'Bewitched' Was A Sitcom About A Witch Married to A Bigot!? HUH???

[Brian Damage]

The show's overriding plot line showed Samantha, a witch, trying to hide her identity as such - because her husband said so, rather than embracing her for who

she was. Underneath the hi-jinks and one-liners about Samantha's meddling mother, Endora, it was a show that glamorized the subordination of one's identity to her husband's preferences. Ouch.

http://www.associatedcontent.com/art...g2.html?cat=41

[DemandYourPickle]

That is a very funny picture of him! But for the last time...

HE is NOT a BIGOT.

[Rezny@gmail.com]

He was no bigot.

[cleverfun3000]

I agree. Darren wasn't a bigot or anything even remotely similar to it. He just wanted to live as normal a life as possible with the woman he loved that happened to be a witch.

[biffbronson]

Originally Posted by Brian Damage

Underneath the hi-jinks and one-liners about Samantha's meddling mother, Endora, it was a show that glamorized the subordination of one's identity to her husband's preferences. Ouch.

I've noticed that with this thread and a new one on the I Dream of Jeannie board, you seem to be trying to put a 21st century, politically correct spin on some of the most beloved shows in TV history. I don't think you're trying to antagonize fans, but that's what you're doing to me...!

I suspect you're trying to be controversial to stimulate conversation. Was The Beverly Hillbillies all about wild, miserly bank presidents with obvious toupees? Was Perry Mason about an in-the-closet homosexual attorney? I mean IMO it gets RIDICULOUS when you try to read way to much into fairly simple and innocent shows.

Maybe the very high divorce rate we have today should be telling us something. At least Sam and Jeannie had good relationships and there was a ton of LOVE. I think that's better than splitting and leaving children with one parent, or the out-of-wedlock birthrate which now exceeds 70% for some groups.

Maybe the sensibilities of the '60s and early '70s weren't all that great. Maybe we have come a long way. But I don't think these shows deserve to be pigeon-holed as male-domination or female submission. Sorry, but this type of thread ruins my appreciation of the work of some of my favorite actors.

[MickeyMac]

There were no bigots on the show, not even Endorra. Sure she thought witches were superior to mortals, but Darrin's dad always charmed her.

[Retro4Life]

Originally Posted by biffbronson

I've noticed that with this thread and a new one on the I Dream of Jeannie board, you seem to be trying to put a 21st century, politically correct spin on some of the most beloved shows in TV history. I don't think you're trying to antagonize fans, but that's what you're doing to me...!

I suspect you're trying to be controversial to stimulate conversation. Was The Beverly Hillbillies all about wild, miserly bank presidents with obvious toupees? Was Perry Mason about an in-the-closet homosexual attorney? I mean IMO it gets RIDICULOUS when you try to read way to much into fairly simple and innocent shows.

Maybe the very high divorce rate we have today should be telling us something. At least Sam and Jeannie had good relationships and there was a ton of LOVE. I think that's better than splitting and leaving children with one parent, or the out-of-wedlock birthrate which now exceeds 70% for some groups.

Maybe the sensibilities of the '60s and early '70s weren't all that great. Maybe we have come a long way. But I don't think these shows deserve to be pigeon-holed as male-domination or female submission. Sorry, but this type of thread ruins my appreciation of the work of some of my favorite actors.

Well, let's be fair here. These are articles that Brian is posting here, he's not writing them. He's just trying to stimulate discussion; I don't think he's implicitly agreeing with the assertions of any of these articles.

[DemandYourPickle]

Originally Posted by Retro4Life

Well, let's be fair here. These are articles that Brian is posting here, he's not writing them. He's just trying to stimulate discussion; I don't think he's implicitly agreeing with the assertions of any of these articles.

Oh. Well, still--he's not a bigot. He's anything but bigoted.

[catlover79]

Originally Posted by cleverfun3000

I agree. Darren wasn't a bigot or anything even remotely similar to it. He just wanted to live as normal a life as possible with the woman he loved that happened to be a witch.

Exactly!!! He didn't want Sam to use her powers because he was afraid someone would see it and take her away from him. Dick York said as much himself in the book Bewitched Forever.

