Cindy James - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

OriginalNightstalker · 08-01-2005, 11:07 PM

What's the story about her husband? I've seen several people comment that he was a psycho. I don't recall the episode mentioning him.

dynoguy88 · 08-01-2005, 11:55 PM

The segment never mentioned Cindy's husband. In fact, they never even showed his picture. The only mention of him at all in the segment was Stack saying, "In July of 1982, Cindy and her husband seperated. 3 months later, the phone calls began."

His name was Roy Makepeace. He wasn't really a pyscho as much as we was a little eccentric. He certainly had his odd qualities, as many people do, but I never saw him as a killer. I read both books about the Cindy James case and I never once got the feeling that he was behind her terror. In fact one of her attacks happened while he was out of the country.

While some people look at the timing of Cindy and Roy's seperation and speculate he could have been responsible for the harrasment, it doesn't seem likely. They didn't get divorced until years later and they continued to date on and off and were on good terms. She even invited him to spend Christmas with her and her family the December after they seperated. She never believed he was behind the harrasment either.

The latest on Makepeace is unknown. In fact, several months ago a poster came here and said that he is currently missing - his whereabouts being a mystery. Haven't heard anything more about him since.

OriginalNightstalker · 08-02-2005, 12:02 AM

After reading 2 books what's your theory about her death?

dynoguy88 · 08-02-2005, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OriginalNightstalker

After reading 2 books what's your theory about her death?

There's so many details mentioned in the book - I may have to go back and post actual quotes if people get interested - but I can't believe that she killed herself. Her body was filled with so many morphine drugs that I find it hard to believe she could have tied herself up even though the knots that bound her hands and legs together weren't very tight. I can't remember how long it would have taken her to pass out after being injected but the biggest fact remains - There was no syringe found anywhere near the body...not in the yard, not in the abandoned house, not anywhere.

What does that mean? Simple. She was killed and her body was dumped. Somebody killed her and tried to make it look like suicide. Her jacket was neatly layed out to give the illusion that she killed herself.

Investigators are torn that the death scene was either suicide made to look like murder or murder made to look like suicide. But either way the same fact remains - Where was the syringe? The Vancouver police refuse to accept anything but suicide because Cindy seemed, at times to be witholding information, which was probably true. And while some events of the last several years of her life and behavior at times seems confusing - I just don't believe that it was suicide.

OriginalNightstalker · 08-02-2005, 12:27 AM

The police have any suspects? I would be surprised if none of the neighbors would'nt have seen/heard prowling going on.

dynoguy88 · 08-02-2005, 12:36 AM

The yard her body was found in didn't have a ton of homes close by so not many people would have seen her anyway. Curiously enough, there was a homeless man that lived out of his van, just 20 yards or so from where the corpse layed on the same yard. He never reported seeing anything. Police believed that her body layed there in the yard for a week but that couldn't have been possible since rodents would have eaten away at her body...which they had already started to do. (I know...yuck!) That's another factor that looks like her body was dumped there.

The inquest of her death came to the conclusion that the death was "undetermined" since technically it can't be proven either way whether it was murder or suicide. Therefore, the case file remains open. But there are no suspects because the entire Vancouver Police Department believe Cindy was responsible for her own death.

MetalHybrid · 08-02-2005, 01:09 AM

I only read Ian Mulgrew's Who Killed Cindy James, and have not read the other book.....yet. I too think that it was a murder, and they must have known she was doubted by the police and that they would think her death would be a suicide, which they did once the body was found. In that way it could be called the perfect crime. And consider where the body was found, and who found the body. Cops said they'd search nearby abandoned housing lots first, but her body was found in just such a place by construction workers, a short time after the police search began.

I think there is at least police incompetence here, and to avoid a public realtions disaster, as the book said, the police ruled a suicide as to avoid public scrutiny for letting a murderer roam free.

And at one point, Cindy did begin to point the finger at her ex-husband, around 87' or 88'.

Steffromquebec73 · 08-02-2005, 07:44 AM

I re-watched that case on the DVD yesterday; I really doubt that she "harassed" and killed herself. I don't think that her ex-hubby is behind it, unless he payed some other people to do it.

