Gimme A Break - Who Dunnit? Want To Compile Complete Episode - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

cloggedmind · 02-19-2021, 08:19 PM

Seems this has aired in recent times on Antenna or somesuch, with dialogue that didn't make it to the dvd version. In fact, it seems that it is the only episode that ended up being a syndicated edit version on the complete series release.

If you have this from an original or recent airing, with The Chief saying to Ray, "Welcome to Glenlawn!!", Nell calling Ray a stuck-up at the end, or any of the other bits, maybe you could get a copy to me?

Now, the recent airings are, apparently, edited in other ways, but a more complete or, hopefully, complete episode could be made by restoring the cut bits of dialogue.

What I'd like to do is edit together a complete episode using the dvd and upload it for anyone who, like me, might want the complete show. That's really all I could offer as a trade.

Odd request, I know.

AngieTribeca · 03-03-2021, 01:04 AM

The DVD version is not a syndicated version. It is missing a few seconds of dialogue but it is not the syndicated edit. It runs a lot longer than the runtimes for most syndicated shows. I have old recordings of this particular episode and can verify that a small portion of dialogue was removed. It wasn't enough to take away from the episode at all. Not sure why that particular part was cut but it was very small.

cloggedmind · 03-03-2021, 09:56 AM

The first afternoon re-runs I watched cut the tone deaf bit and part of the song-and-dance number at the end. There were other trims here and there, and I recall I only had 5 NBC episodes on a tape which were favorites including Who Dunnit? and TV Or Not TV, the latter being complete of the dvd set. Yep, true to form, I recorded over those!

Still, would be nice to have the complete Ray Parker show. Maybe mtvyesteryear would be willing to transfer it from his magic tape collection?

stevea · 03-03-2021, 06:51 PM

This sounds slightly similar something that happened with the Brady Bunch. The closing square grids exist on the "trip" episodes (Grand Canyon and Hawaii) but weren't included on the DVD sets. It's possible the (old) syndication prints have them because Sky TV had them around 20 years ago.

cloggedmind · 03-04-2021, 09:34 AM

Sony did the same thing by throwing a few edited Sanford and Son episodes on the "complete" dvds. Folks even let them know as they were released that they were the cut versions, and when asked if there would be replacements, Sony said(paraphrasing), "No, it's not worth going back to fix a minute or two here and there."

I can think of numerous, other examples- Good Times, Cheers! (not just music edits), Mary Tyler Moore Show (final episode DID get a fix!), Newhart (Shout! did try to fill in some missing pieces, though), Ren and Stimpy (allegedly complete series), The A-Team (episode intros missing, some sydication cuts did get restored eventually), Archie Bunker's Place, Sanford (1980, some episodes never shown uncut since the premiere), Hogan's Heroes, Taxi, Married..With Children.

[wrapping up musically] ..And, many mo-o-o-ore!

AngieTribeca · 03-04-2021, 07:14 PM

I hear that. I'd prefer complete episodes whenever possible. However, I don't think this particular episode was much of a loss since such a small piece of dialogue missing. If it was a whole scene or something important to the plot of the episode I'd be more outraged. For example: The Alf DVD sets are an outrage on so many levels. They didn't even try to obtain the original episodes and opted to use syndicated versions running as low as 19 minutes. As a fan, that was unacceptable. The only reason I own those DVDs is because they were a bargain at Walmart one evening.

VEI did a wonderful job on Gimme A Break because the episodes for the most part were uncut and in decent quality. They could have included a few extras but that isn't even a big deal. The small snippet from Who Dunnit won't take away from the set in the slightest. I'd love to get a better quality version of the episode to edit together with my DVD set but I'm not upset in the slightest.

stevea · 03-04-2021, 07:23 PM

It's nothing like the hatchet job Star Vista did to S2 of Mama's Family. That's one show they never got right (although they came closer by getting the network versions of the first two seasons, which Warners evidently couldn't do).

I'd have paid more to get the missing music, if it was explained, rather than having to edit it back ini.

cloggedmind · 03-04-2021, 10:40 PM

Ugh! Forgot about ALF!! I had to look far and wide to find the unedited Gilligan reunion episode!

You know why they used syndication copies for ALF, right? Because Paul Fusco owned distribution rights to the syndication tapes outright and stood to make a greater profit off of the dvd sets by using those copies. It would have cost a bundle to go back and transfer the network masters, which was done later by Universal or whoever distributed the shows to cable, and unedited shows ran in Canada circa 2000-2010.

