Strange edits in NBC repeats - 88 Halloween special

[justins5256]

I realize this is probably a pretty esoteric topic that won't get much attention, but I noticed something really bizarre about the 10/26/88 episode. This is the Halloween special which featured stories about hauntings - the Queen Mary, the Tallman family with the haunted bunk beds, the General Wayne Inn in Philadelphia, and Jim and Kay Tatum - the retired couple who claimed they saw apparitions and that a ghost would ring a bell.

Anyway, the episode aired on 10/26/88 and was repeated 4/19/89. I always assumed that 4/19 airing was identical. Strangely, that 4/19/89 broadcast had some scenes that were not in the October airing.

Most notably

- during the Queen Mary segment a psychic on board described hearing the sounds of the collision. Possibly the same sounds that were recorded?

- during the General Wayne Inn segment, Stack has a few extra lines in which he introduces the historian who then describes the history of sightings of the ghost of a soldier in the basement.

- Kay Tatum recounts that the "ghost" would occasionally make noises by flipping coins, and also tugged on her blouse.

Interestingly, there is a "preview" at the end of the 10/26 episode about next week's episode which would include the infamous Son of Sam story. This preview is absent in the 4/19 version, so perhaps this footage was added to compensate for the time lost in cutting the preview?

I do not recall what all was shown on Lifetime, or Spike, or on DVD (I think most of these stories were on the Ghost box set).

Regardless, it makes me wonder how many different versions of the segments are floating around.

[dynoguy88]

Originally Posted by justins5256

Anyway, the episode aired on 10/26/88 and was repeated 4/19/89. I always assumed that 4/19 airing was identical. Strangely, that 4/19/89 broadcast had some scenes that were not in the October airing

I recall that exact pattern happening with the orange socks murders segment, though it wasn't as extreme as the examples you cited.

I'll have to look up the dates but when that segment first aired, it was exactly what would come to be shown on the Lifetime version years later (the toll free number taken out of course).

However, when that segment was first repeated on NBC a few months later, there's an extra 30-45 seconds or so towards the end with more of an investigator's interview mentioning the location of Annette Schnee's body being too remote and it being theorized that it might have been more of a dump site than an actual murder site as the camera pans away from the reenactment of police investigating the scene.

I remember seeing that as a kid and going, "huh? Why didn't they include that the first time they aired this story?". Never again did I see that 30 seconds when the segment was rerun over the years that followed.

This would be a good topic for other examples but you need to remember the NBC years and have an excellent memory of course.

[justins5256]

Originally Posted by dynoguy88

I recall that exact pattern happening with the orange socks murders segment, though it wasn't as extreme as the examples you cited.

Interesting. Thanks for pointing that out.

A few I remember offhand...

- The story about the New York coin scam. NBC repeats included a whole extra bit about how some victims then attempted to take the worthless coins to coin shops in New York and resell them only to be told the coins are worthless. In this footage is an interview with a coin shop owner who says the coin scam will continue to work and be profitable because "as P.T. Barnum always says, a sucker is born every minute." This footage didn't make it to Lifetime.

- The repeat of the Doreen Picard and Susan Laferte segment featured a longer interview with Doreen Picard's father, IIRC. That entire episode was changed a bit for rebroadcast. Updates about the arrests of Louis Carlucci and Jon Yount and Diane Brodbeck were added, which is understandable, but a lot of footage from the Beale Treasure segment was inexplicably removed, and some scenes in the Picard and Laferte segment were shortened. So, the Picard/Laferte segment had scenes removed and added.

- Some scenes were supposedly added to the Lifetime RS version of the Freedom II scam story, and some scenes were also cut in the Lifetime version, so neither version is "complete."

[RobinW]

Originally Posted by justins5256

Anyway, the episode aired on 10/26/88 and was repeated 4/19/89. I always assumed that 4/19 airing was identical. Strangely, that 4/19/89 broadcast had some scenes that were not in the October airing.

Most notably

- during the Queen Mary segment a psychic on board described hearing the sounds of the collision. Possibly the same sounds that were recorded?

- during the General Wayne Inn segment, Stack has a few extra lines in which he introduces the historian who then describes the history of sightings of the ghost of a soldier in the basement.

