Hi! Longtime lurker, longtime fan. This site has provided endless enjoyment when bored at work.

I wondered how many cases you can think of in which UM ignored or elided suggestions that the principals were involved in liaisons. I'm thinking specifically of the moribund Kurt McFall case, in which I distinctly got the impression that the visualization of the facts implied more than the evidence may have deserved.

Think of this as an extension of the suspicion of UM's tendency to overplay some elements (e.g. the Satanic Panic of the eighties) and underplay others (drug addiction, homosexuality, adultery) as a sign of the times.

Obviously these tendencies manifest themselves in the early episodes more than the later ones For example: Bryan Nisenfeld's homosexuality was stated baldly in his segment; then again, it was the late nineties, when acceptance of homosexuality had become commonplace.

Possibilities: Beverly McGowan, Matthew Chase

Matthew Chase -- the man shot after a security camera caught the alleged suspect on tape? What makes you think this was a pickup?

Well, even though her husband tried to pretend they had the perfect marriage in his UM interview, it's been highly speculated that Sneha Philip was often engaged in extramarital lesbian affairs and it's been theorized that the woman spotted with her on the security camera footage may have been her lover.

And since it was during the show's earlier years, you'll notice how carefully UM presents the implication about Judy Groezinger's possible lesbian relationship with her friend. They don't outright state anything, but do show a clip of the detective saying: "More than one acquaintance said the relationship was more than just friends".

Matthew Chase -- the man shot after a security camera caught the alleged suspect on tape? What makes you think this was a pickup?

Never thought about this possibility but it could have been this. I've also always thought Matthew Chase was gay, perhaps the suspect in the ATM image was a man posing as a male prostitute who murdered Matthew.

There may have been privacy issues involved. Maybe the sexual orientation topic was sometimes excluded at the request of those closest to the principal(s), possibly so that it wouldn't become more of an issue than it needed to be.

I don't think the robbery had anything to do with Matthew Chase's sexual orientation, but I too got the impression he was gay. I'm gay myself, and I guess it's my gaydar :)

I also agree with the Bev McGowen comment above. I think Elaine Parent (the monster who killed her) probably used seduction as one of her many methods of conning Bev. Plus, I was always struck by her brother repeatedly talking about how much Bev enjoyed her privacy and "her private side."

Finally, I was wondered about Dottie Caylor. While I think Jules, her husband, probably killed her, a part of me wondered if she had run off with a woman. It almost seemed that a woman in her "women's group" may have been interested in Dottie. Just a hunch.

Elaine Parent was bisexual, as several news stories reported at the time.

Matthew Chase was a handsome young man. The actor who played him was actually not so good-looking.

Welcome! :) UM never really mentioned this but I often wondered if Lisa Bishop and Florian were having a fling. That could be one reason why she was so determined to go on the Freedon with him even though everyone was trying to get her not to go.

Also I would add possibly Melvine Aprille. I always wondered if there was more behind her stealing all her husband's money besides just wanting to take the children. I wonder if there was another man involved possibly even the one who went with her to various banks and posed as Jimmy Aprille.

I read an article about the Beverly McGowan case where it was stated she was a lesbian. I think that was probably relevant to her case. Matthew Chase's sexuality maybe made him an easy target for what I believe was a random attack.

Sometimes I felt that the affair angle was overplayed too. It was mentioned that Christi Nichols had been seeing another man, but I never really felt they gave enough evidence to back that up. I think she was looking for a way out and there was never another man - I just thought she wanted to safely get away from Mark.

To be honest, I wouldn't have suspected Matthew Chase was gay -- and I'm gay.

What makes some of you think that he was gay? Is it because his roommate Steven Dahl might have seemed to be gay himself from his interview in the segment or just the picture of Matthew Chase? I'm just curious what you're basing this from.

Another curiosity about the segment: do you think Theresa Dahl, Steven's sister, and Matthew's other roommate, was straight or not? I couldn't really tell from the segment, but she seemed very well-read/intelligent from how she spoke, and as a straight man, I thought she was very pretty.

For some reason I always assumed Matthew Chase and Steve Dahl were a couple. Just a vibe I got, I guess.

For some reason I always assumed Matthew Chase and Steve Dahl were a couple. Just a vibe I got, I guess.

Same here. I just got the vibe that they were a couple, and that Teresa Dahl seemed like the type of girl that all gay men want as a friend :) It's hard to explain to straight people how gay people sometimes can tell when another person is gay; I guess we pick up on the subtleties more easily because we see them in ourselves.

Perhaps it was also the fact that he was thin, clean cut, was described as soft spoken; and they were living in West Hollywood weren't they? That's a very gay friendly part of LA.

But at the end of the day, it was just a hunch. I'm pretty sure it's true too :)

Ha! Well, like I said, I'm gay too, and no doubt it's the sketchiness of the episode that keeps me from imagining this about Chase.

The Connecticut River Valley Killer (who stabbed women to death along the New Hampshire/Vermont border in the 1980's) always interested me so I bought the book about it by Phillip Ginsburgh. One of the victims was Eva Morse who was stabbed to death in July of 1985 while hitchhiking from Charlestown, NH to Claremont. Unsolved Mysteries only showed Eva's picture really quickly along with the rest of the victims and the only attack they gave details on was Jane Boroski's. But the book pointed out that on the day she was killed, Eva arrived at work and told her boss that she was going home sick. When she left, she hitched a ride to Claremont with the intention of visiting her former lesbian lover. She never arrived and her body was found in the area one year later.

The Selena Edon case was the first thing that popped in my head when I read this topic. Many posters here, myself included, speculated that she was a lesbian. Her friend Laurie Gallagher was interviewed in the segment and she was a lesbian. Selena lived in San Francisco. And her qualities and interests made it easy to speculate. She was described by her family as always marching to her own drummer. She worked as a construction worker and she loved motorcycles. I'm gay and I don't like speculation based on stereotypes but in this case, it was always just a feeling I had. Then a friend of Selena's who served with her in the Air Force posted here a couple years ago and told us that Selena confessed to her at the time that she was gay. Some folks thought that the reason she went missing was because she chose to run away so she wouldn't have to come out to her family. But I never believed that was the case. I think the injuries from her motorcycle accident simply resurfaced and she wandered off and doesn't know who she is.

On a side note, I have to say how awesome it is to see so many gay people on the UM board!! Perhaps Robert Stack was a gay icon and didn't even realize it :) I bet he would have been flattered!

I believe Matthew Chase was randomly attacked, but I was concurring with those Steven Dahl/gaydar comments. It just seems likely, considering everything everyone was throwing out in the episode.

The Selena Edon case was the first thing that popped in my head when I read this topic. Many posters here, myself included, speculated that she was a lesbian. Her friend Laurie Gallagher was interviewed in the segment and she was a lesbian. Selena lived in San Francisco. And her qualities and interests made it easy to speculate. She was described by her family as always marching to her own drummer. She worked as a construction worker and she loved motorcycles. I'm gay and I don't like speculation based on stereotypes but in this case, it was always just a feeling I had. Then a friend of Selena's who served with her in the Air Force posted here a couple years ago and told us that Selena confessed to her at the time that she was gay. Some folks thought that the reason she went missing was because she chose to run away so she wouldn't have to come out to her family. But I never believed that was the case. I think the injuries from her motorcycle accident simply resurfaced and she wandered off and doesn't know who she is.

I wouldn't be surprised if Selena's family already knew she was gay. If you notice the last time she phone her mother (in the reenactment anyway) Selena says something like she found someone and 'she promised to be kind to me'. In my opinion that sounds more like a relationship than a friendship. Also noticed in the Charley Project that she was last seen in a hospital in 1991. I wonder what she was there for. I don't believe UM ever mentioned this.

I forgot about Selena. I also believe she was a lesbian. And there was also that segment about the lady who was very accurate in her police composite sketches (don't remember her name) and she was filmed on camera doing one of her drawings with an eyewitness who was holding playdoh as he talked. I always figured that guy was gay as well for some reason.

I'm also gay. nice to see some Posters are down with the rainbow! :lol: but seriously I never really speculated about victim's orientation unless it had something to do with the case.

I cannot recall the man's name but he was Asian. apparently he was found shot to death in his bed. and his friend found him. there was vibes of a coverup because the Sherriff burned the Mattress. rumors arose that the victim had been seeing the Sherrif's wife. but I thought the friend who discovered his body seemed gay. like he was infatuated with the deceased man.

Does anyone remember that episode? I remember the burned mattress.

Does anyone remember that episode? I remember the burned mattress.

Eric Tamiyasu. Very sad case, still unsolved. I think that there was a coverup for sure and also felt that the "friend" Don Dixon, seemed obsessed.

What makes some of you think that he was gay? Is it because his roommate Steven Dahl might have seemed to be gay himself from his interview in the segment or just the picture of Matthew Chase? I'm just curious what you're basing this from.

My feelings are similar to yours, Steve. When people start speculating on someone's sexuality, one has to wonder what the speculation is based on. Sometimes people rush to judgment and base their speculation on some small piece of circumstantial evidence, such as the fact that the person currently doesn't have a significant other or has never been married.

