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Join Date: Jan 09, 2001
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John Larroquette Show Boned the Fish When...
http://www.bonethefish.com/viewtopics.php?3878
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The show revolves around John Hemingway, a recovering alcoholic who is put in charge of the late night shift of the St. Louis bus depot. As a result, some of the people who hung around at that time reflected the slightly darker side of humanity, including a prostitute in drag named Pat who was nonetheless a sensible and sweet person. Perhaps the best description of the show, at least in its early run, was of a carnival sign that John hung in his office the first night he took his job: "This is a Dark Ride." During much of the show, some of the humor and stories revolved around John's attempts to stay sober. One guest star was David Crosby, who played Chester, John's sponsor for AA meetings. Another episode guest starred Bobcat Goldthwait, who played an assistant to John who was constantly a mess (as many of Bobcat's characters in movies appear to be very neurotic), but became suddenly efficient and 'normal,' as soon as he got drunk. Richard S. "Kinky" Friedman appeared as himself in a jail cell.
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https://web.archive.org/web/20070225...ptheshark.com/
- Other Thoughts:
The Sit-com Killer, this time under the guise of Katherine the Nurse, showed up. Also, the show gave in to presssure from focus groups. (One will never forget the "Must See TV" promo where they went out on the street and they decided "it should be more like Friends.") The first season of this show may go down as the greatest twelve episodes of a sitcom ever.
Ted McGinley had three episode appearance as Karl Reese. He was a politican in love with Carly. As the rules state, once Ted appears on the show it has jumped.
When they did a musical version of "The Golden Girls."
The second season when John moved into a new flashy apartment from his original dump. I totally loved this show the first season, but it went down hill after that. Two worse things to happen to the show was John's moving to a new apartment and Mayim Bialik (sp?) from "Blossom" as his daughter. This episode did include a special appearance by Kinky Friedman so it wasn't all bad.
At the beginning of the second season. The first season had a very dark edge to the humour and didn't flinch from issues. An example is when a robber is holding a gun on Larroquette and the black food counter owner (can't remember the character's name), the black guy says to the robber, "Shoot him (pointing at Larroquette) he's white." Larroquette responds "No. Shoot him (pointing at the black guy). You'll do less time." That is truly pointed, funny and revealing of character. Next season was a typical sitcom and I went in search of darker pastures.
This Show is just brilliant. I never saw a better Sitcom.
When Ted McGinley appeared as Carly's boyfriend, the would-be state senator who dumped her after finding out she was a former hooker. Ted McGinley and Gigi (Carly) Rice are married; that should account for something. Plus this show featured Alison La Placa, an actress whom some consider to be the female Ted McGinley. Many point to her as cause for the demise of several failed series (Open House, various Tom Arnold sitcoms, etc.) Of course, she appeared as a recurring character on Friends and failed to kill THAT show, so maybe her luck is changing.
If Ted McGinley is the Patron Saint of shark-jumping, then Allison LaPlaca has to be the Queen of shark-jumping. Every show she goes on manages to be cancelled as soon as she's associated with it (Remember Duets, Open House, and more recently although it somehow is still going relatively strong, Friends).
The show definitely lost its edge at this point. You'd think it's FUN to be a recovering alcoholic. What is it with the NBC execs? They killed "Homicide" the same way - Hmm, the focus groups like treacly cheerful shows. So they gear it to these idiots instead of vigorously promoting the show for its dark-but-realistic self. It becomes a shadow of itself, clogged with jarringly inconsistent crowd-pleasers (Alison LaPlata/Homicide's last season "pretty people"). The original fans then lose interest, and they cancel the show because of bad ratings - which were largely caused by their own meddling. They deserve some sort of anti-award - The Golden Dorsal Fin, perhaps...?
At least they were smart enough to kill Alison LaPlaca off on "Friends". Her voice grates on my nerves!
The show sometime in the second season (I forget the title) when everybody, even though they worked different places, started working the day shift rather than the night shift. At its best, this was the deepest funny show ever. At the start the characters were thrown together with a lot of reason to dislike and distrust each other. The warmth and trust came gradually and honestly in the first few episodes as characters worked in their own ways to improve their lives. But all too quickly it reached a point where characters were more successfully, self satisfied, and immediately turned to low-level snarking at each other like on nearly every other sitcom. Up to the end, the show could still create amazing moments.
Not technically a new baby, but the show took a flying leap when they brought on the unfunny and untalented Mayim Bialick as John's daughter
How can no one mention the appearance of Real Worlder Puck? I know the show was already dying, but the appearance of Puck was the fatal blow
After the first season, NBC pressured the producers (one of whom was Larroquette) to lighten the tone, and the sharks were there! When the show stayed true to the standard John hung in his office, "This is a dark ride", it was brilliant. After the first season, it was all over.
