Which is more important in your life..., if any even are...?

Aren't they both basically the same thing?

Personally, religion is important in my life. I believe in God and that Jesus is our Savior. I believe there is a better life waiting for us up in Heaven.

Originally posted by WingsFan
I believe there is a better life waiting for us up in Heaven.



Ya with no hatred and killing.

I dunno. I have morals because of my religion and what I was taught, but even if I was atheist, Id still have morals.

Oh I have morals alright, I don't have religion though...I'm an athiest.

I like my religion, but the people at my church here are like the biggest bunch of asholes ever. Nothing but a bunch of two faced hypocrits. My old church in Chicago was much better compared to here. Ya know why? Cause they actually acted like they cared anywhere. They didn't act all snobby or 'holier than thou' ou of church just to make you feel bad. They took the time to show you who they were. People here act so nice to you in church, then outside of church, make up so many rumors and other bull about you, it's unbelievable. And it's not the teens, it's the adults! Ridiculous!

Personally, I used to believe in nothing, Like I never cared, but when 2 of my best friend were killed, I believe that there is now something, cuz In my heart and mind, and I am wanting to believe that they are in a better place and having fun where they are. It keeps me sane. Just hoping they are somewhere doing the things that they love carefree.....

I believe in God and that Jesus Christ is our lord and Savior. I believe in Heaven and I can't wait to get there to see all of my family again,but until then I will just keep enjoying life as it comes and deal the good and bad that comes my way, also we wouldn't have to worry about being sick or hurt again plus there will not be any killing or hatred,just love and peace and everybody will get along like one big happy family. I love our church it has the nicest people you could ever meet.

Originally posted by Miss Karly
Oh I have morals alright, I don't have religion though...I'm an athiest.

I agree with you.
I certainly have morals but religion is nothing to me. I've had so many people call me a "sinner" and tell me that I'm going to go to hell - and they've all told me that in the name of Christianity!!!!! What the hell happened to loving thy neighbour and accepting everyone for who they are?????? Organised religion scares the $h!t out of me.
I wouldn't actually call myself an athiest though. I do believe that there is something out there controlling things. I don't call it 'God' though - it's definately not some big beardy guy sitting on a cloud. To me it's Mother Nature that controls things - what makes the wind blow and the sun shine and all that stuff.
I also belive in fate, but only to a certain extent. I think fate exists and if you are meant to be in a certain situation then fate will put you there but once you're in that situation it's up to you to make it work to the best of your abilities. I've screwed-up on a couple of occasions - fate has put me in an excellent situation and I've just wasted it. I'll make the most of it in future and I urge all of you to do the same.

well, my religion dictates most of my morals... but I suppose morals are more important because without them you'd have trouble with the other.

Originally posted by WingsFan
Aren't they both basically the same thing?

Personally, religion is important in my life. I believe in God and that Jesus is our Savior. I believe there is a better life waiting for us up in Heaven. ditto to everything you said...I believe Jesus died for my sins and stuff like that but I dont have anything against anyone who doesn't believe that although i personally think they're wrong.....I hate the conservative right winged christians!! They're are soooo many of them and they're so hypocritical! But I dont let that keep me from believing....I absolutely hate hearing Republicanism preached in sermons....but I dont usually hear that cuz I go a mostly black church and everyone i think there is liberal democrat like me.......so they preach liberalism. :)

Both Religion and morality are equally important in my life.

Originally posted by Mossopp
Organised religion scares the $h!t out of me.
I wouldn't actually call myself an athiest though.

Ditto. I believe in God on my own time, thank you very much. Church to me is just an hour-long storytime that is better spent sleeping. If you don't think that way, that is perfectly fine.

But I DO have morals. My folks taught them to me, not The Bible.

I am a Christian. I believe in God and Jesus. Liek many of you have said. Being a Christian means having morals. Eeven if you do not have the ebst morals but u love Jesus and believe he died for our sins and asked him in your heart than you will go to heaven no matter what. it's as simple as that. :)

Morals? I dont have those! JK

I think that I have morals BECAUSE of my religion, so religion is definitely more important to me. I highly doubt that God would send me to hell for having sex outside of marriage, or saying his name in vain, and then asking for forgiveness...and those are some of the things I consider as morals.

I have morals and my morals consist of the laws given to Moses.

