GOOD TIMES a spin-off of MAUDE

[TVLegend]

Originally Posted by stevea

Sure, Lear would call it a spin off, since it was probably his idea to use Esther Rolle as the star (and probably saying, hey, let's just keep her as Florida). I wonder if Eric Monte would agree, since he and Mike Evans created the show. Monte sued Lear/Tandem/CBS for stealing his idea, and eventually won some residuals.

There is nothing in Good Times which would associate it with Maude, other than what was probably Lear's idea to use Rolle as the star. And maybe one Florida line in Good Times--saying she once worked as a maid.

Florida Evans was Maude’s maid. When they spun her off, they decided to give her the Good Times show that was already in development. There’s a reason why Florida mentioned working as a maid.

[stevea]

The sendoff from Maude was logical. The writing on Good Times should have explained how they were suddenly in Chicago, instead of making it seem like the Evanses were always there. Even if they didn't like the Henry name, they should have kept it anyway, even though it was an overused name from the All in the Family days.

I can just hear Lear, as he's leaving an ivory tower meeting, saying something like--leave her as Florida, and getting credit for "developing" Good Times. And then he washed his hands of the whole thing. Probably Rolle or Amos didn't like the name Henry, and some underling changed it to James--adding to the confusion.

John Rich or someone should have said, hey, we need to set this up a little better. Of course that was just the beginning of the behind-the-scenes problems for Good Times.

[TVFactFan]

Fractured spinoff

[TVFactFan]

Originally Posted by stevea

The sendoff from Maude was logical. The writing on Good Times should have explained how they were suddenly in Chicago, instead of making it seem like the Evanses were always there. Even if they didn't like the Henry name, they should have kept it anyway, even though it was an overused name from the All in the Family days.

I can just hear Lear, as he's leaving an ivory tower meeting, saying something like--leave her as Florida, and getting credit for "developing" Good Times. And then he washed his hands of the whole thing. Probably Rolle or Amos didn't like the name Henry, and some underling changed it to James--adding to the confusion.

John Rich or someone should have said, hey, we need to set this up a little better. Of course that was just the beginning of the behind-the-scenes problems for Good Times.

The reason why its in chicago is because Lear stole Eric Monte's idea of a black family living in chicago. So that's the main reason its not a spinoff to me because its not connecting

[BestTVever]

Originally Posted by stevea

Sure, Lear would call it a spin off, since it was probably his idea to use Esther Rolle as the star (and probably saying, hey, let's just keep her as Florida). I wonder if Eric Monte would agree, since he and Mike Evans created the show. Monte sued Lear/Tandem/CBS for stealing his idea, and eventually won some residuals.

There is nothing in Good Times which would associate it with Maude, other than what was probably Lear's idea to use Rolle as the star. And maybe one Florida line in Good Times--saying she once worked as a maid.

You are associating Good Times as the typical spin off launch. For example Maude had a spin off launch on its show when Archie and Edith visit Maude's daughter for her bridal shower on All In The Family. That does not happen in every scenario. Florida was so successful and funny on Maude that Norman wanted to give her a show. Its very similar how Norman saw Bea Arthur on All In The Family and wanted to give her a show. A good example is Benson. The character remained the same. Benson was too smart for the family, a smart a** butler. When he got his own show it was reality based unlike SOAP. There was no connection to its original show other than the character. However its still a spin off. If the actor playing Benson left the show and became a surgeon on a drama show, it would not be a spin off. The key is they built a show around his character and he was still named Benson. There still may have been a show called Good Times or another name about a black family living in the projects. But Norman used the successful and established character of Florida as the launch as a spin off from a successful show. Its a sneaky way to get more success.
Speaking of Good Times, there is an episode where JJ becomes a manager for a woman performing in a club. She was supposed to get her own show. It that had happened, it would have been a spin off of Good Times. Norman was using Good Times as the launch of a potential spin off. Look at Gimmie A Break with the episode where the girl steals from the store and was going to live with an older white guy. That was going to be a spin off and it would have had nothing to do with Gimmie A Break. Those would be considered spin offs even though the characters had nothing to do with the original show and just appeared in one episode. Florida was in every episode of Maude. Look at the countless spin off attempts from Facts of Life. There are all sorts of weird episodes of characters we never see again in settings that we never see again.