The rough edges that made this show remarkable in its first season were almost all gone by season #2. The one change that, for me, really drove the show into the tank was when Carly stopped being a hooker. You had to know that the network suits wouldn't tolerate such a character on a prime time sitcom any more than they'd be likely to tolerate a drug dealer or a pimp in a comedic role. So the end result was a show that began with a lot of promise quickly degenerating into a banal borefest with forgettable plots, jokes and characters. Too bad.
The show jumped the shark following the debut of the Alison LaShlocka character, who was the catalyst for decline. John moves out of a seedy sleeping room directly into a luxury apartment? Please! Dexter the counter man lost his issues. Eggers was no longer abrasive. Gigi quit hooking and bought the bar (how?). Oscar left the phone booth. Mahalia lost her accent. Pat and the other transvestites disappeared. This was a great show until TPTB (the powers that be) caved in and fell over backwards trying not to "potentially offend anyone's sensibilities". It's a sad state of affairs when networks feel they have to protect viewers from possibly having their toes stepped on by dialogue but will plaster the airwaves with mindless sex, mindless violence, and mindless non-comedy.
When Boyz II Men showed up. They just happened to be coming through this rundown bus station, and Larroquette acted all excited and said "hey, would you mind singing something?" That was the moment that the show totally sold out.
The first season was terrific. A real dark comedy. It was gritty and unlike anything else on TV. The second season it was dead. John switched from a depressed recovering alcoholic to a bumbling buffoon. The network sugar-coated the show and ruined it. Sure it wasn't in the top of the charts in the first season, but that was because it needed time to build an audience (much like Cheers). Once they turned it from something dark and gritty to something cheerful and light the show tanked. But that wasn't all. Not satisfied with just ruining it once, they kept on re-inventing the show. Suddenly it became artistic, with an elephant as a recurring co-star! It seemed like every season it re-invented itself, sometimes getting better (anything was better than the second season), but usually getting worse, until eventually it died a long, slow and lingering death. That first season was great though.
Now this was a great show, one of the 10 best of all time I say. Almost nothing can beat the first season, but the toned changed and the 2nd season flat out stunk. LaPlaca as Catherine was one of the worst moves ever, however the season limped by without cancellation. The third season was much better than the 2nd, but not the 1st. By the 4th season the show had "Cancellation" written all over it. The problem was that Catherine left. Yes she was a cardboard character, yes she was annoying, but she was also an integral part of the show. Without the Carly/John/Catherine love triangle the show fell to pieces (Hampton's "revelation" didn't help much either). The 4th season became a cheesy remake of "Friends" and was unsalvageable. The 6 previously unaired episodes that debuted on USA Network this year show us what a 5th season would have been like, still kind of funny, but just not the John Larroquette Show. It truly was "A Dark Ride" and I mean that in the most respectful way possible. Every fan should see all 86 episodes the first time around, but only the first 22 episodes (1st season) should be savored by the true fan.
This show jumped the shark when someone dumb-ass executive turned on the lights. The first season is my hands down favorite show (not just sitcom) of all time. Beautiful and rich dark comedy leaked from this shows seems. My dad and I watched it every Tuesday, even looking forward to it over "Fraiser". I don't think there is a prime-time network that has the balls to add a show like this to its schedule anymore. GREAT 1ST SEASON. But then it all changed in its second. You can see NBC running a squeegee over this scummy little comedy and wiping away all its texture. In the end, I could care less. It was still funny but without its edge, it was just another show.
A great show that jumped the shark when the tone changed to make it more "watchable for the people". This was not meant to be a popular show, It was meant to be a show that showed the darker side of life in a good way. When the Suits at NBC tried to make it more popular, they stuck a stake in its heart.
My main complaint about this show is the same complaint I have about "Ellen", after her "coming out" episode: Too much whining! In Ellen's case, we constantly heard about how tough it was to be a lesbian. With John Larroquette, we constantly heard about how tough it was to be a recovering alcoholic. On "Cheers", Sam Malone was also in recovery, and occasionally, there were episodes where this fact was relevant to the plot - but it was not brought up every single week! Enough already!
I was 13 when this show premiered and I loved it. I think it ran opposite "Roseanne" the first year (I still remember the promo for this show where JL thought "Roseanne" was a lead in, but instead screamed off camera when he learned that he was on opposite the #1 show at that time) and proved to be formidable competition. The first year was dynamite; seeing the first season on USA is a treat. To this day I don't know why NBC sacrificed the premise of this show for quick ratings. This show could have been on of the greatest of all time. I didn't mind so much that he moved out of that scummy apartment or the romance with Catherine but they worked the day shift. They got rid of all the kooky night time characters and made the main characters idiots. Why, because this show actually had substance? Don't get me wrong, I liked the next two seasons (I still love John's psycho bitch rant) but the spark was gone- even at that time I knew the spark was gone from the show. I stopped watching when Carly & John were about to wed and Catherine busted in. That's the point where this show got too silly for me. What was NBC afraid of? Did people actually complain about the marijuana-brownie episode, or the one where Gene found a baby in the garbage? Was that too real for sensitive-assed people? Thanks once again NBC for interfering with another good show.
Only because of NBC did the show jump the shark. NBC hurt it with poor promotion and timeslots throughout its run. They attempted and suceeded to change the tone after season one, but I think it was still the funniest and most real show out there. It had very few weak episodes.
Had NBC not messed with this show, I have no doubt in my mind that it would have been another on the list of long, successful NBC sitcoms (Cheers, Seinfeld, Wings, and unfortunately Friends). I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the brilliant Darryl "Chill" Mitchell as Dexter. He was so great in his role, he wasn't sugary or friendly RIGHT off the bat like what would have been politically correct at the time...he played a real person with real emotions and not just "the black guy" (wish I could say the same for the janitor). When Dexter finally warmed up to John, it really meant something and was endearing. The interaction between those two was the true basis of enjoyment for me. The two female interests on the show really detracted from the core storyline of the bus station for me. Carly was tolerable because she played a realistic character (hooker), but Catherine was just some boring, vanilla character who seemed way too snobbish to hang out in the bus terminal. Horrible, horrible move by NBC, not to mention the continuous timeslot changes.
The first season was great. The second season the Network seemed to notice and tried to clean it up (Like hooker became a business person) and there was only one plot. How do we embarrass John this week?
I'll agree that the 2nd season marked the end of the dark comedy that made the 1st season so good. By the way, the introduction of the elephant recurrences was John Larroquette's swipe at NBC for the change in tone. It refers to an observation about denial which goes something like "Denying that someone is an alcoholic is like living in a house with an elephant and no one noticing".
I never though this show was that great to begin with..I tune into tv to see unrealistic stuff,if i wanted the crap that nbc shoved down my throat for 4 yrs i would have went to a St.louis bus station,John was never funny on Night Court [ people say Cosby was the most overated show of the 80's i beg to differ].I mean and then they added the whore Mayal or however you spell her crackheade named from the recently cancelled Blossom which also sucked from day one.I mean all these characters,were unfunny,creepy,messed up mofos.
When NBC wanted the show lighter in tone, that's what did it in. Having that elephant show up in almost every episode just showed how stupid things were getting. The first season was great, but the network suits didn't like how things were going for some strange reason. How the show survived for a third and fourth season is beyond me.
John's character on Night Court,was one of the most un-funny, annoying, obnoxious, ass wipes of the bad 80's sitcom world.Well a year after Night Court was thankfully pulled from the air [ btw it was on 9 seasons to long],Some NBC crackerjack decided to give him his own show filled with "" dry" humor,yep it sure was dry wit. Basically it was about a racist alcholic getting his life back together in a ST.Louis bus terminal.First off where is the so called """"HUMOR"""" in this story?and to add insult to injury that obnoxious, annoying cow from Blossom was added ewwww she is single handly the worst sitcom character ever and to add her to this show made it more of a challenge to watch,oh yea then you have poor Johnny O'Boy god someone stick a sock in my mouth and gag me now this guy will never ever be funny,his humor is humorless horse dung plain and simple.Then by the 2nd season they changed it and it became an unwatchable peice of sh*t according to other people and was pulled from the air thank god.Of course in the later 90's NBC would give us sh*t like 3rd rock from the sun,Veronicas Closet,Just Shoot Me [ btw if you happen to watch an episode of that please do what the title instructs you to]
The first season of this show was dark and brilliant. Larroquette is a recovered alcoholic and I thought he probably brought a lot of knowledge to his role. Remember David Crosby as his sponsor?...How great was that! Now, in defense of the network executives that everybody blasts for ruining the show, Larroquette & Don Reo were the show's producers, and I remember reading an interview with Larroquette where he said that the network wanted some changes, and that HE AND REO WERE GOING TO DO WHATEVER THEY WANTED IN ORDER TO KEEP THE SHOW ON THE AIR. So, basically, they just rolled over without so much as a token fight. A pity.
First season's shows were great! Second season - John cleans up, call girl goes legit... ho-hum.
The first season was some of the best sitcom TV I've ever seen. My favorite episode is when our "hero" John goes to apologize to his Ex-wife for being a drunken **** when he was married to her and treating her like garbage. No sitcom phony forgiveness she slams the door in his face. His son shows up latter at the Bus Terminal to speak to John and everyone is awkward. The young man says he can't deal with it and that when he's up to it he may contact John. The end. This episode was so real and funny its a classic. Who says sitcoms have to be relentlessly stupid.
