Is the US sitcom really dead? - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

waichingliu81 · 06-04-2007, 03:10 PM

How America stopped laughing

For more than two decades the US sitcom has reigned supreme. But the genre is suddenly out of favour with the networks. And the culprit? Those cheap British reality shows

Caryn Mandabach
Monday June 4, 2007
The Guardian

Twenty-two years ago, just before a pilot of The Cosby Show was screened at the New York "upfronts" (the annual dog and pony act that US television puts on for ad buyers), many critics were confidently declaring American television comedy to be dead. Pleasant procedural cop shows such as Magnum, P.I. and Simon & Simon dominated the ad-supported, lily-white airwaves, and there was not a single comedy in the top 40 programmes.

The argument was that character comedy, which had its roots in 1930s radio plays, simply was not relevant to a modern television audience. Though the network bosses hoped the jeremiahs were wrong - after all, the network with the number one comedy was always the number one network - then, as now, no one in power rushed to defend the genre. In fact, comedy has always been viewed as television's bright but embarrassing stepchild, skulking in the corner and licking the leftovers from other people's plates.

All that changed when, a few years later, The Cosby Show started to make money. Big money, especially for the independent production company that owned it. Bigger money than all the networks combined were pulling in from their in-house shows. Suddenly, everybody wanted in. The Cosby Show made so much money for its owners that in 1996 the networks successfully lobbied the Clinton administration to change the law to allow them to own 100% of the programmes they broadcast. Now, the vertically integrated big media companies commission 85% of their shows in-house, the independents have almost been driven out of business, and not a single comedy money-spinner has been developed for nearly a decade.

Still, we in the creative community live with the illusion of accomplishment. American writers churn out an average 200 comedy scripts a year (each paid, on average, $100,000) to get 50 produced pilots (average cost, $2 million each) to get (approximately) 10 new series (average cost, $20 million each) to, hopefully, get one new (fingers crossed) hit. As they say in Hollywood, we're talking real money here. Yet not since Will & Grace and That Seventies Show premiered within a few weeks of each other nearly nine years ago has anything even raised a pulse in American syndication markets. Sure, there's been the odd hit, or something off HBO, but, for the most part, network television comedy doesn't seem to be connecting with the audiences in that nice (kerching!) way anymore. So, apart from the colossal financial waste, what is going on?

First, reality television (thanks, Britain!) is cheap, and, though it doesn't repeat well, it consistently occupies at least a third of any schedule. In fact, the buys this year reflect a decrease not only in narrative comedy, but in scripted programming in general. It's just no fun owning this kind of stuff when DVD sales are flattening out, repeats are not delivering, and international buyers are not keen.

In addition, the networks have picked up quite a few spin-offs of existing dramas this year, thus cutting costs by doubling up on writing and production staff, and reducing the need for new ideas.

On top of all that, the smart money is betting there will be a Writers Guild of America strike in October, which is not funny for the networks, and for which they are preparing by arming themselves with increasing amounts of "reality".

Second, television is a middle-aged medium that has almost given up on providing scripted stuff for the kids, who have registered the lack of interest and gone elsewhere for their giggles. So the audience is not renewing itself. Third, even older viewers know how to use their DVD recorders, so why would anyone pay attention to network schedules anyway?

The networks' thinking goes like this. "Things aren't looking good for us. We need to find a way to make more money, pronto. Those scripted comedies are costing too much to produce. No one agrees on what's funny anyway - even our cool niche cable channels can't seem to come up with any winners. The syndication market sucks, we're spending our own money on you, dammit, and we've tried and tried but nothing's worked, and we're frustrated after eight years of this ****, and wipe those crumbs off your chin you stupid idiot!"

So, all you Brit comedy writers, the next time you whinge about how the BBC, ITV, Channel 4 or any other UK network deals with your scripts - how they mis-schedule them, how they never get back to you, how they give you inscrutable notes when they finally do - just remember that you may go through some rough patches, but you are also loved, appreciated, and sometimes even well paid.

