The Best of Ed Sullivan

[GentlemanJim]

We never watched Ed back in the days he was on the air. But, I've been trying to catch as many episodes as possible on METV, due to the historic value.

One thing that has gotten my attention is the production quality. These episodes all appear to me to be refugees from the cutting room floor.

The audiences do not appear to be genuine "insitu" audiences, but rather look more like someone marched a large handful of extras up in front of a camera, turned on the bright lights, and said "everybody clap and smile".

And, Ed's introductions do not seem to have an ambiance (lighting, etc) that is consistent with the performances that follow. They seem more like someone handed him a box of tapes and said "here, you weave these into program blocks" and he is ad libbing the the tweeners.

Question, is this just a result of the "Best of" format of the spliced together programs we are now watching? Or, for those of you who actually saw the show in it's original runs, is this the true nature of the Ed Sullivan shows?

The amount of lighting put into the audience shots, looks particularly suspicious to me. And the splicing in of canned audience shots in a "best of" anthology series, just seems a tad phoney to me.

[SarahBellum]

I have only watched a few of these "shows" on Decades. It doesn't look like it is an actual Ed Sullivan show edited down to a half hour, but rather a splicing of performances from various Ed Sullivan shows into a half hour "Best Of" program.

[GentlemanJim]

I'm sorta wondering if the original show was the same way? Last Sunday's performance of the Lovin' Spoonful didn't even seem like the band and Ed were in the same building together.

And then there is the obvious miming. When I was younger it (in general) didn't seem so obvious, but now it seems almost blatant that they are just mouthing over a pre-recorded track (something you see a lot on Youtube for historic performances, so I'm not blaming just Ed for this)

[stevea]

Lip syncing goes back to the American Bandstand days, where it was common to drop a needle and the star mouths to their record. Sometimes it goes awry, like it did with Mariah Carey a few years ago at New Years.

Unlike American Bandstand, Ed Sullivan was a primetime show. So what's seen now on MeTV is probably a combination of editing different shows together, and possibly inability to get the rights to certain music. You'd probably need to get a full, original show to compare it to. Like this four-episode set with the Beatles:

https://www.amazon.com/Complete-Sull...s%2C210&sr=1-2

Any devout Beatles fan could immediately tell a lip sync, since the records are so familiar.

[GentlemanJim]

Thanks!! The miming was a particularly curious area, because having heard the big fit over the Doors singing their original lyrics in defiance of Ed's wishes, seemed to conflict with what I was seeing.

This past Sunday they had this European singer started singing in French, then evolved to awkward English, and then right between lines, her dress changed style, shape, and color.

[broadmoor]

I always thought the lip-sync trend on television started with Dotty Mack, in the early-1950s. But maybe that was closer to 'mime' as she did it to the vocals of other singers. More akin to the pinch-hitting done in earlier film musicals, when various actors and actresses were occasionally dubbed by professionals. Although, others certainly did do their own vocalizing on the soundtrack, and then mimicked it during the filming.

I'd like to see 'complete' episodes of "Ed Sullivan." Those chopped-up syndicated shows never interested me much. Too uneven. Plus, the episodes are heavily slanted towards rock-n-roll groups, and that's something I've never really cared for. I'm more intrigued by the earlier "Toast of the Town" stuff.

[Coffeecup]

I have been seeing the half hour shows of Ed's. My first thought is how interests have changed. It has been just about 50 years since Ed went off the air. I see singers some well know such as age 20 something Rock Groups. Lovin Spoolfuls, Mama and Papas, Rolling Stones Etc which aren't too bad but still I have heard all the songs and then a singers such as Jim Nabors and or Richard Kiley and say do people today find this peppy. I suppose when the show first aired it was wonderful and fresh but as I see it now I fast forward a lot on my DVR.. I do like to tune into Topo Gigo and get a kick of him.

[GentlemanJim]

Originally Posted by GentlemanJim

And then there is the obvious miming. When I was younger it (in general) didn't seem so obvious, but now it seems almost blatant that they are just mouthing over a pre-recorded track )

Well, how nice that someone moved this thread and made my efforts to relocate it holy heII! one would think that "General Discussion" was generic sufficient that the context police would take a break? I guess not

Regarding the lip synch, which it is claimed was never done on the Ed Sullivan show. Watching last night's episode on the ME TV network, The Mama's and the Papas performance of "California Dreamin" was clearly mimed.

Look at the video, around 31 seconds into it an obviously intoxicated Michelle Phillips takes a bite of a banana, proceeds to chew it, yet you can clearly hear her unencumbered voice doing the background "echo" lyrics.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNlwimUxUME

I also found it interesting the condescending tone in Ed's voice as he conducted the impromptu interview (on the show last night, not in the linked video), almost as if he was talking to a kindergarten class.

[GentlemanJim]

Originally Posted by broadmoor

I'd like to see 'complete' episodes of "Ed Sullivan." Those chopped-up syndicated shows never interested me much. .

Well, I never watched the show back when it was in first runs, but watching what I see now I really have to wonder how much of the content was canned (pre-packaged, or whatever you want to call it) vs performed in front of a live studio audience.

Some of the sets are pretty elaborate to be rigged just for a 5 minute segment of an hour long show. Making me (sometimes) wonder if the artists were in the same building with Ed when their performance was recorded.

[SarahBellum]

I'm guessing most of the musical acts were pre-recorded prior to the show. I know he often had the singer/group come over to shake hands after their performance, but I think that was just a little deception for the TV audience to make it look like it was done "live". Also, I find it interesting when singers are singing but the musicians playing the backing instruments are nowhere to be found.

[GentlemanJim]

I believe the Mamas and the Papas were notorious as a vocal fronting band for "the Wrecking Crew" collective of studio musicians.
There is a documentary about those guys floating around on DVD, that is well worth watching, as far has how many top ten hits they provided the instrumentals for.

I always suspected that the accoustic guitar played by John Phillips was mostly a prop. One might say the same thing about Michelle (lol)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjgpgXRvVZ0

[SarahBellum]

Originally Posted by GentlemanJim

I always suspected that the accoustic guitar played by John Phillips was mostly a prop.

Most likely. I think a lot of musicians use a guitar as a prop. I used to play guitar many years ago, so I can tell when someone is faking it.

[GentlemanJim]

So, I'm left wondering. If many/most of the musical acts for the Sullivan show were recorded remotely, how did that play off for the audience? Were they strictly in attendance for the Topogigio and other stage performances, with no inkling that a major musical act was going to appear as part of the show they were seeing? Or was there some attempt made at a film or video presentation for their viewing?

[SarahBellum]

My guess is they were able to watch the musical acts on monitors in the studio. Perhaps someone on this site actually attended an Ed Sullivan show back in the day and can answer that question.

I went to NY with my parents when I was a kid back in the 60s. They tried to get tickets to the Ed Sullivan show, but none were available.

[GentlemanJim]

That was kind of back in the era before big screens...maybe they could project it like one of those Bell & Howell video projectors?