Matt Flores case - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

njf520 · 06-19-2003, 01:45 PM

has there ever been an update on the matt flores case? he was killed in the parking lot of applied materials inc. in santa clara, CA.

njf

Awsi Dooger · 06-20-2003, 07:10 AM

That's the only case that comes to mind with that description, killed in a business parking lot. If so, I have never seen an update.

I didn't understand why UM was only allowed to show a black-and-white re-enactment of the parking lot incident, when the actual tape was supposedly available. There was a utility vehicle that followed him in, probably a very sad case of mistaken identity. The victim seemed like an All-America type and not involved in anything sinister.

njf520 · 06-20-2003, 11:20 AM

that is the case.

i think that the original tape may have had some info that police didn't want to release, so they could find out which tips were hoaxes, perhaps.

njf

CrushedVelvet · 08-01-2003, 12:44 AM

I too believe there is still no update on this case. I think I saw this case presented on another show awhile back and again, no new leads. Werent invesigators able to name the possible colors of the car? (Not that thats a big lead or snything). What a shame, its heart wrenching watching the video of him and his new baby girl. I dont give up hope b/c criminals always talk and one day someone will spill the beans.

mozartpc27 · 06-19-2007, 10:21 AM

This case is one of the most haunting UM ever covered. I just watched it again in some detail on crystaldawn's DVDs volume 8, and I agree with njf520 that there must have been some pertinent reason for witholding the tape from the show.

This case is sad and frustrating for many reasons, but, with as little as there is to go on, it's unfortunate that larger portions of the tape were not reconstructed. According to the segment, the suspicsious Ford Explorer enters the parking lot for the first time about 20 minutes before the shooting and pulls into a space, facing a camera. Then, a few seconds later, a white Ford Probe pulls into the lot, and the Ford Explorer backs up and follows it.

The next thing we are told is that 4 minutes before the shooting, the Ford Explorer leaves the parking lot, only to return 3 minutes before the shooting.

That's 15 minutes of unaccounted for time. Did the Ford Explorer park elsewhere in the parking lot at that time? Did it leave and come back as it did a few minutes before the shooting? Unfortunately, except for this board, there appears to be next to nothing on this case on the internet. So I guess we'll never know.

One of the things that bothers me, besides the "missing" 15 minutes, is the fact that the Ford Explorer leaves the parking lot 4 minutes before the shooting. Why would the killer leave, if he's waiting for Flores or anyone to show? Doesn't he risk missing his mark? Granted, he returns only a minute later, but I for the life of me can't figure out what purpose leaving serves --- unless it's to contact someone to confirm exactly who his mark is and what car he is driving. Seeing him evidently follow the wrong person once suggests he might have needed to be "reminded" of who he was looking for. The only problem with this theory is that he is gone for only about a minute. The only reason to leave the parking lot is if he wants to use a pay phone to call whoever hired him. Was there a payphone near enough by that he could get out, make a quick call, and return to the lot less than a minute later? If not, why did he leave?

He returns to the lot 3 minutes before the murder, and, a minute later, two cars --- one belonging to the woman who would find Flores and the other belonging to Flores enter the lot. Two minutes after that, Flores is dead, and twenty seconds after that, the Ford Explorer leaves the parking lot for the final time.

These movements suggest to me two things: 1) he did ultimately get the right guy and 2) he wasn't very experienced or good at this. As was mentioned in another thread, this guy is just plain lucky he was not seen by an eyewitness or by the cameras. Nevertheless, he seems to have made some effort to find the right person.

Of course, I could be wrong. Flores was in a rental car after all, and, at that time, white Corsicas were big with rental companies (I remember when I went to DisneyWorld with my family as a kid, we rented a car from some big lot, and they seemed to be ALL white Corsicas).

