Original Night Stalker case - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

rerungirl · 09-27-2003, 01:47 PM

A&E is going to profile the Original Night Stalker case on Cold Case Files this evening (9:00 ET). This case goes back over 20 years and is still unsolved. I saw this episode earlier this summer and it was excellent. Anyone who enjoys UM should find it interesting.

Kane · 11-18-2003, 09:20 AM

It's on again tonight (Tuesday, November 18) at 9:00 PM (Eastern Standard Time).

Eibon · 03-11-2004, 05:55 AM

Did anyone tape this? I looked at aande.com and it doesn't seem to be reairing anytime soon

Rieder · 03-12-2004, 02:48 AM

Its highly unlikely that this case will be resolved. Most serial murderers are not caught. The prominent examples include: the Zodiac; the BTK Strangler; the California Serial killer and the Madison murders of university students between 1968 and 1984 in Wisconsin. The serial murderers that are captured in a short period of time after commencing their murders tend to incorporate spree murder elements, with no cooling off period between murders and its easier for law enforcement to map behaviour patterns and to apprehend them. The Washington sniper would be an example.

crystals · 03-12-2004, 04:52 AM

I didn't know there was an original night stalker. I've heard of the night stalker Richard Ramirez, who killed people in L.A. in 1985. That guy is sick. He even forced his victims to swear to Satan.

But, if the case you're talking about has been unsolved for 20 years, then it must be a different case because Ramirez was convicted and sentenced to death row.

Kane · 03-12-2004, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crystals
I didn't know there was an original night stalker. I've heard of the night stalker Richard Ramirez, who killed people in L.A. in 1985. That guy is sick. He even forced his victims to swear to Satan. But, if the case you're talking about has been unsolved for 20 years, then it must be a different case because Ramirez was convicted and sentenced to death row.

It IS a different case. The so-called Original Night Stalker was featured on UM in July of 2002, but to my recollection, he's not referred to by that nickname in the UM segment.

Check out the following link on the "Original Night Stalker" case:

http://www.unsolved.com/0225-Serialkiller.html

SitcomsAreTheWay · 03-15-2004, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crystals
I didn't know there was an original night stalker. I've heard of the night stalker Richard Ramirez, who killed people in L.A. in 1985. That guy is sick. He even forced his victims to swear to Satan. But, if the case you're talking about has been unsolved for 20 years, then it must be a different case because Ramirez was convicted and sentenced to death row.

Yeah, he's definitely unstable.

From what I understand, he had gotten married to some woman who had been his pen pal for a long period of time. Honestly, I think she's a little unstable herself. I find it disrespectful to the victims and their families regarding her denying the murders and rapes in which he commited.

Rieder · 03-17-2004, 09:26 AM

Richard Ramirez is not unstable. He is a psychopath who deliberately murdered people in Los Angeles and San Francisco in 1985 for personal gratification. Ramirez's gratification involved dominating, controlling his victims through rape, torture and mutilation before death. For an impoverished and poorly educated man committing serial murder was his ticket to being a somebody. Most serial killers tend to be a nobody. They tend to be uneducated, employed in menial jobs and are unable to develop mature human relationships.

The pentagrams, and references to satan is an attempt to taunt and control the public. He may believe in satan, it seems more likely that satan is merely a pawn in an attempt to convince the state that he is psychotic and unstable and avoid the death penalty. If, he was psychotic he would not have been able to commit as many murders and be sitting on death row in San Quentin for almost twenty years.

justins5256 · 03-18-2004, 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rieder
Most serial killers tend to be a nobody. They tend to be uneducated, employed in menial jobs and are unable to develop mature human relationships.

I don't mean to nitpick, but this is not always the case.

Serial killer Ted Bundy was a respected law school student, a rape crisis counselor, and, if I remember correctly, involved in local politics. Bundy was also in a good long distance with relationship with a woman at the time he was commiting the murders.

John Wayne Gacy knew the Carters (as in President Jimmy Carter) and was photographed with Carter's wife. He also played a clown at children's parties, and was generally respected in the community in which he lived. He was also married (and later divorced) prior to the discovery of his crimes.

