Would the show have had the same impact if Darrin was nicer? - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

Arfies · 10-06-2021, 03:52 PM

Much is made about Darrin being a patriarchal jerk when it comes to not wanting Samantha to use her magic. Besides providing a source of conflict for the show from which situations could arise, would the show as a whole have made as much of a cultural impact as it did had Darrin been nicer?

Case in point: if Darrin (and by extension, the rest of the mortal world) is portrayed as oppressive and fuddy-duddy, it makes the witch world (with its sheer freedom, powerful women, world-traveling, bohemian lifestyles, non-capitalism, free love, Alice B. Toklas brownies, gay uncles, etc.) look WAY more attractive and fun than the mortal status quo to the audience that would be watching the show. "Bewitched" as a whole is non-judgemental about all that; it's just the world Samantha's family comes from.

If Darrin was a super nice guy, you'd feel bad for him when witches cast spells on him. The witches would be the "bad guys" instead of the much cooler relatives. But since he deserves it sometimes, it's funny. (Schadenfreude!)

Dick York was Darrin · 10-15-2021, 02:54 PM

During which seasons? He was nicer in some seasons than he was in others.

Of course, you might be misconstruing being "mean" with just being freaked out at whatever vice Endora was putting him in.

Arfies · 10-15-2021, 08:33 PM

Season 5 especially Darrin started being written as meaner, even though he had been put through worse things before.

RetroGuy2000 · 10-16-2021, 01:53 PM

I remember the episode where Darren and Sam stay at Larry's cabin in the woods. Samantha, with Darren's reluctant permission, magics up a fixed version of the cabin. Darren seems "nicer", but the truth is, he's hypocritical: 'no magic... unless I approve it.' Then, on the way home, at the end, he and Sam get stranded on the side of the road. Darren actually pushes Sam to fix the car using magic. This episode drove me crazy because it wasn't about magical spells being bad, but about Darren's approval being needed to use magic. In this episode, he feels like the "patriarchal jerk" Arfies mentions. I guess that does play into the Witch World being seen as more fun.

Arfies · 10-16-2021, 09:03 PM

Something that stuck out to me in “The Magic Cabin” is when Samantha tries to convince Darrin to “let” her fix up the cabin, telling him he’s tired and deserves a vacation- Darrin refuses her help, saying “I’m not worried about me; I’m worried about you” (as she’s pregnant). She says, “okay; you talked me into it” and zaps it. Darrin looks genuinely impressed.

RetroGuy2000 · 10-16-2021, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arfies

Something that stuck out to me in “The Magic Cabin” is when Samantha tries to convince Darrin to “let” her fix up the cabin, telling him he’s tired and deserves a vacation- Darrin refuses her help, saying “I’m not worried about me; I’m worried about you” (as she’s pregnant). She says, “okay; you talked me into it” and zaps it. Darrin looks genuinely impressed.

Maybe Sam's approach all those years was wrong, since she was able to play the pregnancy card and get him to change his mind.

Arfies · 10-17-2021, 12:08 PM

Seriously; she should've played the "pregnancy card" more often, because Darrin was much more okay with witchcraft then! In "Take Two Aspirin," he's so worried about Sam that he doesn't even question following Aunt Clara's crazy directions to steal a black Peruvian rose, an ostrich feather, getting arrested, going to court, visiting a warlock apothecary, etc. He just does it.

RetroGuy2000 · 10-17-2021, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arfies

Seriously; she should've played the "pregnancy card" more often, because Darrin was much more okay with witchcraft then! In "Take Two Aspirin," he's so worried about Sam that he doesn't even question following Aunt Clara's crazy directions to steal a black Peruvian rose, an ostrich feather, getting arrested, going to court, visiting a warlock apothecary, etc. He just does it.

Haha! Good point!

Arfies · 10-19-2021, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RetroGuy2000

Haha! Good point!

Come to think of it, Darrin was just about ready to leave Sam in "Alias Darrin Stephens" ("Sam, it's through. Finished.") He loved her, but turning into a chimp was the last straw for him... until she told him she was having a baby!

TheLittleFaerie · 10-21-2021, 04:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dick York was Darrin

During which seasons? He was nicer in some seasons than he was in others.

Of course, you might be misconstruing being "mean" with just being freaked out at whatever vice Endora was putting him in.

Darrin would flat out start insulting Endora as soon as he came into the room... I've always said, I think Darrin and Endora could have halfway gotten along if Darrin hadn't started in on her 95% of the time

Arfies · 10-22-2021, 12:38 PM

I wonder if someone ever made a chart of “who started it” in every episode- Darrin or Endora. It varies.

RetroGuy2000 · 10-22-2021, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arfies

I wonder if someone ever made a chart of “who started it” in every episode- Darrin or Endora. It varies.

It's true: they both "started it" many times. But with Darrin being at a distinct disadvantage, you'd think he would have zipped his lip a bit more. I mean, considering what Endora could do, it would have made sense for Darren to at least try to show some decorum. I do love the moments when they make peace temporarily.

Samme · 10-22-2021, 04:00 PM

Sitcoms are built on conflict and problems. Smooth 'em out an you don't have a show. The idea is probably to push the conflict to the limit without making the characters unlikeable. Bewitched worked, partly because the original actors were so talented at walking that line. Maybe soften characters a little, but don't change the basic idea. But characters and actors tend to go wrong after a while.

Arfies · 10-22-2021, 04:08 PM

On the other hand, since Endora could literally turn Darrin into a twig and snap it, she could’ve just laughed in his face at the empty threats.

It’s like getting mad at Samantha’s angry pet hamster. He wouldn’t live very long at all compared to her, is not really a threat despite being a jerk sometimes, and makes her happy for the time being, so she could’ve just butted out. (I know her pride wouldn’t allow it).

Samme · 10-22-2021, 04:41 PM

Well, if she laughs it off they lose the conflict for that episode and have to find it somewhere else. And if they do that Agnes becomes less important and maybe walks away from the role. It also makes the show harder to write.

10-06-2021, 03:52 PM	#1
Arfies Memberific Frequent Poster Join Date: Dec 29, 2001 Location: There beneath the blue suburban skies, in summer, meanwhile back.... Posts: 481	Would the show have had the same impact if Darrin was nicer? Much is made about Darrin being a patriarchal jerk when it comes to not wanting Samantha to use her magic. Besides providing a source of conflict for the show from which situations could arise, would the show as a whole have made as much of a cultural impact as it did had Darrin been nicer? Case in point: if Darrin (and by extension, the rest of the mortal world) is portrayed as oppressive and fuddy-duddy, it makes the witch world (with its sheer freedom, powerful women, world-traveling, bohemian lifestyles, non-capitalism, free love, Alice B. Toklas brownies, gay uncles, etc.) look WAY more attractive and fun than the mortal status quo to the audience that would be watching the show. "Bewitched" as a whole is non-judgemental about all that; it's just the world Samantha's family comes from. If Darrin was a super nice guy, you'd feel bad for him when witches cast spells on him. The witches would be the "bad guys" instead of the much cooler relatives. But since he deserves it sometimes, it's funny. (Schadenfreude!)

10-16-2021, 01:53 PM	#4
RetroGuy2000 Julie,Julie Anne,&Felice 4Ever Forum Star Join Date: Dec 27, 2013 Posts: 16,914	I remember the episode where Darren and Sam stay at Larry's cabin in the woods. Samantha, with Darren's reluctant permission, magics up a fixed version of the cabin. Darren seems "nicer", but the truth is, he's hypocritical: 'no magic... unless I approve it.' Then, on the way home, at the end, he and Sam get stranded on the side of the road. Darren actually pushes Sam to fix the car using magic. This episode drove me crazy because it wasn't about magical spells being bad, but about Darren's approval being needed to use magic. In this episode, he feels like the "patriarchal jerk" Arfies mentions. I guess that does play into the Witch World being seen as more fun.
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10-15-2021, 02:54 PM	#2
Dick York was Darrin Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Feb 06, 2021 Location: Virginia Posts: 99	During which seasons? He was nicer in some seasons than he was in others. Of course, you might be misconstruing being "mean" with just being freaked out at whatever vice Endora was putting him in.

10-15-2021, 08:33 PM	#3
Arfies Memberific Frequent Poster Join Date: Dec 29, 2001 Location: There beneath the blue suburban skies, in summer, meanwhile back.... Posts: 481	Season 5 especially Darrin started being written as meaner, even though he had been put through worse things before.

10-16-2021, 09:03 PM	#5
Arfies Memberific Frequent Poster Join Date: Dec 29, 2001 Location: There beneath the blue suburban skies, in summer, meanwhile back.... Posts: 481	Something that stuck out to me in “The Magic Cabin” is when Samantha tries to convince Darrin to “let” her fix up the cabin, telling him he’s tired and deserves a vacation- Darrin refuses her help, saying “I’m not worried about me; I’m worried about you” (as she’s pregnant). She says, “okay; you talked me into it” and zaps it. Darrin looks genuinely impressed.

10-17-2021, 12:08 PM	#7
Arfies Memberific Frequent Poster Join Date: Dec 29, 2001 Location: There beneath the blue suburban skies, in summer, meanwhile back.... Posts: 481	Seriously; she should've played the "pregnancy card" more often, because Darrin was much more okay with witchcraft then! In "Take Two Aspirin," he's so worried about Sam that he doesn't even question following Aunt Clara's crazy directions to steal a black Peruvian rose, an ostrich feather, getting arrested, going to court, visiting a warlock apothecary, etc. He just does it.

10-22-2021, 12:38 PM	#11
Arfies Memberific Frequent Poster Join Date: Dec 29, 2001 Location: There beneath the blue suburban skies, in summer, meanwhile back.... Posts: 481	I wonder if someone ever made a chart of “who started it” in every episode- Darrin or Endora. It varies.

10-22-2021, 04:00 PM	#13
Samme Member Forum Regular Join Date: Dec 01, 2001 Posts: 679	Sitcoms are built on conflict and problems. Smooth 'em out an you don't have a show. The idea is probably to push the conflict to the limit without making the characters unlikeable. Bewitched worked, partly because the original actors were so talented at walking that line. Maybe soften characters a little, but don't change the basic idea. But characters and actors tend to go wrong after a while.

10-22-2021, 04:08 PM	#14
Arfies Memberific Frequent Poster Join Date: Dec 29, 2001 Location: There beneath the blue suburban skies, in summer, meanwhile back.... Posts: 481	On the other hand, since Endora could literally turn Darrin into a twig and snap it, she could’ve just laughed in his face at the empty threats. It’s like getting mad at Samantha’s angry pet hamster. He wouldn’t live very long at all compared to her, is not really a threat despite being a jerk sometimes, and makes her happy for the time being, so she could’ve just butted out. (I know her pride wouldn’t allow it).

10-22-2021, 04:41 PM	#15
Samme Member Forum Regular Join Date: Dec 01, 2001 Posts: 679	Well, if she laughs it off they lose the conflict for that episode and have to find it somewhere else. And if they do that Agnes becomes less important and maybe walks away from the role. It also makes the show harder to write.