Is "Good Times" considered the "black sheep" in the "All In The Family" franchise?

[EccentricGenius]

A thought occurred to me about "Good Times" while I was walking home two days ago, and it's rather interesting:

"All In The Family" spawned more spinoffs than any other series combined (seven in total, if I remember correctly), with "The Jeffersons," "Maude," and the aforementioned "Good Times" being the most notable. "All In The Family," "The Jeffersons" and "Maude" won Emmy awards in the category of Outstanding Lead Actress In A Comedy Series (Jean Stapleton, Isabel Sanford, and Beatrice Arthur were the recipients, respectively, for those three aforementioned sitcoms); in fact, all three spinoffs were awarded with (at least) more than one Emmy.

My question is this: Is "Good Times" considered the "black sheep" of the "All In The Family" franchise? Even though "Good Times" lasted six seasons (1974-79), it wasn't nominated for a single Emmy (the series did receive three Golden Globe nominations, two for Jimmie Walker and one for Esther Rolle). My theory is that due to the backstage, behind-the-scenes bickering from Esther Rolle and (especially) John Amos over the emergence of Jimmie Walker (and his clownish antics) as the star of "Good Times" and the overall direction the sitcom had traveled down as a result. I believe Amos, in particular, was angry with Norman Lear over neglecting "Good Times" in favor of focusing more on his two new programs, "One Day At A Time" and "Mary Hartman, Mary Hartman." (Both series debuted during the winter of 1975-76.) It's no surprise that Amos jumped ship (he was fired) after its third season in the spring of '76; Rolle followed suit a year later after season four (though she eventually returned for its sixth [and final] season in '78).

[TVFactFan]

Originally Posted by EccentricGenius

A thought occurred to me about "Good Times" while I was walking home two days ago, and it's rather interesting:

"All In The Family" spawned more spinoffs than any other series combined (seven in total, if I remember correctly), with "The Jeffersons," "Maude," and the aforementioned "Good Times" being the most notable. "All In The Family," "The Jeffersons" and "Maude" won Emmy awards in the category of Outstanding Lead Actress In A Comedy Series (Jean Stapleton, Isabel Sanford, and Beatrice Arthur were the recipients, respectively, for those three aforementioned sitcoms); in fact, all three spinoffs were awarded with (at least) more than one Emmy.

My question is this: Is "Good Times" considered the "black sheep" of the "All In The Family" franchise? Even though "Good Times" lasted six seasons (1974-79), it wasn't nominated for a single Emmy (the series did receive three Golden Globe nominations, two for Jimmie Walker and one for Esther Rolle). My theory is that due to the backstage, behind-the-scenes bickering from Esther Rolle and (especially) John Amos over the emergence of Jimmie Walker (and his clownish antics) as the star of "Good Times" and the overall direction the sitcom had traveled down as a result. I believe Amos, in particular, was angry with Norman Lear over neglecting "Good Times" in favor of focusing more on his two new programs, "One Day At A Time" and "Mary Hartman, Mary Hartman." (Both series debuted during the winter of 1975-76.) It's no surprise that Amos jumped ship (he was fired) after its third season in the spring of '76; Rolle followed suit a year later after season four (though she eventually returned for its sixth [and final] season in '78).

I never connected Good Times to All in the Family part of the All in the Franchise because GT was based on Eric Monte's life growing up in chicago in the 60's and was created before Maude.

[EccentricGenius]

Originally Posted by TVFactFan

I never connected Good Times to All in the Family part of the All in the Franchise because GT was based on Eric Monte's life growing up in chicago in the 60's and was created before Maude.

Good point, TVFactFan. I forgot that Monte based "Good Times" on his teenaged years in "The Windy City" during the 1960s. Along with input from the late Mike "Lionel Jefferson" Evans (who was developing a sitcom for Tandem Productions at the time; I believe the proposal was called "The Black Family"), Monte molded "Good Times" into the sitcom that it ultimately became. And let's not forget that Monte wrote the classic coming-of-age drama "Cooley High" (directed by Michael Schultz), which was a period piece set in 1960s Chicago. "Cooley High" is an African-American classic; the Motown soundtrack is a gem!