Mama's Family is a bizarre split-rights issue with NBC and Joe Hamilton and the atrocious way the master tapes got split up, stored and, in a couple of cases, (like Cell Mates, for instance) lost. The music cuts were a mostly avoidable disgrace that got, thankfully, corrected with that last complete series set, even though some episodes were still edited. Between that and the earlier BIG box of Mama, it equals as complete a set as one can get, minus the two cut NBC shows and the loss of a couple of Alastair Quince intros.

I know. I need to turn off the computer and the tv and get some kind of life!

Once my posts get pushed off the board, I'll fade into what probably is a sunset, somewhere. From here, it's just mostly cloudy, damp and foggy around the coast..

stevea · 03-04-2021, 11:22 PM

I never knew they fixed the music. Everything?--I'm aware of 4 cuts, IIRC (the worst one being "Harper [Happy] Days are here Again on the mayor episodes--those cuts absolutely RUINED those episodes!) But to get them you'd have to buy the whole series? I'm actually happy with my TBS recordings for seasons 3 thru 6.

cloggedmind · 03-04-2021, 11:56 PM

Yeah, the music's back in Mama's Family for the 2019 complete series, but the episodes have syndication cuts otherwise and the frame rate is monkeyed with like the METV versions-- less like video, more like film. Stuff like "On The Road, Again", "Chariots of Fire", "I Feel Pretty" and "Harper Days.." are all there, though, IIRC.

stevea · 03-05-2021, 12:07 AM

Egad, I hate those frame-rate screw-ups (or on purpose). Watch those end-credits jitter up and down. I still prefer the TBS versions (S3 thru 6), faded color and all!

I'm beginning to remember--wasn't that 2019 complete series set from Warners? So you either get "filmlook" syndication episodes with the music intact (Warners), or (Star Vista) probably out-of-print network version episodes with music cuts. The Warners 2019 S1 and S2 episodes are probably exactly the same as the single season sets (other than the frame-rate changes) Warners put out years before the Star Vista sets came out.

This is one of those shows where you just can't have it all! Which is why I had to piece together complete episodes on the music cuts. Better than nothing!

cloggedmind · 03-05-2021, 12:22 AM

That's right. The 2019 was Warner with the music and the only place for the NBC network seasons is the Star Vista big box. I had intended to make complete versions for myself using the two, just never got the big motivation once the second set showed up. I had difficulty actually getting the package since my neighbor down the street with the same-ish address (he's North end and I'm South end of the same street with the same house number!) took a shine to my mis-delivered mail. I've had quite an issue getting things back.. thankfully, we don't have the same taste in shows, only music!

I wanna say the season 1 and 2 from Warner look more like video, but I'm too lazy to go into the next room and grab the set to find out! How d'ya like that?! LOL

Maybe tomorrow I'll verify it for curiosity's sake whether it's filmy or not, unless someone else here does. Might be already mentioned in the show's thread, but.. search? Me? Lazy again!

stevea · 03-05-2021, 12:30 AM

Star Vista did release season sets, at least for 1 and 2--I have those.

cloggedmind · 03-06-2021, 12:25 PM

Just had a peek at the WB complete set for Mama's Family..

The first season is, basically, the earlier release with VOB's dating back to the late 2000's. The episodes retain the fluid-motion video cadence of interlaced video.

Season 2 onward has been processed resulting in that film look with the mildly jittery credit roll and, strangely, I do believe that the audio is reduced and fades out a bit too soon for the bells at the end of the credits.. maybe to give the WB jingle an added kick:

"Da-DA-DA-DAAAP!!"

stevea · 03-07-2021, 12:13 AM

That frame rate problem probably results from engineers who don't know how to remaster old videotaped shows. I've also seen these jitters on Silver Spoons season 4, which was evidently remastered for MeTV (Chicago local) years ago. The most interesting thing about that remaster is that they left the original bumpers intact, which is unheard of. That may have been a problem with the earlier seasons too, but my set has other sources for those.

I've also seen it on Good Times and Diff'rent Strokes, when they were shown on Starz Black.

02-19-2021, 08:19 PM	#1
cloggedmind Inactive Member Forum Regular Join Date: Apr 30, 2007 Posts: 529	Gimme A Break - Who Dunnit? Want To Compile Complete Episode Seems this has aired in recent times on Antenna or somesuch, with dialogue that didn't make it to the dvd version. In fact, it seems that it is the only episode that ended up being a syndicated edit version on the complete series release. If you have this from an original or recent airing, with The Chief saying to Ray, "Welcome to Glenlawn!!", Nell calling Ray a stuck-up at the end, or any of the other bits, maybe you could get a copy to me? Now, the recent airings are, apparently, edited in other ways, but a more complete or, hopefully, complete episode could be made by restoring the cut bits of dialogue. What I'd like to do is edit together a complete episode using the dvd and upload it for anyone who, like me, might want the complete show. That's really all I could offer as a trade. Odd request, I know.

03-03-2021, 01:04 AM	#2
AngieTribeca Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Jan 20, 2016 Location: Canada Posts: 319	The DVD version is not a syndicated version. It is missing a few seconds of dialogue but it is not the syndicated edit. It runs a lot longer than the runtimes for most syndicated shows. I have old recordings of this particular episode and can verify that a small portion of dialogue was removed. It wasn't enough to take away from the episode at all. Not sure why that particular part was cut but it was very small.

03-03-2021, 09:56 AM	#3
cloggedmind Inactive Member Forum Regular Join Date: Apr 30, 2007 Posts: 529	The first afternoon re-runs I watched cut the tone deaf bit and part of the song-and-dance number at the end. There were other trims here and there, and I recall I only had 5 NBC episodes on a tape which were favorites including Who Dunnit? and TV Or Not TV, the latter being complete of the dvd set. Yep, true to form, I recorded over those! Still, would be nice to have the complete Ray Parker show. Maybe mtvyesteryear would be willing to transfer it from his magic tape collection?

03-03-2021, 06:51 PM	#4
stevea 22 Years On Sitcoms Moderator Forum Legend Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: Indy Posts: 44,824	This sounds slightly similar something that happened with the Brady Bunch. The closing square grids exist on the "trip" episodes (Grand Canyon and Hawaii) but weren't included on the DVD sets. It's possible the (old) syndication prints have them because Sky TV had them around 20 years ago.

03-04-2021, 09:34 AM	#5
cloggedmind Inactive Member Forum Regular Join Date: Apr 30, 2007 Posts: 529	Sony did the same thing by throwing a few edited Sanford and Son episodes on the "complete" dvds. Folks even let them know as they were released that they were the cut versions, and when asked if there would be replacements, Sony said(paraphrasing), "No, it's not worth going back to fix a minute or two here and there." I can think of numerous, other examples- Good Times, Cheers! (not just music edits), Mary Tyler Moore Show (final episode DID get a fix!), Newhart (Shout! did try to fill in some missing pieces, though), Ren and Stimpy (allegedly complete series), The A-Team (episode intros missing, some sydication cuts did get restored eventually), Archie Bunker's Place, Sanford (1980, some episodes never shown uncut since the premiere), Hogan's Heroes, Taxi, Married..With Children. [wrapping up musically] ..And, many mo-o-o-ore!

03-04-2021, 07:14 PM	#6
AngieTribeca Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Jan 20, 2016 Location: Canada Posts: 319	I hear that. I'd prefer complete episodes whenever possible. However, I don't think this particular episode was much of a loss since such a small piece of dialogue missing. If it was a whole scene or something important to the plot of the episode I'd be more outraged. For example: The Alf DVD sets are an outrage on so many levels. They didn't even try to obtain the original episodes and opted to use syndicated versions running as low as 19 minutes. As a fan, that was unacceptable. The only reason I own those DVDs is because they were a bargain at Walmart one evening. VEI did a wonderful job on Gimme A Break because the episodes for the most part were uncut and in decent quality. They could have included a few extras but that isn't even a big deal. The small snippet from Who Dunnit won't take away from the set in the slightest. I'd love to get a better quality version of the episode to edit together with my DVD set but I'm not upset in the slightest.

03-04-2021, 07:23 PM	#7
stevea 22 Years On Sitcoms Moderator Forum Legend Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: Indy Posts: 44,824	It's nothing like the hatchet job Star Vista did to S2 of Mama's Family. That's one show they never got right (although they came closer by getting the network versions of the first two seasons, which Warners evidently couldn't do). I'd have paid more to get the missing music, if it was explained, rather than having to edit it back ini.

03-04-2021, 10:40 PM	#8
cloggedmind Inactive Member Forum Regular Join Date: Apr 30, 2007 Posts: 529	Ugh! Forgot about ALF!! I had to look far and wide to find the unedited Gilligan reunion episode! You know why they used syndication copies for ALF, right? Because Paul Fusco owned distribution rights to the syndication tapes outright and stood to make a greater profit off of the dvd sets by using those copies. It would have cost a bundle to go back and transfer the network masters, which was done later by Universal or whoever distributed the shows to cable, and unedited shows ran in Canada circa 2000-2010. Mama's Family is a bizarre split-rights issue with NBC and Joe Hamilton and the atrocious way the master tapes got split up, stored and, in a couple of cases, (like Cell Mates, for instance) lost. The music cuts were a mostly avoidable disgrace that got, thankfully, corrected with that last complete series set, even though some episodes were still edited. Between that and the earlier BIG box of Mama, it equals as complete a set as one can get, minus the two cut NBC shows and the loss of a couple of Alastair Quince intros. I know. I need to turn off the computer and the tv and get some kind of life! Once my posts get pushed off the board, I'll fade into what probably is a sunset, somewhere. From here, it's just mostly cloudy, damp and foggy around the coast..

03-04-2021, 11:22 PM	#9
stevea 22 Years On Sitcoms Moderator Forum Legend Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: Indy Posts: 44,824	I never knew they fixed the music. Everything?--I'm aware of 4 cuts, IIRC (the worst one being "Harper [Happy] Days are here Again on the mayor episodes--those cuts absolutely RUINED those episodes!) But to get them you'd have to buy the whole series? I'm actually happy with my TBS recordings for seasons 3 thru 6.

03-04-2021, 11:56 PM	#10
cloggedmind Inactive Member Forum Regular Join Date: Apr 30, 2007 Posts: 529	Yeah, the music's back in Mama's Family for the 2019 complete series, but the episodes have syndication cuts otherwise and the frame rate is monkeyed with like the METV versions-- less like video, more like film. Stuff like "On The Road, Again", "Chariots of Fire", "I Feel Pretty" and "Harper Days.." are all there, though, IIRC.

03-05-2021, 12:07 AM	#11
stevea 22 Years On Sitcoms Moderator Forum Legend Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: Indy Posts: 44,824	Egad, I hate those frame-rate screw-ups (or on purpose). Watch those end-credits jitter up and down. I still prefer the TBS versions (S3 thru 6), faded color and all! I'm beginning to remember--wasn't that 2019 complete series set from Warners? So you either get "filmlook" syndication episodes with the music intact (Warners), or (Star Vista) probably out-of-print network version episodes with music cuts. The Warners 2019 S1 and S2 episodes are probably exactly the same as the single season sets (other than the frame-rate changes) Warners put out years before the Star Vista sets came out. This is one of those shows where you just can't have it all! Which is why I had to piece together complete episodes on the music cuts. Better than nothing!

03-05-2021, 12:22 AM	#12
cloggedmind Inactive Member Forum Regular Join Date: Apr 30, 2007 Posts: 529	That's right. The 2019 was Warner with the music and the only place for the NBC network seasons is the Star Vista big box. I had intended to make complete versions for myself using the two, just never got the big motivation once the second set showed up. I had difficulty actually getting the package since my neighbor down the street with the same-ish address (he's North end and I'm South end of the same street with the same house number!) took a shine to my mis-delivered mail. I've had quite an issue getting things back.. thankfully, we don't have the same taste in shows, only music! I wanna say the season 1 and 2 from Warner look more like video, but I'm too lazy to go into the next room and grab the set to find out! How d'ya like that?! LOL Maybe tomorrow I'll verify it for curiosity's sake whether it's filmy or not, unless someone else here does. Might be already mentioned in the show's thread, but.. search? Me? Lazy again!

03-05-2021, 12:30 AM	#13
stevea 22 Years On Sitcoms Moderator Forum Legend Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: Indy Posts: 44,824	Star Vista did release season sets, at least for 1 and 2--I have those.

03-06-2021, 12:25 PM	#14
cloggedmind Inactive Member Forum Regular Join Date: Apr 30, 2007 Posts: 529	Just had a peek at the WB complete set for Mama's Family.. The first season is, basically, the earlier release with VOB's dating back to the late 2000's. The episodes retain the fluid-motion video cadence of interlaced video. Season 2 onward has been processed resulting in that film look with the mildly jittery credit roll and, strangely, I do believe that the audio is reduced and fades out a bit too soon for the bells at the end of the credits.. maybe to give the WB jingle an added kick: "Da-DA-DA-DAAAP!!"

03-07-2021, 12:13 AM	#15
stevea 22 Years On Sitcoms Moderator Forum Legend Join Date: Aug 13, 2003 Location: Indy Posts: 44,824	That frame rate problem probably results from engineers who don't know how to remaster old videotaped shows. I've also seen these jitters on Silver Spoons season 4, which was evidently remastered for MeTV (Chicago local) years ago. The most interesting thing about that remaster is that they left the original bumpers intact, which is unheard of. That may have been a problem with the earlier seasons too, but my set has other sources for those. I've also seen it on Good Times and Diff'rent Strokes, when they were shown on Starz Black.