Did the show ever jump the shark/could it have lasted longer?

[Duster76]

Originally Posted by jharison

Here's what I was told by the MFM representative: Mr Walston was not happy with the overall direction of the series, particularly in the 3rd season scripts, with the use of animals in the plots, (because it was cheaper than hiring actors) and the abandonment of the premise of the series, which was the Martian observing human nature as he tries to return home.
(He once said in a video interview, "They killed the goose that laid the Golden Egg. They didn't know how to keep the goose alive." and "We should have run for 8 years.") In another interview from the 1990s, contrasting "Martian", Mr. Walston expressed admiration for the way Star Trek had evolved, wishing MFM could have reflected such sci-fi ideas.
Therefore, because Mr. Walston wanted to leave the show, the producers then came up with the idea of his 11 year old nephew Andromeda showing up on earth, so that Ray Walston would not have to appear in every episode. If the series had been picked up for a 4th season, Uncle Martin and Andy would have returned to Mars, but Andy would have been sent back to live with Tim in order for him to learn about Earth and Uncle Martin would check in with him from time to time.
Needless to say CBS rejected that idea. The show was said to have been shopped to ABC, but without Mr. Walston's participation, that network was not interested either.

There certainly is a lot to unpack here, so first thanks for posting, although most of the information is available on the web I don't believe it has ever been presented in this forum. With that as a set up let's take a look:

"Mr Walston was not happy with the overall direction of the series, particularly in the 3rd season scripts, with the use of animals in the plots"

Uncle Martin's ability to communicate with animals was certainly a part of the first season (maybe a bit in the second season), I don't remember it being a significant part of season 3.

With respect to the abandonment of the original premise, that sounds like the observation made by Sherwood Schwartz (which I covered). I think the show was up against very formidable competition on NBC with the increasingly popular Walt Disney's Wonderful World of Color, and on ABC Voyage To the Bottom of the Sea which started at 7pm. Martian was doing well against Voyage but the science fiction series was definitely siphoning some of the Martian audience particularly boys and younger adults, and that mixed with the female friendly Disney programming left My Favorite Martian in a very vulnerable position. Jack Chertok (the Producer) had to do something after the 14 position rating drop in season two so he introduced more elaborate gadgetry (chiefly the time machine), gave the Martian a few new powers. Of course it was gimmicky but he needed to fight fire with fire. I thought season 3 was the best so I don't agree with the premise that the scripts were bad, look at the first two episodes of season 3, funny, exciting a lot of energy, some of the best work done during the series run.

With respect to the shows that followed Martian's cancellation, see how well they did:

It's About Time 66-67 - one and done

Gentle Ben 67-69 - two seasons cancelled

To Rome With Love - Lasted one season in the 7:30 time slot, moved to Tuesday cancelled after half a season.

Hogan's Heroes 70-71 Final season

Martian did better than all those shows!

One final note Lassie the lead in series was also going down, dropping to number 17 in Martian's second season, and then to 27 in Martian's third season, and keep in mind it was not up against Disney.

I've seen the Andromeda discussion before. The key reason he was being added to the series had it gone to a 4th season was an attempt to bring back some of the younger viewers who had drifted away from the series. I thought it was a good idea, the show was up against an increasingly popular Disney show, fire with fire.

Walston wasn't going anywhere, don't kid yourself. He was a working actor, 52 years of age with a five year contract (pretty standard at the time), walking away from the series leaving the producer holding the bag would have been potential career suicide. Hollywood is a small town, old saying. I don't doubt he had issues, but my guess would be they were related to money, he considered Chertok a cheapskate.

One final note, I don't know what Walston was thinking comparing My Favorite Martian with Star Trek, to me that would be like comparing The Munsters with The Waltons.

[jharison]

In response to Duster76, a few points to consider:

Animals were the main part of these later 3rd season episodes, "Doggone Martin", "Horse and Buggy Martin", a lion in "Stop the Presses I want to get off" and squirrels in "My Nut Cup Runneth Over" .