[Dr. Thong]

Originally Posted by BestTVever

There are only 2 people that say its not a spin off and they are on this board. They had nothing to do with the creation of the show yet they disagree with the creators of the show and think its not a spin off. Spin offs are not always perfectly transferred into the next show. Benson was a spin off of SOAP. The character Benson became a butler for the CA governor. Yet his SOAP life never mentioned again. But Benson was still the smart a** butler and character but in another show.

There was an episode of Benson where the ghost (or spirit) of Jessica Tate visited Benson. Of course, only he could see her.

[opus]

Originally Posted by Dr. Thong

There was an episode of Benson where the ghost (or spirit) of Jessica Tate visited Benson. Of course, only he could see her.

Actually two episodes. She was also on the show in an earlier season as a real person. And of course she was the governor’s cousin which was the connection that got Benson the job in the first place.

[TVFactFan]

Benson is a poor example, that show was well connected to Soap

[TVLegend]

If it were up to me, the very first episode of Good Times would have been about The Evans family relocating from New York to Chicago and moving in the projects. Henry would still be renamed James and Florida would mention working for Maude Findlay. But it was not up to me, it was up to Lear. He decided that it was not necessary to explain how the Evans ended up in Chicago. That doesn’t mean Good Times is not connected to Maude.

[TVFactFan]

Originally Posted by TVLegend

If it were up to me, the very first episode of Good Times would have been about The Evans family relocating from New York to Chicago and moving in the projects. Henry would still be renamed James and Florida would mention working for Maude Findlay. But it was not up to me, it was up to Lear. He decided that it was not necessary to explain how the Evans ended up in Chicago. That doesn’t mean Good Times is not connected to Maude.

It started like they always been living there

[stevea]

Originally Posted by TVLegend

If it were up to me, the very first episode of Good Times would have been about The Evans family relocating from New York to Chicago and moving in the projects. Henry would still be renamed James and Florida would mention working for Maude Findlay. But it was not up to me, it was up to Lear. He decided that it was not necessary to explain how the Evans ended up in Chicago. That doesn’t mean Good Times is not connected to Maude.

Agree. This is what should have happened. Monte was not involved in the first two scripts, and his pilot was not shown until the third episode. With all the infighting there was probably no thought given to a proper script explaining the Evans' move to Chicago.

Probably already seen by many, here is the story of Lear's and Monte's relationship. It's sad, and Lear is regarded as almost a saint by many:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdzYZ15aAUs

Note in this interview they are careful to not call Good Times a spin off, as they correctly call The Jeffersons.

[TVFactFan]

Im sure people at the time was wondering how Florida ended up in Chicago

[Dr. Thong]

Originally Posted by opus

Actually two episodes. She was also on the show in an earlier season as a real person. And of course she was the governor’s cousin which was the connection that got Benson the job in the first place.

I forgot about the first appearance. It's been so long since I've seen Benson.

[stevea]

One thing to correct, as I was reading thru this whole thread again. Several people say Norman Lear created Good Times (or is one of the creators), which is definitely not correct.
The show was created by Eric Monte and Mike Evans (the show's credits acknowledge this), who both collaborated to create it in 1971, before Maude was even aired. Lear developed the concept by giving Esther Rolle the starring role, and i assume he had a hand in casting the rest of the characters.

[TVLegend]

Originally Posted by stevea

One thing to correct, as I was reading thru this whole thread again. Several people say Norman Lear created Good Times (or is one of the creators), which is definitely not correct.
The show was created by Eric Monte and Mike Evans (the show's credits acknowledge this), who both collaborated to create it in 1971, before Maude was even aired. Lear developed the concept by giving Esther Rolle the starring role, and i assume he had a hand in casting the rest of the characters.

Lear giving Esther Rolle the Florida Evans role is what makes Good Times a spinoff. Why would Florida be on a show that had “nothing to do with Maude”? And why would Florida mention working as a maid in an episode when that was never even acknowledged on Good Times before that?