Why didn't Julia Duffy/Allison Sugarbaker work - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

TMC · 08-30-2018, 03:32 AM

Delta Burke and Jean Smart's departures at the end of Season 5 is generally considered the moment that Designing Women jumped the shark. Season 6 with Julia Duffy and Jan Hooks as their replacements is ironically, the highest rated season of the entire seven year run. Julia Duffy's Allison however, was gone by the end of the year and replaced by Judith Ivey's B.J. for the seventh and last season.

Some theories that I've heard for why it didn't work out for Julia Duffy on Designing Women:

The Allison Sugarbaker character was written poorly as a one-dimensional "outsider". You add to the general feeling that Julia Duffy must have felt a tremendous amount of pressure to come in and replace the most popular cast member amongst a shell-shocked set.

Neither Allison nor Carlene had any of the charm of their predecessors, Suzanne and Charlene: they were written as too one-note. Also, while Julia Duffy and Jan Hooks were great comediennes, both characters were written for laughs only and neither actress could bring out the heartfelt moments regardless.

By the time she joined, Dixie Carter's Julia had to be right about everything, and Duffy's character was written simply to show how superior Julia was. In reality, Julia Sugarbaker was getting insufferable and preachy and she needed a strongly written foil.

They started her off on the wrong note, by having her storm in being a complete shrew. People were just immediately turned off. Suzanne could say and do terrible things but she unlike Allison, had a sweetness and an innocence about her. In the beginning both Mary Jo and Charlene were not happy with Suzanne, but Julia, always stood up for her sister, even when she was ashamed of her or disagreed with her. Eventually the others accepted her. This wasn't the case with Allison.

The one-note joke about Allison and Anthony battling over Suzanne's house went on far too long. It was just racist and, even worse, not funny. Her character never recovered from that start.

They introduced such a nasty character and in the process, made some of the existing characters nasty (esp. Mary Jo), since they were always getting in the mud with Allison.

Julia Duffy is a very low-key actress. She doesn't do way over-the-top very well. Dixie Carter, Jean Smart, Annie Potts, and Delta Burke all just seemed larger than life. The lower-key Duffy never really registered and as a result, it offset the dynamic of the show.

Wavy · 08-31-2018, 02:24 PM

I liked some of the Allison episodes. Preferred it to the final season.

TMC · 12-21-2018, 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wavy

I liked some of the Allison episodes. Preferred it to the final season.

I think another key problem with Julia Duffy is that she was ostensibly playing a variation of her character on Newhart. In other words, Allison was basically a northern woman being transplanted into a southern show. As I said before, Julia Duffy is with all due respect, more of a low-key type of actress. That type of acting style simply didn't mesh too well if she's playing against decidedly more broad and larger than life characters like her predecessor, Suzanne. Allison just came across as a wet-blanket. Another way to look at it is that Allison's character and dialogue could have worked in an ordinary "sitcom" but Designing Women was so tailored to "the character" that she just didn't flow or roll with the atmosphere. At the end of the day, she wasn't a "character" so much as a "caricature", if that makes sense.

'80sSitcoms · 12-21-2018, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMC

At the end of the day, she wasn't a "character" so much as a "caricature", if that makes sense.

Julia became the same way in the last season or two.

rcbrad · 12-21-2018, 08:21 PM

It seems that this was pretty much stated in the original well written post, but the others just did not seem to like Allison at all even from the beginning.

My point is that If the original characters did not like her, it would be hard to expect for the audience to like her as well. Therefore many did not like the character.

The producers later admitted that this was their fault regarding the Allison character and it should not be a reflection of Julia Duffy.

TMC · 01-06-2019, 01:56 AM

I wonder how things would've turned out had say Dixie Carter and Annie Potts left following Season 5 and Delta Burke and Jean Smart stayed?

horizonbeach11 · 02-09-2019, 08:18 PM

They also wrote Allison as a big loser, because anything she tried (getting married, the stupid movie thing with Charles Nelson Reilly, etc.) seemed to fall apart. I guess maybe the point of this was to have the nasty little shrew get her comeuppance and appear more human at the same time, but all it did was make her less funny and make her seem like a huge loser, especially next to the supreme Julia.

I also agree about the character of Mary Jo getting much meaner and as a result much less likable during this season. Mary Jo was always at her best playing one of the more sweet, vulnerable ones of the group along with Charlene. Mean didn't fit her at all.

TMC · 05-06-2019, 05:16 PM

A contrary opinion that I've read is that Season 6 with Julia Duffy was better written and overall had more memorable episodes. Judith Ivey's B.J. was just too affable and didn’t really make an impression the way Allison and her “Obnoxious Personality Disorder” did. Also, the show (to really no fault of Judith Ivey's) was running on fumes by Season 7.

