Who was better? - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

crazyredhead · 12-22-2003, 05:01 PM

Who do you think was the better parent, Desi or Lucy? And why??
I think they were both good parents, so don't throw that excuse at me.

Who do you think was BETTER?

SPLAIN · 12-22-2003, 05:20 PM

Desi showed them love more naturally but was a bad example. Lucy never was taught by her own mother how to parent kids and had a career that took up much of her time, but she worshipped those kids and made sure she set them up with careers and provided millions for the rest of their lives, so even though she might have not been there as much as they would have liked, she had her mother sub for her, and checked their school progress and was hands on as a mother, considering her circumstances. The answer might lie in how each child was also, they were living in affluence in beverly Hills surrounded by spoiled brats who could do as they pleased, but these two had curfews and were disciplined and it shows in how they turned out, and how they are raising their own children. Hopefully they learned from their parents mistakes, that's usually the way it works.

Amber8611 · 12-22-2003, 05:28 PM

I thought they were both great parents (altough Lucie has made some pretty harsh comments about her mother's parenting skills, or atleast left some made by other people in Lucy & Desi: A Home Movie.) Desi got the kids in the summer and holidays and Lucy got them during the school year, so of course they were going to have more fun with Desi, but Lucy was a good disiplinarian and didn't really spoil them as most Hollywood children are. They had an extremely small allowance (something like $.50 a week), so they learned to value a dollar. She also gave them a chance to work with her in Here's Lucy even though they weren't too good at acting in the beginning. She always wanted the best for her children and was constantly praising them in interviews. So even though they might not have been the perfect parents (who is?), they both did a great job, IMO.

Ricardos4ever · 12-22-2003, 10:58 PM

That would be a hard question to have answered because the only two people who really know are those who were directly affected -- Lucie and Desi, Jr. But then again, I'm sure it might be extremely difficult to pinpoint just one person and proclaim them to be the better parent. Lucy and Desi were so different, so they probably had different parenting styles altogether with good and bad traits.

One thing we are forgetting is that there are two other key people who took on parenting roles: Gary and Edie. They had the most difficult job of being the step-parents, and they apparently handled it well. Gary would never take sides in any of the arguments and would treat the kids fairly and as adults. He was also a great sport when Desi Sr. would constantly kid him, and when the kids would show him and Lucy "The Parent Trap" for the 7th time in an attempt to show their mother that they wanted her to get back together with their father (as much as I am not a huge fan of Gary, I must admit that it sounds like he was a great stepfather). Also, Edie was someone who the kids often came to when they felt they couldn't talk to their mother about certain things. So they deserve plenty of credit in helping to raise those kids.

It is hard for me not to feel a little sorry for Gary and Edie. Lucy and Desi were the world's most popular married couple in the '50s (although, for some reason, Gary claimed he was oblivious

), and in everyones' eyes Lucy and Desi would always be married. That must have been very hard to compete with. Never mind the fact that Lucy and Desi kept very much in touch with each other and remained close. Their spouses were very gracious about it, but they were both aware of the strong bond that Lucy and Desi shared. Someone once said that Edie was a very unhappy woman because she knew that Lucy would always come first in Desi's heart and she would always be second. And, of course, Gary's comment after Lucy's death about her finally being happy now, because she's with Desi, speaks volumes. Both Edie and Gary had to face a sad reality. And so did Lucy and Desi.

Ok, that's the only sympathetic Gary post you'll ever get out of me.

dawsongirl · 12-22-2003, 11:49 PM

How bout I just say neither. But I have kind of high standards when it comes to "good" parents. They don't make the cut.

Mickey · 12-23-2003, 06:41 AM

I know we're looking for a lively discussion topic, but this is kind of a pointless one, isn't it? Unless some of you are secretly their children, and know what it's like to be brought up by both of them, then I don't see how anybody here can actually answer this question. If you want to put it as, "knowing what we think we know about them, which one would we rather have been brought up by," then okay, but "which was the better parent" isn't a valid question.

They both loved their kids, however they chose to display that love. What else needs to be said?

crazyredhead · 12-23-2003, 10:25 AM

Good grief, this is just a matter for us to discuss, is that a crime?

crazyredhead · 12-23-2003, 10:50 AM

I agree with what ya'll have said. Desi was a bad example. Do you think his doings rubbed off on Desi Jr. and caused him to do the things he did? Or was it just the selfish desires a teenage boy had?
But I do think Desi was a caring, loving Dad. It did seem as if he spoiled the kids though, but I guess he wanted the times he spent with them to be good.
I haven't heard much on Edie that much. Keith said in his book that she would do things with the kids but that's about it. I sure wish Desi wrote Another Book!

