ABC Saturday Morning cartoons 1962- NOT in color: why?

[cd637299]

ABC’s first color programs were cartoons in fall 1962: Jetsons, Flintstones season 3, and Beany & Cecil in primetime, right?

So—why was ABC allergic to showing Saturday Morning Cartoons from 1962 to at least 1964 or so NOT in color, when they were available in color?

Per TV Guides of the era—-ABC’s reruns of Top Cat, the Jetsons, and even the made-for-TV New Casper Cartoon Show were in B&W.

Why did ABC do that, when NBC had *at least* King Leonardo in color, and maybe other cartoons I don’t know? (NBC live action stuff like Pip the Piper & Shari Lewis Show was in color too.) Was money an issue? I wouldn’t understand that; how much extra would that run ABC IF the primetime stuff was in color?

As Leonardo said, that’s the most unheard thing I ever heard of!

Anybody?

cd

[stevea]

Here's something interesting in the Wikipedia article:

ABC began re-running The Bugs Bunny Show on Saturday mornings in August 1962 until September 1967, when it was moved to Sunday mornings for the remainder of its run. The series was rerun in color beginning in 1966 and remained on ABC until September 1968.

What version of the show was this, which began color airings in September 1966? Was it the original?

[stevea]

About lack of color on ABC in the early 60s: I've read that very little was in color on ABC. Some reasons more wasn't: no color capabilities of a number of affiliates, and fewer affiliates in general than the other networks. CBS's recalcitrance was well-known--they did not want to get in on NBCs "winning" color method, and ABC might have agreed.

The Jetsons was probably one of the first color presentations on ABC, in 1962, along with the third season of The Flintstones.

[stevea]

More from Wikipedia:

The show's title sequences and some of these linking material scenes from the original Bugs Bunny Show are included as bonus features on each volume of the Looney Tunes Golden Collection DVD collection (with the exception of Volume 6). As the original color negatives were cut up by CBS and ABC to create later versions of the show, the linking sequences are presented on DVD using a combination of footage from both what's left of the color negatives (some of which were used in later incarnations, thus helping to preserve them) and the black-and-white ABC broadcast prints prepared in the early 1960s.

In 2009, an episode of the Bugs Bunny Show in color was released on the Saturday Morning Cartoons 1960s Volume 2 set. Saturday Morning Cartoons 1970s Volume 2 includes an episode of the Bugs Bunny/Road Runner Show.

And here's something in the same Wikipedia article that conflicts with an earlier Wikipedia statement on when The Bugs Bunny Show started to air in color:

The Bugs Bunny Show, April 7, 1962 – September 8, 1968 (in color starting September 10, 1966) (ABC)

[cd637299]

Originally Posted by stevea

About lack of color on ABC in the early 60s: I've read that very little was in color on ABC. Some reasons more wasn't: no color capabilities of a number of affiliates, and fewer affiliates in general than the other networks. CBS's recalcitrance was well-known--they did not want to get in on NBCs "winning" color method, and ABC might have agreed.

The Jetsons was probably one of the first color presentations on ABC, in 1962, along with the third season of The Flintstones.

The bottom line was, ABC had color. Although there were few affiliates and/or secondary-ABC, the capability existed.

I doubt that there’s any publication explaining ABC *not* showing color on Saturday mornings vis-a-vis** the prime time cartoons fall ‘62 and later. I just don’t understand the hangup, when the opportunity existed.

[** I like to write “vis-a-vis” to sound intelligent….]

cd

[cd637299]

Originally Posted by stevea

More from Wikipedia:

The show's title sequences and some of these linking material scenes from the original Bugs Bunny Show are included as bonus features on each volume of the Looney Tunes Golden Collection DVD collection (with the exception of Volume 6). As the original color negatives were cut up by CBS and ABC to create later versions of the show, the linking sequences are presented on DVD using a combination of footage from both what's left of the color negatives (some of which were used in later incarnations, thus helping to preserve them) and the black-and-white ABC broadcast prints prepared in the early 1960s.

In 2009, an episode of the Bugs Bunny Show in color was released on the Saturday Morning Cartoons 1960s Volume 2 set. Saturday Morning Cartoons 1970s Volume 2 includes an episode of the Bugs Bunny/Road Runner Show.

And here's something in the same Wikipedia article that conflicts with an earlier Wikipedia statement on when The Bugs Bunny Show started to air in color:

The Bugs Bunny Show, April 7, 1962 – September 8, 1968 (in color starting September 10, 1966) (ABC)

I thought for sure that TBBS started in color in 1965. Be that as it may, it would seem like all interstitials used 1960-62 were dropped for Saturday mornings, due to added commercial time, compared to weeknight prime time, which always had less ad time.

I don’t remember watching TBBS on Saturday mornings outside of the half hour ABC season (1971-72?), and I am almost sure that that version used the title cards (a still of Bugs on stage in spotlight). I would have recognized a missing title, like was done 1960-62.

And BTW that one DVD has one ep of The Porky Pig Show (1964-67}, where “interstitials” didn’t really tell a story, a la TBBS. Mainly it’s just Porky saying (likely originally coming out of a commercial) something like “if you liked that last cartoon, you’ll love this one!” Although individual cartoons had different running times, many were pretty similar in duration.

