Okay I just finished watching The First Time and all though the ep. they have Jo acting really weird and when she talks to Natalie at the end its like what the crap you told her stuff she already knew. I thought of everyone in the house Jo would be the best to talk to he. I always read that 'in the ep. the first time Natalie was the first of the girls to lose their virginity.'and I'm sure many people (me being one of them) sort of assumed that Jo had already had sex with Eddie. but apparently not. I dont know its just weird how the writers have her acting in this ep.. does anyone agree with me or am I all on my own on this one?

yes, I agree. Jo wasn't the Jo we know and love. Maybe b/c Blair wasn't in the ep.

yea, i think that they should have had tootie being more there for natalie than jo becuase they are best friends, maybe that is why i am not too fond of this episode... it seemed quite out of place of characters for everyone! Also, it seemed so unrealistic how snake needed time to "think" he's a guy, what does he need to think about besides doing it again? I thought it gave a bad rep for natalie to have slept with him and then they break up... after you do that with somebody, don't you have a bond where you dont just say, ok... it's over. The situation made it seem more like a one night stand... but i too already assumed that jo had sex with eddie, i assumed that by after season 3 since eddie and jo were still together they had slept together after the marriage ep... infact, i wrote a fanfic in the middle of those two episodes that confirmed my thoughts... interesting that i'm not the only one who thought that

yea, i think that they should have had tootie being more there for natalie than jo becuase they are best friends, maybe that is why i am not too fond of this episode... it seemed quite out of place of characters for everyone! Also, it seemed so unrealistic how snake needed time to "think" he's a guy, what does he need to think about besides doing it again? I thought it gave a bad rep for natalie to have slept with him and then they break up... after you do that with somebody, don't you have a bond where you dont just say, ok... it's over. The situation made it seem more like a one night stand... but i too already assumed that jo had sex with eddie, i assumed that by after season 3 since eddie and jo were still together they had slept together after the marriage ep... infact, i wrote a fanfic in the middle of those two episodes that confirmed my thoughts... interesting that i'm not the only one who thought that

I haven't had that much experience with guys but I know that usually they act like they like a girl until they get what they want. Then they leave. All sex is is a 3 letter and no it does not necessarily build a bond. It's silly to think that way in my opinion.

yea, i think that they should have had tootie being more there for natalie than jo becuase they are best friends, maybe that is why i am not too fond of this episode... it seemed quite out of place of characters for everyone! Also, it seemed so unrealistic how snake needed time to "think" he's a guy, what does he need to think about besides doing it again? I thought it gave a bad rep for natalie to have slept with him and then they break up... after you do that with somebody, don't you have a bond where you dont just say, ok... it's over. The situation made it seem more like a one night stand... but i too already assumed that jo had sex with eddie, i assumed that by after season 3 since eddie and jo were still together they had slept together after the marriage ep... infact, i wrote a fanfic in the middle of those two episodes that confirmed my thoughts... interesting that i'm not the only one who thought that

Yeah the only thing normal about that ep was Snake freaking out after it happened. I've seen it happen both ways I've actually seen some guys stick around after sex but I've seen them run too. And no guys I'm not talking about my own personal experiences.

Seems a bit dillusional to expect that just because you have been with a guy for a year that it is ok to sleep with him. I don't think it is possible to know someone after a freakin year. I thought Natalie had more sense but then again she did want people to think she had been sleeping around in the episode Sex Symbol. I guess it is just a part of always being a little "easy" like she was.

i agree you dont know somebody after a year as well as to sleep with them, while we are getting onto more imo conversation than the episode. I am glad that if they were going to have the one of the girls openly sleep with somebody that they did it with a character who had been in a more "serious" relationship though (it could have worked with tootie and jeff as well) rather than one of the girls just chosing to do it on the sly with some guy. Just becuase it showed that it's still not right to be "easy" in that regard. But, i still think that a lot of people thought that jo and eddie already had slept together, while they were a serious relationship as well... i sort of thought that blair and cliff had too. While i understand Lisa's decision and beliefs conflicted with this episode, i dont feel that she should have not appeared in the episode, she could have brought out her beliefs through blair, blair was religious in some aspects. I dunno, i'm kind of win win over the situation... i too am religious and chosing to wait until marriage, my fiance and i both agree and have been together for 5 years already and will have to way 1.5 more before we marry... but, a lot of my friends have already "taken the plunge" and while i dont agree with it, i dont run away from it instead of putting my small two sense in when asked... i'm sure that they could ahve worked that in, infact.. instead of jo being the one there for nat i think it would have been perfect for blair, she was great in those moments! I think this episode also would have been a LOT better with Mrs. G being there, and just SLIGHTLY involved... BA was involved wayy too much and it drove me nuts!

Blair's beliefs might be different from Lisa's. And I think that Natalie was the worst possible person to make this happen with. They could've picked someone who seemed less desperate who would've actually been believable. Maybe they just wanted the underdog to be the one to do it.

yea, the whole story line seemed so unbelievable... it just didn't fit, and getting andy and pippa involved in the whole sex talk stuff... just didn't work at all! The story line would have been more appropriate around season 6 maybe, while blair and cliff were still together, they would ahve been more believable. I dunno, the episode, i understand where they were going with it, trying to just grab peoples attention the last seasons with the "drama" but it was just not fitting, it seemed so random, and the fact that they broke up afterwards just made you wonder if every other boy natalie brought into the picture, did she sleep with them too?

yea, the whole story line seemed so unbelievable... it just didn't fit, and getting andy and pippa involved in the whole sex talk stuff... just didn't work at all! The story line would have been more appropriate around season 6 maybe, while blair and cliff were still together, they would ahve been more believable. I dunno, the episode, i understand where they were going with it, trying to just grab peoples attention the last seasons with the "drama" but it was just not fitting, it seemed so random, and the fact that they broke up afterwards just made you wonder if every other boy natalie brought into the picture, did she sleep with them too?

I agree with the season 6 Blair and Cliff, it would've been a lot more believeable and then maybe if it would have been Blair she was talking to the writers wouldn't have screwed up Jo's part in it, and have her admit what we all thought, that she had already done it. Whats also good about season 6 Mrs. Garrett was there! I dont like the ep either but if they had done it earlier it might have worked.

Hi guys, if i remember correctly, this eps was a desperate attempt to rejuvenate the show. To that end it worked, it was the highest rated eps of that season. Lisa chose not to appear because it "condoned" pre-marital sex. It is the only episode in which Blair does not appear. I liked that Natalie was the 1st, though it seemed a bit late, Mindy Cohn totally volunteered for it. I thought the character of Snake, well-played by Richard Romanus, was dead on. i remember the scene of Jo choking on her cereal best. Oh, no Jo and Eddie never slept together due to the fact that in 82, the subject wasn't breached, so the series felt it was left unsaid and therefore suspect. All in all I liked the episode, but it did feel odd.

i agree you dont know somebody after a year as well as to sleep with them, while we are getting onto more imo conversation than the episode. I am glad that if they were going to have the one of the girls openly sleep with somebody that they did it with a character who had been in a more "serious" relationship though (it could have worked with tootie and jeff as well) rather than one of the girls just chosing to do it on the sly with some guy. Just becuase it showed that it's still not right to be "easy" in that regard. But, i still think that a lot of people thought that jo and eddie already had slept together, while they were a serious relationship as well... i sort of thought that blair and cliff had too. While i understand Lisa's decision and beliefs conflicted with this episode, i dont feel that she should have not appeared in the episode, she could have brought out her beliefs through blair, blair was religious in some aspects. I dunno, i'm kind of win win over the situation... i too am religious and chosing to wait until marriage, my fiance and i both agree and have been together for 5 years already and will have to way 1.5 more before we marry... but, a lot of my friends have already "taken the plunge" and while i dont agree with it, i dont run away from it instead of putting my small two sense in when asked... i'm sure that they could ahve worked that in, infact.. instead of jo being the one there for nat i think it would have been perfect for blair, she was great in those moments! I think this episode also would have been a LOT better with Mrs. G being there, and just SLIGHTLY involved... BA was involved wayy too much and it drove me nuts!This was one of the things that really frustrated and disappointed me about Lisa and her decision not to appear in the episode. The whole "This goes against my personal beliefs and I don't want to have anyone make that decision because of what we do" whole deal.
Well, how would Blair dealt with it? It just all seems to boil down to Lisa's personal hangups about sex, that God is just so angry about it, but they never really get to discuss the ramifications of it, simply because "it goes
against MY beliefs." Well, that's all well and fine, Lisa, but what does that mean for people who don't share in those beliefs? What sort of practical advice can people get from the show other than God is just mad at "sinful" sex?? It may say one thing in Scriptures, but we're dealing with people who aren't necessarily inclined to read Bibles. What practical advice could Blair give? Or are Natalie and Snake just going to hell for their decisions? :rolleyes:

Bottom line no one should be forced to go against their beliefs for the sake of a tv show. Like I said Blair and Lisa are different and maybe it would have seemed out of character for Blair to go against pre-marital sex just because it is what the person who plays her believes.

I could understand it if there were a more "non-religious" reason for Lisa/Blair to object to pre/nonmarital sex, and the consequences of Natalie's actions were enough to justify it. For the record, I am a Christian who happens to not believe "God will punish you because He hates sex", etc. But we're talking about a generation of people watching the show who don't share in or don't know about Lisa's beliefs. I've been a Christian for almost thirty years and I have never been able to figure out the real reason why Christians get upset about sex. Lisa just made it come across as "this goes against my personal beliefs, and therefore I'm not going to want anyone to watch this show." But what about others' beliefs?

It's interesting that this was the only episode where Lisa's personal beliefs got in the way of her wanting to appear on the show, yet all through the series, she did things that you would think would "contradict" her personal beliefs yet she performed them anyway.

It's interesting that this was the only episode where Lisa's personal beliefs got in the way of her wanting to appear on the show, yet all through the series, she did things that you would think would "contradict" her personal beliefs yet she performed them anyway.

Yeah but aparently she had a really strong belief about this, which she was all go for this in the first season but maybe she didnt care then or she didnt have a choice i dont know.

Maybe, since she was so young when the show began, she wasn't yet Christian. And just because she didn't appear doesn't mean she doesn't want people to see the episode. It's just the simple fact that no one should be made to do something that they don't want to do. She doesn't owe any of you an explanation.

Maybe, since she was so young when the show began, she wasn't yet Christian. And just because she didn't appear doesn't mean she doesn't want people to see the episode. It's just the simple fact that no one should be made to do something that they don't want to do. She doesn't owe any of you an explanation.

If I remember correctly in Lisa's book she said that she became a Christian at the age of 10.

If I remember correctly in Lisa's book she said that she became a Christian at the age of 10.

Maybe she wasn't devout yet then. Her beliefs may have become stronger when she became an adult.

I dont think she owes us an explanation at all, i was just simply stating that she could have used the character of blair to express her christian beliefs of waiting until she was married to have sex. If Lisa feels that she shouldn't converse with people who dont have those beliefs then i'm sure that she can say goodbye to kim and mindy, mindy openly stated that it was about time one of them was out there in the "real world" and obviously kim had a baby and is not married, and i doubt lisa feels that way, so she could have shown other christians how to deal with friends who may be giving into the pressures but sticking with your christian beliefs!

Maybe she wasn't devout yet then. Her beliefs may have become stronger when she became an adult.

True

Maybe she wasn't devout yet then. Her beliefs may have become stronger when she became an adult.She was very devout early on before she even entered Hollywood.

She was very devout early on before she even entered Hollywood.

So I guess you must know her personally. Proof? And maybe Blair isn't a Christian like Lisa is.

So I guess you must know her personally. Proof? And maybe Blair isn't a Christian like Lisa is.Yes, as a matter of fact, I do know her personally. I have met her a number of times several years ago. Her story about how she became a Christian at the age of ten is fairly well-known, before she entered Hollywood.

Whether Blair is a "Christian" or not is beside the point. Blair Warner represents an ideal of what people should be like, regardless of their faith. "Shallow and snobbish"? Not at all. Do you ever notice after watching an episode with Blair that she is never quite the same person at the end as she was in the beginning? She goes through her conflicts, and in the process, she learns something about herself and others. Or others learn something from her. She is not all vain and conceited as you might think. Case in point: the episode where Blair was gracious enough to help Jo out financially to have her continue to go to school at Eastland. They were both fighting like cats and dogs all that time, but Blair was not above helping her and being a friend to her.

The problem often with Christians is that somehow we don't feel like we have to learn anything, we're automatically going to act in a noble, righteous manner all the time simply because we're "born again". What's the point of watching The Facts Of Life if we don't learn something from it? It's more than simply fun and laughter. Our fun and laughter tells us a lot about what's really important to us. The whole point behind art and drama is that it gives a big picture of life, that we feel and identify with the hero and empathize with their struggles. And by going through what our hero goes through and understanding as they do, we go through our own kind of redemption process, we become better persons.

:happyface :loveya: It was one of the best episodes of season 9.

Yes, as a matter of fact, I do know her personally. I have met her a number of times several years ago. Her story about how she became a Christian at the age of ten is fairly well-known, before she entered Hollywood.

Whether Blair is a "Christian" or not is beside the point. Blair Warner represents an ideal of what people should be like, regardless of their faith. "Shallow and snobbish"? Not at all. Do you ever notice after watching an episode with Blair that she is never quite the same person at the end as she was in the beginning? She goes through her conflicts, and in the process, she learns something about herself and others. Or others learn something from her. She is not all vain and conceited as you might think. Case in point: the episode where Blair was gracious enough to help Jo out financially to have her continue to go to school at Eastland. They were both fighting like cats and dogs all that time, but Blair was not above helping her and being a friend to her.