I think there is a very fine line between morals and religion, but I think that they ultimately coincide with each other. I try to live life the way God would have me live it, its not my life but His.





ks

Originally posted by Rudy and Kenny4eva
I Eeven if you do not have the ebst morals but u love Jesus and believe he died for our sins and asked him in your heart than you will go to heaven no matter what. it's as simple as that. :) Wow, what a score! So if I beat the crap outa my next door neighbor because he got mad at me for seducing his underage daughter, I'll go to heaven because I asked Jesus into my heart last Sunday? :crazy:

Originally posted by ks
I have morals and my morals consist of the laws given to Moses.

I think there is a very fine line between morals and religion, but I think that they ultimately coincide with each other. I try to live life the way God would have me live it, its not my life but His.





ks Couldnt have said it better ks!!

Originally posted by kittflynn
Wow, what a score! So if I beat the crap outa my next door neighbor because he got mad at me for seducing his underage daughter, I'll go to heaven because I asked Jesus into my heart last Sunday? :crazy: Well Id say if you were real and sincere about it you wouldn't do something like that....

Originally posted by kittflynn
Wow, what a score! So if I beat the crap outa my next door neighbor because he got mad at me for seducing his underage daughter, I'll go to heaven because I asked Jesus into my heart last Sunday? :crazy: *sigh* i didn't mean it like that. First of all, if you are a Christian why would you do that? Second fo all, if you truly accepted Christ in your heart and did beat the crap pout of your nighbor, then asked jesus for forgiveness for doing such an awful thing than yeah you'll still go to heaven.... I think you misunderstood what i was trying to say.

morality. i believe in God and all but I've never been baptized so I'm going to Hell apparently. whatever.

Originally posted by YearbookLoser
morality. i believe in God and all but I've never been baptized so I'm going to Hell apparently. whatever. well this is my opinion but if you believe then you'll go to heaven, baptism doesn't really mean anything..atleast I dont think it does.......

Originally posted by YearbookLoser
morality. i believe in God and all but I've never been baptized so I'm going to Hell apparently. whatever. uhh just because u haven't been baptized does not mean you are goling to hell. the only way you go to hell is if you do not believe in the trnty, do not believe jesus died for your sins, andhave not asked him for forgevness. Baptism is good it is following Jesus example. But it is not a requirment to get into heaven.

Originally posted by Rudy and Kenny4eva
uhh just because u haven't been baptized does not mean you are goling to hell. the only way you go to hell is if you do not believe in the trnty, do not believe jesus died for your sins, andhave not asked him for forgevness. Baptism is good it is following Jesus example. But it is not a requirment to get into heaven.

um, not really...well idk...

Originally posted by Georgia's on my Mind


well idk...

no one does.

both are very important to me :) and I love my Church

Originally posted by CaitlinMoore2002
both are very important to me :) and I love my Church

I love mine too.

Originally posted by Miss Karly
Oh I have morals alright, I don't have religion though...I'm an athiest.

But do you believe in any kind of spirituality?

Originally posted by AliciaKeysForever
Morals? I dont have those! JK

I think that I have morals BECAUSE of my religion, so religion is definitely more important to me. I highly doubt that God would send me to hell for having sex outside of marriage, or saying his name in vain, and then asking for forgiveness...and those are some of the things I consider as morals.

See, everyone reduces RELIGION down to a list of do's and don'ts
and that was the one thing that Jesus got on the Pharisees about. They made religion into something manageable and not something from the heart. "I may do a little of this, but I don't do that, I've completed my checklist for this week, and until I tidy up that little spot in my mind concerning a wee case of bitterness, I'll
be okay for Sunday school!"

I think this whole thing about religion vs. morality is so bogus.

Spirituality all the way.:clap:

If I may stick my oar in here:

Originally posted by Rudy and Kenny4eva
*sigh* i didn't mean it like that. First of all, if you are a Christian why would you do that? Second fo all, if you truly accepted Christ in your heart and did beat the crap pout of your nighbor, then asked jesus for forgiveness for doing such an awful thing than yeah you'll still go to heaven.... I think you misunderstood what i was trying to say.

You cannot ask "if you're a good christian why would you do that in the first place" because your original statement, as well as the official teaching of the Church is that you can be a non-Christian, perform all sorts of despicable acts, find Jesus, and go to heaven. Makes no difference what you were before or at the time of the despicable acts.

~*~*~*~*~*~*
As for my answer to the original question:

I am not religious so obviously morals are more important to me.

