What Was The Real Reason Don Knotts Didn't Stay for The Duration - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

Duster76 · 01-07-2019, 05:10 PM

There was a recent thread asking the question What if Don Knotts had stayed, but maybe we should take a closer look at why he left in the first place. The public story is basically this, Andy had indicated at some point in the past he would end the series after five years, so Knotts went out and developed a deal for 5 films with Universal. Then Andy changes his mind, signs for three more years only to then find out Knotts had a verbally committed to a movie deal. There may have been more to this than meets the eye.

At the end of the 4th season, Jim Nabors who had only been with the series a year and a half gets a spin off. This may have rubbed Don the wrong way. Don was a critical component to the Griffith series, yet he was paid as a supporting player not a star, and now Nabors leapfrogs over him getting his own starring vehicle. This may have been the key turning point in the relationship between Don and The Andy Griffith Show.

Don didn't sign to do his own series, he signed to do a few movies, big deal. Dick Van Dyke did movies while his series was on, so did Fred MacMurray, it seems something could have been worked out so Don could stay on the show. The question is this, why wasn't it? The money was already set with CBS, the production company could have carved it up differently, Griffith owned a piece of the show maybe he could have reduced his salary (by this time it was pretty clear the series would have a long life in reruns so Griffith would realize the value in future years). Maybe they could have eliminated George Lindsey to save money, cut the number of episodes Don appeared in (maybe 15-18 a season).

My point, why wasn't a solution worked out?

Yong Fang · 01-07-2019, 10:54 PM

I think it was just a case of Knotts thinking Griffith was going to end the show after five years, which he should have done, and Knotts getting into a very lucrative movie deal. Probably the movie company stipulated in the contract that Knotts couldnt work anywhere else and that was that.

Griffith and Knotts were best friends from that show in 1960 until Knotts died in 2006. I doubnt there was any animosity, it was just that Knotts thought the show was going to end and needed to find another job.

vitoscotti · 01-09-2019, 05:08 PM

He got a big movie deal.

Duster76 · 01-11-2019, 10:11 PM

Vitoscotti stated:

"He got a big movie deal".

Well, he did get a 5 picture deal (which I covered in my post), "big", I wouldn't go that far. These pictures had several things in common, they were essentially populated by other TV talent (as a matter of fact a number of them appeared on TAGS), and all were modestly budgeted. In addition, only two of the five films were released during the run of TAGS. His third picture of the deal wasn't out until about eight months after the filming of the final TAGS episode. I don't see any evidence to suggest that TAGS couldn't have worked around a schedule like this (again Dick Van Dyke had more movies to his credit filmed while his series was on). And one final point, Don was working back in series television well before the last film was released.

There's more here than meets the eye.

Duster76 · 01-11-2019, 10:46 PM

Young Fang said:

"Knotts getting into a very lucrative movie deal".

I don't doubt he was making significantly more than on TAGS, but he wasn't getting movie star money.

"Probably the movie company stipulated in the contract that Knotts couldnt work anywhere else and that was that".

I doubt this is true. His films were filled with TV talent, TAGS alumni Hope Summers, Hal Smith, Paul Hartman, Maggie Peterson appeared in the films in addition to many other veteran character actors. My point Universal was certainly comfortable using talent that regularly appeared on the small screen. Any exposure Don received from being in on TAGS could only help the films.

"Griffith and Knotts were best friends from that show in 1960 until Knotts died in 2006. I doubnt there was any animosity, it was just that Knotts thought the show was going to end and needed to find another job".

They were friends all through this period, but business is business and I still feel that Nabors being handed a starring vehicle while Don was being paid second banana money might have motivated him to make other arrangements.

vitoscotti · 01-12-2019, 02:20 AM

Don Knotts movies were a pretty big deal when they were released. I've never heard an iota of evidence of bad blood or jealousy during his stay on tags. I've seen them Knotts & Griffith together interviewed talking about Knotts movie offer. Knotts came to Griffith, Griffith gave his blessing that leaving tags may be necessary because of Knotts 5 year movie deal.. Knotts owed everything to Griffith for giving him his Barney Fife break.

