View Full Version : Which late in the series plot development for Sam was worse


TMC
04-08-2022, 06:07 AM
Her skipping (https://web.archive.org/web/20140406114447/http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/topic/2874131-whos-the-boss/page-10#entry13353675) her senior year in high school or her marriage to Hank?

I've addressed it here before about how Sam was never depicted as being some type of studious bookworm, nerd, or straight A student. This is the same Samantha Micelli who once got a D in chemistry. So how (https://web.archive.org/web/20140407134732/http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/topic/2874131-whos-the-boss/page-8#entry13235159) was she of all people, able to get into an accelerated program, when Sam was with all due respect, portrayed (https://web.archive.org/web/20140407134732/http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/topic/2874131-whos-the-boss/page-8#entry13235401) as an above-average (https://web.archive.org/web/20140405003510/http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/topic/2874131-whos-the-boss/page-13#entry15228926) student at best leading up to that point?

Plus, Sam just strikes me as the type of girl who would want to celebrate finishing high school with her good group of friends at the same time. It just comes across as totally contrived and unrealistic given what we were presented of her character up until that point.

I don't know where to start with her marriage in the final season other than, just like her going to college a year ahead of schedule, it felt like another one of those cases of the writers radically changing Sam's character in a rush. Like others (https://web.archive.org/web/20140406114445/http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/topic/2874131-whos-the-boss/page-11#entry13353994) have said, it's a bit hard to stomach seeing a still teenaged Samantha randomly marrying some dork that we, the viewers hardly know such so that the writers (https://web.archive.org/web/20140406114445/http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/topic/2874131-whos-the-boss/page-11#entry13353761) could avoid seeing Tony and Angela get married.

Novera
04-11-2022, 05:29 PM
What I hated about the Hank storyline was that she was never an outdoorsy type (other than expensive skiing trips) and it felt so artificial. Seriously what were the writers thinking "Lets have the show's bombshell teen turn into a librarian look and marry an outdoor kinda dorky cowboy" Like none of that matches the earlier show, sometimes you have to wonder if someone wanted out of their contract and tried to tank the friggen show!

TMC
04-11-2022, 09:57 PM
What I hated about the Hank storyline was that she was never an outdoorsy type (other than expensive skiing trips) and it felt so artificial. Seriously what were the writers thinking "Lets have the show's bombshell teen turn into a librarian look and marry an outdoor kinda dorky cowboy" Like none of that matches the earlier show, sometimes you have to wonder if someone wanted out of their contract and tried to tank the friggen show!

Alyssa Milano did state (https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1991-12-29-ca-1946-story.html) that Season 8 of Who's the Boss? (1991-92) was going to be her last either way. I don't know if it was absolutely certain that Season 8 was going to be the show's last (the LA Times article that I linked is from December 1991). But it does make you wonder if they cooked up this marriage arc for Sam as a convenient way to write her out of the show just in case there was a ninth season.

And I thought that Matt, who we see early on in Season 7 was Sam's cowboy boyfriend, who she also planned on marrying. Hank was the pre-med doctor who dropped out to become a puppeteer.

TMC
04-14-2022, 06:03 AM
What I hated about the Hank storyline was that she was never an outdoorsy type (other than expensive skiing trips) and it felt so artificial. Seriously what were the writers thinking "Lets have the show's bombshell teen turn into a librarian look and marry an outdoor kinda dorky cowboy" Like none of that matches the earlier show, sometimes you have to wonder if someone wanted out of their contract and tried to tank the friggen show!

The Hank storyline kind of feels like a slight reworking of the Matt storyline from the season prior, where Sam randomly meets this guy and she suddenly wants to get married despite Tony's reservations. But even the Matt storyline feels artificial, because like you said, Samantha never struck as being an outdoorsy type. She was just a normal, around the way, Italian girl from Brooklyn.

One of the things that I dislike the most about the last two seasons of Who's the Boss? is the way that they handled Sam's romantic life. It seemed like that they kept pairing her with guys who weren't entirely right for her or had something very off-putting about their personalities. So her ultimately winding up with a bland dork like Hank just seemed to be par for the course.

TMC
04-20-2022, 06:51 AM
What I hated about the Hank storyline was that she was never an outdoorsy type (other than expensive skiing trips) and it felt so artificial. Seriously what were the writers thinking "Lets have the show's bombshell teen turn into a librarian look and marry an outdoor kinda dorky cowboy" Like none of that matches the earlier show, sometimes you have to wonder if someone wanted out of their contract and tried to tank the friggen show!

Another thing (https://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=413028) that I personally hated about the Hank storyline is that how exactly is Samantha absolutely sure that Hank is "the one"? Sam has had ugly breakups with guys (https://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=412196) before such as Chad McCann (who cheated on her) and Jesse Nash (who abruptly told her that he didn't want to date her anymore). So you would think that based on her history, she would be extra cautious. Even her relationship with Matt the cowboy ended up badly based on the evidence of the "Roomies" episode.

I guess that it also annoys me because Sam for the past eight years, lived with two strong, independent women in Angela and Mona. And yet, with her relationship with Hank, she all but becomes this blindly loyal, almost subservient, clingy housewife, who doesn't at all question Hank's life choices like dropping out of medical school to become a puppeteer. And she never at all took into consideration the fact that as a married woman, Sam would have to by design, become more responsible and not so dependent on Tony or Angela to take care of her first and foremost.

I suppose that it irked me how much the writers pretty much assassinated (https://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=410571) Tony and Sam's (https://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=410185) characters by the end of the series. They all but lost their spunky, blue collar, straight out of Brooklyn charm, in order to make them these irritating yuppies in Connecticut.

Novera
04-20-2022, 07:15 PM
Alyssa Milano did state (https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1991-12-29-ca-1946-story.html) that Season 8 of Who's the Boss? (1991-92) was going to be her last either way. I don't know if it was absolutely certain that Season 8 was going to be the show's last (the LA Times article that I linked is from December 1991). But it does make you wonder if they cooked up this marriage arc for Sam as a convenient way to write her out of the show just in case there was a ninth season.

And I thought that Matt, who we see early on in Season 7 was Sam's cowboy boyfriend, who she also planned on marrying. Hank was the pre-med doctor who dropped out to become a puppeteer.

I've re-watched the series (I cant count how) many times and the fact I mixed up Hank and Matt says it all. If you ask me about Chad? The ultimate 80s cool name, I'll tell you all about how he tried to get the ring out of the sink... and to this day the I never EVER pour hot butter down the drain (just in case)

AMackII
04-21-2022, 11:28 AM
Romance/Marriage with Hank was Sam’s very worst during Season 8

TMC
04-27-2022, 06:00 AM
Many of the big storylines in the last few seasons didn't feel organic. The first big storyline development in the series was probably Angela getting fired from her advertisement company and deciding to strike it on her own. The second big one was probably Tony enrolling in college.

I know that there are people who aren't fans of seeing Tony going to college, but I can realistically buy seeing a man like Tony Micelli do that. I don't think that he ever wanted to be a housekeeper forever, he just wanted a way to keep his daughter out of trouble. He was the type who I could see, striving to better himself and his family.

Plus, Tony Danza in real life, is big on education (he has taught English as a side hustle), so it isn't like wanting to promote the importance of education towards children was that out of reach. And if I remember correctly, Tony's character wanted to enroll in college in part, to set a good example for Sam.

But towards the end of the series, the writers were throwing challenges or new plot developments at the characters just for the hell of it. Like when they brought Billy into the show. They just brought Billy on to the show just because. It's like Mrs. Rossini randomly shows up on Angela's doorstep one day with this little kid and tells Angela and Tony that they need to take care of him as if he were a new puppy.

