My, how you've changed! - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

Brian Damage · 06-19-2002, 07:17 PM

Has anyone else noticed how much the characters have changed since the pilot?

1. Frasier who loosened up a lot during his Cheers run, seemingly went back to his pretentious ways. Dare I say even worse than his first days on Cheers???

2. Marty who started out as a cranky old man, seems more loveable.

3. Daphne who started out as a naive kook, matured a great deal.

4. Niles began as being cold,shallow and snobby loosened up like Frasier did when he was on Cheers.

5. Roz started out as a female version of Sam Malone, grew out of that character. Something that not even Sam could do.

I wonder? The Cheers characters stayed the same through out the entire run. Hmmmmmm???

TJL · 06-19-2002, 07:51 PM

One of the true signs of a great long running show, is when the characters have the opportunity to grow and evolve beyond a character description in a pilot episode.

Brian Damage · 06-20-2002, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by TJL
One of the true signs of a great long running show, is when the characters have the opportunity to grow and evolve beyond a character description in a pilot episode.

I agree

Dr. Lilith Sternin · 06-21-2002, 01:32 AM

I disagree with the Cheers characters 'staying the same' throughout the entire run. You completely contridicted yourself saying Frasier had changed, 'loosing up' since his first appearance. I believe that's true for all the characters, to different degrees. Most characters stayed consistant, but they grew as the series progressed.

I think Rebecca's character changed the most. She started out as a hard-ass, climbing the corporate ladder business woman who wouldn't take **** from anyone, into a whiny, neurotic whimp. That was a complete disappointment.

Sam, though he was always a playboy, changed dramatically. He wanted to change his ways even if he hadn't succeeded, but just the fact he acknowledged his way of life wasn't fulfilling, proved to me his character had grown.

Lilith softened up from the first episode we saw her on... we saw the softer side to the woman originally written in her initial episode. During her pregnancy her character changed a LOT. Hmmm... there's so many more. I mean, Norm, Cliff, Woody... there characters didn't make a significant change, but in small ways, they did. I'm at the point of rambling, but I did have a valid point somewhere.

Good observations for the Frasier characters. I completely agree. They really have grown over the years, which makes them all the more enjoyable to watch. Even Lilith, who is only makes guest appearances every now and then, has changed drastically on Frasier. I think "Room Service" explains itself.

As for Frasier going back to his pretentious ways, possibly his show and his local fame blew his head back up, turning him back into the original stiff we had met.

I love egotistical Frasier, though. He had lost his edge by the end of Cheers. I mean, the man was ready to jump off the ledge of a building... please! A respected psychiatrist?! *sigh* I digress.

Brian Damage · 06-21-2002, 07:40 PM

I stand corrected on the Cheers characters, when I wrote that I really had Cliff, Norm and Carla in mind. Sam did change to a slight degree, but always seemed to revert back to good ol' playboy Sammy. I never even considered Rebecca or Lillith.

Central Perk · 06-22-2002, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Lilith Sternin
I disagree with the Cheers characters 'staying the same' throughout the entire run. You completely contridicted yourself saying Frasier had changed, 'loosing up' since his first appearance. I believe that's true for all the characters, to different degrees. Most characters stayed consistant, but they grew as the series progressed.

I think Rebecca's character changed the most. She started out as a hard-ass, climbing the corporate ladder business woman who wouldn't take **** from anyone, into a whiny, neurotic whimp. That was a complete disappointment.

Sam, though he was always a playboy, changed dramatically. He wanted to change his ways even if he hadn't succeeded, but just the fact he acknowledged his way of life wasn't fulfilling, proved to me his character had grown.

Lilith softened up from the first episode we saw her on... we saw the softer side to the woman originally written in her initial episode. During her pregnancy her character changed a LOT. Hmmm... there's so many more. I mean, Norm, Cliff, Woody... there characters didn't make a significant change, but in small ways, they did. I'm at the point of rambling, but I did have a valid point somewhere.

Good observations for the Frasier characters. I completely agree. They really have grown over the years, which makes them all the more enjoyable to watch. Even Lilith, who is only makes guest appearances every now and then, has changed drastically on Frasier. I think "Room Service" explains itself.

As for Frasier going back to his pretentious ways, possibly his show and his local fame blew his head back up, turning him back into the original stiff we had met. I love egotistical Frasier, though. He had lost his edge by the end of Cheers. I mean, the man was ready to jump off the ledge of a building... please! A respected psychiatrist?! *sigh* I digress.

I liked her as a neurotic wimp and as a hard-ass..it seemed like they couldn't decided what to do about her so they sorta combined the roles and made her a hard-ass neurotic wimp...but she was more neurotic than hard-ass...a lot more...

06-19-2002, 07:17 PM	#1
Brian Damage I'm Rich Bitch Forum Icon Join Date: Feb 03, 2002 Location: What Ain't No Country I Ever Heard Of...They Speak English in What? Posts: 63,107	My, how you've changed! Has anyone else noticed how much the characters have changed since the pilot? 1. Frasier who loosened up a lot during his Cheers run, seemingly went back to his pretentious ways. Dare I say even worse than his first days on Cheers??? 2. Marty who started out as a cranky old man, seems more loveable. 3. Daphne who started out as a naive kook, matured a great deal. 4. Niles began as being cold,shallow and snobby loosened up like Frasier did when he was on Cheers. 5. Roz started out as a female version of Sam Malone, grew out of that character. Something that not even Sam could do. I wonder? The Cheers characters stayed the same through out the entire run. Hmmmmmm???
	__________________ The Key to the Kingdom of Heaven: John 3:3 *Money Doesn't Buy Happiness...But I'd Rather Cry in My Private Jet*

06-19-2002, 07:51 PM	#2
TJL Suburbanite Extrordinaire Forum Star Join Date: Dec 29, 2001 Location: New Jersey - the cradle of civilization Posts: 16,591	One of the true signs of a great long running show, is when the characters have the opportunity to grow and evolve beyond a character description in a pilot episode.
	__________________ "I think I'll stroll up to the front to see how the shooting's going..." - Capt. Benjamin Franklin "Hawkeye" Pierce Read my blogs! http://centralparkamisguide.com/ http://dvdcriticscorner.com Visit me on Facebook!http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=641138880 Hey, I do the tweet thing too! http://twitter.com/TomLevier My shop of handmade items! http://www.etsy.com/shop/ColdGarageCreations

06-21-2002, 01:32 AM	#4
Dr. Lilith Sternin Ice Cube in Heels Forum Regular Join Date: Jan 31, 2002 Posts: 523	I disagree with the Cheers characters 'staying the same' throughout the entire run. You completely contridicted yourself saying Frasier had changed, 'loosing up' since his first appearance. I believe that's true for all the characters, to different degrees. Most characters stayed consistant, but they grew as the series progressed. I think Rebecca's character changed the most. She started out as a hard-ass, climbing the corporate ladder business woman who wouldn't take **** from anyone, into a whiny, neurotic whimp. That was a complete disappointment. Sam, though he was always a playboy, changed dramatically. He wanted to change his ways even if he hadn't succeeded, but just the fact he acknowledged his way of life wasn't fulfilling, proved to me his character had grown. Lilith softened up from the first episode we saw her on... we saw the softer side to the woman originally written in her initial episode. During her pregnancy her character changed a LOT. Hmmm... there's so many more. I mean, Norm, Cliff, Woody... there characters didn't make a significant change, but in small ways, they did. I'm at the point of rambling, but I did have a valid point somewhere. Good observations for the Frasier characters. I completely agree. They really have grown over the years, which makes them all the more enjoyable to watch. Even Lilith, who is only makes guest appearances every now and then, has changed drastically on Frasier. I think "Room Service" explains itself. As for Frasier going back to his pretentious ways, possibly his show and his local fame blew his head back up, turning him back into the original stiff we had met. I love egotistical Frasier, though. He had lost his edge by the end of Cheers. I mean, the man was ready to jump off the ledge of a building... please! A respected psychiatrist?! sigh I digress.
	__________________ "Musical theatre -- it's totally American and when it's good, it's like nothing else." ~Bebe Neuwirth </center> Lilith: I mapped out our dominant and recessive traits on a genome square, applied Mendel's laws, allowed for anomolies, and concluded that you are the best biological choice. Frasier: I see. Well, enticed as I am by your honeyed words, I'm gonna need some kissin'. Lilith: Frasier, don't misunderstand. I'm not proposing any change in our relationship. Frasier: Would we sleep together? Lilith: I thought we'd freeze your sperm. Frasier: Is that a yes or a no? Lilith: Natural fertilization isn't practical. I'd have to fly to Seattle every time I ovulate. Frasier: Right, okay. So then, your plan is for me to visit some local doctor, freeze my essence, and then bring it home with you. Lilith: Correct. I'll take mine to go!

06-21-2002, 07:40 PM	#5
Brian Damage I'm Rich Bitch Forum Icon Join Date: Feb 03, 2002 Location: What Ain't No Country I Ever Heard Of...They Speak English in What? Posts: 63,107	I stand corrected on the Cheers characters, when I wrote that I really had Cliff, Norm and Carla in mind. Sam did change to a slight degree, but always seemed to revert back to good ol' playboy Sammy. I never even considered Rebecca or Lillith.

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