Justin

SitcomsAreTheWay · 03-18-2004, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rieder
Richard Ramirez is not unstable. He is a psychopath who deliberately murdered people in Los Angeles and San Francisco in 1985 for personal gratification. Ramirez's gratification involved dominating, controlling his victims through rape, torture and mutilation before death. For an impoverished and poorly educated man committing serial murder was his ticket to being a somebody. Most serial killers tend to be a nobody. They tend to be uneducated, employed in menial jobs and are unable to develop mature human relationships.

The pentagrams, and references to satan is an attempt to taunt and control the public. He may believe in satan, it seems more likely that satan is merely a pawn in an attempt to convince the state that he is psychotic and unstable and avoid the death penalty. If, he was psychotic he would not have been able to commit as many murders and be sitting on death row in San Quentin for almost twenty years.

Well in my opinion, anyone who rapes, tortures, or even brutalizes period isn't in their right mind. To go about making a name for himself the way he did, he couldn't have been.

Also, there are actually serial killers who have been sitting on death row for years or have been put to death although they are or were actually mentally ill. Alton Coleman was a prime example of that. Not all take mental illness into consideration.

Rieder · 03-18-2004, 04:54 AM

The statement that serial murderers tend to be uneducated was a general statement. Some serial murderers are highly educated. Michael Ross who murdered six women in Connecticut and Illinois in the early 1980s graduated from Cornell University with a Bachelor of Science degree in Agricultural Economics. Ted Bundy graduated from the University of Washington with a Bachelor of Science degree in Psychology. He never graduated from the University of Utah Law School. Paul Bernardo graduated from the University of Toronto with an Bachelor of Economics and was employed as a junior accountant with Price Waterhouse. Bernardo murdered his wife's sister and several young women in Canada in the early 1990s. Ross, Bundy and Bernardo are in a minority.

Most serial killers tend to be uneducated or poorly educated. Some notable exponents have been Robert Hansen, Lawrence Bittaker and Roy Norris, Charles Ng, David Lucas and Gerald Parker. Lacking an education does not imply the serial murderer is stupid. Ed Kemper is considered to be very intelligent with an estimated IQ of 160. Mythology tends to surround Bundy and most serial murderers. He was not as intelligent as many believe. His IQ was estimated at 120. Most of the serial murderers are not Ivy League graduates, have graduated from high school or possess an IQ around 150. The average IQ is estimated to be 120. An IQ of 120 is considered to be slightly above average. The assumption they are highly intelligent seems to originate from their effort to avoid apprehension, the traits of manipulation and domination and most of them are not captured.

Rieder · 03-18-2004, 05:44 AM

Both Ted Bundy and John Wayne Gacy appeared to be respectable. Bundy not only attended the University of Utah Law School, but was involved in the Republican party in Washington and before entering law school was employed as a social worker in a crisis clinic. He worked alongside Ann Rule, who has become a successful true crime author. He maintained a relationship with 'Liz Kendall' in Washington state while studying in Utah.

John Wayne Gacy did not graduate from high school. He became a successful businessman and married a woman in 1964. The marriage collapsed in 1968. His wife divorced him after he was convicted of sodomy in Iowa. He had some involvement in the Democratic Party and dressed up as "Pogo the Clown'"and entertained children at hospitals and parties.

Bundy and Gacy's seemingly respectable lives were facades. Beneath the respectability were two psychopaths who enjoyed dominating and controlling victims before murdering them. The facade of respectability is part of a serial murderers' desire to be manipulative. Using the Freudian psychoanalytic model the serial murderer wants people to view the respectability of consciousness while harbouring perverse desires and fantasies in their unconscious.

09-27-2003, 01:47 PM	#1
rerungirl Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Sep 23, 2002 Location: Midwest Posts: 295	Original Night Stalker case A&E is going to profile the Original Night Stalker case on Cold Case Files this evening (9:00 ET). This case goes back over 20 years and is still unsolved. I saw this episode earlier this summer and it was excellent. Anyone who enjoys UM should find it interesting.

11-18-2003, 09:20 AM	#2
Kane Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Mar 07, 2001 Location: MA, United States Posts: 3,367	It's on Cold Case Files again It's on again tonight (Tuesday, November 18) at 9:00 PM (Eastern Standard Time).

03-12-2004, 04:52 AM	#5
crystals Member Senior Member Join Date: Feb 02, 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 1,829	I didn't know there was an original night stalker. I've heard of the night stalker Richard Ramirez, who killed people in L.A. in 1985. That guy is sick. He even forced his victims to swear to Satan. But, if the case you're talking about has been unsolved for 20 years, then it must be a different case because Ramirez was convicted and sentenced to death row.
	__________________ The man who lends a helping hand is the true hero.

03-11-2004, 05:55 AM	#3
Eibon Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Mar 11, 2004 Location: Posts: 16	Did anyone tape this? I looked at aande.com and it doesn't seem to be reairing anytime soon

03-12-2004, 02:48 AM	#4
Rieder Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Apr 24, 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 83	Its highly unlikely that this case will be resolved. Most serial murderers are not caught. The prominent examples include: the Zodiac; the BTK Strangler; the California Serial killer and the Madison murders of university students between 1968 and 1984 in Wisconsin. The serial murderers that are captured in a short period of time after commencing their murders tend to incorporate spree murder elements, with no cooling off period between murders and its easier for law enforcement to map behaviour patterns and to apprehend them. The Washington sniper would be an example.

03-17-2004, 09:26 AM	#8
Rieder Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Apr 24, 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 83	Richard Ramirez is not unstable. He is a psychopath who deliberately murdered people in Los Angeles and San Francisco in 1985 for personal gratification. Ramirez's gratification involved dominating, controlling his victims through rape, torture and mutilation before death. For an impoverished and poorly educated man committing serial murder was his ticket to being a somebody. Most serial killers tend to be a nobody. They tend to be uneducated, employed in menial jobs and are unable to develop mature human relationships. The pentagrams, and references to satan is an attempt to taunt and control the public. He may believe in satan, it seems more likely that satan is merely a pawn in an attempt to convince the state that he is psychotic and unstable and avoid the death penalty. If, he was psychotic he would not have been able to commit as many murders and be sitting on death row in San Quentin for almost twenty years.

03-18-2004, 04:54 AM	#11
Rieder Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Apr 24, 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 83	The statement that serial murderers tend to be uneducated was a general statement. Some serial murderers are highly educated. Michael Ross who murdered six women in Connecticut and Illinois in the early 1980s graduated from Cornell University with a Bachelor of Science degree in Agricultural Economics. Ted Bundy graduated from the University of Washington with a Bachelor of Science degree in Psychology. He never graduated from the University of Utah Law School. Paul Bernardo graduated from the University of Toronto with an Bachelor of Economics and was employed as a junior accountant with Price Waterhouse. Bernardo murdered his wife's sister and several young women in Canada in the early 1990s. Ross, Bundy and Bernardo are in a minority. Most serial killers tend to be uneducated or poorly educated. Some notable exponents have been Robert Hansen, Lawrence Bittaker and Roy Norris, Charles Ng, David Lucas and Gerald Parker. Lacking an education does not imply the serial murderer is stupid. Ed Kemper is considered to be very intelligent with an estimated IQ of 160. Mythology tends to surround Bundy and most serial murderers. He was not as intelligent as many believe. His IQ was estimated at 120. Most of the serial murderers are not Ivy League graduates, have graduated from high school or possess an IQ around 150. The average IQ is estimated to be 120. An IQ of 120 is considered to be slightly above average. The assumption they are highly intelligent seems to originate from their effort to avoid apprehension, the traits of manipulation and domination and most of them are not captured.

03-18-2004, 05:44 AM	#12
Rieder Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Apr 24, 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 83	Both Ted Bundy and John Wayne Gacy appeared to be respectable. Bundy not only attended the University of Utah Law School, but was involved in the Republican party in Washington and before entering law school was employed as a social worker in a crisis clinic. He worked alongside Ann Rule, who has become a successful true crime author. He maintained a relationship with 'Liz Kendall' in Washington state while studying in Utah. John Wayne Gacy did not graduate from high school. He became a successful businessman and married a woman in 1964. The marriage collapsed in 1968. His wife divorced him after he was convicted of sodomy in Iowa. He had some involvement in the Democratic Party and dressed up as "Pogo the Clown'"and entertained children at hospitals and parties. Bundy and Gacy's seemingly respectable lives were facades. Beneath the respectability were two psychopaths who enjoyed dominating and controlling victims before murdering them. The facade of respectability is part of a serial murderers' desire to be manipulative. Using the Freudian psychoanalytic model the serial murderer wants people to view the respectability of consciousness while harbouring perverse desires and fantasies in their unconscious.