Why? - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

crazyredhead · 12-26-2003, 06:22 PM

Why do you think Desi started drinking and philandering in 1955? I know he had before but why did he start again? Was it his own selfish desires, stress, or what do you think?

Kazza · 12-26-2003, 06:34 PM

He always was a drinker but the pressures that he had to fulfill Lucy's ambition is what made him drink that way. She was given the option to retire happily or keep on growing; that's what they did and led to that. He had that uncontrollable feeling that everything had to be taken care of and to make Lucy happy. What about if they had retire happily and lived that way; probably his drinking would'nt had gone as far as it did. No one makes you drink but that was the escape to all the pressures that the business put on him.

Ricardos4ever · 12-26-2003, 11:52 PM

Couldn't have said it better myself. Just to add to that, his real love was performing -- being center stage, beating on that conga drum. In ILL he performed, but the majority of his work was the behind-the-scenes stuff which had him sitting behind a desk, constantly making huge decisions and deals. Building a television empire was fun at first and he was good at it, but in the long run it didn't make him happy. He was a performer at heart, not a businessman. The unhappiness and added pressure began to wear on him.

Another big thing that played into his drinking may have been the fact that Lucy was center stage, not him. He was raised in a culture where women were second to men, and his ego got the better of him sometimes. He was doing a huge part of the work, but Lucy got all of the glory. He was proud of her and recognized her as the great talent and the reason for the show's success, but it still must have been hard on him. As Lucie Arnaz said, he never even got the credit until he was dead. But God knows Lucy tried to open people's eyes about it. They were always giving each other the credit.

SPLAIN · 12-29-2003, 02:34 PM

Yes, that's true, he drank and gambled and fooled around BEFORE he ever met her, and he couldn't cope with being Mr Ball, so that did not help. He certainly knew how to present her though and he was muuch better for her than her second husband in that regard. He was not a stupid man, so he had to know that when he presented her with that choice of retiring or getting bigger, she would choose to go on working, because she had the talent to be working till she dropped. He had to know that. He built the empire, but after a while the joys of running it wore off and his drinking interfered to the point where he almost lost it all. So she took over, and saved it, he retired, but eventually also tried to come back, retiring at 47 was crazy, and the money pressures intensified so he tried coming back. The accent still played a factor in his not getting certain roles, i couldn't believe it when i heard that he wanted to play Elliot Ness, and it's a shame that the Hollywood people are that narrowminded, but even on Alice, when he had that small role, they complained about his looks, and drinking and his accent, some things never change!

Lodee · 01-06-2004, 05:24 PM

Quote:

i couldn't believe it when i heard that he wanted to play Elliot Ness

And he finally did get to play him on SNL!

Mickey · 01-06-2004, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SPLAIN
even on Alice, when he had that small role, they complained about his looks, and drinking and his accent, some things never change!

What was wrong with his looks? Or was this later, and they felt he had drunk them away?!

dawsongirl · 01-06-2004, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mickey
What was wrong with his looks? Or was this later, and they felt he had drunk them away?!

It was later. 1978. He looked like hell imo.

SPLAIN · 01-07-2004, 10:59 AM

Didn't you ever see him hosting Saturday Night Live Mickey, his teeth were horrible, hair white, face puffy, i think good looking people pay for it later one because both Lucy and Desi were put through the ringer later in life. It's like society wants to remember them the way they used to look, even when they're older, well, not eveybody can pull a Cary Grant. In a way, i always thought someone like Marilyn Monroe or Princess Diana dying young was a good thing, they will always be remembered as great beauties.

Mickey · 01-07-2004, 12:39 PM

Saturday Night Live didn't really get shown here until the eighties, and then only very late nights. It hasn't really been shown since. I haven't seen Desi any later than the Ironside episode, when he looked fine to me.

Speaking of good looking people 'paying for it later', though, that certainly doesn't apply to Dirk Benedict! He's over here at the moment for some reason, popping up all over the schedules, and he looks incredible. It pays to be macrobiotic!

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SPLAIN · 01-07-2004, 02:33 PM

Yeah, but, correct me if i'm wrong, didn't he have cancer at some point, decades ago? We have some very famous people here in North America who died of cancer after preaching about their love of eating tree bark and other unappetizing things. Anybody remember Yule Gibbons, and wasn't Adele Davis another one who had to eat crow when it came out that she had cancer?

Lodee · 01-07-2004, 03:37 PM

I rememer Yule Gibbons! Geez I haven't heard that name in years.

