View Full Version : What Was The Real Reason Don Knotts Didn't Stay for The Duration


Duster76
01-07-2019, 05:10 PM
There was a recent thread asking the question What if Don Knotts had stayed, but maybe we should take a closer look at why he left in the first place. The public story is basically this, Andy had indicated at some point in the past he would end the series after five years, so Knotts went out and developed a deal for 5 films with Universal. Then Andy changes his mind, signs for three more years only to then find out Knotts had a verbally committed to a movie deal. There may have been more to this than meets the eye.

At the end of the 4th season, Jim Nabors who had only been with the series a year and a half gets a spin off. This may have rubbed Don the wrong way. Don was a critical component to the Griffith series, yet he was paid as a supporting player not a star, and now Nabors leapfrogs over him getting his own starring vehicle. This may have been the key turning point in the relationship between Don and The Andy Griffith Show.

Don didn't sign to do his own series, he signed to do a few movies, big deal. Dick Van Dyke did movies while his series was on, so did Fred MacMurray, it seems something could have been worked out so Don could stay on the show. The question is this, why wasn't it? The money was already set with CBS, the production company could have carved it up differently, Griffith owned a piece of the show maybe he could have reduced his salary (by this time it was pretty clear the series would have a long life in reruns so Griffith would realize the value in future years). Maybe they could have eliminated George Lindsey to save money, cut the number of episodes Don appeared in (maybe 15-18 a season).

My point, why wasn't a solution worked out?

Yong Fang
01-07-2019, 10:54 PM
I think it was just a case of Knotts thinking Griffith was going to end the show after five years, which he should have done, and Knotts getting into a very lucrative movie deal. Probably the movie company stipulated in the contract that Knotts couldnt work anywhere else and that was that.

Griffith and Knotts were best friends from that show in 1960 until Knotts died in 2006. I doubnt there was any animosity, it was just that Knotts thought the show was going to end and needed to find another job.

vitoscotti
01-09-2019, 05:08 PM
He got a big movie deal.

Duster76
01-11-2019, 10:11 PM
Vitoscotti stated:

"He got a big movie deal".

Well, he did get a 5 picture deal (which I covered in my post), "big", I wouldn't go that far. These pictures had several things in common, they were essentially populated by other TV talent (as a matter of fact a number of them appeared on TAGS), and all were modestly budgeted. In addition, only two of the five films were released during the run of TAGS. His third picture of the deal wasn't out until about eight months after the filming of the final TAGS episode. I don't see any evidence to suggest that TAGS couldn't have worked around a schedule like this (again Dick Van Dyke had more movies to his credit filmed while his series was on). And one final point, Don was working back in series television well before the last film was released.

There's more here than meets the eye.

Duster76
01-11-2019, 10:46 PM
Young Fang said:

"Knotts getting into a very lucrative movie deal".

I don't doubt he was making significantly more than on TAGS, but he wasn't getting movie star money.

"Probably the movie company stipulated in the contract that Knotts couldnt work anywhere else and that was that".

I doubt this is true. His films were filled with TV talent, TAGS alumni Hope Summers, Hal Smith, Paul Hartman, Maggie Peterson appeared in the films in addition to many other veteran character actors. My point Universal was certainly comfortable using talent that regularly appeared on the small screen. Any exposure Don received from being in on TAGS could only help the films.

"Griffith and Knotts were best friends from that show in 1960 until Knotts died in 2006. I doubnt there was any animosity, it was just that Knotts thought the show was going to end and needed to find another job".

They were friends all through this period, but business is business and I still feel that Nabors being handed a starring vehicle while Don was being paid second banana money might have motivated him to make other arrangements.

vitoscotti
01-12-2019, 02:20 AM
Don Knotts movies were a pretty big deal when they were released. I've never heard an iota of evidence of bad blood or jealousy during his stay on tags. I've seen them Knotts & Griffith together interviewed talking about Knotts movie offer. Knotts came to Griffith, Griffith gave his blessing that leaving tags may be necessary because of Knotts 5 year movie deal.. Knotts owed everything to Griffith for giving him his Barney Fife break.

For Knotts having tv actors in his movies that was common in a lot of 60s movies. I always believed Knotts made a huge mistake leaving tags. I thought he should have worked the movies in his tags down time. He still was comedically brilliant...proof with his tags color episodes. We'd have many more classic Knotts color episodes if he'd stayed.