· Caryn Mandabach produced The Cosby Show and Roseanne. She has a first-look deal with the BBC

i saw this article on a UK newspaper website 'The Guardian' and i was wondering whether what she has written rings true, according to you. the state of tv is so sad to see nowadays. is the sitcom really dead in the water? what advice would you give to up and coming sitcom writers and what would you say to the current ones that are around today?

JulieSomoski · 06-04-2007, 03:43 PM

Wow, that was perfectly put. There has not been a really successful sitcom since The Cosby Show and Roseanne. These 2 shows were really funny, and kept us glued to the telelvision for years. Ever since The Cosby Show went off the air, TV has become stale, especially sitcoms. Many have tried. Friends and Seinfeld were probably the 2 most successful left, yet they were nothing compared to the Cosby Show.

Now, in my opinion, sitcoms right now are dead. You can't find a good sitcom these days even on TV Land. But, if a good sitcom were to come around, then everybody would watch. But, ther is no good sitcom these days. So, I voted that there is still hope, yet currently, they are dead.

waichingliu81 · 06-04-2007, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roseanne88-97

Wow, that was perfectly put. There has not been a really successful sitcom since The Cosby Show and Roseanne. These 2 shows were really funny, and kept us glued to the telelvision for years. Ever since The Cosby Show went off the air, TV has become stale, especially sitcoms. Many have tried. Friends and Seinfeld were probably the 2 most successful left, yet they were nothing compared to the Cosby Show.

Now, in my opinion, sitcoms right now are dead. You can't find a good sitcom these days even on TV Land. But, if a good sitcom were to come around, then everybody would watch. But, ther is no good sitcom these days. So, I voted that there is still hope, yet currently, they are dead.

actually, i didn't say all that- it's just that i noticed this article in a newspaper on the internet and thought this would make for an interesting post. anyway back to your comments, i find that what you have posted here is interesting. personally i would blame the current upsurge in reality tv and the increase in these shows for the decline in sitcoms

mraw · 06-04-2007, 03:52 PM

Home Improvement was the last sitcom to really make me laugh out loud. I think that most sictoms today are based more within reality, and that makes them less funny (save for a few good one-liners). Several sitcoms are quite entertaining to me, just not lol funny.

blue4t · 06-04-2007, 03:53 PM

I really hope the sitcom is not dead. I think it just needs to be revamped. What current sitcoms are popular shows in the US? Scrubs is popular right now among people my age. I think there are some sitcoms that are popular or maybe semi-popular like Two and a Half Men and My Name is Earl. Apart from that there's really nothing. Part of it is there are so many reality shows out there, but I think another part is that creators/writers are trying too hard to copy other popular, long lasting sitcoms. When Friends was nearing it's end, there were tons (at least to me) shows popping up about a group of 20something friends trying to make it in the world (and most of the time, being paired up). Originality is key here. It is hard because a lot of ideas have already been used. Its OK to reuse an idea, it just has to be made so that it is uniquely separate from everything else.

waichingliu81 · 06-04-2007, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue4t

I really hope the sitcom is not dead. I think it just needs to be revamped. What current sitcoms are popular shows in the US? Scrubs is popular right now among people my age. I think there are some sitcoms that are popular or maybe semi-popular like Two and a Half Men and My Name is Earl. Apart from that there's really nothing. Part of it is there are so many reality shows out there, but I think another part is that creators/writers are trying too hard to copy other popular, long lasting sitcoms. When Friends was nearing it's end, there were tons (at least to me) shows popping up about a group of 20something friends trying to make it in the world (and most of the time, being paired up). Originality is key here. It is hard because a lot of ideas have already been used. Its OK to reuse an idea, it just has to be made so that it is uniquely separate from everything else.