SPLAIN · 12-23-2003, 10:55 AM

I agree about the stepparents, but think you're giving Gary too much credit. What choice did he have? Like has been said many times in books, he cleared away every friend and family member from Desi's era, but couldn't possibly do anything about Lucy's mom or her kids. And i swear we never heard anything about Edie back then, Desi and Edie were more or less out of the public eye. But you're right, if their parents didn't have time for them, the stepparents were there too which helped, and i too always admired the fact that Gary was peacemaker in fights and looked to laugh all the time. The best thing that was said though by Amber about the fact that if you can't wait to have kids, have been denied that joy for so long, of course you're going to spend the rest of your life so thrilled to have had those kids and enjoy your time with them. Risking her professional life to start them on careers was a perfect example, and as i've said before, try and find another star who spent their interviews talking about their kids aspirations, grades and friends and so on, very unselfish. As for you Dawsongirl, don't you allow for the fact that most Hollywood brats are spoiled rotten, and these two got some normalcy compared to their contemporaries.

crazyredhead · 12-23-2003, 02:38 PM

I'm surprised how Edie could take all the crap that Desi gave her. He didn't stop doing the things he did even after Lucy. You would have thought he would have learned his lesson? LOL I bet their kids could give us more info on Edie. Didn't Lucie and Little Desi have a stepbrother too?

PracTz · 12-23-2003, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crazyredhead
I'm surprised how Edie could take all the crap that Desi gave her. He didn't stop doing the things he did even after Lucy. You would have thought he would have learned his lesson? LOL I bet their kids could give us more info on Edie. Didn't Lucie and Little Desi have a stepbrother too?

That's right. Edie had a son nearly the same age as his stepsibs(and according to Keith got along with them as children) but I've never heard what became of him. I guess since his father was the founder of Kal-Kan, he saw to it that the son was generously provided for but I'm not sure.

While we're on the subject, I don't think Gary or Edie anything less than dedicated stepparents to Lucie or Desi,Jr- and while I don't think Lucy or Desi were flawless as parents, I believe each of them adored their offspring and did the best they believed they knew how with them (and I'm glad they both lived to resolve many misunderstandings from teenhood and be close to their offspring at the end of their lives)!

SPLAIN · 12-23-2003, 03:15 PM

But Lucie still has issues to this very day and i was told about my own that it NEVER goes away, so she should just give up and go on with her life, hopefully she has learned from those mistakes and will do a better job with her own kids.

Ricardos4ever · 12-23-2003, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crazyredhead
I'm surprised how Edie could take all the crap that Desi gave her. He didn't stop doing the things he did even after Lucy. You would have thought he would have learned his lesson?

I suspect that Edie married Desi with a good idea of who he was and probably didn't expect him to change. Edie had already been friendly with both Lucy and Desi for years before she and Desi ever got together, so she probably heard a lot of the gossip that was going on about them, and maybe she was witness to some of the battles that went on between Lucy and Desi. After all, many of their fights would be very open in front of guests, especially toward the end. But I really don't know how close Edie was to Lucy and Desi when they were still married -- I just know that she was a neighbor of theirs at Del Mar.

My point is, I'm sure that Edie didn't come into the marriage clueless about Desi's alcoholism, his philandering, etc. She was just a lot more tolerant about it than Lucy. She even knew about about a house that Desi kept so he could have his flings, but she didn't go there. I remember reading that her attitude about it was that he was getting older and was just trying to prove to himself that he still had it, so she let him be.

crazyredhead · 12-24-2003, 09:52 AM

Very good info, guys. I remember reading that Desi was trying to convince Edie to marry him. He was saying like leave that bum and marry me. LOL Didn't they get married in Las Vegas? What a perfect place for Desi! lol

SPLAIN · 12-24-2003, 10:58 AM

Even Lucy knew about his house in the hills, she referred calls there. Can you imagine telling your husband's girlfriends to call him at his OTHER house? The thing with POOR Edie, and i mean that litterally is she was married to a multimillionnaire and she only asked of Desi that he take care of her in the style she had been accustomed to. The money he got from Lucy for his share of Desilu, 2 and one half million was what he had to live on, and he lived off of that instead of investing it and living off the interest. So, not only did Edie show tolerance but she lowered her lifestyle substantially. When they both died after long illnesses, they left heavily mortgaged houses and debts, but at least i hope their time together was pleasant. Because Desi was a fun loving gregarious life live to the fullest type of guy. Yes being married in Las Vegas was VERY appropriate, LOL!