As long as we're on the topic, I'll admit that I never suspected that Raymond Burr (the original UM host) was gay. His official biography stated that he had been married three times and had a son who was deceased. However, only one of Burr's marriages was confirmed, and it ended in divorce. It eventually came to light that his other two marriages were ficticious, and that he never had any children. In other words, he falsified the story of a deceased son and two other marriages to cover up the truth about his orientation.

The late Dick Sargent did a similar thing. When he was doing the ABC TV show Bewitched, the network's press biography stated that he had an ex-wife. By many accounts, however, Sargent's homosexuality was an open secret among the cast and crew of the series. But it wasn't until 1991 when Sargent publicly acknowledged that he was gay. He admittedly made up the story of an ex-wife so that people wouldn't speculate on his sexuality.

My feelings are similar to yours, Steve. When people start speculating on someone's sexuality, one has to wonder what the speculation is based on. Sometimes people rush to judgment and base their speculation on some small piece of circumstantial evidence, such as the fact that the person currently doesn't have a significant other or has never been married.

As long as we're on the topic, I'll admit that I never suspected that Raymond Burr (the original UM host) was gay. His official biography stated that he had been married three times and had a son who was deceased. However, only one of Burr's marriages was confirmed, and it ended in divorce. It eventually came to light that his other two marriages were ficticious, and that he never had any children. In other words, he falsified the story of a deceased son and two other marriages to cover up the truth about his orientation.

The late Dick Sargent did a similar thing. When he was doing the ABC TV show Bewitched, the network's press biography stated that he had an ex-wife. By many accounts, however, Sargent's homosexuality was an open secret among the cast and crew of the series. But it wasn't until 1991 when Sargent publicly acknowledged that he was gay. He admittedly made up the story of an ex-wife so that people wouldn't speculate on his sexuality.

Wow, I did not know that Raymond Burr and Dick Sargent made up false histories to hid their sexual orientation. Part of me feels that that is a sad commentary about how intolerant our society still seems to be if these men felt the need to go to such extremes. :(

I also agree that orientation is not really relevant to cases in terms of solving the cases; I think the person who started this thread just was curious what others thought about some of the people profiled on UM. That's all.

I'd no ulterior motives: I was curious about sharing experiences about detecting subtext like a couple of posters did with Matthew Chase.

I cannot recall the man's name but he was Asian. apparently he was found shot to death in his bed. and his friend found him. there was vibes of a coverup because the Sherriff burned the Mattress. rumors arose that the victim had been seeing the Sherrif's wife. but I thought the friend who discovered his body seemed gay. like he was infatuated with the deceased man.

Yep, good ol' Don Dixon. One of the oddest things he said was this random line: "The only ones that I know that didn't do it are my wife and myself". His mention of his wife was so out of the blue and just seemed like he was trying to convey: "See? I really didn't have a homosexual crush on my friend. I'm married, you know!".

Unfortunately I can't find that episode online.

Unfortunately I can't find that episode online.

While checking out the forbidden site, search using "burned evidence" and it should come up ;) Hope that helps.

Yep. Don Dixon is a weird 'un.

I also agree that orientation is not really relevant to cases in terms of solving the cases; I think the person who started this thread just was curious what others thought about some of the people profiled on UM. That's all.

It's not relevant in some case but it is in others. The Bryan Nisenfeld's case comes to mind.

The Connecticut River Valley Killer (who stabbed women to death along the New Hampshire/Vermont border in the 1980's) always interested me so I bought the book about it by Phillip Ginsburgh. One of the victims was Eva Morse who was stabbed to death in July of 1985 while hitchhiking from Charlestown, NH to Claremont. Unsolved Mysteries only showed Eva's picture really quickly along with the rest of the victims and the only attack they gave details on was Jane Boroski's. But the book pointed out that on the day she was killed, Eva arrived at work and told her boss that she was going home sick. When she left, she hitched a ride to Claremont with the intention of visiting her former lesbian lover. She never arrived and her body was found in the area one year later.

The Selena Edon case was the first thing that popped in my head when I read this topic. Many posters here, myself included, speculated that she was a lesbian. Her friend Laurie Gallagher was interviewed in the segment and she was a lesbian. Selena lived in San Francisco. And her qualities and interests made it easy to speculate. She was described by her family as always marching to her own drummer. She worked as a construction worker and she loved motorcycles. I'm gay and I don't like speculation based on stereotypes but in this case, it was always just a feeling I had. Then a friend of Selena's who served with her in the Air Force posted here a couple years ago and told us that Selena confessed to her at the time that she was gay. Some folks thought that the reason she went missing was because she chose to run away so she wouldn't have to come out to her family. But I never believed that was the case. I think the injuries from her motorcycle accident simply resurfaced and she wandered off and doesn't know who she is.

I have watched the Selena Edon case a few times and I suspected that she was a lesbian based on how she was discussed and described in the segment and seeing her friend Laurie being interviewed pinged my gaydar. Do you a link to the thread in which Selena's friend posted on?

I agree with you, I think Selena's brain injured probably played a part in her disapperance. I think it would be good Discovery ID's Disappered to do a show on Selena's disapperance.

I remember there was a segment about a married couple who owned a video rental store or some kind of business and the wife disappeared and it was speculated because of a letter that a wife left her husband for another woman but I can't remember any names.

I agree with you, I think Selena's brain injured probably played a part in her disapperance. I think it would be good Discovery ID's Disappered to do a show on Selena's disapperance.

I always thought that was a very weird case. Not because of Selena's sexual orientation, but the circumstances of her disappearance. She literally just "upped and left". I think the trauma she sustained probably plays a large role too. I wonder if there are similar stories of people disappearing for inexplicable reasons after a brain injury.

I remember there was a segment about a married couple who owned a video rental store or some kind of business and the wife disappeared and it was speculated because of a letter that a wife left her husband for another woman but I can't remember any names.

Pam Page.

I always got the feelog that don dixon was a closet homosexual. He could have expressed feelings for Eric and then in a fit of embarrassment later, killed him. Or even motivated by jealousy. Who knows, it would make some sense.

I have watched the Selena Edon case a few times and I suspected that she was a lesbian based on how she was discussed and described in the segment and seeing her friend Laurie being interviewed pinged my gaydar. Do you a link to the thread in which Selena's friend posted on?

It was one very short post. All it said was...

I was stationed in the Air Force with Selena. She was originally from Chicago. We were stationed at Travis Air Force Base, California. She confessed to me that she was gay. She also had a wild side and took a lot of chances. She would go off with people she had just met, etc. Yet, I was still surprised when I saw the Unsolved Mysteries episode of her as a missing person.

gspencer

I always thought that was a very weird case. Not because of Selena's sexual orientation, but the circumstances of her disappearance. She literally just "upped and left". I think the trauma she sustained probably plays a large role too. I wonder if there are similar stories of people disappearing for inexplicable reasons after a brain injury.



Pam Page.

Thank you for posting the name of the case I was wondering about. I was remembering this case sometime back and I kept trying to remember the name of the wife.

I also though Selena's case was strange because of her brain injury. My cousin is an occupational therapist and she has worked with brain injury patients for almost five years. She has said that in some situations the abilities of good judgment and impulse are effected in a lot of patients and some of these people can't really make good decisions. I think maybe that could have been the case with Selena.

It was one very short post. All it said was...

Thank you for posting it dynoguy. Even though it was short it gave us a little more insight into Selena's history.

I thought Matt's story might of been changed a bit to hide his sexuality from the viewers. I got the vibe Matt might be gay or bisexual by looking at his picture.

I'm not sure how relevant this is to the case but I believe there is a very good chance that Amy Bradley was gay. In the case, they suggested that she was involved with some guy on the cruise ship. Hmm...I just don't believe it.

Really? What makes you say that?

I never thought about Matthew Chase being gay, but I rewatched the segment and I can see it now. Maybe that does add a new element to the case. I am not gay, but surprised to see so many gay USM fans! Represent!

Wait...Raymond Burr was gay!!?!?!?

Honestly, the actor playing Chase and Chase's photos appear in the segment so briefly that I'm surprised you guys got a "vibe."

Honestly, the actor playing Chase and Chase's photos appear in the segment so briefly that I'm surprised you guys got a "vibe."

Indeed. I'm not understanding this vibe so many people are getting. I can't get a vibe from someone from one quick photo.

Indeed. I'm not understanding this vibe so many people are getting. I can't get a vibe from someone from one quick photo.

I guess the vibe came more from Matthew's friends interviewed in the segment.

It's entirely possible that it's Chase's friends who were gay.

Really? What makes you say that?I'm not going to generalize that all gay women look like such and such. However, Amy looked like a very specific stereotype; that of a sports-orientated gay girl.

http://www.amybradley.net/photos.htm

Of course, my aunt loved sports and looked the same, yet she was straight. This is all unfounded speculation. Still, I don't rule out the chance that she was gay.