I'll have to search for the books in the library, as I don't think that the bookstores still have it as new.

That case is fascinating to say the least. I also want to search the Vancouver Sun microfilm archives, as to whatever article were written on it.

And the actress who played Cindy in the re-enactment looks exactly the same. it's creepy!

The only weird thing is that she onced walked her dog out for a long time at 3 AM, alone w/him, and the dog seemed like a small Corgis or similar. Not a "scary looking" dog by any stretch. But she had friends staying at her house that night, so maybe she felt safer going for a long doggie walk at night?

Who knows...Maybe she got harassed and then started to "embelish" the story herself, then she got nuts by the whole thing (harassments, police not believing her, etc...). know I would've gotten nuts as well, sp. after the harrassment continued after she changed her last name and she moved!!

Another case not on the DVD and that I haven't seen in a little while is the "L'Enfant" case, about a mid-eastern man who was kidnapped by terrorists in his area, then he moved to the US, opened a restaurants and got harassed by, among other things, scary phone calls w/ a childish voice and giggles, saying they were called "l'enfant" (meaning "the child" in French). Man that case gave me the shivers! I wish I'd see it again soon!

They should've made a DVD set w/weird misc. cases that don't include murders, legends or the paranormal. I love all sets that I've yet watched, but there are a few other themes that they could make.

Thinman · 08-02-2005, 08:55 AM

dyno,

They speculate that the morphine was ingested orally and would not have taken effect for 15-30 minutes (plenty of time for her to tie herself up). Being a nurse, it would have been easy for her to get her hands on this drug. The knot expert took three minutes to replicate the knots that bound Cindy. I believe the "attack" that killed her was just another staged attention getting scene that accidentally killed her.

I believe Cindy was behind the attacks all along. Not one neighbor ever saw or heard anything. There were never any footprints, fingerprints, fibers, hairs, etc. left behind. She was never sexually assaulted in the attacks. Everytime police surveillance was on her house, the harrassment stopped. In seven years, some kind of evidence would have surfaced. No criminals are that good at what they do.

dynoguy88 · 08-02-2005, 11:28 AM

I can cetainly see why people would think it would be suicide. Cindy did act odd at times during those 7 years and didn't always act like a normal victim would act. Another strange incident was when her house was set on fire, apparently by her attacker. She was relatively calm after getting her friends and dog out of the house and it wasn't until police arrived that she started to act histarical and crying. That always seemed suspicious to me. I also find it odd that she would go out walking her dog at 2:00 in the morning after everything she had been through.

But there were times when it seemed like there really could have been an attacker. One evening, she was playing cards with her friends Tom and Agnes Woodcock (they were like second parents to her and began living with her for a while so she would feel safer) - they were playing cards at 3:00 in the morning because she had trouble sleeping when the burgler alarm went off and they all heard someone out in the yard. After checking, they found a dead cat left on her front porch with a note tied around it's neck; "You're next!"

If Cindy was able to stage that, she must have been some kind of master genius because Agnes said she never once left the room.

The phone lines constantly being cut also confuses me. She certainly never had any knowledge of which phone lines were hers, which ones were her down stairs tenant and which ones were her neighbors that lived close by yet her phone lines were always cut and never anyone else's. And the threatening phone calls - she wasn't always alone when she would recieve them. There were times when her PI, her police officer friend and her family members answered one of these calls with Cindy in the room.

Either way, whether it was suicide or murder, the Vancouver Police look like a bunch of fools. Thinman mentioned that in seven years, some kind of evidence would have surfaced. That may be true...but how come in seven years the police could never catch Cindy doing these things to herself? Come on, seven years is a long time. If an attack always seemed to happen when surveillance was taken off her house why didn't the police just trick her and tell her that it was taken off but instead stay and see if they could catch her in the act? This isn't rocket science here. If the police was so convinced that she was doing this to herself, they should have got the proof first instead of making accusations.

Thinman · 08-02-2005, 02:09 PM

This is certainly one of the most interesting cases UM has ever profiled because a legitimate argument can be made for either side. I am a little skeptical of the stories corroborated by the Woodcocks and her cop "friend" because they are not unbiased sources. I'm not trying to call anyone a liar, but the Woodcocks would have said or done anything to clear Cindy's name. The cop was having a sexual relationship with her.

