Carroll O’Connor Got "Tom Kelcy" Fired From 'All in the Family!'

[Brian Damage]

Tell me how you came to play Harry the bartender during seven seasons of All in the Family and then Archie Bunker’s Place.

Paul Bogart was directing All in the Family, and the very last episode of the sixth season had a scene where Edith and Archie had an argument because he wasn’t taking her out any more, and she was going out on her own that night. So where does she go? She goes to Kelcy’s, and the story doesn’t work if she’s recognized by Kelcy. So the actor who was playing Kelcy gets the week off, and they need somebody else. And Paul was instrumental in recommending me for that role. It was just a one-shot. That’s all it was supposed to be, just that one episode. So I did it. And it was a good part, too. There was some good stuff to do in that particular episode, I assume I did it very well, because after the hiatus my agent called and said, “They want you back.”

I went back, and then I discovered that I was going to be playing that part from then on. So what happened to Kelcy? In fact, the actor who was playing Kelcy, his agent kept calling that first season, saying, “When is Bob going to be back on the show?” And unfortunately, no one in authority there had the guts to tell him that Bob’s not coming back on the show. And that’s show business.

Do you have any idea why they decided to make the change and bring you back?

Yes. I think Paul told me this, because Paul was involved in the eventual hiring of me again. I think, in that conversation about it with Carroll and Norman Lear, Carroll said, “I’m so tired of Bob’s lousy jokes.” And that was that. Apparently Bob [Hastings] was a joker at work, always coming up with jokes. And Carroll O’Connor says, “I’m tired of his lousy jokes.” And that cost the man a career, and gave me another one.

So the All in the Family role was important in your career?

Tremendous. In my career and my life, it was seven years. With increasing money each season. It allowed me to retire, let me put it that way.

http://classictvhistory.wordpress.co...reen-part-two/

[Mr. Television]

Archie stifled another one. lol

[Brian Damage]

Originally Posted by Stuck In The '70's

Archie stifled another one. lol

LOL

It is amazing to me how much power O'Connor had

[Mr. Television]

Originally Posted by Brian Damage

LOL

It is amazing to me how much power O'Connor had

He was the biggest tv star of the 70's. Just like Bill Cosby had a lot of Power in the 80's. When you're the star of the #1 show on tv, what you say goes. lol

[Brian Damage]

Originally Posted by Stuck In The '70's

He was the biggest tv star of the 70's. Just like Bill Cosby had a lot of Power in the 80's. When you're the star of the #1 show on tv, what you say goes. lol

I suppose you are right, but didn't it seem that Carroll O'Connor was abusing that power? The way he got cast members fired and all?

[Mr. Television]

Originally Posted by Brian Damage

I suppose you are right, but didn't it seem that Carroll O'Connor was abusing that power? The way he got cast members fired and all?

Yea he went overboard. But then I looked at someone like Roseanne and I think she was far worse. lol Once they get the power they use it. I remember the year JR was shot on Dallas. Larry Hagman held out for more money and wouldn't report to the set. The producers even talked to some other actors like Robert Culp about replacing him but they didn't. Hagman had them over a barrel . Then when their ratings fall they lose all the power...like CBS cancelling ABP without allowing it to have a final episode.

[Brian Damage]

Originally Posted by Stuck In The '70's

Yea he went overboard. But then I looked at someone like Roseanne and I think she was far worse. lol Once they get the power they use it. I remember the year JR was shot on Dallas. Larry Hagman held out for more money and wouldn't report to the set. The producers even talked to some other actors like Robert Culp about replacing him but they didn't. Hagman had them over a barrel . Then when their ratings fall they lose all the power...like CBS cancelling ABP without allowing it to have a final episode.

