Do You Think Mickey Rooney Was A Hypocrite For Turning Down 'All In The Family?' - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

Brian Damage · 02-18-2012, 06:05 PM

Norman Lear’s first choice for the lead role in his edgy new sitcom was Mickey Rooney. He pitched the role of bigoted Archie Justice (the show was called Justice for All at the time) to “the Mick” and gave him a script to read. Rooney responded, “’Norman, they’re going to kill you in the street. They’re going to kill you dead.” He felt that such an offensive show would spell career death for anyone involved. (Even Lucille Ball commented “How can they show this on CBS?” after viewing the pilot.) Of course, All in the Family went on to not only win ratings and awards but also made a star out of the man who ultimately played Archie, Carroll O’Connor.

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Sure… Mickey Rooney was above the racism in “Family”… but not at all in “Breakfast at Tiffany’s…?!?”

Schmoopie · 02-19-2012, 01:39 AM

Wow, never knew he was up for the role, but I have to admit he was funny in Breakfast at Tiffany's. Of course, speaking as an Audrey Hepburn fanatic, I pay more attention to her role than in his.

Yong Fang · 03-11-2012, 07:36 AM

Two things,

Rooney is or thought himself to be a super A List actor. Rooney was a bit before my time, but he had been in film for 30 plus years before 1971, and probably thought television was beneath him. Rooney is probably the last surviving member of the "Golden Age" of film from the 1930's and 40's, who eschewed television in general as a step down.

Also, Rooney did not like the content of the show. I think he wanted to be seen as "nice", who wanted to do family films and stuff like that. He did not want to play "against type" so to speak. Rooney wanted the public to know him as a late 1930's teenager doing barn dances with Judy Garland and not some old racist fart on a sitcom.

The show itself because of the content was a gamble. This is another reason why Rooney passed. If the show failed, then Rooney's career (in his mind) would probably be finished. Did he kick himself in the ass when AITF was a hit? Probably did. However, for him, he was still an established star of note who was still working and in demand.

Carroll O'Connor was a stage and minor movie character actor, mostly playing heavies, cops and whatnot before AITF. Not a star by any note and someone that few people had ever heard of before 1971. He was living and working in Rome and made a deal with Norman Lear that when the show flopped, Lear paid for his ticket back to Italy. This did not happen, and the rest is history.

tdr · 03-19-2012, 05:04 PM

A hypocrite? No. No one will ever know for sure how it would have changed his career if he had accepted the role of Archie. But Carroll O'Connor was not a well-known star at the time, and there may have been quite difference between this show making a star out of an actor and capitalizing on the previous status of a star. Regardlelss, the fact that an (any) actor chooses not to accept an offered role because of his prognostication of how such a project may be perceived is not hypocrisy. If he had another reason entirely for not accepting it, that might be hypocrisy.

Johnny be good! · 03-25-2012, 10:58 AM

Carroll's fame skyrocketed after all this.

LittleRickyII · 04-02-2012, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yong Fang

Two things,

Rooney is or thought himself to be a super A List actor. Rooney was a bit before my time,

Before your time? Mickey Rooney isn't before anyone's time! He's still a very busy actor, most recently appearing in the new Muppet Movie.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yong Fang

but he had been in film for 30 plus years before 1971, and probably thought television was beneath him.

No, he didn't think television was beneath him. He had made many guest appearances on TV shows throughout the '50s and '60s, and even starred in his own sitcom in 1964.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yong Fang

The show itself because of the content was a gamble. This is another reason why Rooney passed. If the show failed, then Rooney's career (in his mind) would probably be finished.

This, I agree with. There had never been anything like All in the Family on TV before, and there was no reason to think something so daring would not bomb big time. It was bound to offend people (and it did) and it could have been career suicide for an established actor people had grown up with, who was known for family fare.

Mr. Television · 04-02-2012, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LittleRickyII

Before your time? Mickey Rooney isn't before anyone's time! He's still a very busy actor, most recently appearing in the new Muppet Movie.

No, he didn't think television was beneath him. He had made many guest appearances on TV shows throughout the '50s and '60s, and even starred in his own sitcom in 1964.

This, I agree with. There had never been anything like All in the Family on TV before, and there was no reason to think something so daring would not bomb big time. It was bound to offend people (and it did) and it could have been career suicide for an established actor people had grown up with, who was known for family fare.

He also starred in his own sitcom in the 1950's.

Yea I agree with you about it possibly being career suicide for an established actor. Nobody knew at the time that AITF would take off like that. Carroll O'Connor was not as well known so the risk wasn't as great. As it was, it made him a star.

LittleRickyII · 04-02-2012, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuck In The '70's

He also starred in his own sitcom in the 1950's.

I didn't know that. So two sitcoms under his belt before All in the Family. He also starred in a couple in the '80s and '90s. I specifically remember seeing him in One of Boys, in which he co-starred with Dana Carvey and Nathan Lane (before we knew who they were).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuck In The '70's

Yea I agree with you about it possibly being career suicide for an established actor. Nobody knew at the time that AITF would take off like that. Carroll O'Connor was not as well known so the risk wasn't as great.

Yep!

