Hi, guys and Happy New Year :wave:. Do you have a character that you really dislike? You can pick someone of the main cast, a recurring character or even someone that appeared in only one episode. I can say Kelly or Miko, since they're my least favorite.

Even though Kelly was really rotten in her introduction to the show, I still can tolerate her more than Molly. I just can't stand Molly. She has the worst facial expressions too. I think it's Emily Dickinson, there's a scene where Natalie says something about the pizza Tootie brings in. Molly has this arrogant expression as Natalie is speaking and it comes off she's wanting Natalie to shut up. Molly in real life really needed that stick removed from her ass because she was not better than the other girls in acting. I am so happy she only lasted 15 episodes. She was the worst mistake this show had.

Even though Kelly was really rotten in her introduction to the show, I still can tolerate her more than Molly. I just can't stand Molly. She has the worst facial expressions too. I think it's Emily Dickinson, there's a scene where Natalie says something about the pizza Tootie brings in. Molly has this arrogant expression as Natalie is speaking and it comes off she's wanting Natalie to shut up. Molly in real life really needed that stick removed from her ass because she was not better than the other girls in acting. I am so happy she only lasted 15 episodes. She was the worst mistake this show had.

I'm not a huge fan of Molly, in fact I would have picked her for the third position but Kelly was mean and rude towards Mrs. Garrett, she stole her food and her money. And both Kelly and Miko had that strange obsession for Jo :lol:

Of the main characters, the one I disliked the most was Jo. Couldn't relate to her at all and thought they excused too much of her criminal behavior early on. She reminded me too much of Chauchi from Happy Days who I absolutely despised.

As for a minor character, I would go with Rick. It was an odd relationship he had with Jo. The sudden marriage, her returning to live with the girls after their honeymoon. He seemed to be in the closet and Jo was his beard. That cross dressing scene certainly didn't change my mind on that.

Even though Kelly was really rotten in her introduction to the show, I still can tolerate her more than Molly. I just can't stand Molly. She has the worst facial expressions too. I think it's Emily Dickinson, there's a scene where Natalie says something about the pizza Tootie brings in. Molly has this arrogant expression as Natalie is speaking and it comes off she's wanting Natalie to shut up. Molly in real life really needed that stick removed from her ass because she was not better than the other girls in acting. I am so happy she only lasted 15 episodes. She was the worst mistake this show had.

Molly mentioned she had some kind of personality clash with Mindy so that look may have been real. She didn't say whether this occurred during the first season or sometime between the first or second after the Great Purge. Her lines with Natalie was cut out for the New Girl, Part 2. They apparently buried the hatchet when Mindy appeared on The Secret Life of an American teenager.

I'm not a huge fan of Molly, in fact I would have picked her for the third position but Kelly was mean and rude towards Mrs. Garrett, she stole her food and her money. And both Kelly and Miko had that strange obsession for Jo :lol:

Miko probably was the first lesbian cast member on the show. She had a serious crush on JO.

Pippa. Also not a fan of Kevin.

Of the main characters, the one I disliked the most was Jo. Couldn't relate to her at all and thought they excused too much of her criminal behavior early on. She reminded me too much of Chauchi from Happy Days who I absolutely despised.

As for a minor character, I would go with Rick. It was an odd relationship he had with Jo. The sudden marriage, her returning to live with the girls after their honeymoon. He seemed to be in the closet and Jo was his beard. That cross dressing scene certainly didn't change my mind on that.

I didn't know you disliked Jo. Yeah, she was very "tough" during her first year. It took her one/two seasons to calm down, in fact I like her most during the later seasons. I agree about Rick, that episode was very similar to the plot of Teenage Marriage

Molly mentioned she had some kind of personality clash with Mindy so that look may have been real. She didn't say whether this occurred during the first season or sometime between the first or second after the Great Purge. Her lines with Natalie was cut out for the New Girl, Part 2. They apparently buried the hatchet when Mindy appeared on The Secret Life of an American teenager.

Interesting. Maybe Molly had some kind of resentment towards Mindy, something like "You're not an actress but they kept you on the show and they fired me!"

Pippa. Also not a fan of Kevin.