yeah, the sitcom genre has become stale and it needs an injection of not just originality but also new and inventive storylines, themes, characters, plot ideas etc. i don't know whether you'd call ugly betty a 'sitcom' but it has done well for itself and thus, it has sitcom elements encompassed within it

Justafan65 · 06-04-2007, 05:03 PM

I would say that the last sitcom that made me laugh out loud was Still Standing. I think it was highly under-rated. Loved Seinfeld, Cosby, Cheers, Frasier and According to Jim too. I must say, I read a lot of scripts and not many make me laugh out loud. It's hard enough to do that when I am watching a show but to read something and actually lol is a challenge. I did just that several times on a pilot I read this spriing. Unfortunately, it didn't get picked up but I hope that isn't a continued sign that the networks think we need to be "told" when to laugh by showing us uncreative and silly humor (ie Cavemen?) and instead will allow us to see the humor in shows that we can all relate to by finding the humor in real life situations.

comedyfreak · 06-04-2007, 05:13 PM

I think the traditional sitcom is dead, there's nothing out there that is really funny anymore. Of the new shows I like How I Met Your Mother and Adventures of Old Christine.

waichingliu81 · 06-04-2007, 05:25 PM

it is why i watch the classic sitcoms of yesteryear, as opposed to the current ones. it's as if nobody in tv land in the US care about this genre as much as they should. they are letting it rot into a corpse, whilst at the same time, they have stiffled the production of sitcoms by allowing reality tv shows to dominate the tv schedules now and then. it's a very sad situation for us sitcom fanatics to see this genre being neglected, all in favour of 'voyeuristic tv' where the concept of being looked at has gone as far as watching former a-list celebs reclaim their past glories and where people's real lives are- due to their exploits on screen- being cheapened to the extreme

EmoJoe · 06-04-2007, 05:51 PM

if we're only counting the "traditional" sitcoms (ie with a laugh track, multi-camera...ect), then yes, i think it is dead. those type of shows just aren't popular anymore...the "typical" sitcoms, with the big family and kids and blah blah blah. those type of shows IMO are dead and buried - and it's understandable, how many times can you watch those type of shows without it getting old?

if we're counting single-camera sitcoms though (ie Scrubs, 30 Rock, The Office). then i say no..they aren't the "traditional" sitcom, but i think those types of shows are the new sitcom, and people need to reliaze that and try and accept them. those type of shows are really popular with my age group and i think they are the new generation of sitcoms. if people actually watched them and gave them a chance instead of whining about how they don't have a laugh track and aren't "traditional" then maybe they will become MORE then semi-hits.

just my thoughts.

waichingliu81 · 06-04-2007, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe®

if we're only counting the "traditional" sitcoms (ie with a laugh track, multi-camera...ect), then yes, i think it is dead. those type of shows just aren't popular anymore...the "typical" sitcoms, with the big family and kids and blah blah blah. those type of shows IMO are dead and buried - and it's understandable, how many times can you watch those type of shows without it getting old?

if we're counting single-camera sitcoms though (ie Scrubs, 30 Rock, The Office). then i say no..they aren't the "traditional" sitcom, but i think those types of shows are the new sitcom, and people need to reliaze that and try and accept them. those type of shows are really popular with my age group and i think they are the new generation of sitcoms. if people actually watched them and gave them a chance instead of whining about how they don't have a laugh track and aren't "traditional" then maybe they will become MORE then semi-hits.

just my thoughts.

what you have posted here joe is great. though i am more of a fan of the multi-camera, laughter track- type of sitcoms, although everybody hates chris and ugly betty are shows that i love watching- and yet those use just a single-camera .

USATVFAN · 06-04-2007, 06:04 PM

Between the years 1971-2003 were the best sitcoms.

