Gabe Kaplan Or James Komack? Who Ruined Welcome Back Kotter? Take A Side? - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

Brian Damage · 01-15-2011, 09:33 PM

Gabe Kaplan wanted the show to remain a straight up comedy, while James Komack wanted to make the show more into a dramedy. What would you have perferred seeing more? Whose side would you take in their bitter battle? Who really ruined "WBK?"

catlover79 · 01-15-2011, 10:19 PM

I gotta take Gabe's side on this one. Though I think the loss of John Travolta would've helped sink the show either way.

Marvo301 · 01-15-2011, 10:24 PM

James Komack killed the show. Kaplan created all the characters (originally for his stand-up act) and had a vision for the direction the series should take. Komack as the producer pulled rank and took the series in a different direction. Not only did he ruin the show but he caused Kaplan to be absent from almost all of the season three episodes.

dakert · 01-15-2011, 11:26 PM

I am ready for season 2 on DVD!!! It has been so long since I have watched seasons 2-4 that I dont remember much about them. I will always remember season 4 with John Travolta working as an orderly "I am so confused" hahahaha and something like

Mr Kotter: Vinnie if you just wanted to be an orderly you didnt even have to go to school.

Vinnie: Now you tell me

catlover79 · 01-16-2011, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marvo301

Not only did he ruin the show but he caused Kaplan to be absent from almost all of the season three episodes.

I thought it was the Season 4 episodes.

Marvo301 · 01-16-2011, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by catlover79

I thought it was the Season 4 episodes.

You're right it was the 4th season that Kaplan was absent from most of the episodes.

Dr. Thong · 01-16-2011, 11:17 AM

Kaplan had a plan for season four involving Kotter and the Sweathogs migrating to a community college. I'm sure in the grand sitcom tradition, Woodman would have ended up there as well.

They were starting to look too old for high school students and this would have given the show at least four more years -- possibly more, as it would have taken them forever to get a degree.

I think Kaplan being there would have helped the fourth season, because the void created by his and Travolta's departures really hurt the show. When you build a show around a group of characters and two of the five leave, it really upsets the chemistry.

catlover79 · 01-16-2011, 10:08 PM

^ I agree with that, though I think they all looked to old to be high school kids from day one!

Dr. Thong · 01-17-2011, 09:54 AM

Monika, you think they were old, just watch the movie Grease. Stockard Channing (Rizzo) was 35 playing a teenager. She was nearly old enough to be Rizzo's mother!!

spunkygirl · 01-17-2011, 10:33 AM

You don't mess with what works, so I blame James Komack. The loss of John Travolta was the key that killed it overall though

catlover79 · 01-17-2011, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Thong

Monika, you think they were old, just watch the movie Grease. Stockard Channing (Rizzo) was 35 playing a teenager. She was nearly old enough to be Rizzo's mother!!

Not to mention Olivia Newton-John was pushing 30. I think the only cast members who were still teenagers at the time of filming were Dinah Manoff (Marty) and Lorenzo Lamas (Tom).

catlover79 · 01-17-2011, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragonflies

You don't mess with what works, so I blame James Komack. The loss of John Travolta was the key that killed it overall though

Agreed.

Dr. Thong · 01-17-2011, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by catlover79

Not to mention Olivia Newton-John was pushing 30. I think the only cast members who were still teenagers at the time of filming were Dinah Manoff (Marty) and Lorenzo Lamas (Tom).

I just read that Gabrielle Carteris from Beverly Hills 90210 just turned 50, which means she was 30 while playing a teenager.

catlover79 · 01-17-2011, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Thong

I just read that Gabrielle Carteris from Beverly Hills 90210 just turned 50, which means she was 30 while playing a teenager.

Yup, I remember that!!!

biffbronson · 01-17-2011, 04:32 PM

There are some who also point to Komack for the demise of The Courtship of Eddie's Father, particularly how Season 3 was not up to the standards of the first two seasons of that series. I'm sure there's plenty of blame to go around in that case, but I'm thankful for The Komack Co. overall or the series may have never existed. Bixby/Komack friction may have been very different, but to later have Kaplan/Komack conflict reveals Komack tended to stand his ground.

