Why exactly did "Sanford" (1980-81) fail

[TMC]

And please don't say that it's because Demond Wilson (Lamont) didn't participate because that's way too obvious or easy of an argument.

Here's some insight that I could immediately find off of the TV Party website:

http://www.tvparty.com/mysfoxx2.html

Redd's next series, 'Sanford', was an attempt by NBC to revive the Fred Sanford character in January, 1980, with new producers and none of the old series regulars except Rollo (Nathaniel Taylor).

Fred was still in the junkyard, but now saddled with an obese, live-in good-ol-boy named Cal who has invested in the "junk business".

Fred was also now dating a wealthy, Beverly Hills socialite with a stereotypically stuffy family. When initial ratings proved light, LaWanda Page was brought back as Aunt Ester, but without strong scripts this lackadaisical misadventure only lasted only a few months.

http://www.tvparty.com/70-sanford-arms.html

NBC and Redd Foxx kissed and made up and attempted to resurrect Sanford & Son in March of 1980 - both parties were desperate for the kind of massive success they had together just a few years earlier; NBC's ratings were in the same toilet as Redd's career.

Demond Wilson wouldn't play ball so the network, in their infinite wisdom, teamed Fred with a white redneck instead. Inexplicably, Fred Sanford also acquired a rich girlfriend. Other than Rollo and officers Smitty and Hoppy, the supporting cast from the original series - including Aunt Ester - were nowhere to be seen.

The first episode of Sanford did attract the big numbers the network was hoping for but the revised format and unfunny jokes were a big turn off. NBC yanked the show in the fall but wasn't ready to give up - after all, the initial ratings proved the public still wanted to like the show.

The peacock network switched things up when the show returned as a mid-season replacement in 1981. For one thing Sanford was moved to Friday nights where Sanford & Son dominated the ratings just five years earlier. Aunt Ester, Grady, and Hoppy & Smitty all made guest appearances. The scripts were overall funnier but the show was dropped after just four outings, returning in the summer of 1981 to burn off episodes already shot.

[MikeLutton]

not sure ido know I really liked this show toward 2nd season should lasted like few more years least to get the others noticed and all

[TMC]

Since I didn't exactly get the answer that I wanted..:

I don't think Sanford could have been anywhere near the hit Sanford and Son was in its prime. Even if Lamont were there and the show came back as Sanford and Son, I still don't think it would have done as well. S&S was a very "70's show." We're now in the more sophisticated and more slickly produced 80s television climate where the bell bottoms, afros and wah-wah guitars of 1975 have lost their value.

That being said, I think Sanford could've done better than it did if certain things had been different. I don't anyone was feeling Cal as a replacement for Lamont. Maybe he could have worked as like a neighbor who Fred butted heads with, ala Julio...but not as a stand-in for Lamont. Then things were further compounded by Fred's boring new girlfriend with no explanation for what had happened with Donna.

I think what they should have done was put Grady in Lamont's place and turn the show into a buddy comedy with he and Fred getting into hijinx. Viewers probably would have better accepted that, since they already knew Grady.

Sanford (as it was) was just too awkward to accept. They didn't change what needed to be changed, but altered what should have been left alone.

I was thinking that a show like Sanford & Son would have a fairly hard time having to adjust to the more "touchy-feeling" formula (S&S wasn't exactly the most politically correct show in hindsight) of '80s shows. I remember watching episodes of Sanford on BET back in the mid-'90s (and for a spell in 2008) and there was an episode in which Fred lectures Cal's prejudice mother about tolerance. The whole thing seemed kind of disingenuous and hypocritical because Fred Sanford was pretty bigoted himself on Sanford & Son.

[MikeLutton]

and aunt esther was barley,on there that was missed,bubba was not seen either the house looked lot cleaner n painted to other then that good show.i think rollo should of stayed on there give ol feeling of the old show

[Cloud9 Lorraine]

I think S&S was a great show. With the exception of a few weak episodes in later seasons, the show could do no wrong. It had a certain "personality" and there was no way to recreate the same dynamics again. The schtick, the characters, the concept, all melded together creating a show we are all still watching, enjoying and talking about 40 years later. Often spin-offs are unsuccessful, I think in part, because viewers are expecting a continuation of the original show, and it is never the same.

