What issues would everyone like to see addressed in TDVDS reunion, and is a half hour long enough?
I personally would like to know how Richie's life turned out; what he became. Also, did Laura ever persue a carreer in dancing, or anything else? Did Rob's novel ever make it to the Best Seller's List? Who moved away? Who stayed in New York/New Rochelle?
There's a lot to address for a 30 min show, as Carl said he's planning. I think it should be a Sunday Night Movie, don't you?

Steve

Originally posted by SawgrassSteve
What issues would everyone like to see addressed in TDVDS reunion, and is a half hour long enough?
I personally would like to know how Richie's life turned out; what he became. Also, did Laura ever persue a carreer in dancing, or anything else? Did Rob's novel ever make it to the Best Seller's List? Who moved away? Who stayed in New York/New Rochelle?
There's a lot to address for a 30 min show, as Carl said he's planning. I think it should be a Sunday Night Movie, don't you?

Steve

As usual, Steve, you and I agree.

I've been thinking about this some myself. If Carl were to go the more traditional reunion-movie route, I'd like to see the Petries renew their vows. It would give him a perfect excuse to bring everyone back together, even those who might have moved away. Also, I think some mention should be made of Buddy's, Mel's and Jerry's deaths. I wouldn't think Carl would just expect us to forget they ever existed.

Kristen

I agree with Kristen!! And the renewing Robs & Lauras wedding vowes would be cute!

Originally posted by Kristen
I'd like to see the Petries renew their vows.
Kristen,
You're a genius! That would be the perfect plot for a reunion movie. Everyone coming together (in spight of comical mishaps, of course) to see the perfect couple renew their vows.
You've GOT to send that in to Carl. You can't keep gold like that to yourself!

Steve

Originally posted by SawgrassSteve

Kristen,
You're a genius! That would be the perfect plot for a reunion movie. Everyone coming together (in spight of comical mishaps, of course) to see the perfect couple renew their vows.
You've GOT to send that in to Carl. You can't keep gold like that to yourself!

Steve

:blush: I doubt a guy like Carl would want to hear from me, but thank you for the compliment.

BTW, do we know what year they got married originally? (Meaning the Camp Crowder wedding, not the one in upstate NY LOL)

Kristen

I was thinking about this today and hoping that when they do the reunion, they don't use today's brand of humor, by that I mean the vulgar bathroom humor, bad language and sexual innuendo. I don't want to hear any belching or farting coming from Rob and Laura. I hope they stay true to the original style of creative humor without vulgarity. I tell my children all the time, that back in the early days of TV, writers were creative and FUNNY without resorting to such vulgarity because they were not allowed to be gross back then. Now it's anything goes and I hope they don't ruin a reunion show with that type of humor. I want to feel comfortable letting my entire family watch this show and feel comfortable that it will be appropriate for children.
I think one of the reasons so many of us are still such ardent fans of this show is because it displays creativity and talent whereas so many of today's show go for the cheap humor. Does any one else feel this way?
Lolac :)

Originally posted by Lolac
I was thinking about this today and hoping that when they do the reunion, they don't use today's brand of humor, by that I mean the vulgar bathroom humor, bad language and sexual innuendo. I don't want to hear any belching or farting coming from Rob and Laura. I hope they stay true to the original style of creative humor without vulgarity. I tell my children all the time, that back in the early days of TV, writers were creative and FUNNY without resorting to such vulgarity because they were not allowed to be gross back then. Now it's anything goes and I hope they don't ruin a reunion show with that type of humor. I want to feel comfortable letting my entire family watch this show and feel comfortable that it will be appropriate for children.
I think one of the reasons so many of us are still such ardent fans of this show is because it displays creativity and talent whereas so many of today's show go for the cheap humor. Does any one else feel this way?
Lolac :)

Lolac,
You're absolutely right, but you have to remember Carl's the one writing this. I think we can trust him not to cheapen it. Nobody knows the characters of Rob, Laura, etc. better than he does. That's just how I look at it.