For Knotts having tv actors in his movies that was common in a lot of 60s movies. I always believed Knotts made a huge mistake leaving tags. I thought he should have worked the movies in his tags down time. He still was comedically brilliant...proof with his tags color episodes. We'd have many more classic Knotts color episodes if he'd stayed.

The classic tags episodes can be watched over and over. His movies are good, but I can only watch them once in a blue moon.

Knotts career fizzled after his 5 year movie deal, and didn't get renewed for leads in movies. A lot of sitcom comedy actors just lose it when they hit a certain age like Knotts in the horrible threes company.

Yong Fang · 01-22-2019, 11:11 PM

I thought Three's Company was a crappy show but getting Knotts was genius and he blended well with the other actors of the show.

Count Istvan Teleky · 06-16-2019, 03:15 PM

Don Knotts was, is and always will be Barney Fife. 3's Co. was the right kinda show for late 70's early 80's and Knotts did add a little to it but the losing the Ropers was mistake for show IMO.

Schmo · 10-30-2019, 01:38 PM

Knotts’ movies were basically Disney clones.

GentlemanJim · 12-26-2019, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duster76

My point, why wasn't a solution worked out?

I recall reading that the 5 year projection for the show's run was a factor (as others have mentioned)...Then the sponsors and the studio begged for more. So they made Andy Griffith an $$offer$$ he couldn't refuse.

Knotts had already made the movie deal, but that wasn't a prohibiting factor.

Griffith and his agent owned slightly over 50% of the show, and Knotts asked for his own percentage.

Nobody wanted to give up a share to accommodate Knott's request.

That's the story I recall reading, and I think it was Sheldon Leonard who ultimately convinced Griffith what a bad idea that would be. Concerned it might open up the gates for other cast members

Duster76 · 01-02-2020, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GentlemanJim

I recall reading that the 5 year projection for the show's run was a factor (as others have mentioned)...Then the sponsors and the studio begged for more. So they made Andy Griffith an $$offer$$ he couldn't refuse.

Knotts had already made the movie deal, but that wasn't a prohibiting factor.

Griffith and his agent owned slightly over 50% of the show, and Knotts asked for his own percentage.

Nobody wanted to give up a share to accommodate Knott's request.

That's the story I recall reading, and I think it was Sheldon Leonard who ultimately convinced Griffith what a bad idea that would be. Concerned it might open up the gates for other cast members

Thanks, this information was helpful. The movie deal was given as a reason for many years, it never made any sense. I think Nabors getting the lead in his own series must have stuck in Don's craw, at that point there was no way he was going to stay with the series unless he received serious financial considerations. I understand what Don did, and I understand Andy's decision, he had the ink on a three year deal with or without Don.

GentlemanJim · 01-03-2020, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duster76

Thanks, this information was helpful. The movie deal was given as a reason for many years, it never made any sense. I think Nabors getting the lead in his own series must have stuck in Don's craw, at that point there was no way he was going to stay with the series unless he received serious financial considerations. I understand what Don did, and I understand Andy's decision, he had the ink on a three year deal with or without Don.

What I've posted so far, I read elsewhere. Now I am going to proceed with my own speculation, so be forewarned

They had to sweeten the pot considerably to get Griffith to sign on for the extension. I believe that is how he got the large percentage he was set to get.

Giving even a part his "raise" away to make Knotts happy, likely looked, felt, and smelled like a step backwards. I doubt Sheldon Leonard was any happier with the thought of giving up more of his share either.