Mr. Television · 06-04-2007, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe®

if we're only counting the "traditional" sitcoms (ie with a laugh track, multi-camera...ect), then yes, i think it is dead. those type of shows just aren't popular anymore...the "typical" sitcoms, with the big family and kids and blah blah blah. those type of shows IMO are dead and buried - and it's understandable, how many times can you watch those type of shows without it getting old?

if we're counting single-camera sitcoms though (ie Scrubs, 30 Rock, The Office). then i say no..they aren't the "traditional" sitcom, but i think those types of shows are the new sitcom, and people need to reliaze that and try and accept them. those type of shows are really popular with my age group and i think they are the new generation of sitcoms. if people actually watched them and gave them a chance instead of whining about how they don't have a laugh track and aren't "traditional" then maybe they will become MORE then semi-hits.

just my thoughts.

The only one of those type of sitcoms I like is My Name Is Earl. I tried watching The Office and Scrubs and I couldn't get into them.

waichingliu81 · 06-04-2007, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weezyfan

Between the years 1971-2003 were the best sitcoms.

yeah i'd agree with you, those were the days when american sitcoms were at its prime. but now, i despair at the present state that it is in right now

waichingliu81 · 06-04-2007, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walking Tall

The only one of those type of sitcoms I like is My Name Is Earl. I tried watching The Office and Scrubs and I couldn't get into them.

i've never got into them either, likewise the hype surrounding the office is so OTT. why anyone would consider that show humourous- US or UK version- is beyond me. i cannot stand that type of humour, and it's that kind of humour of which the makers assume it's funny when to the majority of us, its not

View Poll Results: is the US sitcom really dead
yes it is- it is going to take a miracle for it to make a comeback	19	59.38%
no it isn't- there is still life in the old dog yet	13	40.63%
Voters: 32. You may not vote on this poll

06-04-2007, 03:10 PM	#1
waichingliu81 debbie allen Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Dec 28, 2006 Location: london, england, UK Posts: 4,347	Is the US sitcom really dead? How America stopped laughing For more than two decades the US sitcom has reigned supreme. But the genre is suddenly out of favour with the networks. And the culprit? Those cheap British reality shows Caryn Mandabach Monday June 4, 2007 The Guardian Twenty-two years ago, just before a pilot of The Cosby Show was screened at the New York "upfronts" (the annual dog and pony act that US television puts on for ad buyers), many critics were confidently declaring American television comedy to be dead. Pleasant procedural cop shows such as Magnum, P.I. and Simon & Simon dominated the ad-supported, lily-white airwaves, and there was not a single comedy in the top 40 programmes. The argument was that character comedy, which had its roots in 1930s radio plays, simply was not relevant to a modern television audience. Though the network bosses hoped the jeremiahs were wrong - after all, the network with the number one comedy was always the number one network - then, as now, no one in power rushed to defend the genre. In fact, comedy has always been viewed as television's bright but embarrassing stepchild, skulking in the corner and licking the leftovers from other people's plates. All that changed when, a few years later, The Cosby Show started to make money. Big money, especially for the independent production company that owned it. Bigger money than all the networks combined were pulling in from their in-house shows. Suddenly, everybody wanted in. The