Kristen

I think the idea of them renewing their vows is quite nice. I'm not sure if there should be a reunion show but I'd sure be watching. And
I have faith in Carl Reiner, but doubt it'll happen. But I sorta
would like to see things tied up.
But a half hour is too short and
I think a two hour TV movie is too long. Besides, no two hour reunion
movie of a sitcom has ever really
worked. It just becomes a different
animal. It's now a movie. There's
no laugh track or studio audience.
It doesn't look or feel the same.
And when it fails you wish they
had never done it (or that you
wanted them to). And yet, I'd still
do it I guess. But I'd rather see
it as a one hour special done in front of an audience. It would seem
more like the old show, and if it
turned out badly it wouldn't turn
up forever to remind us of the mistake. And, if it's good, it ends
up on a DVD or fans would have
a copy. But, the thing is age.
Rose looks too old and sick to
be funny. And yet age is why I'd
now like to see it. To somehow see
Rob and Laura tie it all up and
say it was all worth it. To somehow
confront the age thing and yet be
funny too. I remember a few years
ago Carl was going in for a heart
operation and said he didn't think
it was gonna be the end for him,
but if it was, he'd had a wonderful
life. I thought that was a great
sentiment. Ya know, I somehow wish
that thought for Rob and Laura...

I agree with you on the age thing. I feel so sad when I see Rose Marie. She truly has not aged well, through no fault of her own. I remember seeing a clip from a situation comedy that she and Morey Amsterdam had a cameo part in (Caroline in the City, I think it was called) and both she and Morey looked really rough. I almost tend to agree with the posts on the other thread that I want to remember them the way they were and not see them as they are now. Dick and Mary have aged well, however. I don't know. It is a little confusing. I will always love The Dick Van Dyke Show. Lolac :confused:

Originally posted by Lolac
I was thinking about this today and hoping that when they do the reunion, they don't use today's brand of humor, by that I mean the vulgar bathroom humor, bad language and sexual innuendo. I don't want to hear any belching or farting coming from Rob and Laura. I hope they stay true to the original style of creative humor without vulgarity. I tell my children all the time, that back in the early days of TV, writers were creative and FUNNY without resorting to such vulgarity because they were not allowed to be gross back then. Now it's anything goes and I hope they don't ruin a reunion show with that type of humor. I want to feel comfortable letting my entire family watch this show and feel comfortable that it will be appropriate for children.
I think one of the reasons so many of us are still such ardent fans of this show is because it displays creativity and talent whereas so many of today's show go for the cheap humor. Does any one else feel this way?
Lolac :)

Lolac,

I really doubt there is anyone on any of these boards that is MORE morally conservative than I am (notice I said "more", not equal to). I am in 100% agreement with you. I love the older shows for that exact reason - they can be funny without resorting to potty humor or things I find morally repugnant.

Hey, one of the main reasons I switched over to DirectTV about 4 years ago was because I wanted to get TVLand and Boomerang. I won't even let my kids watch modern cartoons, much less modern comedies. There has been a steady decline in this area over the last 30 years or so. I just don't watch anything that airs today because I know at some point they are gonna get into some form of T & A or resort to potty humor.

Hopefully, Carl Reiner will keep the "spirit" of any reunion in the era of the early 60's, not the early 2000's.

B&W "it's not that I like black & white shows better for reasons of aestheticism, but because of the much better morality and quality" O.

I agree with you on the age thing. I feel so sad when I see Rose Marie. She truly has not aged well, through no fault of her own.

Yabbut, we have to remember Rose Marie will be 80 this year. She and the late, great Morey Amsterdam were much older than Dick and Mary. Heck, Morey was already in his 50's when the show began. So all things considered, the fact that she merely looks her age doesn't imply (to me) that she is ill. Most septegenarians would be lucky to look as good and be as mentally sharp as Rose Marie.

I know, Sitcom Sally. I wasn't ragging on her. It just makes me sad, that's all. She is the same age as my mother, who is in a lot better shape, thankfully. I know it won't be long before it's me that people will be saying, "She didn't age well" about. It's still hard to see. I mujst look on the bright side. She will always be 38 years old as long as there are reruns! Not all of us can say that!! :talk: Lolac

:) Oh, no Lolac, I didn't think you were ragging on RM. It's also hard for me to reconcile these people I see in their "youthful" prime every day on TV with the hard reality of their appearances 40+ years later. I guess I was trying to remind myself as much as anyone else that time waits for no one.

Which is why I couldn't get into the Mary and Rhoda reunion movie. Not that it was awful, because as those things go, it wasn't. It just broke the illusion, is all.

I agree, Sitcom Sally. I understand your feelings completely and you said it better than I did!! Lolac :wave:

Originally posted by B&W fan


Lolac,

I really doubt there is anyone on any of these boards that is MORE morally conservative than I am (notice I said "more", not equal to)... I just don't watch anything that airs today because I know at some point they are gonna get into some form of T & A or resort to potty humor.