Or what about Jim Fixx that runner who died of a heart attact! All that exercise and healthy living for nothing!

Mickey · 01-08-2004, 06:09 AM

Dirk had cancer in 1975, not that I entirely see the relevancy! He switched to macrobiotics to fight it, 'cause conventional medicine gave him no chance. There's no tree bark in macrobiotics anyway, it's nice stuff! It's basically just the food that humans were originally designed to exist on (in a temperate environment - it'd kill you in the Arctic!), and still runs most efficiently on today. Dirk's been living his life as a sort of experiment ever since, just to see what happens. It's quite interesting actually, however it turns out.

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SPLAIN · 01-08-2004, 02:28 PM

Sorry Mickey, i didn't mean to equate what Dirk was doing with what the others did, great for him, if they didn't give a chance and he proved them wrong by taking charge of his life, i really admire that, unfortunately i know nothing about Microbiotics having lived my entire 53 years on junk and LOVING every minute of it. Like Jackie Kennedy said on her deathbed, if she had known she would die so young, she would have had every dessert that was ever offered her! Living a life with bland mediocre food doesn't always really EXTEND life, maybe it just SEEMS that way! LOL!

Mickey · 01-08-2004, 04:21 PM

Precisely. There's no point extending your life if you're not enjoying it!

__________________
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Lodee · 01-08-2004, 04:38 PM

Well, if I found out I was going to die one of the first things I'd do is go get myself a pack of cigarettes.

Maybe some cheesecake too.

12-26-2003, 06:22 PM	#1
crazyredhead Seniorita Forum Regular Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: DIZZY LAND Posts: 715	Why? Why do you think Desi started drinking and philandering in 1955? I know he had before but why did he start again? Was it his own selfish desires, stress, or what do you think?
	__________________ *BEKAH* But uf coss I cahn spik purfuctly good Amurecun. Ethel: "Ring the bell." Fred: "What for?" Ethel: "They don't know we're comin up and people would like a little privacy." Fred: "These aren't people, they're Ricky & Lucy."

12-26-2003, 11:52 PM	#3
Ricardos4ever Henna-rinsess Frequent Poster Join Date: Jan 28, 2002 Location: Somewhere in the middle of the world's longest Conga line Posts: 473	Couldn't have said it better myself. Just to add to that, his real love was performing -- being center stage, beating on that conga drum. In ILL he performed, but the majority of his work was the behind-the-scenes stuff which had him sitting behind a desk, constantly making huge decisions and deals. Building a television empire was fun at first and he was good at it, but in the long run it didn't make him happy. He was a performer at heart, not a businessman. The unhappiness and added pressure began to wear on him. Another big thing that played into his drinking may have been the fact that Lucy was center stage, not him. He was raised in a culture where women were second to men, and his ego got the better of him sometimes. He was doing a huge part of the work, but Lucy got all of the glory. He was proud of her and recognized her as the great talent and the reason for the show's success, but it still must have been hard on him. As Lucie Arnaz said, he never even got the credit until he was dead. But God knows Lucy tried to open people's eyes about it. They were always giving each other the credit.
	__________________ ELVIS LIVES ***** "They had one of those historical marriages, like Napoleon and Josephine, Richard and Liz--destined to be trouble but destined for them to never find anyone as passionate or as fabulous." -- Lucie Arnaz on her parents, Lucille Ball and Desi Arnaz

12-26-2003, 06:34 PM	#2
Kazza Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Oct 17, 2003 Posts: 3,244	He always was a drinker but the pressures that he had to fulfill Lucy's ambition is what made him drink that way. She was given the option to retire happily or keep on growing; that's what they did and led to that. He had that uncontrollable feeling that everything had to be taken care of and to make Lucy happy. What about if they had retire happily and lived that way; probably his drinking would'nt had gone as far as it did. No one makes you drink but that was the escape to all the pressures that the business put on him.

12-29-2003, 02:34 PM	#4
SPLAIN I Love Lucy Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Mar 04, 2002 Location: MONTREAL, CANADA Posts: 4,563	Yes, that's true, he drank and gambled and fooled around BEFORE he ever met her, and he couldn't cope with being Mr Ball, so that did not help. He certainly knew how to present her though and he was muuch better for her than her second husband in that regard. He was not a stupid man, so he had to know that when he presented her with that choice of retiring or getting bigger, she would choose to go on working, because she had the talent to be working till she dropped. He had to know that. He built the empire, but after a while the joys of running it wore off and his drinking interfered to the point where he almost lost it all. So she took over, and saved it, he retired, but eventually also tried to come back, retiring at 47 was crazy, and the money pressures intensified so he tried coming back. The accent still played a factor in his not getting certain roles, i couldn't believe it when i heard that he wanted to play Elliot Ness, and it's a shame that the Hollywood people are that narrowminded, but even on Alice, when he had that small role, they complained about his looks, and drinking and his accent, some things never change!

