OT: Shedding Light on the Exorcist Case

[Cori aka ChrisSCrush]

The author of this interesting article did a lot of in-depth research that purports to explain everything. http://www.strangemag.com/exorcistpage1.html He calls into question accepted incidents such as the arm slashing episode dramatized on UM. This article does seem like great detective work, but I totally don't buy the conclusion. Far too many credible witnesses to this case claim they experienced truly paranormal events. http://www.examiner.com/article/the-...d-the-exorcist According to this author one of the chief witnesses was pretty wishy-washy about it, though. http://www.strangemag.com/halloran.html

Voila, here is one of many articles including the real name, address, and a high school yearbook photo. http://www.infobarrel.com/The_Exorci...Edwin_Hunkeler

Much more information here. (Fascinating, yes, I am sitting up half the night looking at this.) http://mikesbigblogorainydayfunexorc....blogspot.com/

So, is this Greg Holewinski a fool, a liar, or just a delusional old man? Someone's lyin'!

[wiseguy182]

I don't recall UM profiling this case. I did see it recently on the Unexplained Files, they had an interview with an elderly man who I believe was the last living clergyman connected to the case. He died before the program even aired. Not sure I would trust anything that comes out of the Examiner.

[Cori aka ChrisSCrush]

Originally Posted by wiseguy182

I don't recall UM profiling this case. I did see it recently on the Unexplained Files, they had an interview with an elderly man who I believe was the last living clergyman connected to the case. He died before the program even aired. Not sure I would trust anything that comes out of the Examiner.

Yes, I clearly remember it on UM. They had some kind of account by a priest who was talking with the boy when the boy suddenly started running wildly and the priest tackled him just before he could throw himself off a cliff. The boy had no memory of beginning to run and didn't know how he got there. They also dramatized the arm-slashing with the bedspring in the hospital. The Examiner article is just a print version of what ran on Unexplained Files, since I wanted to post a print source rather than video, but the video is online if you want to see it.

[TracyLynnS]

I only remember the Kathy exorcism segment on UM. Was this part of that segment or something different?

http://unsolvedmysteries.wikia.com/wiki/HOPE

[Cori aka ChrisSCrush]

Originally Posted by Cori aka ChrisSCrush

So, is this Greg Holewinski a fool, a liar, or just a delusional old man? Someone's lyin'!

Strange, this lengthy obituary states that he did indeed work at the right hospital, presumably at the right time, but doesn't say a thing about him being a retired Catholic monk! http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg...GRid=130731720

Troy Taylor, the author of The Devil Came to St. Louis, is the one who found Brother Hollewinske (not Holewinski). He states on a post on his Facebook page dated July 31 that he took him at his word. He remains open-minded about what happened in 1949, which he says was worth the twenty years of research he put into it. The author of the blog, Mike Madonna, emailed me that no one should be held accountable for what they say under the influence of the powerful painkillers Brother Hollewinske was taking towards the end of his life. So far I've found no further statements regarding him.

[Cori aka ChrisSCrush]

Originally Posted by TracyLynnS

I only remember the Kathy exorcism segment on UM. Was this part of that segment or something different?

http://unsolvedmysteries.wikia.com/wiki/HOPE

So far my searches are turning up only Kathy, "Ghost Boy," and Don Decker aka "Rain Boy." Somehow I managed to miss both the Kathy and Ghost Boy segments despite watching this program religiously, but I know I saw a reenactment of this which included "Robbie's" parents bringing him to see the priest in an office and Robbie cussing out the priest which scandalized his mother, Robbie running towards a cliff being stopped only when tackled by the priest, and Robbie in the hospital bed slashing the priest's arm with a bedspring. I do recall Robbie being successfully exorcised but don't remember hearing anything about St. Michael until I saw the Unexplained Files version--but I would still swear I saw this earlier version on Unsolved Mysteries!

[wiseguy182]

Originally Posted by Cori aka ChrisSCrush

So far my searches are turning up only Kathy, "Ghost Boy," and Don Decker aka "Rain Boy." Somehow I managed to miss both the Kathy and Ghost Boy segments despite watching this program religiously, but I know I saw a reenactment of this which included "Robbie's" parents bringing him to see the priest in an office and Robbie cussing out the priest which scandalized his mother, Robbie running towards a cliff being stopped only when tackled by the priest, and Robbie in the hospital bed slashing the priest's arm with a bedspring. I do recall Robbie being successfully exorcised but don't remember hearing anything about St. Michael until I saw the Unexplained Files version--but I would still swear I saw this earlier version on Unsolved Mysteries!

since you insist on having this debate, I should make the following points:

1) there are no threads in this forum about this case.
2) nothing comes up in the episode guides
3) nothing comes up on UM wiki
4) nobody has come forward to state that they have seen this segment.
5) this forum is filled with posts about people who *swear* they have seen a segment on UM, but it turns out it was another show.
6) why should we take your word for it? After all, you're pretty insistent Patsy Ramsey is guilty.