[biffbronson]

Edit-- please see below. I now see that Brian Damage was not using quotation marks.

Originally Posted by Retro4Life

Well, let's be fair here. These are articles that Brian is posting here, he's not writing them. He's just trying to stimulate discussion; I don't think he's implicitly agreeing with the assertions of any of these articles.

I didn't even read the article -- I was responding to what he wrote, "it was a show that glamorized the subordination of one's identity to her husband's preferences. Ouch." Sorry, but if he doesn't necessarily agree with that, he should have been more clear when he posted.

I had just read his post on the I Dream of Jeannie board where he stated he gnashed his teeth when viewing Tony Nelson's treatment of Jeannie. That was his own viewing he wrote about as far as I can tell -- he related his own views. From that as well, there's a lot of implied agreement that Samantha was mistreated. As far as being fair, how can we separate what Brian Damage has posted -- in his own words and not quoted from elsewhere -- from what he believes, meaning is it fair to us when we get bombarded with material that seems to implicitly agree with the flaws of these old series?

This whole thing follows a trend of looking back at series and picking apart the creators' work, whether it was Sherwood Schwartz' "and the rest" credits on the opening of Gilligan's Island or the merits of cheaply done kids' animation spin-off series. I don't necessarily want him to agree with me on anything and everything, but I do expect to have some separation between his opinions and those of others -- even if his recent viewing resulted in teeth gnashing!

Edit: Here (below) is what I've now posted on the Jeannie board -- sorry, my apologies.

I now see that you were quoting an outspoken feminist named Shayna Leah. Please use quotation marks in the future -- I was having trouble linking to the article and didn't know that you quoted from it directly. Sorry for the confusion -- my apologies. Personally I think the author is a revisionist screwball.

[DemandYourPickle]

Originally Posted by catlover79

Exactly!!! He didn't want Sam to use her powers because he was afraid someone would see it and take her away from him. Dick York said as much himself in the book Bewitched Forever.

That's right. And he only gets mad at her when she does it anyway. Like he says all the time, if you use magic once, you're going to use it again. So he tries to keep her from using magic as much as he can, he reprimands her even if he thinks she used it at all, because he doesn't want his wife or daughter hurt. I think it's sweet.

[OH Nuts!]

I don't think Darrin was bigoted as much as flustered by all the hijinks of Sam's very zany family. Like someone said, I think most of his unease may have been his fear of somehow losing Sam if too much got out.

As for Endora I think she was VERRRY COOL. Considered how easily she could have squished Darrin like a bug SHE was pretty darn tolerant. And when she did put a spell on him they were rather mild considering her powers.

[Bonsai]

I agree that Darrin was NOT a bigot. Most of the reasons he gave for discouraging witchcraft were, on the whole, understandable.

The biggest reason was that he wanted to make his own way, feel like his accomplishments were really his own----not just because he was married to someone who could give him ANYTHING for the asking...

Another reason was that (as already stated in this thread) if Sam was found out, it would cause no end of unsolvable trouble for them in the mortal world.......as was so plainly shown in the episode where Sam makes Darrin have a dream about what it would be like if they told the world....Darrin's horror and grief as Sam and Tabitha were taken into military custody pretty much says it all...

and, last, but not least, the "real world" reason----you can't write a television show with sufficient tension, conflict, or entertainment for very many episodes without the husband-doesn't-want-her-to-do-it plot element.

Having said all that, though-----I always felt that Darrin should have at least had patience with Sam doing things that had EVERYTHING to do with family and cultural obligations and NOTHING to do with benefitting them materially or letting the secret out...

[BewitchedFan]

Originally Posted by Brian Damage

The show's overriding plot line showed Samantha, a witch, trying to hide her identity as such - because her husband said so, rather than embracing her for who

Trying to hide her identity because Darrin said so????

First of all, Darrin was the reason for Samantha not using witchcraft....he is NOT the reason for her hiding her identity. Samantha revealing herself as a witch to mortals is dangerous and is absolutely forbidden by the witches council.

[catlover79]

^ That's right, and in the pilot, Sam herself said she wasn't going to do any more witchcraft for Darrin's sake.