"Martian" never appeared in the top 25 Nielsen lists published in newspapers during the 65-66 season. But this site below sheds some light on its ranking.

http://www.thetvratingsguide.com/199...v-ratings.html

According to this site, "Martian" ranked 45th in the Nielsens, 32.2 share, with "Voyage To The Bottom of the Sea" at 67th. with 29.7 share. Yet, in terms of all CBS shows MFM ranked #23 and for all ABC shows Voyage ranked #22. Disney, (which interestingly here, tied with Ed Sullivan) ranked 17th in the Top 25 list. which put it 4th of all NBC programs, behind Bonanza, Get Smart, and The Man From UNCLE. (Sullivan ranked #11th for all of CBS shows.)

Lassie is ranked 27th in Nielsens. Its rank of #17 means it was 17th among all CBS shows.

The first CCTBS time machine episode was supposed to be aired June 20, 1965 in black and white as the 37th show of the 2nd season, but was pulled at the last minute, presumably to be introduced in color for the premiere episode of season 3. The date of the script for "Time Out For Martian" episode is March 15, 1965. The 1215 time machine episode was not aired until May 8,1966, after all the color shows had been broadcast.

The use of gadgets in plots started in season 2, 1964-65 when Marty Roth became story consultant. These included a memory eradicator machine, a neuro-cerebral stimulator, a benevolence bulb, a duplicating machine, the molecular separator, and a dimensional separator.

The Andromeda episode was written by Roth in Jan 1966, filmed the week of January 24, 1966 and rushed to air Feb 27 1966. CBS actually aired a prime time promo for the episode on Thursday Jan 24th, to see what the rating response would be. But it is unknown what the ratings were for the Andy episode.

In my opinion, it was a terrible idea. The strength of the series was the buddy comedy, adventure and chemistry with Ray and Bill. It would have been negatively altered by the presence of 11 year old Andy.

Interestingly, Star Trek 1966-69 did very occasionally use some plot themes originally done on MFM, (man split into good and evil twin, different personalities, time travel) but when this was pointed out by his staff, producer Gene Roddenberry did not care about that issue.

Also, the idea was not to "compare" MFM to Trek. It was simply to note that more elements of science fiction plots might have been followed in "Martian", as opposed to drifting into fantasy. The potential was there.

[Duster76]

Originally Posted by jharison

In response to Duster76, a few points to consider:

Animals were the main part of these later 3rd season episodes, "Doggone Martin", "Horse and Buggy Martin", a lion in "Stop the Presses I want to get off" and squirrels in "My Nut Cup Runneth Over" .

"Martian" never appeared in the top 25 Nielsen lists published in newspapers during the 65-66 season. But this site below sheds some light on its ranking.

http://www.thetvratingsguide.com/199...v-ratings.html

According to this site, "Martian" ranked 45th in the Nielsens, 32.2 share, with "Voyage To The Bottom of the Sea" at 67th. with 29.7 share. Yet, in terms of all CBS shows MFM ranked #23 and for all ABC shows Voyage ranked #22. Disney, (which interestingly here, tied with Ed Sullivan) ranked 17th in the Top 25 list. which put it 4th of all NBC programs, behind Bonanza, Get Smart, and The Man From UNCLE. (Sullivan ranked #11th for all of CBS shows.)

Lassie is ranked 27th in Nielsens. Its rank of #17 means it was 17th among all CBS shows.

The first CCTBS time machine episode was supposed to be aired June 20, 1965 in black and white as the 37th show of the 2nd season, but was pulled at the last minute, presumably to be introduced in color for the premiere episode of season 3. The date of the script for "Time Out For Martian" episode is March 15, 1965. The 1215 time machine episode was not aired until May 8,1966, after all the color shows had been broadcast.

The use of gadgets in plots started in season 2, 1964-65 when Marty Roth became story consultant. These included a memory eradicator machine, a neuro-cerebral stimulator, a benevolence bulb, a duplicating machine, the molecular separator, and a dimensional separator.

The Andromeda episode was written by Roth in Jan 1966, filmed the week of January 24, 1966 and rushed to air Feb 27 1966. CBS actually aired a prime time promo for the episode on Thursday Jan 24th, to see what the rating response would be. But it is unknown what the ratings were for the Andy episode.

In my opinion, it was a terrible idea. The strength of the series was the buddy comedy, adventure and chemistry with Ray and Bill. It would have been negatively altered by the presence of 11 year old Andy.

Interestingly, Star Trek 1966-69 did very occasionally use some plot themes originally done on MFM, (man split into good and evil twin, different personalities, time travel) but when this was pointed out by his staff, producer Gene Roddenberry did not care about that issue.