The classic tags episodes can be watched over and over. His movies are good, but I can only watch them once in a blue moon.

Knotts career fizzled after his 5 year movie deal, and didn't get renewed for leads in movies. A lot of sitcom comedy actors just lose it when they hit a certain age like Knotts in the horrible threes company.

Yong Fang
01-22-2019, 11:11 PM
I thought Three's Company was a crappy show but getting Knotts was genius and he blended well with the other actors of the show.

Count Istvan Teleky
06-16-2019, 03:15 PM
Don Knotts was, is and always will be Barney Fife. 3's Co. was the right kinda show for late 70's early 80's and Knotts did add a little to it but the losing the Ropers was mistake for show IMO.

Schmo
10-30-2019, 01:38 PM
Knotts’ movies were basically Disney clones.

GentlemanJim
12-26-2019, 08:45 PM
My point, why wasn't a solution worked out?

I recall reading that the 5 year projection for the show's run was a factor (as others have mentioned)...Then the sponsors and the studio begged for more. So they made Andy Griffith an $$offer$$ he couldn't refuse.

Knotts had already made the movie deal, but that wasn't a prohibiting factor.

Griffith and his agent owned slightly over 50% of the show, and Knotts asked for his own percentage.

Nobody wanted to give up a share to accommodate Knott's request.

That's the story I recall reading, and I think it was Sheldon Leonard who ultimately convinced Griffith what a bad idea that would be. Concerned it might open up the gates for other cast members

Duster76
01-02-2020, 10:47 PM
I recall reading that the 5 year projection for the show's run was a factor (as others have mentioned)...Then the sponsors and the studio begged for more. So they made Andy Griffith an $$offer$$ he couldn't refuse.

Knotts had already made the movie deal, but that wasn't a prohibiting factor.

Griffith and his agent owned slightly over 50% of the show, and Knotts asked for his own percentage.

Nobody wanted to give up a share to accommodate Knott's request.

That's the story I recall reading, and I think it was Sheldon Leonard who ultimately convinced Griffith what a bad idea that would be. Concerned it might open up the gates for other cast members

Thanks, this information was helpful. The movie deal was given as a reason for many years, it never made any sense. I think Nabors getting the lead in his own series must have stuck in Don's craw, at that point there was no way he was going to stay with the series unless he received serious financial considerations. I understand what Don did, and I understand Andy's decision, he had the ink on a three year deal with or without Don.

GentlemanJim
01-03-2020, 12:29 AM
Thanks, this information was helpful. The movie deal was given as a reason for many years, it never made any sense. I think Nabors getting the lead in his own series must have stuck in Don's craw, at that point there was no way he was going to stay with the series unless he received serious financial considerations. I understand what Don did, and I understand Andy's decision, he had the ink on a three year deal with or without Don.

What I've posted so far, I read elsewhere. Now I am going to proceed with my own speculation, so be forewarned :eek:

They had to sweeten the pot considerably to get Griffith to sign on for the extension. I believe that is how he got the large percentage he was set to get.

Giving even a part his "raise" away to make Knotts happy, likely looked, felt, and smelled like a step backwards. I doubt Sheldon Leonard was any happier with the thought of giving up more of his share either.

If I had been in AG's shoes, I might have been tempted to say "Hey Don, we're willing to give you a big raise.....but that's as far as it goes"

Schmo
01-05-2020, 11:11 AM
To my knowledge, Don never publicly complained about feeling cheated or leaving the series on acrimonious terms. In retrospect, his departure may have kept the writers from running out of fresh ideas of what to do with his character.

loaferman
01-07-2020, 05:36 PM
To my knowledge, Don never publicly complained about feeling cheated or leaving the series on acrimonious terms. In retrospect, his departure may have kept the writers from running out of fresh ideas of what to do with his character.

One of the genius moves by the writers was to not have Barney in every episode. He had the potential to become an early version of Fonzie. As far as Knotts leaving I have read that the idea of him wanting a percentage was floated but nobody was budging on that. I don't think his leaving gave the writers fresh ideas as many episodes were kind of a repeat of past plots or another "Aunt Bee...(learns to fly, drive, do a TV show, etc.). None of the new characters was anywhere near a Barney or even Floyd such as Howard, Sam and Emmett. If you can read the book "Andy and Don" it answers a lot of things very well.

Obviously his movie deal did allow him to appear a couple of times, but "color Mayberry" to me just was never he same, even when Don appeared.

GentlemanJim
01-07-2020, 09:36 PM
"color Mayberry" to me just was never he same, even when Don appeared.

I think that with the 6 oclock news showing police beating students with riot batons, America's perception of law enforcement changed over the course of the show also. I think re-inventing the show around Howard and Emmett was an attempt to address that....but it just didn't work.

The "town drunk" flaunting the law in 1960 was innocent fun. But by 1968 America wasn't so innocent anymore.

I also seem to remember that the Federal gov't started working through covert channels to reward content creators for creating program material that championed Law enforcement, and programming that made light of law enforcement was discouraged.

The "Partnership for a drug free America" was one such entity that was used to funnel federal money intended to encourage cooperation. There were others, usually employing the word "education" in their name (fwiw)

Schmo
02-15-2020, 03:07 PM
When it comes down to which decision was worse - Knotts leaving the series or Griffith deciding to stay for three more seasons - I guess it’s a toss-up.

Mayberry'sBadBoy
02-16-2020, 04:31 PM
One further thing that might've influenced Knotts decision to leave TAGs for the movies was Bob Ross becoming the new Producer for Season 5 and ushering in a change of tone for the series. Unlike Aaron Reuben Ross was more willing to have nastiness in Mayberry which resulted in several episodes where Andy and Barney severely butted heads and episodes where Barney acted extremely angry or extremely annoyed (The Luck of Newton Monroe and Opie flunks Arithmetic come to mind). The only episode in the first four season that comes close to this is Season 3's One-Punch Opie and that has the excuse that that episode was repeatedly hacked to pieces and rewritten enough times to the point it should've been dropped. From what I've read Knotts did not care for these sorts of plots and realizing that this was going to be the future combined with Griffith's increasing fights with George Lindsey and Francis Bavier might have influenced him to leave for a less stressful environment. Knotts had grown up with an abusive schizophrenic father and I doubt he wanted Barney to be viewed anywhere near like that.

GentlemanJim
06-18-2022, 08:38 PM
I just watched a 1966 episode (season 4) of McHale's Navy titled "Little Red Riding Doctor".

In it, Don Knotts makes a guest appearance. The role was not the kind you would expect for a "conquering hero". It was very much the kind of bit part you'd expect for someone who was looking for work.

So, the stories alleging knotts left to pursue golden horizons, seems a bit dubious to me.

Mayberry'sBadBoy
06-19-2022, 07:20 PM
I just watched a 1966 episode (season 4) of McHale's Navy titled "Little Red Riding Doctor".

In it, Don Knotts makes a guest appearance. The role was not the kind you would expect for a "conquering hero". It was very much the kind of bit part you'd expect for someone who was looking for work.

So, the stories alleging knotts left to pursue golden horizons, seems a bit dubious to me.

Part of it might've been Don struggling with revisiting a similar part he hadn't done in a decade (Don played a similar doctor in No Time for Sergeants where he did Will Stockdale (played by Andy Griffith in an amusing role reversal) Manual dexterity test. That was the first time the two worked together) and the other part might've been Don's homelife unravelling making him worried about alimony. 1966 was the year Don Knott's first wife and mother to Karen Knotts left him because she found out he was having a fair because as part of psychological healing he confessed it to her. Those two things probably were why he was doing the bit parts.

GentlemanJim
06-19-2022, 07:57 PM
You know how some insist the TAGS episode "Banjo Playing Deputy" was a litmus to test how Jerry Van Dyke might fit in to the Mayberry cast?

I couldn't help feeling like the "Little Red Riding Doctor" episode of McHale might have been a similar "casting call" type role for Knotts. Especially the way they had him disguised like a woman, reminiscent of the Darlings Wedding episode on TAGS......almost as if to say "well, that bit was funny, let's give it a try here and see how it goes over" ?

Road Dog
06-19-2022, 08:01 PM
Don's daughter, Karen, addressed this very question in an interview shortly after the 'Andy and Don' book was published. She said Don really was convinced Andy was going to end the show after the 5th season. So Don started looking for work. She said her father's negotiations on the Universal movie deal were still in progress when Andy decided to continue TAGS for at least 3 more seasons. Don wasn't sure what to do, but his wife encouraged him to take the movie deal since it would mean a substantial pay increase, plus Andy and executive producer Sheldon Leonard assured Don that he was welcome to return to TAGS as his schedule permitted. BTW, his daughter also mentioned that Don was offered the opportunity to be Jack Benny's sidekick in a revival of 'The Jack Benny Program' in the early 70's after Benny's usual sidekick, Eddie 'Rochester' Anderson declined to participate. Don was ready to sign-on, but the series had to be delayed (and eventually postponed) due to Benny's declining health.

Duster76
06-20-2022, 01:12 PM
You know how some insist the TAGS episode "Banjo Playing Deputy" was a litmus to test how Jerry Van Dyke might fit in to the Mayberry cast?

I couldn't help feeling like the "Little Red Riding Doctor" episode of McHale might have been a similar "casting call" type role for Knotts. Especially the way they had him disguised like a woman, reminiscent of the Darlings Wedding episode on TAGS......almost as if to say "well, that bit was funny, let's give it a try here and see how it goes over" ?

With respect to Don's McHale's Navy appearance, both the series and Don's movie The Ghost and Mr. Chicken were Universal products. The film was in release at the time and Easter recess was about a month off, the TV appearance was timed to give Don some exposure with the ultimate goal to drive audience interest in seeing Don in a film. Don's Andy Griffith Show appearances in season 6 were timed immediately ahead of the release of The Ghost and Mr. Chicken.

Duster76
06-20-2022, 02:15 PM
[QUOTE=Road Dog;6063695]Don's daughter, Karen, addressed this very question in an interview shortly after the 'Andy and Don' book was published. She said Don really was convinced Andy was going to end the show after the 5th season. So Don started looking for work. She said her father's negotiations on the Universal movie deal were still in progress when Andy decided to continue TAGS for at least 3 more seasons. Don wasn't sure what to do, but his wife encouraged him to take the movie deal since it would mean a substantial pay increase, plus Andy and executive producer Sheldon Leonard assured Don that he was welcome to return to TAGS as his schedule permitted. BTW, his daughter also mentioned that Don was offered the opportunity to be Jack Benny's sidekick in a revival of 'The Jack Benny Program' in the early 70's after Benny's usual sidekick, Eddie 'Rochester' Anderson declined to participate. Don was ready to sign-on, but the series had to be delayed (and eventually postponed) due to Benny's declining health.

With all due respect to Don's daughter, I think even Don admitted there was more to it than that. Don was a very important part of the success of the series, when Jim Nabors was given the spin-off a line had been crossed. It was now up to Don and his agent to establish what Don's value to the series actually was and to ask to be compensated at that level. Don wanted some percent of ownership to continue, he was turned down, so he left the series. The idea that he could not do these movies while working on the series is folderol. Why couldn't he, other actors in TV series were doing movies, Dean Martin with his own variety series turned out 6 movies from 66-67. No one is the bad guy here, this is just business, Don understood that and Andy understood it. Andy has his money from CBS for the final three seasons with or without Don. From a negotiating standpoint, Don couldn't get much and Andy couldn't give much, that's just the way it was.

I don't know about this Jack Benny business. Jack had been doing specials for NBC (I think they were billed as Farewell Specials), maybe Don was going to be his sidekick on those. I can't imagine Jack in his late 70's at this point doing a regular series or any network being interested in something like that.

GentlemanJim
06-20-2022, 04:05 PM
, the TV appearance was timed to give Don some exposure with the ultimate goal to drive audience interest in seeing Don in a film. .

If that was the case, the role in McHale was not very flattering. I guess the old axiom about it not mattering so much what they are saying, as it does that it is you they are talking about, comes into play?

SarahBellum
06-20-2022, 04:58 PM
Other actors in TV series were doing movies, Dean Martin with his own variety series turned out 6 movies from 66-67.

And Dino was also recording LPs and appearing in Vegas.

Mayberry'sBadBoy
06-20-2022, 05:04 PM
[QUOTE=Road Dog;6063695]Don's daughter, Karen, addressed this very question in an interview shortly after the 'Andy and Don' book was published. She said Don really was convinced Andy was going to end the show after the 5th season. So Don started looking for work. She said her father's negotiations on the Universal movie deal were still in progress when Andy decided to continue TAGS for at least 3 more seasons. Don wasn't sure what to do, but his wife encouraged him to take the movie deal since it would mean a substantial pay increase, plus Andy and executive producer Sheldon Leonard assured Don that he was welcome to return to TAGS as his schedule permitted. BTW, his daughter also mentioned that Don was offered the opportunity to be Jack Benny's sidekick in a revival of 'The Jack Benny Program' in the early 70's after Benny's usual sidekick, Eddie 'Rochester' Anderson declined to participate. Don was ready to sign-on, but the series had to be delayed (and eventually postponed) due to Benny's declining health.

With all due respect to Don's daughter, I think even Don admitted there was more to it than that. Don was a very important part of the success of the series, when Jim Nabors was given the spin-off a line had been crossed. It was now up to Don and his agent to establish what Don's value to the series actually was and to ask to be compensated at that level. Don wanted some percent of ownership to continue, he was turned down, so he left the series. The idea that he could not do these movies while working on the series is folderol. Why couldn't he, other actors in TV series were doing movies, Dean Martin with his own variety series turned out 6 movies from 66-67. No one is the bad guy here, this is just business, Don understood that and Andy understood it. Andy has his money from CBS for the final three seasons with or without Don. From a negotiating standpoint, Don couldn't get much and Andy couldn't give much, that's just the way it was.

I don't know about this Jack Benny business. Jack had been doing specials for NBC (I think they were billed as Farewell Specials), maybe Don was going to be his sidekick on those. I can't imagine Jack in his late 70's at this point doing a regular series or any network being interested in something like that.

Mildly off-topic but Carol Burnett was a fan of Jack Benny and given her show was doing well they might have gotten somewhere if she had used her show as a way of spinning it off like Mama's family and if you had tailored it so that Benny could be replaced by someone else (Like have Hans Conried on standby as a relative of Bennys) could take over.

vitoscotti
06-21-2022, 07:54 PM
Don Knotts still had his comedic brilliance in the TAGS color episode visits. There could of been so many more of his hilarious episodes if he stayed. That always was my main concern. Not why he left.

UCpL3qItQWE

Schmo
06-22-2022, 06:22 PM
Regardless of the “real” reason Knotts left TAGS, I think he did so at the right time. The quality of the writing slipped in the color era. I can’t see how the on-screen chemistry between Griffith and Knotts could remain strong without “Flanderization” setting in.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Flanderization

Duster76
06-23-2022, 12:02 AM
Regardless of the “real” reason Knotts left TAGS, I think he did so at the right time. The quality of the writing slipped in the color era. I can’t see how the on-screen chemistry between Griffith and Knotts could remain strong without “Flanderization” setting in.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Flanderization

The scripts used in the Warren episodes were in reality reworked scripts meant originally for the Barney character, I think that's pretty clear. So getting back to your point about the possible "Flanderization", I'm not sure that would have applied in this case. I think there is some evidence to suggest that the production team might have been leaning in the direction of having Barney footloose and fancy free. That type of situation would have been right in Don's wheelhouse, he could have done so much with it. In Episode 15 season 6, "Girl-Shy" Warren becomes a sleepwalking Casanova and makes a play for Helen. Assuming that this situation was originally intended for the Barney character, it could have been explained by the fact that Barney and Thelma Lou had broken up and she had moved away (all of course happening off screen). "The Return of Barney Fife" episode 17 season 6 is essentially a reworked version of "Class Reunion" from season 3, the reunion could have played the same as it did wrapping up the Barney/Thelma Lou situation and opening Barney to new romantic adventures (in Barney's case misadventures), giving the writers a lot of additional storylines to explore.

SarahBellum
06-23-2022, 12:41 PM
Regardless of the “real” reason Knotts left TAGS, I think he did so at the right time. The quality of the writing slipped in the color era. I can’t see how the on-screen chemistry between Griffith and Knotts could remain strong without “Flanderization” setting in.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Flanderization

Plus Opie was older and no longer the cute little boy that he was originally. And Gomer had been replaced by Goober who was not nearly as endearing. And Floyd was basically reduced to cameo appearances due to his declining health.

Dude111
06-23-2022, 01:19 PM
Don Knotts is awesome!!!!!

ThisLittlePiggy
06-26-2022, 01:01 PM
I've heard they were very good friends in real life so I highly doubt he would have pushed him out. I think he just wanted to spread his wings and try other things. In fact, I think I heard Andy was pretty upset when he left the show.

Duster76
06-28-2022, 01:11 PM
I've heard they were very good friends in real life so I highly doubt he would have pushed him out. I think he just wanted to spread his wings and try other things. In fact, I think I heard Andy was pretty upset when he left the show.

"I highly doubt he would have pushed him out".

He definitely wasn't pushed out, that's true.

"I heard Andy was pretty upset when he left the show".

I'm sure he was very upset when Don left the show.

Those statement are true but that's not what's under discussion. Don was a big part of the reason the show was so successful the first five seasons, he wanted to be compensated for that. Andy had a deal for three more seasons and that deal was not contingent on Don being on the series. It made getting a deal done next to impossible. Andy understood that and Don to his credit understood that.

ThisLittlePiggy
06-28-2022, 07:16 PM
"I highly doubt he would have pushed him out".

He definitely wasn't pushed out, that's true.

"I heard Andy was pretty upset when he left the show".

I'm sure he was very upset when Don left the show.

Those statement are true but that's not what's under discussion. Don was a big part of the reason the show was so successful the first five seasons, he wanted to be compensated for that. Andy had a deal for three more seasons and that deal was not contingent on Don being on the series. It made getting a deal done next to impossible. Andy understood that and Don to his credit understood that.

I see what you're saying. That makes sense.

vitoscotti
06-29-2022, 10:02 AM
Two guys having a bitter falling out conspiracy theory who spoke highly of each other, worked together after TAGS, seems a flawed conspiracy theory. Also, the linking of the scripted attitudes of the characters they portrayed on TAGS into the actors real life views is priceless.

Duster76
06-29-2022, 10:39 PM
[QUOTE=vitoscotti;6066998]Two guys having a bitter falling out conspiracy theory who spoke highly of each other, worked together after TAGS, seems a flawed conspiracy theory. Also, the linking of the scripted attitudes of the characters they portrayed on TAGS into the actors real life views is priceless.

Where is there a suggestion that Andy and Don had a bitter falling out? Business decisions were made, Don wanted some ownership consideration to continue in the series, he had met his initial commitment, Andy was unwilling to give up any ownership percentage because it would have been prohibitively expensive. Both Don and Andy acknowledged this negotiation in separate interviews. Again, I think both understood the other's position, so the friendship survived. Why do you insist this is a conspiracy theory, you have two parties with different interests that could not reach agreement, in contract negotiations things like this happen.

"the linking of the scripted attitudes of the characters they portrayed on TAGS into the actors real life views is priceless".

I'm not sure what's being referred to, could you give a specific example(s).

Schmo
06-30-2022, 05:50 PM
[QUOTE=vitoscotti;6066998]Two guys having a bitter falling out conspiracy theory who spoke highly of each other, worked together after TAGS, seems a flawed conspiracy theory. Also, the linking of the scripted attitudes of the characters they portrayed on TAGS into the actors real life views is priceless.

Where is there a suggestion that Andy and Don had a bitter falling out? Business decisions were made, Don wanted some ownership consideration to continue in the series, he had met his initial commitment, Andy was unwilling to give up any ownership percentage because it would have been prohibitively expensive. Both Don and Andy acknowledged this negotiation in separate interviews. Again, I think both understood the other's position, so the friendship survived. Why do you insist this is a conspiracy theory, you have two parties with different interests that could not reach agreement, in contract negotiations things like this happen.

"the linking of the scripted attitudes of the characters they portrayed on TAGS into the actors real life views is priceless".

I'm not sure what's being referred to, could you give a specific example(s).
“Vitoscotti” likely believes Griffith and Knotts resented each other in real life. It’s easy to see why. We’ve heard a lot of stories (some true, some not) about co-stars not getting along.

Yong Fang
07-07-2022, 05:46 AM
The cast of the color shows were not as funny as the black and white shows. Howard Sprague. Emmit and Goober Pyle as a main character were just not like the original people.

Mayberry'sBadBoy
07-08-2022, 07:34 PM
The cast of the color shows were not as funny as the black and white shows. Howard Sprague. Emmit and Goober Pyle as a main character were just not like the original people.

I think a lot of it had to do with three things: Changes in writing staff The Sheriff theme being downplayed in later seasons and the fact that, for lack of a better term, Mayberry started to become more Urban. Almost all the classic TAGS episodes were written by a group of writers who i called The Big Five Harvey Bullock and the writing teams of Bill Idelson/Sam Brobeck and of course Jim Fritzell/Everette Greenbaum. The Fritzell-Greenbaum team left after Season 5, Bullock left after Season 6 and the episodes the Idelson/Brobeck team seemed to tailor their series towards inoffensive humor as TAGS transitioned to Mayberry RFD.

The second change was Andy's role as Sheriff being reduced. Being a Sheriff meant that Andy had to deal with disputes and also things that come with being a sheriff: attending town meetings, doing inventory, putting up signs and helping Barney practice his defense techniques. Not only do these provide humor/allow memorable moments, but when Andy is required to act tough/mean he has a way of doing it without making mad plus he also has other people to get mad like Barney. I think a lot of people forget that there are several episodes in the Black and White series where Barney lets his temper get the better of him but bar "The Luck of Newton Monroe" and "One-Punch Opie" the audience doesn't want to strangle him like they do in the color episodes either because he has a right to be mad or because he gets his comeuppance, which is something that is sorely missing from the colored episodes where Andy is just angry with next to no punishment. In addition reducing the role means Andy has to find some other conflict which brings me to my next point

After the sixth season TAGS Starts to become more Urban. The Mayberry Train Station almost completely replaces the bus station and there are more plots that focus on urban matters. While there are rural feels even that is still kept urban like the fishing scene in Old Sam is more what you'd expect from a midsize town as opposed to the fishing episodes beforehand. Consequently, this means Andy and other characters spend the episode angry and even when put to good use (Dinner at 8) it's still irritating because how it's all the same concept: A new change comes to Mayberry (In that episode Aunt Bea and Opie goes away for the weekend leaving Andy home alone) and that results in everyone mad/sick. Naturally when all your actors can do is grouse (Emmet and Goober) or act Sick (Howard) it makes it a chore to watch and that's not even getting into the fact it's obvious the star is just there for the paycheck.

TL;DR Good Writers+Finding Something for Andy to do when the sheriff theme downplayed+ not having the same plot about change making people angry/sick be the driving point for most of the episodes (with the only alternative being Hellcat Helen jealous Andy looked in the direction of another woman) would've made bad characters Goober, Howard Emmett, Emmett's wife and Sam Jones much more tolerable.

Duster76
07-10-2022, 12:04 AM
TAGS changed formats during the 6th season, it went from a comedy series to a slice of life series. The show focused on telling stories about the characters or situations in Mayberry. As it turned out when Don left he took all the comedy of the series with him. Andy really didn't want to do comedy, Jack Burns was brought in to play Warren providing the comedy for the series but the character didn't get over and Jack was let go. We often think of the Howard character as being Warren's replacement, but actually the character adds clarity to the direction of the series, from that point on the show was going to be story based, some might have a little humor but the aim was really mellow slice of life stories.

Here's the thing the idea worked! Unlike Bewitched the show remained a huge hit over the final three seasons and RFD basically kept that premise successfully going for another three seasons.

TVShowAddict
08-06-2022, 12:17 PM
Don Knotts movies were a pretty big deal when they were released. I've never heard an iota of evidence of bad blood or jealousy during his stay on tags. I've seen them Knotts & Griffith together interviewed talking about Knotts movie offer. Knotts came to Griffith, Griffith gave his blessing that leaving tags may be necessary because of Knotts 5 year movie deal.. Knotts owed everything to Griffith for giving him his Barney Fife break.

For Knotts having tv actors in his movies that was common in a lot of 60s movies. I always believed Knotts made a huge mistake leaving tags. I thought he should have worked the movies in his tags down time. He still was comedically brilliant...proof with his tags color episodes. We'd have many more classic Knotts color episodes if he'd stayed.

The classic tags episodes can be watched over and over. His movies are good, but I can only watch them once in a blue moon.

Knotts career fizzled after his 5 year movie deal, and didn't get renewed for leads in movies. A lot of sitcom comedy actors just lose it when they hit a certain age like Knotts in the horrible threes company.

Knotts did not make a huge mistake leaving the show, Griffith made a huge mistake continuing the show when he is supposed to end it after 5 years

Schmo
08-06-2022, 07:32 PM
Knotts’s movies haven’t aged well.

vitoscotti
08-06-2022, 08:13 PM
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Schmo
08-08-2022, 08:13 PM
Knotts did not make a huge mistake leaving the show, Griffith made a huge mistake continuing the show when he is supposed to end it after 5 years

The ratings remained high and Griffith made a lot of money. But like Knotts, he had a hard time escaping from the show’s shadow.