from her own show attracted more viewers. The show was still good but got more commercial and a little bit more cheesy(Dad sees a UFO, David falls in love with a princess). And you have to admit Sandy was not a strong of a lead a strong Val!

Same thing with Designing Women. Once Delta Burke left after the whole controversy in the press, ratings went up to see how it affected the show.

[TMC]

Originally Posted by Sonny Carson

Ratings got better because the controversy of Valarie being fired from her own show attracted more viewers. The show was still good but got more commercial and a little bit more cheesy(Dad sees a UFO, David falls in love with a princess). And you have to admit Sandy was not as strong of a lead as Val!

The bottom-line is that Valerie Harper was the reason the show was even created in the first place. And since her fans would in theory, be the core of any fanbase, her not acknowledging the program pretty much robs it of that support.

And quite frankly for most people, it can be hard to be a fan series which had no consistency during its entire run. Like I said, it started as vehicle for Valerie Harper to one for budding star Jason Bateman (even though Sandy Duncan was technically, the lead at this point).

[TMC]

Originally Posted by king of comedy

My mistake, these shows haven't aged well is what I meant.

One could argue that Valerie/The Hogan Family really wasn't that funny to begin with. Outside of with Valerie Harper and Jason Bateman and an occasional one-liner later on from Sandy Duncan, was the show really that amusing? And besides Jason Bateman's David, were there any real breakout characters? As talented of a performer Bateman was/is it isn't like he could easily carry the series on his own shoulders. The narrative structure just wasn't compatible with the style of humor at which he excels. I mean compare being inside the confines of the formulaic, Miller-Boyett cheese-factory to something more ahead of its time and edgier like It's Your Move.

[TMC]

Originally Posted by RetroGuy2000

I'd forgotten that one. Thanks for the reminder. Once Shirley was gone, the show lost what had made it work. That last season was terrible.

The last season of Laverne & Shirley was an utter trainwreck. It wasn't just the fact that Cindy Williams was gone after the first two episodes, it was feeling that writers ran out of decent storylines and began to come up with really far fetched ones. Like there was an episode where Laverne ends up on death row by mistake. And there is another one where they are talking to a ghost.