If I had been in AG's shoes, I might have been tempted to say "Hey Don, we're willing to give you a big raise.....but that's as far as it goes"

Schmo · 01-05-2020, 11:11 AM

To my knowledge, Don never publicly complained about feeling cheated or leaving the series on acrimonious terms. In retrospect, his departure may have kept the writers from running out of fresh ideas of what to do with his character.

loaferman · 01-07-2020, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmo

To my knowledge, Don never publicly complained about feeling cheated or leaving the series on acrimonious terms. In retrospect, his departure may have kept the writers from running out of fresh ideas of what to do with his character.

One of the genius moves by the writers was to not have Barney in every episode. He had the potential to become an early version of Fonzie. As far as Knotts leaving I have read that the idea of him wanting a percentage was floated but nobody was budging on that. I don't think his leaving gave the writers fresh ideas as many episodes were kind of a repeat of past plots or another "Aunt Bee...(learns to fly, drive, do a TV show, etc.). None of the new characters was anywhere near a Barney or even Floyd such as Howard, Sam and Emmett. If you can read the book "Andy and Don" it answers a lot of things very well.

Obviously his movie deal did allow him to appear a couple of times, but "color Mayberry" to me just was never he same, even when Don appeared.

GentlemanJim · 01-07-2020, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loaferman

"color Mayberry" to me just was never he same, even when Don appeared.

I think that with the 6 oclock news showing police beating students with riot batons, America's perception of law enforcement changed over the course of the show also. I think re-inventing the show around Howard and Emmett was an attempt to address that....but it just didn't work.

The "town drunk" flaunting the law in 1960 was innocent fun. But by 1968 America wasn't so innocent anymore.

I also seem to remember that the Federal gov't started working through covert channels to reward content creators for creating program material that championed Law enforcement, and programming that made light of law enforcement was discouraged.

The "Partnership for a drug free America" was one such entity that was used to funnel federal money intended to encourage cooperation. There were others, usually employing the word "education" in their name (fwiw)

01-07-2019, 05:10 PM	#1
Duster76 Member Senior Member Join Date: Mar 01, 2008 Location: New jersey Posts: 1,644	What Was The Real Reason Don Knotts Didn't Stay for The Duration There was a recent thread asking the question What if Don Knotts had stayed, but maybe we should take a closer look at why he left in the first place. The public story is basically this, Andy had indicated at some point in the past he would end the series after five years, so Knotts went out and developed a deal for 5 films with Universal. Then Andy changes his mind, signs for three more years only to then find out Knotts had a verbally committed to a movie deal. There may have been more to this than meets the eye. At the end of the 4th season, Jim Nabors who had only been with the series a year and a half gets a spin off. This may have rubbed Don the wrong way. Don was a critical component to the Griffith series, yet he was paid as a supporting player not a star, and now Nabors leapfrogs over him getting his own starring vehicle. This may have been the key turning point in the relationship between Don and The Andy Griffith Show. Don didn't sign to do his own series, he signed to do a few movies, big deal. Dick Van Dyke did movies while his series was on, so did Fred MacMurray, it seems something could have been worked out so Don could stay on the show. The question is this, why wasn't it? The money was already set with CBS, the production company could have carved it up differently, Griffith owned a piece of the show maybe he could have reduced his salary (by this time it was pretty clear the series would have a long life in reruns so Griffith would realize the value in future years). Maybe they could have eliminated George Lindsey to save money, cut the number of episodes Don appeared in (maybe 15-18 a season). My point, why wasn't a solution worked out?

01-07-2019, 10:54 PM	#2
Yong Fang Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 04, 2009 Location: Memphis Tennessee Posts: 3,073	I think it was just a case of Knotts thinking Griffith was going to end the show after five years, which he should have done, and Knotts getting into a very lucrative movie deal. Probably the movie company stipulated in the contract that Knotts couldnt work anywhere else and that was that. Griffith and Knotts were best friends from that show in 1960 until Knotts died in 2006. I doubnt there was any animosity, it was just that Knotts thought the show was going to end and needed to find another job.

01-09-2019, 05:08 PM	#3
vitoscotti Member Senior Member Join Date: Feb 14, 2017 Location: Illinois Posts: 1,076	He got a big movie deal.

01-11-2019, 10:11 PM	#4
Duster76 Member Senior Member Join Date: Mar 01, 2008 Location: New jersey Posts: 1,644	Vitoscotti stated: "He got a big movie deal". Well, he did get a 5 picture deal (which I covered in my post), "big", I wouldn't go that far. These pictures had several things in common, they were essentially populated by other TV talent (as a matter of fact a number of them appeared on TAGS), and all were modestly budgeted. In addition, only two of the five films were released during the run of TAGS. His third picture of the deal wasn't out until about eight months after the filming of the final TAGS episode. I don't see any evidence to suggest that TAGS couldn't have worked around a schedule like this (again Dick Van Dyke had more movies to his credit filmed while his series was on). And one final point, Don was working back in series television well before the last film was released. There's more here than meets the eye.

01-11-2019, 10:46 PM	#5
Duster76 Member Senior Member Join Date: Mar 01, 2008 Location: New jersey Posts: 1,644	Young Fang said: "Knotts getting into a very lucrative movie deal". I don't doubt he was making significantly more than on TAGS, but he wasn't getting movie star money. "Probably the movie company stipulated in the contract that Knotts couldnt work anywhere else and that was that". I doubt this is true. His films were filled with TV talent, TAGS alumni Hope Summers, Hal Smith, Paul Hartman, Maggie Peterson appeared in the films in addition to many other veteran character actors. My point Universal was certainly comfortable using talent that regularly appeared on the small screen. Any exposure Don received from being in on TAGS could only help the films. "Griffith and Knotts were best friends from that show in 1960 until Knotts died in 2006. I doubnt there was any animosity, it was just that Knotts thought the show was going to end and needed to find another job". They were friends all through this period, but business is business and I still feel that Nabors being handed a starring vehicle while Don was being paid second banana money might have motivated him to make other arrangements.

01-12-2019, 02:20 AM	#6
vitoscotti Member Senior Member Join Date: Feb 14, 2017 Location: Illinois Posts: 1,076	Don Knotts movies were a pretty big deal when they were released. I've never heard an iota of evidence of bad blood or jealousy during his stay on tags. I've seen them Knotts & Griffith together interviewed talking about Knotts movie offer. Knotts came to Griffith, Griffith gave his blessing that leaving tags may be necessary because of Knotts 5 year movie deal.. Knotts owed everything to Griffith for giving him his Barney Fife break. For Knotts having tv actors in his movies that was common in a lot of 60s movies. I always believed Knotts made a huge mistake leaving tags. I thought he should have worked the movies in his tags down time. He still was comedically brilliant...proof with his tags color episodes. We'd have many more classic Knotts color episodes if he'd stayed. The classic tags episodes can be watched over and over. His movies are good, but I can only watch them once in a blue moon. Knotts career fizzled after his 5 year movie deal, and didn't get renewed for leads in movies. A lot of sitcom comedy actors just lose it when they hit a certain age like Knotts in the horrible threes company.

01-22-2019, 11:11 PM	#7
Yong Fang Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 04, 2009 Location: Memphis Tennessee Posts: 3,073	I thought Three's Company was a crappy show but getting Knotts was genius and he blended well with the other actors of the show.

06-16-2019, 03:15 PM	#8
Count Istvan Teleky Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Jun 08, 2019 Location: LA Posts: 34	Don Knotts was, is and always will be Barney Fife. 3's Co. was the right kinda show for late 70's early 80's and Knotts did add a little to it but the losing the Ropers was mistake for show IMO.

10-30-2019, 01:38 PM	#9
Schmo Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Aug 24, 2013 Posts: 466	Knotts’ movies were basically Disney clones.

01-05-2020, 11:11 AM	#13
Schmo Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Aug 24, 2013 Posts: 466	To my knowledge, Don never publicly complained about feeling cheated or leaving the series on acrimonious terms. In retrospect, his departure may have kept the writers from running out of fresh ideas of what to do with his character.