And I'm sorry to whoever said it, but it is just plain wrong to assume morals and religion are one and the same. Morals are dictated by society; namely they are dictated by those who hold power in a society. It just so happens that in America, a largely Judeo-Christian nation, many of society's morals coincide with that faith, and in fact are derived from that dogma. But why do you think those Judeo-Christian morals prevail over all others? Not because they are more right, but because most of the people whole hold the power in this country are Judeo-Christian. You may think you have gotten your morals from religion (and you may well have) but those of us without faith have basically the same morals as well.

Originally posted by Rudy and Kenny4eva
uhh just because u haven't been baptized does not mean you are goling to hell. the only way you go to hell is if you do not believe in the trnty, do not believe jesus died for your sins, andhave not asked him for forgevness. Baptism is good it is following Jesus example. But it is not a requirment to get into heaven.
Thats right. Ive never been baptized. So even though I pray, believe in God, and want to go to Heaven, Im going to Hell anyways? Uh ya... that makes no sense. Im going to Heaven because I believe in God and what he stands for and I know I make sins. I doubt hes going to turn me down because I didnt get baptized.

Originally posted by Rudy and Kenny4eva
the only way you go to hell is if you do not believe in the trnty, do not believe jesus died for your sins, andhave not asked him for forgevness.

Too bad, they kicked me out for trying to take over...
how about you? :).

Anyway- I'm gonna play the Devil's Advocate here. What if you all die, and you come to find out... there's no Heaven? No God, no Hell, and we all evolved from some now-extinct species? I hate when people say "Your going to Hell because your an Athiest" First off, most Athiests don't even believe in Hell- so there's no point of telling them they'll go to Hell. Second of all, you can't prove there is a God, or Heaven, or Hell. Just like we can't prove there is no God.

This is a debate that will last throughout time. True, we can't prove or disprove God or Heaven. The Bible says that it is all based on faith. So, you either believe or you don't. Personally, I do believe. Others don't. But, my question is why would someone call me a hypocrite and tell me I'm wasting my time believing just because they don't believe? My religion is what gives me hope and strength. My religion is what persuades me to be the best of who I am and be a friend to everyone around me. Likewise, I'm not going to preach to someone who doesn't want to hear it. It's a matter of respecting others' opinions.


I think morals and norms are different. Norms are the part of culture that dictates how we behave and act in society. Norms are like manners. They are based on being polite and considerate toward other people. Morals are things we do based of spirituality. Morals derrive from the Bible. But, that's just my take on things.

The initial question asked whether I hold morals more highly than religion, I believe. Well, to me, both are important. But, above religion is spirituality. I don't want to obsess over following rules. But, I DO want to personal relationship with God. I want to be able to know there is someone out there who still cares when no one else does. I like feeling that I'm not alone. Feeling that even though everyone else gets busy and wrapped up in their own problems, I have my God to turn to for encouragement and advice.

Originally posted by CollegeGirl
This is a debate that will last throughout time. True, we can't prove or disprove God or Heaven. The Bible says that it is all based on faith. So, you either believe or you don't. Personally, I do believe. Others don't. But, my question is why would someone call me a hypocrite and tell me I'm wasting my time believing just because they don't believe? My religion is what gives me hope and strength. My religion is what persuades me to be the best of who I am and be a friend to everyone around me. Likewise, I'm not going to preach to someone who doesn't want to hear it. It's a matter of respecting others' opinions.


I think morals and norms are different. Norms are the part of culture that dictates how we behave and act in society. Norms are like manners. They are based on being polite and considerate toward other people. Morals are things we do based of spirituality. Morals derrive from the Bible. But, that's just my take on things.

The initial question asked whether I hold morals more highly than religion, I believe. Well, to me, both are important. But, above religion is spirituality. I don't want to obsess over following rules. But, I DO want to personal relationship with God. I want to be able to know there is someone out there who still cares when no one else does. I like feeling that I'm not alone. Feeling that even though everyone else gets busy and wrapped up in their own problems, I have my God to turn to for encouragement and advice.

I totally agree. But, to answer whoever said what will happen if we all wake up and find out there is no heaven or hell? Well, I feel that my life is better following God, and I feel that he helps me. So, if my life is better by believing then if when I die I find out that I was wrong. So what, my life was better anyway.

BTW, I'd like to say I'm sorry to those people who have had bad experiences with church/religion. We (christians) are only human, not perfect, and we make mistakes just like everyone else.

