DVD commentaries (the problem with Cybill)

[colin72]

Don't read if you don't want to know anything about the commentaries...




After listening to all of the commentaries (and watching the featurette), I think it's pretty obvious Cybill was... hmm, how can I say it in a polite way... a pain in the butt on the set.

During Jay Daniels commentary on Big Man on Mulberry Street he quite sullenly refers to an incident during the filiming of the scene where Maddie meets David's ex-wife. Cybill wanted to make one choice for how Maddie reacted to the meeting and Glenn wanted something different. Cybill eventually walked off of the set (she seems to have done this MANY times). This led to a meeting with Glenn, Jay and Cybill, her agent and her attorney. After the meeting, Jay said Cybill became "ill" and was gone for a long period of time leading to big delays in filming. Although Jay doesn't exactly say it, you can definitely tell that when he says Cybill became "ill", he means she wasn't sick at all rather, she was playing prima donna because she didn't get her way.

The commentaries on the 3rd season DVDs along with the material on the 1st and 2nd season DVDs, make it pretty apparent Cybill was trouble on the set. I hate to say it because I like Cybill and admire her work as Maddie but she was obviously stubborn and hard to work with.

And please, let's not argue that a strong woman is being labled as a b*tch while it would be OK for a guy (it wouldn't). Stubborn and hard to work with is independent of gender or whatever label you want to put on a person. There's nothing wrong with an actor giving input and having opinions of their character but they need to defer to the opinion of the creator and writer of their character (and we all know Glenn was "let go" because of disagreements with Cybill).

Most of us are well aware of the problems that caused delays in new Moonlighting episodes (late scripts, Cybill's pregnancy, Bruce's broken collar bone), but I think one thing that harmed Moonlighting greatly, and shouldn't have, was Cybill's attitude and actions on the set.

Sorry, but I'm just calling it as I see it.

[dihop]

You are aware that Jay Daniel was the executive producer of Cybill's own TV show in the mid 90s, right? If she was so impossible to work with, it seems odd that he would have accepted that job.

Sorting through all the info from that time, it is obvious that the Moonlighting set was a difficult one at points. Twenty hour days, with incomplete scripts will do that to people.

I think all the parties involved would probably accept their share of the blame, if blame even needs to be dealt. It was, in my opinion, one of the finest shows on TV, and had a five year run. Pretty good for a series, wouldn't you say?

[colin72]

Originally Posted by dihop

You are aware that Jay Daniel was the executive producer of Cybill's own TV show in the mid 90s, right? If she was so impossible to work with, it seems odd that he would have accepted that job.

Sorting through all the info from that time, it is obvious that the Moonlighting set was a difficult one at points. Twenty hour days, with incomplete scripts will do that to people.

I think all the parties involved would probably accept their share of the blame, if blame even needs to be dealt. It was, in my opinion, one of the finest shows on TV, and had an excellent five year run. Pretty good for a series, wouldn't you say?

Yeah, I'm aware that Jay worked on Cybill's show. And I didn't say she was "impossible" to work with. Please don't mischaracterize my comments.

Moonlighting did not have an "excellent five year run". So, no I wouldn't agree. ML had an excellent 3 season run and then it fell apart and at times was terrible... and not just by ML standards.

Maybe you haven't listened to Jay's commentary on Big Man on Mulberry Street. Once you do, maybe you will come back and post again with a different perspective on what I originally said.

[kismet]

How about when BW came in late with hangovers? When his breath/body smelled like booze, or stale cigarettes? How about when Bruce apologized (on the first DVD set) for making life miserable for those close to him during Moonlighting's run because he didn't know how to handle the sudden fame? How about the change in Maddie's character from strong and vulnerable to super bitch?

There were lots of problems on Moonlighting, and Cybill was just one of them.

[diana2001]

Hi Colin,

As a matter of fact, our upcoming interview with Jay Daniel touches on his work on the Cybill show. When we post the interview I will alert eveyone here on the board.

Diana
www.moonlighting21.com

[colin72]

Originally Posted by kismet

How about when BW came in late with hangovers? When his breath/body smelled like booze, or stale cigarettes? How about when Bruce apologized (on the first DVD set) for making life miserable for those close to him during Moonlighting's run because he didn't know how to handle the sudden fame? How about the change in Maddie's character from strong and vulnerable to super bitch?

There were lots of problems on Moonlighting, and Cybill was just one of them.

Did you read my post?

Have you listened to the commentary I referred to?

I'm not trying to be a smartass but it seems as though you feel the need to counter the observations I made after hearing Jay's commentary by listing Bruce's problems and attempting to pile it on (and by pile it on I mean adding that his "body" smelled like booze and he smelled of "stale cigarettes". If he came in late, yes that's bad but you're attempting to pile it on with comments like saying he smelled like "stale ciargettes". That's reaching quite a bit).

I'm not looking to start some big argument. I'm well aware that on some fan forums if you are critical of something you are attacked as though you insulted someone's first born.

Anyway, my point was it has become increasingly obvious to me from what those on the DVDs have said that Cybill really disrupted the set and INTENTIONALLY delayed filming in some major ways. Again, listen to Jay's commentary. He even chooses his words very carefully and tries to be polite.

[dihop]

True, I have not yet listened to Jay's commentary.

I guess, in my mind, it doesn't matter whose fault it is. I'm just not into bashing people, period.

Of course, you are entitled to your opinion. Just as others are entitled to disagree.

[colin72]

Originally Posted by dihop

True, I have not yet listened to Jay's commentary.

I guess, in my mind, it doesn't matter whose fault it is. I'm just not into bashing people, period.

