I've created this thread because Ginger is a 'love her or hate her' kind of character. I don't think any of the other castaways stir up such extreme emotions among viewers ( particularly female viewers) and certainly writers of fanfiction. (Who are also primarily female.)

Why do people dislike Ginger? Is it mainly because of Tina Louise's reputation on set?

Bob Denver reportedly locked horns with Tina all the time. She 'hogged the makeup chair', she made diva demands. In his book, Gilligan, Maynard And Me, he takes several swipes at her, which I find completely hilarious, considering his book was written in like, 1993 and he's still bitchin'. :lol:

Tina Louise had that reputation, but I doubt they were all angels. Anyone knows that in any close professional working group, there is always the scapegoat, the one that everyone else gangs up on, usually in subtle ways, like "Uh-oh, here comes so-and-so."

I really doubt that Tina was the absolute beyotch that she has become in the eyes of many. Her spats with Bob Denver were probably because they were both strong-willed people. Bob was the star, fresh from his success on Dobie Gillis, he was probably beginning to feel invincible. Tina, by all accounts was 'tricked' into joining GI because her agent told her she would be the star. But I doubt either Bob or Tina came away permanently scarred from their battles.

I think Ginger Grant is a fascinating character and much misunderstood. She came out of Hollywood and ended up on an island stranded with 6 other people that she may never have crossed paths with if she hadn't taken the 3 hour tour. In the early days she colluded with Mr. Howell to try and scam either Gilligan or the entire group. She came on to Gilligan more times than I've had hot dinners. But was Gilligan mentally or emotionally destroyed by her unwanted advances? No- he improved his game. By season 3 he just let her get on with it.

Okay, I'm just babbling now. But it would be interesting to see what everyone else thinks of Ginger. Whether it's because you genuinely don't like the character, or whether your feelings are based on the reputation that Tina Louise had.

Thank you! Off my soapbox now. :wave:

I'm only basing my comments on the Ginger character. I don't care what happens off the set as long as it doesn't encroach on the performances on set. And I've never noticed anything in any of the episodes.
I didn't like the character when I was young because of her amourous nature. Girl germs and all that stuff. But these days I appreciate the character more and quite like her.

Tina, by all accounts was 'tricked' into joining GI because her agent told her she would be the star.

I've never understood that fully -- once she learned that the series title would refer to Bob's character...??

I don't dislike her character, but I don't like her nearly as much as the others. I think many peoples dislike of her character stems allot from Tina Louise and the fact that she was ashamed of GI and anything that reminded her of GI for many years. Even for the TV movie "Rescue from GI" she wanted an unheard of amount to reprise the Ginger character. obviously her way of saying I don't want to play the part. On the TV land awards, she wouldn't even sit with Dawn and Russel, she sat with Carol Burnett. But in her late 70s, she seems to have had a total change of heart about GI. I think the change came around the time she did the cameo on the GI episode of Rosanne, but even in that episode she didn't play Ginger. she played Rosanne.

I agree with everyone who thinks the dislike of Ginger stems from the 'dislike' of Tina. But it shouldn't, because despite what went on behind the scenes, it didn't rub off on her portrayal of the character. Ginger starts out as a femme fatale and gradually progresses to a team player. She's never a complete b*tch. And her seductions nearly always fail anyway, no matter who she tries it on with, which is not only funny, but makes me sympathise with her. I love when she breaks the fourth wall and shrugs at the camera, or swans off rolling her eyes because Gilligan has outsmarted her.

Tina should have embraced GI. It didn't ruin her career, it brought her into the spotlight. But I'm sad, as a GI fan, that her off-screen antics clouded the way Ginger was received. Because as much as I love Mary Ann, there are times when I think that Ginger actually shows more vulnerability.

THERE. I've said it.

Ginger was all right. I never hated her but admittedly I did like Mary Ann better because let's face it, Mary Ann was the more likable character. Ginger was funny and Tina played her part well, with the stunning red hair and all the sparkly gowns that she'd somehow brought onto a boat for a short tour, LOL.
Sure she should have relied on her smarts more than her manipulative sexual thing she couldn't seem to shake. Again, this was her character.
I don't know about any of the off the show publicity, but I have noticed that many times when a female actress gets a little power she must be "taken down a notch" in the press for petty things that would only be chalked up to assertiveness had a male actor done the same thing. Just my 2 cents.