Cosby Show made so much money for its owners that in 1996 the networks successfully lobbied the Clinton administration to change the law to allow them to own 100% of the programmes they broadcast. Now, the vertically integrated big media companies commission 85% of their shows in-house, the independents have almost been driven out of business, and not a single comedy money-spinner has been developed for nearly a decade. Still, we in the creative community live with the illusion of accomplishment. American writers churn out an average 200 comedy scripts a year (each paid, on average, $100,000) to get 50 produced pilots (average cost, $2 million each) to get (approximately) 10 new series (average cost, $20 million each) to, hopefully, get one new (fingers crossed) hit. As they say in Hollywood, we're talking real money here. Yet not since Will & Grace and That Seventies Show premiered within a few weeks of each other nearly nine years ago has anything even raised a pulse in American syndication markets. Sure, there's been the odd hit, or something off HBO, but, for the most part, network television comedy doesn't seem to be connecting with the audiences in that nice (kerching!) way anymore. So, apart from the colossal financial waste, what is going on? First, reality television (thanks, Britain!) is cheap, and, though it doesn't repeat well, it consistently occupies at least a third of any schedule. In fact, the buys this year reflect a decrease not only in narrative comedy, but in scripted programming in general. It's just no fun owning this kind of stuff when DVD sales are flattening out, repeats are not delivering, and international buyers are not keen. In addition, the networks have picked up quite a few spin-offs of existing dramas this year, thus cutting costs by doubling up on writing and production staff, and reducing the need for new ideas. On top of all that, the smart money is betting there will be a Writers Guild of America strike in October, which is not funny for the networks, and for which they are preparing by arming themselves with increasing amounts of "reality". Second, television is a middle-aged medium that has almost given up on providing scripted stuff for the kids, who have registered the lack of interest and gone elsewhere for their giggles. So the audience is not renewing itself. Third, even older viewers know how to use their DVD recorders, so why would anyone pay attention to network schedules anyway? The networks' thinking goes like this. "Things aren't looking good for us. We need to find a way to make more money, pronto. Those scripted comedies are costing too much to produce. No one agrees on what's funny anyway - even our cool niche cable channels can't seem to come up with any winners. The syndication market sucks, we're spending our own money on you, dammit, and we've tried and tried but nothing's worked, and we're frustrated after eight years of this ****, and wipe those crumbs off your chin you stupid idiot!" So, all you Brit comedy writers, the next time you whinge about how the BBC, ITV, Channel 4 or any other UK network deals with your scripts - how they mis-schedule them, how they never get back to you, how they give you inscrutable notes when they finally do - just remember that you may go through some rough patches, but you are also loved, appreciated, and sometimes even well paid. · Caryn Mandabach produced The Cosby Show and Roseanne. She has a first-look deal with the BBC i saw this article on a UK newspaper website 'The Guardian' and i was wondering whether what she has written rings true, according to you. the state of tv is so sad to see nowadays. is the sitcom really dead in the water? what advice would you give to up and coming sitcom writers and what would you say to the current ones that are around today?
	Last edited by waichingliu81; 06-04-2007 at 06:04 PM.

