Parents, traders, please read- CAREFULLY

[savageamusement]

Trading is a great hobby.
Sometimes it gets taken too far-
Sometimes we argue, or get taken advantage of
We do what we can as a trading community to spare each other problems if we can.
Feedback, threads, word of mouth.

And at other times a moderator or owner step in- and sometimes a fight can be settled
Sometimes a disagreement resolved.

But no matter what there are still risks in this hobby and some people don't consider at all.

The below is a very serious situation, read it- and take it seriously.
Do not post anything comical on this thread, as the subject matter is far from.
And please do not use it for a platform to go off topic, as it won't be tolerated.


*
You only have to be 13 to use this site.
Some disagree with that, and very rarely do under the legal age trade- they are busy with school, busy with life-
But the fact is we DO have younger traders-
and we do have a LOT of younger users-

So take this into consideration.

Recently, running a check for a show "My living dolls"
A check was run for the show through Google trading groups, than Yahoo.

And to big surprise a user did have them- and had them on his list.
Another Trader, his name is Terry Ortman

You wouldn't think anything of it- until you knew the truth

If you have tried to trade Terry anytime in the last year, since November- he doen'st reply to emails
And doesn't seem to be around. He dropped off the face of the earth for trading.
Well, the reason is- sevearl other traders, came to find out, what else he traded- As he actually provided "examples of his work"

What was that other hobby?
Child Pornography.

Yes, he plead guilty

ORTMAN PLEADS GUILTY TO BEING A CHILD PORNOGRAPHER


TERRY ORTMAN OF DECATUR,ILLINOIS PLED GUILTY TO A REDUCED CHARGE OF
SELLING CHILD PORN - HE HAD A TOTAL OF 5 CHILD PORN CHARGES - HE'S BEEN

IN THE MACON COUNTY JAIL FOR 6 MONTHS BECAUSE HE COULD NOT RAISE BAIL
OF$25,000.


HE'S FACING 3 TO 5 YEARS IN THE STATE PRISON PLUS BEING LISTED AS A
REGISTERED SEXUAL OFFENDER

All of this is public record, as sex offenders are required to waive that right if plead guilty or found guility.

Now ask yourself-
What better way to get information on a child or young adult
but to be in a trading hobby.


Please be careful when trading.
If you are a young adult trading, take precautions- you can ask your parents for a post office box- for example
You can trade under your initials for another example
Do not give out personal information such as your birthdate, or picture.
Do not exchange phone numbers this is an UNUSUAL practice, if requested report it to a moderator.
Go with your gut, if something feels unusual, report it.


Trading can be a wonderful hobby
but it can open the door to the obvious excahnge of personal information
So PLEASE I can't stress this enough
do trader checks-
and if you see anything unusual- if someone sends you , or offers you illegal materials, adult materials- let a moderator know.


Becuase this trader in question was asking for pictures of the teens he traded, and offering "modeling money" for those who wanted to pose.



If your an adult trader, sharing the hobby iwth your child or teen, as some do.
BE aware, be aware of what they are getting. Be aware of who they are trading- and most of all let them know, if they come across something as this, they can come to you. Or come to me or any moderator as well as Todd himself of course.

[T-Greg]

Holy Moses! Good advice Kim. Take heed people and be careful who you are dealing with. See the story below. Is this the same guy? He lives in Decatur, Illinois:

http://www.angelfire.com/il/terryortman/press.html

[savageamusement]

Yes that is him.


I made sure to verify the name, and the address to old trading records-

I have added him to the bad trader list- of course-

I know this doen'st fall under my normal moderator responsibilities- but- the safety of the members is my concern.

[loren]

holy crap

this is another example of the internet as a good spot to become what and whom ever you choose to be

there are lots of sickos out there

lots of predators of all kinds

[savageamusement]

AS POSTED on the bad trader list


here is his email and associated site as well


NAME:TERRY ORTMAN
EMAIL:tort@gmx.net
LOCATION: DECATUR ILLINOIS
SELLER IDS:tort@gmx.net
SITES ASSOCIATED WITH:'FAQ MAINTAINER' OF ALT.FAN.TRACI-LORDS
REASON FOR ADDITION TO LIST:
FOUND GUILTY OF CHILD PORNAGRPHY, SOLICITING MINORS

[T-Greg]

Originally Posted by savageamusement

Yes that is him.


I made sure to verify the name, and the address to old trading records-

I have added him to the bad trader list- of course-

I know this doen'st fall under my normal moderator responsibilities- but- the safety of the members is my concern.

If only we'd known, we could have had Harvey go undercover (no pun intended) as a 13 year old girl, and had naked pictures sent to him. He would have been so horrified, he would probably have stopped. If only we'd known...sigh.

[lilhave]

Originally Posted by T-Greg

If only we'd known, we could have had Harvey go undercover (no pun intended) as a 13 year old girl, and had naked pictures sent to him. He would have been so horrified, he would probably have stopped. If only we'd known...sigh.

Here is a quote from Savage's post.

The below is a very serious situation, read it- and take it seriously.
Do not post anything comical on this thread, as the subject matter is far from.