You prefer Kelly over Pippa?? :eek::eek:

:lol::lol::lol:

Most of you already know my dislike of Pimppa, but I have to say that Kevin is even worse. At least Pimppa had a tie to Eastland. Kevin is just some random, vacant-eyed cutie played by Shirley Jones’ least-talented son (at least when it comes to acting). He had no business living with the girls.

Interesting. Maybe Molly had some kind of resentment towards Mindy, something like "You're not an actress but they kept you on the show and they fired me!"

This article and accompanied video shows Molly talking briefly about her relationship with Mindy Cohn.
https://toofab.com/2015/10/23/molly-ringwald-plead-the-fifth-facts-of-life/

I didn't know you disliked Jo. Yeah, she was very "tough" during her first year. It took her one/two seasons to calm down, in fact I like her most during the later seasons. I agree about Rick, that episode was very similar to the plot of Teenage Marriage

Never connected with Jo.

You prefer Kelly over Pippa?? :eek::eek:

:lol::lol::lol:

Slightly, I think.

Like, the writers absolutely ruined the character of Kelly, and they did so very quickly (just by making her completely unlikable and a weird Jo stalker), but there was no reason a "fifth girl" couldn't have worked, with the proper writing and planning.

By the time Pimppa came along, the show had lost its charm. Cast members were ready, at that point, to move on... some already had. The very Heart of the Show (Mrs. G.) had moved on. Pippa was now emblematic of everything that was wrong with the show: they were just throwing out fads to try to stay relevant: Spencer's Gifts! Shoulder Pads! Big Hair! Bull from Night Court! Pastels! Guest stars! Musical Guest Stars! Urchins! And finally: Australia!

But none of these desperate attempts at staying relevant could save the show, and weirdly, the writers made the main characters despise and mistreat a character (Pippa) they had taken in, a character for whom they supposedly cared. The chemistry between many characters was weird. Relationships seemed strained. But the relationship between the Core Four and Pippa was unusually weird.

Pippa herself was mostly brought in to enter Stage Left, say some mildly humorous Aussie slang, and then exit Stage Right. But imagine if the character had been from Central Africa. The same material, with changed nationalities, could never have aired today, because laughing at the Crazy Foreigner with the Funny Accent worked okay in the 1980s, but hasn't dated well. If the material isn't timeless, what is it doing in syndication?

Also, the set-up for Pippa, with her replacing her friend Franny, was so messed up and complicated. I will never even understand why the writers made Pippa's introduction so complex. There didn't even need to be a Franny, especially since no-one currently in the house ever even spoke to Franny! Just have Pippa come to the US, forging her father's permission to go to Eastland. Cut out the Franny impersonation altogether, and leave viewers less confused as to who this girl actually is!

Maybe, with some adjustments, the Pippa/Tootie brooch episode could have worked. But usually, Pippa was just an outcast, with no real connection to these older girls, and only a connection to Andy. We as viewers begin to dislike the Core Four at how they treat this girl. Yet there's never any resolution.

In an abbreviation: WTF?! It just feels like the writers didn't know what they were doing.

Most of you already know my dislike of Pimppa, but I have to say that Kevin is even worse. At least Pimppa had a tie to Eastland. Kevin is just some random, vacant-eyed cutie played by Shirley Jones’ least-talented son (at least when it comes to acting). He had no business living with the girls.

Yes.

And he's even a weirder stalker than Kelly. I know it was the 1980s, but my god! Did he really need to sniff their underwear? :eek:

Let's talk about Roy. Every time he walked on screen, I let out an "ugh." He was so annoying and never gave up when he made a pass at Jo, even though it was blatantly clear she wasn't interested.

URCHIN ANDY was the character i most disliked: that kid was always in the way and had absolutely no connection to the 'Core of 4'! (But i have to admit, that by bringing BEVERLY ANN to the show and adopting him, his presence had more meaning).

I know some of you have a strong dislike for PIPPA and KELLY, but at least those 2 kids weren't in almost 3 seasons, whereas that URCHIN KID was everywhere and sometimes for no reason at all!

