That "Teaching a valuable lesson" thing - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

GentlemanJim · 02-25-2021, 10:57 AM

There has been abundant discussion on other boards where members insist that television programs teach values, and otherwise "force" viewers to come to terms with important social issues. I believe the 50s era programs in particular are credited with portraying the "American dream" we are all supposed to aspire for (particularly a handful of iconic classics)

On one of the Wednesday METV episodes, a "heartthrob" of Wally's makes an insensitive comment about Wally's nose, leading into quite a protracted ordeal of self consciousness.

The "valuable lesson du jour" unfolds towards the end where Ward lectures Beaver that it's not our appearance we are judged by, but rather whats "inside"...the way we act that counts.

But is that actually true? Unfortunately most people that I know maintain an inventory of benchmarks that they use to immediately start measuring people from the moment they first meet them. And it doesn't take long for these people to start sharing their assessment with others.

And, is Ward's lesson even consistent with other valuable lessons taught elsewhere in the series? The importance of good grooming, keeping your fingernails clean, and a shine on your shoes...stuff like that...because "You only get one chance to make a first impression"...etc etc

Seems to be an apparent conflict in the curriculum here.

Not to beat a dead horse excessively, but I found it quaintly humorous to see the father figure still dressed in a suit and tie well into the evening profess that it's what's inside that really matters.

CosmicCharlie · 02-26-2021, 11:25 PM

Inventory of benchmarks ?

Pretty boys & Pretty girls Dominate society circles -
It's just the way it is as part of what our society values, at least in their world +-

On top of the pretties aspect is the fact that the young and juvenile adults can be truly cruel with little remorse for their actions +-

AND
"You only get one chance to make a first impression"...etc etc

Not Always True - the Beautiful People can be jerks and are most usually accepted on their appearance vs how nice they are on the inside ... at least initially ...

The 1st lesson of life maybe should be is that Life Is Not Fair ...

For me Wards words are usually well written for the 22 minutes given, but I see your point

stevea · 02-27-2021, 03:35 AM

Interesting points. Not only do we have the comment about Wally's nose, later the message is reinforced by comments about Beaver's freckles, Beaver's sheepdog looks, Eddie making suggestions to Beaver about "ditching the dodo" (to get a more preferable date for a dance), Ward wearing a different suit because of the business man's luncheon today (any suit isn't good enough, it's gotta be a blue one).

So when Ward steps in and lectures "it's what's inside that counts," Beaver could counter with, "Then why do you sit around the house in a suit a lot of the time?" or "Why do you wear a fancier suit to the business lunch?"

ThisLittlePiggy · 02-27-2021, 06:54 AM

Well, maybe realizing that others are likely to judge us by external features, we may want to dress well and groom ourselves appropriately.

It's still a fact that the outward appearance is not the substantial thing.

Pug nose or not, Wally can breathe through it. The breath is what is important and essential, not the actual physical nose.

And nobody is judging Ward wearing suits at home. They aren't judging June for wearing pearls and a dress at home. We as viewers make fun of them for it, but it was also an earlier time when folks tended to dress up.

GentlemanJim · 02-27-2021, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CosmicCharlie

Inventory of benchmarks ?

Yeah, really. Such as Movado vs Casio, Florsheim vs Walmart, Versace vs Coty, obese vs fit, overbearing vs meek, ...stuff like that.

I got to thinking this over in some spare moments, and the concept of "stereotypes" came to mind.

When you are unsure how to feel about a stranger, it's only natural to look for clues that give you some idea of the type person they are. A job applicant with scuffed up shoes applying for a sales job where image is a factor, being one example.

So, we train ourselves to look for distinguishing characteristics to give us some idea of what is "under the hood". I opine that once one practices that type of evaluation for long enough, eventually patterns due to (observer) habit will enter into the picture. This may very well be where we give rise to stereotyping, not as a conscious effort, but simply through human nature to repeat what has worked for us in the past.

RetroGuy2000 · 02-27-2021, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThisLittlePiggy

And nobody is judging Ward wearing suits at home. They aren't judging June for wearing pearls and a dress at home. We as viewers make fun of them for it, but it was also an earlier time when folks tended to dress up.

But was it really? My grandmother and I would watch Leave it to Beaver when I was a kid, and she, too, would laugh at June wearing pearls while vacuuming. This was as unrealistic for my grandmother as it was for me.

ThisLittlePiggy · 02-28-2021, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RetroGuy2000

But was it really? My grandmother and I would watch Leave it to Beaver when I was a kid, and she, too, would laugh at June wearing pearls while vacuuming. This was as unrealistic for my grandmother as it was for me.

My mother actually dressed up all the time just because she loved clothes and loved to look that way. I had neighbors who wore suits and hats every single day of their lives.

I guess some folks are just that way, although I don't know anybody like that now so I guess I figured some people did that many decades ago.

Oh, well.

I'm more of the slobby type.

stevea · 02-28-2021, 08:57 AM

My mother had a knack for finding clothes that were inexpensive but she still looked quite nice, even in her bent-over later years. So much so that people would stop her and give her compliments.

Me, I'm the jeans and T-shirt type.

GentlemanJim · 03-03-2021, 01:55 PM

I believe that one inadvertent lesson that I learned watching this show, was that Eddie had an uncanny knack for disappearing just before the sh*t hit the fan.

There were exceptions, but for the most part the guy was teflon.

vitoscotti · 03-03-2021, 02:44 PM

I found it funny on "Beaver and Poncho" where Ward is on the phone with an underling Charlie at the office. Ward has rank over Charlie and he was ripping him a new one big time. Maddest I've seen Ward.
I know it's business, not family. But, Ward wasn't going his level headed do good pep talk he gives the kids. Interesting seeing this side of him.

02-25-2021, 10:57 AM	#1
GentlemanJim Concerns, Support, & Feedback Forum Veteran Join Date: Dec 26, 2019 Location: The back country Posts: 5,443	That "Teaching a valuable lesson" thing There has been abundant discussion on other boards where members insist that television programs teach values, and otherwise "force" viewers to come to terms with important social issues. I believe the 50s era programs in particular are credited with portraying the "American dream" we are all supposed to aspire for (particularly a handful of iconic classics) On one of the Wednesday METV episodes, a "heartthrob" of Wally's makes an insensitive comment about Wally's nose, leading into quite a protracted ordeal of self consciousness. The "valuable lesson du jour" unfolds towards the end where Ward lectures Beaver that it's not our appearance we are judged by, but rather whats "inside"...the way we act that counts. But is that actually true? Unfortunately most people that I know maintain an inventory of benchmarks that they use to immediately start measuring people from the moment they first meet them. And it doesn't take long for these people to start sharing their assessment with others. And, is Ward's lesson even consistent with other valuable lessons taught elsewhere in the series? The importance of good grooming, keeping your fingernails clean, and a shine on your shoes...stuff like that...because "You only get one chance to make a first impression"...etc etc Seems to be an apparent conflict in the curriculum here. Not to beat a dead horse excessively, but I found it quaintly humorous to see the father figure still dressed in a suit and tie well into the evening profess that it's what's inside that really matters.

02-26-2021, 11:25 PM	#2
CosmicCharlie Member Senior Member Join Date: Jan 14, 2019 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 2,451	Inventory of benchmarks ? Pretty boys & Pretty girls Dominate society circles - It's just the way it is as part of what our society values, at least in their world +- On top of the pretties aspect is the fact that the young and juvenile adults can be truly cruel with little remorse for their actions +- AND "You only get one chance to make a first impression"...etc etc Not Always True - the Beautiful People can be jerks and are most usually accepted on their appearance vs how nice they are on the inside ... at least initially ... The 1st lesson of life maybe should be is that Life Is Not Fair ... For me Wards words are usually well written for the 22 minutes given, but I see your point

02-27-2021, 03:35 AM	#3
stevea 22 Years On Sitcoms Moderator Forum Legend Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: Indy Posts: 44,930	Interesting points. Not only do we have the comment about Wally's nose, later the message is reinforced by comments about Beaver's freckles, Beaver's sheepdog looks, Eddie making suggestions to Beaver about "ditching the dodo" (to get a more preferable date for a dance), Ward wearing a different suit because of the business man's luncheon today (any suit isn't good enough, it's gotta be a blue one). So when Ward steps in and lectures "it's what's inside that counts," Beaver could counter with, "Then why do you sit around the house in a suit a lot of the time?" or "Why do you wear a fancier suit to the business lunch?"

02-27-2021, 06:54 AM	#4
ThisLittlePiggy Member Forum Junkie Join Date: Nov 02, 2013 Posts: 85,171	Well, maybe realizing that others are likely to judge us by external features, we may want to dress well and groom ourselves appropriately. It's still a fact that the outward appearance is not the substantial thing. Pug nose or not, Wally can breathe through it. The breath is what is important and essential, not the actual physical nose. And nobody is judging Ward wearing suits at home. They aren't judging June for wearing pearls and a dress at home. We as viewers make fun of them for it, but it was also an earlier time when folks tended to dress up.

02-28-2021, 08:57 AM	#8
stevea 22 Years On Sitcoms Moderator Forum Legend Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: Indy Posts: 44,930	My mother had a knack for finding clothes that were inexpensive but she still looked quite nice, even in her bent-over later years. So much so that people would stop her and give her compliments. Me, I'm the jeans and T-shirt type.

03-03-2021, 01:55 PM	#9
GentlemanJim Concerns, Support, & Feedback Forum Veteran Join Date: Dec 26, 2019 Location: The back country Posts: 5,443	I believe that one inadvertent lesson that I learned watching this show, was that Eddie had an uncanny knack for disappearing just before the sh*t hit the fan. There were exceptions, but for the most part the guy was teflon.

03-03-2021, 02:44 PM	#10
vitoscotti Member Senior Member Join Date: Feb 14, 2017 Location: Illinois Posts: 1,084	I found it funny on "Beaver and Poncho" where Ward is on the phone with an underling Charlie at the office. Ward has rank over Charlie and he was ripping him a new one big time. Maddest I've seen Ward. I know it's business, not family. But, Ward wasn't going his level headed do good pep talk he gives the kids. Interesting seeing this side of him.