06-04-2007, 03:43 PM	#2
JulieSomoski Roseanne Reboot - March 27! Forum Veteran Join Date: Nov 06, 2004 Location: Michigan Posts: 7,558	Wow, that was perfectly put. There has not been a really successful sitcom since The Cosby Show and Roseanne. These 2 shows were really funny, and kept us glued to the telelvision for years. Ever since The Cosby Show went off the air, TV has become stale, especially sitcoms. Many have tried. Friends and Seinfeld were probably the 2 most successful left, yet they were nothing compared to the Cosby Show. Now, in my opinion, sitcoms right now are dead. You can't find a good sitcom these days even on TV Land. But, if a good sitcom were to come around, then everybody would watch. But, ther is no good sitcom these days. So, I voted that there is still hope, yet currently, they are dead.
	__________________ Click here to view some great articles written by my husband and I! All views are appreciated! Watch: Medium, Fridays at 9pm, on CBS! Big Bang Theory, Mondays at 9:30pm, on CBS! The Mentalist, Thursdays at 10pm, on CBS! Old Christine, Wednesdays at 8pm, on CBS! ABC's Comedy Lineup, Starting Wednesdays at 8:30pm, on ABC!

06-04-2007, 05:13 PM	#8
comedyfreak Cheers! Forum Fanatic Join Date: Dec 14, 2005 Location: Sunny California Posts: 11,061	I think the traditional sitcom is dead, there's nothing out there that is really funny anymore. Of the new shows I like How I Met Your Mother and Adventures of Old Christine.
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06-04-2007, 05:51 PM	#10
EmoJoe Cool cool cool Forum Addict Join Date: Apr 23, 2004 Location: New Jersey Posts: 71,478	if we're only counting the "traditional" sitcoms (ie with a laugh track, multi-camera...ect), then yes, i think it is dead. those type of shows just aren't popular anymore...the "typical" sitcoms, with the big family and kids and blah blah blah. those type of shows IMO are dead and buried - and it's understandable, how many times can you watch those type of shows without it getting old? if we're counting single-camera sitcoms though (ie Scrubs, 30 Rock, The Office). then i say no..they aren't the "traditional" sitcom, but i think those types of shows are the new sitcom, and people need to reliaze that and try and accept them. those type of shows are really popular with my age group and i think they are the new generation of sitcoms. if people actually watched them and gave them a chance instead of whining about how they don't have a laugh track and aren't "traditional" then maybe they will become MORE then semi-hits. just my thoughts.
	__________________ "I know the difference between TV and reality, Jeff. TV has structure, it makes sense, there are likable leading men. In real life, we have this. We have you." - Abed Nadir, Community www.sitcomsarestupid.blogspot.com

06-04-2007, 03:52 PM	#4
mraw Movin' On Up! Frequent Poster Join Date: Jul 09, 2006 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 343	Home Improvement was the last sitcom to really make me laugh out loud. I think that most sictoms today are based more within reality, and that makes them less funny (save for a few good one-liners). Several sitcoms are quite entertaining to me, just not lol funny.

06-04-2007, 03:53 PM	#5
blue4t Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Nov 15, 2005 Posts: 168	I really hope the sitcom is not dead. I think it just needs to be revamped. What current sitcoms are popular shows in the US? Scrubs is popular right now among people my age. I think there are some sitcoms that are popular or maybe semi-popular like Two and a Half Men and My Name is Earl. Apart from that there's really nothing. Part of it is there are so many reality shows out there, but I think another part is that creators/writers are trying too hard to copy other popular, long lasting sitcoms. When Friends was nearing it's end, there were tons (at least to me) shows popping up about a group of 20something friends trying to make it in the world (and most of the time, being paired up). Originality is key here. It is hard because a lot of ideas have already been used. Its OK to reuse an idea, it just has to be made so that it is uniquely separate from everything else.

06-04-2007, 05:03 PM	#7
Justafan65 Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Apr 06, 2007 Location: Washington Posts: 30	I would say that the last sitcom that made me laugh out loud was Still Standing. I think it was highly under-rated. Loved Seinfeld, Cosby, Cheers, Frasier and According to Jim too. I must say, I read a lot of scripts and not many make me laugh out loud. It's hard enough to do that when I am watching a show but to read something and actually lol is a challenge. I did just that several times on a pilot I read this spriing. Unfortunately, it didn't get picked up but I hope that isn't a continued sign that the networks think we need to be "told" when to laugh by showing us uncreative and silly humor (ie Cavemen?) and instead will allow us to see the humor in shows that we can all relate to by finding the humor in real life situations.

06-04-2007, 05:25 PM	#9
waichingliu81 debbie allen Forum 4000 Club Member Join Date: Dec 28, 2006 Location: london, england, UK Posts: 4,347	it is why i watch the classic sitcoms of yesteryear, as opposed to the current ones. it's as if nobody in tv land in the US care about this genre as much as they should. they are letting it rot into a corpse, whilst at the same time, they have stiffled the production of sitcoms by allowing reality tv shows to dominate the tv schedules now and then. it's a very sad situation for us sitcom fanatics to see this genre being neglected, all in favour of 'voyeuristic tv' where the concept of being looked at has gone as far as watching former a-list celebs reclaim their past glories and where people's real lives are- due to their exploits on screen- being cheapened to the extreme

06-04-2007, 06:04 PM	#12
USATVFAN Member Senior Member Join Date: Jan 31, 2007 Location: Kalispell, USA Posts: 1,742	Between the years 1971-2003 were the best sitcoms.