Season 08 Episodes

[TheLogoMan94]

If anybody has kept track, Me-TV is now on Season 08. I've noticed the color on a majority of the episodes is a bit faded, but on some episodes, whenever they switch to a new scene, the color is severely faded, and there's lots of film debris and some scratches. The whole episode can look clean, but there'll be a 1 minute scene with faded color and will be littered with film debris. How come this happens? Is it because those scenes were not originally included in the original syndication master and were just added later on?

Here's a comparison. This comes from S08 E11. Notice how in the first picture, the colors appear normal, and during that scene, there is very little film debris.

In the second picture, when the scene changed, the colors are more noticeably faded, and it has a bunch of film debris. That scene only lasted 12 seconds before it switched back to a scene similar to the first picture, which is that it had no sign of color fade and looked clean.

[stevea]

The transfers to videotape were probably done in the 80s or 90s (for seasons 6 thru the first half of 11), and I think season 8 looks the worst. The background color variations from episode to episode are amazing. This was the first season done at a different production studio.

IMO the worst-looking episode is the Aunt Cecile visit. There are other problems in this season besides faded color--film shifting around in the sprockets, which probably indicates a deteriorated print was used. With modern remastering there are probably ways to correct that problem.

There is a noticeable improvement with season 10 for whatever reason--maybe they switched to better cameras or film. This improvement lasted thru the first half of season 11. As far as I know seasons 1 thru 5 and the last half of 11 and all of 12 were never transferred from 35mm--the transfers appear to have been done from 16mm copies. The Syndication Bible website still says those seasons are unavailable for syndication.

[TheLogoMan94]

I agree wholeheartedly, Season 08 is the worst in terms of color quality. Season 08 will have the occasional episodes that looks great, like my captures of E02 and E03; however, episodes like E16, are bad in quality. That episode, "Liverpool Saga," actually aired Friday. Throughout the whole episode, the color is dull, and the print is very dirty. At one point a few years ago, I thought it came from 16mm, just because of how dirty the print looked. You said the Aunt Cecile episode (E13) was the worst, but in my opinion, I gotta give it to E16 ("Liverpool Saga"); but, you're not wrong about that episode at all. In some parts, the color is good, but in other parts, it's really bad.

Season 10 is a huge improvement over Season 08 in terms of quality. Clean, sharp video and great sound. Season 09 is also like that too, in a way. If I had to rate the color seasons based on quality, and based on the current prints we have, I'd say, ranging from best to worst: S10, S09, S07, S06, S11.1, S08, S11.2, & S12.

Season 12 is the absolute worst. Instead of retransferring any 16mm prints they may have had, or even beat up 35mm prints, they choose to transfer a (presumably Betacam) tape, which was used to dub a 16mm print onto. I highly doubt CBS did any changing in terms of quality within the last year to S11.2 & S12. The only change I could see is removing Viacom's old logo, but even then, it does seem like it was added on purpose.

[stevea]

If CBS is going to continue releasing DVD sets, I'd think they would have to improve S11.5 and S12 in some way, assuming they get that far. I agree S12 is the absolute worst. That is the only season where they chopped the starring cast out of the end credits. That, and another poster on Sitcoms claims the original opening credits were corrected to show Dawn Lyn and Ronne Troup and delete Don Grady. They really need to master from those 35mm prints if they can find them. Combine that with the choppy edits and missing transitions...ugh!

[TheLogoMan94]

I was hoping my print of a S11 episode was actually a S12 episode, because I think that would be the only chance of seeing that variation of the intro. Comparing the audio of the Odyssey airings and Me-TV airings, the Odyssey airings sound a bit better, probably because it wasn't dubbed a second time to another (presumable) tape format like what CBS did with these episodes. Either that, or they were just mastered very poorly.

[stevea]

Yep, the audio on many MeTV S12 episodes is pretty bad (the Fergus episodes are absolutely horrible). But the color on Odyssey is more faded than MeTV.

I'll never understand the syndication history of M3S. If it was my decision I would have syndicated all the color episodes. And at some point they even removed the first half of S11 from the package. I could kick myself for not taping those from channel 40 when they aired them years ago. Then I would have had complete copies of those.