Originally posted by Georgia's on my Mind


I love mine too. Mine is soo awesome its a foursquare church (have you heard of those) anyways they are TOTALLY huge and they dont buy into that whole If you smoke,drink, have sex before marriage you go to Hell CRAP that My old church believed in so much

Originally posted by CaitlinMoore2002
Mine is soo awesome its a foursquare church (have you heard of those) anyways they are TOTALLY huge and they dont buy into that whole If you smoke,drink, have sex before marriage you go to Hell CRAP that My old church believed in so much

umm....cool? yeah, i went to school at the school attached to my church and I know like everyone in the parish...And the preist is so nice so i enjoy it, it's like a family.

Originally posted by CaitlinMoore2002
Mine is soo awesome its a foursquare church (have you heard of those) anyways they are TOTALLY huge and they dont buy into that whole If you smoke,drink, have sex before marriage you go to Hell CRAP that My old church believed in so much

and no i've never heard of one of those

Originally posted by Georgia's on my Mind


and no i've never heard of one of those

Lisa Whelchel is Foursquare.

Anyways Caitlin- I'm glad to see that the people in your Church aren't big into that stuff. Most Foursquares I've met are.

When I was still 'shopping for religions' a year or so back, I looked into Foursquare. The people were HUGE (and I mean huge) into that "No R movies, no sex before marriage, no alcohol even if your 21, no smoking, no lottery, no wearing baggy jeans, no pink hair, no public schools, no swearing, no bellybuttons showing, no more than one hole in your ear, no reading Harry Potter, no watching TV 14 shows like Jerry Springer, no listening to Guns N' Roses, Black Sabbath, no one but Christian artists." Jesus Christ...I may as well die.

Originally posted by Miss Karly


Lisa Whelchel is Foursquare.

Anyways Caitlin- I'm glad to see that the people in your Church aren't big into that stuff. Most Foursquares I've met are.

When I was still 'shopping for religions' a year or so back, I looked into Foursquare. The people were HUGE (and I mean huge) into that "No R movies, no sex before marriage, no alcohol even if your 21, no smoking, no lottery, no wearing baggy jeans, no pink hair, no public schools, no swearing, no bellybuttons showing, no more than one hole in your ear, no reading Harry Potter, no watching TV 14 shows like Jerry Springer, no listening to Guns N' Roses, Black Sabbath, no one but Christian artists." Jesus Christ...I may as well die.

Really? I didn't know that... Wow, that sounds alot worse than my church..

Originally posted by Miss Karly
no lottery, no watching TV 14 shows like Jerry Springer
:faint: No LOTTO??????:eek:

I like my church, even though I dont go anymore. They werent whicked strict and everyone was really nice. I used to be part of the youth group and we used to go to Monadknock in the winter and go snowtubing and in the summer. It was really fun. Most of the people who went to church were "normal" people-- meaning they were average people and werent whicked strict like some people are. I went to school with all the kids and everyone was pretty much around here. It was a Baptist church.

If you're religious you're expected to lead a moral life. Then again you can choose not to believe in god or religion and still live a moral life. So, morality would definately come WAYYYY before religion...organized religion is bull anyway!

Originally posted by CollegeGirl
I think morals and norms are different. Norms are the part of culture that dictates how we behave and act in society. Norms are like manners. They are based on being polite and considerate toward other people. Morals are things we do based of spirituality. Morals derrive from the Bible. But, that's just my take on things.


Well the way I view it (which happens to be the way I was taught but I agree with it) is that morals are a type of "norm". There are several types of norms, and morals fall into the "mores" category. But basically they are the types of things everyone thinks of when they think of morals, such as not killing or being monogamous, or whatever...and if you violate the mores you are considered immoral.

I believe the type of norm you are referring to is a subdivion called folkways, which dictates our everyday behavior. They can change often, such as it's OK to laugh at a movie but probably not at a funeral. Mores are more stable, often never changing.

I still take opposition to the statement that "Morals are things we do based on spirituality" (and you are not the only one that has said this so this isn't aimed only at CollegeGirl) because that implies those without spirituality don't have morals. I don't deny most morals come from the Bible, as I said in my last post, but you don't have to be spiritual to have them.

Originally posted by Miss Karly
When I was still 'shopping for religions' a year or so back, I looked into Foursquare. The people were HUGE (and I mean huge) into that "No R movies, no sex before marriage, no alcohol even if your 21, no smoking, no lottery, no wearing baggy jeans, no pink hair, no public schools, no swearing, no bellybuttons showing, no more than one hole in your ear, no reading Harry Potter, no watching TV 14 shows like Jerry Springer, no listening to Guns N' Roses, Black Sabbath, no one but Christian artists." Jesus Christ...I may as well die.

Son of a...why not just lock yourself in a closet and die?

Originally posted by Bootsy Whoosh


Well the way I view it (which happens to be the way I was taught but I agree with it) is that morals are a type of "norm". There are several types of norms, and morals fall into the "mores" category. But basically they are the types of things everyone thinks of when they think of morals, such as not killing or being monogamous, or whatever...and if you violate the mores you are considered immoral.

I believe the type of norm you are referring to is a subdivion called folkways, which dictates our everyday behavior. They can change often, such as it's OK to laugh at a movie but probably not at a funeral. Mores are more stable, often never changing.

I still take opposition to the statement that "Morals are things we do based on spirituality" (and you are not the only one that has said this so this isn't aimed only at CollegeGirl) because that implies those without spirituality don't have morals. I don't deny most morals come from the Bible, as I said in my last post, but you don't have to be spiritual to have them.

You're right about the subdivisions of norms. My brain classifies things oddly (a better word, being "incorrectly" *LOL*). But, the point I was trying to make still came out, I think. I agree that one doesn't have to believe in a God to practice morals. But, I still believe that morals were based on spirituality. (Does that make sense?) I'm not saying you do them to please God, but rather that they were originally based on spirituality/religion.

Originally posted by CollegeGirl
(Does that make sense?)

Yes, you made perfect sense. :wave:

Originally posted by Miss Karly


Too bad, they kicked me out for trying to take over...
how about you? :).

Anyway- I'm gonna play the Devil's Advocate here. What if you all die, and you come to find out... there's no Heaven? No God, no Hell, and we all evolved from some now-extinct species? I hate when people say "Your going to Hell because your an Athiest" First off, most Athiests don't even believe in Hell- so there's no point of telling them they'll go to Hell. Second of all, you can't prove there is a God, or Heaven, or Hell. Just like we can't prove there is no God.

I still have your story of May 5th in my inbox. What you told me then is different from what you're saying now. I can understand
how you feel, but I have never understood...WHY exactly the change?:confused:

You're not going to hell, btw....

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica


I still have your story of May 5th in my inbox. What you told me then is different from what you're saying now. I can understand
how you feel, but I have never understood...WHY exactly the change?:confused:

You're not going to hell, btw....

Meh I think it's all a bunch of bulls#it now. I've got a much deeper insight on things.

Originally posted by Miss Karly


Lisa Whelchel is Foursquare.

Anyways Caitlin- I'm glad to see that the people in your Church aren't big into that stuff. Most Foursquares I've met are.

When I was still 'shopping for religions' a year or so back, I looked into Foursquare. The people were HUGE (and I mean huge) into that "No R movies, no sex before marriage, no alcohol even if your 21, no smoking, no lottery, no wearing baggy jeans, no pink hair, no public schools, no swearing, no bellybuttons showing, no more than one hole in your ear, no reading Harry Potter, no watching TV 14 shows like Jerry Springer, no listening to Guns N' Roses, Black Sabbath, no one but Christian artists." Jesus Christ...I may as well die. oh I know Karly I think it depends on any church it doesnt really matter because my OLD church was a Nazarene church and was SOO INTO all that it was pathetic they TOTALLY ridiculed my dad because he smoked and now they are all "oh i'm sorry about your loss" because my grandpa died but we KNOW they dont really like him ya know what I mean but No this church is AWESOME and I work there to (the preschool I work at is in my church) yeah the people can be RUDE sometimes but atleast they were there when My grandpa died when ALOT Of my friends werent

Originally posted by Miss Karly


Lisa Whelchel is Foursquare.

Anyways Caitlin- I'm glad to see that the people in your Church aren't big into that stuff. Most Foursquares I've met are.

When I was still 'shopping for religions' a year or so back, I looked into Foursquare. The people were HUGE (and I mean huge) into that "No R movies, no sex before marriage, no alcohol even if your 21, no smoking, no lottery, no wearing baggy jeans, no pink hair, no public schools, no swearing, no bellybuttons showing, no more than one hole in your ear, no reading Harry Potter, no watching TV 14 shows like Jerry Springer, no listening to Guns N' Roses, Black Sabbath, no one but Christian artists." Jesus Christ...I may as well die.

Okay, Karly, I just PM'd you a big thingie to you before I saw what you wrote her and...well...I THINK I GET YER POINT NOW.........NO BLACK SABBATH!!!!!!!!!! A FATE WORSE THAN FOURSQUARE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek: :crying: HOW IN THE WORLD DOES TUCKER LIVE WITHOUT...."Master of Reality" on the turntable....

I'm glad so many people are pointing out how many "earthly" rules are put on religion. This is one of the biggest things, I think, that drives people away from God.

The last hospital I worked at, this nurse was in some sect - I never asked the name of it, but she had to always wear dresses and wasn't allowed to cut her hair. I don't remember all what else, since I try to avoid being personal with jerks (she was cruddy to the patients and real lazy)

She got on one of the women working there (her 40+ yr. old niece) because she was wearing scrub pants. And the whole time Im thinking, you show respect for your religion by wearing a skirt, but you treat people like crap?

I do not really understand the overabulndance of "earthly rules"
a lot of the different sects abide by, it's an individual thing I spose.

I just know that a Christian

believes
tries not to be judgemental (we're people, so we do without even meaning to sometimes)
has mercy and understanding for others and tries to avoid
selfish anger and hate (everybody gets angry, its a people thing)
doesnt let lust and jealousy run rampant in their lives (people are weak, there will always be some lust and jealousy - if you recognize it and get over it, thats a good thing)

Lots of things.

I've been a Christian as long as I can remember - I've loved Ozzy / Black Sabbath music since I was small, and see the desperation and beauty in their lyrics. I smoke, but Im trying to quit. I mess around with people who drive me nuts, but I don't hate them. I believe people can be forgiven before they even ask, and that Heaven will be totally right on.

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica


Okay, Karly, I just PM'd you a big thingie to you before I saw what you wrote her and...well...I THINK I GET YER POINT NOW.........NO BLACK SABBATH!!!!!!!!!! A FATE WORSE THAN FOURSQUARE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek: :crying: HOW IN THE WORLD DOES TUCKER LIVE WITHOUT...."Master of Reality" on the turntable....

i never heard of black sabbath before....i really need to download one of these songs.

Originally posted by Georgia's on my Mind


i never heard of black sabbath before....i really need to download one of these songs.

Me and Karly both agree...Your life will be changed for the better.:D

"Black Sabbath" and "Paranoid" are great albums to start with.

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica


Me and Karly both agree...Your life will be changed for the better.:D

"Black Sabbath" and "Paranoid" are great albums to start with.

lol i'll d/l one tomorrow....it's on
my list of things to download now...i'll let you know what I think... oy vey I'm paranoid enough lol don't think i need to listen to that one lol

download Sabbath's megalomania!

dang, I wish he'd play that at ozzfest one of these years!

Originally posted by DetectiveGriffin
download Sabbath's megalomania!

dang, I wish he'd play that at ozzfest one of these years!

I saw them do it in concert in 1976!!!!! MY FIRST CONCERT!!!!!
But I was wondering, why was Ozzy singing it live not at the higher voice he sang on the Sabotage album??:confused: Maybe someone *sabotaged* his voice...?:lol:

"Obsessed with fantasy, possessed by my screams, I mixed reality with super-odd dreams, THE GHOST OF VIOLENCE WAS SOMETHING I'VE SEEN, I SOLD MY SOUL TO BE THE HUMAN OBSCENE...." That song rocks, all 9 minutes of it...:rock: :guitar: :guitar: :rock:

When I went to church, they tried to shove it down our throats that heavy metal was satanic and they gave us all these instances. Fortunately, I knew most of them to be BS. They weren't looking beyond the surface. Most of Black Sabbaths songs were about slavery to drugs and life-crippling depression - not slavery to satan.
I've always thought Ozzy Osbourne was a more beautiful poet than any other - of course, I'm twisted. <GG>

-----

Megalomania (The abbreviated version of one of the best songs in the universe, from memory and stuff -with lyrics probably spelled right)

I hide myself inside the shadows of shame
The silent symphonies were playing their games
My body echoed to the dreams of my soul
It started something that I could not control

Where can I run to now?
The joke is on me
No sympathizing, God, it's insanity


Obsessed with fantasy, possessed with my schemes
I mixed reality with pseudo-god dreams
The ghost of violence was something
I'd seen
I sold my soul to be the human obscene

How could it poison me?
The dream of my soul
How did my fantasies take complete control?

I feel something's taken me I don't know where
It's like a trip inside a separate mind

The ghost of tomorrow from my favorite dream is telling me to leave it all behind

Feel it slipping away, slipping in tomorrow
Got to get to happiness, want no more of sorrow

How I lied, went to hide
How I tried to get away from you now
Am I right if I fight?
That I might just get away from you now

I feel something's giving me the chance to return
It's giving me the chance of saving my soul
Beating the demigod, I'm fading away
I'm going backwards, but I'm in control


I'm really digging schizophrenia the best of the earth
I've seized my soul in the fires of hell
Peace of mind eluded me, but now it's all mine
I simply try, but he wants me to fail

Feel it slipping away, slipping in tomorrow
Now I've found my happiness, providence of sorrow

No more lies, I got wise
I despise the way I worshipped you
Now I'm free, can't you see
And now I won't be led by you now

:lol: :rotflmao:
I love how a discussion of religion and morality has somehow morphed into a dissection of Ozzy Osbournes musical career! :lol:
I can't believe that someone out there has never heard of Black Sabbath!!!! To hear some classic Sabbath check out 'Masters Of Reality', 'Paranoid' and 'Black Sabbath'. To hear Ozzy at his solo-best get your ears around 'Bark At The Moon', 'Blizzard of Ozz' and 'Ultimate Sin'.

Well, i think it's actually very appropriate.
He's long been considered by religious and moral leaders to be a immoral Satanist. I think this type of superficial judgement has damaged the reputation
of the church as a whole.

Now, I don't think he's a really moral person - I never did. I don't appreciate
the way he's (or they have) used the negative attention to hype up an image.
Every Ozzfest I've been to, I've had to pass up the tshirt because of some satan image or the like on it. (2002 is the first ozzfest I've missed, what was on the shirt this year?)

But, having some pastor try to make a name for himself by slamming people without even trying to fully take in the situation hasn't helped. It's like they always say, 'you can't lie to kids - they see right through it.'
One of the things I remember at my church was watching a movie about the dangers of heavy metal music turning kids into satanist - so much misinformation. One of my favorites was they brought up the band DIO.
Never really listened to them, they were always on headbangers ball, ok group, I thought. The movie pointed out that DIO is spanish for GOD, and that these heathens had taken that name to assert themselves as God and make fun of his name.
Well, if I were RONNIE JAMES DIO, I woulda sued. <G>

Now, back to Ozzy's career. Anyone have anything else really awesome to add? I think my favorite "modern" songs from him are I JUST WANT YOU and BACK ON EARTH.

<G>

GO OZZY! YEAH! WOOOOOOO!

Religion is more important in my life than morals.

Originally posted by DetectiveGriffin
Well, i think it's actually very appropriate.
He's long been considered by religious and moral leaders to be a immoral Satanist. I think this type of superficial judgement has damaged the reputation
of the church as a whole.

Now, I don't think he's a really moral person - I never did. I don't appreciate
the way he's (or they have) used the negative attention to hype up an image.
Every Ozzfest I've been to, I've had to pass up the tshirt because of some satan image or the like on it. (2002 is the first ozzfest I've missed, what was on the shirt this year?)

But, having some pastor try to make a name for himself by slamming people without even trying to fully take in the situation hasn't helped. It's like they always say, 'you can't lie to kids - they see right through it.'
One of the things I remember at my church was watching a movie about the dangers of heavy metal music turning kids into satanist - so much misinformation. One of my favorites was they brought up the band DIO.
Never really listened to them, they were always on headbangers ball, ok group, I thought. The movie pointed out that DIO is spanish for GOD, and that these heathens had taken that name to assert themselves as God and make fun of his name.
Well, if I were RONNIE JAMES DIO, I woulda sued. <G>

Now, back to Ozzy's career. Anyone have anything else really awesome to add? I think my favorite "modern" songs from him are I JUST WANT YOU and BACK ON EARTH.

<G>

GO OZZY! YEAH! WOOOOOOO!

I've read 13 years ago or so Ozzy saying he didn't really want to be thought of as the "evilest" guy in rock & roll, that was his image, it was all theatrics, etc. I think in the past 15 years he's been a little more down to earth (pun intended?) in his lyrics and
lifestyle, kinda more introspective and all. I don't think he's really capitalized so much on the "Satan" bit in his lyrics except in "Mr. Crowley". But of course he's also tried to downplay his "I'm just a nice guy" bit so people CAN believe he's the Real Full-Meal Deal in
"Devil-Rock"...I think he may be trying to have a balance between the two images of himself. Of course a reality show like The Osbournes may over-expose him and take away some of the mystery....

I've seen so many of those stupid "anti-rock/metal" videos, SOMEONE is out to make a buck, cashing in on people's fears. I got some stuff on a Led Zeppelin website about the rumors of
"Stairway to Heaven" containing backwards masking messages...
The surviving members of the band deny it vehemently and ask why some busybody people can't find some other worthwhile hobby, take up sports or something...:rolleyes:

Originally posted by Mossopp
:lol: :rotflmao:
I love how a discussion of religion and morality has somehow morphed into a dissection of Ozzy Osbournes musical career! :lol:
I can't believe that someone out there has never heard of Black Sabbath!!!! To hear some classic Sabbath check out 'Masters Of Reality', 'Paranoid' and 'Black Sabbath'. To hear Ozzy at his solo-best get your ears around 'Bark At The Moon', 'Blizzard of Ozz' and 'Ultimate Sin'.

I LOVE Blizzard of Ozz! I swear when I die, I'm gonna be buried with that in my casket. I love that album so much...

Originally posted by Miss Karly


I LOVE Blizzard of Ozz! I swear when I die, I'm gonna be buried with that in my casket. I love that album so much...

I remember 15 years ago, I sent a letter to Lisa at her church using the lyrics of "Crazy Train", written in response to judgemental "Christians":

MAYBE IT'S NOT TOO LATE, TO LEARN HOW TO LOVE AND FORGET HOW TO HATE...

I had heard the lyrics so many times before, and to hear it SERIOUSLY for the first time was a major revelation, literally. Ozzy
had reclaimed his place as the prophet of peace for me for the first time since I followed him in the 70's with Black Sabbath.

One thing that really pissed me off in the 80's was a song by a Christian singer named Geoff Moore and the Distance where he sang this ABSOLUTELY STUPID, ARROGANT song called "Winning Back the Rock", with these lyrics that ragged on popular metal bands of the time: "Ozzy's on a Crazy Train, there is no doubt..."
He wasn't being very kind to Ozzy, in other words. I felt like strapping Geoff Moore and the Distance in the Space Shuttle and blasting him out to a DISTANT asteroid or haemerroid, one of the two...:mad: :lol:

Originally posted by Chocoholic
Aren't they both basically the same thing?

Personally, religion is important in my life. I believe in God and that Jesus is our Savior. I believe there is a better life waiting for us up in Heaven.I would hope so..... All I have seen is evilness and horrible stuff for the most part here :(

I do not follow a religion... Its made up BS for control..........

You are spot on Dude, I was brainwashed into my 30's and then worked on a cleansing. Had the great pleasure of meeting on the radio and phone, Blase Bonpane, former catholic priest and his wife, a former nun. They were beautiful couple and had 2 acccomplished children.

He authored the book: Imagine No Religion and I believe it's the last book I purchased.

https://www.ncronline.org/news/blase-bonpane-89-peace-and-human-rights-activist-dies-los-angeles


Sister Rebel: Theresa Bonpane, I believe she is 88 abd lives in Santa Monica.

https://redhen.org/book/sister-rebel/

God bless ya Carole!!

I do not follow a religion... Its made up BS for control..........

I don't think religion is to be blamed as basically all religions are same and carry the same message of being a better human beings. It is only when religion get interpreted by human beings that things goes haywire. Remember that God gave human beings common sense before giving them religion. So common sense precede religion beliefs :)

Ya I guess your right.........

Ah there is a Religion thread and I did comment a while ago. And now I'm wondering if I had been raised in a bible teaching life, how much different would I have turned out. Last night on Coast to Coast a Bible Prophecy guy was talking about the rapture and the end of us...I turned it off.

My dad never believed in a Supreme anything and I wonder how he's doing in his casket.

I believe the 10 Commandments did so much good in my life.

How about some Interesting Comments from some here....


Religion and Spirituality are NOT the same.