01-07-2004, 10:59 AM	#8
SPLAIN I Love Lucy Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Mar 04, 2002 Location: MONTREAL, CANADA Posts: 4,563	Didn't you ever see him hosting Saturday Night Live Mickey, his teeth were horrible, hair white, face puffy, i think good looking people pay for it later one because both Lucy and Desi were put through the ringer later in life. It's like society wants to remember them the way they used to look, even when they're older, well, not eveybody can pull a Cary Grant. In a way, i always thought someone like Marilyn Monroe or Princess Diana dying young was a good thing, they will always be remembered as great beauties.

01-07-2004, 12:39 PM	#9
Mickey Ranger Forum Regular Join Date: Oct 12, 2002 Location: The UK, and still finding Desi funnier than Lucy Posts: 960	Saturday Night Live didn't really get shown here until the eighties, and then only very late nights. It hasn't really been shown since. I haven't seen Desi any later than the Ironside episode, when he looked fine to me. Speaking of good looking people 'paying for it later', though, that certainly doesn't apply to Dirk Benedict! He's over here at the moment for some reason, popping up all over the schedules, and he looks incredible. It pays to be macrobiotic! __________________ 46664 - Play Music - Fight AIDS

01-07-2004, 02:33 PM	#10
SPLAIN I Love Lucy Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Mar 04, 2002 Location: MONTREAL, CANADA Posts: 4,563	Yeah, but, correct me if i'm wrong, didn't he have cancer at some point, decades ago? We have some very famous people here in North America who died of cancer after preaching about their love of eating tree bark and other unappetizing things. Anybody remember Yule Gibbons, and wasn't Adele Davis another one who had to eat crow when it came out that she had cancer?

01-07-2004, 03:37 PM	#11
Lodee Member Senior Member Join Date: Jun 12, 2003 Posts: 1,562	I rememer Yule Gibbons! Geez I haven't heard that name in years. Or what about Jim Fixx that runner who died of a heart attact! All that exercise and healthy living for nothing!

01-08-2004, 06:09 AM	#12
Mickey Ranger Forum Regular Join Date: Oct 12, 2002 Location: The UK, and still finding Desi funnier than Lucy Posts: 960	Dirk had cancer in 1975, not that I entirely see the relevancy! He switched to macrobiotics to fight it, 'cause conventional medicine gave him no chance. There's no tree bark in macrobiotics anyway, it's nice stuff! It's basically just the food that humans were originally designed to exist on (in a temperate environment - it'd kill you in the Arctic!), and still runs most efficiently on today. Dirk's been living his life as a sort of experiment ever since, just to see what happens. It's quite interesting actually, however it turns out. __________________ 46664 - Play Music - Fight AIDS

01-08-2004, 02:28 PM	#13
SPLAIN I Love Lucy Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Mar 04, 2002 Location: MONTREAL, CANADA Posts: 4,563	Sorry Mickey, i didn't mean to equate what Dirk was doing with what the others did, great for him, if they didn't give a chance and he proved them wrong by taking charge of his life, i really admire that, unfortunately i know nothing about Microbiotics having lived my entire 53 years on junk and LOVING every minute of it. Like Jackie Kennedy said on her deathbed, if she had known she would die so young, she would have had every dessert that was ever offered her! Living a life with bland mediocre food doesn't always really EXTEND life, maybe it just SEEMS that way! LOL!

01-08-2004, 04:21 PM	#14
Mickey Ranger Forum Regular Join Date: Oct 12, 2002 Location: The UK, and still finding Desi funnier than Lucy Posts: 960	Precisely. There's no point extending your life if you're not enjoying it! __________________ 46664 - Play Music - Fight AIDS

01-08-2004, 04:38 PM	#15
Lodee Member Senior Member Join Date: Jun 12, 2003 Posts: 1,562	Well, if I found out I was going to die one of the first things I'd do is go get myself a pack of cigarettes. Maybe some cheesecake too.