TMC · 08-12-2019, 02:17 AM

Has Julia ever talked about her year on Designing Women? It had to be miserable. After just a few months, there were legitimate reports that they were looking to drop her. Then, knowing she wasn't going to be asked back, she had to do the last two episodes of the season with her replacement, Jackee Harry (whose offer to join the cast was rescinded thanks to Dixie Carter).

Apparently, Jan Hooks made a rather flippant remark to the press when they let Julia Duffy go. It was something along the lines of “glad I’m not her”! It makes you wonder how things would've turned out if Jan Hooks switched roles with Julia Duffy (with Jan playing a frigid ice queen and Julia playing a rube).

TMC · 08-15-2019, 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by horizonbeach11

They also wrote Allison as a big loser, because anything she tried (getting married, the stupid movie thing with Charles Nelson Reilly, etc.) seemed to fall apart. I guess maybe the point of this was to have the nasty little shrew get her comeuppance and appear more human at the same time, but all it did was make her less funny and make her seem like a huge loser, especially next to the supreme Julia.

I also agree about the character of Mary Jo getting much meaner and as a result much less likable during this season. Mary Jo was always at her best playing one of the more sweet, vulnerable ones of the group along with Charlene. Mean didn't fit her at all.

They also never softened Allison's character up a bit. She was too much of a one-note antagonist. She was just way too bitchy and annoying to believably not have been strangled by Julia at some point.

Stanwyck16 · 04-09-2020, 07:35 AM

When I first watched season 6 of Designing Women I was in high school. I hated Allison's character and was upset that Suzanne wasn't on the show anymore. Jan Hooks character filled a big hole that was left from Charlene being gone, as it wasn't until I was older that I actually came to appreciate what she brought to the show. Now watching it, I think she is hilarious, but at the time I just never really appreciated or missed her character when she was replaced by Jan Hooks, and I adored Jam Hooks character immediately. Still do.

So it puzzled me that even though I say and believe Suzanne is my favorite character on DW, the season I have watched more than any other season by far is season 6. It took a lot of re-watchings before I realized I didnt hate Allison's character at all. I actually LOVE her character. In the same way that Suzanne is a one woman show, Allison is too. But instead of being larger than life on the screen and tugging on your heart-strings, mostly fluff with a light mix of politics. Season 6 was when DW found its stride-but no one, not the writers, not the actors, and definitely not the viewers, who were watching in record numbers and liking it more even as they were hating Allison-even recognized or knew why.

The other seasons are great, but very emotionally charged, which can be draining. Season 6 was built for the long run. Julia Duffy played that character to perfection. Firing her was lunacy. I still wonder how amazing season 7 could have been if they had kept her around. DW is my fave show of all time, but I still haven't made it all the way through season 7. I just can't. It got so cringey and everyone's acting fell apart. I feel too sad for them when I watch it, and the show is supposed to be a comedy.

TMC · 08-18-2020, 03:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stanwyck16

When I first watched season 6 of Designing Women I was in high school. I hated Allison's character and was upset that Suzanne wasn't on the show anymore. Jan Hooks character filled a big hole that was left from Charlene being gone, as it wasn't until I was older that I actually came to appreciate what she brought to the show. Now watching it, I think she is hilarious, but at the time I just never really appreciated or missed her character when she was replaced by Jan Hooks, and I adored Jam Hooks character immediately. Still do.

So it puzzled me that even though I say and believe Suzanne is my favorite character on DW, the season I have watched more than any other season by far is season 6. It took a lot of re-watchings before I realized I didnt hate Allison's character at all. I actually LOVE her character. In the same way that Suzanne is a one woman show, Allison is too. But instead of being larger than life on the screen and tugging on your heart-strings, mostly fluff with a light mix of politics. Season 6 was when DW found its stride-but no one, not the writers, not the actors, and definitely not the viewers, who were watching in record numbers and liking it more even as they were hating Allison-even recognized or knew why.

The other seasons are great, but very emotionally charged, which can be draining. Season 6 was built for the long run. Julia Duffy played that character to perfection. Firing her was lunacy. I still wonder how amazing season 7 could have been if they had kept her around. DW is my fave show of all time, but I still haven't made it all the way through season 7. I just can't. It got so cringey and everyone's acting fell apart. I feel too sad for them when I watch it, and the show is supposed to be a comedy.

I'm kind of surprised in hindsight, that they didn't cast Gail O'Grady as Carlene. Gail O'Grady was in the series finale as Kiki Kearney. Maybe I say this because I could genuinely believe Gail (with her blonde hair, green eyes, and curvy frame) as being Jean Smart's sister than I could with Jan Hooks.

Kasey · 08-18-2020, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMC

I'm kind of surprised in hindsight, that they didn't cast Gail O'Grady as Carlene. Gail O'Grady was in the series finale as Kiki Kearney. Maybe I say this because I could genuinely believe Gail (with her blonde hair, green eyes, and curvy frame) as being Jean Smart's sister than I could with Jan Hooks.

I would have preferred Gail on the show as a semi-regular character rather than Sheryl Lee Ralph. Etienne was so cringe-worthy. They should have kept Jackee Harry.

RetroGuy2000 · 08-18-2020, 01:42 PM

I adored Julia Duffy as Stephanie in Newhart, but the Allison character was too snobby, without the flakiness of Stephanie. This made her far less likeable. The other Designing Women didn't seem to like her, and thus the audience didn't like her. If the audience doesn't like a character, but that character also isn't supposed to be a villain, the character ends up caught in the middle.

Allison was much like Kathy Bowman on Roseanne, but on Roseanne, the character was handled beautifully.

TV Guy · 08-20-2020, 01:08 PM

I loved Kathy Bowman on Roseanne, and I thought she was a wonderful recurring antagonist. She wouldn’t have worked as a regular - a little of her went a long way.

I’m always amazed at how poorly the Allison character was conceived. The snobbiness would have worked if they hadn’t been so heavy handed about it. And the whole “obnoxious personality disorder” thing undercut her from her first episode. They should have written her as a moderate snob who was intelligent and a good business woman and was a worthy foil of Julia. Instead, the other characters thought she was pathetic from the very beginning. What a waste of a talented actress like Julia Duffy. The cast change could have helped revitalize the show and prolong it. Instead, it limped through its final two seasons.

08-30-2018, 03:32 AM	#1
TMC Member Forum Idol Join Date: Jan 09, 2001 Posts: 125,181	Why didn't Julia Duffy/Allison Sugarbaker work Delta Burke and Jean Smart's departures at the end of Season 5 is generally considered the moment that Designing Women jumped the shark. Season 6 with Julia Duffy and Jan Hooks as their replacements is ironically, the highest rated season of the entire seven year run. Julia Duffy's Allison however, was gone by the end of the year and replaced by Judith Ivey's B.J. for the seventh and last season. Some theories that I've heard for why it didn't work out for Julia Duffy on Designing Women: The Allison Sugarbaker character was written poorly as a one-dimensional "outsider". You add to the general feeling that Julia Duffy must have felt a tremendous amount of pressure to come in and replace the most popular cast member amongst a shell-shocked set. Neither Allison nor Carlene had any of the charm of their predecessors, Suzanne and Charlene: they were written as too one-note. Also, while Julia Duffy and Jan Hooks were great comediennes, both characters were written for laughs only and neither actress could bring out the heartfelt moments regardless. By the time she joined, Dixie Carter's Julia had to be right about everything, and Duffy's character was written simply to show how superior Julia was. In reality, Julia Sugarbaker was getting insufferable and preachy and she needed a strongly written foil. They started her off on the wrong note, by having her storm in being a complete shrew. People were just immediately turned off. Suzanne could say and do terrible things but she unlike Allison, had a sweetness and an innocence about her. In the beginning both Mary Jo and Charlene were not happy with Suzanne, but Julia, always stood up for her sister, even when she was ashamed of her or disagreed with her. Eventually the others accepted her. This wasn't the case with Allison. The one-note joke about Allison and Anthony battling over Suzanne's house went on far too long. It was just racist and, even worse, not funny. Her character never recovered from that start. They introduced such a nasty character and in the process, made some of the existing characters nasty (esp. Mary Jo), since they were always getting in the mud with Allison. Julia Duffy is a very low-key actress. She doesn't do way over-the-top very well. Dixie Carter, Jean Smart, Annie Potts, and Delta Burke all just seemed larger than life. The lower-key Duffy never really registered and as a result, it offset the dynamic of the show.
	Last edited by TMC; 04-30-2019 at 09:20 PM.

05-06-2019, 05:16 PM	#8
TMC Member Forum Idol Join Date: Jan 09, 2001 Posts: 125,181	A contrary opinion that I've read is that Season 6 with Julia Duffy was better written and overall had more memorable episodes. Judith Ivey's B.J. was just too affable and didn’t really make an impression the way Allison and her “Obnoxious Personality Disorder” did. Also, the show (to really no fault of Judith Ivey's) was running on fumes by Season 7.
	Last edited by TMC; 12-03-2019 at 04:10 AM.

08-18-2020, 01:42 PM	#14
RetroGuy2000 Julie,Julie Anne,&Felice 4Ever Forum Star Join Date: Dec 27, 2013 Posts: 16,914	I adored Julia Duffy as Stephanie in Newhart, but the Allison character was too snobby, without the flakiness of Stephanie. This made her far less likeable. The other Designing Women didn't seem to like her, and thus the audience didn't like her. If the audience doesn't like a character, but that character also isn't supposed to be a villain, the character ends up caught in the middle. Allison was much like Kathy Bowman on Roseanne, but on Roseanne, the character was handled beautifully.
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08-31-2018, 02:24 PM	#2
Wavy Member Occasional Poster Join Date: Sep 16, 2017 Location: Trumbull, CT Posts: 94	I liked some of the Allison episodes. Preferred it to the final season.