The problem often with Christians is that somehow we don't feel like we have to learn anything, we're automatically going to act in a noble, righteous manner all the time simply because we're "born again". What's the point of watching The Facts Of Life if we don't learn something from it? It's more than simply fun and laughter. Our fun and laughter tells us a lot about what's really important to us. The whole point behind art and drama is that it gives a big picture of life, that we feel and identify with the hero and empathize with their struggles. And by going through what our hero goes through and understanding as they do, we go through our own kind of redemption process, we become better persons.

Very well said

What's done is done people. She didn't appear in the episode and she probably doesn't care whether you think she should have or not. Get over it.

What's done is done people. She didn't appear in the episode and she probably doesn't care whether you think she should have or not. Get over it.Lisa doesn't strike me as a person who "doesn't care" what people think. She's a very consciencious person, and she is certainly entitled to what she believes about premarital sex, but my point is that it would have been better if she didn't make seem simply like "one of her own personal religious pet peeves" that she wanted everyone else to embrace. To have her give a more practical reason as to why premarital sex is wrong, she could be saying, and I understand her reticence over the thought of encouraging other young people to take that step, etc. The episode was very helpful in discussing what could happen if young people make that choice (i.e., Natalie becoming upset when Snake left, thinking their actions had something to do with it, the emotional scars of that).

While I fully respect Lisa's right to not be in the episode and I certainly respect her own religious beliefs, I think it is important to seperate Blair and Lisa. One is a real person. The other a fictional character that Lisa portrayed.

I totally get that Lisa wanted Blair to be a good role model, but just because somebody portrays a certain kind of character onscreen doesn't mean that they are that way in real life. A person does not need to be condemned for playing a character that might engage in premarital sex even if it is not their own beliefs.

Look at Lisa and Blair in the first season. Blair was a lot more overtly sexual and Lisa might not have agreed with it, but she played the character at the time the way it was written.

Quite honestly, Lisa was very lucky that she was working for writers and producers who ultimately respected her wishes and let her sit out of the episode. Not all producers and writers would have done that. Many might have forced her hand and made her come to work and shoot that episode.

But I just think it's important to draw a line between Blair and Lisa. The same way I certainly don't think any less of Mindy for portraying the character who decided to lose her virginity.

While I fully respect Lisa's right to not be in the episode and I certainly respect her own religious beliefs, I think it is important to seperate Blair and Lisa. One is a real person. The other a fictional character that Lisa portrayed.

I totally get that Lisa wanted Blair to be a good role model, but just because somebody portrays a certain kind of character onscreen doesn't mean that they are that way in real life. A person does not need to be condemned for playing a character that might engage in premarital sex even if it is not their own beliefs.

Look at Lisa and Blair in the first season. Blair was a lot more overtly sexual and Lisa might not have agreed with it, but she played the character at the time the way it was written.

Quite honestly, Lisa was very lucky that she was working for writers and producers who ultimately respected her wishes and let her sit out of the episode. Not all producers and writers would have done that. Many might have forced her hand and made her come to work and shoot that episode.

But I just think it's important to draw a line between Blair and Lisa. The same way I certainly don't think any less of Mindy for portraying the character who decided to lose her virginity.
I think by the time that episode aired Lisa had enough power on the show to dictate that she didn't appear. The show was winding down and she was a major star. Early on she was part of an ensemble. If she would have said something then, she might have been replaced like they did with the other girls that were fired.

I think by the time that episode aired Lisa had enough power on the show to dictate that she didn't appear. The show was winding down and she was a major star. Early on she was part of an ensemble. If she would have said something then, she might have been replaced like they did with the other girls that were fired.

I agree with that to an extent. I'm sure Lisa was much more comfortable making her feelings known when the show was a success and she was part of a working formula. Yes, when she was an unknown she could have been easily replaced if she became known as difficult.

The show was definitely winding down so there really wasn't much to lose on her part also--as you point out. Since the show was in the 9th and last season, I can't imagine the show would bother to fire her or replace her. It wouldn't be worth it.

But regardless since she signed a contract, they could have obligated her to film that episode. They could have made life a lot harder for her than they did. Especially since weren't they working on a spinoff for her at the time?

My only point is that while Lisa of course had way more leverage at the end of the run than the beginning, she also seemed to be lucky in regards to her working environment in that they understood her beliefs and didn't force her to act against them.

I feel like too much is being read into this. It's just a show and people should be able to seperate it from reality. If you cannot, then maybe you shouldn't be watching tv. In nearly every post I have read on this topic it seems as though people don't care as much about her beliefs as much as they do about not being able to see one of their favorite characters in an episode. Was there this much controversy about anyone else not appearing in an episode because I do not view this topic as any more or less important than any other topic they have discussed. (And to ABlairican Pie, as I stated previously in this thread, just because you think you know someone doesn't mean you do and, no disrespect but, I think if you met Lisa Whelchel a hundred times she would not remember you from any of her other fans. Sorry :(

it's not necessarily reading into it too much or giving hype about lisa not being in ONE episode, becuase if that were the case, i would gripe and gripe about charlotte rae leaving the show in the first episode of season 8 and having been absent for many episodes throughout season 6 and 7.... we got on the topic becuase everyone agreed that Jo was completely the wrong person to console natalie and it was completely out of character for Jo as well... everyone thought that it should be blair, and for that to be the case, she would have had to appear in the episode, and that's how we got onto this. It doesn't really matter whether she was religious or not, i was just simply stating that she could still be christian and play the part of a "sort of christian" while helping out natalie... and to say that blair was not a christian would be an understatement... becuase she had the tiff with her sister where she was angry with God, but it seemed like she settled that, christianity had been brought up a couple times with blair saying she was.

I feel like too much is being read into this. It's just a show and people should be able to seperate it from reality. If you cannot, then maybe you shouldn't be watching tv. In nearly every post I have read on this topic it seems as though people don't care as much about her beliefs as much as they do about not being able to see one of their favorite characters in an episode. Was there this much controversy about anyone else not appearing in an episode because I do not view this topic as any more or less important than any other topic they have discussed. (And to ABlairican Pie, as I stated previously in this thread, just because you think you know someone doesn't mean you do and, no disrespect but, I think if you met Lisa Whelchel a hundred times she would not remember you from any of her other fans. Sorry :(I am a Christian who is deeply involved in understanding the relationship between faith and the purpose of art. What does art do, and how does it affect us? Neither I, nor others here, simply accept the idea that The Facts Of Life is "just a show" and that people should "seperate it from reality". The whole purpose of the show is to point out what should be in reality, how people should live and act toward each other, how to solve problems. No one is saying that Lisa is not entitled to her beliefs, it's just when she tells the producers and creators of the show that she does not want a show dealing with premarital sex, and they ask why not, she could not simply tell them, "because it's against my beliefs, and God is against sex in that way." How does her personal beliefs translate into a lesson about the ethicality of sex on the show? Is the bottom line of avoiding
premarital sex only "God will punish you with something horrible for going against what it says in the Book of Ephesians, etc."? That's just not practical. People are dealing with the question of sex, and the show did in fact handle it well, and show what some of the consequences could be. It all ended up fine, Natalie and Snake realized their love for each other.

The rest of the country watching the show, except for members of the Religious Right, would not swallow the whole point of an episode, "Premarital sex is wrong because God will punish you if you do". They needed something more practical, something they could apply to their lives. We talk about "not being respectful of Lisa's beliefs", well, part of belief is accepting and embracing something that cannot be proven, except in the heart and mind of the person believing it. That's part of faith, and that can be a good thing, but fans of the show want something that can be demonstrated in the context of a half-hour sitcom. "But those characters on the show are not real, why bother with them?" They are very real, they all represent types: Blair, the image of success, beauty, and conceit with a heart of gold inside, Natalie, the sociable can-do person with imagination who often lacks practicality, Tootie, the future thespian tagalong who tries to prove her "maturity", and Jo, the hard-as-nails rebel and outcast who hides a sensitive heart. The reason why we are drawn to them is because we see something of ourselves in each of them. That's why the show was so successful for for nine seasons. But going back to Lisa's religious beliefs, it cannot be proven that God will punish you for having premarital sex. It can be proven that if one does not take certain precautions, however, certain things can happen as a result of sex, some lasting roughly nine months (or even longer if that result gets out of the house and goes to college).

True, there's a possibility that Lisa may not remember me after five years, but that doesn't mean that I don't know her. I'd think that if she made an appearance here in the near future, I'm sure she would.

But my question is, why is a religious belief more important than embracing the importance of characters on a sitcom?

But my question is, why is a religious belief more important than embracing the importance of characters on a sitcom?

Did you seriously just ask that question? Do you honestly think this show could be more important than religious beliefs? IT IS JUST A SHOW! SHE DOES NOT OWE YOU AN EXPLANATION! I am starting to think that some of you have over-stepped the line of liking/loving this show into obsession. So maybe this isn't the place for me...

Did you seriously just ask that question? Do you honestly think this show could be more important than religious beliefs? IT IS JUST A SHOW! SHE DOES NOT OWE YOU AN EXPLANATION! I am starting to think that some of you have over-stepped the line of liking/loving this show into obsession. So maybe this isn't the place for me...Okay, okay. Religion is more important than anything. Religion is far more superior to how human beings assimilate and process ideas, how people think in regards to "useless" things like art, drama, television, or humor. It is far more important to understand that God is an angry God who wishes to punish people for the sin of fornication, let that be young people's answer as to whether premarital sex is okay. Let the thunderbolts be cast down upon our skulls.

Okay, all seriousness aside, this is what I wish to say, you probably weren't around twenty years ago when she said a number of things in the press about this show, as well as in her Facts Of Life bio published six years ago, but she DID insist that the producers of the show NOT do an episode concerning premarital sex, claiming that it conflicted with her beliefs. They insisted that they would do it, they already had a discussion with her several years before about the same topic, and now felt that the girls were ready to deal with it. Lisa insisted that her character be written out of that episode, she did not want to be a party to that. She may not have owed us an explanation as to why she chose not to be in it, BUT SHE GAVE US ONE ANYWAY. Lisa was very much a public Christian twenty years ago, not only was she on the show, but she toured around the country doing speaking engagements at churches and promoting her album. This was her ministry. She felt very consciencious about what she did on the show and what kind of message she promoted. She was not at all private about her beliefs, she wanted everyone to accept Christ and His life in the way that she did.

You can say "It's just a show." If it was "just" a show, then it would not have mattered one way or another what she said or didn't say. She understood that young people were watching and making decisions based on what Blair, Jo, Natalie, and Tootie were doing and promoting. You can't tell these fans that it's just a show, that it has no bearing in real life. Like I said,
the characters on the show strike a chord with viewers because we can relate to them and their situations.

Let me rephrase the question religious beliefs vs. characters on a t.v. program. My concern is that Lisa's religious beliefs regarding premarital sex were not something private, she has always been outspoken as to why she wanted people to accept them. But how do you convey that belief to people without making it look like simply "her own personal religious pet peeve"? She was offered the part as Blair promoting a safe-sex point of view that was consistent with Blair's character, but she turned it down, knowing the "pro-sex" pitch would win out. It would have been very interesting to see what Blair would have said, she always had a good voice for speaking her mind. Instead, Blair's voice was absent from the episode.

And she has the right to do whatever she wants. I'm sure she was not going to just put her religious beliefs aside for your enjoyment. You know where she stands on the issue and I guess she believes that is enough. And it should be but apparently not to most of the people commenting on the topic. As I said before, no one should turn to a television series for answers to their problems. How could you not see that any reasonable person who is having these problems should not look to a show or anything else for that matter to solve it? It makes me realize just how easily influenced not only kids are but adults as well. This whole topic just makes me think that you think every situation will turn out as they do in this show. It's not logical. It just isn't, and I am sorry if I am the only one with any sense of reality around here. ohno:

And, if you knew me, you would not that religion certainly does not come before too many things in my life right now. But I am able to see that it is important, thank you.

And she has the right to do whatever she wants. I'm sure she was not going to just put her religious beliefs aside for your enjoyment. You know where she stands on the issue and I guess she believes that is enough. And it should be but apparently not to most of the people commenting on the topic. As I said before, no one should turn to a television series for answers to their problems. How could you not see that any reasonable person who is having these problems should not look to a show or anything else for that matter to solve it? It makes me realize just how influential not only kids are but adults as well. This whole topic just makes me think that you think every situation will turn out as they do in this show. It's not logical. It just isn't, and I am sorry if I am the only one with any sense of reality around here. ohno:

And, if you knew me, you would not that religion certainly does not come before too many things in my life right now. But I am able to see that it is important, thank you.If a t.v. show isn't the place to discuss important issues of the day that affect people's lives, then why was she on the show then?

No one is saying that things will have that "happy ending" like on the show. Btw, you just contradicted yourself from what you said above: you said it was "just a show", but here you say that the show was influential not only for kids but adults. Well?

Here's another interesting point: would you agree also that things don't turn out all that great in religion either? No one's saying that t.v. sitcoms solve everyone's problems, but just give people something to think about. Does everything get solved in funda-gelical Christianity? No one's saying that religion isn't or shouldn't be important in a person's life. But to what extent? Christians do make up rules that if one doesn't abide by them, they're all going to hell, in their opinion.


By the way, read my signature below:

So I guess you must know her personally. Proof?

In her website, she says: "I became a Christian when I was ten-years-old and since that time my whole life has been about serving the Lord and sharing His love with others."
(http://www.lisawhelchel.com/my_faith.htm)
This is what those of us who don't know her personally have read.

If a t.v. show isn't the place to discuss important issues of the day that affect people's lives, then why was she on the show then?

No one is saying that things will have that "happy ending" like on the show. Btw, you just contradicted yourself from what you said above: you said it was "just a show", but here you say that the show was influential not only for kids but adults. Well?

Here's another interesting point: would you agree also that things don't turn out all that great in religion either? No one's saying that t.v. sitcoms solve everyone's problems, but just give people something to think about. Does everything get solved in funda-gelical Christianity? No one's saying that religion isn't or shouldn't be important in a person's life. But to what extent? Christians do make up rules that if one doesn't abide by them, they're all going to hell, in their opinion.


By the way, read my signature below:

When did I say the show was influential? (Go back and read my post) My point is that you people let this show influence you too much. And what signature are you talking about because I don't see it? BTW, I am not religious by any means, but Ms. Whelchel has a right to hers as does anyone else.

When did I say the show was influential? (Go back and read my post) My point is that you people let this show influence you too much. And what signature are you talking about because I don't see it? BTW, I am not religious by any means, but Ms. Whelchel has a right to hers as does anyone else.
It's called a discussion....no need to get so upset over things.

I am not upset, sweetie. I am just trying to prove my point that what is being said is not all that logical.

i don't let every little thing about the show influence my life, but when i was down and didn't know where to turn (when i was just getting into the show around age 15 or 16... which is 5 to 6 years ago) i would watch the show to bring me out of my craptastic life (because i was forking my religion at that time as well) and it would show me that life is worth living to experience some of the things that the girls were... i did NOT sit in a situation and be like, hmm... what would blair do right now? No! It was just an escape for me out of my current world into a make believe world that i would have LOVED to be in! I get the difference between reality and make believe, but sometimes just pretending you're in the make believe world to get out of the crappy reality is a great way to keep going in life! And that is my fondness of the show! Some people have said that certain decisions came from the show, like the suicide episode, but i highly doubt that anybody would be fooling around with a guy/girl and be like, hey... natalie had sex with snake, i think i should too. That's just ridiculous, if it does happen, then erica is right... people make their decisions not on their own but by every tv show they see, which means our world is doomed... and i don't think that this is true. We all have our own minds to use

Some people have said that certain decisions came from the show, like the suicide episode, but i highly doubt that anybody would be fooling around with a guy/girl and be like, hey... natalie had sex with snake, i think i should too. That's just ridiculous, if it does happen, then erica is right... people make their decisions not on their own but by every tv show they see, which means our world is doomed... and i don't think that this is true. We all have our own minds to use

Well put. This person is the only one here who seems to see where I am coming from...somewhat. But I do not agree whole-heartedly. Why let a show take you from reality only to be faced with having to deal with your life again after 22 some odd minutes? It sets you up for disappointment because, most likely, your situation will end up nothing like it did in this show.

Well put. This person is the only one here who seems to see where I am coming from...somewhat. But I do not agree whole-heartedly. Why let a show take you from reality only to be faced with having to deal with your life again after 22 some odd minutes? It sets you up for disappointment because, most likely, your situation will end up nothing like it did in this show.No one is saying that all your life's problems will be solved in the course of a 22-minute episode. But should the moral, or "the happy ending", the lesson learned by the characters at the end of a show be jettisoned simply for the sake of "nothing like that really happens in real life"?
Perhaps Natalie should have had the worst case scenario, like she got preggers, or worse.

Of course, not every episode of the Facts Of Life ended up with a happy ending, such as the one where the student committed suicide, or Jo's revenge against her journalism teacher forced him to quit his teaching job.

No one is saying that all your life's problems will be solved in the course of a 22-minute episode. But should the moral, or "the happy ending", the lesson learned by the characters at the end of a show be jettisoned simply for the sake of "nothing like that really happens in real life"?
Perhaps Natalie should have had the worst case scenario, like she got preggers, or worse.

Of course, not every episode of the Facts Of Life ended up with a happy ending, such as the one where the student committed suicide, or Jo's revenge against her journalism teacher forced him to quit his teaching job.

Who says pregnancy is the worst case scenario? I think the worst thing that could have happened to Natalie did happen because she was naive and stupid. Natalie was such a desperate person and this is what it got her, exactly what she deserved. If was Snake I would have kept running and never looked back.

Who says pregnancy is the worst case scenario? I think the worst thing that could have happened to Natalie did happen because she was naive and stupid. Natalie was such a desperate person and this is what it got her, exactly what she deserved. If was Snake I would have kept running and never looked back.Natalie was "desparate" to have sex?
She "deserved" to have Snake walk out on her? Why did Natalie deserve to be "punished" for having sex? You do know how the episode started, right?

Natalie was "desparate" to have sex?
She "deserved" to have Snake walk out on her? Why did Natalie deserve to be "punished" for having sex? You do know how the episode started, right?

Uh...she was like planning to go out with him for her anniversary. So what? She deserved it because she should not have done it. She was waiting for the one person who actually wanted to do it with her (cuz as we all know she isn't a beauty queen) Someone like her jumps at the chance of having sex with a person you barely know.

Uh...she was like planning to go out with him for her anniversary. So what? She deserved it because she should not have done it. She was waiting for the one person who actually wanted to do it with her (cuz as we all know she isn't a beauty queen) Someone like her jumps at the chance of having sex with a person you barely know.WOW!!! Now I've heard everything!!! The REAL reason she did it was she was "ugly" and desperate!!!! OUCH!!! :eek2: Strange, because if you're one of the girls who's more attractive, then you're NOT as desperate for sex. Hmmmmmm.

But then I guess this reflects on your real feelings about sex, if a girl does it, then they are a skank and a whore who deserves to be punished, right? Thank God we're not living in Saudi Arabia. ohno:

Most people here would tell you that Natalie is NOT ugly. She may not be as cute as Blair, but then, no one is as cute as Blair. As far as Natalie "barely knowing" Snake, she had been going with him for a year. I think that's enough time to know someone.

WOW!!! Now I've heard everything!!! The REAL reason she did it was she was "ugly" and desperate!!!! OUCH!!! :eek2: Strange, because if you're one of the girls who's more attractive, then you're NOT as desperate for sex. Hmmmmmm.

But then I guess this reflects on your real feelings about sex, if a girl does it, then they are a skank and a whore who deserves to be punished, right? Thank God we're not living in Saudi Arabia. ohno:

Most people here would tell you that Natalie is NOT ugly. She may not be as cute as Blair, but then, no one is as cute as Blair. As far as Natalie "barely knowing" Snake, she had been going with him for a year. I think that's enough time to know someone.

I was friends with a girl from the time I started 2nd grade to around the end of 8th grade. I thought I knew her but she stabbed me in the back and did evil things to me. Prime example of how you cannot know someone after a year. But go sleep with someone you have only known for a year if you want. I, however, am never going to be that naive. And, for the record, I never said Natalie was ugly, thank you. I just do not think she is attractive at all. And yes, most girls who have sex within a small amount of time after meeting someone are sluts. How hard is it to wait? I mean, why do it anyway if it is going to end like Natalie's situation. I hope that you do not seriously believe you can know someone after a year. ohno:

Well put. This person is the only one here who seems to see where I am coming from...somewhat. But I do not agree whole-heartedly. Why let a show take you from reality only to be faced with having to deal with your life again after 22 some odd minutes? It sets you up for disappointment because, most likely, your situation will end up nothing like it did in this show.

I'm sorry if what i was meaning didnt come across as very clear, so i hope this helps :) I was not meaning that i try to see how they can solve the same problems i am facing in 20 minutes, it's just a general escape from reality, you know... like reading a book. It's nice to think of a world where everything is not exactly perfect but pretty darn close. In a time of my life when things just couldn't go up or down, it was nice to think of a world where it may just come out alright... and eventually my life did come out alright (but not becuase of a certain show or anything related to what i saw on tv). It doesn't really set me up for disappointment... my life set me up for disappointment, it just took me out of the disappointing world of my life for just that half hour or longer... which was better than remaining in it the full 24 hours of the day i hope that explains what i meant :)

I was friends with a girl from the time I started 2nd grade to around the end of 8th grade. I thought I knew her but she stabbed me in the back and did evil things to me. Prime example of how you cannot know someone after a year. But go sleep with someone you have only known for a year if you want. I, however, am never going to be that naive. And, for the record, I never said Natalie was ugly, thank you. I just do not think she is attractive at all. And yes, most girls who have sex within a small amount of time after meeting someone are sluts. How hard is it to wait? I mean, why do it anyway if it is going to end like Natalie's situation. I hope that you do not seriously believe you can know someone after a year. ohno:Well, I can understand how even after several years, you can think you know someone and find out they're totally treacherous. We've also heard of couples who've been married or together for decades to find out someone's been cheating on the other. So I can relate to that. I think in Natalie's case,
it would depend on the kind of chemistry two people would have with each other to make them decide when and if to have sex. Some people might think
a year is enough, some people more than a year, some less. It all depends on the person.

I think, though, that the producers and writers of the show figured, well, a year after their first meeting seems okay for them to have sex. In drama, there is a little story device called suspension of disbelief. This means that we hold back our tendency to say, "things don't happen like that, or so fast, etc.", we accept it as part of the story line. Like in Superman or Spider-Man. In real life, most people would wait a little longer than a year before they figured it was right to have sex, but the show's not insisting that you wait a year or longer, or less. This was convenient to the plot to make it a year. Funny how in the previous season, Snake was a character who was only alluded to, but never seen. The girls were asking if he was even real. Also, by the time the episode aired, the show was in its last season and knew it wasn't going to go into a tenth season to make it more "realistic" for the sex episode.

We may all have an opinion of Natalie and what she did, whether it was right or wrong, but the real question is, what did the writers of the show intend for us to get out of the episode?