Harvey

[Lamont]

very unfortunate for the trading community to be touched by this type of scandal

but let this be a warning--- u NEVER know who u r trading with
so be careful, be cautious and ask questions if it doesnt seem right

i have had people email me to ask for trades---- i look at the list and sometimes i see a good deal of "adult" material on the list

so as a general rule--- i steer clear of them

now im not some overly moral person, im not a prude at all
but i do not feel comfortable trading with someone who actively lists hardcore material on their public list--- it just aint appropriate

if they want to have an Adult list--- make it available ONLY BY REQUEST to people they know-- and for Gods sake, keep it of legal age

and that was just GENERAL ADULT/HARDCORE material----
the dime a dozen variety---- ive also been approached by those with "questionable" items on their list--- adult materials that are FAR FROM THE MAIN STREAM ----perhaps nothing criminal, but certainly sick and disturbing
which is even more awkward

so i just tell them "not interested" and block their emails after that

ive NOT been approached by anyone with this type of stuff on the list--- Little Children! (sickening!) and i hope i NEVER EVER EVER am--- because if you are trading that kind of stuff, this aint the site for you and i urge u to get some serious psychiatric help before u get some serious legal trouble! it aint welcome in Lamonts junkyard

sometimes we get too comfortable in our trading community and we forget that, like all parts of society, there are Bad people out there and we need to be careful

[kix_dude]

there used to be a trader in Iowa years ago... I can't remember his name but he would always throw in a disc of whatever his favorite "adult" movie was at the time. Although it wasn't child porn, I thought that was kinda wrong. I always told him I had no interest in it and i'd rather him not send anymore, but everytime we traded there would be one.

[Lamont]

Its just not appropriate
even if the adult material is legal, u do NOT send it out to people u dont know
and u certainly do not include it in trading lists and on trading sites

i mean---- jeesh, it aint like its hard to find porn online--- if someone wants to trade that stuff-- please, take it to an Adult site to do it, away from this site and away from a large number of minors!

[T-Greg]

Originally Posted by lilhave

Here is a quote from Savage's post.

The below is a very serious situation, read it- and take it seriously.
Do not post anything comical on this thread, as the subject matter is far from.

Harvey

You're right. My boo boo. But I could not resist.

[Japs]

Awful to think someone on here could be capable of such a thing. This is a very nice online community and everyone seems to be very friendly. Im a new poster but already feel like I belong to the site. Lets hope nothing happens like this again. Also I agree with lamont, adult material (pornography) aint a good idea to be on peoples lists.

[ajm1972]

One tape trader would tape over his porn tapes with stuff he owed me, when the tape got down to the last few minutes you would see graphic stuff. Couldnt the person just sent me something on a new blank tape??? I never traded with him again because he did it more than once on his tapes he sent me.

Aj

[Anthony33]

Originally Posted by savageamusement

Trading is a great hobby.
Sometimes it gets taken too far-
Sometimes we argue, or get taken advantage of
We do what we can as a trading community to spare each other problems if we can.
Feedback, threads, word of mouth.

And at other times a moderator or owner step in- and sometimes a fight can be settled
Sometimes a disagreement resolved.

But no matter what there are still risks in this hobby and some people don't consider at all.

The below is a very serious situation, read it- and take it seriously.
Do not post anything comical on this thread, as the subject matter is far from.
And please do not use it for a platform to go off topic, as it won't be tolerated.


*
You only have to be 13 to use this site.
Some disagree with that, and very rarely do under the legal age trade- they are busy with school, busy with life-
But the fact is we DO have younger traders-
and we do have a LOT of younger users-

So take this into consideration.

Recently, running a check for a show "My living dolls"
A check was run for the show through Google trading groups, than Yahoo.

And to big surprise a user did have them- and had them on his list.
Another Trader, his name is Terry Ortman

You wouldn't think anything of it- until you knew the truth

If you have tried to trade Terry anytime in the last year, since November- he doen'st reply to emails
And doesn't seem to be around. He dropped off the face of the earth for trading.
Well, the reason is- sevearl other traders, came to find out, what else he traded- As he actually provided "examples of his work"

What was that other hobby?
Child Pornography.

Yes, he plead guilty

ORTMAN PLEADS GUILTY TO BEING A CHILD PORNOGRAPHER


TERRY ORTMAN OF DECATUR,ILLINOIS PLED GUILTY TO A REDUCED CHARGE OF
SELLING CHILD PORN - HE HAD A TOTAL OF 5 CHILD PORN CHARGES - HE'S BEEN

IN THE MACON COUNTY JAIL FOR 6 MONTHS BECAUSE HE COULD NOT RAISE BAIL
OF$25,000.


HE'S FACING 3 TO 5 YEARS IN THE STATE PRISON PLUS BEING LISTED AS A
REGISTERED SEXUAL OFFENDER

All of this is public record, as sex offenders are required to waive that right if plead guilty or found guility.

Now ask yourself-
What better way to get information on a child or young adult
but to be in a trading hobby.


Please be careful when trading.
If you are a young adult trading, take precautions- you can ask your parents for a post office box- for example
You can trade under your initials for another example
Do not give out personal information such as your birthdate, or picture.
Do not exchange phone numbers this is an UNUSUAL practice, if requested report it to a moderator.
Go with your gut, if something feels unusual, report it.


Trading can be a wonderful hobby
but it can open the door to the obvious excahnge of personal information
So PLEASE I can't stress this enough
do trader checks-
and if you see anything unusual- if someone sends you , or offers you illegal materials, adult materials- let a moderator know.


Becuase this trader in question was asking for pictures of the teens he traded, and offering "modeling money" for those who wanted to pose.



If your an adult trader, sharing the hobby iwth your child or teen, as some do.
BE aware, be aware of what they are getting. Be aware of who they are trading- and most of all let them know, if they come across something as this, they can come to you. Or come to me or any moderator as well as Todd himself of course.

Eww, what a creep.,

[gilligan fanatic]

Originally Posted by savageamusement

*
You only have to be 13 to use this site.
Some disagree with that, and very rarely do under the legal age trade- they are busy with school, busy with life-
But the fact is we DO have younger traders-
and we do have a LOT of younger users-

1. Thanks for the warning

2. Just wondering why people disagree with it. Mainly just cases like the one you mentioned or are there other reasons?