- Kay Tatum recounts that the "ghost" would occasionally make noises by flipping coins, and also tugged on her blouse.

Interesting, as I don't remember ever seeing these segments without these pieces of footage! I own the ghosts DVD set and I'm pretty sure all these bits are included. In fact, I used to have a VHS copy of the special which I watched numerous times during my childhood and I'm pretty sure all these bits were there too. But IIRC, I think I might have taped the April 1989 rerun off of TV rather than the original October 1988 special. So I guess you could almost call the rerun an "UM director's cut".

You can go nuts keeping track of these things. I know that some of the DVD sets contain edited segments with key pieces of information missing. For example, the Arnold Archambeau/Ruby Brugieur DVD version cuts out the entire section about the witness seeing Arnold in a bar on New Year's Eve.

[TheCars1986]

I only know of a handful of the early 89-90 episodes that were edited during the Lifetime reruns.

The Terri McClure murder segment was chopped down by about 2 minutes. I know for certain that Tim McClure's answer about the polygraph was edited, as well as the last line in the segment with McClure pleading with anyone who saw his mother's murder to come forward. I'm guessing this was edited to make room for the "update" in the case.

John Branion's segment was also edited for the reruns. They eliminated the part about Branion possibly hiring a hitman to kill his wife, and his angry response at being asked that question during the segment. Again, I think this was probably done to make room for the update at the end.

I think I've seen at least 2 or 3 different versions of the Keith Reinhard segment. One had the little oddity about a woman Keith was seen talking to at a party towards the end, that was completely missing from other airings. I've seen this version one time. Another version omitted the nuclear dumping angle completely (I believe this was on the forbidden site at one point).

[justins5256]

Originally Posted by RobinW

Interesting, as I don't remember ever seeing these segments without these pieces of footage! I own the ghosts DVD set and I'm pretty sure all these bits are included. In fact, I used to have a VHS copy of the special which I watched numerous times during my childhood and I'm pretty sure all these bits were there too. But IIRC, I think I might have taped the April 1989 rerun off of TV rather than the original October 1988 special. So I guess you could almost call the rerun an "UM director's cut".

I know what you mean. In my mind, those scenes were always a part of the segment. Perhaps I'm basing this on memories of the Lifetime rerun or maybe I've just watched the NBC rerun version more frequently (I don't have the Ghosts set). In any event, I couldn't sleep the other night, so I decided to watch some old UM. I came upon this episode in its October 1988 incarnation. It dawned on me later that the scenes were missing in the Tatum segment only. At first, I thought I had zoned out and missed them, but then I actually compared the two versions and made this discovery which I wrote about above.

Originally Posted by RobinW

You can go nuts keeping track of these things. I know that some of the DVD sets contain edited segments with key pieces of information missing. For example, the Arnold Archambeau/Ruby Brugieur DVD version cuts out the entire section about the witness seeing Arnold in a bar on New Year's Eve.

I have often wondered if the DVD versions were edited just so they could pack that many stories on the discs with the extra features and not run out of space.

In terms of the NBC edits, it's odd. Given the "constantly evolving" nature of the show (i.e., updates being added, segments being swapped around in reruns, etc.) I could see the producers either having multiple versions of the segments trimmed to fit certain time constraints, or perhaps "outtake" type footage that didn't make the original cut, but that could be added as filler if needed.

I'd love to know more segments that got this treatment. However, like dynoguy said, it's probably difficult to know for sure unless someone has a sharp memory of the original NBC run. Not to mention that the NBC repeat episodes are probably the most scarce in terms of what is out there. Not many people recorded vintage UM, and even fewer folks recorded the network re-broadcasts. The few re-broadcasts I do have were likely from time shifting and it's a miracle they survived.

[wiseguy182]

I can confirm all 4 segments on the 10/26/88 episode made it to the retail dvd sets.

That's weird that whoever made those (First Look I think it was) would show edited versions. I have a lot of retail dvd sets of many different shows and they have been very, very good about showing complete episodes. Sort of veering off topic, but just yesterday, I watched a 2 part Married with Children episode called "Shop til you Drop" (the supermarket sweep episode) on my retail dvd set and they had a few scenes in there I have never seen before, which is remarkable because I have seen that episode so many times in reruns in syndication I could probably recite the entire dialogue, word for word.

