http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/05/21/smiley.face.killer/index.html?eref=rss_topstories

Yeah, I have read about these cases before. But I do not recall the "smiley face" element. I always say that if an adult is missing to check any large body of water nearby, wooded areas, cliff drop-offs, because these accidents do happen and the bodies are found at later times in said areas. I can think of one that was on UM; the case where the man and women who were friends disappeared in his Jeep, years later they were found in a drainage ditch or something like that, in a Lifetime update. I think some of these cases are related somehow, but unfortunately I fear they will never get coverage because the victims are "drunk" college guys. When men go missing it is not given the same amount of urgency as a woman, and added to it that the men were drinking before they went missing makes it even more unlikely that these cases will be treated as the work of a serial killer/killers.

isn't there a similar case where there's a suspected serial killer somewhere in the midwest where all these young college age guys have gone missing and turning up in lakes or something?

HERE HAVE BEEN MURDERS SINCE 98 AND IT'S 09 IT'S REPORTED TO BE 45 KNOWN MURDERS HOWEVER....MOST COUNT UP TO 76 MURDERS.

THEY'VE HAPPENED IN OVER 11 STATES AND IT FORMS A SMILEY FACE ON THE USA MAP OF WHERE THE MURDERS TOOK PLACE.

1. COLLEGE GUYS
2. COME HOME FROM PARTIES/BARS
3. DROWNED
4. SMILEY FACES ON THE CRIME SCENE I THINK IT'S A CULT.

THE FBI FINDS THEM TO BE SUICIDES THERE'S NO WY IN HELL.

IMO, definitely not suicides, but I don't think it's a cult. I think it's probably more likely to be a gang. Or maybe one group of thugs heard about it and the idea of killing people this way, just for the heck of it, kind of travelled from region to region by word of mouth.

I don't think it's a cult or a gang...I think it's one man...possible two. They are well traveled (such as truckers) who appear to be about college age. This way they fit in. I believe they either go to the frat parties or bars where these young men are drinking and end up following them out. I don't think it is random...I do believe that the smiley faces have a purpose. In my opinion they pick men because it's true...a man going missing is not going to be as big as a woman going missing. I believe that they kill for the thrill of it. It's not sexual gratifications like some murders...it's just the thrill of killing someone...overpowering someone. They have chosen a group of the population that it would "make sense" to go missing because of their drinking...but in the end it doesn't make sense at all. In my opinion there is a pattern to the killings...we just haven't figured it out yet. Killers like these are planners...very deliberate in everything they do including the kill. It's funny how most of the bodies have been found in the river...but there is a lack of water in the lungs (in at least some of the cases.) I think that the smiley face is important...but not the most important clue...I feel that the smiley face is there to distract us from something more important...what it is...I don't know yet. I've studied these murders for a while and and I knew one of the first victims in Minnesota. In my opinion the police are just beginning to see the light with this case. At first it seemed to big with them...it was to far reaching with the possibility of a killer or two roaming the mid-west and east...but the police are getting there. The FBI...not so much. They still say all of this is completely random and honestly...I wonder whats wrong with them? Are they now so busy with protecting our borders and foreign issues that they cannot or do not have the time to accept that this is an actual serial killer issue? Anyway...I'll stop going on about this. I'd just like to see this one solved someday...if anything...for my old friend Josh!

Wow, you went to St. Johns? At first I wrote this whole case off, but after looking at it more, I do agree something is amiss here. I have been drunk more times than I can count but I never got the urge to walk towards water or fall off a bridge or whatever the case may be. These were not suicides that is for sure, I lean towards the murder theory. Surely some of these were murder. I believe Josh's body has never been found?

I didn't go to St. Johns...I Knew him for earlier. And there have been times when I have thought about it and just accepted the fact that he just walked into the lake on campus...but then why hasn't his body been found. I know some people theorize that the bodies that end up "missing" and not found may have more evidence on them...so the killer/killers had to dispose of the bodies in different ways. My theory is that the victims who were less drunk...fought off their attackers and left possible evidence than the victims who were so totally drunk that they really were unable to fight anything. Again...that's just my theory. As for Josh...He was never a big drinker...he was very responsible and would in no way gotten so drunk that he would have walked into a lake or river...it's foul play...plain and simple.

Another college guy just went missing here (where the Chris Jenkins case was) and he was found in the river as well. I never heard anything after that though, so I'm not sure what they called this one.

Dan Zamlen, a student at St. Thomas, was found in the Mississippi River about 4 weeks after he disappeared. He was on his cell phone with a friend after leaving a party, said "oh my god" or something, and that was it.

Dan Zamlen, a student at St. Thomas, was found in the Mississippi River about 4 weeks after he disappeared. He was on his cell phone with a friend after leaving a party, said "oh my god" or something, and that was it.

Well, that certainly sounds suspicious.

If he wasn't on his cell, talking to his friend, while precariously tippy toeing on the edge of the river and then "oh my god" fell in...

Then it sounds like he could have seen that he was about to be jumped, said "oh my god" then in the struggle the assailants tossed his phone, cutting off the conversation between him and his friend.

I wonder if Bryan Nisenfeld should be looked into in connection with these cases. College male, missing, found in water. Admittedly, he was not last seen at a bar, but I think it should at least be checked out.

Hmm, yeah, I dont know, I think a majority of these cases are connected. I mean, the police are writing it off as just a bunch of drunk drownings. It sort of reminds me of the police in the Jack Davis Jr case writing it off as a drunk falling down the stairs. The police officers response in that was totally lame. Hence why he was demoted from Chief to Sergeant.

I can tell you I have been drunk MANY times and one thing I did not have a desire to do was suddenly walk towards a huge body of water. That is what does not make sense to me. In practically all of these cases the guys were familiar with their surroundings. Chris Jenkins in Minneapolis, I am certain he was thrown off that bridge. I mean in order for him to 'fall' off of that bridge he would have had to have climbed over the railing and jumped off. Jenkins body was found several months after he disappeared, in the Mississippi River. It appeared he had been beaten and then thrown over the bridge as I believe he died from drowning or from impact with the water from the fall from the bridge. Originally Minneapolis Police labeled it an accident, only after a change of administration did the new police chief order a new investigation and this time the cause of death was changed to homicide.

In Zamlen's case, he had been at a party near campus, and left at around 3 in the morning, I think. He was walking on the street that runs along the river. He may have been upset when he left, and also under the influence (but who knows as to what degree). He was diabetic, which may have complicated things further.

I have been in the vicinity, and I thought there was a fence that ran along the edge of the sidewalk so people wouldn't fall down the side to the river (the street is quite a bit above it). It's steep too, so if someone was on the side, they could easily trip and fall into the river.

James Majors was a smiley killing bastard.

There was another one in the news today.

A 21 year old WI college kid was walking home drunk from the bar and ended up drowned in the river. The police are saying "no foul play" is involved.

http://www.todaystmj4.com/news/local/50104957.html

Missing UWM Student Found Dead in River
MILWAUKEE - The body of a missing University of Wisconsin Milwaukee student was found in the Milwaukee River Monday. Bryan Barker, 21, hadn't been seen since July 4.

Police said no foul play is suspected.

Barker was a business major from New London, Wisconsin.

He was last seen leaving Sullivan's, a Water Street bar, about 1 a.m. on Saturday. Barker was out celebrating a friend's birthday and left the bar to walk to home.

The medical examiner's report says friends described Barker as intoxicated at the time.

His family reported him missing later Saturday after Barker's girlfriend could not reach him on his cell phone.

Barker's body was recovered from the river about two blocks north of the bar.

Boy, this is getting ridiculous. The cops once again writing it off as just another drunk college kid falling in the water. I personally do not believe them but that is me.

RE: my previous post...

On 7/8/09, on this blog, http://helpfindthemissing.org/blog/?p=20

A woman named Liz also posted this article because of her suspicions to a Smily Face Killer connection, and claimed that the same thing happend in the same area about one year ago.

Kadrmas,

You still up this late? I had caffeine at dinner and can't sleep. I'll be paying for it tomorrow, when I want to sleep in....

I did a search for "smiley face killer" and good grief! There's tons of info. Anderson Cooper has done pieces on this, as well as all the main new sources, such as CNN, MSNBC, ABC, etc writing articles.

Forensic Factor on Discovery channel did a piece on this. So has the New York Post, and other smaller newspapers and new stations. It can't *all* be coincedence....

My quick two cents on this...

As someone from Minnesota who went to college in the Midwest, I do think there are an awful lot of these that happen. But, I really have a hard time believing these are the work of a serial killer. Seems like a lot of work to kill someone and in all of these cases there is no great physical evidence and no witnesses seeing people being thrown into water (at least that I have heard of).

I think it is absolutely tragic, but when people are drunk they do dumb things. They get lost, they stumble, they go weird places to take a leak, and all kinds of other stuff. Walking drunk near any body of water is just asking for trouble.

If this were the work of a serial killer, I honestly think there would be more evidence. The circumstances alone don't make evidence. Again, it does seem like this happens a lot in this area but I just can't imagine that it is the work of serial killers. You would have to case a bar or party, wait for a single male to leave, know that he was going to walk by a body of water, ambush that person with no one seeing you, and then hope to hell there is no evidence left on the body and make sure they are dead with no physical evidence on the body of any weapon or beating.

It's just a little much for me. But then again, I could be wrong.

Funny Todd, I too am from Minnesota and am a college student and sad to say have been drunk many, many, many times, too many to count. However the one thing I never had a desire to do was wander towards a body of water for no reason. Well actually the part about 'knowing' that a person would have to walk by a body of water is simply not so. You could see anyone, and do what you wanted with him. I have a hard time believing ALL of these were accidents. But again, the cops are perfectly content to write all of these off as being a bunch of stupid drunk college kids so why do any investigation? I mean you are right in that some of them might have been accidental however at least some of these were murders and they need to be investigated. Physical evidence, trust me, plenty of the best serial killers of all time have got away with 10, 20, 30 murders because they were great at eliminating physical evidence.

IMO, the killer doesn't have to hope a drunk walks near a body of water, he/she just has to hang at a bar that's located near the water. Then they know the drunks have to walk past the river.

However, I still don't believe that every single case of a drowned drunk is murder. It just seems that there's an excessive amount of this happening in certain areas that should probably cause cops to do some very careful investigating to make sure that it's actually an accident.

I've been suspicious about that med student in OH (forgot his name right now) but he was observed by video survellance at the Ugly Tuna Saloona. He was talking to some people at one point, then he just disappeared forever.

The bar was in the university district of columbus OH, and was about a half mile from the Olentangy River. That feeds into the Scioto river, (which goes through Circleville OH hmmm) before it finally ends in the Ohio River.

The proximity of the bar to the area where he would have probably needed to walk back to where he was staying meant that he'd have to go near the river. Could have been an accident or murder, but he did disappear, never to be found, and he was probably drunk and near the water. They shoulda looked in the river, imo.

Physical evidence, trust me, plenty of the best serial killers of all time have got away with 10, 20, 30 murders because they were great at eliminating physical evidence

I would respectfully disagree with that.

I think serial killers might not leave definitive evidence to incriminate themselves, but they would leave some evidence that they were serial killings.

Even the best of us get sloppy on occasion. I find it hard to believe that a person could be that perfect and execute a crime that soundly without even one slip up.

Okay, the guy I was talking about is Brian Schaffer. Here's the website his family has set up.

http://www.findbrianshaffer.com/

I was just now reading the news online and foxnews has this video about the smiley face killer: http://www.foxnews.com/search-results/m/26617839/people-of-interest.htm#q=smiley (if that link doesn't work, you can find the video by looking on their list here: http://www.foxnews.com/video/index.html )

I checked cnn to see if they had any info and did a google search but nothing came up except six month old info.

This video is new and was just posted today. I'd like to know what they are saying, but I don't have speakers on my pc. The foxnews site doesn't have a text version of the video available.

Anyone want to take a look at the video and report back?

This video is new and was just posted today. I'd like to know what they are saying, but I don't have speakers on my pc. The foxnews site doesn't have a text version of the video available.

Anyone want to take a look at the video and report back?

Really wasn't much. They interviewed one of the investigators from New York and he said "hopefully soon" they will release new evidence of some people of interest. Basically, this guy claims they have evidence of a network from East Coast to West Coast that there are these Smiley Face killers. It had a lot of conjecture but no new facts.

I by no means think that none of this was foul play. Seems odd if that many healthy young men would die all on their own. What is really odd to me is that there don't seem to be many young women falling into bodies of water. Not sure why that is.

But the one thing that I keep coming back to is that most of these men were drunk or had been drinking. No one exactly makes the best decisions after drinking so it makes me wonder if it isn't some kind of testosterone thing (yes, I may be grasping at straws).

I still highly doubt there is a coast-to-coast network of serial killers here. What is their point? How did they organize? Seems like a lot to swallow. Then again, too many good young men are drowning for no reason. :confused:

Thanks for watching that for me, and being my "ears". :)

It's a bummer that there's nothing of substance included in that video.
They must have been trying to make news out of a whole lotta nothin.