[king of comedy]

I loved Cooley High. I don't look at Good Times now because it just hasn't aged well.

[TVFactFan]

Originally Posted by EccentricGenius

Good point, TVFactFan. I forgot that Monte based "Good Times" on his teenaged years in "The Windy City" during the 1960s. Along with input from the late Mike "Lionel Jefferson" Evans (who was developing a sitcom for Tandem Productions at the time; I believe the proposal was called "The Black Family"), Monte molded "Good Times" into the sitcom that it ultimately became. And let's not forget that Monte wrote the classic coming-of-age drama "Cooley High" (directed by Michael Schultz), which was a period piece set in 1960s Chicago. "Cooley High" is an African-American classic; the Motown soundtrack is a gem!

Right, and Lear wanted to take credit and call a Good Times a spinoff which it was not. Not sure why he couldn't label a new Norman Lear Comedy like
One Day at a Time

[king of comedy]

The character Flo was a character from Maude.

[TVFactFan]

Originally Posted by king of comedy

The character Flo was a character from Maude.

Her husband and where she lived wasn't which is why it's not a spinoff

[visaman666]

Flo from Alice? I don't think so!

[TVFactFan]

Originally Posted by visaman666

Flo from Alice? I don't think so!

Florida. Lol

[Will Dockery]

Originally Posted by EccentricGenius

Good point, TVFactFan. I forgot that Monte based "Good Times" on his teenaged years in "The Windy City" during the 1960s. Along with input from the late Mike "Lionel Jefferson" Evans (who was developing a sitcom for Tandem Productions at the time; I believe the proposal was called "The Black Family"), Monte molded "Good Times" into the sitcom that it ultimately became. And let's not forget that Monte wrote the classic coming-of-age drama "Cooley High" (directed by Michael Schultz), which was a period piece set in 1960s Chicago. "Cooley High" is an African-American classic; the Motown soundtrack is a gem!

I haven't checked to verify this, but isn't there a connection with Cooley High and the sitcom "What's Happening?"

[Will Dockery]

Originally Posted by king of comedy

I loved Cooley High. I don't look at Good Times now because it just hasn't aged well.

Cooley High:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/What%27s_Happening!!

"What's Happening!! was loosely based on the Eric Monte-penned film Cooley High..."

[Will Dockery]

Originally Posted by EccentricGenius

Good point, TVFactFan. I forgot that Monte based "Good Times" on his teenaged years in "The Windy City" during the 1960s. Along with input from the late Mike "Lionel Jefferson" Evans (who was developing a sitcom for Tandem Productions at the time; I believe the proposal was called "The Black Family"), Monte molded "Good Times" into the sitcom that it ultimately became. And let's not forget that Monte wrote the classic coming-of-age drama "Cooley High" (directed by Michael Schultz), which was a period piece set in 1960s Chicago. "Cooley High" is an African-American classic; the Motown soundtrack is a gem!

This is interesting how Good Times and What's Happening have very similar roots yet take the characters in very different directions:

====================================

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cooley_High

ABC planned a television adaptation of Cooley High, but the pilot was poorly received, and Fred Silverman, the head of the network, asked the pilot's producers, TOY Productions, to redo the show as a sitcom with new characters and with a new title so as not to confuse it with Monte's film Cooley High. New writers were hired, cast changes made, and a switch from one-camera to three-camera filming delivered What's Happening!! to the network, where it ran from August 5, 1976 to April 28, 1979. The show and the production company were then purchased by Columbia Pictures Television in 1979 and ran in syndication for a number of years.[when?]

Cooley High also inspired the CBS television show The White Shadow (November 27, 1978 to March 16, 1981), starring Ken Howard.

=================================

And so it goes.