Another vote for the jump occurring with the second season. First season was dark and funny. Then second season brought on the toothless warm and fuzzies. As for the poster above who can't get a handle on punctuation nor spelling nor grammar, thanks for making me feel better about myself.
Not really a vote, just an anecdote: I went to a taping during the last season. The show had an unbelievably stupid plot about John trying to return a tape recorder or something, which he nicknamed "Tapey." I kid you not. It was supposed to be a comment on ethics, but it was only mind-bogglingly banal. The warm-up comedian really had his work cut out for him, trying to maintain laughs from the audience. People were walking out in droves. The episode never aired before the show was canceled a few months later. Small wonder. I can't believe this show was ever good -- it must have done the jump long before!
I loved this show and I liked Boyz II Men, but when Boyz II Men suddenly showed up in the bus terminal to Mime to their current single, I lost all respect - for them, and the network, and television in general, I mean who benefits from all this shameless cross promotion - certainly not the viewer who gets to see their favourite band inexplicably shoehorned into their favourite show in a move which diminishes both. It's bad enough when Bands are 'featured' on shows like Buffy or Melrose Place, but this sad event was the first evidence that NBC was tampering the show, after this they ditched Chester and brought on Catherine (Why?) promoted John to the day shift (way to quickly) and sealed the deal by involving McGinley, shame NBC shame!
I love Alison La Placa's work but she has to be the female Ted McGinley. She even has a line on this show in response to John saying the he thought she was funny that goes something like "yeah, but people don't get me, I've had six series that were all canceled." In fact in 2001 she was in a pilot called "Nathan's Choice" that never aired, maybe she's now killing shows even before they're broadcast.
Well...when i heard a while back that John Larroquette was getting his own show, after Night Court had it's run, I was naturally excited. The funniest cast member of NC getting his own show...(Right On!!) The first season I really liked, the show had a lot of room for the characters to develop, and each of the supporting cast had it's own little quirks about them...to really make them stand out. The first season the show had a real dark edge to it, but really, really funny as well. Naturally, I thought the second season, would be just as good, maybe funnier, because the support cast would have more room to develop. (Boy was I wrong!) I watched a couple of shows on season 2, the edge was gone the darkness was gone and Hemmingway moved to a swanky new pad. I liked it when he was in his dumpy apartment instead of his condo. What I noticed about sit-coms is that, when the main character makes a move, the show is really established and so are the other characters. All I can say is about this show is they rushed the main character too fast and the supporting cast. I stopped watching completely when he had his house warming party, and the humour i didn't get, nor could I understand why he would invite bums and homeless people to his house warming... (I didn't understand the concept or the humor.) (Just a Thought....) Great site!! (KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK!!!!!)
I started watching Larroquette in the spring of 1996 and was very angry when NBC cancelled the show that fall. I was glad when USA started airing it in 2000 and made it a point to watch every day. The show did not decline in its second season. It was only natural for John to have a girlfriend sooner or later. But the program was almost done by the time NBC cancelled it. About six episodes were aired on USA that did not appear on NBC. These episodes are rather pointless. Overall, Larroquette, like the very similar Wings, was one of the best sitcoms of the nineties.
I loved the first season of this show. It was so dark, yet creative and funny. John Larroquette's character (John Hemingway lol) is a recovering alcoholic, just as it Mr. Larroquette himself. He used his own life experiences in the role. Everyone around him was edgy and dark too. The angry young black man, the hooker, the latina woman who felt John stole her job, and the crooked cops. It was great. I still remember the episode where John goes to an AA meeting and unknowingly eats marijuana brownies. He then feels guilty because he fell off the wagon. Now it's that much harder for him to deal with his alcoholism. The other episode that really stands out in my mind was the season ender where his daughter comes to visit him. He had literally never met her. The only reason he got to now was because she was on her way to college and came to see him. I just remember it being so dark, and so well done. And so very very funny!! That's why the second season absolutely stunned me. How could they do that to my favorite sitcom? Suddenly the young black man is only angry in a funny way, the hooker (no longer a hooker) now owns the bar, the latina is comedy relief (nothing more), and he cops degenerate almost into keystone cops. Why, I ask you, WHY? Damn you network execs!!!!!!!
I agree that when they "cheered" it up the 2d season, it was not near as good, although still better than many other sitcoms ever were. The dynamics between John and Darryl "Chill" Mitchell were were just right and was my favorite part of this show
The first season was dark and not what American TV viewers are used to. It was even filmed dark. It was brilliant. The second season brought in a love interest and brighter sets. The whole tone of the show changed and everybody stopped watching because it sucked.
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10-02-2013, 06:15 PM
