Why Are Some VHS/Betamax Off The Air Recordings Uncopyable?

[seanmc1114]

I primarily collect and trade recordings of original off-the-air TV recordings with original commercials. I have transferred a ton of material from both VHS and betamax tapes over the years and I occasionally, though very rarely, get the following message during a transfer: "Uncopyable movies, cannot record".

My setup is to use an Insignia IS-DVD1000121 DVD/VCR Recorder with either a VHS or betamax player running into it via RCA cables and the signal running out of the Insignia machine via RCA cables to a TV so I can monitor the progress.

There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason as to which shows or even stations have this problem and if it happens and I try to record the tape a second time, sometimes it will work and other times the same error message will appear though usually at a different point in the recording.

Most of these recordings are from the early to mid 80s and none are commercially released home videocassettes.

I am somewhat familiar with Macrovision protection but could such a protection system appear in an off-the-air recording? Any thoughts or suggestions?

[justins5256]

I have heard of this before. I think it has to do with abnormalities in the signal itself making the DVD recorder "think" it is seeing Macrovision. The abnormalities could have been present at the time of the original telecast and were recorded on the tape, or they could have been introduced in duplication assuming the tape is a dupe and not the original.

The only way to get around it is to use a time base corrector to rebuild the signal at broadcast specifications and capture that.

[Mace Dolex]

I use to do tape transfers of my own personal VHS recordings without a problem and occasionally would do with retail store videos, I would rent a movie and at home make a personal copy for myself.

Disney VHS videos I know were known to protect their movies which is why I would get my recordings with the picture fading in and out sometimes.

As for your problem I'm not sure what it could be.

[seanmc1114]

Originally Posted by justins5256

The only way to get around it is to use a time base corrector to rebuild the signal at broadcast specifications and capture that.

I've wondered about one of those. Any recommendations?

[justins5256]

Originally Posted by seanmc1114

I've wondered about one of those. Any recommendations?

DataVideo TBC-1000.

I've been converting since 2004 or so and never done a single conversion without it. It re-bulds the signal and softens some of the noise inherent in VHS playback. It is kinda pricey though. However, for a prosumer unit, the price isn't bad. Keep in mind, the real TBCs used by broadcasters cost thousands.

ETA: Not sure how easy they are to come by these days since analog is obsolete.

[Smilings]

Had good luck with Dimax Grex from www.xdimax.com.

[justins5256]

Originally Posted by Smilings

Had good luck with Dimax Grex from www.xdimax.com.

That looks like a video stabilizer. Those are designed primarily to defeat copy protection. I don't know that it would necessarily work with the problems the OP is describing since what he is encountering technically isn't copy protection.

[pkripper001]

Here are 2 options :
The TBC-1000 has been replaced by the TBC-5000. $800
http://www.proflixsales.com/products...facturer_id=74
New Old Stock TBC-1000
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Datavideo-TB...item3cf1d473eb

[danderson400]

i didn't have any issues when recording "On Scene: Emergency Response" or "China Beach" and back then i guess things were different in terms of recording i used T-120

[danderson400]

in fact my copies of those shows were in pristine condition for years in a bedroom attic

[seanmc1114]

I bought this Video Time Base Corrector Synchronizer Color Corrector on e-Bay and have not only had no more issues with uncopyable shows, but it definitely improves the picture quality.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/250889809126

[danderson400]

i have a question for different types of shows i used diffrent speeds is that a good idea? i used SP for "On Scene: Emergency Response" but used SLP for sports is that wrong to do?

[justins5256]

Originally Posted by danderson400

i have a question for different types of shows i used diffrent speeds is that a good idea? i used SP for "On Scene: Emergency Response" but used SLP for sports is that wrong to do?

When you recorded them originally on VHS, or in converting them to DVDR?

Recording speed was always a personal preference, so it's ultimately subjective, and I wouldn't say it was "wrong" per say. SLP mode in VHS was always the most economical and space/storage efficient option. I used SLP quite a bit back in the 1990s simply because I was a student and couldn't afford to buy tons of VHS tapes, nor did I want tons of tapes sitting around taking up living space.

On the flip side, those recordings look the worst now in terms of picture quality/clarity and they are the hardest to track when playing them back for capturing to digital mediums.

So, it's a tradeoff.

When it comes to trades, I tell people if I know the tape was recorded in SLP or LP originally, as some people don't like that.

However, I've always been of the school of thought that with some shows and movies that are so rare/unavailable, I'd rather have a lower quality copy as opposed to not having the title at all.

[danderson400]

i do remember one case when i taped the "China Beach" finale movie "Hello Goodbye" i wanted to record a discovery channel doco about the Vietnam War so i used EP for that

[danderson400]

i always taped shows in diffrent speeds sp for 30 minute or hour shows slp for sports