Also, the idea was not to "compare" MFM to Trek. It was simply to note that more elements of science fiction plots might have been followed in "Martian", as opposed to drifting into fantasy. The potential was there.

Interesting response, let me go at this from a different angle.

Between 1959-1970 CBS used the 7:30 time slot primarily for kid friendly programming consistent with the lead-in series Lassie at 7 leading up to the ultimate something for everybody ages 8-80, The Ed Sullivan Show. The last thing CBS would have supported was "more elements of science fiction plots", no heavy lifting, straight forward plotting, simple premise. As we know the show's numbers had fallen off rather dramatically in the three seasons it was on the air placing it in serious jeopardy as far as being renewed. Chertok couldn't just sit still he had to at least attempt to give the network something to think about so he came up with Andromeda. As you yourself point out the network greenlighted the episode and promoted it so they must have thought it was a plausible solution to the declining ratings. During this 11 year period under discussion, My Favorite Martian was the only series that had no young people in the cast. Several series, Dennis the Menace and Gentle Ben had children in lead positions, To Rome with Love had children as prominent characters. Even It's About Time had young people in the cast. I thought the idea worked you obviously didn't but the idea is defendable.

With respect to animals, I know Ray hated the idea but again kids like animals and I don't think they made that much difference in the perceived third season problems.

I have all three seasons on DVD, I'll go back and take a look at the episodes you noted.

It's hard for me to discuss the third season in negative terms or the series overall for that matter. I liked the entire series, the third season was my favorite.

[jharison]

Let's take a moment to consider the topic being discussed here: "Could the show have lasted longer?"

Sure…Creatively. Without a doubt. Absolutely. There were plenty of stories to tell, even if there are disagreements about what story line options would have best served the series.

But business-wise, maybe not so much, given where it landed in the ratings at the end of the 65-66 season.

I had read in TV GUIDE March of 1966 that MFM was meeting "sponsor resistance". And in fact, while watching the show that spring, instead of seeing a sponsored commercial, CBS put in its own promo for other CBS series. You knew that meant that MFM was in trouble if they couldn't sell sponsor time. That confirms the ratings problem.

So, as we mention in these posts, one solution to counter the drop in ratings was the addition of the Martian's young nephew. Whether it was done to accommodate Mr. Walston's wish to reduce his appearances on the series due to poor scripts or purely to try to gain back young viewers to the series, the idea was rejected by CBS as well as ABC, due to the lack of participation by Ray Walston.

I'm remembering back in middle school, as a devoted fan who would have been very happy to have a 4th season of MFM, my idea at the time was to move MFM to a different day and time slot during the week, opposite a program that would not have the same competition for an audience. But now, in retrospect, I believe that a scheduling change would not have solved the problem of the scripts continuing to be sub-par, unless a whole new writing team was brought in.

So, certainly, if the ratings problem had been solved, perhaps the show could have continued. But the question becomes, at what cost? The Andy story line that the producers selected would have drastically limited the adventures of Tim and Martin, even if Ray had continued his weekly role. Instead, in my opinion, the best path forward would have been to send Andy back home and so return to the basic premise of MFM and the chemistry of the actors in this sci-fi buddy comedy.

Interestingly, here is a podcast transcript from SHOKUS RADIO from 2008 of actor Wayne Stan who played Andy, discussing how his role came about.

(HOST) STU: Why did they put your show on {only} 3 weeks after you shot it?

WAYNE: They were thinking that this might regenerate the show and also trying to bring to a head what would happen with the future of the show...What I heard, is that they were still negotiating with Ray Walston, and they were trying to figure out how were going to proceed, if they were going to proceed with the series, and by really promoting this episode and putting it on a few weeks earlier than they might have, they could get an idea of what the ratings would be and what the reaction would be.

(HOST) STU: Wayne...they told you at the end of your shoot, you may be a regular next year, right? Something to that effect?

WAYNE: Yes. Actually I had a 5 year contract…

(HOST) STU: …So, to hear this, after one week on the show, you must have been on Cloud 9?

WAYNE: I was excited, but they also prepared me for the possibility that the show would not go on. They had also said that it was possible that it’s going to be cancelled. "We’re negotiating…we’re not sure if it’s going to continue…" They did prepare me for that—they really didn’t just build me up to say no.