Good point about her also not being caught doing these things. But, it would be a whole lot easier for her to get away with these things than someone else, in my opinion. I just can't get past the fact that she was violently assaulted five times and there was not a shred of evidence suggesting another party was involved.

OriginalNightstalker · 08-03-2005, 03:03 PM

After seeing the segment again today, IMO I think she was stalked in the beginning. The offender stopped at some point to observe the effect it was having. Don't forget were talking about a period of roughly 8 years. Also when people are being stalked they have a natural tendency to become to vigilant to the point where they suspect everything around them. When Cindy James reached this point he realized he was in her head, controlling her thoughts, so that's one reason why he had a lull. Second reason for some time there was the police presence, with that many officers staking out the house I think it wasn't feasible for the stalker to make his next move.
Next I think Cindy became frustrated/defiant over the whole situation which would explain her walking her dog at odd times in the night. That was to tell the stalker that she wasn't afraid of him, which he took as a direct challenge.
Eventually the stalker made his move when Cindy became more complacent or less vigilant which would happen eventually especially over such a long time frame.

Judyhymesisalive · 04-09-2016, 10:01 PM

I don't remember this case. I'm reading lots online but it seems like quite a complex case. Anyone care to break it down for me and give it to me in a 'nutshell'

comicbookwriter · 04-10-2016, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judyhymesisalive

I don't remember this case. I'm reading lots online but it seems like quite a complex case. Anyone care to break it down for me and give it to me in a 'nutshell'

Perfect storm of classic UM:

-two versions of the segment have been shown. One had more info than the other.
-Cindy James claimed to be harassed by an unknown assailant.
-She's found gagged and drugged.
-Vancouver police believe she's making it all up.
-Harassment gets worse. Cindy has friends and family keeping an eye on her place when weird things happen.
-Police still think she's making it all up.
-Cindy's behavior becomes more erratic.
-Cindy is found dead of a massive morphine overdose, also tied and gagged and beaten.

Evidence seems to suggest that there might HAVE been a harasser but there's circumstantial evidence to suggest that Cindy was experiencing a mental breakdown.

There are two books written about the case that have even more information than was on the UM segment.

That's a very basic set up.

CBW

Judyhymesisalive · 04-10-2016, 09:08 PM

Wow OK thanks! Has anyone been charged with her murder? Or do the police think because of her 'breakdown' she did it herself?

08-01-2005, 11:07 PM	#1
OriginalNightstalker Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Jul 21, 2005 Location: Illinois Posts: 78	Cindy James What's the story about her husband? I've seen several people comment that he was a psycho. I don't recall the episode mentioning him.
	__________________ Some people are so stupid. Use your brian morons!

08-01-2005, 11:55 PM	#2
dynoguy88 Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Apr 01, 2000 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 3,675	reply The segment never mentioned Cindy's husband. In fact, they never even showed his picture. The only mention of him at all in the segment was Stack saying, "In July of 1982, Cindy and her husband seperated. 3 months later, the phone calls began." His name was Roy Makepeace. He wasn't really a pyscho as much as we was a little eccentric. He certainly had his odd qualities, as many people do, but I never saw him as a killer. I read both books about the Cindy James case and I never once got the feeling that he was behind her terror. In fact one of her attacks happened while he was out of the country. While some people look at the timing of Cindy and Roy's seperation and speculate he could have been responsible for the harrasment, it doesn't seem likely. They didn't get divorced until years later and they continued to date on and off and were on good terms. She even invited him to spend Christmas with her and her family the December after they seperated. She never believed he was behind the harrasment either. The latest on Makepeace is unknown. In fact, several months ago a poster came here and said that he is currently missing - his whereabouts being a mystery. Haven't heard anything more about him since.