[Cori aka ChrisSCrush]

One more detail, I remember the priests asked the entity where it would leave the boy and the word "Exit" appeared on his body with an arrow. I don't recall if they actually interviewed on camera the one priest willing to openly comment about it, or merely someone who had studied the alleged events.

[Cori aka ChrisSCrush]

Never mind, I found it. I searched names at the Internet Movie Database for Walter H. Halloran, the one priest involved with the case who was willing to speak publicly, who appeared on at least three programs talking about his experiences. One of these was a documentary, In the Grip of Evil, http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0122543/?ref_=nm_flmg_slf_2, which aired on the Discovery Channel in 1997. The wound inflicted on the inexperienced young priest was from shoulder to wrist, requiring more than 100 stitches, and Father Halloran was then called in. The video is on a website which shall remain nameless, where Unsolved Mysteries clips go to die, and I viewed up to the arm-slashing scene and am satisfied this is the program I saw. You can leave this thread here or move it to the section for non-UM cases, I don't care. Just thought someone might find it of interest.

[Cori aka ChrisSCrush]

Thanks for not moving the thread. I have now labeled it "OT," which should make everything all right.

[Cori aka ChrisSCrush]

This information on The Exorcist has been available for some time, but I just discovered it thanks to a helpful post on a message board I frequent, where I asked about it after seeing the St. Louis house featured on the 100th episode of Ghost Adventures which ran on Halloween. Of course William Peter Blatty is at no fault as his work is fiction and not passed off as fact. This concerns numerous stories told about the real case. Many sources state that despite extreme efforts by fans of the book and movie, the real boy involved in the original 1949 events has never been identified. What!? They know the address, but they don’t know who lived there? What is that?

Here is the segment of Unexplained Files featuring reenactments and the actual interview with the self-proclaimed witness, whose name they spell wrong: http://www.sciencechannel.com/tv-sho...e-exorcist.htm

Photo on Mike Madonna’s Facebook page. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater This image, supplied by a classmate of the actual boy, is the only picture that has surfaced taken closest to the time of the exorcism.

Strange, this lengthy obituary of Brother Greg Hollewinske states that he did indeed work at the right hospital, presumably at the right time, but doesn't say a thing about him being a retired Catholic monk! http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg...GRid=130731720

Facebook page of Troy Taylor, author of The Devil Came to St. Louis. https://www.facebook.com/authortt He is the one who found Brother Hollewinske for his Unexplained Files appearance. He states on a post dated July 31 that he took him at his word. He remains open-minded about what happened in 1949, which he says was worth the twenty years of research he put into it. So far I've found no further statements regarding Brother Hollewinske, and would be very interested to learn of anyone who knew him and can comment one way or another on his level of involvement or lack thereof.

Further information: writeup on Reverend Luther Miles Schulze, wikibin.org/articles/luther-miles-schulze.html a Lutheran pastor who was the first clergyman to observe the boy. He wrote a lengthy article describing his observations, and, according to a 1949 newspaper article referenced here, www.strangemag.com/exorcistpage1.html gave a talk on the subject. The newspaper article describes him as laughing as he related the events and claiming he told the boy to cut the comedy. Unfortunately neither the text of the pastor's talk nor his article seem to be available online, so no checking whether what he actually said and wrote contradict the newspaper article.

Internet Movie Database page for Walter H. Halloran, the one priest documented to have participated who was willing to speak publicly. www.imdb.com/name/nm0356726/?ref_=rvi_nm This lists programs in which he appeared describing his experiences, which can then be checked for availability on sites which may happen to feature videos.

Amazon.com entry for the book The Real Story Behind the Exorcist, by Mark Opsasnick, who did the groundbreaking research on the case. http://www.amazon.com/The-Real-Story...Mark+Opsasnick Of course no one should review a book they haven’t read, but can we please give this guy some love in the comments? I commented on remarks posted about him and Reverend Luther Miles Schulze which seem unfounded to a degree bordering on slander. Several other much less well-researched books have garnered way better reviews. For those relying solely on Amazon reviews, this is extremely misleading!

I hope I am not doing a public disservice in providing this information, as personally I believe there is something to these things. I'd hate to contribute to someone saying, "Well, if the most famous case ever is this questionable, it must be fine to play with Ouija boards and so on," which IMHO it's emphatically not!

In case all this proves too much, this cracks me up every time I think of it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RifxYTpS39o When Tim Conway ad libs that she is now all good including “a little of her left knee,” you can see Bernadette Peters crack up.