OH YEAH! Forgot—the 1960-62’s began with a cold opening about 20 seconds from each cartoon. I don’t remember that on the Porky show; again, added commercial time!

Like the original Bugs Bunny Show, the Porky Pig Show had no title cards—however in the closing credits are shown the three titles together & copyright date, as was TBBS.

And—on my DVD of TBBS, the whole story between cartoons was there, in this case Bugs dealing with the Goofy Gophers, in grainy color, whereas the individual cartoons were pristine/digitized, FWIW. Copyright was 1961, no title cards.

Am I all over the place or what?

cd

[stevea]

I'm gonna order that Saturday Morning DVD. Maybe somebody shot a TV screen with a movie camera, or a TV studio monitor with a color film camera. I'd just like to see what it looked like back then.

At some point either ABC or CBS (or more likely Warners) edited and struck color prints. Again as was so typical, with no thought to value, the edited out material was apparently thrown away. That original opening in color was changed a few times over the many years CBS and ABC had the show; the changes were to the backgrounds.

I'd like to think Jerry Beck is working on this, as I've heard on Warner podcasts that Warners is working on the Hanna-Barbera cartoon shows for MeTV Toons. It's strange Jerry has never addressed this subject on Cartoon Research; I could find nothing.

[cd637299]

Know what, stevea? I wasn’t as clear as I should have been. When I said “grainy,” basically it was (I assume) 16mm film. Not blurry like a kinescope.

Maybe you can get your money back.

cd

[stevea]

I haven't sent the order to Amazon yet, but I still want to see it. I don't have any of the Sat. Morning Cartoon DVDs--they sound kind of interesting.

[biffbronson]

So far in this thread, there's been no mention of RCA, the parent company of NBC, that had been marketing color RCA TVs by the time in question.

From Smithsonian Magazine:

"Of the three television networks in the U.S., only NBC was invested in pushing color programming—its parent company, RCA, had developed the color system that eventually became the NTSC standard, so it stood to profit from color set sales. Full conversion of all three networks was not complete until the late 1960s."

From another source:
"By the 1960s, the market was saturated in black-and-white sets, so TV manufacturers (read: RCA) needed something new to sell to consumers. And this is where we point out that RCA owned NBC."

It's known that there was “bad blood” between CBS and RCA/NBC over the development of color TV.

Regarding ABC, I haven't found evidence, but one may speculate that if ABC ran lots of programming in color early on, in a way they would've been playing into the hands of their competitor NBC. Conversion was slow to happen, it seems reasonable that primetime was prioritized.

[cd637299]

Regarding RCA, I’m fully aware, but obviously the writing was on the wall.

However, prioritizing primetime does make sense. I just think that it wouldn’t have cost an extra penny to do so for Saturday morning. I *can* imagine children bugging their parents to go out and get an RCA set, however.

cd

[stevea]

Originally Posted by cd637299

Regarding RCA, I’m fully aware, but obviously the writing was on the wall.

However, prioritizing primetime does make sense. I just think that it wouldn’t have cost an extra penny to do so for Saturday morning. I *can* imagine children bugging their parents to go out and get an RCA set, however.

cd

The Saturday morning thing doesn't make any sense. But at the time, they might have said they don't have a spare color film chain for that purpose; who knows? A lot of things don't make sense--such as the first two seasons of The Flintstones aired in black and white. CBS refusing to show The Lucy Show in color starting in 1963, even though it was filmed in color starting then.

[cd637299]

Yeah Lucy Show is an example.

I will say that both Lucy along with Hanna-Barbera & ofher TV animators went to color early, knowing all too well that reruns would last into a new era. Years before YouTube, maybe 2002, I was able to procure color-produced “Calvin & the Colonel” episodes. (BTW ABC’s first color program was episode 1 of The Jetsons, which aired 1 day after the last showing of Calvin! The latter is one of the first TV shows I *ever* remembered from toddler days.

I just would have to think that ABC had separate budgets for Sat morning & prime time. I’m not sure what ABC ran on Sunday mornings outside of “Discovery.” Per my Oct 1963 TV Guide, ABC had AFL Football on Sunday afternoons———in black & white.

cd

[stevea]

Originally Posted by cd637299

Yeah Lucy Show is an example.

I will say that both Lucy along with Hanna-Barbera & ofher TV animators went to color early, knowing all too well that reruns would last into a new era. Years before YouTube, maybe 2002, I was able to procure color-produced “Calvin & the Colonel” episodes. (BTW ABC’s first color program was episode 1 of The Jetsons, which aired 1 day after the last showing of Calvin! The latter is one of the first TV shows I *ever* remembered from toddler days.

I just would have to think that ABC had separate budgets for Sat morning & prime time. I’m not sure what ABC ran on Sunday mornings outside of “Discovery.” Per my Oct 1963 TV Guide, ABC had AFL Football on Sunday afternoons———in black & white.

cd

I do remember The Bullwinkle Show on ABC Sunday mornings--that was probably the late 60s.