I didn't like Sanford at all. It tried to be a continuation of S&S, but it lacked everything that made S&S great, like chemistry between likable characters and a conceivable concept. Fred and Lamont's relationship transcended beyond the story line of a particular episode. Esther, Bubba, Grady, all a perfect concoction of characters that played well off each other.

Probably a better idea would have been to let S&S rest in peace and recreate a completely different show for Redd. Like "The Bob Newhard Show" vs. "Newhart". Of course, this is all hindsight, but in my opinion, S&S couldn't be matched no matter what they did.

[TMC]

What's Happening! is another black-lead sitcom from the '70s that you can argue didn't exactly translate well in the '80s:
http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/...d.php?t=271687

You can also argue that shows like Diff'rent Strokes and The Jeffersons "lost their edge" or whitewashed their black characters/turned them into caricatures once the '80s set in:
http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/...d.php?t=327885

https://web.archive.org/web/20061214...jeffersons.htm

I thought that The Jeffersons was the best spinoff ever produced by Norman Lear. But it has jumped quite a few sharks. #1-WHITEWASHING: When the show started in 1975, it was very much like ALL IN THE FAMILY with its raw edgineess and sharp humor. George and Louise may have moved on up out of the ghetto, but their heads did not. The show was very keen on its' racial identity early on. But by the time the 1981-82 season ended, THE JEFFERSONS had become completely whitewashed, even though it was the third highest rated show on TV that season (behind DALLAS and 60 MINUTES.) George had become friends with Tom and Bentley and stopped making jokes like "Pin The Tail on the Honky" and "Zebra". And Louise, the sensible, level-headed one, became even more snobbier than George, trying to impress the upper crust NY socialites. #2-THE 2 LIONELS: Why exactly did Mike Evans leave the show? I could somewhat tolerate Damon Evans, but for me-and a lot of others-Mike Evans is the TRUE Lionel Jefferson. #3-MOTHER JEFFERSON'S DEATH: I think the person who said that Zara Cully's death was the best thing that ever happened to the show is cruel. Mother Jefferson provided the show with some of the best one-liners ever used. Not to mention that she was the one thing who could irritate Louise more that George's snobbishness. But deep down, Mama loved and respected Louise. #4-CHECKING IN: Checking In was the ill-fated spinoff in where Florence was managing a hotel with Larry Linville (a.k.a. Frank Burns from M*A*S*H). Giving Florence her own show was a dumb idea. Though I loved the interplay between Linville and Marla Gibbs, she was sorely needed back on THE JEFFERSONS. Who else was going to help Louise keep George in check? #5-NO CLOSING EPISODE: How in the hell did this show not have a closing episode? If MASH, COSBY, and countless others have a closing show, why can't this one have it? It was just as important of a show

The Jeffersons is my all time favorite sitcom made in the US. When it debuted it had sharp and edgy humor but by the 1980s when Embassy Productions took over for Norman Lear, it had turned into another one of the crappy "comedies" that came from that decade. Louise had become an idiotic and foolish woman and George became friends with Tom and started looking out for Florence. Mother Jefferson was the best. Even at the age of 86, she delivered some of the most hilarious performances ever witnessed on TV. Even though the quality had been diminished, it deserved a final episode.

[Rewound50]

I think you completely undersell Demond Wilson as the straight man in this series. The father/son dynamic gave the show it's charm and set the tone for the struggles they had trying to pay the bills and make it. Losing Lamont placed the crux of the dilemma on Fred every time and diluted the family quality that gave the show it's endearing charm. That was easily demonstrated when they tried to replace Lamont with characters that were one dimensional and even more stereotyped than what audiences could swallow. It betrayed the tone of the original series and audiences quickly saw that. The original show ended only because there was too much tension between the actors and the producers. It didn't help that Foxx and Wilson each had a major coke problem that likely played a big role in that process.