Of course, you are entitled to your opinion. Just as others are entitled to disagree.

Yes, obviously everyone is entiltled to their opinion. My opinion is based on the words of those who worked on ML and specifically I was commenting on what Jay said during his Big Man on Mulberry Street commentary.

You say, "I guess, in my mind, it doesn't matter whose fault it is. I'm just not into bashing people, period." I don't know if you are trying to say I was bashing Cybill. Although it reads as though that's what you're inferring, I'll assume that's not what you're saying.

[dihop]

I guess we will agree to disagree....nothing at all inferred.

[Dutchie]

Hey Colin, are you here for fun? Because you're not making my day. These things seem to happen a lot when you post. Don't try pushing your opinion through. I've read a lot about the things that happened during Moonlighting. Everyone has made mistakes on this show, so stop bashing Cybill. And yes, that is what I think you're doing.

I for one am glad for the effort Cybill put in her character, it got Maddie the way she is today, and I'm sad that she didn't keep pushing it till the end because Maddie wasn't Maddie anymore after season 4.

Hard to work with? Probably, but she does it for a good course. Not to mention how tired they all where, which brings stressfull moments with it.

That's all I have to say about it, I feel no need to defend myself any further for my opinion.

Stephanie

[Luar]

You are right, Steph
I think that what did Moonlighting great were battles too. But also the cast and crew talent and admiration each other.
We can see it now on DVDs.
Their enthusiasm, their amusing...
I like them and all around.

[MulberryGal]

Although I haven't yet listened to the commentaries (I'm in the UK, so it will take a few days for them to be shipped) I think Cybill has been very honest that she was very awkward at times in ML, and wishes that she had appreciated things more at the time. I think Bruce has said similar things about himself not dealing with instant fame that well, but as someone said, they were under huge pressure at the time. As peeps have said, people who have worked with Cybill in later shows and found her much easier to deal with, which makes me believe its more complex than just one or the other lead actor being awkward. As people have said, both of them were a problem at some point during the run, due to different reasons. Even Allyce said that it was a difficult set.

I do think Cybill had a point regarding how they changed Maddie's character into a complete b*tch overnight tho. If you watch how she is in Season 2 and compare to Season 4, she's almost a different character.

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you Colin, I'm just saying that whilst its true that Cybill was awkward at times on set, it's not a matter of her 'being a problem'. There were lots of problems, from what I've read...

I like what Luar says too...

Mul

[colin72]

Originally Posted by Dutchie

Hey Colin, are you here for fun? Because you're not making my day. These things seem to happen a lot when you post. Don't try pushing your opinion through.

I almost don't even know how to respond to the above.

"Hey Colin, are you here for fun? "
Are you trying to say I can't comment on what Jay said during his commentary? Otherwise I'm disrupting the fun? I don't get it.

"Because you're not making my day."
With all due respect, if a strangers post and opinion on a TV show message board in some way ruins your day.... well, what can I say.

"These things seem to happen a lot when you post."
What "things happen a lot"?

"Don't try pushing your opinion through."
Try pushing my opinion through where/how? Am I not entilted to an opinion based on what Jay Daniels himself says? Strange.

Originally Posted by Dutchie

I've read a lot about the things that happened during Moonlighting. Everyone has made mistakes on this show, so stop bashing Cybill. And yes, that is what I think you're doing.

Please read my post again and tell me where I'm "bashing" Cybill. I think you're trying to apply the term bashing where it doesn't fit. And yes, you can think it's bashing but that doesn't mean it is or that you are right. Sorry. I'm a ML fan and have been since the begining.

Originally Posted by Dutchie

I for one am glad for the effort Cybill put in her character, it got Maddie the way she is today, and I'm sad that she didn't keep pushing it till the end because Maddie wasn't Maddie anymore after season 4.

Hard to work with? Probably, but she does it for a good course. Not to mention how tired they all where, which brings stressfull moments with it.

That's all I have to say about it, I feel no need to defend myself any further for my opinion.

Stephanie

I appreciate the effort Cybill put into her work as well but that doesn't mean she's excused for behaving badly. No one should be. And sorry but if someone is hard to work with and then tries to justify it by saying it's for "a good cause", that's just lame.

As I said previously, I understand there were problems on the ML set but I've been wondering for nearly 20 years just what went wrong and after hearing Jay's commentary, he delicately shed some light on Cybill intentionally causing some major delays in filming. Have you listened to the commentary I initially referred to?

I'm going to listen to the commentary again and will detail my thoughts in the Big Man on Mulberry Street thread.

[marla]

i haven't seen the commentary because i already have all episodes from the pilot threw 'to heiress human' on video.
i wondered what went wrong myself and i like reading your thoughts and the jay guy (can't remember his name) thoughts.
i Cring when someone Walks Off The Set and Gets Ill. oh Yuk, Yuk, Yuk.
And bringing in an Agent and Lawyer-now i'm hiding under the table.

now if only cybill shephard had done that at the start of season 4. sigh.

[colin72]

Originally Posted by marla

i haven't seen the commentary because i already have all episodes from the pilot threw 'to heiress human' on video.
i wondered what went wrong myself and i like reading your thoughts and the jay guy (can't remember his name) thoughts.
i Cring when someone Walks Off The Set and Gets Ill. oh Yuk, Yuk, Yuk.
And bringing in an Agent and Lawyer-now i'm hiding under the table.

now if only cybill shephard had done that at the start of season 4. sigh.

If you haven't seen it yet Marla, I posted a transcript of Jay Daniels' commentary that I was referring to above in the thread: "Big Man on Mulberry Street commentary".