Why the killer left the parking lot altogether for about a minute will always bother me, I guess.

mozartpc27 · 06-19-2007, 01:21 PM

From an article I purchased from the San Jose Mercury News of May 13, 1994, as found on newsbank:

"A close review of the security surveillance videotapes that scan the company's parking lots has led investigators to search for a Ford Explorer that is observed on the tape entering and leaving the lot several times before and after Flores was slain about 8:15 a.m. March 24 as he arrived for work."

The Explorer was seen on the tape entering and exiting the parking lot several times, before and after the shooting, according to this article. This differs from the UM segment, which claims the Explorer left the parking lot for the last time after the shooting. It's hard to imagine why the killer would return after shooting Flores. Another article I looked at from newsbank (but did not purchase) mentions that Flores had fully exited his car and was reaching back to get his coat when he was shot. In my mind, this means the shooter must have gotten a pretty good look at him --- how could he mistake him for someone else?

Interesting.

EDIT: I bought a second article, written ten years after the incident, hoping it might reveal some leads that were pursued but exhausted, etc., but really nothing of interest in the article, except that it was raining the day he was shot. UM segment has it as a bright, sunny morning.

LooksLikeCRicci · 06-19-2007, 09:21 PM

I really wish there would be somewhat of a break in this case. It's always haunted me as well.

I agree with the earlier posts-- those 15 minutes of unaccounted time, in my opinion, are incredibly important in cracking what happened. In addition, I feel that the reason the Ford Explorer left the parking lot 4 minutes before the crime occurred is BECAUSE he was looking for the right person. However, I still feel that he got the wrong one.

To me, the case screams of a botched job. If not, it's the perfect crime because everyone has assumed that Flores was the unintended victim of a hit.

Melanie85 · 03-28-2008, 09:29 AM

This case always struck me and left me completely baffled as to why this poor man was murdered. It's now been 14 years since this happened and I can't find any new info on it.

The "wrong man" theory is the only thing anybody has come up with to make sense of it all, but I can't imagine why a hitman would decide to murder somebody in broad daylight - in a busy parking lot too - with the risk of having somebody get his license plate # or even a physical description. Seems like if I'm going to murder somebody, I'd make sure there would be no potential witnesses. Just seems like an unlikely time/place to carry out a murder.

DarkDante · 03-28-2008, 12:23 PM

^ Not really especially if the guy was hired to kill Flores. I mean look at the case of Roger Wheeler Senior. Whitey Buldger former head of Boston's Irish Mafia put a hit on Wheeler and a hitman shot him in broad daylight at his country club in a manner nearly identical to how Flores was killed.

There were wittnesses to Roger Wheeler's murder too but the killer wore a disguise and the most anyone could scrape out was a partial license plate and it took almost twenty years and the collaspe of Bulger's empire to identify who murdered Wheeler. In the case of Flores, I don't think anyone even saw him get murdered they only noticed he was dead after the fact.

They were able to track the suspicious activity of a Ford Explorer that has been pointed out which could've been driven by Flores' killer.

I think unless some evidence can be shown that Flores was the victim of a mistake hit, it could've been something from Flores past possibly with his work in the military. I dunno maybe its just from watching too much UM but you can't discount the fact that Flores could've been the intended victim.

Tighthead · 03-28-2008, 02:30 PM

This one reminds me of the Seattle area realtor who was killed. No clear motive, no clear suspect, not much to go on.

Melanie85 · 03-28-2008, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkDante

^ Not really especially if the guy was hired to kill Flores. I mean look at the case of Roger Wheeler Senior. Whitey Buldger former head of Boston's Irish Mafia put a hit on Wheeler and a hitman shot him in broad daylight at his country club in a manner nearly identical to how Flores was killed.

There were wittnesses to Roger Wheeler's murder too but the killer wore a disguise and the most anyone could scrape out was a partial license plate and it took almost twenty years and the collaspe of Bulger's empire to identify who murdered Wheeler. In the case of Flores, I don't think anyone even saw him get murdered they only noticed he was dead after the fact.

They were able to track the suspicious activity of a Ford Explorer that has been pointed out which could've been driven by Flores' killer.