Interesting about Larry Hagman, I guess he was always "difficult." Roseanne, I heard was an absolute nut job on the set and as for Carroll O'Connor, I guess you are right about that. I would like to see exactly how many cast members he got fired, so far I know of Bob Hastings (Kelcy) and James Cromwell (Stretch) lol

[Mr. Television]

Originally Posted by Brian Damage

Interesting about Larry Hagman, I guess he was always "difficult." Roseanne, I heard was an absolute nut job on the set and as for Carroll O'Connor, I guess you are right about that. I would like to see exactly how many cast members he got fired, so far I know of Bob Hastings (Kelcy) and James Cromwell (Stretch) lol

I know that Sada Thompson of Family was originally supposed to play Irene and Carroll had her fired and replaced with Betty Garrett. I imagine it was quite alot of people. lol

[Brian Damage]

Originally Posted by Stuck In The '70's

I know that Sada Thompson of Family was originally supposed to play Irene and Carroll had her fired and replaced with Betty Garrett. I imagine it was quite alot of people. lol

Do you know if Vincent Gardenia was fired too?

[Mr. Television]

Originally Posted by Brian Damage

Do you know if Vincent Gardenia was fired too?

I heard he quit but I don't know why. I remember some on here saying it was because of the size of the role or something like that but I'm not sure.

[Retro4Life]

^No offense to Gardenia, but that role was always kind of an irritating one for me.

I actually wasn't a huge fan of Irene, either. I mean, yes, it was cool to have a feminist who clashed with Archie, but really you already had Mike and Gloria for that, and I always thought it was hard to believe that Edith would be such good friends with someone who would basically come into her house and trash her husband. Yes, Mike did it too, but Mike's barbs with Archie were largely provoked by Archie, and he did try to get along with him if he could. Plus, Mike was family.

Irene on the other hand, would just come in and start insulting her friend's husband in his own house. I dunno, I just always surprised that Edith never said, "Irene, I know Archie can be a pain, but come on now, he IS my husband" or something like that.

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack this thread, lol.

It's telling about O'Connor's power, but I will say that from what I've read, his 'decisions' seemed mostly to be good ones.

[Brian Damage]

Originally Posted by Retro4Life

^No offense to Gardenia, but that role was always kind of an irritating one for me.

I actually wasn't a huge fan of Irene, either. I mean, yes, it was cool to have a feminist who clashed with Archie, but really you already had Mike and Gloria for that, and I always thought it was hard to believe that Edith would be such good friends with someone who would basically come into her house and trash her husband. Yes, Mike did it too, but Mike's barbs with Archie were largely provoked by Archie, and he did try to get along with him if he could. Plus, Mike was family.

Irene on the other hand, would just come in and start insulting her friend's husband in his own house. I dunno, I just always surprised that Edith never said, "Irene, I know Archie can be a pain, but come on now, he IS my husband" or something like that.

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack this thread, lol.

It's telling about O'Connor's power, but I will say that from what I've read, his 'decisions' seemed mostly to be good ones.

That's okay retro, nobody is hijacking this thread at all. I love discussing classic tv shows and the controversies that went with them. They really seemed to be more prevalent in the 70's than any other decade. lol

[Retro4Life]

Originally Posted by Brian Damage

That's okay retro, nobody is hijacking this thread at all. I love discussing classic tv shows and the controversies that went with them. They really seemed to be more prevalent in the 70's than any other decade. lol

IMO, Brian, that might be because in the 70's the bar was set higher. Now the sitcoms are so programmed and "safe" there really isn't much to discuss.

Thanks for understanding, btw.

[Brian Damage]

Originally Posted by Retro4Life

IMO, Brian, that might be because in the 70's the bar was set higher. Now the sitcoms are so programmed and "safe" there really isn't much to discuss.

Thanks for understanding, btw.

So true!

I guess Charlie Sheen is the closes thing now to a 1970's tv star that we have. lol

[Retro4Life]

Originally Posted by Brian Damage

So true!

I guess Charlie Sheen is the closes thing now to a 1970's tv star that we have. lol

I can't think of a 70's sitcom star that was so publicly teetering on the edge, but then again in those days the media scrutiny wasn't nearly as intense as now. The closest I can think of would be Mackenzie Phillips, but her case wasn't spun as positively because she didn't have the clout that Sheen does, plus I'm guessing the fact that she's a woman might have had something to do with it, i.e. it's "macho" and "cool" for a guy to lead a reckless lifestyle but with a woman people just shake their heads (not advocating that stance, just saying that seems to be the prevailing prejudice).