Hughsgirl · 04-04-2012, 11:28 AM

I wouldn't call him a hypocrite at all. Obviously the role wasn't for him and I have to thank him for turning it down because I'm convinced there was only one Archie Bunker and that was Carroll O'Connor. Had it not been for him, I don't think it would have lasted as long as it did. Now, this is just my opinion, but a strong one.

lucyandethel · 04-10-2012, 04:30 PM

Mickey Rooney as Archie Bunker????? OMG!!! Wrong, Wrong, Wrong!

This reminds of a story of when producer David Selznick asked Margaret Mitchell who she wanted to play Rhett Butler in the movie based on her book, "Gone with the Wind". She said: Groucho Marx.

Some people just should not be involved in casting!

02-18-2012, 06:05 PM	#1
Brian Damage I'm Rich Bitch Forum Icon Join Date: Feb 03, 2002 Location: What Ain't No Country I Ever Heard Of...They Speak English in What? Posts: 63,107	Do You Think Mickey Rooney Was A Hypocrite For Turning Down 'All In The Family?' Norman Lear’s first choice for the lead role in his edgy new sitcom was Mickey Rooney. He pitched the role of bigoted Archie Justice (the show was called Justice for All at the time) to “the Mick” and gave him a script to read. Rooney responded, “’Norman, they’re going to kill you in the street. They’re going to kill you dead.” He felt that such an offensive show would spell career death for anyone involved. (Even Lucille Ball commented “How can they show this on CBS?” after viewing the pilot.) Of course, All in the Family went on to not only win ratings and awards but also made a star out of the man who ultimately played Archie, Carroll O’Connor. Read the full text here: http://www.mentalfloss.com/blogs/arc...#ixzz1mm1Nv7gH --brought to you by mental_floss! Sure… Mickey Rooney was above the racism in “Family”… but not at all in “Breakfast at Tiffany’s…?!?”
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02-19-2012, 01:39 AM	#2
Schmoopie Keep Calm and Love Snoopy Forum Star Join Date: Jul 13, 2008 Location: Lynnwood, Washington Posts: 15,697	Wow, never knew he was up for the role, but I have to admit he was funny in Breakfast at Tiffany's. Of course, speaking as an Audrey Hepburn fanatic, I pay more attention to her role than in his.
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03-25-2012, 10:58 AM	#5
Johnny be good! Member Senior Member Join Date: Feb 18, 2007 Location: Westland, Michigan Posts: 1,633	Carroll's fame skyrocketed after all this.
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03-11-2012, 07:36 AM	#3
Yong Fang Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 04, 2009 Location: Memphis Tennessee Posts: 3,073	Two things, Rooney is or thought himself to be a super A List actor. Rooney was a bit before my time, but he had been in film for 30 plus years before 1971, and probably thought television was beneath him. Rooney is probably the last surviving member of the "Golden Age" of film from the 1930's and 40's, who eschewed television in general as a step down. Also, Rooney did not like the content of the show. I think he wanted to be seen as "nice", who wanted to do family films and stuff like that. He did not want to play "against type" so to speak. Rooney wanted the public to know him as a late 1930's teenager doing barn dances with Judy Garland and not some old racist fart on a sitcom. The show itself because of the content was a gamble. This is another reason why Rooney passed. If the show failed, then Rooney's career (in his mind) would probably be finished. Did he kick himself in the ass when AITF was a hit? Probably did. However, for him, he was still an established star of note who was still working and in demand. Carroll O'Connor was a stage and minor movie character actor, mostly playing heavies, cops and whatnot before AITF. Not a star by any note and someone that few people had ever heard of before 1971. He was living and working in Rome and made a deal with Norman Lear that when the show flopped, Lear paid for his ticket back to Italy. This did not happen, and the rest is history.

03-19-2012, 05:04 PM	#4
tdr Member Senior Member Join Date: Mar 23, 2001 Posts: 1,454	A hypocrite? No. No one will ever know for sure how it would have changed his career if he had accepted the role of Archie. But Carroll O'Connor was not a well-known star at the time, and there may have been quite difference between this show making a star out of an actor and capitalizing on the previous status of a star. Regardlelss, the fact that an (any) actor chooses not to accept an offered role because of his prognostication of how such a project may be perceived is not hypocrisy. If he had another reason entirely for not accepting it, that might be hypocrisy.

04-04-2012, 11:28 AM	#9
Hughsgirl Member Forum Regular Join Date: Sep 22, 2008 Location: Michigan Posts: 804	I wouldn't call him a hypocrite at all. Obviously the role wasn't for him and I have to thank him for turning it down because I'm convinced there was only one Archie Bunker and that was Carroll O'Connor. Had it not been for him, I don't think it would have lasted as long as it did. Now, this is just my opinion, but a strong one.

04-10-2012, 04:30 PM	#10
lucyandethel Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Dec 18, 2009 Location: Los Angeles CA Posts: 435	Mickey Rooney as Archie Bunker????? OMG!!! Wrong, Wrong, Wrong! This reminds of a story of when producer David Selznick asked Margaret Mitchell who she wanted to play Rhett Butler in the movie based on her book, "Gone with the Wind". She said: Groucho Marx. Some people just should not be involved in casting!