Another thing to consider is that while Mary Ann is probably the more popular character of the two, there wasn't really much depth to her. Nothing against Dawn Wells, who by all accounts is an absolute dream, and could only do so much with the scripts that were given to her, but for the most part Mary Ann was "nice". That's about it; nice. She looked great and was a bit naive but really didn't have a lot of dimension and Ginger did have a "bit" of dimension, via her seducing and crying jags and manipulation of men. So it's easy to like a character who really never does anything wrong or controversial, while those that do show a bit of depth like Ginger or Mr. Howell, get dumped on a bit.

I do think that Louise's attitude toward the show probably also greatly contributes to the feeling about Ginger, whether fairly or not.

I think there's a certain amount of depth to all the characters if you look hard enough. Yes, some more than others.

Admittedly, I didn't like Ginger when I was younger, either. I thought she was "gross." But, hey, I was seven and people always called me Ginger (thank god it didn't make me hate being a redhead) and I would always react like, "What? Ew! No!" But being older I understand her more and I see the different facets to her character and I think she's fascinating. I think she's one of the more psychologically interesting characters on the show, which is probably partly a credit to Tina's skill that she laments that she never got to use.

I don't know whether or not Tina's "reputation" had anything to do with people disliking her, but at the time I didn't know anything about any off-screen business, so it didn't affect my opinion.

It does make me sad that she was so against the show, though. I understand where she was coming from with her frustration, but who knows if she would have had a big career without it anyway. The show brought her international recognition. If you don't want to be associated with something, don't sign on to do it and then don't be cranky about it after the fact.

I've always liked Mary Ann more anyway, regardless of any real life business. When I was little I wanted her to be my friend or my big sister and then I wanted to be her. I still kinda do. Although these days I want to be like Dawn - she's awesome and more hilariously inappropriate than Mary Ann, haha.

I've created this thread because Ginger is a 'love her or hate her' kind of character. I don't think any of the other castaways stir up such extreme emotions among viewers ( particularly female viewers) and certainly writers of fanfiction. (Who are also primarily female.)

Why do people dislike Ginger? Is it mainly because of Tina Louise's reputation on set?

Bob Denver reportedly locked horns with Tina all the time. She 'hogged the makeup chair', she made diva demands. In his book, Gilligan, Maynard And Me, he takes several swipes at her, which I find completely hilarious, considering his book was written in like, 1993 and he's still bitchin'. :lol:

Tina Louise had that reputation, but I doubt they were all angels. Anyone knows that in any close professional working group, there is always the scapegoat, the one that everyone else gangs up on, usually in subtle ways, like "Uh-oh, here comes so-and-so."

I really doubt that Tina was the absolute beyotch that she has become in the eyes of many. Her spats with Bob Denver were probably because they were both strong-willed people. Bob was the star, fresh from his success on Dobie Gillis, he was probably beginning to feel invincible. Tina, by all accounts was 'tricked' into joining GI because her agent told her she would be the star. But I doubt either Bob or Tina came away permanently scarred from their battles.

I think Ginger Grant is a fascinating character and much misunderstood. She came out of Hollywood and ended up on an island stranded with 6 other people that she may never have crossed paths with if she hadn't taken the 3 hour tour. In the early days she colluded with Mr. Howell to try and scam either Gilligan or the entire group. She came on to Gilligan more times than I've had hot dinners. But was Gilligan mentally or emotionally destroyed by her unwanted advances? No- he improved his game. By season 3 he just let her get on with it.

Okay, I'm just babbling now. But it would be interesting to see what everyone else thinks of Ginger. Whether it's because you genuinely don't like the character, or whether your feelings are based on the reputation that Tina Louise had.

Thank you! Off my soapbox now. :wave:
I would say it doeshave something to do with Louise herself. However, IMO, the character served absolutely no purpose. She was nowhere near as good-looking as the character thought she was. Perhaps a different actress would have made it better but probably not much.

See, I didn't grow up with GI, (although I do have very vague memories of it from long ago). I only started watching it 18 months ago, and I was told about Tina Louise not liking the show almost immediately, so it did have a smal effect on how I saw Ginger. I was kind of disappointed to hear that one of the cast members wasn't happy, because GI is such a happy show. Oh, I know these were 'real people' and their working days would not have been all sparkly sunshine from morning to night, just because they were creating a show that was sunny and sweet. But Tina did such a good job with Ginger that I wonder if her performance might have been EVEN BETTER had she fully embraced the role the way the others embraced theirs.