I think unless some evidence can be shown that Flores was the victim of a mistake hit, it could've been something from Flores past possibly with his work in the military. I dunno maybe its just from watching too much UM but you can't discount the fact that Flores could've been the intended victim.

True. But this doesn't appear (to me) to be an organized mob hit mainly due to the Ford Explorer's movements in the moments leading up to the murder. It seemed as though the Ford Explorer wasn't sure if he even had the right car (as I recall wasn't he following another car in the parking lot?).

The killer was lucky that nobody saw the actual crime that would be able to identify him or his car. Also, I wonder if the building had any security officers. He took a big risk by killing somebody in a parking lot of a large company in the morning when the likeihood of eyewitnesses would be greatest. I wonder if he considered that there was survelliance footage of the parking lot.

I know I'm arguing a moot point, because regardless the killer got away with murder and an innocent man is gone. But it makes it all the perplexing

CanadianUMFan · 03-30-2008, 03:16 PM

Was Flores married? Could his wife or an ex set up a hit on him?

Mystery Lover · 03-30-2008, 05:54 PM

I haven't seen this in a long time. But can someone tell me if the license plate was at all visible on the camera footage? If so, can't the FBI enhance it and get a clearer pcture of the numbers or letters on the plate?

UMfan0682 · 03-30-2008, 11:14 PM

Yes, Matt Flores was married with a daughter at the time of his death. As Dante had said, it is possible that this could have been connected from something in his past. I'm leaning towards a case of mistaken identity. The segment mentioned that the police had looked into his past, and found everyone to consider him a good person who was well liked.

As for the security camera footage, judging by the recreation from UM, the angle at which the suspected car was captured at was on the side, and no clear view from the back or front. I'm also sure they were not able to tell what the color of the car was, but were able to rule out a few.

Melanie85 · 04-01-2008, 09:25 AM

Assuming this was a case of mistaken identity, I wonder if the police ever tried to find the killer's intended victim. I haven't given this much thought before now, but it might provide answers.

It's very possible that the intended victim worked at Applied Materials and would be in the parking lot the same time Matt Flores was killed. Why else would the killer and intended victim be in this parking lot at that time if the victim did not actually work there? I wonder if the police investigated employees of Applied Materials by determining who might be mistaken with Flores by physical appearance and/or be driving a car similar to his at that time.

06-19-2003, 01:45 PM	#1
njf520 Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Jan 29, 2003 Posts: 136	Matt Flores case has there ever been an update on the matt flores case? he was killed in the parking lot of applied materials inc. in santa clara, CA. njf

06-20-2003, 07:10 AM	#2
Awsi Dooger Member Senior Member Join Date: Feb 18, 2003 Location: Miami Posts: 1,537	Is that the guy with the blonde wife and little daughter? That's the only case that comes to mind with that description, killed in a business parking lot. If so, I have never seen an update. I didn't understand why UM was only allowed to show a black-and-white re-enactment of the parking lot incident, when the actual tape was supposedly available. There was a utility vehicle that followed him in, probably a very sad case of mistaken identity. The victim seemed like an All-America type and not involved in anything sinister.

08-01-2003, 12:44 AM	#4
CrushedVelvet Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Oct 25, 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 331	I too believe there is still no update on this case. I think I saw this case presented on another show awhile back and again, no new leads. Werent invesigators able to name the possible colors of the car? (Not that thats a big lead or snything). What a shame, its heart wrenching watching the video of him and his new baby girl. I dont give up hope b/c criminals always talk and one day someone will spill the beans.
	__________________ CrushedVelvet

06-19-2007, 10:21 AM	#5
mozartpc27 Vigilante Logician Forum Regular Join Date: Mar 09, 2006 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 926	This case is one of the most haunting UM ever covered. I just watched it again in some detail on crystaldawn's DVDs volume 8, and I agree with njf520 that there must have been some pertinent reason for witholding the tape from the show. This case is sad and frustrating for many reasons, but, with as little as there is to go on, it's unfortunate that larger portions of the tape were not reconstructed. According to the segment, the suspicsious Ford Explorer enters the parking lot for the first time about 20 minutes before the shooting and pulls into a space, facing a camera. Then, a few seconds later, a white Ford Probe pulls into the lot, and the Ford Explorer backs up and follows it. The next thing we are told is that 4 minutes before the shooting, the Ford Explorer leaves the parking lot, only to return 3 minutes before the shooting. That's 15 minutes of unaccounted for time. Did the Ford Explorer park elsewhere in the parking lot at that time? Did it leave and come back as it did a few minutes before the shooting? Unfortunately, except for this board, there appears to be next to nothing on this case on the internet. So I guess we'll never know. One of the things that bothers me, besides the "missing" 15 minutes, is the fact that the Ford Explorer leaves the parking lot 4 minutes before the shooting. Why would the killer leave, if he's waiting for Flores or anyone to show? Doesn't he risk missing his mark? Granted, he returns only a minute later, but I for the life of me can't figure out what purpose leaving serves --- unless it's to contact someone to confirm exactly who his mark is and what car he is driving. Seeing him evidently follow the wrong person once suggests he might have needed to be "reminded" of who he was looking for. The only problem with this theory is that he is gone for only about a minute. The only reason to leave the parking lot is if he wants to use a pay phone to call whoever hired him. Was there a payphone near enough by that he could get out, make a quick call, and return to the lot less than a minute later? If not, why did he leave? He returns to the lot 3 minutes before the murder, and, a minute later, two cars --- one belonging to the woman who would find Flores and the other belonging to Flores enter the lot. Two minutes after that, Flores is dead, and twenty seconds after that, the Ford Explorer leaves the parking lot for the final time. These movements suggest to me two things: 1) he did ultimately get the right guy and 2) he wasn't very experienced or good at this. As was mentioned in another thread, this guy is just plain lucky he was not seen by an eyewitness or by the cameras. Nevertheless, he seems to have made some effort to find the right person. Of course, I could be wrong. Flores was in a rental car after all, and, at that time, white Corsicas were big with rental companies (I remember when I went to DisneyWorld with my family as a kid, we rented a car from some big lot, and they seemed to be ALL white Corsicas). Why the killer left the parking lot altogether for about a minute will always bother me, I guess.
	__________________ "You can't say the words that the rock makes you feel like." - Patty Johnson

06-20-2003, 11:20 AM	#3
njf520 Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Jan 29, 2003 Posts: 136	that is the case. i think that the original tape may have had some info that police didn't want to release, so they could find out which tips were hoaxes, perhaps. njf

06-19-2007, 01:21 PM	#6
mozartpc27 Vigilante Logician Forum Regular Join Date: Mar 09, 2006 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 926	From an article I purchased from the San Jose Mercury News of May 13, 1994, as found on newsbank: "A close review of the security surveillance videotapes that scan the company's parking lots has led investigators to search for a Ford Explorer that is observed on the tape entering and leaving the lot several times before and after Flores was slain about 8:15 a.m. March 24 as he arrived for work." The Explorer was seen on the tape entering and exiting the parking lot several times, before and after the shooting, according to this article. This differs from the UM segment, which claims the Explorer left the parking lot for the last time after the shooting. It's hard to imagine why the killer would return after shooting Flores. Another article I looked at from newsbank (but did not purchase) mentions that Flores had fully exited his car and was reaching back to get his coat when he was shot. In my mind, this means the shooter must have gotten a pretty good look at him --- how could he mistake him for someone else? Interesting. EDIT: I bought a second article, written ten years after the incident, hoping it might reveal some leads that were pursued but exhausted, etc., but really nothing of interest in the article, except that it was raining the day he was shot. UM segment has it as a bright, sunny morning.

