Frasier

[losthighway]

I always liked Kirsty Alley's comedic timing and delivery. I thought she was really funny, but Ted and Shelly did have great chemistry together, kind of like Tim and Crystal.

I've always wondered what the Wings creators would have done if Crystal had left the show after 3 or 4 seasons before she and Joe were married? You know they would have added someone to the cast to create some kind of a love interest for Joe or Brian. But in my opinion Crystal would have been very hard to replace. It just woudn't have been the same without Helen.

[Krista2882]

that's interesting... I mean, I haven't seen THAT many episodes of Cheers, so maybe I'm missing something, but I never really felt like Ted Danson and Shelley Long had that much on-screen chemistry... hhmmm... I'll have to watch for that the next time I see the show. But it wasn't something that I ever really thought was that noticeable.
Not like the on-screen chemistry that Tim Daly and Crystal Bernard have on Wings... now that's something that always jumped out at me ever since I started watching the show.

It's funny how a Frasier thread quickly turned into a Cheers thread. hehe

OH!, and T-man (hehehe)-- you said you've always wondered what would have happened if Crystal left Wings before Helen and Joe got married... oh man, I would have freaked out! haha. I still would have kept watching the show, but the Joe and Helen thing- their chemistry together and their relationship is one of my favorite things about the show, and without that, it would have been seriously lacking, in my opinion. Plus, Helen IS one of my favorite characters, so the show would definatley been missing something without her.

~Krista

[losthighway]

Originally posted by Krista2882
that's interesting... I mean, I haven't seen THAT many episodes of Cheers, so maybe I'm missing something, but I never really felt like Ted Danson and Shelley Long had that much on-screen chemistry... hhmmm... I'll have to watch for that the next time I see the show. But it wasn't something that I ever really thought was that noticeable.
Not like the on-screen chemistry that Tim Daly and Crystal Bernard have on Wings... now that's something that always jumped out at me ever since I started watching the show.

~Krista

If you ever get a chance to check out the DVD of the first year of Cheers you should, and then you'll see what I mean about Ted and Shelly. Ted and Shelly really didn't get along that well off the set acording to many reports, but on camera, the chemistry is truly there. It wasn't a real strong sexual chemistry, like Crystal and Tim had, but they had real good comedic timing and acting chemistry that is pretty rare.

Wings got put down by the critics quite a bit for using the same formula as Cheers used with Sam and Diane saying Wings did the same as far as the Helen and Joe relationship went....you know starting with having an attraction for each other but not acting upon it, then getting them together as a couple, only to quickly break them up, and then having the characters act like they don't really care about each other anymore in that way, when they obviously do. I thought it was a silly criticism, but technically it was the same formula as far as the characters of the show.

And YES, I could not imagine Wings without Crystal at all. I thought Shelly Long made one of the worst decisions any actress ever has when she left Cheers. But I'm just thankful Crystal didn't decide to pursue her music career full time and leave Wings early. Imagine if she had left after season 4, and pulled a Thomas Hayden Church? Not only would the show have lost all the great work she did with Tim Daly, but there were so many great things the Helen character brought to the show on her own......like her biting sarcasm, and how it was so fun to watch this pint sized 5'3" little thing get physical with people and throw them around. Nope, I really don't think they ever would have been able to replace Crystal. The show would have never been the same.

[pilotguy]

Originally posted by losthighway

I've always wondered what the Wings creators would have done if Crystal had left the show after 3 or 4 seasons before she and Joe were married? You know they would have added someone to the cast to create some kind of a love interest for Joe or Brian. But in my opinion Crystal would have been very hard to replace. It just woudn't have been the same without Helen.

In the earliest "Alex Lambert" episodes, it seems like they're trying to create a new love interest for Joe. There's a certain chemistry there between Joe and Alex....a very DIFFERENT kind of chemistry than what Joe and Crystal had, but a chemistry nonetheless.
Don't forget, before she started dating Brian, Joe and Alex shared a steamy kiss or two themselves....but I don't think that a "Joe and Alex" relationship would have had the staying power of a "Joe and Helen" relationship!

[spunkygirl]

I like Frasier the character only on Cheers, I never cared much for him when he got his own show. I am with you, I will take Wings any day over Frasier, Cheers, etc....

[peter may]

shelley long actually admitted that she wished she never left Cheers, when she was on the graham norton (UK chat show) a couple of months ago.

[pilotguy]

Originally posted by peter may
shelley long actually admitted that she wished she never left Cheers, when she was on the graham norton (UK chat show) a couple of months ago.

Please help refresh my memory....I haven't seen this "Cheers" episode in years, but there was an episode (after Shelley had left the show) where Norm, Cliff, Frasier and Woody go to a drive-in movie to watch some old Japanese sci-fi film (one of those "Godzilla"-type films)......

They're sitting in the car watching the film and Norm is an expert on this particular Japanese sci-fi series of films....He's pointing out the various actors on the screen and says about one actress, "She didn't apprear in any more of these after this one"...and Woody innocently asks, "Who in their right mind would leave a successful series right in the middle of it?"

It was done as a "throwaway" line, but it was HILARIOUS!

[DianeChambers87]

Yeah that's how the Godzilla line went where woody ends up asking

Woody: Why would an actress leave a hit series like that?

Frasier: (shrugs) who knows...

lol...I'm getting more into Wings and Joe and Helen do have sexual tension and good chemistry......and I hate to come here and post a different opinion than one posted but I have to say that Joe and Helens sexual tension doesn't compare to Sam and Dianes......it was just insane...you know? If you have never seen the first 5 seasons and not so much the first season because they are just kind of flirting but the 4 other ones....the chemistry and sexual tension is amazing. I can't really explain it that well, you would have to watch an episode from the 2, 3, 4, or 5 season...and what I mean by insane is that well they would drive each other to insanity...at one point the Diane character checked into an asylum because of Sam (hence she meets Dr. Frasier Crane), Sam tried to kill her once...well actually there were a lot of times where I thought that he was going to kill her....but this one time he did try and she had him arrested....

[DianeChambers87]

Yeah that's how the Godzilla line went where woody ends up asking

Woody: Why would an actress leave a hit series like that?

Frasier: (shrugs) who knows...

lol...I'm getting more into Wings and Joe and Helen do have sexual tension and good chemistry......and I hate to come here and post a different opinion than one posted but I have to say that Joe and Helens sexual tension doesn't compare to Sam and Dianes......it was just insane...you know? If you have never seen the first 5 seasons and not so much the first season because they are just kind of flirting but the 4 other ones....the chemistry and sexual tension is amazing. I can't really explain it that well, you would have to watch an episode from the 2, 3, 4, or 5 season...and what I mean by insane is that well they would drive each other to insanity...at one point the Diane character checked into an asylum because of Sam (hence she meets Dr. Frasier Crane), Sam tried to kill her once...well actually there were a lot of times where I thought that he was going to kill her....but this one time he did try and she had him arrested....

[phoebe7165]

Originally posted by DianeChambers87
Yeah that's how the Godzilla line went where woody ends up asking

Woody: Why would an actress leave a hit series like that?

Frasier: (shrugs) who knows...

lol...I'm getting more into Wings and Joe and Helen do have sexual tension and good chemistry......and I hate to come here and post a different opinion than one posted but I have to say that Joe and Helens sexual tension doesn't compare to Sam and Dianes......it was just insane...you know? If you have never seen the first 5 seasons and not so much the first season because they are just kind of flirting but the 4 other ones....the chemistry and sexual tension is amazing. I can't really explain it that well, you would have to watch an episode from the 2, 3, 4, or 5 season...and what I mean by insane is that well they would drive each other to insanity...at one point the Diane character checked into an asylum because of Sam (hence she meets Dr. Frasier Crane), Sam tried to kill her once...well actually there were a lot of times where I thought that he was going to kill her....but this one time he did try and she had him arrested....

And this was a comedy?!! Sounds more like a soap opera!!

[losthighway]

I watched every season of Cheers and know the show quite well. I think both Ted and Shelly and Tim and Crystal had great chemistry. I think the Tim and Crystal "sexual" chemistry was stronger. (I really believed they were in love) but there is a lot that goes into the chemistry of actors and characters besides the sexual chemistry. But either way, both were very good together.

[Krista2882]

yeah, on Cheers, Sam and Diane had sexual tension. I agree with that. but what I was talking about is chemistry that sometimes happens between two actors that work together. and personally, I never noticed that on Cheers between Ted and Shelley. But I think I may have to see more episodes.
On Wings, Crystal and Tim, as actors, or as people, or whatever, had a chemistry between them, and it showed in their acting together on the show.
and when you talk about two actors having a chemistry together, sometimes it's as simple as them being able to work together really well, and feed off of each other.
and then sometimes it's like what you have with Tim and Crystal- They worked together really well, and there seemed to always be a spark between them onscreen. Now I always wondered if, when that happens, if there is some kind of attraction to each other in real life. I'm not an actor, so I have no idea about this, but it just seems like for two people to have such a spark between them while working onstage, it must come from somewhere! I'm not saying there was something going on between Tim and Crystal, so please don't take it that way, because I know Tim was and is married. But you know, you just kind of wonder if there really was some sort of attraction between them in real life, because it seemed so real between them on screen as Joe and Helen. But I'm NOT saying they acted on it or anything!
On "Farscape", two of the actors on that show- Ben Browder and Claudia Black have this amazing onscreen chemistry. and I remember one time on the Farscape message board, someone said that they wondered if there was some real-life attraction between them, and people on the board jumped down his throat saying "how could you say that? Ben is happily married!!... you should have more respect for them then to think that they would act on some onscreen chemistry, when one of them is married! ...blah blah blah..." lol and stuff like that.
So I want to just make sure you all know i don't mean any disrespect to Tim or Crystal. I don't want anyone jumping down my throat! lol. But I know you guys are too nice to do that anyway

geez!! this thing took me about 40 minutes to type. it all of a sudden got really busy at work!

~Krista

[losthighway]

Originally posted by Krista2882
yeah, on Cheers, Sam and Diane had sexual tension. I agree with that. but what I was talking about is chemistry that sometimes happens between two actors that work together. and personally, I never noticed that on Cheers between Ted and Shelley. But I think I may have to see more episodes.
On Wings, Crystal and Tim, as actors, or as people, or whatever, had a chemistry between them, and it showed in their acting together on the show.
and when you talk about two actors having a chemistry together, sometimes it's as simple as them being able to work together really well, and feed off of each other.
and then sometimes it's like what you have with Tim and Crystal- They worked together really well, and there seemed to always be a spark between them onscreen. Now I always wondered if, when that happens, if there is some kind of attraction to each other in real life. I'm not an actor, so I have no idea about this, but it just seems like for two people to have such a spark between them while working onstage, it must come from somewhere! I'm not saying there was something going on between Tim and Crystal, so please don't take it that way, because I know Tim was and is married. But you know, you just kind of wonder if there really was some sort of attraction between them in real life, because it seemed so real between them on screen as Joe and Helen. But I'm NOT saying they acted on it or anything!

~Krista

Well said. I couldn't agree more. You and I are simpatico!

I'm sure you'll be losing sleep over that.

But I always felt there was a real attraction between Crystal and Tim. No matter how good of an actor you are, you just can't fake that. Not that anything was ever acted upon, but it seemed genuine to me.

[Krista2882]

Originally posted by losthighway
Well said. I couldn't agree more. You and I are simpatico!

I'm sure you'll be losing sleep over that.

oh, you know it, T. hahaha!

[DianeChambers87]

Originally posted by phoebe7165
And this was a comedy?!! Sounds more like a soap opera!!

lol them trying to kill each other made pretty good comedy! lol! The more and more that I watch wings, the more and more I like it (especially Lowell) lol. Maybe it was different in Joe and Helen's case cause the actors did get along and liked each other. It is no secret that Shelley and Ted weren't the best of friends...lol well Shelley and the whole cast.