12-22-2003, 05:01 PM	#1
crazyredhead Seniorita Forum Regular Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: DIZZY LAND Posts: 715	Who was better? Who do you think was the better parent, Desi or Lucy? And why?? I think they were both good parents, so don't throw that excuse at me. Who do you think was BETTER?
	__________________ *BEKAH* But uf coss I cahn spik purfuctly good Amurecun. Ethel: "Ring the bell." Fred: "What for?" Ethel: "They don't know we're comin up and people would like a little privacy." Fred: "These aren't people, they're Ricky & Lucy."

12-22-2003, 10:58 PM	#4
Ricardos4ever Henna-rinsess Frequent Poster Join Date: Jan 28, 2002 Location: Somewhere in the middle of the world's longest Conga line Posts: 473	That would be a hard question to have answered because the only two people who really know are those who were directly affected -- Lucie and Desi, Jr. But then again, I'm sure it might be extremely difficult to pinpoint just one person and proclaim them to be the better parent. Lucy and Desi were so different, so they probably had different parenting styles altogether with good and bad traits. One thing we are forgetting is that there are two other key people who took on parenting roles: Gary and Edie. They had the most difficult job of being the step-parents, and they apparently handled it well. Gary would never take sides in any of the arguments and would treat the kids fairly and as adults. He was also a great sport when Desi Sr. would constantly kid him, and when the kids would show him and Lucy "The Parent Trap" for the 7th time in an attempt to show their mother that they wanted her to get back together with their father (as much as I am not a huge fan of Gary, I must admit that it sounds like he was a great stepfather). Also, Edie was someone who the kids often came to when they felt they couldn't talk to their mother about certain things. So they deserve plenty of credit in helping to raise those kids. It is hard for me not to feel a little sorry for Gary and Edie. Lucy and Desi were the world's most popular married couple in the '50s (although, for some reason, Gary claimed he was oblivious ), and in everyones' eyes Lucy and Desi would always be married. That must have been very hard to compete with. Never mind the fact that Lucy and Desi kept very much in touch with each other and remained close. Their spouses were very gracious about it, but they were both aware of the strong bond that Lucy and Desi shared. Someone once said that Edie was a very unhappy woman because she knew that Lucy would always come first in Desi's heart and she would always be second. And, of course, Gary's comment after Lucy's death about her finally being happy now, because she's with Desi, speaks volumes. Both Edie and Gary had to face a sad reality. And so did Lucy and Desi. Ok, that's the only sympathetic Gary post you'll ever get out of me.
	__________________ ELVIS LIVES ***** "They had one of those historical marriages, like Napoleon and Josephine, Richard and Liz--destined to be trouble but destined for them to never find anyone as passionate or as fabulous." -- Lucie Arnaz on her parents, Lucille Ball and Desi Arnaz Last edited by Ricardos4ever; 12-22-2003 at 11:19 PM.

12-23-2003, 06:41 AM	#6
Mickey Ranger Forum Regular Join Date: Oct 12, 2002 Location: The UK, and still finding Desi funnier than Lucy Posts: 960	I know we're looking for a lively discussion topic, but this is kind of a pointless one, isn't it? Unless some of you are secretly their children, and know what it's like to be brought up by both of them, then I don't see how anybody here can actually answer this question. If you want to put it as, "knowing what we think we know about them, which one would we rather have been brought up by," then okay, but "which was the better parent" isn't a valid question. They both loved their kids, however they chose to display that love. What else needs to be said?
	__________________ 46664 - Play Music - Fight AIDS

12-23-2003, 10:25 AM	#7
crazyredhead Seniorita Forum Regular Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: DIZZY LAND Posts: 715	Good grief, this is just a matter for us to discuss, is that a crime?
	Last edited by crazyredhead; 12-23-2003 at 10:51 AM.

12-22-2003, 05:20 PM	#2
SPLAIN I Love Lucy Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Mar 04, 2002 Location: MONTREAL, CANADA Posts: 4,563	Desi showed them love more naturally but was a bad example. Lucy never was taught by her own mother how to parent kids and had a career that took up much of her time, but she worshipped those kids and made sure she set them up with careers and provided millions for the rest of their lives, so even though she might have not been there as much as they would have liked, she had her mother sub for her, and checked their school progress and was hands on as a mother, considering her circumstances. The answer might lie in how each child was also, they were living in affluence in beverly Hills surrounded by spoiled brats who could do as they pleased, but these two had curfews and were disciplined and it shows in how they turned out, and how they are raising their own children. Hopefully they learned from their parents mistakes, that's usually the way it works.