Now about JO i'm going to have slightly disagree with you FOL FAN ITA: i actually liked her better during the early years when she was 'rough' and a troublemaker. During the later years, i found her rather catty and mean towards BLAIR at times! (She kept calling her shallow and insensitive).
JO even went far as to tell her one of her dates " once you get to know BLAIR, you realize that her shallowness is the deep part" and i absolutely disagree: anyone you can read between the lines will know that there has always been more to her than meets the eyes lol!

On the other hand, MOLLY didn't bother me as she did to you Christopher: she was my least favourite 'Lost girl', but i wouldn't go as far as saying she ruined the show and was the worst addition (URCHIN ANDY was in my opinion the worst and pointless addition to the show lol!).

The end....

On the other hand, MOLLY didn't bother me as she did to you Christopher: she was my least favourite 'Lost girl', but i wouldn't go as far as saying she ruined the show and was the worst addition (URCHIN ANDY was in my opinion the worst and pointless addition to the show lol!).

Molly was a social justice warrior character. She was telling us how to refer to them, what to buy when it came to foreign or American products, and all that crap. Molly wanted people to be like her and do things she thought was for the best. I can't stand people like that. I think we should all be who we want and do what we want because that's what makes us unique.

Molly was a social justice warrior character. She was telling us how to refer to them, what to buy when it came to foreign or American products, and all that crap. Molly wanted people to be like her and do things she thought was for the best. I can't stand people like that. I think we should all be who we want and do what we want because that's what makes us unique.




Boy! You really do hate MOLLY!!!!

:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent:brent

We now have a new generation of Mollys.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CCbQLohDjFE/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Let's talk about Roy. Every time he walked on screen, I let out an "ugh." He was so annoying and never gave up when he made a pass at Jo, even though it was blatantly clear she wasn't interested.

Talk about things that would never air today! :lol:

The bread vendor sexually harassing a student! He'd be fired in a heartbeat.

Molly mentioned she had some kind of personality clash with Mindy so that look may have been real.

What Christopher's talking about is actually a moment for her character. Molly Parker is supposed to look unamused/annoyed because Natalie delivered a bad joke as a punchline to a serious question Molly just posed.

I think Kelly is probably the overall for fans. Once you hurt Mrs. Garrett, that is your death knell for the TV burial yard. And in her case, it was.

So yeah, Kelly is probably my vote too.

I think we should all be who we want and do what we want because that's what makes us unique.

I don't agree to that without question, because it's wrong when when people spread lies and hate and get into corruption and hurt other people. So I think we should all be good and care about each other.

I don't agree to that without question, because it's wrong when when people spread lies and hate and get into corruption and hurt other people. So I think we should all be good and care about each other.

Well we should already know to be nice to others. That's not what I'm referring to. I'm referring to someone having to change completely how they are because a person tells us we're acting wrong. If she was educating instead of just telling people what to do, that would be different. But she is arrogant and pushy. Just let people be who they are and learn for themselves.

Yes, she needed years of experience and learning in order to become "a Mrs. Garrett". ('80s Dude made a post here last year where he recognized Molly often says essentially the same things as Mrs. Garrett to try and steer the girls right, but because of her youth and misguided passion and inexperience, she doesn't come off as well and so her words of warning aren't heeded)

Yes, she needed years of experience and learning in order to become "a Mrs. Garrett". ('80s Dude made a post here last year where he recognized Molly often says essentially the same things as Mrs. Garrett to try and steer the girls right, but because of her youth and misguided passion and inexperience, she doesn't come off as well and so her words of warning aren't heeded)

The scenes where I can think of where Molly says the same thing as Mrs. Garrett, but before Mrs. Garrett was telling Sue Ann it wasn't worth starving herself for a (stupid) boy, telling Tootie she shouldn't have accepted the extra change she mistakenly got from the pizza shop clerk in Emily Dickinson, and telling Sue Ann and Cindy that they shouldn't be fighting over a run because they were best friends in Running. Plus telling Mrs. Garrett she shouldn't go back with Mr. Garrett.

Well we should already know to be nice to others. That's not what I'm referring to. I'm referring to someone having to change completely how they are because a person tells us we're acting wrong. If she was educating instead of just telling people what to do, that would be different. But she is arrogant and pushy. Just let people be who they are and learn for themselves.

Molly has created a 2nd generation of Molly Parkers. Her 11 year old twins are the same age as Molly was when she started the Facts of Life.

Well we should already know to be nice to others. That's not what I'm referring to. I'm referring to someone having to change completely how they are because a person tells us we're acting wrong. If she was educating instead of just telling people what to do, that would be different. But she is arrogant and pushy. Just let people be who they are and learn for themselves.

It definitely would be hard to live with a character who was always a Social Justice Warrior.

I was thinking about this today, and how the Molly character was somewhat similar to Lauri Hendler's character in Little Lulu (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDt5NtLn4cM), the 1978 ABC Weekend Special about the feminist girl who takes on some male sexist pigs in her school. The special was meant to empower girls and make them feel like equals in a society that didn't always respect women. But it came off as horribly one-note, the boys acting like total jerks, the girls as heroines.

In the first few seconds of the film, we see the problem with the script: Lulu and her friends are staging a protest, picketing the boys' sports club. But while they are yelling for equal rights, something feels terribly off: they aren't protesting in front of anyone with the power to make decisions; they're just protesting in front of the boys in their school. The boys, being children, have no real power to keep the girls off their team; the girls should have simply contacted the coaches.

I can see where Molly could grate with some viewers. There are times when Molly's sense of social justice feel appropriate, and other times when the script calls for her to do things which don't feel intelligent, or like the ways a girl would fight sexism. Molly's dialogue comes off sometimes as artificial, or inappropriately-timed. In these instances, she feels like Lulu: protesting for the wrong people. But I feel like, with some tinkering, Molly's character had promise, because this was a show about empowering women, about female friendships. They needed scripts written by women, though, and not elderly men.

It definitely would be hard to live with a character who was always a Social Justice Warrior.

I was thinking about this today, and how the Molly character was somewhat similar to Lauri Hendler's character in Little Lulu (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDt5NtLn4cM), the 1978 ABC Weekend Special about the feminist girl who takes on some male sexist pigs in her school. The special was meant to empower girls and make them feel like equals in a society that didn't always respect women. But it came off as horribly one-note, the boys acting like total jerks, the girls as heroines.

In the first few seconds of the film, we see the problem with the script: Lulu and her friends are staging a protest, picketing the boys' sports club. But while they are yelling for equal rights, something feels terribly off: they aren't protesting in front of anyone with the power to make decisions; they're just protesting in front of the boys in their school. The boys, being children, have no real power to keep the girls off their team; the girls should have simply contacted the coaches.

I can see where Molly could grate with some viewers. There are times when Molly's sense of social justice feel appropriate, and other times when the script calls for her to do things which don't feel intelligent, or like the ways a girl would fight sexism. Molly's dialogue comes off sometimes as artificial, or inappropriately-timed. In these instances, she feels like Lulu: protesting for the wrong people. But I feel like, with some tinkering, Molly's character had promise, because this was a show about empowering women, about female friendships. They needed scripts written by women, though, and not elderly men.




Wait a minute Retro: was FOL written by elderly men???

:stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid:

Wait a minute Retro: was FOL written by elderly men???

:stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid:

Much of the first season was written by older guys. This may be why there are odd references to Tootie's sciatica. Well, maybe just one, but still.

Albert E. Lewin, who co-wrote "Molly's Holiday", was born in 1916. He was writing screenplays starting in 1949. Rowland Barber, who co-wrote "The Facts of Love", was born in 1920. Martin Ragaway, who wrote "The Return of Mr. Garrett" and "Dieting", was born in 1923. Jerry Meyer, who wrote or co-wrote many of the Season 1 episodes, had been writing for television since 1961 (still, he must have been a spring chicken compared to the other guys on the writing team).

Fresh blood was definitely needed. Linda and Margie were brought in, and wisely so... but they had some strange ideas about stereotypes. Tootie couldn't have a catchphrase, but Blair could? Tootie couldn't be on rollerskates, but Jo could be on a motorcycle?

Much of the first season was written by older guys. This may be why there are odd references to Tootie's sciatica. Well, maybe just one, but still.

Albert E. Lewin, who co-wrote "Molly's Holiday", was born in 1916. He was writing screenplays starting in 1949. Rowland Barber, who co-wrote "The Facts of Love", was born in 1920. Martin Ragaway, who wrote "The Return of Mr. Garrett" and "Dieting", was born in 1923. Jerry Meyer, who wrote or co-wrote many of the Season 1 episodes, had been writing for television since 1961 (still, he must have been a spring chicken compared to the other guys on the writing team).

Fresh blood was definitely needed. Linda and Margie were brought in, and wisely so... but they had some strange ideas about stereotypes. Tootie couldn't have a catchphrase, but Blair could? Tootie couldn't be on rollerskates, but Jo could be on a motorcycle?



Thank you for the detailed information Retro!

:thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks:

Linda and Margie were brought in, and wisely so... but they had some strange ideas about stereotypes. Tootie couldn't have a catchphrase, but Blair could?

Yup, because in Tootie's case it trapped her into being "the baby" with that wide-eyed naivete of "TGBT!" But Blair's IJHAOoMBI was ageless.

Tootie couldn't be on rollerskates, but Jo could be on a motorcycle?

I know they say somewhere about that partially being a stereotype, but it seems their biggest problem with that was, as Margie says with saucer eyes: "NO ONE ROLLER SKATES. IN. THE HOUSE."

I'm not saying they're right or wrong on these, just sharing where they're coming from, lol (according to Margie).

It is a little odd though that Margie confirms with such glee that they were met with NO resistance AT ALL in axing Tootie's catchphrase. She clearly sees that as a personal triumph.

But to be fair to the writers, I wouldn't say they were "elederly" men. I mean you can if you want to, but to me "elderly" is 70s or older. I'd just call them "older" until they hit "elderly" status IMO, lol.

But to be fair to the writers, I wouldn't say they were "elederly" men. I mean you can if you want to, but to me "elderly" is 70s or older. I'd just call them "older" until they hit "elderly" status IMO, lol.

:grr:

^--- :lol:

"Alright boys, let's get this here girls' school underway!" :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr:

^--- :lol:

"Alright boys, let's get this here girls' school underway!" :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr:

:brent Great writers room re-enactment pal!

Thanks buddy! Can't ya just feel the 1979-ness in the air?? :lol:

Thanks buddy! Can't ya just feel the 1979-ness in the air?? :lol:

Haha yep! Pass the- whatever 1979 popular snack item- over!

Haha yep! Pass the- whatever 1979 popular snack item- over!

Haha! Ol' Retsy'll tell ya what that was! :grr:

:lol:

Haha! Ol' Retsy'll tell ya what that was! :grr:

:lol:

Well I looked some up. How about Nabisco's Tid Bits?

Haha! Ol' Retsy'll tell ya what that was! :grr:

:lol:

It was crackerjacks. :lol:

I loved Tid Bits and miss them to this day!

Are we talking about Tootie’s “there’s gonna be trouble” catchphrase? I wonder why they wanted to get rid of it - I thought it was cute.

Are we talking about Tootie’s “there’s gonna be trouble” catchphrase? I wonder why they wanted to get rid of it - I thought it was cute.

Yup. Margie thought it was "bordering on stereotype" of pegging Tootie as the wide-eyed naive baby of the girls, so she wanted that "baby-ing phrase" gone. :rolleyes:

I think we all wish they'd kept it.

Yup. Margie thought it was "bordering on stereotype" of pegging Tootie as the wide-eyed naive baby of the girls, so she wanted that "baby-ing phrase" gone. :rolleyes:

I think we all wish they'd kept it.

I didn't get the sense that they thought it was a "baby" stereotype, but rather of the "wide-eyed black person" of the Minstrel Shows.

I clearly remember though, that on the episode '7 Little Indians' TOOTIE uses her catchphrase for one last time: "THERE IS GOING TO BE TROUBLE!!!!" (after 7 seasons hee hee!)

I clearly remember though, that on the episode '7 Little Indians' TOOTIE uses her catchphrase for one last time: "THERE IS GOING TO BE TROUBLE!!!!" (after 7 seasons hee hee!)

Actually after 6 seasons, because she says it once in season 2, and Mrs. Garrett says a variation of it in "Gossip" in season 2 as well. :)

I have a feeling I remember it being used once in, like, S3 or S4, too. Unlike the skates, they phased it out.

Actually after 6 seasons, because she says it once in season 2, and Mrs. Garrett says a variation of it in "Gossip" in season 2 as well. :)

Tootie says it in the s2 premiere and then in Gossip again.

All the characters should have had catch phrases, a la Happy Days.

I have a feeling I remember it being used once in, like, S3 or S4, too. Unlike the skates, they phased it out.

I don't think she does. I think that would really jump out and stick in memory while binging if she did that, and I don't have that memory. I think she doesn't say it after "Gossip" until "Seven Little Indians". If someone proves different though, then of course I'll concede, lol.

What's funny/interesting is that this is considered Tootie's "catchphrase", yet she only said it, what, 4 times in 2 seasons? (and then that one "cameo" of if in SLI). That's amazing and so cool that she is so fondly remembered for that.

Heck, Blair's catchphrase wasn't coined until season 2 at the earliest, and she said her "IJHAOoMBI" line several more times than Tootie ever said hers.

I don't think she gdoes. I think that would really jump out and stick in memory while binging if she did that, and I don't have that memory. I think she doesn't say it after "Gossip" until "Seven Little Indians". If someone proves different though, then of course I'll concede, lol.

What's funny/interesting is that this is considered Tootie's "catchphrase", yet she only said it, what, 4 times in 2 seasons? (and then that one "cameo" of if in SLI). That's amazing and so cool that she is so fondly remembered for that.

Heck, Blair's catchphrase wasn't coined until season 2 at the earliest, and she said her "IJHAOoMBI" line several more times than Tootie ever said hers.

She says it in the flashback Ep of s5 after focusing on her old catchphrase moments earlier

She says it in the flashback Ep of s5 after focusing on her old catchphrase moments earlier

She actually says it in the "then present time" of season 5, and not just in a flashback? If so, then wow, I had totally forgotten that. And I misspoke earlier based on my influence by valentina's post on this board in the past day that Tootie didn't say it from season 2 until season 7, lol. :p

She actually says it in the "then present time" of season 5, and not just in a flashback? If so, then wow, I had totally forgotten that. And I misspoke earlier based on my influence by valentina's post on this board in the past day that Tootie didn't say it from season 2 until season 7, lol. :p

Yep present time Tootie says it :D

I don't think she does. I think that would really jump out and stick in memory while binging if she did that, and I don't have that memory. I think she doesn't say it after "Gossip" until "Seven Little Indians". If someone proves different though, then of course I'll concede, lol.

Found it, based on Lorsie's excellent observation. It's at the very least around the 15-minute mark in "The Way We Were, Part 1", just after Blair breaks Jo's engine rebuild.

Yep present time Tootie says it :D

Wow!

JO's catchphrase would be "I got beer!"

Edna’s would be “Girls. Girls! GIRLS!!”

Edna’s would be “Girls. Girls! GIRLS!!”

:soapbox::soapbox::soapbox::soapbox::soapbox::soapbox::soapbox::soapbox:

I thought Roy was annoying.. I was wondering, did you dislike Jo the whole series or just when she was a troublemaker in the early days?

I liked dorky Roy, lol.

I liked dorky Roy, lol.
Haha! He was eh..... kinda a prototype Urkel

Haha! He was eh..... kinda a prototype Urkel

He kind of was, always asking Jo out, and always getting rejected.

Ironically, we should have seen him more often in the bakery era, where his bread-delivery skills could have come in handy.

He kind of was, always asking Jo out, and always getting rejected.

Ironically, we should have seen him more often in the bakery era, where his bread-delivery skills could have come in handy.

Haha yep

Ironically, we should have seen him more often in the bakery era, where his bread-delivery skills could have come in handy.

What's baffling is that they did use him in an early EE episode which felt so natural and was more continuity, but then they just dropped him after that*.

*(as a DeForest Bakery delivery boy--they did bring him back years later for a Valentine's appearance)

What's baffling is that they did use him in an early EE episode which felt so natural and was more continuity, but then they just dropped him after that*.

*(as a DeForest Bakery delivery boy--they did bring him back years later for a Valentine's appearance)

I agree it's baffling. Especially because the writers clearly wanted more guys in the picture: they brought in Andy and Kevin in Season 6. But Roy, who would have an actual reason to be in a bakery... no. :lol: