Breaking news on the Angela Hammond Case!! [Archive] - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

kadrmas15

10-20-2009, 07:24 PM

I am not sure how things work in Norway but what are you talking about Rob Schafer cannot be cleared? We are an innocent until proven guilty society. Sure he could be cleared. His car, his transmission was severely damaged. I will say, for an 18 year old kid to do what you are accusing him of he would have to be pretty damn smart. He would have to have incredible foresight that a person that age simply would not have.

Rob Shafer did eventually move on yes, well that is if you consider him getting a new woman in his life moving on. I have yet to see how that makes him or anyone else guilty in and of itself. Yes he did eventually marry I believe and I am not sure if he stayed in Missouri or if he moved elsewhere or what?

However I mean to have the foresight to come up with the story he did, I do not think it was unusual that no one in town saw him. This was a small town, it was a weeknight, the downtown area at that time of night even in the relative early evening would have been deserted as most of the shops would have been closed, traffic would have been light. This was before the days most of the general public had cell phones so using a pay phone was not at all unusual. I am assuming the police checked with the pay phone company to check the records and I am assuming there was a record of someone using that pay phone to make a call to Rob's house. Also there were witnesses BEFORE the abduction who saw Angie using the pay phones.

You seem to get confused making someone a suspect and clearing them. Yes the police had reason to make Rob Schafer a suspect. He was her boyfriend, she was pregnant and presumably he was the father of the child, he was the last person KNOWN to have talked to her before the alleged abduction. However again, someone told him these details about the bearded, dirty looking man driving a lime green and white Ford Pickup with a mural in the back window of a fish jumping out of water. Those are very specific details.

Comparing Rob Schafer to Donnie Hansen is simply not even close to a fair comparison. I am an innocent until proven guilty believer, I am pro defense but wow, Donnie's lawyer must have been F. Lee Bailey or the prosecutor stunk to lose that case. I have seen people convicted of murder charges off of WAY less than what they had on Donnie Hansen.

That was not just a circumstantial case. I mean who was in possession of the murder weapon the night of the murder? Donnie Hansen. Who purchased the shotgun shells used to kill his sisters? Donnie Hansen. Who purchased the gas can and the gasoline used to start the fire? Donnie Hansen. On top of that who tried sneaking back into the shop allegedly to feed the family dog even though he knew the dog had been moved to a neighbors and was not there? Donnie Hansen. Why? It is because he knew the shotgun was in there because he put the gun in there after he shot his sisters and started the trailer on fire. He did not know the cops had already found the gun and removed it from the shop.

I mean to me, it is pretty incredible he was convicted in that case because as I said, I have seen many people convicted off of way less than what they had on Donnie Hansen. Now, whether or not Donnie was alone or not in this plot is the big question. I actually lean towards the theory that he was not. I guess this is why the jury acquitted but it still comes as a surprise to me because the D.A. sought the death penalty. To do that, you need a 'death qualified' jury. So the jurors at least claimed that in the event they convicted they would be willing to potentially recommend the defendant be sentenced to death. Since people that believe in the death penalty overall tend to be more conservative they also tend to be more likely to convict.

The jury in Donnie's case came out of Alameda County, California (Oakland and parts of the East Bay Area, San Leandro, Hayward, Fremont, Newark, Union City, Pleasanton, Dublin, Livermore, etc.) It is unclear whether the trial was held in Oakland or if the jury was brought up from Alameda County to Humboldt County to Eureka for the trial? Alameda County is at least 200 miles south of Humboldt County.

Anyway, sorry for dragging on off topic but I wanted to show how Rob Schafer and Donnie Hansen in their separate respects are really not fair to compare. By the way, you do not see this very often but it seems that once in a while pursuing the death penalty actually backfires for the prosecution. Look at the case of Danny White in San Francisco who killed Mayor George Moscone and City Supervisor Harvey Milk in 1978. When he was arrested he was charged with two counts of first degree murder and the prosecutors sought the death penalty.

Sounds good right? Well one problem they did not take into account. When they pursued the death penalty they obviously had to get a death qualified jury. San Francisco as everyone knows is probably the most or certainly one of the most liberal areas in the United States, then and now. However in 1978, there was a small but solid conservative bloc there who were not found of Moscone and Milk and other liberals as they had felt they had turned the city upside down. So when the death penalty was sought, the prosecutors knew they were getting conservative people on that jury but they did not count on the fact that conservative people also were likely to view the victims a lot less sympathetically than liberals would. As a result, White was convicted of the lesser charges of voluntary manslaughter and was later sentenced to 10 years in prison. He was released after serving 5 and killed himself a couple of years after his release.

marlins3

10-21-2009, 05:42 PM

Doggone it! Some posts on here just leave me shaking my head wondering "How?!?! Why?!?!". I really don't get the logic. For clarification , read my response to somebody on a William Bradford Bishop thread. I have never, ever thought Ro wa s asuspect in this case. From the very first time I saw this I concluded in about 20 seconds he was not responsible in any way. To say Rob is responsible is like saying Angela's mother is resonsible because she did not have a phone in the house. I am sure Rob is now married to someone else and I think there is nothing suspicious about that in any way. Not moving on (especially now that it is nearly 20 years later) would be unhealthy fo rhim. I know a part of him will always grieve. Some clown on this forum presented some elaborate theory about Rob dressing up in disguise to kidnap Angie. That is the second most absurd thing I have ever read on this forum (the first being a post in the William Bradford Bishop thread I mentioned earlier). I apologize that "Angry Marlin" has emerged in my last few posts on this message board. I know everyone is allowed to hold an opinion. But some theories are just so wet that dismissing them is rather easy. As Bob Bean would say, "I knew what I had and I was eager to pass it on, ok."

Angela's own mother never suspected Rob either. I am sorry, but to dwell on Rob at this point is fruitless. He did not do it. Also, rob was not the last person to see Angela alive. He wa sthe last person to talk to her but she left and went somehwere after dropping Rob off at his house. This was prior to her making the ill-fated phone call. Many thanks go out to Angela's brother Loren for posting on here as well.

marlins3

10-21-2009, 05:45 PM

liv1527

10-21-2009, 10:27 PM

I'm sure not a day goes by that Rob doesn't feel bad enough about the way everything went down the night Angela was abducted. Even 20 years later, I'm sure he still carries this with him. But I truly never belived he was a real suspect. Just someone the police has to rule out. How anyone can think he couldn't move on with someone new is beyond me. Is he supposed to grieve himself to death?

slasherman

10-22-2009, 06:16 PM

I am not sure how things work in Norway but what are you talking about Rob Schafer cannot be cleared? We are an innocent until proven guilty society. Sure he could be cleared. His car, his transmission was severely damaged. I will say, for an 18 year old kid to do what you are accusing him of he would have to be pretty damn smart. He would have to have incredible foresight that a person that age simply would not have.

I have seen smarter homicide than this from younger people. If you mean cleared as not a suspect, I really cannot understand how anybody can rule him out. What happened to the transmission I think Rob Schafer used to fit his story. The thing with the transmission happened but not the way Rob is telling.

Rob Shafer did eventually move on yes, well that is if you consider him getting a new woman in his life moving on. I have yet to see how that makes him or anyone else guilty in and of itself. Yes he did eventually marry I believe and I am not sure if he stayed in Missouri or if he moved elsewhere or what?

The point is how long after the incident did he get a new girlfriend and maybe already got one when he was with Angela.

However I mean to have the foresight to come up with the story he did, I do not think it was unusual that no one in town saw him. This was a small town, it was a weeknight, the downtown area at that time of night even in the relative early evening would have been deserted as most of the shops would have been closed, traffic would have been light. This was before the days most of the general public had cell phones so using a pay phone was not at all unusual. I am assuming the police checked with the pay phone company to check the records and I am assuming there was a record of someone using that pay phone to make a call to Rob's house. Also there were witnesses BEFORE the abduction who saw Angie using the pay phones.

If the witnesses saw Angela why did they not see the green pick up truck? I think they saw someone else. If somebody called from that phone boot i think it was Rob.

You seem to get confused making someone a suspect and clearing them. Yes the police had reason to make Rob Schafer a suspect. He was her boyfriend, she was pregnant and presumably he was the father of the child, he was the last person KNOWN to have talked to her before the alleged abduction. However again, someone told him these details about the bearded, dirty looking man driving a lime green and white Ford Pickup with a mural in the back window of a fish jumping out of water. Those are very specific details.

Angela told him these details about the bearded, dirty looking man driving a lime green and white Ford Pickup. Strange conversation if you ask me. So it was not just some witness and again Rob was the last known witness in the case. He was also the last(and only) person to see the the green pick up truck. He was about two meters from it when it drove towards him in the opposite direction. Then at the most crucial and important moment of his life the transmission failed. Sometimes when a story is too unbelievable it is simply not true.
And remember Angela is NO witness in this case she is missing.

Comparing Rob Schafer to Donnie Hansen is simply not even close to a fair comparison. I am an innocent until proven guilty believer, I am pro defense but wow, Donnie's lawyer must have been F. Lee Bailey or the prosecutor stunk to lose that case. I have seen people convicted of murder charges off of WAY less than what they had on Donnie Hansen.
That was not just a circumstantial case. I mean who was in possession of the murder weapon the night of the murder? Donnie Hansen. Who purchased the shotgun shells used to kill his sisters? Donnie Hansen. Who purchased the gas can and the gasoline used to start the fire? Donnie Hansen. On top of that who tried sneaking back into the shop allegedly to feed the family dog even though he knew the dog had been moved to a neighbors and was not there? Donnie Hansen. Why? It is because he knew the shotgun was in there because he put the gun in there after he shot his sisters and started the trailer on fire. He did not know the cops had already found the gun and removed it from the shop.

The reason I compare Donnie Hansen and Rob Schafer is that I find the stories they are telling is so unbelievable it cannot be true. I don't think the story Donnie is telling sounds more fantastic than the story Rob is telling. The comparison are probably not completely fair but it was just to point out something. The point is when a story is too unbelievable to be true it is probably not true..

Rob Schafer:
- The last one to speak to Angela
- Not calling the police before it was all over
- The last one to see Angela
- The only one that has been described the killers look
- The only one to see the pick up truck
- Was two meter from the abductor
- Car broke down on crucial moment
- Soon to be father
- And when I saw him interviewed on UM I did not see a face of an innocent man like many of you did.

The Abductor (the bearded, dirty looking man)
This bogeyman has to be one of the most amateurish killers out there. Why did he not wait for Angela to hang up the phone? Even though all other people had called the police when something like this had happened, Rob did not. Why did the abductor not neutralize Angela before putting her in his front seat? Having a woman kicking and screaming in the front seat while driving seems unlikely.
They way the abductor act just seems wrong and the way he looks seems wrong (cliche of a bad guy). They only way I can explain this is because it is part of Rob's imagination.

Jediknight1823

10-22-2009, 09:33 PM

^Actually Rob wasn't the only one who saw the truck.

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1299dfmo.html

It says 2 other people saw the truck, and a man similar to the description Angela gave Rob.

kadrmas15

10-23-2009, 12:12 AM

Slasherman again, you seem to not understand the point I am trying to make. Why can Rob Schafer not be ruled out? You have yet to explain this to me. Frankly I do not see what is so implausible about Rob's story. It was looked at very carefully and yes Rob was the prime suspect for a while as he should have been due the circumstances of him being Angie's boyfriend, him being the father of her unborn child etc. However you act like he was never looked at it when that is simply not true. He was looked at very carefully, there was simply nothing there other than innuendo so he was ruled out. That is what should happen in every case. That does not mean he is ruled out for good, forever, what it does mean is that until something more solid comes forward, he is ruled out.

What I do not get is why you think it is so odd that Angie would tell him the description. Remember, according to Rob, SHE told him there was a truck that kept circling the block and that she was a little nervous about it. I bet you Rob has kicked himself in the rear a million times for not going down there and investigating. However if you are saying that it makes him responsible for not going down there to check it out that is ridiculous. I mean, is he psychic? How did he know his girlfriend was going to be abducted? He didn't! Hence why he did not go down there. He and Angie both thought at first the guy was probably just lost or something. It is not unheard of for someone to get lost even in a rural area.

However when the truck pulled up to the phones that is when Angie got really freaked. So Rob asked her what the driver looked like and she told him. Rob was not there so the fact he gave a general description was based off of what Angie told him. Other witnesses by the way saw the truck and that driver, at least two, they did not see the abduction but they saw a similar truck and a similar looking man. Mind you this was at night, so naturally you are not going to see something as well at night as you would during the day.

Frankly, I do not get what you find so implausible about it. It seems to me you think he did it more because a suspect did not pan out so you automatically assume he did it. I assume you thought he was guilty because he did not sit there and ball his eyes out. You could tell by his lip, he was emotional he was trying to control his emotions. This is one thing that bugs the hell out of me. You do not like his emotions or lack of them so you instantly assume he must have done it. How does someone look like a guilty or innocent man? Explain that one to me. Are you psychic?

Also, his cars transmission was out. That is something you cannot fake, either it is out or it is not. His car remained in the same spot. It was checked, it was out. I suppose he faked the tranny going out too and then parked it on a public street waiting to be busted. Rob did what popped into his head first. He heard the scream on the phone and he bolted. I mean what good is it going to do to call the police when you hear a scream and you do not know anything else to tell them? I do not see anything abnormal about him not having the knee jerk reaction to call the police.

Wow the bogeyman. Ridiculous. Again slasherman, you seem to be flinging crap against the wall hoping some of it sticks. Why you are so desperate to believe in Rob Schafer's guilt off of no real evidence is beyond me. Mind you, Angie was seen at a certain time, Rob Schafer was seen with his own car broke down in the street only minutes later! How would he have time to do away with Angie and not have her body be found? Ridiculous.

Comparing Donnie Hansen to Rob Schafer is another ridiculous comparison on your part. Donnie Hansen, there was physical evidence against him, there was tangible evidence that was not part of a he said/she said scenario. He bought the gas can, he bought the gas, he purchased the shotgun shells, all of this was documented. He was in possession of the murder weapon that night by his own admission as well as the admission of the friend that loaned up the gun. Plus Donnie Hansen trying to sneak back into his own shed to get the gun because 1. He knew it was there because he placed it there in an effort to hide it and 2. He wanted to get rid of the gun so that the slugs could not be traced to that gun.

Name an example where you have seen a person that was Rob's age (18) and pull off a brilliant homicide? You will be hard pressed to find one. Yes people that age kill but usually the killings are quite sloppy because to be honest, I would think a person that age would be an inexperienced killer and particularly in a killing that was not planned out far in advance they would not have the time or foresight to cover up certain things, come up with certain details, etc.

Also, why is it a crime for Rob Schafer to move on? Yes Rob Schafer did eventually marry someone else, I believe it was 5 or 6 years after Angie's disappearance but I hardly see how this makes him guilty. You act like Angie was missing and that he was pulling a Scott Peterson or something and calling his mistress on the phone during the search or that he shacked up with another chick weeks after she disappeared. Total nonsense. Sorry man but your theory just does not hold water.

Todd Mueller

10-23-2009, 10:04 AM

I The reason I compare Donnie Hansen and Rob Schafer is that I find the stories they are telling is so unbelievable it cannot be true. I don't think the story Donnie is telling sounds more fantastic than the story Rob is telling.

I don't really have a dog in this fight, but I couldn't agree with you less on this.

Donnie Hansen may have been found "not guilty" by a court, but he is one of the most guilty people ever featured on UM. The evidence (both circumstantial and otherwise) support this. I will never know why he was acquitted but everything he did points to his guilt, literally and figuratively.

Rob Schafer's story while being unique does stand up under scrutiny. Her parents believe him, the cops believed him, and frankly, if he wanted to kill her there would have been much easier ways to do it without being so complex or having the chance to be exposed.

I'm not saying there is NO WAY that Rob did this, but to compare these two is like comparing OJ and David Duwaliby. You have a "we all know he did it" vs. "there is a chance he may have done it."

I respect your views on Rob Schafer, but to say he is no different than Donnie Hansen is... well... in the words of Donnie Hansen: "Ludicrous."

mattc

10-23-2009, 11:44 AM

The "is Rob guilty" issue ends for me when I read, repeatedly, that "the cops have cleared Rob of any involvement in the case." The Doe Network says that the cops investigated him for a week, so in my mind, they are convinced he did not have anything to do with this: My guess is he took a polygraph, plus you have the other witnesses who also saw the truck and the man around the phone booth. He was babysitting his brother, if I recall, so there's his testimony... I mean, I'm sure that the cops would have preferred it be the boyfriend than to have the town think that a psycho killer is on the loose in that small town. I am sure that the cops would not say that he had nothing to do with the crime unless they were absolutely, abundantly sure.

Those few of you posting and saying Rob should still be a suspect are basing it on things like "his story was weird," or "he didn't seem innocent in the segment." Come on... this board is great because of the sound arguments, and those aren't sound.

Have you noticed how, on UM, when someone is still a suspect, they make it a point to mention it: this person "remains a suspect." Well, they were quick to say that Rob no longer was a suspect, so the police were convinced 20 years ago that he had nothing to do with this, and yet some of you still argue, 20 years later, that he did it??? Come one guys.

Necco

10-23-2009, 06:10 PM

Those of you who doubt Rob's story because he went after her without calling the cops first, please remember that logic doesn't always reign in such situations. People's first reactions aren't always the best ones. How many people died trying to get out the front door of the Station nightclub instead of looking for a closer emergency exit? They tried to go out the door they came in. Simple equation "Need to leave, go to where I came in"

I feel confident in thinking that's Rob's entire thought process was "Angela in danger-GET TO ANGELA" It's an understandable reaction. Even if he is cool as a cucumber, he may have thought "If I call 911 I have to explain everything, that'll take 2-3 minutes, then the cops have to get into their cars (another few minutes) and get to her (another few minutes), I can just go now and be there in 2 minutes."

He's one of the few significant others on UM that I didn't think was guilty as sin.
Just my opinion.
-Necco

Bleedingheart

11-03-2009, 04:50 AM

The Kansas City Star October 4, 1991

Edition: METROPOLITAN
Section: NATIONAL/WORLD
Page: A1
Topics:
Index Terms:
Kidnapping

Family of missing woman hasn't given up hope Angela Hammond vanished 6 months ago.

Author: LANE BEAUCHAMP; Springfield Correspondent

Article Text:CLINTON, Mo. - Day by day, those who know Angela Hammond try to get on with their lives. Her fiance trains for the military. Her mother plans a long-delayed vacation. Her best friend seeks work in Colorado. And yet they can't forget the night, six months ago today, when Hammond vanished just a few blocks from this west-central Missouri town's square. She hasn't been seen or heard from since. "I know the statistics aren't good at this point for finding her, but until something happens, you can't give up," Hammond's mother, Marsha Cook, said this week. "The hope is always going to be there. " Hammond, 20, disappeared about 11:45 p.m. on April 4. Police think she was abducted while talking to her fiance from a pay telephone in supermarket parking lot. Hammond's fiance heard her scream, then the line went dead.

The disappearance sparked an intensive air and ground search across the region for days. A special team of investigators - including Highway Patrol officers and federal agents - dug into the case. A reward fund topped $16,000. Authorities also searched unsuccessfully for possible links to two similar disappearances in western Missouri. In Nevada, a convenience store worker disappeared after closing up shop Feb. 27. In Macks Creek, Mo., another convenience store worker was robbed and abducted Jan. 19. Her body was found in the Little Niangua River two days later. Those cases also remain unsolved. Investigators said this week that although similarities exist among the three cases, there still is no concrete evidence to connect the crimes. And so far no solid clues in Hammond's case have been found.

Clinton police Detective Damon Parsons said the investigation was no further along today than it was a few weeks after Hammond was abducted. "There's someone out there who has information, but they just may not realize it," Parsons said. "Until they come forward or until she's found, there really is not much more we could do. " Authorities and Hammond's friends and family are now pinning their hopes on network television for leads in the case. The NBC-TV program "Unsolved Mysteries" will be in Clinton next week to re-enact the kidnapping. The episode is tentatively set to air in early December. "Hopefully somebody will see this and have some information," said Hammond's stepmother, Kathy Hammond, of Olathe. "We feel so helpless and frustrated because there isn't anything we can do. Maybe this show will bring some answers. " But the show may bring false hope. David Rader, one of the program's producers, said only two of 49 missing-persons cases presented on the show have been solved. Police are looking for a late 1960s model Ford pickup with a water or outdoor scene in the rear window and possibly with a white top. The truck may have damage to its left front fender.

Two witnesses told police they saw a white man with a mustache wearing a dark-colored baseball-style cap sitting in the truck near the telephone booth Hammond was using. The witnesses' description is similar to one Hammond gave her fiance moments before the line went dead. The lingering investigation has left Hammond's friends and family in a state of limbo. "I guess you think time will heal everything, but we're six months down the road now and I'm still not any better," Cook said. "It's still just a roller coaster of emotions. " This week Cook was planning her first vacation since her daughter disappeared. She won a trip to Florida through her work, but leaving was not an easy decision to make.

"I need some time to step back, but it was hard to decide to go out of town," Cook said. "I was convinced, though, that it would be OK to leave for a couple of days, and I really need that time. " Rob Shafer, Hammond's fiance, has been training as a National Guardsman at Fort Eustis, Va., since June. Attempts to reach him by telephone this week were unsuccessful. But Hammond's mother said Shafer seems to be taking the disappearance hard. "He's kind of shut himself off," Cook said. Posters still hang in storefront windows here and at truck stops and rest areas across the Midwest. Police have checked possible sightings of Hammond as far as Texas and looked into suspects in and out of prison. Conservation agents patrolling the area's hills and lakes are routinely reminded of the case. "At least I know people are still out there looking," Cook said.

Mastermind

11-03-2009, 01:30 PM

The only reason why Rob was even considered a suspect is because he was the last person to see her alive. That's it. Nothing else points to him being a suspect.

Those of you who doubt Rob's story because he went after her without calling the cops first, please remember that logic doesn't always reign in such situations. People's first reactions aren't always the best ones. How many people died trying to get out the front door of the Station nightclub instead of looking for a closer emergency exit? They tried to go out the door they came in. Simple equation "Need to leave, go to where I came in"

The typical response for most males when their wife, girlfriend, child or mother is in danger is to reach out and solve the problem right away. Personally I would have the same response.

People only call 9-11 when the danger has been verified. All Rob knew at the moment was that Angela screamed.

FanfromES

11-08-2009, 04:35 PM

Mastermind

11-08-2009, 05:18 PM

I wouldnt clear Rob as a suspect because he looked sincere in his UM interview, or because Angela's parents thought he got nothing to do with her disappearence. Or because he was too young to get away with such an evil plan...

I guess that UM didnt tell us everything, maybe there is a record of the phone call so his story was confirmed, there was those witnesses who saw the same pickup truck...etc

Remember that UM was just a TV show, it wasnt a serious crime presentation for investigative purposes.

I agree with Slasherman that the story sounds too fantastic to be real, but again, i guess the police cleared Rob because they did their homework. If thats not the situation, it wont be the first case where new evidence points to people previously cleared as suspects.

1. I find it hard to believe he fabricated this story and wasn't even caught in one lie. Usually liars try to keep the story simple.

2. I have to imagine that the damage to his car was real and that his car was found exactly where he left it. Further bolstering his story. Not to mention finger prints. And yes, I'm almost 100% positive they checked the phone records.

3. The description of the painted window is to elaborate for him to have made up on the spot. Not to mention he was very vague about the paintings details. Not to mention there were other suspects that verified that detail.

Your innocent until proven guilty. The ONLY reason Rob is a suspect is that he was the last person to be in contact with her when she was alive. I need more to go on for Rob to be considered a suspect.

kadrmas15

11-08-2009, 08:08 PM

Yes, I agree with you mastermind. To me, there is just not anything there to point to Rob Shafer. Yes of course he should have been investigated as a suspect and he was investigated rather thoroughly and cleared. I would imagine he did take a polygraph test and passed. But besides that, the police did not find any inconsistencies in his story.

I agree with you mastermind that in cases like this where someone is lying, a majority of the time they try to keep the story simple so it is easier to explain things away. I mean for Rob to come up with an elaborate story like this on such a short term basis is in and of itself too remarkable for me to consider credible. But on top of that, why would he come up with such an elaborate story like this if he knew it not to be true? It would be incredibly easy to catch him in a lie then when he is coming up with all of this elaborate stuff that did not happen. Why would he say his car's transmission went out if it really did not go out?

I am basically certain that the police checked his car and found the transmission was indeed severely damaged to the point to where the car had gave out and was not operable. Rob I am sure left his car in the place where he claimed it gave out and so he did not plant the car there. I am sure the police also checked out the phone records.

I mean, I guess Rob is the only one that truly knows what he did or did not do. However based on the evidence that I am aware of, there is just nothing there to show me that Rob's story is not true and there is nothing there to show me he is responsible for Angela's disappearance. It is pretty scary to me where some folks are perfectly willing to think a person is guilty because of their own innuendo and speculation without any real evidence or facts.

Drakken

11-11-2009, 12:07 PM

Well, we cannot prove a negative without demonstrating a positive. Rob being ruled out doesn't prevent any possibility if new evidence points to him in the future.

But right now, Rob is ruled out by investigators because A) the absence of physical evidence linking him directly with the commission of the crime and B) third party witnesses and physical evidence (his truck, his brother, phone bills) confirming his side of story.

Yeah, Angela describing the suspect and his truck might seem odd, but remember it is a very small town in which people know everyone, and Angela was confronted to a stranger behaving oddly around her. We do not know exactly what words Angela used to describe the suspect, and I don't think Rob provided an exact script. Perhaps she said "uh, Rob, there is a ugly, flithy man in overalls turning around me and looking at me ugly". As for the truck, Rob and third-party witnesses saw it from behind, hence we do not need Angela necessarily mentioning it - or perhaps she said "wow, it's weird, there is a fish motive in his rear window".

In the end, we must apply Occam's Razor: Either Rob is a supergenius of evil capable of incredible feats and a master illusionist to be able to abduct his girlfriend in a very short timespan in plain sight of people who know him, including his own brother, or he did not do it. It would need a set of unbelievable circumstances to allow the possibility that Rob did it.

compulsive dvd

11-12-2009, 01:58 AM

Apostapler

11-12-2009, 02:08 AM

TheCars1986

11-12-2009, 11:22 AM

I'm pretty sure Angela called him from a phone because she was going out to do other things that night with friends while Rob stayed home and babysat his younger brother. And if he was ruled out as a suspect in only a week by police, then why are people still saying he's guilty? That's questioning the integrity of the law enforcement agency and it's almost like a slap in the face to them. They get paid to investigate, so I'm sure they followed every lead and checked his story and I'm sure his brother corroborated his story. And he definitely came across as innocent to me the way he almost teared up and seemd pretty PO'ed at himself for not being able to save her.

crazytatsink

11-13-2009, 12:11 AM

http://c1.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/70/l_faf1102694544910b3103d22b2a7307c.jpg

crazytatsink

11-13-2009, 12:12 AM

www.myspace.com/cheryl_ann_kenney

crazytatsink

11-18-2009, 09:40 PM

I got with the local news in Joplin, Mo. and had my mothers picture and info about the case aired on the local news last night. This is the website to go to to view the video.....

www.fourstateshomepage.com

Go to the news button scroll to local news from there go through the videos of the local news it will have her pic and story

Drakken

11-23-2009, 07:02 PM

And if he was ruled out as a suspect in only a week by police, then why are people still saying he's guilty? That's questioning the integrity of the law enforcement agency and it's almost like a slap in the face to them. They get paid to investigate, so I'm sure they followed every lead and checked his story and I'm sure his brother corroborated his story. And he definitely came across as innocent to me the way he almost teared up and seemd pretty PO'ed at himself for not being able to save her.

Well, there are some people who always remain skeptical or unconvinced by blatant evidences when it shoots down their little theories or conspiracies. Like, for example, those arguing that the Duke of Clarence is Jack the Ripper, or that Lee Harvey Oswald didn't act alone or was used as scapegoat. When someone is convinced of something, often it is very hard to make him or her change their mind even when presenting what a layperson would consider reasonable evidence of the contrary.

We'd think that evidence would be enough to convince any rational layperson about ABC, but sometimes laypeople aren't that rational and still believe DEF, notwithstanding "evidence". ;)

Yeah, Rob was a suspect for about a week or so because it is law enforcement policy to consider family members, acquaintances, and lovers first as suspects, then go from there if they are cleared. But for some people, Rob would always remain suspect even if Angela was found dead somewhere and the suspect confessed to the crime. They'd say something like "Well, that doesn't prove anything as suspects have been known to confess to crimes they didn't commit".

bell83

11-23-2009, 11:36 PM

I hope they find out what happened to her. This case always bothered me. "I didn't need to use the phone, anyway." Creepiest line EVER:eek:

MIKE MORANO

12-03-2009, 12:18 AM

my name is mike i live in the bronx ny and im 19 years of age and i remember being 6 years old and watching unsolved mysteries with my sister on lifetime and seeing this case of angela hammond and i remember the nightmares i had of the man portraying the suspect,man oh man i was scared and to this day i still think of angela hammond because this case flat out bothers me and i want answers...i read some threads about those despicable excuses for human beings raping that woman trudy darby in the barn and killing her and i remember robert stack saying in his eerie voice that that crime couldve been tied to this then i saw in april of this year on that news cast that this was not connected to trudy darby or miss kenney...its december 2009 for gods sake is there anyway we could get some answers and actually have a legitimate suspect...this is a horrible situation because imagine the people affected in this case since 1991 that are still wondering what truly happened..this was a young woman that was pregnant and she lived in a small town and had alot to live for and to think that since 1991 we still dont have a suspect...the boyfriends story was very farfetched but i believe it,the authorities mustve done plenty of research to determine rob was innocent..so just imagine april 1991 and december 2009 and to this day theres been nothing but a new lead with some dna bullcrap..DNA? its 2009 and all you have is microsize fibers of DNA? this is horrendous...this case will always haunt me and all we could do is post some stuff and pray 1 day that this is solved because everyone affected deserves closure..and not to be disrespectful but lets get this story out more can you imagine what would happen if they made a movie about this,it would spark more intrigue worldwide and personally i think they should to get this case exposed globally..i hope someone replys to my message and i hope that 1 day we know what really happened to angela hammond, because she and her family deserved better than this

Thiussat

12-04-2009, 08:09 AM

But right now, Rob is ruled out by investigators because A) the absence of physical evidence linking him directly with the commission of the crime and

That doesn't compute since there is no physical evidence in this case at all. If police rule people out because of a lack of evidence, then this means they must rule out everyone on earth because of "lack of evidence." Like Carl Sagan said "absence of evidence is not evidence of absence." In reality, the way you rule somebody out is when they present evidence they didn't commit the crime (usually through an alibi), or if the physical evidence points to someone other than them. Again there's no physical evidence in this case so it's not possible to rule someone out (other than alibis or, in some cases, polygraphs). What was Rob's alibi? I know he was at home with his brother part of the night, but the rest doesn't seem clear.

B) third party witnesses and physical evidence (his truck, his brother, phone bills) confirming his side of story

I assume the police would check his phone bill, but the segment did not mention it one way or the other so I will have to refrain from comment.

As for the transmission -- it means nothing. He could have knocked it out while on a back road somewhere dumping a body and then came up with the "I threw it in reverse chasing the killer" story. You are assuming his story is true and basing the facts of the case on his account. You can't do that.

In the end, we must apply Occam's Razor: Either Rob is a supergenius of evil capable of incredible feats and a master illusionist to be able to abduct his girlfriend in a very short timespan in plain sight of people who know him, including his own brother, or he did not do it. It would need a set of unbelievable circumstances to allow the possibility that Rob did it.

Occam's Razor would say the following:

Is it more likely that some stranger rode into town and nabbed a woman (who happened to be on the phone with someone only a few blocks away) in plain sight of the entire town square

or..

Is it more likely that one of the known last people to see Angela alive might have been the culprit? A person who knew she was pregnant and perhaps didn't feel comfortable with that fact.

Granted, I am speculating about a motive because, as you said, there is no evidence tying anyone to the crime. I am simply providing the scenario I think is more likely. Am I saying this is indisputably what happened? Of course not.

As for the "Rob has a detailed story so he must be telling the truth" notion, it's a big mistake to believe this. The truth is, most people who are good liars end up creating a detailed account of events. Ask any criminal psychologist about this. In fact, the psychologists will tell you to be weary of extremely detail oriented accounts because it's often a sign of someone desperately trying to appear legit when they aren't. Case in point: Casey Anthony.

I would be interested to know how he did on the polygraph. Perhaps this was used to rule him out?

Bleedingheart

12-04-2009, 08:47 AM

That there was several witnesses that described the same man as Rob stated Angela described

MIKE MORANO

12-07-2009, 01:31 PM

im curious to know where exactly robs been all these years,i heard that in 91 he was gonna join the military but im not 100 percent sure im very curious to know his whereabouts all these years

Mastermind

12-07-2009, 05:58 PM

The one thing that has always made me believe absolutely in Rob's innocence is his car. It's awfully darn hard to fake transmission failure in such a timely manner.

Not to mention, WHY would he fake a transmission failure?
The repair is pretty expensive and I'm sure Rob can't afford to lose his ride for such a long period of time. Bad enough you committed murder, no you have damage your own care just to make your cover story work? Especially considering, you need that car to potentially escape at some point.:confused:

Rob could easily make up the story without the transmission failure. :rolleyes:

marlins3

12-07-2009, 09:17 PM

Rob had nothing to do with her disappearance and even Angela's family is satisfied with that conclusion. The only thing odd is that she used apay phone but I read somewhere that she had no home phone so that amkes sense as well. I do not understand anyone that truly believes he was involved in any way.

bell83

12-07-2009, 10:41 PM

Seriously. It's been stated time and time again that Rob has been cleared of being a suspect. The police obviously have access to more evidence than all of us do, so I don't see why it keeps coming up that "it must be Rob."

Thiussat

12-08-2009, 01:19 AM

Not to mention, WHY would he fake a transmission failure?

You're not following me. I never said he faked it. I said that perhaps he damaged it during the crime and then made a cover story for why it was damaged.

By the way, I would be curious to know how he got the car home. Did he walk home? Did he finally get the car started and drive to his house? Did a friend pick him up? Or did he call a tow truck?

Especially considering, you need that car to potentially escape at some point.:confused:

Escape where? And why?

Rob could easily make up the story without the transmission failure.

Yes, but his transmission was in fact damaged, so it's possible he could have used this fact to explain away how the killer conveniently "got away" from him when he could have damaged it some other way. Again, I never denied his transmission was damaged.

I am not saying "whodunnit" one way or the other since I feel there weren't enough facts presented by the segment to come to any conclusion. I just find the random killer story less likely than the boyfriend scenario. I say this primarily because A) Boyfriends do this way more often than random killers and B) his story seems a bit too convenient.

Perhaps the Police know things we don't and have come to a conclusion based on this confidential information. I am basing my reasoning off of the segment and a few newspaper articles.

Seriously. It's been stated time and time again that Rob has been cleared of being a suspect. The police obviously have access to more evidence than all of us do, so I don't see why it keeps coming up that "it must be Rob."

Yes, I am aware the police have "cleared" him, but I would be interested in knowing what was their reason was for clearing him? Typically "persons of interest" are cleared in one of two ways: polygraphs or alibis. Again, I am not saying "whodunnit" one way or the other, I am merely throwing ideas out there and debunking flawed logic I have seen in this thread. That's what this message board is here for right? To question and debate?

Mastermind

12-08-2009, 12:52 PM

Especially considering, you need that car to potentially escape at some point.

Escape where? And why?

If you killed your girlfriend, wouldn't you want to have a working car available in case you might decide to become a fugitive and escape the law?

You're not following me. I never said he faked it. I said that perhaps he damaged it during the crime and then made a cover story for why it was damaged.

By the way, I would be curious to know how he got the car home. Did he walk home? Did he finally get the car started and drive to his house? Did a friend pick him up? Or did he call a tow truck?

How and why would he have damaged the car? What possible reason could he have for using the car in such a way that it would be damaged? Who was he chasing or being chased by?

I assume a tow truck was called. Even so, it is possible to drive a damaged car home. I have a feeling the car was not a high priority for Rob at that moment.

I just find the random killer story less likely than the boyfriend scenario. I say this primarily because A) Boyfriends do this way more often than random killers and B) his story seems a bit too convenient.

How do you know this is a killing. Who said anything about murder?
Angela Hammond is a missing person...this is a huge distinction that must be adhered to.
I would buy Rob as a murderer if here body was found and that there was some idea about how she was killed. Where her body is found would also provide some clues.

Statistically, yes you are most likely to be killed by someone that you know rather than a stranger.

More importantly, he's a living eyewitness to the events
The police by nature would have interviewed him to death. He would have been the prime suspect in the 48 hr investigation.
If the boyfriend is cleared, then it goes to the next possibility.. a jelous lover......then a friend that may have wanted to rape her....once exhausted you have to go to the possibility that she was killed by a stranger....

Perhaps the Police know things we don't and have come to a conclusion based on this confidential information. I am basing my reasoning off of the segment and a few newspaper articles.

I'm pretty sure the police have:
1. Done lie detectors and profiling on Rob.
2. Did luminol test on the car trunk.
3. Did analysis on the damage the car suffered.
4. Interviewed numerous times and corrobarated facts via other witnesses.
5. more importantly, phone records probably detailed there were phone calls from the payphone that fit the time period and length.

If Rob killed Angela, think about the things that are missing
1. For as fantastic as Rob's story is, he was never caught in a lie. His story was corrabarated by witnesses.
2. Rob would have to have killed her with his fists, knife or bludgeon device. No blood was found on Rob. No bruises, No defense wounds. No blood on the car. I doubt Rob would have killed her with
3. Where did he kill her? An alley way? At home? Scenic route? Rob would have had to have time to move the body from those places. He would have to have moved her body in his car trunk? No hair was found in the trunk. No evidence of cleaning. Would Rob even have the time to dispose of her body.

leafygreens

12-08-2009, 02:03 PM

The initial link referenced TSTMNBM (The site that must not be mentioned) so was edited out by the powers that be. It's an April 2009 news report from KMBC regarding possible DNA evidence that can now be processed with new technology.

Can someone explain this to me? Where is this link?

kane7474

12-09-2009, 04:12 PM

I just dont get why it is that every six months or so someone starts a new Angela Hammond thread without bothering to use the search function and seeing the past threads where this case has literally been talked to death. It has been well established that there was no possible way for Rob ( the boyfriend) to have committed this act.

If you read through the other threads you would know that. People are posing questions like "why was she calling from a pay phone" or " did his transmission really fail". Again READ THROUGH THE OTHER THREADS. We have had the victims family members as well as people who knew both parties post on this site and those questions have ALL been answered.

Back in May of 2009 the Clinton police claimed they were closing in on a suspect. They claimed there was DNA evidence. There was a story on our local news station here. However nothing new came out of it and there has been no arrests or updates to this case.

TracyLynnS

12-11-2009, 03:34 PM

justins5256

12-11-2009, 03:50 PM

I really hate this case.

kane7474

12-11-2009, 08:57 PM

For those who don't want to search the other threads for these answers:

She was calling from a pay phone because she was on her way home from hanging out with a friend. She was going home to take a bath. She had no working phone at her house and wanted to tell Rob goodnight, basically.

The boyfriend was staying home babysitting his younger brother at the time. (Verified by police, and phone records too, I think.)

IIRC, the reason his transmission failed was because he was driving in one direction, and while the car was still moving in that direction, he saw the truck Angela described and heard her screaming as that vehicle went in the opposite direction, so he shifted it into reverse on the fly, ruining the transmission.

Rob is alive and well, and IIRC (from other posts on the subject) is married with a family, living a normal all american midwest life.

For the record, I don't suspect Rob, even though it's said that the number one killer of pregnant women is the baby daddy. Rob's alibi was confirmed by the cops who investigated the disappearance. Rob's fiance and unborn child were murdered, and I don't think he was involved in any way. He's a victim, too, imo.
Well lets go a step further here as far as Rob is concerned.
For him to have done this he would have had to,

A-killed his girlfriend and disposed of the body to where it would never be found within 45 minutes.

B- Had his little brother lie for him as to why he left the house in such a hurry and get various other witnesses to lie for him who saw the truck before Angela was abducted.

C- Remove all blood, hair and DNA that might point the police to him again within the 45 minute timeframe.

D- Fool a polygraph as well as fool Angela's family members all of which do not suspect Rob and have maintained his innocence from the start.

lorenhammond83

01-28-2010, 01:08 PM

mwcarolina

02-01-2010, 04:31 PM

- - Was two meter from the abductor
- Car broke down on crucial moment

ok, let me first say, this, i disagree with you Slasherman on almost everything you said, Rob isn't Hanson because the Hanson acted VERY suspicious, why go back for the gun??? Second, the police cleared Rob after investigating him. Now as for the things i copyed and pasted. Yes he was close to the abductor in a car chase, but as for the car breaking down, NEWSFLASH, cars break down!!!! and yes they can happen at bad times, he damaged his transmission when he saw the truck and did a u-turn or something, and if Rob did do it think about all the things he would have to do, he would've had to kill his girlfriend, hide or body so it wouldn't be found for 18 years, make sure he was clean of all blood and hide the weapon so it won't be found and oh yeah, hide other blood evidence so it can't be found, because if he killed her at home, he would have to clean or in the street, if he killed her there wouldn't someone find blood???

marlins3

02-02-2010, 05:49 PM

True statement: Angela did not have a home phone at the time!
Loren Hammond

Thank you, Mr. Hammond. I knew I read that somehwere. It must have been an earlier post of yours. I hope this case gets solved .

marlins3

02-02-2010, 05:53 PM

Hambone2421

02-03-2010, 11:03 AM

I agree with you 100%. I had acar quit literally 100 feet from my work parking lot one time. I guess that makes me look suspicious in the eys of some people lol:rolleyes:

I believe Rob put his car in reverse the abrupt shift from forward to reverse is what damaged his transmission. Maybe slasherman can take his car out and speed allong then suddenly just drop it into reverse and see how long it runs after that :)

First time commenting on this case and I agree with Justin. I hate this case. I honestly hope that her killer/abductor is captured or has already been captured. This has to be one of the most heinous, unnecessary crimes ever profiled on Unsolved Mysteries.

I do not for a second think Rob killed Angela. As it has been said numerous times on here, he would have had to do too much and hide too much evidence in such a short amount of time for him to be the killer. Most noteworthy is that if he were the killer, then that means Angela's body is somewhere in that town and here we are 19 years later and it has not been discovered. Don't some believe that Kenneth McDuff was responsible for this?

mwcarolina

02-03-2010, 01:53 PM

I agree with you 100%. I had acar quit literally 100 feet from my work parking lot one time. I guess that makes me look suspicious in the eys of some people lol
I believe Rob put his car in reverse the abrupt shift from forward to reverse is what damaged his transmission. Maybe slasherman can take his car out and speed allong then suddenly just drop it into reverse and see how long it runs after that
yep, personally, i have yet to damage my transmission, but it is really easy to do and whoever would do that on purpose is an idoit because it is very costly to fix, yeah Slasherman needs to do what you said, i don't think Slasherman knows alot about cars.

I honestly hope that her killer/abductor is captured or has already been captured. This has to be one of the most heinous, unnecessary crimes ever profiled on Unsolved Mysteries.
i do too, this case bothers me the most, mainly because of the segment and that scream, it is very chilling and i am glad i never dealt with anything like this especially Rob, he was so close, but his car gave up on him.

I do not for a second think Rob killed Angela.
i don't either, i think it was a sexual preditor who went to a small town because he thought he could get away with it and so far he has, sadly.

if he were the killer, then that means Angela's body is somewhere in that town and here we are 19 years later and it has not been discovered.
yep, that last line i agree with especially.
my thoughts exactly, Rob (at the time) was young, and even good criminals leave evidence behind and if Rob did this, we would've found the body.

Mastermind

02-03-2010, 07:18 PM

I again, should stress in this case that Angela is a missing person.

While I believe she is most likely a murder victim...the possibility of her being alive is still a possibility.

Shahla

02-03-2010, 09:11 PM

Unless she became a sexslave I don't think she is alive.
And even if she became a sexslave she either got killed later (within a few weeks, months) or would be found alive by now. Like in the Dugard case. That took 18 years and I think that was the longest time in any sexslave case where a stranger was involved.
I believe Rob told the truth and that she was abducted for sexual purposes by a predator. That most likely means that she was killed in the first hours after the abduction.
I also think she just was in the wrong place at the wrong time.
That segment was to me the most impressive in a way that it really 'hit me', kicked in. Chills..I never forgot this segment.

Clockworkhigh

02-13-2010, 02:51 PM

I'm a grown man and I can never watch this segment unless it's a bright sunny day outside and people are BBQing on their patios. Why? Because it scares the daylights out of me. It is just so real, so RANDOM! I am a huge horror movie fan, but UM segments are real and the way this one gets re-enacted is downright creepy. Remember when the killer talked to Rob on the phone for a second? Creepy.

Look, I have had my transmission die. I regret to tell you I know how the sound and feeling is. That reverse would have hampered the car and it wouldn't have had much life after that. It is increibly accurate that Rob could have still chased the car briefly after the reverse before the transmission slowed him to a crawl. That would have been a painful way to watch your girlfriend escape. Not to mention something no one else says is how in the world would Angela feel when she is literally watching Rob's car conk out and the last hope for her to be saved. That would have been a painful way, getting hope that your boyfriend can save you and then literally seeing that hope devour.

Look I know Angela's family posts here (feel your pain). And despite the fact that this scenario is directly out of a movie I believe it. I believe Rob too. I have never doubted Rob. But I am going to come up with a less talked about motive.

Angela is pregnant. She calls Rob wishes him good night. She describes this car and the man by the phone booth to a tee. Is there a smidgen of a possibility that Angela staged her own escape? Wanted to start a new life with someone? Changed her name? The "filthy" guy she described wasn't actually filthy and was her new man helping her start a new life? Then Rob almost screws up the plan by nearly catching them.

Unlikely? Probably. And I don't believe it but maybe a few do and all I am doing is brainstorming. Things have to happen first. Angela has to be unhappy with Rob. She has to hate her family. By all accounts she didn't on either counts. Plus Rob DID see the car she was caught in. It was the same one she described. Why describe the same one when you are trying to get away. Why not say it's a Honda Civic?

So am I contradicting myself? Yes. But I wanted to open that other possibility.

mwcarolina

02-13-2010, 05:12 PM

Look, I have had my transmission die.
i agree, which is why i found it dumb that someone can say that the transmission problem is staged, first off, staging it costs a lot of money and second, why would anyone stage that?

I regret to tell you I know how the sound and feeling is. That reverse would have hampered the car and it wouldn't have had much life after that.
yep, i agree, you know stuff about cars, unlike the dude who posted that he didn't believe Rob.

That would have been a painful way to watch your girlfriend escape.
agree, that would suck to watch, he was so close, but his car died.

Not to mention something no one else says is how in the world would Angela feel when she is literally watching Rob's car conk out and the last hope for her to be saved. That would have been a painful way, getting hope that your boyfriend can save you and then literally seeing that hope devour.
yeah, i imagine it was hard for her too, i just hope she is alive and i REALLY hope they catch the man who did this.

Clockworkhigh

02-13-2010, 06:05 PM

That would have been a painful way to watch your girlfriend escape.
agree, that would suck to watch, he was so close, but his car died.

And while this is far from proof just circumstantial evidence, Rob seemed 100% genuine in his pain. There was never a scent of deception in his interview, just a hurt young man who probably blames himself to this day despite the reports of having a happy new marriage. I've always thought of this like a "Cast Away" clone. I'm talking about the Tom Hanks movie of course. Someday something tells me that Angela will reappear and despite Rob being in a happy new marriage it will take him back to that day. Like in "Cast Away"

Also another thing to consider. Jaycee Dugard. This was the same time frame, 1991. Jaycee was missing for 18 years and pretty much presumed dead. Her step father saw much of what Rob saw. Someone taking her and he hopped on his bike to chase him to no avail. There were many, many doubts that the step father was telling the truth. In short order, he was. Jaycee was found and was reunited with her parents. This tells me that there is always hope that Angela can still be alive. Look at Jaycee. Look at Elizabeth Fritzl from Austria (girl locked by her father in the cellar for 20+ years). Also as haunting as this may be, never assume that Angela's unborn child didn't make it

starmushrooms

02-16-2010, 12:35 AM

And while this is far from proof just circumstantial evidence, Rob seemed 100% genuine in his pain. There was never a scent of deception in his interview, just a hurt young man who probably blames himself to this day despite the reports of having a happy new marriage. I've always thought of this like a "Cast Away" clone. I'm talking about the Tom Hanks movie of course. Someday something tells me that Angela will reappear and despite Rob being in a happy new marriage it will take him back to that day. Like in "Cast Away"

Also another thing to consider. Jaycee Dugard. This was the same time frame, 1991. Jaycee was missing for 18 years and pretty much presumed dead. Her step father saw much of what Rob saw. Someone taking her and he hopped on his bike to chase him to no avail. There were many, many doubts that the step father was telling the truth. In short order, he was. Jaycee was found and was reunited with her parents. This tells me that there is always hope that Angela can still be alive. Look at Jaycee. Look at Elizabeth Fritzl from Austria (girl locked by her father in the cellar for 20+ years). Also as haunting as this may be, never assume that Angela's unborn child didn't make it
After seeing a few cases over the years where people long assumed dead reappear I hold on to hope that anything can be possible. This is one of those cases.

Also, for a 12 year old at the time this and the Blind River Rest Stop murders reenactments were the creepiest I had seen on UM. They both still give me the creeps and I'm 30 now.

For this case it really was the randomness of it. I grew up in a tiny New Hampshire town with the blinking traffic light and a payphone on the corner under a dim light. It made you think it could have been anybody, or even you, who happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

mwcarolina

02-16-2010, 11:06 AM

And while this is far from proof just circumstantial evidence, Rob seemed 100% genuine in his pain.
i believe that he is innocent for two reasons, one he's a young man and if he would've killed his girlfriend Angela, he would've had to hide her body to wear it was NEVER found and clean up the scene and himself and make up a story and have his transmission shot, it doesn't add up that he could do this, however his story does add up and i agree Rob seemed genuine unlike other cases like Paul Pollis and Rob even blamed himself, which i say, it wasn't his fault, that man who did this had no business coming to that town to kidnap someone.

mozartpc27

02-16-2010, 11:45 AM

I believe he is innocent because he was investigated and cleared by competent authorities.

starmushrooms

02-16-2010, 10:24 PM

Honestly, I think he's innocent.

I read on another forum where someone said they were sure the police helped him cover up the murder. I don't think the police would have a reason to try and help him cover it up if he did do it. I also don't think he had the time to do it from the time line of events and what witnesses said.

Shahla

02-17-2010, 03:01 AM

starmushrooms

02-22-2010, 06:46 PM

To me it's bogus the police helped Rob cover up. Come on. The person who wrote that isn't in his or her right mind or watches to much surrealistic tv.

I don't think she is alive because for a man who wanted a sexslave she most probably was too old.

The staged theory sounds too incredible for me to even go into.

When I thought about the sex slave angle I also thought she was too old for someone to want for that. I also don't believe anyone who took her waited around for her to give birth 5 months later.

I hope Rob was able to go on with his life after this.

Clockworkhigh

02-23-2010, 12:58 AM

When I thought about the sex slave angle I also thought she was too old for someone to want for that. I also don't believe anyone who took her waited around for her to give birth 5 months later.

I hope Rob was able to go on with his life after this.

I think he did for sure. Apparently he is married now.

You know I really liked Rob. I liked him a lot in the segment. He seemed genuine, so the angle I am going to portray is not my opinion necessarily but something worth discussing.

How good was the relationship with Rob and Angela? Did they fight? He obviously would have known about the pregnancy at 4 months. Now stranger things have happened. Young men have killed before because of the prospect of fatherhood. So let's say all of this actually happens. Angie calls Rob, sees a truck with a sinister looking man and she gets abducted. He runs out of his house and sees the suspected truck. He goes in reverse and blows his transmission. She is gone, the suspect is gone into the night.

Now if this is just a story all of that can be covered. Rob's car is busted up, the phone company would be able to prove that a call was made, Rob's little brother would know that Rob left the house in a panic.

So what is the difference? Was this man Rob's accomplice/hitman? Rob seemed to describe to a tee what Angie described as the truck with the decal. If that is told to me and then I hear a scream and run out the door I think I would lose my train of thought and forget that all too accurate description of the vehicle. All that has to happen is Rob passing a polygraph. Other than that he gets the benefit of the doubt from everyone. Angie is gone, she's dead, her baby is dead, Rob is free. The "filthy" guy who was supposedly white is actually black which the cops wouldn't be looking for.

Crazy story eh? Does anyone buy that theory?

Cursiorandcursior

07-30-2010, 04:24 PM

This may have been mentioned in other threads, but the only thing I seemed to miss in this case is why Angela called Rob from a pay phone. It was a small town. Why didn't she just go to Rob's house? She was already pregnant, it's not like he would have had to sneak her in. I never thought Rob had anything to do with it. When you see him in the interview, his nostrils kind of flare, like he's still pissed about the whole thing.

Indeed. Why stop to make a phone call? Why not simply go to his home?

For those who would rule him out without any evidence may make for wanting to believe in the goodness of men. If anything the more we learn about such cases is the extent of evil men are capable of. Nothing surprises me any longer. Having said this I believe in the principle that we are innocent until proven guilty. At the same time, all criminal cases must inevitably be solved through elimination of suspects and physical evidence. So far all I know is hearsay evidence in the way of what was allegedly said over a phone of which no copy of same exists.

From this new news it seems that the Darby and Kenney cases are not related. We can assume that the perps and McDuff's DNA were on file. Who's left? Evidently some mysterious serial killer passing through town?

What am I missing here?

All of us would love if it was McDuff's DNA found. But from the report I watched there was no hint of that or they would have said so. If his DNA had been found it would have been a prima facia case that he was the perp wouldn't he? So again, who is left as a viable suspect? I'm all ears and eyes with absolutely no dog in this hunt. I just want to see it solved.

Scooby67

03-01-2011, 11:38 AM

Indeed. Why stop to make a phone call? Why not simply go to his home?

For those who would rule him out without any evidence may make for wanting to believe in the goodness of men. If anything the more we learn about such cases is the extent of evil men are capable of. Nothing surprises me any longer. Having said this I believe in the principle that we are innocent until proven guilty. At the same time, all criminal cases must inevitably be solved through elimination of suspects and physical evidence. So far all I know is hearsay evidence in the way of what was allegedly said over a phone of which no copy of same exists.

From this new news it seems that the Darby and Kenney cases are not related. We can assume that the perps and McDuff's DNA were on file. Who's left? Evidently some mysterious serial killer passing through town?

What am I missing here?

All of us would love if it was McDuff's DNA found. But from the report I watched there was no hint of that or they would have said so. If his DNA had been found it would have been a prima facia case that he was the perp wouldn't he? So again, who is left as a viable suspect? I'm all ears and eyes with absolutely no dog in this hunt. I just want to see it solved.

test, test

Scooby67

03-01-2011, 11:48 AM

test, test

I entered law enforcement in 1991 and just recently retired after 20 years of service. I give most police officers the benefit of the doubt. Police Officers choose there line of work because they care! I can tell you they don't do law enforcement for the money. The Police always keep an open mind. Rob Schafer probably is an innocent man who was deeply affected by the loss of his fiance and girlfriend. Mr. Schafer certainly seemed shaken up in the Unsolved Mysteries segment. I can also guarantee you the police checked out the car and as much of robs story as possible. Apparently the car did have a fatal mechanical problem. Now that being said, in a case like this, no one is ever truly eliminated until the case is solved. If evidence ever points back to Rob Schafer then the police will follow that evidence. I heard a story that DNA evidence was discovered and this evidence apparently eliminated two suspects who were convicted of another unrelated murder. If DNA can eliminate suspects you can bet it is good DNA and it can also lead to the real suspect. So keep in mind my friends no one is ever eliminated until the case is solved. Good Day, Scooby67

Scooby67

03-01-2011, 11:56 AM

test, test
Also as a father with three daughters of his own I should have posted my prayers for the Hammond Family first! I appologize. My prayers are with all of the Hammond family. If my daughter was missing it would destroy my life. I can't imagine your pain. I saw the Angela Hammond case, as a young, rookie, police officer on unsolved mysteries. The case has stuck with me all these years. I don't know the details of the case, other than what was on unsolved mysteries, and I have to put faith in the investigating officers. If they initially cleared Rob Schafer they had a reason to clear him. His story apparently checked out. Now Police Officers don't have soul detectors and some times folks expect Police Officers to do the impossible. You can't arrest some one without evidence. Now having said that keep in mind no one is ever eliminated completely, in this kind of case, until the case is solved. So all avenues are open in this kind of investigation. I hope the new DNA evidence leads to an identifiable suspect. Thats my hope. God Bless The Victims Of Violent Crime,

Sincerely, Scooby67

rocker88

03-22-2011, 06:54 PM

First time commenting on this case and I agree with Justin. I hate this case. I honestly hope that her killer/abductor is captured or has already been captured. This has to be one of the most heinous, unnecessary crimes ever profiled on Unsolved Mysteries.

I do not for a second think Rob killed Angela. As it has been said numerous times on here, he would have had to do too much and hide too much evidence in such a short amount of time for him to be the killer. Most noteworthy is that if he were the killer, then that means Angela's body is somewhere in that town and here we are 19 years later and it has not been discovered. Don't some believe that Kenneth McDuff was responsible for this?
I thought McDuff was a good suspect for a few days. I still think he is a possible suspect but there is room for plenty of doubt about that. McDuff was not confirmed to be living in KC until April of 1992. A full year after Angela's dissapearance. Most think McDuff was in Texas at the time of Angela's dissapearance. But there is room for error here. McDuff was officially unaccounted for several times in 1991. McDuff was actually questioned about the dissapearance and denied his involvment in it. I don't make a habit of believing serial killers because they have strange reasons for not admitting certain crimes even if they have nothing to lose and some small thing to gain but it still has to be weighed in the overall evidence. I think McDuff could have done it still but if you made me rate his likely guilt on a scale of 1-10, with 1 being least likely to be guilty and 10 being most likely to be guilty,based on current evidence, I would rate McDuff as a 3. I think Rob is telling the truth based on evidence presented. However because this crime is unsolved I have to rate Robs likelyhood as a suspect. Based on current evidence I rate Rob likely guilt as a 1, least likely to be guilty. You can throw all the conspiracy theories you want about the boyfriend and without evidence we must assume he's the least likely person to be guilty. So who did abduct Angela and are there any cases that were solved that are similar to her abduction? I have to assume Angela's abductor was caught, for another crime, died or is otherwise incapacitated. No other dissapearances in Western Missouri. Serial killers only stop when caught, or dead, or otherwise unable to troll for victims anymore. Yes they could move to another area as well but anyhow thats my opinion. Sincerley, Joe Bryan.

CuriousMind90

03-22-2011, 07:15 PM

rocker88

03-22-2011, 10:11 PM

It will be 20 years gone for poor Angela and her unborn child on the 4th of April; Twenty years ago that terrible night.

Twenty long years of silence and sorrow for her family. I know she is somewhere better and in peace, but she was robbed of longevity and the chance to be a mother, robbed from this Earth in the prime of her life, and that is an injustice of the gravest kind.

Angela may know peace wherever she may be, if there is indeed a Heaven, but as long as her fate remains unknown, and her body remains unfound for a proper burial, and her is not killer named and brought to justice, her family will not know peace or closure.
You know CuriousMind90 I often get engrossed in a story and forget that it's about real people who's loss is very real and very total. I can't imagine the pain Angela's family is going through. I have three daughters and I can't imagine the pain. I pray no one ever has to suffer like Angela's family has. I'm sorry for their pain. May God bring their Baby home. May her abductor suffer endlessly. God Bless The Victims Of Violent Crime,

Sincerely, Joe Bryan.

Cursiorandcursior

03-23-2011, 11:50 AM

What I always find disturbing is that the public never knows if the tips and information they provide is ever really examined and eliminated. Several months ago I came into information that I believed then, and believe now, should have been looked at seriously and eliminated. Essentially, it came from someone formerly in Springfield (100 miles from Clinton) who took notice of a "handyman" who acted suspiciously and drove a yellowish green truck of the vintage supposedly used in this abduction. It also had the window decal in the back window. Now I had no way to check it out nor did I have the actual name of the individual, however, I had specific information on how to ascertain this person's name through his employer. That information was passed onto the detective handling this case via e-mail. I have heard nothing further. I thought it was a good lead but do not know if it was ever looked at.

I thought I had made mention of this previously but may not. Anyway I thought I would bring it up again since this thread has again had interest expressed recently.

My recollection is that McDuff was eliminated on the lack of opportunity to have committed this crime. For some time I thought it was a very good suspect in view of the fact he was captured in the K.C. area just a short distance from Clinton.

CuriousMind90

03-23-2011, 11:53 AM

What I always find disturbing is that the public never knows if the tips and information they provide is ever really examined and eliminated. Several months ago I came into information that I believed then, and believe now, should have been looked at seriously and eliminated. Essentially, it came from someone formerly in Springfield (100 miles from Clinton) who took notice of a "handyman" who acted suspiciously and drove a yellowish green truck of the vintage supposedly used in this abduction. It also had the window decal in the back window. Now I had no way to check it out nor did I have the actual name of the individual, however, I had specific information on how to ascertain this person's name through his employer. That information was passed onto the detective handling this case via e-mail. I have heard nothing further. I thought it was a good lead but do not know if it was ever looked at.

I thought I had made mention of this previously but may not. Anyway I thought I would bring it up again since this thread has again had interest expressed recently.

Pass the information on directly to Angela's brother. His name is Loren Hammond and he has a facebook. He also set up a facebook page for Angie. I passed on the Larry Hall theory to him a few months ago. Any little tip could help.

benoitbabe

04-08-2011, 11:28 PM

It said in the UM segment that police proved Rob was on the phone with her at home by the phone records from his home and the pay phone. So, he was totally cleared. He did not get a new girlfriend right away. He waited a long time for her. Please watch the segment again.

rocker88

04-09-2011, 11:12 AM

For those of you from Clinton Missouri or the area around the crime scene and for those who personally know the victims involved in this case please forgive our speculation. As a retired police officer who worked the streets for 20 years I know that usually the police are right. Usually! Police are correct in well over 70% of all cases. Of those they are wrong about they usually figure out they were wrong pretty quickly. So if the police say Rob is totally innocent then I believe them. The police obviously had records to prove some one in Rob's residence was on the phone at the time of the abduction. Also Angie had no phone at home so it makes sense for her to stop and use a pay phone. I mean let's behonest were talking about poor American kids, Angie, and Rob. Kids getting ready to start a life together. By poor I don't mean hungry poor but just kids who don't have some one putting a silver spoon in their mouths. So I don't question the phone call nor do I question the old beater car that broke down. But in cases like this no possibility is ever disregarded. It may be filed in the unlikely section of the filing cabinet but if evidence ever emerges that makes it more likely the police will look at that area again. I believe Angela's abductor is a stranger. Some one she did not know. I believe Robs story. I could be wrong and I have been wrong before but thats what I believe based on what I know. I believe Angela's abductor is a serial killer. The question is wheather this suspect is local or not. If not where was he going. Where is he and is he still alive. If he is still alive why no more victims. Did the suspect move? Finally is the suspect one of the long list of serial killers captured since Angela's abduction? I hope with the new DNA obtained that this answer will be forthcoming. In closing my prayers go out to Angela's and Robs family. I know Rob has suffered immensely. Every man knows what I mean by that. The feeling of being unable to protect the ones you love. I am sure had Rob caught up to that monster that he would have gave him hell. If that monster does not pay in this life he will pay in the next life. I have to believe their is a just God. No I can't explain why he allows bad things to happen but I have to have faith. To the abductor I say this: Their is no escape on Judgement Day! God Bless The Victims. Sincerely,

Joe Bryan.