08-02-2005, 12:36 AM	#6
dynoguy88 Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Apr 01, 2000 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 3,675	reply The yard her body was found in didn't have a ton of homes close by so not many people would have seen her anyway. Curiously enough, there was a homeless man that lived out of his van, just 20 yards or so from where the corpse layed on the same yard. He never reported seeing anything. Police believed that her body layed there in the yard for a week but that couldn't have been possible since rodents would have eaten away at her body...which they had already started to do. (I know...yuck!) That's another factor that looks like her body was dumped there. The inquest of her death came to the conclusion that the death was "undetermined" since technically it can't be proven either way whether it was murder or suicide. Therefore, the case file remains open. But there are no suspects because the entire Vancouver Police Department believe Cindy was responsible for her own death.

08-02-2005, 11:28 AM	#10
dynoguy88 Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Apr 01, 2000 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 3,675	reply I can cetainly see why people would think it would be suicide. Cindy did act odd at times during those 7 years and didn't always act like a normal victim would act. Another strange incident was when her house was set on fire, apparently by her attacker. She was relatively calm after getting her friends and dog out of the house and it wasn't until police arrived that she started to act histarical and crying. That always seemed suspicious to me. I also find it odd that she would go out walking her dog at 2:00 in the morning after everything she had been through. But there were times when it seemed like there really could have been an attacker. One evening, she was playing cards with her friends Tom and Agnes Woodcock (they were like second parents to her and began living with her for a while so she would feel safer) - they were playing cards at 3:00 in the morning because she had trouble sleeping when the burgler alarm went off and they all heard someone out in the yard. After checking, they found a dead cat left on her front porch with a note tied around it's neck; "You're next!" If Cindy was able to stage that, she must have been some kind of master genius because Agnes said she never once left the room. The phone lines constantly being cut also confuses me. She certainly never had any knowledge of which phone lines were hers, which ones were her down stairs tenant and which ones were her neighbors that lived close by yet her phone lines were always cut and never anyone else's. And the threatening phone calls - she wasn't always alone when she would recieve them. There were times when her PI, her police officer friend and her family members answered one of these calls with Cindy in the room. Either way, whether it was suicide or murder, the Vancouver Police look like a bunch of fools. Thinman mentioned that in seven years, some kind of evidence would have surfaced. That may be true...but how come in seven years the police could never catch Cindy doing these things to herself? Come on, seven years is a long time. If an attack always seemed to happen when surveillance was taken off her house why didn't the police just trick her and tell her that it was taken off but instead stay and see if they could catch her in the act? This isn't rocket science here. If the police was so convinced that she was doing this to herself, they should have got the proof first instead of making accusations.

08-03-2005, 03:03 PM	#12
OriginalNightstalker Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Jul 21, 2005 Location: Illinois Posts: 78	After seeing the segment again today, IMO I think she was stalked in the beginning. The offender stopped at some point to observe the effect it was having. Don't forget were talking about a period of roughly 8 years. Also when people are being stalked they have a natural tendency to become to vigilant to the point where they suspect everything around them. When Cindy James reached this point he realized he was in her head, controlling her thoughts, so that's one reason why he had a lull. Second reason for some time there was the police presence, with that many officers staking out the house I think it wasn't feasible for the stalker to make his next move. Next I think Cindy became frustrated/defiant over the whole situation which would explain her walking her dog at odd times in the night. That was to tell the stalker that she wasn't afraid of him, which he took as a direct challenge. Eventually the stalker made his move when Cindy became more complacent or less vigilant which would happen eventually especially over such a long time frame.
	Last edited by OriginalNightstalker; 08-03-2005 at 10:36 PM.

08-02-2005, 12:02 AM	#3
OriginalNightstalker Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Jul 21, 2005 Location: Illinois Posts: 78	After reading 2 books what's your theory about her death?

08-02-2005, 12:27 AM	#5
OriginalNightstalker Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Jul 21, 2005 Location: Illinois Posts: 78	The police have any suspects? I would be surprised if none of the neighbors would'nt have seen/heard prowling going on.