12-21-2018, 08:21 PM	#5
rcbrad Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Jan 21, 2007 Posts: 479	It seems that this was pretty much stated in the original well written post, but the others just did not seem to like Allison at all even from the beginning. My point is that If the original characters did not like her, it would be hard to expect for the audience to like her as well. Therefore many did not like the character. The producers later admitted that this was their fault regarding the Allison character and it should not be a reflection of Julia Duffy.

01-06-2019, 01:56 AM	#6
TMC Member Forum Idol Join Date: Jan 09, 2001 Posts: 125,181	I wonder how things would've turned out had say Dixie Carter and Annie Potts left following Season 5 and Delta Burke and Jean Smart stayed?

02-09-2019, 08:18 PM	#7
horizonbeach11 Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Mar 05, 2018 Location: Inside a console TV Posts: 109	They also wrote Allison as a big loser, because anything she tried (getting married, the stupid movie thing with Charles Nelson Reilly, etc.) seemed to fall apart. I guess maybe the point of this was to have the nasty little shrew get her comeuppance and appear more human at the same time, but all it did was make her less funny and make her seem like a huge loser, especially next to the supreme Julia. I also agree about the character of Mary Jo getting much meaner and as a result much less likable during this season. Mary Jo was always at her best playing one of the more sweet, vulnerable ones of the group along with Charlene. Mean didn't fit her at all.

08-12-2019, 02:17 AM	#9
TMC Member Forum Idol Join Date: Jan 09, 2001 Posts: 125,181	Has Julia ever talked about her year on Designing Women? It had to be miserable. After just a few months, there were legitimate reports that they were looking to drop her. Then, knowing she wasn't going to be asked back, she had to do the last two episodes of the season with her replacement, Jackee Harry (whose offer to join the cast was rescinded thanks to Dixie Carter). Apparently, Jan Hooks made a rather flippant remark to the press when they let Julia Duffy go. It was something along the lines of “glad I’m not her”! It makes you wonder how things would've turned out if Jan Hooks switched roles with Julia Duffy (with Jan playing a frigid ice queen and Julia playing a rube).

04-09-2020, 07:35 AM	#11
Stanwyck16 Member First Time Poster Join Date: Apr 09, 2020 Location: Sacramento Posts: 1	When I first watched season 6 of Designing Women I was in high school. I hated Allison's character and was upset that Suzanne wasn't on the show anymore. Jan Hooks character filled a big hole that was left from Charlene being gone, as it wasn't until I was older that I actually came to appreciate what she brought to the show. Now watching it, I think she is hilarious, but at the time I just never really appreciated or missed her character when she was replaced by Jan Hooks, and I adored Jam Hooks character immediately. Still do. So it puzzled me that even though I say and believe Suzanne is my favorite character on DW, the season I have watched more than any other season by far is season 6. It took a lot of re-watchings before I realized I didnt hate Allison's character at all. I actually LOVE her character. In the same way that Suzanne is a one woman show, Allison is too. But instead of being larger than life on the screen and tugging on your heart-strings, mostly fluff with a light mix of politics. Season 6 was when DW found its stride-but no one, not the writers, not the actors, and definitely not the viewers, who were watching in record numbers and liking it more even as they were hating Allison-even recognized or knew why. The other seasons are great, but very emotionally charged, which can be draining. Season 6 was built for the long run. Julia Duffy played that character to perfection. Firing her was lunacy. I still wonder how amazing season 7 could have been if they had kept her around. DW is my fave show of all time, but I still haven't made it all the way through season 7. I just can't. It got so cringey and everyone's acting fell apart. I feel too sad for them when I watch it, and the show is supposed to be a comedy.

08-20-2020, 01:08 PM	#15
TV Guy Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Jun 25, 2001 Location: Boston, MA, USA Posts: 3,419	I loved Kathy Bowman on Roseanne, and I thought she was a wonderful recurring antagonist. She wouldn’t have worked as a regular - a little of her went a long way. I’m always amazed at how poorly the Allison character was conceived. The snobbiness would have worked if they hadn’t been so heavy handed about it. And the whole “obnoxious personality disorder” thing undercut her from her first episode. They should have written her as a moderate snob who was intelligent and a good business woman and was a worthy foil of Julia. Instead, the other characters thought she was pathetic from the very beginning. What a waste of a talented actress like Julia Duffy. The cast change could have helped revitalize the show and prolong it. Instead, it limped through its final two seasons.