I wonder as far as Welcome Back Kotter, it was James' propensity to want to explore social issues that prompted him to drift towards dramedy eventually? On Courtship there were several episodes dwelling on women's liberation, interracial dating, U.S./Russia politics, etc. Maybe it was just in Komack's nature to want to get into that kind of stuff -- and the college setting would have leant itself.

01-15-2011, 09:33 PM	#1
Brian Damage I'm Rich Bitch Forum Icon Join Date: Feb 03, 2002 Location: What Ain't No Country I Ever Heard Of...They Speak English in What? Posts: 63,107	Gabe Kaplan Or James Komack? Who Ruined Welcome Back Kotter? Take A Side? Gabe Kaplan wanted the show to remain a straight up comedy, while James Komack wanted to make the show more into a dramedy. What would you have perferred seeing more? Whose side would you take in their bitter battle? Who really ruined "WBK?"
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01-15-2011, 10:19 PM	#2
catlover79 God Bless Val Forum Addict Join Date: May 29, 2006 Location: Bewitched in Ohio Posts: 70,376	I gotta take Gabe's side on this one. Though I think the loss of John Travolta would've helped sink the show either way.
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01-15-2011, 10:24 PM	#3
Marvo301 I'm NOT a Blockhead! Forum Celebrity Join Date: May 17, 2002 Location: The Great White North Posts: 21,453	James Komack killed the show. Kaplan created all the characters (originally for his stand-up act) and had a vision for the direction the series should take. Komack as the producer pulled rank and took the series in a different direction. Not only did he ruin the show but he caused Kaplan to be absent from almost all of the season three episodes.
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01-16-2011, 11:17 AM	#7
Dr. Thong a/k/a "ACK!" Forum Veteran Join Date: Jul 10, 2001 Location: New Hampshire, USA Posts: 5,546	Kaplan had a plan for season four involving Kotter and the Sweathogs migrating to a community college. I'm sure in the grand sitcom tradition, Woodman would have ended up there as well. They were starting to look too old for high school students and this would have given the show at least four more years -- possibly more, as it would have taken them forever to get a degree. I think Kaplan being there would have helped the fourth season, because the void created by his and Travolta's departures really hurt the show. When you build a show around a group of characters and two of the five leave, it really upsets the chemistry.
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01-17-2011, 04:32 PM	#15
biffbronson Sentimental Fool Forum Star Join Date: Aug 22, 2009 Location: Near Notre Dame Posts: 10,493	There are some who also point to Komack for the demise of The Courtship of Eddie's Father, particularly how Season 3 was not up to the standards of the first two seasons of that series. I'm sure there's plenty of blame to go around in that case, but I'm thankful for The Komack Co. overall or the series may have never existed. Bixby/Komack friction may have been very different, but to later have Kaplan/Komack conflict reveals Komack tended to stand his ground. I wonder as far as Welcome Back Kotter, it was James' propensity to want to explore social issues that prompted him to drift towards dramedy eventually? On Courtship there were several episodes dwelling on women's liberation, interracial dating, U.S./Russia politics, etc. Maybe it was just in Komack's nature to want to get into that kind of stuff -- and the college setting would have leant itself.
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01-15-2011, 11:26 PM	#4
dakert Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: May 10, 2007 Location: Altoona PA Posts: 3,411	I am ready for season 2 on DVD!!! It has been so long since I have watched seasons 2-4 that I dont remember much about them. I will always remember season 4 with John Travolta working as an orderly "I am so confused" hahahaha and something like Mr Kotter: Vinnie if you just wanted to be an orderly you didnt even have to go to school. Vinnie: Now you tell me

01-16-2011, 10:08 PM	#8
catlover79 God Bless Val Forum Addict Join Date: May 29, 2006 Location: Bewitched in Ohio Posts: 70,376	^ I agree with that, though I think they all looked to old to be high school kids from day one!

01-17-2011, 09:54 AM	#9
Dr. Thong a/k/a "ACK!" Forum Veteran Join Date: Jul 10, 2001 Location: New Hampshire, USA Posts: 5,546	Monika, you think they were old, just watch the movie Grease. Stockard Channing (Rizzo) was 35 playing a teenager. She was nearly old enough to be Rizzo's mother!!

01-17-2011, 10:33 AM	#10
spunkygirl Member Moderator Forum Celebrity Join Date: Apr 26, 2003 Posts: 21,563	You don't mess with what works, so I blame James Komack. The loss of John Travolta was the key that killed it overall though