a grown man living in his girlfriend's parents house. How could any father have respect for his daughter's boyfriend if he is living inside their house? If you notice, Archie did have a little more respect for him once Mike moved next door. But no father is going to respect his daughter's boyfriend if he moves in with them and eats their food.-Anyone Agree?

I agree (Raises hand). There isn't any way I would respect that ole MEATHEAD either.............

Originally posted by Sitcom Analyzer
a grown man living in his girlfriend's parents house. How could any father have respect for his daughter's boyfriend if he is living inside their house? If you notice, Archie did have a little more respect for him once Mike moved next door. But no father is going to respect his daughter's boyfriend if he moves in with them and eats their food.-Anyone Agree?

Well, when Archie and Edith were first married they lived with Edith's parents. Whether Archie's attitude is surprising or not, it's definitely hypocritical.

Originally posted by TVgen62
Well, when Archie and Edith were first married they lived with Edith's parents. Whether Archie's attitude is surprising or not, it's definitely hypocritical.


Oh I didn't know that.

Maybe so but I bet Archie had a job and pitched in with some money which I seem to remember Mike went to school and Gloria had the job which ticked Archie off and it would anyone. Mike was nothing but a disrespectful,loud mouth,hippie liberal who had no clue about the real world! If I remember right his excuse for not working was he was going to school full time, BIG DEAL!!! Most people go to school full time, work at least part time and even raise a family. He was just plain lazy!!

Oh, I'm sure Archie would've helped out money-wise since he grew up during the Depression and knew about hard times.
When I was in college, I had a part-time job my first semester, but my grades started to slip, so I had to quit my job and focus completely on my studies or else I would have ended up academic probation. Once my grade got up, I tried looking for a job again, but no luck. Anyway, if I had been living at someone else's house while in school, I definitely would've helped out the best I could money-wise. Mike stayed under Archie's roof and all he could do was argue with him. If this were real, I don't Mike would've lasted long at the Bunker's, even if he was married to Gloria.
-Kristi

Originally posted by desilu #1
Maybe so but I bet Archie had a job and pitched in with some money which I seem to remember Mike went to school and Gloria had the job which ticked Archie off and it would anyone. Mike was nothing but a disrespectful,loud mouth,hippie liberal who had no clue about the real world! If I remember right his excuse for not working was he was going to school full time, BIG DEAL!!! Most people go to school full time, work at least part time and even raise a family. He was just plain lazy!!
Originally posted by KayEn78
Anyway, if I had been living at someone else's house while in school, I definitely would've helped out the best I could money-wise. Mike stayed under Archie's roof and all he could do was argue with him. If this were real, I don't Mike would've lasted long at the Bunker's, even if he was married to Gloria.

I had a problem with a person living under someone else's roof and being that rude, arrogant, insulting and self-righteous while being in that person's house rent free. In real life a person like Mike would had their tail kicked out.

I understand the part that Gloria went to work while Mike went to classes. If he still could had a part time job and still get through school.

The entertainment value of the show was all good. Those five years of the four of them under the same roof was the best comedy that we were treated to. I lived for Saturday nights at 8pm for the Bunker's and I was only 9 when the show first came on.

In real life no one would not live under another person's roof for free behaving the way Mike did. Sure Archie was no angel in this but it is his house.

Originally posted by desilu #1
Maybe so but I bet Archie had a job and pitched in with some money which I seem to remember Mike went to school and Gloria had the job which ticked Archie off and it would anyone. Mike was nothing but a disrespectful,loud mouth,hippie liberal who had no clue about the real world! If I remember right his excuse for not working was he was going to school full time, BIG DEAL!!! Most people go to school full time, work at least part time and even raise a family. He was just plain lazy!!

Amen! I was actually just thinking about this the past few days; that I hear Meathead always complaining "I go to school full-time, Arch!" but, lol, we hardly EVER see him studying! AND! The couple of times he DID get a job to pay Archie back for something, he did it just fine.

Mike disgusts me too. He may be in school full time but if his studies are so all encompassing that he can't work and contribute financially, he ought to at least help around the house with odd jobs and stuff. And he definitely owes it to Archie to show respect for him as an older man who is supporting him through school. Otherwise he couldn't have finished his education and gone on to a good job afterwards. The fact that they disagreed on so many things is definitely an aspect that made the show more humourous, but Mike ought to have prefaced his negative responses with "With all due respect Archie, I think...." rather than just blatantly telling him he was wrong all the time.

Anyway, there was one episode where it was summertime and I imagine Mike was out of school. Is there some reason he couldn't have worked during the summers? He could have helped defray the mounting debt he was incurring that would have to be repaid at some point. For him to just sit on his tailfeathers during the summer while Archie still worked was unconscionable. I frankly don't see how he could have lived with himself. :argue:

:cat:

I agree. Mike was not a nice person. All he was, as Archie put in one episode "a beard with nothing under it"

Heck, I think Mike held back on Archie. If someone like Archie called me "meathead" all the time, I'd be tempting to call him something like "fatso" or "baldy". I loved the episode where Mike was moving out and he called Archie a "fatheaded bigot" because that's exactly what he was. Archie mellowed in the later episodes, but in the early ones, Archie's character was practically a Nazi with his hatred of African Americans, Jews, and just about everyone else.

Originally posted by GeeBee
Heck, I think Mike held back on Archie. If someone like Archie called me "meathead" all the time, I'd be tempting to call him something like "fatso" or "baldy". I loved the episode where Mike was moving out and he called Archie a "fatheaded bigot" because that's exactly what he was. Archie mellowed in the later episodes, but in the early ones, Archie's character was practically a Nazi with his hatred of African Americans, Jews, and just about everyone else.



Yes Archie was very Hateful in the earlier seasons which caused him to be on the cover of Ebony in 1972. The title of the front cover said Is this the real White America?

The Nazis killed people, Archie didn't kill anyone on the show. Yes, he said rude things, but he didn't kill. There's a difference between Nazi hatred and plain bigtroy. Remember the KKK episode? Even didn't like what they were doing.
-Kristi

Originally posted by KayEn78
The Nazis killed people, Archie didn't kill anyone on the show. Yes, he said rude things, but he didn't kill. There's a difference between Nazi hatred and plain bigtroy. Remember the KKK episode? Even didn't like what they were doing.
-Kristi

Archie was a racist and an anti-Semite in the first few seasons. He mellowed a lot in the later episodes, including the one where he opposed the KKK. However, if he hadn't been such a bigot, the KKK would have never been attracted to him in the first place. Bigotry is hatred and hatred is the language of the Nazis. Hitler could have never gotten the power that he did, had it not been for a bigoted society. Violence is the inevitable conclusion of all prejudice.

Lighten up, GeeBee. This was the first Sitcom ever to address these issues. Archie just SAID what people were thinking in those days, except for the weirdo hippies (I'm willing to bet, deep down some of them too.). They had to dish out a lot in the first couple/few season to keep people coming back. Archie got stereotyped and put in his place sometimes too, don't forget. And like KayEn78 said, Archie didn't kill anyone like the stupid Nazis, so don't dare compare him with them, that's disgusting.

...he ought to at least help around the house with odd jobs and stuff...

Actually, it WAS said in one episode that he did a lot of odd jobs around the house.

I agree with Conservativeballer. The people I know who lived during the Depression and WWII years are prejudice in some way (whether it's black people, hispanic people etc). There's no way that they would ever kill anyone. Oh, one more thing...also it's hard to compare Archie to the Nazis because he fought the Nazis in WWII. He knew what they were doing was wrong. Plus, the Nazis used more "hateful" words (I won't say them here, but one starts with a k). A lot of the time, when people are prejudice they learned it from their own parents (i.e. Archie's father) and saw it in the time they grew up in. There are still good things about Archie. He loved his wife and family. And he did come home from work every day. He didn't beat his wife or "little girl." If he didn't like it at home he probably would've gotten drunk many a time at Kelseys. There's good and "bad" in every time and person.
-Kristi

Originally posted by ConservativeBaller
Lighten up, GeeBee. This was the first Sitcom ever to address these issues. Archie just SAID what people were thinking in those days, except for the weirdo hippies (I'm willing to bet, deep down some of them too.). They had to dish out a lot in the first couple/few season to keep people coming back. Archie got stereotyped and put in his place sometimes too, don't forget. And like KayEn78 said, Archie didn't kill anyone like the stupid Nazis, so don't dare compare him with them, that's disgusting.






To be a conservative: You have to believe that bigotry is normal and tolerance is weird.

Originally posted by KayEn78
I agree with Conservativeballer. The people I know who lived during the Depression and WWII years are prejudice in some way (whether it's black people, hispanic people etc). There's no way that they would ever kill anyone. Oh, one more thing...also it's hard to compare Archie to the Nazis because he fought the Nazis in WWII. He knew what they were doing was wrong. Plus, the Nazis used more "hateful" words (I won't say them here, but one starts with a k). A lot of the time, when people are prejudice they learned it from their own parents (i.e. Archie's father) and saw it in the time they grew up in. There are still good things about Archie. He loved his wife and family. And he did come home from work every day. He didn't beat his wife or "little girl." If he didn't like it at home he probably would've gotten drunk many a time at Kelseys. There's good and "bad" in every time and person.
-Kristi


I didn't say that all racists and anti-Semites, like Archie, kill people. I said that they are speaking the language of Hitler with their hate and bigotry. I also suspect that Archie's motivation for fighting the Nazis had much more to do with the attack on America than any real concern about the lives of Jewish people in another country. Yes, people do learn prejudice from their parents, but the smart ones are able to get past it. Let's face it, Archie was not supposed to be the sharpest tool in the shed. As for beatings, he gave his wife "VERBAL beatings" on almost every show. Unlike other TV wives such as Alice Kramden, Edith Bunker was not able to stand up for herself, which made Archie more of a bully than anything else.

Mind you, all of these things describe the "early Archie". His character practically became another person on the later seasons. The Archie of later years still had many vices. He forged Edith's name, he kissed another woman, and he was still enough of a bigot to attract hate groups. But, the later Archie had redeeming qualities that the earlier Archie never had like shame, vulnerability, and a conscience.

I stand behind my original statement. The early version of Archie Bunker was a hateful racist and anti-Semite. People who make a hero out of him miss the whole point of the show

That's very true, Archie was verbally abusive toward Edith in nearly every show, but she finally learned to stand up for herself later on.
-Kristi

I just realized something; 30 years later, CBS' hit show "All in the Family" is still, erm, "launching" (?) discussion like what we're doing right now. Heh, just wanted to point that out.

Originally posted by GeeBee

I stand behind my original statement. The early version of Archie Bunker was a hateful racist and anti-Semite. People who make a hero out of him miss the whole point of the show That is absolutely true. People who make a hero out of him, or say things like, "Archie just said what people were thinking in those days, except for the weirdo hippies..." missed the whole point of the show. The point of the show was that Archie, though loveable in his own way, was a foolish and ignorant man who was sure to get a laugh out of an audience by saying foolish and ignorant things every week.