Thinking about all this leaves me with a lot of questions, starting with Reverend Luther Miles Schulze. The 1949 newspaper article referenced here www.strangemag.com/exorcistpage1.html has him giving a talk making light of the events, yet an article for The Parapsychology Bulletin (August 1949, Number 14), a periodical of the New York-based Parapsychology Foundation, titled “Report Of A Poltergeist” appeared publishing his name. (I posted above saying that he wrote the article, which is incorrect—it was uncredited.) Well, why was this article published and what did it say? So, you’re an adult with a responsible community position, a child/teenager comes to your house and pulls a mischievous prank, and you go to a Parapsychology Foundation? To say what? Beware of pranksters? Without seeing this article, it would seem to me that there is more to this.

Then there are the priests. Why would people who present themselves as professionals allow themselves to be yanked around for months by a highly-strung young man staging an elaborate act? At what point would they not simply walk off, saying, “He needs help other than ours”? Who leaked this story to the press, and why did Father Halloran continue to discuss it for decades afterwards? If absolutely nothing paranormal happened, why would professional people risk their reputations by taking a non-story to the press?

As for the subject and any of his family members not wanting to discuss it, that proves absolutely nothing. If he was possessed, would they advertise it? If not, yes, they’d be embarrassed, and either way it was not their finest hour and they’d want to put it behind them. Their behavior in no way proves anything paranormal either did, or did not, happen.

Lastly, there is the mysterious matter of Brother Greg Hollewinske, a dying cleric who should be making his peace with God, coming forward and absolutely swearing he witnessed profoundly paranormal phenomena. His possible involvement bears further looking into.

I have come to no bottom line conclusion here, except that there is an awful lot of smoke for no fire. Certainly the exaggerated events did not occur as depicted in the book and movie, but it seems to me something out of the ordinary did in fact happen.

All the nonsense peddled about the Exorcist events makes me think of one of my favorite subjects, Chicago’s famous hitchhiking ghost, Resurrection Mary. Notice I say “subject,” not “story,” “myth,” or “legend.” There is just too much good evidence for the events, about which I have posted here: http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread1041302/pg1
http://www.paranormalsoup.com/forums...ection+%2Bmary
http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/...d.php?t=330240



In case all this proves too much, this cracks me up every time I think of it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RifxYTpS39o When Tim Conway ad libs that she is now all good including “a little of her left knee,” you can see Bernadette Peters crack up.

(End of my original post and beginning of the second one with afterthoughts.)

Thinking about all this leaves me with a lot of questions, starting with Reverend Luther Miles Schulze. The 1949 newspaper article referenced here www.strangemag.com/exorcistpage1.html has him giving a talk making light of the events, yet an article for The Parapsychology Bulletin (August 1949, Number 14), a periodical of the New York-based Parapsychology Foundation, titled “Report Of A Poltergeist” appeared publishing his name. (I posted before saying that he wrote the article, which is incorrect—it was uncredited.) Well, why was this article published and what did it say? So, you’re an adult with a responsible community position, a child/teenager comes to your house and pulls a mischievous prank, and you go to a Parapsychology Foundation? To say what? Beware of pranksters? Without seeing this article, it would seem to me that there is more to this.

Then there are the priests. Why would people who present themselves as professionals allow themselves to be yanked around for months by a highly-strung young man staging an elaborate act? At what point would they not simply walk off, saying, “He needs help other than ours”? Who leaked this story to the press, and why did Father Halloran continue to discuss it for decades afterwards? If absolutely nothing paranormal happened, why would professional people risk their reputations by taking a non-story to the press?

As for the subject and any of his family members not wanting to discuss it, that proves absolutely nothing. If he was possessed, would they advertise it? If not, yes, they’d be embarrassed, and either way it was not their finest hour and they’d want to put it behind them. Their behavior in no way proves anything paranormal either did, or did not, happen.

Lastly, there is the mysterious matter of Brother Greg Hollewinske, a dying cleric who should be making his peace with God, coming forward and absolutely swearing he witnessed profoundly paranormal phenomena. His possible involvement bears further looking into.

I have come to no bottom line conclusion here, except that there is an awful lot of smoke for no fire. Certainly the exaggerated events did not occur as depicted in the book and movie, but it seems to me something out of the ordinary did in fact happen.

All the nonsense peddled about the Exorcist events makes me think of one of my favorite subjects, Chicago’s famous hitchhiking ghost, Resurrection Mary. Notice I say “subject,” not “story,” “myth,” or “legend.” There is just too much good evidence for the events, about which I have posted here: http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread1041302/pg1
http://www.paranormalsoup.com/forums...ection+%2Bmary
http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/...d.php?t=330240

(Second Afterthought)

Another obituary showing that the purported witness was a distinguished and decorated hero! Hardly the sort to spout sensationalism. He came from a large family and has a brother and sister still living! http://obits.dignitymemorial.com/dig...13&mid=5991334