BTW, Don Dixon looks like the type to hang around elementary schools. Just sayin

It's entirely possible that it's Chase's friends who were gay.

I understand completely. But honestly, how many straight men would have two close gay friends who were close enough to be interviewed on tv?

I understand completely. But honestly, how many straight men would have two close gay friends who were close enough to be interviewed on tv?

My husband is the first that springs to mind, though off the top of my head I can think of at least 2 other straight guys I know who have multiple gay friends who are very close.

My best friend is a straight man.

I must say that this is a very interesting thread. And, yes, I could see UM not being forthcoming with information about some of the victims' sexuality whether potentially relevant to the case or not.

I think Amy Bradley looks like, well, a young woman from the late 90's. That short hairstyle was fairly popular back then. I had several straight girl friends who had it.

Never thought about this possibility but it could have been this. I've also always thought Matthew Chase was gay, perhaps the suspect in the ATM image was a man posing as a male prostitute who murdered Matthew.


Doubt that. The guy in the photo was butt ugly and a gang type bandana was found in his car. Matt wasnt looking for a hook up that night, and we dont even know if he was gay. I believe he had work the next day, so he didnt plan on staying out late. Discard the theory.

Doubt that. The guy in the photo was butt ugly and a gang type bandana was found in his car. Matt wasnt looking for a hook up that night, and we dont even know if he was gay. I believe he had work the next day, so he didnt plan on staying out late. Discard the theory.

People who hire prostitutes really don't care about how attractive they are. Have you seen streetwalkers before? The fact that Matthew didn't plan on staying out late means nothing. He could have simply changed his mind.

Welcome! :) UM never really mentioned this but I often wondered if Lisa Bishop and Florian were having a fling. That could be one reason why she was so determined to go on the Freedon with him even though everyone was trying to get her not to go.


I'm pretty much certain they were. In fact, she was covertly going on a break to bone that guy in the Caribbean, and make that crazed journalism project traveling on a wrecked sieve on the side.

People who hire prostitutes really don't care about how attractive they are. Have you seen streetwalkers before? The fact that Matthew didn't plan on staying out late means nothing. He could have simply changed his mind.

Since nobody here knew Matthew, I guess anything is possible. But I think we're getting a little off track here regarding his activities the night he was killed.

Regardless of whether he was gay or not, I highly doubt he was looking for a hookup or in need of a prostitute. I just think he planned on depositing his paycheck, buying some cat food and coming straight home like Teresa said. He just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. Going to an ATM alone at night is bad news and I don't think people were as aware of that in the 1980's as they are now. The simplest explanation is usually the right one.

Since nobody here knew Matthew, I guess anything is possible. But I think we're getting a little off track here regarding his activities the night he was killed.

Regardless of whether he was gay or not, I highly doubt he was looking for a hookup or in need of a prostitute. I just think he planned on depositing his paycheck, buying some cat food and coming straight home like Teresa said. He just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. Going to an ATM alone at night is bad news and I don't think people were as aware of that in the 1980's as they are now. The simplest explanation is usually the right one.

I too think he was abducted at gunpoint, while drawing money out of the ATM. Someone brought up earlier in the thread the fact that the man in the composite may have been a "pickup" and I kind of expanded on that idea as a possibility.

I got the vibe from the Don Kemp segment that he and the guy in the trailer possibly had a homosexual relationship. Did anyone else feel that way? I also thought perhaps Kristen Modafferi was a lesbian.

I think Amy Bradley looks like, well, a young woman from the late 90's. That short hairstyle was fairly popular back then. I had several straight girl friends who had it.

Are you sure that those girlfriends of yours are straight? ;)

I got the vibe from the Don Kemp segment that he and the guy in the trailer possibly had a homosexual relationship. Did anyone else feel that way? I also thought perhaps Kristen Modafferi was a lesbian.

Don't know about Kemp. For Modafferi you have nothing to go on. She moved to the most heavily populated megalopolis in North America without knowing a single person there. During the month she spent there after having traveled 3,000 miles, she made eye contact with ten times more people than she actually spoke to. She barely scratched the surface of friendship with anyone who was in the very small percentage of Bay Area residents with whom she talked. Did she place a newspaper ad that included her new land line number ? That was a scary thing to do in the era before Myspace. I was too scared to do that before Myspace.

Modafferi could have been fooled by a bad person who increased their mutual familiarity in an exponentially faster way -- more intimate conversation after one minute, ten times as intimate after two minutes. Or it could have been one day / two days. And they could have been inside that San Francisco shopping mall talking about the beauty of Lands End -- not sex. The point is we know their mutual familiarity and Modafferi's trust in the other person increased faster, faster, faster within a very short time. Minutes ? Days ? Even if it were two weeks, that's not long enough for some young women in strange surroundings to become suspicious of a new acquaintance in a megalopolis.

Modafferi planned to take a photography course, but no one in such a class has come forward to say he or she ever met her. Back then an aspiring photographer had to get information by talking, not typing or texting. Modafferi was vulnerable. Unfortunately, in death she is vulnerable to people who claim to have "gaydar." Law enforcement doesn't use such a thing.

Modafferi's case remains as mysterious as the skeleton discovered encased in a block of ice in Wisconsin in the 1980s. That's in another thread I started less than an hour ago.

I'm also gay. nice to see some Posters are down with the rainbow! :lol: but seriously I never really speculated about victim's orientation unless it had something to do with the case.

I cannot recall the man's name but he was Asian. apparently he was found shot to death in his bed. and his friend found him. there was vibes of a coverup because the Sherriff burned the Mattress. rumors arose that the victim had been seeing the Sherrif's wife. but I thought the friend who discovered his body seemed gay. like he was infatuated with the deceased man.

Oh yes...that has been my theory all along on the case. Remember how Eric and his date heard banging outside? and Eric sort of ignored (probably guessed who it was) I TOTALLY think Dixon had a crush and when it wasn't mutal he couldn't deal with it.

I just want to clarify that while I got the impression that Matthew Chase might be gay from his segment I in no way thought it had anything to do with the crime against him.

I always had a suspicion Dan Tondevold was gay.

The redhead from the mystery hum segment is/was probably a man who was in the process of becoming female. At least that what it looked like to me.

Was doing some Googling pertaining to Kurt McFall recently.

McFall's mentor, Gabriel Carillo aka "Caradoc," passed away in 2007 and his obituary listed a partner, so I think we can assume he was gay. Also, some things I've found online about the religious group Kurt was involved in at the time of his death indicate that sex is an important part of the practice.

Also from the McFall segment, some Googling pertaining to Hilary Powers revealed that her name in SCA was "Sir Hilary of Serendip."

I always had a suspicion Dan Tondevold was gay.

The redhead from the mystery hum segment is/was probably a man who was in the process of becoming female. At least that what it looked like to me.


Not gay, but transgender maybe?

Sometimes I felt that the affair angle was overplayed too. It was mentioned that Christi Nichols had been seeing another man, but I never really felt they gave enough evidence to back that up. I think she was looking for a way out and there was never another man - I just thought she wanted to safely get away from Mark.

On Christi's Charley Project page, the narrative describes how police did find a letter in Christi's car--apparently written to the man she was supposed to have been seeing--saying that she would be leaving after Christmas, and that she would contact him again in a few months. Of course, just going on the UM segment alone, I too had the same feeling about it. Ever since I first read about him, I've always wondered who this person was. I wonder if Mark didn't try to pin the blame on him for Christi's disappearance, but there's pretty much zero information on the case outside of several articles over the years that don't really provide much more information than what was given in the segment.

I also picked up the vibe that Matthew Chase was gay and he lived with his partner and his sister. The feeling wasnt as strong as it was with Selena Edon. Am I the only one who feels Selena Edon is still alive?

His age (18) and the year (1988) stop me from thinking he's out and already living with his boyfriend and his boyfriend's sister.

His age (18) and the year (1988) stop me from thinking he's out and already living with his boyfriend and his boyfriend's sister.

Not back then in 1988, but yes in the present.

Also from the McFall segment, some Googling pertaining to Hilary Powers revealed that her name in SCA was "Sir Hilary of Serendip."
This confirms my suspicion that the McFall segment is among the funniest in UM history.

Was doing some Googling pertaining to Kurt McFall recently.

McFall's mentor, Gabriel Carillo aka "Caradoc," passed away in 2007 and his obituary listed a partner, so I think we can assume he was gay. Also, some things I've found online about the religious group Kurt was involved in at the time of his death indicate that sex is an important part of the practice.

Also from the McFall segment, some Googling pertaining to Hilary Powers revealed that her name in SCA was "Sir Hilary of Serendip."

So he might of partake in a such a event, but may of not like doing it?

So he might of partake in a such a event, but may of not like doing it?

One of the articles I read indicated that Carillo had been criticized because he engaged in sex with students as part of the rituals. It was mentioned in the UM segment that Kurt may have uncovered something unsettling about the cult and I'm wondering if this could have been it, or it may have been something along those lines.

On that note, I don't see it as a gay or straight issues, just the "creep factor" that Carillo might sleep with his followers, or have this as an expectation (assuming he did).

One of the articles I read indicated that Carillo had been criticized because he engaged in sex with students as part of the rituals. It was mentioned in the UM segment that Kurt may have uncovered something unsettling about the cult and I'm wondering if this could have been it, or it may have been something along those lines.

On that note, I don't see it as a gay or straight issues, just the "creep factor" that Carillo might sleep with his followers, or have this as an expectation (assuming he did).

I'm not surprise since sex sometimes does play a major factor in most of these groups regardless of gender, age, and sexual orientation.

I'm not surprise since sex sometimes does play a major factor in most of these groups regardless of gender, age, and sexual orientation.

I found a website that basically lays out the key concepts of their religion and practices. There are tracts about the group's philosophies on many different topics including, among many other things, sex. Of course, I skimmed it. There was some stuff about how teenagers naturally want to experiment and that it's too bad they don't have a safe place where they can experiment with each other sexually. Here is the link if anyone is interested...

http://witcheye.com/ironpent.html

Now, I'm not saying that I definitely think this is what went down in regard to Kurt McFall, but suppose that Carillo was, for lack of a better word, a chicken hawk type who used his religion to attract teenagers and manipulate them into situations where they would feel obligated to have sex with him.

I have confirmation that Matt Chase was in fact, gay. Managed to find this link, after not having found anything about this case on the net in years.

He took a mannequin to the prom in protest after not being allowed to take his boyfriend (presumably Steven Dahl)

http://forums.previously.tv/topic/18962-unsolved-and-unforgettable/

I'm dying to know some of the other "stunts" he pulled.

Forgive me for not recalling the details but there was this case of a female US Marshall who got shot to death and, evidently, the killer/s took her gun. Anyway, there was this other female US Marshall who pleaded with the viewers to help solve the murder AND to have that gun found so she could have it. Somehow if it turned out that had more in common than being amongst the earliest female US Marshalls it wouldn't have come as a complete surprise to me.

Forgive me for not recalling the details but there was this case of a female US Marshall who got shot to death and, evidently, the killer/s took her gun. Anyway, there was this other female US Marshall who pleaded with the viewers to help solve the murder AND to have that gun found so she could have it. Somehow if it turned out that had more in common than being amongst the earliest female US Marshalls it wouldn't have come as a complete surprise to me.

I think you might be thinking of Julie Cross who was a secret service agenct at a time when there were very few, if any, female agents circa late 70s and early 80s. She was murdered in 1980.

If that's the case, I don't think there was a plea to find her specific gun. However, I do remember her friend (also an agent) being interviewed and saying that she kept Julie's badge and would occasionally wear it to honor her memory.

I have confirmation that Matt Chase was in fact, gay. Managed to find this link, after not having found anything about this case on the net in years.

He took a mannequin to the prom in protest after not being allowed to take his boyfriend (presumably Steven Dahl)

http://forums.previously.tv/topic/18962-unsolved-and-unforgettable/

I'm dying to know some of the other "stunts" he pulled.

Oh – wow. Recent post too. I'm still amazed some of you could tell he was gay from his photo though (and I'm gay). The show still elided mention of his sexuality. Had Matthew Chase been dating Teresa Dahl, the show would have mentioned it, e.g. "He was living in L.A. with his girlfriend Teresa Dahl and her brother Steven."

Forgive me for not recalling the details but there was this case of a female US Marshall who got shot to death and, evidently, the killer/s took her gun. Anyway, there was this other female US Marshall who pleaded with the viewers to help solve the murder AND to have that gun found so she could have it. Somehow if it turned out that had more in common than being amongst the earliest female US Marshalls it wouldn't have come as a complete surprise to me.

There were some horribly nasty sexist comments on the video of that segment when it was available online. Still pisses me off just thinking about it.

Had Julie and her academy friend been male officers, I highly doubt anyone would've batted an eye at the other keeping his buddy's badge to honor the other's memory.

Julie was a Secret Service agent, btw. Her friend was a sergeant in the San Diego PD, where they originally met.

I never assumed Matthew Chase was gay. Then again, I may not have the best gaydar. I was shocked, SHOCKED I tell you, when George Michael came out as gay. I am on the straight end of the spectrum and when I was a kid I thought George Michael was the manliest man on the planet and pulled all the hot ladies. Then again I have been to gay clubs where most of the attendees look like pro wrestlers and could easily beat me beyond recognition.

I also have never heard the world "elided" until this thread. I figured the OP misspelled "alluded."

that's my contribution to this thread. I do know Danny Wheeler did not have an affair with Pat Snee because he's not into incest, though, no matter what UM might have alluded to.

There were some horribly nasty sexist comments on the video of that segment when it was available online. Still pisses me off just thinking about it.

Had Julie and her academy friend been male officers, I highly doubt anyone would've batted an eye at the other keeping his buddy's badge to honor the other's memory.

Julie was a Secret Service agent, btw. Her friend was a sergeant in the San Diego PD, where they originally met.
I remember this. I was also pissed off at comments like "ew lesbian badge thing." :mad:

Julie's friend was one of my favorite interviewees. She spoke highly of Julie, their similar competitiveness, and wanting to remember her and keep her badge. You could tell they were good friends and colleagues. It makes me seriously angry that people would mock their friendship and a woman wanting to remember and honor her friend. If any callous comments should be made, it should be about the scum responsible for the murder, not the woman who died in the line of duty or her friend who also works a job putting her life on the line to keep the streets safe.

Oh – wow. Recent post too. I'm still amazed some of you could tell he was gay from his photo though (and I'm gay). The show still elided mention of his sexuality. Had Matthew Chase been dating Teresa Dahl, the show would have mentioned it, e.g. "He was living in L.A. with his girlfriend Teresa Dahl and her brother Steven."

I have a lot of admiration for Matt - seems like he was really ahead of his time.

He has one of the best smiles ever in that pic.

I remember this. I was also pissed off at comments like "ew lesbian badge thing." :mad:

Julie's friend was one of my favorite interviewees. She spoke highly of Julie, their similar competitiveness, and wanting to remember her and keep her badge. You could tell they were good friends and colleagues. It makes me seriously angry that people would mock their friendship and a woman wanting to remember and honor her friend. If any callous comments should be made, it should be about the scum responsible for the murder, not the woman who died in the line of duty or her friend who also works a job putting her life on the line to keep the streets safe.


For the record, I have nothing but contempt for the thug who shot Julie and hope the case gets solved and the book gets thrown at him and have admiration for Julie's determination and wanting to do right by the community. I have no way of knowing one way or the other what the bond between Julie and her colleague may have been. However; if it turned out that had more in common than just being fellow officers, it wouldn't have come as a total surprise to me. And I think there WOULD be folks out there who'd bat or roll an eye if both the above were men re the badge.

I have a lot of admiration for Matt - seems like he was really ahead of his time.

Ahead of his time were the exact words that popped in my head when I read that. Doing the math, he had to have graduated high school in 1984, maybe the year before.

I went to high school in the late 90's, in a blue state where anything gay related was getting to be much less taboo. Still, during that time period, nobody dared to come out in high school. Everyone always waited until college. That's what I did. Matt on the other hand was protesting not being able to bring his boyfriend to prom in the mid-80's in a small, very conservative Oregon town. That's a completely different universe.

It's nice to find out this info. Usually victims profiled on UM were described briefly at the beginning of segments by Stack or a family member or friend. We never got that with Matt. All we learned about him was that he moved to California after high school.

Ahead of his time were the exact words that popped in my head when I read that. Doing the math, he had to have graduated high school in 1984, maybe the year before.

I went to high school in the late 90's, in a blue state where anything gay related was getting to be much less taboo. Still, during that time period, nobody dared to come out in high school. Everyone always waited until college. That's what I did. Matt on the other hand was protesting not being able to bring his boyfriend to prom in the mid-80's in a small, very conservative Oregon town. That's a completely different universe.

It's nice to find out this info. Usually victims profiled on UM were described briefly at the beginning of segments by Stack or a family member or friend. We never got that with Matt. All we learned about him was that he moved to California after high school.

The author made an interesting point about Medford, Oregon I had noticed and all the early cases related to there. I had never heard of the city before UM, but it's currently the 4th largest city in OR.

For years we wondered about Chase and we get the answer. So odd how things work.

Who could forget Melvin Eugene Hansen, Richard Boggs, Ellis Henry Greene, and of course party boy John Hawkins?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Boggs

http://lawandordnance.com/An-Outrageous-Murder-Plot.html

Here's John Hawkins today.

http://www.johnbarretthawkins.com/

Oddly enough, John Hawkins refers to his potential soulmate as "female." Hmmm.

I have a lot of admiration for Matt - seems like he was really ahead of his time.

He has one of the best smiles ever in that pic.

Matthew Chase, I definitely felt was gay. It looks like our suspicions were confirmed. I really felt sorry for his BFF when she was interviewed. You could tell how much she cared about him.

Matthew Chase, I definitely felt was gay. It looks like our suspicions were confirmed. I really felt sorry for his BFF when she was interviewed. You could tell how much she cared about him.

I do feel bad for the Dahls and Matthew's family. Teresa in particular seemed pretty confident Matt was still alive even though it was pretty obvious what happened and everyone else knew it. She must have been devastated to learn about the murder.

I do feel bad for the Dahls and Matthew's family. Teresa in particular seemed pretty confident Matt was still alive even though it was pretty obvious what happened and everyone else knew it. She must have been devastated to learn about the murder.

It sounded as if she was going through the "denial" part of the grieving process. I am sure she still thinks about him daily. I wonder what ever became of Teresa.

I just hope Steve Dahl (if they were lovers) was able to move on from such a traumatic loss.

I just hope Steve Dahl (if they were lovers) was able to move on from such a traumatic loss.

Me too, for both Steve and Teresa, though I didn't get the impression they were lovers, but close friends. It was kind of neat how they all moved together to LA and were roommates. I am guessing this was in the West Hollywood area.

Me too, for both Steve and Teresa, though I didn't get the impression they were lovers, but close friends. It was kind of neat how they all moved together to LA and were roommates. I am guessing this was in the West Hollywood area.

Stack said they were all friends since they were little kids. That's really the only information UM said about their pre-California lives.

I'd be curious to know how Steve and Teresa are doing today. They were likable interviewees.

Stack said they were all friends since they were little kids. That's really the only information UM said about their pre-California lives.

I'd be curious to know how Steve and Teresa are doing today. They were likable interviewees.


We should find them!

There is a Teresa Dahl on Facebook, but it's hard to tell if it's really her because she has glasses on and Teresa didn't wear glasses in the interview. Plus I looked at her friends list and there's no Steve or whatever his full name is. He himself might have passed or this Teresa Dahl is a different one.

I forgot about Selena. I also believe she was a lesbian. And there was also that segment about the lady who was very accurate in her police composite sketches (don't remember her name) and she was filmed on camera doing one of her drawings with an eyewitness who was holding playdoh as he talked. I always figured that guy was gay as well for some reason.


Why the speculations on Matthew Chase and the well-coiffed man that hosted "Jason" in the Jeannie Boyland segment?

[QUOTE=thinwhiteduke74]Oh – wow. Recent post too. I'm still amazed some of you could tell he was gay from his photo though (and I'm gay). The show still elided mention of his sexuality. Had Matthew Chase been dating Teresa Dahl, the show would have mentioned it, e.g. "He was living in L.A. with his girlfriend Teresa Dahl and her brother Steven."[/QUOTE/]

The site says it was arumor that he was homosexual. There was no concrete proof.

There was once a passing thought that Deborah Poe and her roommate ("We had an unusual friendship") was homosexual. But, I doubt that was the case. I think they were just friends living together.

The site says it was arumor that he was homosexual. There was no concrete proof.

That isn't the case at all. I was the one who uncovered the post and I distinctly remember it was coming from somebody who knew all 3 of them. Specifically, he used to sit next to Teresa Dahl in algebra class. Apparently, Matthew and his boyfriend were out and it was pretty well known in the area. Not a rumor. I guess you could call the claim unverified, but I really don't know what motive anyone would have for spreading false information on a person that's been dead for 27 years.

I also thought that people from their hometown said Matt protested not being able to take his boyfriend to prom? Or was that a rumor?

I also thought that people from their hometown said Matt protested not being able to take his boyfriend to prom? Or was that a rumor?

That was from the same article. I tend to believe it, since it was also stated he took a mannequin to the prom in spite of it. That's not something somebody can make up.

Why the speculations on Matthew Chase and the well-coiffed man that hosted "Jason" in the Jeannie Boyland segment?

Well there's also a possibility that Richard Simmons is a completely heterosexual man.

But I doubt it.

That was from the same article. I tend to believe it, since it was also stated he took a mannequin to the prom in spite of it. That's not something somebody can make up.
I agree. I mean, I guess someone could make it up, but it seems so random and detailed that why would they have reason to?

On a side note, I think about this case a lot. I wouldn't go use an ATM late at night in my own relatively safe suburb of L.A. county, but in the heart of L.A. itself, downtown? I shiver to think about it. The thing about downtown is that there are plenty of places that are just fine. You'll see people dressed up and partying. But go a couple of blocks astray and suddenly you'll want to turn back and get the heck out of there. I don't even feel at ease surrounded by burly male friends down there. I'm guessing that this was something Matt had done before and he felt fine doing it as long as he was quick about it. Unfortunately, he picked the wrong time and place :(

I've always caught a vibe in the military friends who both committed suicide(or did they?) case. The story is pitched conspiratorially and they were both married to women, but something about the despondent psych write-up on the second "suicide" always hinked me towards something else.

That was from the same article. I tend to believe it, since it was also stated he took a mannequin to the prom in spite of it. That's not something somebody can make up.

OMG. The more and more I read about Matthew Chase, the more I like him. That's hilarious. And probably quite provocative for the 1980's. Good on him.

If all of that was true about Matt Chase, then he was a cool person, not too many gay guys in the 80's were out especially in high school, and if he took that mannequin to the prom then wow. He could have been a great role model, who knows what he could have done.

Sad Case, sometimes you wonder what these young people would have done had they not been murdered, or gone Missing

theero! A fellow Miamian!

Jack Quinn is another. he's the guy that stole money from the credit union that employed him (not on the scale of Steve Hadley). His wife said he would leave for work very early. Police suspected he was seeing his girlfriend.


BTW, has anyone else seen the Masterminds episode "The Disappearing Man". It is about Steve Hadley and is very good.

The Leo Koury segment alluded to him being involved in gay community in Richmond, VA. I found these two references (I realize you need to take Wikipedia with a grain of salt at times) that show the extent of his Koury's activities. The segment didn't get into this much detail...maybe due to the time when the segment aired? Also, I believe the one bar mentioned in the segment was "The Mail Box"...in reality is was "The Male Box".

https://books.google.com/books?id=9MMAg_NnwQUC&pg=PA50&lpg=PA50&dq=leo+koury&source=bl&ots=_I1TSpG3Xd&sig=lltT1oYdKpoGe7U_56ewQt2LjVE&hl=en&sa=X&sqi=2&ved=0CGIQ6AEwDGoVChMI2_jL17GXyAIVDJ6ACh3wXwrW#v=onepage&q=leo%20koury&f=false

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Block_(Richmond,_VA)#Leo_Joseph_Koury

Well, bummer. I don't usually do such things, but I contacted that person that knew Matthew Chase to see if they had any more interesting stories. Unfortunately, I didn't get a response.

Steve Dahl looks good for his age. Reminds me of yhe guy from Prom Night who mysteriously died at some point in the mid eighties from aids

Steve Dahl looks good for his age. Reminds me of yhe guy from Prom Night who mysteriously died at some point in the mid eighties from aids

Where did you see a current photo of him?

His Facebook

With all due respect, I wish those who are or have attempted to contact Matthew's family and/or friends would have the discretion to not harass them about Matthew. I am sure they have suffered enough and it would seen morbid to them for some stranger(s) to suddenly bombard them, asking them stories about their murdered son/friend. I know some of us are curious, but maybe it's best to let it go.

On another note, does anyone get a homosexual vibe from Scott Johnston, the young man who saw the man that killed Jonathan Francia? Jeanne Boylan said Scott was an "interesting" man who took care in the way he looks (how he combs his hair and the way he dresses), and the way they he said that "Jason", all cowboyish, was the kind of guy the girls would be into. Just seems metrosexual if not homosexual. I also find it funny that Scott lived in a trailer, as clean and neat as he looked. Looks like he may have had to find a new crowd of friends after finding out Paul and "Jason" murdered someone. Poor Scott.

Steve Dahl looks good imo

With the series being brought back, Amy new suspicions?

I got the vibe from the Don Kemp segment that he and the guy in the trailer possibly had a homosexual relationship.

I just watched the Farina version then on YT and thought the same thing. The case is so weird I don't even know if he was anywhere the trailer or some shady guy.

Based on typical percentages within the population there are far too many names in this thread

On another note, does anyone get a homosexual vibe from Scott Johnston, the young man who saw the man that killed Jonathan Francia? Jeanne Boylan said Scott was an "interesting" man who took care in the way he looks (how he combs his hair and the way he dresses), and the way they he said that "Jason", all cowboyish, was the kind of guy the girls would be into. Just seems metrosexual if not homosexual. I also find it funny that Scott lived in a trailer, as clean and neat as he looked. Looks like he may have had to find a new crowd of friends after finding out Paul and "Jason" murdered someone. Poor Scott.

I'm a gay male myself and I have definitely misread people's sexual orientations before, but Scott Johnston definitely struck me as gay. It's impossible to say for certain of course, but that was my first impression. If I remember correctly, he was best friends with the Paul's wife/girlfriend which is unusual for a straight man, but most telling was the way he described the mysterious "Jason" character: When he began describing him in the interview, he said something to the effect that he was an attractive man, then kind of backpedaled and said something like, "Well, he was someone that the girls would find attractive." Seemed clear enough to me that he thought the Jason character was sexually attractive (despite the fact that he had blood on his hands and had just committed a murder).

If Scott Johnston isn't gay, I'm a woolly mammoth. One of the cuter UM participants too -- what hair!

If Scott Johnston isn't gay, I'm a woolly mammoth. One of the cuter UM participants too -- what hair!

If Scott Johnston isn't gay, I'm a woolly mammoth.


Just watched the segment and you are definitely NOT a wooly mammoth.

me! i mean, us! i mean, Louis Bourgeois and Jean-Marie Gagnon.

we are so clearly gay and UM did not mention it all.

BY THE WAY: am i crazy or didn't i see this case on amazon? I can't find it now.

me! i mean, us! i mean, Louis Bourgeois and Jean-Marie Gagnon.

we are so clearly gay and UM did not mention it all.

BY THE WAY: am i crazy or didn't i see this case on amazon? I can't find it now.

Wait ... am I missing something here?

Wait ... am I missing something here?

I think they are referring to their avatar picture. I got lost for a second, too. :)

I think they are referring to their avatar picture. I got lost for a second, too. :)

Ahhh ... ok, makes more sense now. I was a bit excited (is that bad?).

Ahhh ... ok, makes more sense now. I was a bit excited (is that bad?).

sorry to have gotten your hopes up :(

but am i crazy or was this case on amazon?

Just watched the segment and you are definitely NOT a wooly mammoth.

Just watched this one again and Scott Johnston is definitely a friend of Dorothy's. ;)

me! i mean, us! i mean, Louis Bourgeois and Jean-Marie Gagnon.

we are so clearly gay and UM did not mention it all.

BY THE WAY: am i crazy or didn't i see this case on amazon? I can't find it now.

It was originally aired as part of the Alcatraz special in order to keep up with their "prison escapes" theme, but for some reason, they've edited the segment out of the Alcatraz special on Prime.

On a side note, I was initially VERY confused by the preceding Scott Johnson comments since I thought everyone was referring to the boy who was burned in the shack.

I did too!

On a side note, I was initially VERY confused by the preceding Scott Johnson comments since I thought everyone was referring to the boy who was burned in the shack.

Oh, holy crap, I laughed so hard at reading this. That probably WAS a brain bender. :)

Oh, holy crap, I laughed so hard at reading this. That probably WAS a brain bender. :)

This is HILARIOUS ( I am saying this in my Jerri Blank voice) .

Yes, clearly Scott was a friend of Dorothy and there is absolutely no question in my mind about that.

I really need to rewatch this segment to get some laughs again. He was a very attractive male, I will add.

I think UM, in general, had a very conservative bent to it, especially in its early years, which is why they shied away from topics like same-sex relationships. I can't think of any case before Bryan Nisenfeld's (which of course was years after the NBC run) where Stack mentioned anything about homosexuality, aside from the Leo Khoury case with that awful scene of his henchman recruiting someone 'from the gay community' as a hitman.

I skimmed quickly through the pages of this thread, but I don't believe the John Hawkins / Dr Richard Boggs case was mentioned. UM completely side-stepped the homosexual angle on this one, but Forensic Files, which did an episode on this case years later, tackled it head-on. Not only did investigators discover that Dr Boggs had financial problems, but he was closeted and sex toys were found in his office drawers. Their victim, Ellis Henry Greene (who did not look anything like the re-enactment actor and whose actual picture was not used), was HIV positive and it's thought that Dr Boggs met him at a gay bar. John Hawkins also was known to use his charms on both men and women; one of his former lovers called AMW with his whereabouts.

Add in another (gay) person who clocked Matthew Chase from the get-go, sometimes you just know these things. But then again, I didn't see that segment until I was 25. Also, it was clear that Scott Johnston had a crush on "Jason" which (hopefully) dissipated after he realized that he was part of a murder. (And I also had to not confuse him with the little Arizona boy who died in the shack.)

I *did* see the Jean-Marie Gagnon segment as a kid and never forgot that B&W pic of him and Louis Bourgeois. I mean, really! Then Gagnon was discovered to be in a small Georgia town as a masseur. :lol:

(a) Re: Boggs, I really need to see that episode. I think he later succumbed to AIDS (Boggs) if I am correct. The whole crime was an awful ordeal in planning. How did the doctor think that nobody would find out the truth? The EMS learned it after showing up and noticing the body's rigor mortis.

(b) I know Matthew Chase has been discussed several times as being gay. I have the same feeling too, and myself also being gay, I felt bad for his parents. I feel that they probably knew nothing about their son's lifestyle, until they returned to California after he disappeared. Of course, like most of this stuff on here, it is just speculation. But Oregon was a pretty conservative state in the 1980s and I know he wasn't from Portland.

I was born in the 1980s and grew up in the bible belt. Where I am from, gay people were considered perverts. Because AIDS was so rampant at that time period, and the 1990s, people also associated it with Leprosy. It doesn't surprise me in hindsight that UM avoided the topic. I think all of this is educational to future generations who will never understand how off topic the subject of homosexuality really was during that period.

(b) I know Matthew Chase has been discussed several times as being gay. I have the same feeling too, and myself also being gay, I felt bad for his parents. I feel that they probably knew nothing about their son's lifestyle, until they returned to California after he disappeared. Of course, like most of this stuff on here, it is just speculation. But Oregon was a pretty conservative state in the 1980s and I know he wasn't from Portland.

I thought someone posted an anecdote about Chase taking a boyfriend to his prom. No doubt his parents would've learned about it.

Point taken, though!

Oh my! That's news to me. There's just so much information stacked up on these boards, there's no way I can read all of the stuff that's been posted. I do admire the people who were around for the postings, and still remember their stuff!

I think UM, in general, had a very conservative bent to it, especially in its early years, which is why they shied away from topics like same-sex relationships. I can't think of any case before Bryan Nisenfeld's (which of course was years after the NBC run) where Stack mentioned anything about homosexuality, aside from the Leo Khoury case with that awful scene of his henchman recruiting someone 'from the gay community' as a hitman.:

Since we're talking about the late 80's here, I don't know if you can really say the show had a "conservative bent" in those early years that transitioned in to the 90's as much as it was the norm for all television. If you pick out any sitcom or drama from those exact years, even having a gay character was much too controversial unless it was the rarely seen guest star who's only purpose was to stand in for "the very special episode." And even those were once in a blue moon.

As much as you can watch the Mark Groezinger segment now and probably roll your eyes over how much they tried to tip-toe around the lesbian angle between Judy and her friend, just the fact that they pointed it out is kind of a miracle considering this aired in 1989.

And although Matthew Chase disappeared and his segment aired in 1988, his sexuality was pretty moot because his case involved a bad neighborhood and being in the wrong place at the wrong time. That killer wanted his Mathew's money.

I do remember kind of being thrown for a loop the first time I saw the Will Hendrick segment. It was the first time I ever remembered hearing the word, "gay" on the show. It centered on a missing gay college kid and had interviews with his partner and parents, the mother in particular saying she worried that some psycho who didn't like gay people might have killed her son. And they even show a reenactment of the partner firing an employee after the employee called him a f*ggot. (And yes, the actor even said the actual word.)

What's interesting about the Bryan Nisenfeld segment is that we still don't even know for sure if he was gay. It was theorized by an investigator who read his poetry and an RA in his dorm. But his friends and family can only speculate.

I think UM, in general, had a very conservative bent to it, especially in its early years, which is why they shied away from topics like same-sex relationships. I can't think of any case before Bryan Nisenfeld's (which of course was years after the NBC run) where Stack mentioned anything about homosexuality, aside from the Leo Khoury case with that awful scene of his henchman recruiting someone 'from the gay community' as a hitman.

I skimmed quickly through the pages of this thread, but I don't believe the John Hawkins / Dr Richard Boggs case was mentioned. UM completely side-stepped the homosexual angle on this one, but Forensic Files, which did an episode on this case years later, tackled it head-on. Not only did investigators discover that Dr Boggs had financial problems, but he was closeted and sex toys were found in his office drawers. Their victim, Ellis Henry Greene (who did not look anything like the re-enactment actor and whose actual picture was not used), was HIV positive and it's thought that Dr Boggs met him at a gay bar. John Hawkins also was known to use his charms on both men and women; one of his former lovers called AMW with his whereabouts.

Add in another (gay) person who clocked Matthew Chase from the get-go, sometimes you just know these things. But then again, I didn't see that segment until I was 25. Also, it was clear that Scott Johnston had a crush on "Jason" which (hopefully) dissipated after he realized that he was part of a murder. (And I also had to not confuse him with the little Arizona boy who died in the shack.)

I *did* see the Jean-Marie Gagnon segment as a kid and never forgot that B&W pic of him and Louis Bourgeois. I mean, really! Then Gagnon was discovered to be in a small Georgia town as a masseur. :lol:


I never caught that with Scott Johnston. I thought he seemed replsed by jason'smanner of dress (He had a quote similar to "Oh boy. This guy dresses like a cowboy." ) Maybe he did have acrush on him, though. I know he made the statement that Jason was a good looking huy and tehn caught himsel and said "The ladies would be attracted to him."

I really iwsh UM had gone into more detail about Dr. Boggs. the Fprensic Files episode was great. I hav ebeen unable to find the AMW segment on John Hawkins (I have only seen a commercial). Is it available anywhere? I haven't seen the thin on Oxygen about John Hawkins either (no cable or Dish).

On another note, does anyone get a homosexual vibe from Scott Johnston, the young man who saw the man that killed Jonathan Francia? Jeanne Boylan said Scott was an "interesting" man who took care in the way he looks (how he combs his hair and the way he dresses), and the way they he said that "Jason", all cowboyish, was the kind of guy the girls would be into. Just seems metrosexual if not homosexual. I also find it funny that Scott lived in a trailer, as clean and neat as he looked. Looks like he may have had to find a new crowd of friends after finding out Paul and "Jason" murdered someone. Poor Scott.

Or, he only had money to afford a trailer.

Since we're talking about the late 80's here, I don't know if you can really say the show had a "conservative bent" in those early years that transitioned in to the 90's as much as it was the norm for all television.

^This.

What about Selena Edon?

She was mentioned upthread, no?

he was best friends with the Paul's wife/girlfriend which is unusual for a straight man

Well ****, I better let my two close female friends know we can't be friends anymore.

Dustin Johnson is openly gay. He was the son of the woman murdered by Dennis Keith Smith. He looks very bear-y today. Woof.

I'm surprised no one has brought up A.J. Breaux. UM did not mention he was gay, but it's been revealed in media accounts. My theory on his disappearance is that he went to a rendezvous at the park and was killed by someone who targeted gay men.

I graduated high school in 1984, same year as Matthew Chase. Back then homosexuality was not really discussed on television. If UM had revealed any of these murder victims were gay they would have undoubtedly been showered with hate mail from certain parts of the country.

I would include Breaux now, sure.

I'm surprised no one has brought up A.J. Breaux. UM did not mention he was gay, but it's been revealed in media accounts. My theory on his disappearance is that he went to a rendezvous at the park and was killed by someone who targeted gay men.



While that's possible, AJ's disappearance is very cloudy. There are a lot of different scenarios, like alcohol relapse, mental illness, suicide, and abduction/murder. Given his volunteer work, he would have been surrounded by some people that may not have been on the right track legally. It's hard to imagine that he would have left his daughters, I also think that he could have left on his accord and never went back. His disappearance is one of the most mysterious on the show, I personally don't feel that he was murdered because of his sexuality, but that could have been something that was a factor in his disappearance, and yet maybe it had nothing to do with it at all.

While that's possible, AJ's disappearance is very cloudy. There are a lot of different scenarios, like alcohol relapse, mental illness, suicide, and abduction/murder. Given his volunteer work, he would have been surrounded by some people that may not have been on the right track legally. It's hard to imagine that he would have left his daughters, I also think that he could have left on his accord and never went back. His disappearance is one of the most mysterious on the show, I personally don't feel that he was murdered because of his sexuality, but that could have been something that was a factor in his disappearance, and yet maybe it had nothing to do with it at all.

There's no way to prove it but I don't get the sense his disappearance had anything to do with his sexuality either.

I think it had something to do with money. AJ owned a clothing store for 30-something years. Being a longtime successful business owner, I'm sure whoever abducted AJ thought he had plenty of money, and they wanted access to it. I think it's possible this person was even waiting for AJ beside his car when he bought milk from the convenience store. That would explain why he never made it home. He lived with one of his daughters who would know immediately that he never made it home.

A mental breakdown seems unlikely. A relapse feels even MORE unlikely as he was in great spirits in both the meeting at the Easy Does It Club and the conversation with the cashier at the convenience store. I don't know what could have happened so quickly to make him start drinking and then run away in shame.

While attitudes towards gay people can get pretty disgusting, especially in the south, a secret rendezvous at the park with a gay basher doesn't really help explain the Kenneth Pelligrin sighting and exchange at the phone booth a few days later. I don't see a gay basher kidnapping him for multiple days. And AJ didn't have any viewable bruises or injuries during this sighting either. He was just unkempt.

Sadly, I feel AJ was killed very shortly after the phone booth sighting. Maybe the men in the red car allowed him to make that phone call thinking he was going to arrange some type of monetary transfer or something and when that didn't happen, they killed him.

There's no way to prove it but I don't get the sense his disappearance had anything to do with his sexuality either.

While attitudes towards gay people can get pretty disgusting, especially in the south, a secret rendezvous at the park with a gay basher doesn't really help explain the Kenneth Pelligrin sighting and exchange at the phone booth a few days later. I don't see a gay basher kidnapping him for multiple days. And AJ didn't have any viewable bruises or injuries during this sighting either. He was just unkempt.

I don't put it on a gay basher at all, instead another gay man who victimized others because of their marginalized status and the nature of anonymous meetings. More like Jeffrey Dahmer and John Wayne Gacy, gay men who used other gay men as easy targets.

I don't put much stake in eyewitness sightings...too many fails in UM's long history (Cary Lynn Nixon, Lil Miss, Gail Delano, etc.). It was probably not him at the phone booth or they were mistaken on the date.

I don't put it on a gay basher at all, instead another gay man who victimized others because of their marginalized status and the nature of anonymous meetings. More like Jeffrey Dahmer and John Wayne Gacy, gay men who used other gay men as easy targets.

I don't put much stake in eyewitness sightings...too many fails in UM's long history (Cary Lynn Nixon, Lil Miss, Gail Delano, etc.). It was probably not him at the phone booth or they were mistaken on the date.

Yeesh. Jeffrey Dahmer and John Wayne Gacy are two of the most heinous, evil serial killers in history. They kept endless body parts and corpses stacked on top of each other inside their own homes. And their victims were always either teenage boys or young men in their early 20's. (Also, Gacy's victims were not gay, at least the majority of known ones weren't. They were either runaways or teens who tried applying for a job in what was advertised as a construction business.) AJ, approaching 59 years old and being a very well known resident throughout Houma, doesn't seem like the typical kind of target. His disappearance would be noticed and reported immediately, and it was. With that said, it's not out of the question that a disturbed gay man could do this another. I just don't see a secret meeting in the park or anywhere at that moment. Why even buy the carton of milk first?

Also, you can't throw this eyewitness sighting in with the other examples you mentioned that all involved complete strangers. The witness was extremely reliable having known AJ for almost his entire life, and the fact that he said, "Hey AJ," and the man replied, "hey," back.

I just don't see the scenario you provided. But to each their own.

Yeesh. Jeffrey Dahmer and John Wayne Gacy are two of the most heinous, evil serial killers in history. They kept endless body parts and corpses stacked on top of each other inside their own homes. And their victims were always either teenage boys or young men in their early 20's. (Also, Gacy's victims were not gay, at least the majority of known ones weren't. They were either runaways or teens who tried applying for a job in what was advertised as a construction business.) AJ, approaching 59 years old and being a very well known resident throughout Houma, doesn't seem like the typical kind of target. His disappearance would be noticed and reported immediately, and it was. With that said, it's not out of the question that a disturbed gay man could do this another. I just don't see a secret meeting in the park or anywhere at that moment. Why even buy the carton of milk first?

Also, you can't throw this eyewitness sighting in with the other examples you mentioned that all involved complete strangers. The witness was extremely reliable having known AJ for almost his entire life, and the fact that he said, "Hey AJ," and the man replied, "hey," back.

I just don't see the scenario you provided. But to each their own.

absolutely, in fact AJ's case is the very example of when you should take an eye witness testimony a bit more seriously, and I think AJ's daughter hit the nail on the head in her interview when she mentioned the fact that the 2 witnesses knew him very well. Now I will concede that it is not 100%, but you can't compare it to Lisa Marie Kimmel's case as you've stated.

There's no way to prove it but I don't get the sense his disappearance had anything to do with his sexuality either.

I think it had something to do with money. AJ owned a clothing store for 30-something years. Being a longtime successful business owner, I'm sure whoever abducted AJ thought he had plenty of money, and they wanted access to it. I think it's possible this person was even waiting for AJ beside his car when he bought milk from the convenience store. That would explain why he never made it home. He lived with one of his daughters who would know immediately that he never made it home.

A mental breakdown seems unlikely. A relapse feels even MORE unlikely as he was in great spirits in both the meeting at the Easy Does It Club and the conversation with the cashier at the convenience store. I don't know what could have happened so quickly to make him start drinking and then run away in shame.

While attitudes towards gay people can get pretty disgusting, especially in the south, a secret rendezvous at the park with a gay basher doesn't really help explain the Kenneth Pelligrin sighting and exchange at the phone booth a few days later. I don't see a gay basher kidnapping him for multiple days. And AJ didn't have any viewable bruises or injuries during this sighting either. He was just unkempt.

Sadly, I feel AJ was killed very shortly after the phone booth sighting. Maybe the men in the red car allowed him to make that phone call thinking he was going to arrange some type of monetary transfer or something and when that didn't happen, they killed him.

those are good points, I actually never heard or thought of the clothing store/monetary motive, but that makes a lot more sense to me now as a possible motive.

those are good points, I actually never heard or thought of the clothing store/monetary motive, but that makes a lot more sense to me now as a possible motive.

Going after someone's money just seems like a much easier and more logical explanation than some of the endless rabbit holes we try to explore for many cases. Finding out later that the victim was gay...it certainly creates a new avenue to explore but I feel rarely does the revelation actually end up steering the story away from what was always the original motive.

It reminds me of when we were discussing the Matthew Chase case a few years ago and some people said they believed Matthew was killed because he tried to attempt a gay hookup in the bank parking lot with the wrong man. And I had to respond, how does a quick trip to the ATM and stopping to buy cat food turn into that? He was clearly killed by a criminal who wanted his money and he was going to kill Matthew afterwards regardless of his sexual orientation. It was nothing more than being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I can't prove my theory about AJ but it just seems the most logical.

I skimmed quickly through the pages of this thread, but I don't believe the John Hawkins / Dr Richard Boggs case was mentioned. UM completely side-stepped the homosexual angle on this one, but Forensic Files, which did an episode on this case years later, tackled it head-on. Not only did investigators discover that Dr Boggs had financial problems, but he was closeted and sex toys were found in his office drawers. Their victim, Ellis Henry Greene (who did not look anything like the re-enactment actor and whose actual picture was not used), was HIV positive and it's thought that Dr Boggs met him at a gay bar. John Hawkins also was known to use his charms on both men and women; one of his former lovers called AMW with his whereabouts.




Ran across that FF segment and good lord is it wild. Will never watch that one the same way again.

Should the title of this thread have been "alluded" instead of "elided"?

Should the title of this thread have been "alluded" instead of "elided"?

Yeah. That took me longer to figure out than I'm willing to admit, and it was only after seeing someone use "eluded" in place of "alluded" on Reddit.

those are good points, I actually never heard or thought of the clothing store/monetary motive, but that makes a lot more sense to me now as a possible motive.

I thought he worked at the clothing store, but was not the owner of it. Likely a big difference in income there.

I thought he worked at the clothing store, but was not the owner of it. Likely a big difference in income there.
So I was not sure if he owned a clothing store or if he worked there as an employee. regardless I think money could have been a motive for his kidnapping/disappearance.

Tim McClure

Tim McClure

Elaborate?

Elaborate?

Just the impression I got from him.

I used "elided" because in many of the stories the writers stepped around or removed the homosexual elements.

I used "elided" because in many of the stories the writers stepped around or removed the homosexual elements.

I think you're looking for "alluded."

I think you're looking for "alluded."

If the writers had alluded to the homosexuality, the directors wouldn't have had to elide them in the filming. In some cases the complexities of sexuality eluded them.

*see what I did there*

I saw the Adam Hecht segment again and I may be totally off with this but it seemed to me there were subtle undertones of something more with Tony and perhaps the family alluded but at the same time avoided any hints to something more between the two.

Blair Adams

Wow almost 3 years since anybody has posted in this thread.
I'm surprised no one brought up Liz Carmichael or Delia Leon yet.
Also some of the comments under the E.L.F episode on YouTube towards Sarah Allen are rude, we don't know for a fact if she was transgender.
That person was living her life as best she could despite everything and nearly 30 years later people are misgendering and transvestigating her, even the one comment mentioning her here did so nearly a decade ago.

Good catch re Liz Carmichael/Jerry Dean Michael.

Wow alomst 3 years since anybody has posted in this thread.
I'm surprised no one brought up Liz Carmichael or Delia Leon yet.
Also some of the comments under the E.L.F episode on youtube towards Sarah Allen are rude, we don't know for a fact if she was transgender.
That person was living her life as best she could despite everything and nearly 30 years later people are misgendering and transvestigating her, even the one comment mentioning her here did so nearly a decade ago.

definitely agree about Sarah Allen. also some of the posts about Matthew Chase disappoint me. Particular about him possibly hooking up with someone and getting murdered. we know that he was robbed, there's literally a dude on CCTV standing over his shoulder. there was evidence found in his vehicle that gang activity could have also been a reason, which we know that Matt was not involved in, which proves wrong place wrong time. Matt's latest UM update also theorizes that his murderer was desperate for money and was soon murdered himself shortly after his crime.

Going after someone's money just seems like a much easier and more logical explanation than some of the endless rabbit holes we try to explore for many cases. Finding out later that the victim was gay...it certainly creates a new avenue to explore but I feel rarely does the revelation actually end up steering the story away from what was always the original motive.

It reminds me of when we were discussing the Matthew Chase case a few years ago and some people said they believed Matthew was killed because he tried to attempt a gay hookup in the bank parking lot with the wrong man. And I had to respond, how does a quick trip to the ATM and stopping to buy cat food turn into that? He was clearly killed by a criminal who wanted his money and he was going to kill Matthew afterwards regardless of his sexual orientation. It was nothing more than being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I can't prove my theory about AJ but it just seems the most logical.
definitely agree here about both AJ and Matthew. Matthew's case is closed now and there's no question in my mind that he was robbed by a gang member.

surprised that I didn't reply when you posted this. I always tend to think that AJ's disappearance had to do with money and AJ's involvement in the easy does it club or perhaps involvement with another drug addict that had nothing to do with the club and was perhaps an associate of someone who did. I think someone from the club could have put him in contact with someone else. Not everyone agrees with that theory, but it's just a hunch that I cannot shake. if we are to believe the eye witness that knew AJ well, AJ was seen with other men who may have been gay or not, I tend to think not. they might have been drinking or on drugs and for whatever reason bullied AJ thinking that he could fund their drug/alcohol bender/rampage. they could have also bullied or pressured AJ into drinking. or the witness might have been wrong. IDK, but that is the best lead that we have IMO.

I've always caught a vibe in the military friends who both committed suicide(or did they?) case. The story is pitched conspiratorially and they were both married to women, but something about the despondent psych write-up on the second "suicide" always hinked me towards something else.

I think you are talking about Mike Carmichael and Billy ray Hargrove...not sure if you are talking about an extramarital affair? I think one of the guys wives accused him of having an affair which would not be surprising because military members travel a lot and work in close quarters with one another. doesn't mean they all have affairs, but some do. some have affairs and some get wrongfully accused because it's hard being a military spouse regardless of gender.

as for suicide I believe that both committed suicide because of several hardships that they were going through. One of them didn't show up to work and allegedly didn't want to face his leadership who would have punished him for not coming to work. I think one or both were also in trouble and facing court martial for fraud. that would have put them in a bad standing in their unit. so any subsequent trouble would have possibly put their career on the line, I.E showing up late to work, while normally gets shrugged off in most cases, would have been a big deal for someone who is already dealing with a past crime.

The military services though are not absolved from wrong doing when someone commits suicide. that is where I wish more family members would have taken a different approach. try to find out why their loved one did it and find out what the services could have done to take better care of their family members. that would be more meaningful and helpful than accusing people of conspiracies.

I read an article on Sarah Allen years ago that mentioned that she did in fact transition in the 1980s. I've seen some nasty comments about her on YouTube and it's just pitiful. I wonder how Sarah has been since the Unsolved Mysteries interview?

I read an article on Sarah Allen years ago that mentioned that she did in fact transition in the 1980s. I've seen some nasty comments about her on YouTube and it's just pitiful. I wonder how Sarah has been since the Unsolved Mysteries interview?

yeah and sad to read about the comments about Julie Cross as well when that video was on there. I don't remember seeing that segment on Unsolved Mysteries, for some reason I remember from another program but I could be mistaken. I was watching an American history video today unrelated to UM and then made the mistake of scrolling through the comments.

I remember the possible hate crimes on the show and how they definitely avoided talking about homosexuality (it was the late 1980s and 1990s).

Beverly McGowan's murder always seemed unnecessarily brutal even from the viewpoint of trying to conceal her identity. The viciousness of it really struck me as over the top--of course, that's me trying to understand an evil act as a rational person.

I don't know about Beverly's sexuality, but maybe Elaine Parent felt rejected in addition to panicking (as some programs have speculated) over Beverly potentially calling the police. That could explain the savagery of the killing. Elaine Parent was 100 percent narcissistic and evil, and clearly her ex-lover (a woman) felt that darkness too.

I read an article on Sarah Allen years ago that mentioned that she did in fact transition in the 1980s. I've seen some nasty comments about her on YouTube and it's just pitiful. I wonder how Sarah has been since the Unsolved Mysteries interview?

Oh wow that's really cool I had no idea, I remember looking her up and could find nothing about her online.
It's amazing how sometimes without anybody expecting it LGBTQ people would show up in older shows and media in general, it's like we've always been here you know?
And yes I agree it's pitiful, just goes to show you that even without trying or "shoving their ideologies down your throat" some people just have a problem with trans folks simply existing.
I hope she's had a good life and has been able to overcome this impairment.