I dunno. I like Ginger, and I like Mary Ann. But Mary Ann's full potential wasn't realised either. Once she started putting her hands on her hips and rolling her eyes in disapproval at everyone, she lost some of her girlish charm- for me, anyway. Perhaps it was because she had given up trying to get Gilligan's attention and was turning into an old maid before her time, haha. (JWood201, I'm kidding. I'll ship MAG until the day I die.)

Ginger absolutely served a purpose.

Why would they waste their time writing a character and paying an actress for a character that served no purpose?

Her purpose, at least at the beginning, was to be Mary Ann's foil, Howell's accomplice, and Proffy's potential love interest / lab assistant. She routinely had good ideas that helped the cause of the week, sometimes her seductions of the guests worked (for a second, until they called her out on it).

It may not always seem like a character is doing much, but structurally, from a writing standpoint, everyone is necessary. Try taking her out of certain episodes. Although, I admit that the girls do absolutely nothing sometimes, but that's a logical and structural decision as well. Without Ginger, certain episodes just don't work.

It's like on GLEE. Sue Sylvester is a main character, is very important, and serves an important function. Yet she is not in every single episode.

It's like on GLEE. Sue Sylvester is a main character, is very important, and serves an important function. Yet she is not in every single episode.

Was there ever an episode of GI where a single cast member was not present? I think all episodes featured all castaways to some extent, even when it wasn't 'their' episode.

Ginger was totally necessary. Just ask any red-blooded male viewer. :rolleyes:

No, you're right, everyone was in every episode. Because they're on an island, it'd be impossible to have an episode without someone. But the point I was making is that everyone has a function and even though they're not necessary to individual episodes all the time, they're necessary to the whole. There are certain episodes where MA and Ginger barely show up.

I always find it funny that even though Ginger is the vamp and the femme fatale, her seduction techniques never work on anyone. Except I think the robot blew a gasket...

She was always quite good humoured about it, though!

Ginger/Tina was my favorite character on the show! She was beautiful, glamourous, and funny at the same time. She had the look of sexy movie stars Marilyn Monroe & Jayne Mansfield. I wished the producers paid the amount Tina demanded so at least fans can see her in one of the reunion TV movies. It would've been a REAL reunion with all the castaways.

No, you're right, everyone was in every episode. Because they're on an island, it'd be impossible to have an episode without someone. But the point I was making is that everyone has a function and even though they're not necessary to individual episodes all the time, they're necessary to the whole. There are certain episodes where MA and Ginger barely show up.

I wished Lost In Space characters were in every episode like Gilligan's Island. "Madam", The blonde girl, and Guy Williams anyone....

Thanks for starting this discussion! Very interesting posts so far. I'm something of a GI fan rarity in that Ginger is my favorite character (along with Proffy). Why? Because in my view she is, as noted above, one of the most obviously complex characters, which I always find interesting. She's a vamp seductress who runs away from men the second the tables are turned, and becomes shy when she receives attention from a man she genuinely cares for (Proffy). Though she comes off as very worldly and would have others see her that way, she still has a real sense of innocence. (Sherwood Schwartz said this, as the reason why Tina Louise was perfect for the role -- she was able to bring this to the part). Even though she appears to have all the confidence in the world, she often reveals a lot of insecurity beneath.

I think one reason some fans dislike her is that while all the castaways have faults, hers are very obvious. She's spectacularly vain, doesn't appear to do her fair share of work most of the time, and can be very self-centered. In Season 1 particularly, she often uses her looks, charm and other means (like siding with the Howells) to get what she wants. Coming from the self-promoting Hollywood environment, it's easy to see why she would do these things. One thing I don't understand is why she is sometimes portrayed as very malicious and cruel (especially towards Gilligan) in some fanfic writing -- those traits are completely out of character for her. She could be snappish at times, but certainly no more so than most of the other castaways, even Mary Anne.

Another aspect of her character that I like is that she undergoes a great deal of personal growth over the series. As noted above, she becomes much more of a team player. She goes from manipulating Gilligan at the behest of Mr. Howell in S1 to defending him often by S3. Twice she even defends his life by putting herself in mortal danger. (As a related side note, I love that it is the Howells and Ginger - the "antagonists" to Gilligan in S1 - who are the three that directly face Kincaid and Ramoo in "The Hunter").

Ginger, for all her faults, really does have more good traits than she does bad. She is kind-hearted, courageous, has a desire to help others, and does have a moral code that she managed to stick with even in Hollywood's "anything to get what you want" environment. (Some examples are her misgivings about lying to the other castaways even when the Professor urges her to, her strong reactions to the implications that she is not a "nice girl", and the fact that she feels adultery and using the "casting couch" are strictly off-limits). She is also one of the most optimistic castaways. Her "function" in the group is arguably morale -- not only in providing entertainment, but in keeping up her glass-half-full attitude.

Ginger/Tina was my favorite character on the show! She was beautiful, glamourous, and funny at the same time. She had the look of sexy movie stars Marilyn Monroe & Jayne Mansfield. I wished the producers paid the amount Tina demanded so at least fans can see her in one of the reunion TV movies. It would've been a REAL reunion with all the castaways.

She was certainly better at comedy than people give her credit for. And if she really didn't enjoy working on GI, then it absolutely does not show on screen.

Ginger in the pilot was played by Kit Smythe and was a completely different character, but when Tina came to the show she said they were looking for a Marilyn Monroe type so it was the producers who altered Ginger, not Tina.

But obviously she did demand too much for the movies, otherwise she would have been paid and she would have been in them. It's a shame she wasn't, because as you say, it would have been a real reunion with the original, one and only Ginger Grant.

Thanks for starting this discussion!

You're welcome! Long time, no see! :wave:

She's a vamp seductress who runs away from men the second the tables are turned, and becomes shy when she receives attention from a man she genuinely cares for (Proffy)

Look at how she ran from Duke, when moments before she'd been all starry-eyed!

I think one reason some fans dislike her is that while all the castaways have faults, hers are very obvious. She's spectacularly vain, doesn't appear to do her fair share of work most of the time, and can be very self-centered. In Season 1 particularly, she often uses her looks, charm and other means (like siding with the Howells) to get what she wants. Coming from the self-promoting Hollywood environment, it's easy to see why she would do these things. One thing I don't understand is why she is sometimes portrayed as very malicious and cruel (especially towards Gilligan) in some fanfic writing -- those traits are completely out of character for her. She could be snappish at times, but certainly no more so than most of the other castaways, even Mary Anne.

I've never portrayed her as malicious or cruel in my fanfics because I absolutely don't see her that way. But I have seen it done, and I don't like it either. And I think everyone is sadly suspicious of women who use their looks to get what they want. That kind of thing scares everyone, women and men alike. It's a primal thing, I think. But Ginger would have acted that way out of a sense of survival. She could be surprisingly innocent when her guard was down.

Another aspect of her character that I like is that she undergoes a great deal of personal growth over the series. As noted above, she becomes much more of a team player.

I think out of all of them, Ginger undergoes the most transformation, and it's quite subtly played, too.

I also agree with everything else you said, haha. It's nice to see such well thought out comments in defence of ol' Ginge. She is a team player and has a lot of heart, and in the case of Gilligan, I think the two of them become like brother and sister, annoying each other at times but ultimately caring more about each other than even they would like to admit. You know, like really respecting each other's differences.

Ginger absolutely served a purpose.

Why would they waste their time writing a character and paying an actress for a character that served no purpose?

Her purpose, at least at the beginning, was to be Mary Ann's foil, Howell's accomplice, and Proffy's potential love interest / lab assistant. She routinely had good ideas that helped the cause of the week, sometimes her seductions of the guests worked (for a second, until they called her out on it).

It may not always seem like a character is doing much, but structurally, from a writing standpoint, everyone is necessary. Try taking her out of certain episodes. Although, I admit that the girls do absolutely nothing sometimes, but that's a logical and structural decision as well. Without Ginger, certain episodes just don't work.

It's like on GLEE. Sue Sylvester is a main character, is very important, and serves an important function. Yet she is not in every single episode.

Let's see:
Skipper- Captain of the Island
Gilligan-menial tasks
Professor-medicine and other scientific things
Mary Ann-cooking and laundry
Ginger-?
Mr. and Mrs. Howell-? Why would they be on such a small boat anyway?

I've created this thread because Ginger is a 'love her or hate her' kind of character. I don't think any of the other castaways stir up such extreme emotions among viewers ( particularly female viewers) and certainly writers of fanfiction. (Who are also primarily female.)

Why do people dislike Ginger? Is it mainly because of Tina Louise's reputation on set?

Bob Denver reportedly locked horns with Tina all the time. She 'hogged the makeup chair', she made diva demands. In his book, Gilligan, Maynard And Me, he takes several swipes at her, which I find completely hilarious, considering his book was written in like, 1993 and he's still bitchin'. :lol:

Tina Louise had that reputation, but I doubt they were all angels. Anyone knows that in any close professional working group, there is always the scapegoat, the one that everyone else gangs up on, usually in subtle ways, like "Uh-oh, here comes so-and-so."

I really doubt that Tina was the absolute beyotch that she has become in the eyes of many. Her spats with Bob Denver were probably because they were both strong-willed people. Bob was the star, fresh from his success on Dobie Gillis, he was probably beginning to feel invincible. Tina, by all accounts was 'tricked' into joining GI because her agent told her she would be the star. But I doubt either Bob or Tina came away permanently scarred from their battles.

I think Ginger Grant is a fascinating character and much misunderstood. She came out of Hollywood and ended up on an island stranded with 6 other people that she may never have crossed paths with if she hadn't taken the 3 hour tour. In the early days she colluded with Mr. Howell to try and scam either Gilligan or the entire group. She came on to Gilligan more times than I've had hot dinners. But was Gilligan mentally or emotionally destroyed by her unwanted advances? No- he improved his game. By season 3 he just let her get on with it.

Okay, I'm just babbling now. But it would be interesting to see what everyone else thinks of Ginger. Whether it's because you genuinely don't like the character, or whether your feelings are based on the reputation that Tina Louise had.

Thank you! Off my soapbox now. :wave:

Was Tuesday Weld available? Or did she not get along with Bob Denver either?

Was Tuesday Weld available? Or did she not get along with Bob Denver either?

Who knows the answers to your questions, Party? :p

I liked Ginger. She added to the mix of the show.

She was certainly better at comedy than people give her credit for. And if she really didn't enjoy working on GI, then it absolutely does not show on screen.

Ginger in the pilot was played by Kit Smythe and was a completely different character, but when Tina came to the show she said they were looking for a Marilyn Monroe type so it was the producers who altered Ginger, not Tina.

But obviously she did demand too much for the movies, otherwise she would have been paid and she would have been in them. It's a shame she wasn't, because as you say, it would have been a real reunion with the original, one and only Ginger Grant.

Tina was really good at comedy. At the top of my head I somewhat recall an episode where "Ginger" played these different roles to impress a producer (?) who was stranded on the island temporarily. You're right about her attitude onscreen. I didn't catch any eye rolling or bitchy attitude in any of the Gilligan Island episodes from Tina. What a complete professional. Doing her job to make people laugh :lol:

I would be curious to know the amount that was demanded compared to the other castmates for the Rescue...movie.

Who knows the answers to your questions, Party? :p
I heard Weld did not get along with Dwayne Hickman. The woman from the pilot was out because she had dark hair like Wells. I do think somebody else might have played it better. Mary Ann might have been an easier role to play, but I think it's important that she was more enjoyable to watch, and not just because she was better looking, although that is also true...

I heard Weld did not get along with Dwayne Hickman. The woman from the pilot was out because she had dark hair like Wells. I do think somebody else might have played it better. Mary Ann might have been an easier role to play, but I think it's important that she was more enjoyable to watch, and not just because she was better looking, although that is also true...

Tuesday Weld was probably too big a star to join the cast of a regular TV show, although that's only my guess.

I find it fascinating how much the characters of Ginger and Mary Ann changed from the pilot.

Ginger was dark haired and sarcastic - she was in no way a 'vamp'.
Mary Ann (or rather, 'Bunny' as she was called)- was blonde and ditzy, but not particularly 'beautiful' in the accepted sense. She looked more mischievous and cheeky.

And then they totally changed these girls and made them both into stereotypes. The glamour girl and the girl-next-door who made pies and wore gingham dresses. (errr, and shorty shorts....! :) )

What would have happened if they'd kept to the original formula? It would have been a very different show indeed.

Tina was really good at comedy. At the top of my head I somewhat recall an episode where "Ginger" played these different roles to impress a producer (?) who was stranded on the island temporarily. You're right about her attitude onscreen. I didn't catch any eye rolling or bitchy attitude in any of the Gilligan Island episodes from Tina. What a complete professional. Doing her job to make people laugh :lol:

I would be curious to know the amount that was demanded compared to the other castmates for the Rescue...movie.

That was the season 3 episode 'The Producer'. With Phil Silvers playing Harold Hecuba. I loved Tina's 'Italian waitress'. "You wanna bread!"

In My Fair Gilligan (season 1), when Ginger gets hit with remnants of the pie that Gilligan throws at Mr. Howell, that was done deliberately by Bob Denver because the crew guys wanted some time off to play cards and Tina would need two hours in the makeup chair to get her hair fixed. Bob said, "I put a spin on it."

No wonder those two were always at each other's throats. :lol: