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#511 | |
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Join Date: Sep 15, 2010
Location: NE Indiana
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And how is his alibi "solid?" His account of the story is the only one shown and it makes him look like a "hero." If other witnesses had seen the abduction, the car chase and the truck stalking the victim, then his account would be more credible. 2) I'm aware that decals aren't included w/ the vehicle information. Never said that. What I did say was the decal as described was very distinctive. The number of trucks having it would be very limited. As would the number of trucks w/ tread patterns of the tires on the truck that parked next to the phone booth. 3) Were these two witnesses unavailable to for the UM segment? Do you have a link for their accounts? 4) This is a small town. While there may be HUNDREDS of prints, most are probably not adult males that drive green late model Ford pick up trucks. And even if the prints weren't in the system (which would be unlikely given the nature of the crime) wouldn't having them on file for possible use comparison by the FBI or w/ a later suspect be advisable? And anything on the ground at/around the crime scene is potential evidence. Anything in the immediate area of the abduction can be considered a clue. That's Crime Scene Investigation 101. You pick it up, bag it and hold it until you can exclude it. 5) The boyfriend was home babysitting his brother according to him. The brother wasn't show during the segment so it can't be determined that the brother wasn't asleep the entire time. Nor was it determined that he woke during or just after the time the "car chase" took place. And a 1/2 hour call on a payphone to a person she just left? Really? And that person didn't tell her to leave the area when she grew uneasy about the strange vehicle? Or drive down to the area to check on her as it was only seven blocks away? Had this case happened in a town or city w/ a competent police force, this case probably would have been solved many years ago. |
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#512 | |
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#VLSKMS
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Join Date: Nov 22, 2008
Location: Maryland
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#513 |
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Join Date: Nov 21, 2010
Posts: 244
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Here here on your last point cocytus.
In any case, if I had a girlfriend, I'd want her to have mace or something similar, especially if she's going out at night. Of course, that's me and this isn't 1991, but still... I don't see though what's so weird about them having a half hour phone call...Youngbirds in love. Although, wouldn't that require a large amount of coins to have to be kept pumping in to keep the call going? I'll put it this way: The abductor used the payphone next to her, as well as her payphone (to make that comment about not needing to use the phone). There should have been a set of prints on least one of the two phones, unless of course the guy was wearing gloves. And if he wasn't wearing gloves, then it's likely there was two sets of identical prints on each phone, since he used both. Even if he wasn't wearing gloves, I'm sure Angela put up a struggle--There would have been the guy's hairs (and let's say there's two of them--that doubles the chance of there being ANY sort of physical evidence) on the ground or maybe some tissue evidence if she was able to cut him and draw blood in her struggle. Not only that, but even just from him walking back and forth, from his truck to the phone repeatedly--Surely a hair or something would drop on the ground There has to have been some sort of physical evidence. Even if the guy wasn't in the criminal system in 1991, there had to be some even minor physical evidence left at the scene. Plus, the tire marks that you mentioned. Rob indicates this was a high speed chance, and surely when the abductor sped out of the parking lot there had to be some sort of tire marks left. |
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#514 | |||
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Don't Look Up
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Join Date: Jan 07, 2009
Posts: 3,107
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Quote:
If the brother was asleep during the phone call and car chase (or even if he was awake for all or part of the time), he may have had no important information to give UM, so he wasn't interviewed. Maybe they wanted to use their air time getting information from the guy who was actually talking to Angela and chasing the truck. Interviewing a little brother who may have been left home or sleeping during all this will not make for good tv. Quote:
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Plus, you have to remember, Angela was an adult. Rob wasn't even married to her. She was her own woman. Rob couldn't order her to go somewhere or tell her to do something she didn't want to do. Obviously, it was a terrible mistake for her not to leave, but Angela felt safe enough to stay where she was. |
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#515 |
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Don't Look Up
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Join Date: Jan 07, 2009
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I was thinking more about this, and wanted to add a couple things.
In any other circumstance, I would think that the boyfriend was most likely responsible. I think there are studies showing the number one killer of pregnant women is the child's father. Back when this happened, I'm not sure if the public knew the statistics, but the cops probably did. (And that's probably one reason UM didn't reveal the pregnancy during their segment.) Rob (Angela's boyfriend and father of the baby) was considered the top suspect. The police eventually cleared him and don't think he's involved. Nearly 2 decades later, Angela's family still believe in Rob's innocence, as they've stated here. They've had many years to think about the specifics of this case and they know more about the details than we'll ever know. They feel confident that Rob's not involved. So, after years of careful condsideration, neither the police nor Angela's family consider him a suspect. That's definitely enough for me to be certain of it, too, and to move on to discuss other possibilities. |
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#516 | |
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Join Date: Sep 15, 2010
Location: NE Indiana
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2) Polygraphs are worthless. They can't be used as evidence in court and they a notoriously unreliable when used to question suspects. Do you know why the police use a polygraph? When they confront a suspect w/ the fact that they "failed" the test, the suspect usually confesses. If the suspect doesn't confess and the test shows "no deceit" then the polygraph (if it worked) should exonerate them, shouldn't it? It doesn't....so polygraph tests are worthless. 3) Was the transmission failing BEFORE the "car chase" occurred? That was never mentioned in the segment. Also, even if it did fail,what does that mean? That the chase that nobody heard nor saw took place? Again, in a larger city w/ a more competent police force, it's likely that the boyfriend's story would be questioned in greater detail and that this case would have been solved before now. |
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#517 | |
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Join Date: Nov 21, 2010
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It's pretty obvious he didn't do it, at least to me. There was a whole network of serial killers operating just in Missouri at the time. There were probably a dozen or more serial killers in that corridor of the country (Kansa, Missouri, etc) at that particular period. I'd say the odds, sadly, favor Angela being in the wrong place at the wrong time and falling victim to one of these sickos. And that's what we should be focusing on if we ever want to see her get justice, or at least her remains be recovered and given a proper burial. |
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#518 |
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#VLSKMS
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Join Date: Nov 22, 2008
Location: Maryland
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If someone passes a polygraph it tends to take the focus away from them in an investigation. That coupled with the account Rob gave (pretty detailed account if he were making it all up) is what cleared him as a suspect, IMO.
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#519 | |
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Join Date: Mar 10, 2006
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Angela and Rob where at a bbq together. Sometime before 10pm Angela dropped Rob off at his house because he had agreed to babysit his younger brother while his mom was out. Angela left Rob to go visit a friend named Kayla. Kayla's last name escapes me but it is mentioned in this forum. The plan was that when Rob's mother returned home he was going to meet up with Angela uptown. So, around 11pm Angela drops Kayla off at her home and goes to the payphone to call Rob and see if his mother has retured and if he's coming to meet her. Rob informs her his mother has not returned and he cannot leave yet so she continues talking to him on the phone. Obviously you know what happens next. Angela mentions that the green truck has circled the block and his now pulling up near the phones and gives Rob the description of the man. This was not odd as it was late at night and it was someone in a small town that she did not recognize. Rob hears her scream and heads down to the phone booth. He passes the truck and turns around and chases it for a few blocks but transmission gives out. Now you have mentioned about a chase no one heard. Lets look at why that is. If you re watch this segment you will see that the chase took place right in the main part of town. There are no homes in this area, only businesses which by the way where all closed at that time of night. So there was no one there to witness the chase and Im sure you can imagine that this late at night on a weekday most people are in bed. You also ask about when his transmission was damaged. Well the segment clearly states that he damaged his transmission when throwing his vehicle into reverse when he was trying to get turned around to chase the truck. Angela's friend Kayla was talked to by police and her's and Rob's stories fit together perfectly. This is why Rob simply didnt have the time or means to have done this and gotten away with it. I dont understand why you keep saying his story should have been questioned alot more. Have you seen the police reports? Do you actually know to what extent he was questioned? I can gaurantee you that before he was hooked up to the polygraph machine he was extensively questioned. He was treated as a suspect in the beginning and was cleared. |
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#520 | |
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Join Date: Mar 10, 2006
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About the layout.... If you type Angela Hammond into youtube you will see a story from our local news where you will see some brief shots of what the area looked like in 91. On the two guy theory, I suggest you watch the segment again. Angela was in the booth and appears to be looking to her right side at the man who is looking around in the truck. The other attacker could have been dropped off when he was circling and walked up on her other side. The man could have been fumbling around in the truck while the other one made his approach. Think about this, Angela had last stated the man was in the truck looking for something, then she screams. She never said "hes coming back over here" or here he comes again". I also dont think this guy put alot of thought into what he was doing or planned this out to a tee. If he was smart he would not have grabbed a girl who was on the phone nor woud he be kidnapping anyone in a vehilce with this distinctive mural in the back window. He just got very lucky. My guess is he was out looking for a woman working alone in a convienance store much like Darby and Kenny. When he found no situations like that, he then came upon Angela and decided to grab her. |
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#521 | |
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Join Date: Nov 21, 2010
Posts: 244
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I hope he's found someday. |
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Last edited by CuriousMind90; 11-30-2010 at 06:02 AM. |
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#522 | |
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Join Date: Sep 15, 2010
Location: NE Indiana
Posts: 781
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The reason that I have issues with the boyfriend story is because as it's presented it doesn't make that much sense. How was the driver of the truck able to restrain the girl drive the truck and avoid me a car that was chasing him? How was it that the boyfriend was able to locate the exact truck going in the exact direction necessary for him to intercepted it? You did state correctly that this all took place in the downtown area. However I have never been to a downtown of any size that didn't have homes very near the center of town. No one in those homes heard a high-speed car chase down the streets at 11 to 12 o'clock at night? And the transmission could have been damaged in advance. Or when the boyfriend was disposing of the body and then it just failed at the location that it did. The boyfriend was very popular athlete locally and he was also a popular kid in school. The police would've been very hard pressed at that time to keep him as a suspect for those facts alone. Given that it was a small town, it's also likely that social pressures prevented this from being seen as something someone local could do. |
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#523 | |
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Join Date: Mar 10, 2006
Posts: 778
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How was the driver able to restrain the girl? Well my thoughts are there was more then one abductor. However she did state he was a large man and Angela was barely 5ft tall and probably weighed less then 130lbs so it is possible he could have muscled her into the truck. We just dont have that information unless the killer is found. How was it Rob was able to intercept the truck? Well Rob knew exactly where Angela was. He lived 7 blocks from the payphones. He drove down when he heard her scream and the truck drove past him. I dont see that as some miracle coincidence. No one in the homes heard the chase? How do we know that? It wasnt mentioned in the segment but that doesnt mean its not in the police reports somewhere. And when you look at the area there where no homes around where she was taken or where Rob turned around. This is where the sounds of screeching tires would have been heard and there are no homes around there. I guess Robs transmission could have been damaged earlier but that would be pure speculation. If he did damage it somewhere else how in the world did he get it back to being in the middle of the street in the downtown area?? Here's what we know....... Kayla told police she was with Angela up until 11pm. The next thing we know for sure is that Rob was contacting Police around midnight with the story of her being abducted. This means that if he indeed killed her that he had one hour to get it done AND conceal her body where it would never be found AND clean up all blood or any type of evidence of a struggle then park his car with damaged transmission in the middle of downtown and then go alert police with this story he just fabricated. All this had to be done in less then an hour and his brother would have to lie for him. Keep in mind that the police did state to a reporter that atleast two other witnesses claimed to have seen the truck in the area that night. Now do you see why he was cleared? |
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#524 |
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#VLSKMS
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Join Date: Nov 22, 2008
Location: Maryland
Posts: 8,612
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I've always thought her abducter was armed with at least a knife. That and the fact that Angela wasn't very big physically is the reason why she was so easily subdued. I'm sure Rob's car was found broke down in the town, a pretty elaborate plot to pull off if he were being deceitful.
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#525 |
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Don't Look Up
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Join Date: Jan 07, 2009
Posts: 3,107
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I think there are many different possible reasons why Angela couldn't get out of the truck while she was being abducted.
She was a small woman. The guy could have just overpowered her and restrained her. I'm quite a big larger than Angela. I'm 5'6 and my husband is 5' 10" (not a really big guy at all). We've just been horsing around wrasslin and stuff (lol) and my husband can actually grab both my wrists in just one of his hands and hold them securely. I can't get free, although we're not really fighting, so I don't try to hurt him to force him to release my wrists. It was really shocking for me to realize how much more strength men can have. I remember reading about at least one case where a guy already had handcuffs hooked up on the passenger side of the car so that when he abducted his victim, he only had to get the cuffs on her and she would be trapped, tied to the vehicle. Others have removed the door handle from the passenger door in preparation for a kidnapping. (I think maybe Ted Bundy was one who did this.) That makes it just about impossible for a panicking victim to get out of the vehicle. The victim wouldn't be familiar with the interior of the car and in Angela's case, it was late at night. (Think of the times you've been in a friend's car or borrowed or rented a car that you're not familiar with, and then you try to find the handle or window buttons in the dark. Sometimes it takes a bit of searching.) I think it would be hard for her to find the handle in the dark, and just about impossible to escape if the handle was removed. He also could have been holding a weapon on her. Many people cooperate or are immobilized with fear when someone is pointing a gun at them. |
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