12-22-2003, 05:28 PM	#3
Amber8611 Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Aug 21, 2003 Location: Connecticut Posts: 188	I thought they were both great parents (altough Lucie has made some pretty harsh comments about her mother's parenting skills, or atleast left some made by other people in Lucy & Desi: A Home Movie.) Desi got the kids in the summer and holidays and Lucy got them during the school year, so of course they were going to have more fun with Desi, but Lucy was a good disiplinarian and didn't really spoil them as most Hollywood children are. They had an extremely small allowance (something like $.50 a week), so they learned to value a dollar. She also gave them a chance to work with her in Here's Lucy even though they weren't too good at acting in the beginning. She always wanted the best for her children and was constantly praising them in interviews. So even though they might not have been the perfect parents (who is?), they both did a great job, IMO.

12-22-2003, 11:49 PM	#5
dawsongirl Member Forum Icon Join Date: Jan 04, 2001 Posts: 53,134	How bout I just say neither. But I have kind of high standards when it comes to "good" parents. They don't make the cut.

12-23-2003, 10:50 AM	#8
crazyredhead Seniorita Forum Regular Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: DIZZY LAND Posts: 715	I agree with what ya'll have said. Desi was a bad example. Do you think his doings rubbed off on Desi Jr. and caused him to do the things he did? Or was it just the selfish desires a teenage boy had? But I do think Desi was a caring, loving Dad. It did seem as if he spoiled the kids though, but I guess he wanted the times he spent with them to be good. I haven't heard much on Edie that much. Keith said in his book that she would do things with the kids but that's about it. I sure wish Desi wrote Another Book!

12-23-2003, 10:55 AM	#9
SPLAIN I Love Lucy Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Mar 04, 2002 Location: MONTREAL, CANADA Posts: 4,563	I agree about the stepparents, but think you're giving Gary too much credit. What choice did he have? Like has been said many times in books, he cleared away every friend and family member from Desi's era, but couldn't possibly do anything about Lucy's mom or her kids. And i swear we never heard anything about Edie back then, Desi and Edie were more or less out of the public eye. But you're right, if their parents didn't have time for them, the stepparents were there too which helped, and i too always admired the fact that Gary was peacemaker in fights and looked to laugh all the time. The best thing that was said though by Amber about the fact that if you can't wait to have kids, have been denied that joy for so long, of course you're going to spend the rest of your life so thrilled to have had those kids and enjoy your time with them. Risking her professional life to start them on careers was a perfect example, and as i've said before, try and find another star who spent their interviews talking about their kids aspirations, grades and friends and so on, very unselfish. As for you Dawsongirl, don't you allow for the fact that most Hollywood brats are spoiled rotten, and these two got some normalcy compared to their contemporaries.

12-23-2003, 02:38 PM	#10
crazyredhead Seniorita Forum Regular Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: DIZZY LAND Posts: 715	I'm surprised how Edie could take all the crap that Desi gave her. He didn't stop doing the things he did even after Lucy. You would have thought he would have learned his lesson? LOL I bet their kids could give us more info on Edie. Didn't Lucie and Little Desi have a stepbrother too?

12-23-2003, 03:15 PM	#12
SPLAIN I Love Lucy Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Mar 04, 2002 Location: MONTREAL, CANADA Posts: 4,563	But Lucie still has issues to this very day and i was told about my own that it NEVER goes away, so she should just give up and go on with her life, hopefully she has learned from those mistakes and will do a better job with her own kids.

12-24-2003, 09:52 AM	#14
crazyredhead Seniorita Forum Regular Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: DIZZY LAND Posts: 715	Very good info, guys. I remember reading that Desi was trying to convince Edie to marry him. He was saying like leave that bum and marry me. LOL Didn't they get married in Las Vegas? What a perfect place for Desi! lol

12-24-2003, 10:58 AM	#15
SPLAIN I Love Lucy Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Mar 04, 2002 Location: MONTREAL, CANADA Posts: 4,563	Even Lucy knew about his house in the hills, she referred calls there. Can you imagine telling your husband's girlfriends to call him at his OTHER house? The thing with POOR Edie, and i mean that litterally is she was married to a multimillionnaire and she only asked of Desi that he take care of her in the style she had been accustomed to. The money he got from Lucy for his share of Desilu, 2 and one half million was what he had to live on, and he lived off of that instead of investing it and living off the interest. So, not only did Edie show tolerance but she lowered her lifestyle substantially. When they both died after long illnesses, they left heavily mortgaged houses and debts, but at least i hope their time together was pleasant. Because Desi was a fun loving gregarious life live to the fullest type of guy. Yes being married in Las Vegas was VERY appropriate, LOL!