I understand and agree, B&W Fan! I don't think there is any such thing as a conservative sitcom.
Although I personally, identify as a liberal politically, I do consider myself socially conservative, which is probably why I too have a tough time with modern music and TV content. Don't you just wish there was a channel for all of that stuff in one place, so you could more easily avoid it? They could call it "The Anything Goes Channel," or simply, "Sleeze TV," or something. The same for radio. Put all of that stuff on one station in every town. Call it "The Audio Porn/Pro Drugs/Self-Destructive Behavior Station," and be done with it!
Say whatever you like about the Adult Film Industry, but they go out of their way to make sure minors don't have access to their brand of entertainment.
That being said, and I know this is TDVDS board guys, but you might want to give American Dreams (http://nbc.com/American_Dreams/) a look-see on Sunday nights. It's 1st Class (and I do mean class) television, unlike anything else out there now. There's a reason why TV Land gave them the "New Classic" award.

Steve

Originally posted by SawgrassSteve


I understand and agree, B&W Fan! I don't think there is any such thing as a conservative sitcom.
Although I personally, identify as a liberal politically, I do consider myself socially conservative, which is probably why I too have a tough time with modern music and TV content. Don't you just wish there was a channel for all of that stuff in one place, so you could more easily avoid it? They could call it "The Anything Goes Channel," or simply, "Sleeze TV," or something. The same for radio. Put all of that stuff on one station in every town. Call it "The Audio Porn/Pro Drugs/Self-Destructive Behavior Station," and be done with it!
Say whatever you like about the Adult Film Industry, but they go out of their way to make sure minors don't have access to their brand of entertainment.
That being said, and I know this is TDVDS board guys, but you might want to give American Dreams (http://nbc.com/American_Dreams/) a look-see on Sunday nights. It's 1st Class (and I do mean class) television, unlike anything else out there now. There's a reason why TV Land gave them the "New Classic" award.

Steve

Thanks Steve. I figured we'd agree on that (since we come down on the same side on many things).

I haven't seen "American Dreams" yet. I won't promise anything, but if I get a chance, I'll check it out. To be honest, my time is quite limited and I tend to only watch those shows I KNOW I'll like, hence my love for the older stuff.

Take care,

B&W "boy I wish we could get a definite release date on the DVD set from Doug - I'm getting real fidgety" fan

I hope in the reunion that it would show Rob and Laura doing a song and dance together. My opinion Dick Van Dyke and Mary Tyler Moore were like the Fred Aistaire and Ginger Rogers of situation comedy when it came to their song and dance numbers. To me that was the highlight of the show.

Originally posted by mstewart
I hope in the reunion that it would show Rob and Laura doing a song and dance together. My opinion Dick Van Dyke and Mary Tyler Moore were like the Fred Aistaire and Ginger Rogers of situation comedy when it came to their song and dance numbers. To me that was the highlight of the show.

I don't think Mary can dance anymore, due to her diabetes. Perhaps they could sing (I don't know if she still has her voice or not), but I would love to hear some Mountain Greenery or something else fun.

I just hope it's better than the Mary and Rhoda reunion. Phew!:thumbsdow

Originally posted by mstewart
I hope in the reunion that it would show Rob and Laura doing a song and dance together. My opinion Dick Van Dyke and Mary Tyler Moore were like the Fred Aistaire and Ginger Rogers of situation comedy when it came to their song and dance numbers. To me that was the highlight of the show.

I agree. I wouldn't be surprised if they've already talked about doing that. It would be great to see them sing and dance together. Perhaps to "You, Wonderful You" again.

Kristen

Lolac & co.,
I think it's a pretty safe bet that any "Dick Van Dyke Show" revisitation written by Carl Reiner will NOT hinge on . . .

. . . who is the real father of So-and So's baby . . .

. . . who is sleeping with whom . . .

. . . which character is secretly gay . . . .


etc., etc. etc.

There's a very interesting theory I've read, put forth by Yvonne Craig, who used to play Batgirl on the "Batman" TV series of the 1960s. She feels that the writers of the classic television shows of the '50s & '60s grew up actually experiencing life, and listening to the radio. Today's writers, on the other hand, grew up sitting in front of a TV set. Without even realzing it, they became accustomed to TV directors, costume designers, set decorators, etc. doing all of their imagining for them.

The result: a breed of writers today who were trained for years to be less imaginative than the ones we had years ago.

I'm not sure about that, but it certainly does make sense to me.
And, with Carl Reiner being from that "old school," so to speak, it stands to reason that we should expect something from him, which is of a higher quality than the sitcoms that are currently on the air.
Earlier, someone mentioned the show "American Dreams." I'm just about the farthest thing from an expert on that topic. It seems to me, though, that while that is a very high quality piece of work, it doesn't have the innocence of early 1960s' television. The one episode I saw centered around a young couple's physical involvement, racial prejudice, and a wife's inability to communicate to her husband an incident involving herself and another man. Great show, though.

Anyway, I like the idea of a Petrie renewal of marriage vows as a basis for a cast reunion. The funeral of one of the departed characters -- Buddy, Jerry or Mel -- may be a good possibilty, also . . . although that might set too depressing a tone for the rest of the show/special/movie (whatever it's going to be). I think there needs to be at least *some* serious moments in the production somewhere, though.

My "Challenge", if I can call it that, to Carl Reiner is this:

Create a show, here in 2003, that has zero curse words in it; has zero potty humor in it; has zero sex jokes in it!

Someone is thinking about right now, "Wait a minute! If none of those things are in the show, he won't get past the first 30 seconds." I disagree completely. If those horrible qualities are not in the show, he'll simply re-create what he had 40 years ago - the best sitcom ever!

B&W "I absolutely do NOT want to hear Rob or Laura saying four letter words!!!" fan

Originally posted by B&W fan
My "Challenge", if I can call it that, to Carl Reiner is this:

Create a show, here in 2003, that has zero curse words in it; has zero potty humor in it; has zero sex jokes in it!

Someone is thinking about right now, "Wait a minute! If none of those things are in the show, he won't get past the first 30 seconds." I disagree completely. If those horrible qualities are not in the show, he'll simply re-create what he had 40 years ago - the best sitcom ever!

B&W "I absolutely do NOT want to hear Rob or Laura saying four letter words!!!" fan

Amen, B&W Fan!!! I had to turn off "The Gin Game" last night. I couldn't handle that awful language coming out of Dick Van Dyke's mouth. I didn't think it would bother me, but it really did. I turned, instead, to a really lame movie on CBS called "Remembering Lucy." All in all, a disappointing evening for classic TV. Lolac :(

B&W,
I've had a chance to think about this some more since my earlier reply, and I've gotta say: That's one whopper of a challenge you'e making, even to Carl Reiner! I don't know if it's possible. After all, we're living in a completely different world from the one in which Rob, Laura and their friends lived in 1963. Even today's so-called "nice, family shows" like "7th Heaven" have plotlines dealing with whether or not the daughter is pregnant.

Another complication is -- television in the early 1960s often wasn't a true reflection of what real life was like at the time, anyway. The world wasn't necessarily as nice and clean then as it appeared on TV. It wasn't *quite* as wholesome a world then as today's young people are led to believe it was. The language some members of my family used and some of the things we talked about in the privacy of our homes -- even then -- could not be found on TV until *decades* later. So, you've got the double dilemma of the world having grown up and the television gudelines having changed so drastically on top of that.

So unfortunately, I think the chances of us seeing a show in 2003 possessing all the qualities of innocence of a 1963 show are about as likely as us seeing an elderly Rob Petrie visiting his balding, middle-aged son Ritchie, and Ritchie eagerly hollering, "Hi, Daddy! Did you bring me anything??"

By the way, "The Gin Game"'s Weller Martin and Fonsia Dorsey are about as far removed from Rob & Laura Petrie as you can find anywhere -- a true testament to the enormous talents of Dick and Mary. They each did an outstanding job in the play. Obscenity, however, is in the eye (and ear) of the beholder. What offends one person may not necessarily offend the next. That's one reason it's a good thing our televisions . . . and radios . . . come with all the buttons they do.

Originally posted by Artfiore1

Another complication is -- television in the early 1960s often wasn't a true reflection of what real life was like at the time, anyway. . . .


Who ever said television ever had anything to do with reality?! Even the "reality shows" on TV today have nothing do do with real life! I don't watch The Dick Van Dyke Show because it reflects reality either then or now. I watch it because it is clean, wholesome and creative entertainment. The situations presented are close enough to real life to make them familiar to us and therefore funny, but no one expects real life from a situation comedy. I agree with B&W fan. I do NOT want to hear vulgarity, profanity and filth coming out of the mouths of Rob and Laura Petrie! Long live the Standard and Practices! Lolac

:rant:

Lolac,
Any work of general fiction created on this planet and about life on this planet *has* to be based, at least to some degree, on real life. But you're right.

I think this is probably the only period of my entire life during which I can truthfully say I don't have a favorite TV show . . . or even a few I like. That's why, at least 90% of the time, probably more, my TV is set on TVLand -- to escape the realities of today, in more ways than one.

Since the subject has already been brought up, I'll take the opportunity to offer my two cents about the play. I know I may be in the minority here, but I enjoyed last night. Yes, of course, it was shocking to hear Dick talking like that. But as he and Mary said on Larry King, it wasn't really him saying it. It was the character. One thing it did was make me appreciate Rob and Laura that much more, and the decent people they are. Also it made me want a DVD show reunion more (If that were even possible!!).

That's my 2 cents on "Gin Game."

Kristen

I loved hearing Dick swear. I don't know, I just like hearing older people curse. *shrug* That's just me. I also have a cat.

Kristen,
I agree with you, of course.
You folks keep referring to all the swearing *Dick* did in the play. Remember -- almost every single off color word he said was later repeated by Mary, too . . . including the BIG one (and I don't mean "flurk.")

He made an excellent miserable, foul-mouthed, grumpy old man. And, she made a wonderful uptight, troubled, sad and lonely old woman. And, they did dance a little together. Sure, it wasn't Rob & Laura on stage at Camp Crowder. But I think at least they danced as well as two elderly nursing home residents (one of whom walks with a cane) can be expected to dance.

Lolac, Artfiore1 and B&WFan,
Believe me, I'm not trying to poke fun at your beliefs. I too appreciate the clean wholesomeness of our show, but I must ask you both a question:
Does the mature subject matter of TDVDS ever offend you? I'm asking because you three seem to not prefer it in your entertainment (which is fine).
Personally, mature themes don't offend me per se, but depending on how it's presented, it could be offensive. It's the difference between today's Hip-Hop, and 70s' Soft Rock. Same theme (sex and drugs), but different presentation.
For example, here's a copy & paste from Artfiore1's post on this thread about "American Dreams:"
"The one episode I saw centered around a young couple's physical involvement, racial prejudice, and a wife's inability to communicate to her husband an incident involving herself and another man. Great show, though."
That's true, but they deal with those very relevant themes with total class and elegance.
Here's how some DVDS themes could be described:
"There are episodes with a wife beater, an alcoholic, a kid who curses at school, married people kissing their friends and neighbors, teens who have crushes on adults, people trying to tempt married people into an affair, a husband who tests his wife to see if she'll cheat on him, a wife who dresses so sexy, the shows sponsors had to intervene, a wife who spends half an episode naked and in the tub, a woman who lives a man and has his child before they get married, etc."
We all know, however that those episodes were written cleanly, and comically, but seeing your posts, I'm just curious. When it comes to today's shows, does it matter how the subject is handeled, or is it just the theme that offends you? No offense meant.

Steve

Steve,
Very clever reply! Your phrasing of the "Van Dyke Show" situations reminded me of the movie summary which reportedly had appeared a few years back in a California newspaper TV section: "Transported to a surreal landscape, a young girl kills the first woman she encounters, then teams with three complete strangers to kill again." The movie: "The Wizard Of Oz."

But seriously, I think you've got me all wrong. My saying there's nothing on TV today that I like doesn't mean I'm "offended" by what's on -- there is just never a time anymore when I'm saying, "My show is on tonight. Can't wait 'til eight o'clock!" -- like it seems I used to. By mentioning my TV is tuned most of the time to TVLand "to escape the realities of today, in more ways than one," I mean both a) avoidance of the "reality" shows of today, which don't interest me at all and b) that, to put it bluntly, life sucks for me right now, and I'd rather spend my TV time in a simpler era.


As for "American Dreams," all I meant was that while those situations, no doubt, were realities in the early 1960s, over all, they *weren't* on TV comedy at the time. Be honest, now -- can you imagine an episode in which Wally Cleaver comes home and tells Ward that Mary Ellen Rogers was upset about the number of girls he'd been to "second base" with before her . . . or that a black kid had been denied entry into a future astronauts club? References to the fact that girls even *had* second bases were rarely made in those days (if ever). And, remember the network uproar when the parents of the baby, whom Rob Petrie suspected may have been given to him and Laura by mistake at the hospital turned out to be *black*! (GASP!) For some reason, they thought black viewers might be upset by the joke. (??)


Regarding the "Van Dyke Show" situations you mentioned: What could possibly be offensive about an episode in which a woman is naked and in a bathtub *OFF CAMERA*, or an episode in which a kid curses at school, when the viewer isn't given the slightest hint, in Laura's recounting of the event via telephone, what the "bad" word was. Married people kissing their friends and neighbors was simply in keeping with the recurring theme of jealousy which ran through so much of that series. A teen having an innocent crush on an adult is a natural, normal thing which has probably happened to most of us. These, like the other DVD situations you mentioned were not the least bit offensive.
Had they been done today, the person whom Laura had to kiss in the Cleopatra play quite possibly could have been another woman . . . we would have heard Ritchie actually say the "bad" word at school . . . the teen would have sneaked into the Petrie bedroom, stolen a pair of Laura's pantIes and brought them home with him . . . the camera would have been right there in the bathtub with Laura . . . etc., etc. I think you get the drift. But, you know what -- not a single one of those things would offend me.

I can't tell you the last time I was "offended" by something I saw or heard on television -- years ago or today. To be perfectly honest with you, I'm not sure I've even been offended by anything *ever*. . . except maybe your reply. (Only kidding.)

Art! My hat's off to you! What a great way to summarize the situation!

Steve, there's no question that things have changed tremendously over the course of the last 40 years in TV. I don't want to get into everything I know about censorship and the gradual decaying of morals in movies and tv, but there were a couple of events in the mid to late 60's, in Hollywood, that changed everything. This seemed to coincide with the move from black & white to color with most tv shows, and therefore it is most noticable during that transition. Thus my siggy referring to me as "B&W fan".

Art's description of "Wizard of Oz" hit the nail on the head. I think you protest a bit too much, or reach a bit too far, in your attempt to tell us TDVDS dealt with "mature" themes and actually pushed the envelope. It did no such thing. It was a clean show - just like the other sitcoms of its time.

Overall, I was thinking the same thing Lolac was when I was reading some of the responses in this thread talking about "reality" now and "reality then.

I don't care if folks did indeed curse and talk sex and everything else in the early 60's. The fact is TV is entertainment (in fact when it gets too big for its own britches and thinks its more than entertainment is when guys like Norman Lear start going crazy with PC lessons). I don't tune in to be shocked into reality. I hear enough cursing thruout the day in the marketplace of real life. I see enough sensuality just in the news ads and commercials on tv. If I want to get upset at the "condition" of soceity I can tune into O'Reilly or Hannity and Colmes and get a doze of all that.

BUT, when I tune into TV I want to "escape" all those things and be "entertained." And, IMHO, I don't need all the things we've mentioned to entertain me.

One need not go so far the other way with "milk & cookies" dialog, or "mommy & daddy" dialog to avoid the challenge I issued to Carl Reiner ealier. Let's give the man more credit than that. A block against cursing, sex talk, and potty humor surely doesn't mean we've exhuasted all our talent to entertain. If so, we are in far worse shape than I ever thought. It can be done today. It's just a matter of choosing to do it.

B&W "interesting discussion" fan

P.S. I didn't watch the "Gin Game." After seeing the Larry King interview, I knew it wasn't for me. Unlike others, I don't think old folks cursing is funny. I've never understood that mindset.

Artfiore1,
That response was clever, funny, concise, sarcastic, and informative!
Thanks.

Steve

B&W fan,
Thanks a million for the nod! That's a pretty impressive reply you put up, yourself. Well-done!

==============================================

Steve,
I appreciate all the other adjectives, but I never meant to be "sarcastic." Sorry.

Originally posted by Artfiore1
Steve,
Very clever reply! Your phrasing of the "Van Dyke Show" situations reminded me of the movie summary which reportedly had appeared a few years back in a California newspaper TV section: "Transported to a surreal landscape, a young girl kills the first woman she encounters, then teams with three complete strangers to kill again." The movie: "The Wizard Of Oz."

But seriously, I think you've got me all wrong. My saying there's nothing on TV today that I like doesn't mean I'm "offended" by what's on -- there is just never a time anymore when I'm saying, "My show is on tonight. Can't wait 'til eight o'clock!" -- like it seems I used to. By mentioning my TV is tuned most of the time to TVLand "to escape the realities of today, in more ways than one," I mean both a) avoidance of the "reality" shows of today, which don't interest me at all and b) that, to put it bluntly, life sucks for me right now, and I'd rather spend my TV time in a simpler era.


As for "American Dreams," all I meant was that while those situations, no doubt, were realities in the early 1960s, over all, they *weren't* on TV comedy at the time. Be honest, now -- can you imagine an episode in which Wally Cleaver comes home and tells Ward that Mary Ellen Rogers was upset about the number of girls he'd been to "second base" with before her . . . or that a black kid had been denied entry into a future astronauts club? References to the fact that girls even *had* second bases were rarely made in those days (if ever). And, remember the network uproar when the parents of the baby, whom Rob Petrie suspected may have been given to him and Laura by mistake at the hospital turned out to be *black*! (GASP!) For some reason, they thought black viewers might be upset by the joke. (??)


Regarding the "Van Dyke Show" situations you mentioned: What could possibly be offensive about an episode in which a woman is naked and in a bathtub *OFF CAMERA*, or an episode in which a kid curses at school, when the viewer isn't given the slightest hint, in Laura's recounting of the event via telephone, what the "bad" word was. Married people kissing their friends and neighbors was simply in keeping with the recurring theme of jealousy which ran through so much of that series. A teen having an innocent crush on an adult is a natural, normal thing which has probably happened to most of us. These, like the other DVD situations you mentioned were not the least bit offensive.
Had they been done today, the person whom Laura had to kiss in the Cleopatra play quite possibly could have been another woman . . . we would have heard Ritchie actually say the "bad" word at school . . . the teen would have sneaked into the Petrie bedroom, stolen a pair of Laura's pantIes and brought them home with him . . . the camera would have been right there in the bathtub with Laura . . . etc., etc. I think you get the drift. But, you know what -- not a single one of those things would offend me.

I can't tell you the last time I was "offended" by something I saw or heard on television -- years ago or today. To be perfectly honest with you, I'm not sure I've even been offended by anything *ever*. . . except maybe your reply. (Only kidding.)


I agree completely with Artfiore1. I am not offended by the themes, I just think there are tasteful ways to present them as The Dick Van Dyke Show does. As an aside, in which episode of TDVDS did someone have a baby before they were married? You aren't thinking of the episode where Rob and Laura get remarried because she lied about her age on her marriage license, are you? I think that is a bit of a stretch! :) Seriously, though, life does not offend me. Crudity and vulgarity do. That's all. Lolac

Originally posted by Lolac



You aren't thinking of the episode where Rob and Laura get remarried because she lied about her age on her marriage license, are you? I think that is a bit of a stretch! Lolac

Yes, Lolac, I was! That was my point, actually. Someone (Not you) could point out plots and themes in TV shows, music, movies, etc in just that way, because it's contrary to their sensibilities on the subject. It would behoove the individual to see for themselves whether or not someone's description is accurate. That is, unless certain subject matter can never be broached, in your opinion; which was the basis of my question.
Artfiore1, I didn't mean sarcasm as a bad thing, and indeed may have used the wrong word altogether. I liked your response.

Steve

Steve,
I thank you.

And so does our Queen.

Originally posted by SawgrassSteve
What issues would everyone like to see addressed in TDVDS reunion, and is a half hour long enough?http://www.angelfire.com/ny/nyuk/images/kinkydvd.jpg

:grineyes: - What was the real reason for being content in sleeping in separate beds.

Originally posted by SawgrassSteve


That is, unless certain subject matter can never be broached, in your opinion; which was the basis of my question.

Steve

I don't believe there is any subject matter that can never be broached, but I believe with all of my heart that there are tasteful ways to do it. Case in point: when the movie Philadelphia came out several years ago, I decided I would not go see it because it dealt with homosexuality. I didn't want to be subjected to all manner of graphic homosexual material. When Tom Hanks (my favorite contemporary actor) won the Oscar for Best Actor for that movie, I decided to put my sensibilities in a suit of armour and rent it at the video store. That way, I could turn it off if it got too bad. I was very pleasantly surprised that, although the theme of the movie was the prejudice that gay men with AIDS were experiencing, it was tastefully and powerfully portrayed. I was not offended at all.
The television and movie industry can portray all manner of social problems on the screen without subjecting it's audience to the basest forms of expression. But they choose instead to bombard us with the lowest forms of entertainment in order to make a dollar.
The reason I watch TV Land and classic TV is because the shows are creative and the writers were talented and they addressed all manner of issues in a tasteful way. The Dick Van Dyke show talks about gays in 3 different episodes, which I mentioned in a post on another thread but it was so cleverly done that you almost miss the reference if you weren't paying attention! And they are funny!!
So please, don't ruin Rob and Laura Petrie for me! If Carl Reiner wants to bring them down to today's entertainment standards, then I most likely will not watch a TDVDS reunion show. Lolac :bighug:

Originally posted by Lolac


So please, don't ruin Rob and Laura Petrie for me! If Carl Reiner wants to bring them down to today's entertainment standards, then I most likely will not watch a TDVDS reunion show. Lolac :bighug:

On that we also agree, Lolac. I don't want to see any surprise twists to the characters. Don't tell us Sally was a closet lesbian and is coming out (saw that on on "Mad TV"), or that Rob has a gambling problem but is getting help, or that Jerry died of scirrosis of the liver from drinking, or that Laura and Milli once shared a kiss, or that Richie spent a year and a half in juvie, or... well, you get the point.
give us the clean, funny, happy Petries and friends, PLEASE!