[TheLogoMan94]

I really can't complain, at least I have HD copies of S11.2 & S12, instead of those old Odyssey recordings (which I actually still have as well.) It seems CBS did a bit of retouching/editing to improve the color, while also cutting out a few scenes and adding cleaner intros.

The syndication history was strange. Comprised of 2 packages: S01-05 & S11-S12, and S06-S10. Not sure why it was syndicated like that, but they must have had their reasons. The page on the Syndication Bible hasn't been updated since 2009, and I don't expect an update soon.

I'm only 25, and I hope that at least during my lifetime, all of this show will be remastered. I would absolutely love to see that.

[Hazel Anyday]

It's amazing what a remastering job, or going to the original prints can do for quality. I remember back in the '80's watching Petticoat Junction on a far off local UHF channel, the color was all green and purple and faded out. I thought then, it's too bad the film has deteriorated so compared to my memory of it when it was first on the air.

Then TV Land came along and showed these beautiful bright and accurately color episodes. I was so surprised to see the show hadn't deteriorated at all, or if it had it had been brought back to life somehow. Me TV also has shown these beautiful versions of Petticoat, though some episodes the color is a bit on the purple side, it's still a vast improvement over those '80's unrestored prints.

[TheLogoMan94]

Especially if you're dealing with 16mm! My only print of "Petticoat Junction" has faded to shades of pink. I have 8 episodes of "My Three Sons," 7 in color and 1 in B&W. All of the color episodes, except for 1, have faded to shades of pink or red because they're printed on early Eastman stock, which is the worst color stock. The only one that hasn't, my print of "Double Jealousy" (S10 E15,) was printed on Fujifilm stock in 1975. The colors are beautiful, but have a bit of a purplish hue.

I just wonder how S08, in terms of overall quality, is the worst. Dirty prints and faded color affect almost every episode. All of the S06-S10 episodes are Viacom prints, and if their logo is anything to judge by, these masters were probably made in the early-'90s. Still, for almost 30 year old masters, they hold up well, especially compared to the recent masters of S03-S05 & S11.2-S12.

[stevea]

Many of the season 6 and 7 episodes look quite good. I never really thought about the film stock being an issue. I guess this is one reason why they produce a new film print when doing a proper remaster.

[stevea]

Originally Posted by TheLogoMan94

...Still, for almost 30 year old masters, they hold up well, especially compared to the recent masters of S03-S05 & S11.2-S12.

Recent masters? I could only wish!

All I know CBS did was attach a new CBS Productions logo, which could have even been done by MeTV. I know I made a comment about improved color in season 11.5 and 12, but MeTV could have tweaked that, too.

In some cases a different opener was attached, but that was just a common opener lifted from a season 10 syndication episode.

[stevea]

Today's episode looked really good. The credits weren't even sped up.

[TheLogoMan94]

Originally Posted by stevea

Recent masters? I could only wish!

All I know CBS did was attach a new CBS Productions logo, which could have even been done by MeTV. I know I made a comment about improved color in season 11.5 and 12, but MeTV could have tweaked that, too.

In some cases a different opener was attached, but that was just a common opener lifted from a season 10 syndication episode.

By "recent masters," I simply meant that CBS just dubbed old episodes to a new format, that's really all.

That's really the only differences compared to the Odyssey airings: a new intro and CBS's logo added to the end, replacing Viacom's logo (on some occasions.)

[stevea]

MeTV used that "new" intro on some episodes. On others they had the same intro Odyssey used. I think the "Hi welcome to our show" even slipped thru once. At least they didn't use the intro where the music speeds up after the announcer is done.

IIRC the new intro episodes turned out to be the very-badly edited episodes.

Those old Viacom logos are fascinating. Somebody probably left them on there (sometimes) for kicks.

[TheLogoMan94]

I done some counting: 12 episodes make up S11.2, and 24 episodes make up S12. Eighteen episodes had Viacom logos, and 18 didn’t. And speaking of Viacom, CBS and Viacom just announced their merger, which will happen at the end of this year.

Wish CBS would’ve retained Viacom’s logo on all of 36 of those episodes, but 18 is good enough. When I saw it last year, it was the first time I saw it on TV since about 2001 or so. S11 E14 was the first S11 episode I captured, and I put the closing credits up:

https://youtu.be/NhSYpDKX4_0