06-19-2007, 09:21 PM	#7
LooksLikeCRicci Likes to live in a clean house Moderator Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Nov 27, 2005 Posts: 4,055	I really wish there would be somewhat of a break in this case. It's always haunted me as well. I agree with the earlier posts-- those 15 minutes of unaccounted time, in my opinion, are incredibly important in cracking what happened. In addition, I feel that the reason the Ford Explorer left the parking lot 4 minutes before the crime occurred is BECAUSE he was looking for the right person. However, I still feel that he got the wrong one. To me, the case screams of a botched job. If not, it's the perfect crime because everyone has assumed that Flores was the unintended victim of a hit.

03-28-2008, 09:29 AM	#8
Melanie85 Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Apr 01, 2005 Posts: 62	This case always struck me and left me completely baffled as to why this poor man was murdered. It's now been 14 years since this happened and I can't find any new info on it. The "wrong man" theory is the only thing anybody has come up with to make sense of it all, but I can't imagine why a hitman would decide to murder somebody in broad daylight - in a busy parking lot too - with the risk of having somebody get his license plate # or even a physical description. Seems like if I'm going to murder somebody, I'd make sure there would be no potential witnesses. Just seems like an unlikely time/place to carry out a murder.

03-28-2008, 12:23 PM	#9
DarkDante Member Senior Member Join Date: Jul 27, 2002 Posts: 1,569	^ Not really especially if the guy was hired to kill Flores. I mean look at the case of Roger Wheeler Senior. Whitey Buldger former head of Boston's Irish Mafia put a hit on Wheeler and a hitman shot him in broad daylight at his country club in a manner nearly identical to how Flores was killed. There were wittnesses to Roger Wheeler's murder too but the killer wore a disguise and the most anyone could scrape out was a partial license plate and it took almost twenty years and the collaspe of Bulger's empire to identify who murdered Wheeler. In the case of Flores, I don't think anyone even saw him get murdered they only noticed he was dead after the fact. They were able to track the suspicious activity of a Ford Explorer that has been pointed out which could've been driven by Flores' killer. I think unless some evidence can be shown that Flores was the victim of a mistake hit, it could've been something from Flores past possibly with his work in the military. I dunno maybe its just from watching too much UM but you can't discount the fact that Flores could've been the intended victim.

03-28-2008, 02:30 PM	#10
Tighthead Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Aug 15, 2006 Posts: 199	This one reminds me of the Seattle area realtor who was killed. No clear motive, no clear suspect, not much to go on.

03-30-2008, 03:16 PM	#12
CanadianUMFan Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Jun 21, 2007 Location: St Catharines, Ontario, Canada Posts: 215	Was Flores married? Could his wife or an ex set up a hit on him?

03-30-2008, 05:54 PM	#13
Mystery Lover Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Feb 13, 2005 Posts: 175	I haven't seen this in a long time. But can someone tell me if the license plate was at all visible on the camera footage? If so, can't the FBI enhance it and get a clearer pcture of the numbers or letters on the plate?

03-30-2008, 11:14 PM	#14
UMfan0682 Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Jul 11, 2004 Posts: 124	Yes, Matt Flores was married with a daughter at the time of his death. As Dante had said, it is possible that this could have been connected from something in his past. I'm leaning towards a case of mistaken identity. The segment mentioned that the police had looked into his past, and found everyone to consider him a good person who was well liked. As for the security camera footage, judging by the recreation from UM, the angle at which the suspected car was captured at was on the side, and no clear view from the back or front. I'm also sure they were not able to tell what the color of the car was, but were able to rule out a few.

04-01-2008, 09:25 AM	#15
Melanie85 Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Apr 01, 2005 Posts: 62	Assuming this was a case of mistaken identity, I wonder if the police ever tried to find the killer's intended victim. I haven't given this much thought before now, but it might provide answers. It's very possible that the intended victim worked at Applied Materials and would be in the parking lot the same time Matt Flores was killed. Why else would the killer and intended victim be in this parking lot at that time if the victim did not actually work there? I wonder if the police investigated employees of Applied Materials by determining who might be mistaken with Flores by physical appearance and/or be driving a car similar to his at that time.