[TVFactFan]

Originally Posted by Rewound50

I think you completely undersell Demond Wilson as the straight man in this series. The father/son dynamic gave the show it's charm and set the tone for the struggles they had trying to pay the bills and make it. Losing Lamont placed the crux of the dilemma on Fred every time and diluted the family quality that gave the show it's endearing charm. That was easily demonstrated when they tried to replace Lamont with characters that were one dimensional and even more stereotyped than what audiences could swallow. It betrayed the tone of the original series and audiences quickly saw that. The original show ended only because there was too much tension between the actors and the producers. It didn't help that Foxx and Wilson each had a major coke problem that likely played a big role in that process.

Lamont was a nerdy boring whiner who was not as fun to watch as Cal

[WatcherofOldTV]

The audience moved on and the jokes were no longer hip with the time.

Also, the actors had nothing to play. The writing was much poorer than when the series first aired. It was played out and started out as worn out as when it had ended around the time of that stupid Hawaii show.

It wasn't that Cal wasn't Lamont. It's that the guy was a horrible actor and physically was not funny. He shouldn't have been as overbearing in size, as Redd Foxx was the star of the show, not him. This was a subtle but main difference.

Also, having Rollo on the show didn't make any sense without Lamont. It told the audience that they were begging for ratings and that does little to instill confidence in the audience.

At this time, NBC was grasping for straws and Freddy Silverman tried to pull this together, but it wasn't right for the audience. He wanted Redd Foxx in a 1 hour dramadie about a math teacher who moonlights as a comedian. Never got off the ground, so he went back to Sanford.

[GARFIELDKOOL]

Originally Posted by WatcherofOldTV

The audience moved on and the jokes were no longer hip with the time.

Also, the actors had nothing to play. The writing was much poorer than when the series first aired. It was played out and started out as worn out as when it had ended around the time of that stupid Hawaii show.

It wasn't that Cal wasn't Lamont. It's that the guy was a horrible actor and physically was not funny. He shouldn't have been as overbearing in size, as Redd Foxx was the star of the show, not him. This was a subtle but main difference.

Also, having Rollo on the show didn't make any sense without Lamont. It told the audience that they were begging for ratings and that does little to instill confidence in the audience.

At this time, NBC was grasping for straws and Freddy Silverman tried to pull this together, but it wasn't right for the audience. He wanted Redd Foxx in a 1 hour dramadie about a math teacher who moonlights as a comedian. Never got off the ground, so he went back to Sanford.

It was that and other things. Like you first mentioned, the audience moved on. In 1980-81, what was the #1 shows on TV? Dallas, Dukes of hazzard, Three's Company, just to name a few. Sanford and Son had been off of TV for 3 years and you the people had different new shows to watch. It was a new era. The 70s shows were being pushed out for the 80s shows. Sanford wasn't Sanford and Son, plain and simple. I see they brought in Lawanda Page in the second season, to me that looked like they were trying to raise the ratings with that. But it was too late, a new era began

[TVFactFan]

Sanford is much better than the last season of Sanford and son

[Sonny Carson]

Originally Posted by TVFactFan

Sanford is much better than the last season of Sanford and son

Agreed!

[TVFactFan]

Originally Posted by Sonny Carson

Agreed!

I would say season 1 too. Remember in season 1 all we saw was Lamont and Fred no other characters

[GARFIELDKOOL]

Originally Posted by TVFactFan

I would say season 1 too. Remember in season 1 all we saw was Lamont and Fred no other characters

Season 1 was decent IMO. You have to realize that season 1 was a tryout and everything wasn't developed and didn't come together yet. But it was ok. Just remember, season 1 was living up to it's title.

[TVFactFan]

Originally Posted by GARFIELDKOOL

Season 1 was decent IMO. You have to realize that season 1 was a tryout and everything wasn't developed and didn't come together yet. But it was ok. Just remember, season 1 was living up to it's title.

I would take Cal over Lamont any day of the week