In fact, many shows are good about showing unaired scenes, alternate takes and what not in their dvd releases. Offhand, the only shows that had obvious edits in their dvds were Little House on the Prairie, Roseanne, Mr. Bean and Family Matters (season 4), and they all ended up being re-done due to numerous consumer complaints with all of the edited footage being thrown back in (with LHOTP having improved audio and video to boot).

But back to the original topic, I am sort of surprised something similar didn't happen with the UM retail sets, although perhaps the reasoning for that is that the edits weren't as noticeable. Or maybe there's some Easter eggs we don't know about.

[RobinW]

Another edit from the Bizarre Murders DVD set is in the Cindy James segment, as they cut out the scene with the ominous answering machine message. I remember it being quite the eye-opener when I found a longer version of that segment online containing that scene a few years ago.

But, yes, I agree that the DVD edits could have simply been a case of having enough space to fit a certain amount stuff on the discs.

[justins5256]

Originally Posted by wiseguy182

I can confirm all 4 segments on the 10/26/88 episode made it to the retail dvd sets.

That's weird that whoever made those (First Look I think it was) would show edited versions. I have a lot of retail dvd sets of many different shows and they have been very, very good about showing complete episodes. Sort of veering off topic, but just yesterday, I watched a 2 part Married with Children episode called "Shop til you Drop" (the supermarket sweep episode) on my retail dvd set and they had a few scenes in there I have never seen before, which is remarkable because I have seen that episode so many times in reruns in syndication I could probably recite the entire dialogue, word for word.

In fact, many shows are good about showing unaired scenes, alternate takes and what not in their dvd releases. Offhand, the only shows that had obvious edits in their dvds were Little House on the Prairie, Roseanne, Mr. Bean and Family Matters (season 4), and they all ended up being re-done due to numerous consumer complaints with all of the edited footage being thrown back in (with LHOTP having improved audio and video to boot).

But back to the original topic, I am sort of surprised something similar didn't happen with the UM retail sets, although perhaps the reasoning for that is that the edits weren't as noticeable. Or maybe there's some Easter eggs we don't know about.

I think that given the non-episodic nature of UM, and the fact that these sets were incomplete anyway (really, they were just collections of segments as opposed to full episodes which were always a mixed bag in terms of segment genres) First Look probably figured that no one would notice or care that certain segments were edited. When it comes to little nitpick stuff like this, a missing line of dialog here or there, only us few diehards are going to really notice, and we're not the casual fan types those sets were intended for.

[dynoguy88]

Originally Posted by justins5256

In terms of the NBC edits, it's odd. Given the "constantly evolving" nature of the show (i.e., updates being added, segments being swapped around in reruns, etc.) I could see the producers either having multiple versions of the segments trimmed to fit certain time constraints, or perhaps "outtake" type footage that didn't make the original cut, but that could be added as filler if needed.

I think that's exactly the reason for the NBC edits. And if that's true, that's pretty awesome because you would never see a television program do that today. Today's programming is all centered around cramming in as many commercials as possible. That's why dramas and sitcoms no longer have theme songs and all programs have been shortened by 3-4 minutes in their 30 and 60 minute blocks...to make more room for more stupid commercials. NBC apparently said, "screw that," when they added this extra footage to their UM repeats.

[Hops3098]

Originally Posted by dynoguy88

That's why dramas and sitcoms no longer have theme songs and all programs have been shortened by 3-4 minutes in their 30 and 60 minute blocks...to make more room for more stupid commercials. NBC apparently said, "screw that," when they added this extra footage to their UM repeats.

Likewise, I remember being annoyed back in the day when Lifetime edited the UM opening sequence, cutting out the scrolling case types and Solved mashup. I know was not a huge edit as far as time and pertinence to the episode, but in terms of style, I thought the effect of music and captured criminals was a really cool part of the show.

I also suspect that Lifetime increased the frequency of Lost Love segments my my chagrin, but I definitely have no proof of that.

I don't really mean to bash Lifetime overall... despite these two personal annoyances, I think we as fans are quite lucky that Lifetime picked up the Stack version in syndication. It dramatically increased the stock of segments that survive in our collections today.