Steve

Originally posted by SawgrassSteve


On that we also agree, Lolac. I don't want to see any surprise twists to the characters. Don't tell us Sally was a closet lesbian and is coming out (saw that on on "Mad TV"), or that Rob has a gambling problem but is getting help, or that Jerry died of scirrosis of the liver from drinking, or that Laura and Milli once shared a kiss, or that Richie spent a year and a half in juvie, or... well, you get the point.
give us the clean, funny, happy Petries and friends, PLEASE!

Steve


:thanks: Thanks, Steve! Lolac (aka Millie Helper on "Petries and Friends" board!)

Originally posted by Lolac



:thanks: Thanks, Steve! Lolac (aka Millie Helper on "Petries and Friends" board!)

You're Millie? I'm Laura...LOL I had no idea that was you!

Kristen

Hey Steve,
I just thought of a couple of other rather unsavory (for lack of a better word) "Van Dyke Show" situations that could have been included in your earlier reply: A man, his wife and his co-workers breaking into and entering his boss' office in the middle of the night to steal something . . .

. . . and a wife posing for a nude portrait.

How are those for inaccurate descriptions which are contrary to one's sensibities on the subjects?

Originally posted by Kristen


You're Millie? I'm Laura...LOL I had no idea that was you!

Kristen

I'm Millie!!! I love Millie. I thought she was one of the great unsung characters of that show. She was so funny. I loved it in "The Empress Carlotta's Necklace" when she tells Laura to wear it "to a bad neighborhood. Maybe you'll get held up by a thief with bad taste." Or how she calls Jerry "Dumbo" or one of my all time favorites, when she and Laura spend a night alone in the house while everyone else is on a camping trip. She's hilarious! Lolac


:stooges:

That's a good one, Artfiore1! In fact, I think that would make a good new thread for this board to see how many of those we can come up with!
Hey, Lolac!
I didn't know you were Millie on Yahoo! I'm Rob!

Steve

Boy, have I missed a lot in the last month! So many worthy comments in this thread that I scarcely know where to begin!

1. You can't put the genie back in the bottle:
Once viewers are accustomed to a "tell it like it is" attitude in TV shows (especially sitcoms), airing a sanitized version would be a hard-sell. I think it would be easier to sell a show that bears absolutely NO resemblance to reality than something that may be perceived as a sugar-coated version of life.

* NOTE: I can't get excited over any current TV show either. I mostly watch TVLand, Cartoon Network, Sci-Fi Channel or (true) non-fiction programming.

2. There's no substitute for quality:
Regardless of personal preference, quality shows are defined by memorable characters and acting/writing that's consistently above-par.

Otherwise all I can add is, "NO TDVDS REMAKE/SEQUEL!" I prefer not to taint my memories of the show and its characters. Reunite the actors, NOT the characters.

TVgen62
Quite well said. You are very wise.

Originally posted by Artfiore1
TVgen62
Quite well said. You are very wise.

Thank you for the kind words. Everyone else made such insightful (and varied) comments, that I didn't want to disappoint anyone. Also, I didn't want to look like a(n) [INSERT POST-60s TV PROFANITY HERE]!

Originally posted by Artfiore1
Steve,
Regarding the "Van Dyke Show" situations you mentioned: What could possibly be offensive about an episode in which a woman is naked and in a bathtub *OFF CAMERA*...


Mary appeared "naked" ON camera in a sudsy bathtub in the final season MTM ep "Mary's Insomnia", so by the 70's all the mystery was gone. That ep, though, did have a hilarious moment when Lou, Murray, and Ted have all joined her in the bathroom. Ted drops his reading glasses into the tub, reaches down for them, only to stop when Mary says slowly and angrily "Don't...You...Dare!!!". :)

Originally posted by jehobden


Mary appeared "naked" ON camera in a sudsy bathtub in the final season MTM ep "Mary's Insomnia", so by the 70's all the mystery was gone. That ep, though, did have a hilarious moment when Lou, Murray, and Ted have all joined her in the bathroom. Ted drops his reading glasses into the tub, reaches down for them, only to stop when Mary says slowly and angrily "Don't...You...Dare!!!". :)

I know this is off-topic for this board, but I just have to say that that is my all time favorite scene from the MTM show! :D

Kristen