08-02-2005, 01:09 AM	#7
MetalHybrid Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Mar 10, 2005 Location: Campbell(near San Jose), CA Posts: 141	I only read Ian Mulgrew's Who Killed Cindy James, and have not read the other book.....yet. I too think that it was a murder, and they must have known she was doubted by the police and that they would think her death would be a suicide, which they did once the body was found. In that way it could be called the perfect crime. And consider where the body was found, and who found the body. Cops said they'd search nearby abandoned housing lots first, but her body was found in just such a place by construction workers, a short time after the police search began. I think there is at least police incompetence here, and to avoid a public realtions disaster, as the book said, the police ruled a suicide as to avoid public scrutiny for letting a murderer roam free. And at one point, Cindy did begin to point the finger at her ex-husband, around 87' or 88'.

08-02-2005, 07:44 AM	#8
Steffromquebec73 Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Jul 30, 2005 Posts: 20	I re-watched that case on the DVD yesterday; I really doubt that she "harassed" and killed herself. I don't think that her ex-hubby is behind it, unless he payed some other people to do it. I'll have to search for the books in the library, as I don't think that the bookstores still have it as new. That case is fascinating to say the least. I also want to search the Vancouver Sun microfilm archives, as to whatever article were written on it. And the actress who played Cindy in the re-enactment looks exactly the same. it's creepy! The only weird thing is that she onced walked her dog out for a long time at 3 AM, alone w/him, and the dog seemed like a small Corgis or similar. Not a "scary looking" dog by any stretch. But she had friends staying at her house that night, so maybe she felt safer going for a long doggie walk at night? Who knows...Maybe she got harassed and then started to "embelish" the story herself, then she got nuts by the whole thing (harassments, police not believing her, etc...). know I would've gotten nuts as well, sp. after the harrassment continued after she changed her last name and she moved!! Another case not on the DVD and that I haven't seen in a little while is the "L'Enfant" case, about a mid-eastern man who was kidnapped by terrorists in his area, then he moved to the US, opened a restaurants and got harassed by, among other things, scary phone calls w/ a childish voice and giggles, saying they were called "l'enfant" (meaning "the child" in French). Man that case gave me the shivers! I wish I'd see it again soon! They should've made a DVD set w/weird misc. cases that don't include murders, legends or the paranormal. I love all sets that I've yet watched, but there are a few other themes that they could make.

08-02-2005, 08:55 AM	#9
Thinman Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Apr 08, 2005 Posts: 182	dyno, They speculate that the morphine was ingested orally and would not have taken effect for 15-30 minutes (plenty of time for her to tie herself up). Being a nurse, it would have been easy for her to get her hands on this drug. The knot expert took three minutes to replicate the knots that bound Cindy. I believe the "attack" that killed her was just another staged attention getting scene that accidentally killed her. I believe Cindy was behind the attacks all along. Not one neighbor ever saw or heard anything. There were never any footprints, fingerprints, fibers, hairs, etc. left behind. She was never sexually assaulted in the attacks. Everytime police surveillance was on her house, the harrassment stopped. In seven years, some kind of evidence would have surfaced. No criminals are that good at what they do.

08-02-2005, 02:09 PM	#11
Thinman Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Apr 08, 2005 Posts: 182	This is certainly one of the most interesting cases UM has ever profiled because a legitimate argument can be made for either side. I am a little skeptical of the stories corroborated by the Woodcocks and her cop "friend" because they are not unbiased sources. I'm not trying to call anyone a liar, but the Woodcocks would have said or done anything to clear Cindy's name. The cop was having a sexual relationship with her. Good point about her also not being caught doing these things. But, it would be a whole lot easier for her to get away with these things than someone else, in my opinion. I just can't get past the fact that she was violently assaulted five times and there was not a shred of evidence suggesting another party was involved.

04-09-2016, 10:01 PM	#13
Judyhymesisalive Wadada Frequent Poster Join Date: Mar 31, 2016 Location: Germany Posts: 388	I don't remember this case. I'm reading lots online but it seems like quite a complex case. Anyone care to break it down for me and give it to me in a 'nutshell'
	__________________ If you're from Africa why are you white?

04-10-2016, 09:08 PM	#15
Judyhymesisalive Wadada Frequent Poster Join Date: Mar 31, 2016 Location: Germany Posts: 388	Wow OK thanks! Has anyone been charged with her murder? Or do the police think because of her 'breakdown' she did it herself?