I never once bought Sam and Hank as a couple like I did with Tony and Angela. Heck, Mona's romance with Max (Leslie Nielsen's character) was more believable than Sam and Hank's. Sam and Hank's relationship just comes across as standard puppy love. Maybe they were tying to go with a "Romeo and Juliet" scenario with the feuding families and the misunderstood and/or forbidden love angle. But the whole thing is so rushed and poorly development, that it just rings hallow.

TMC
05-05-2022, 03:13 AM
Romance/Marriage with Hank was Sam’s very worst during Season 8

I sometimes wonder if they should've married Sam off with Jesse Nash. Jesse was arguably, Sam's most noteworthy love interest. And even though their relationship ended badly, I kind of feel that there was a loose end to that storyline.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/df/ae/2a/dfae2af164265a9a8e2122c0eb629cc0.jpg

They just made Jesse out to be a villain who just randomly and coldly decided to dump Sam and we never see or hear from his character again.

Sam and Jesse felt more like an actual couple than Sam and Hank or even Sam and Matt. Jesse at least, seemed like a real, multi-dimensional character. And they at the very least, had a history together instead of the way that Sam just rushes into marrying Hank after only knowing him a very short while.

Novera
05-06-2022, 05:31 PM
I sometimes wonder if they should've married Sam off with Jesse Nash. Jesse was arguably, Sam's most noteworthy love interest. And even though their relationship ended badly, I kind of feel that there was a loose end to that storyline.

I think he was the best bf as well, I always thought it was like them refining Mason into a more interesting b/f with all the dorky stuff removed. I hate it when shows break up couples this way, where it's like "hi, it's over, credits roll" after getting to know the character. Like the infamous Julie episode ditching Mike at the altar (Growing Pains)... because of what happened there I always wonder if it was a similar situation when the same thing happens on another show. Did Jesse (the actor) do something wrong, maybe the writers thought he wasn't right for her, whatever it is - it's so weird when they just ditch someone that quickly after building them up so much.

Sometimes you can even sense the actor being happy about it, like that Mike/Julie thing, I feel like I'm watching a guy get dumped by a girl he can't stand but is acting sad about it because that's what you're supposed to do.

TMC
05-11-2022, 04:35 AM
I think he was the best bf as well, I always thought it was like them refining Mason into a more interesting b/f with all the dorky stuff removed. I hate it when shows break up couples this way, where it's like "hi, it's over, credits roll" after getting to know the character. Like the infamous Julie episode ditching Mike at the altar (Growing Pains)... because of what happened there I always wonder if it was a similar situation when the same thing happens on another show. Did Jesse (the actor) do something wrong, maybe the writers thought he wasn't right for her, whatever it is - it's so weird when they just ditch someone that quickly after building them up so much.

Sometimes you can even sense the actor being happy about it, like that Mike/Julie thing, I feel like I'm watching a guy get dumped by a girl he can't stand but is acting sad about it because that's what you're supposed to do.

It also kind of reminds me of the end (https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:ZCV7PjOZkagJ:https://twitter.com/thekidsin201/status/1286653836392902657%3Flang%3Den+&cd=15&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us) of Three's Company, where they rushed Janet into a marriage just like Sam on Who's the Boss? as a means of giving her character some type of closure. And like Hank on Who's the Boss?, Janet's eventual husband, Phillip (https://threescompany.fandom.com/wiki/Phillip_Dawson) was very bland and square to the point in which you immediately wonder what she saw in him.

Heck, Tony might as well have been Mr. Bradford from the Three's a Crowd spin-off of Three's Company. Tony pretty much acted like the obnoxiously meddlesome father-in-law once Sam and Hank get married.

TMC
05-15-2022, 04:56 AM
What I hated about the Hank storyline was that she was never an outdoorsy type (other than expensive skiing trips) and it felt so artificial. Seriously what were the writers thinking "Lets have the show's bombshell teen turn into a librarian look and marry an outdoor kinda dorky cowboy" Like none of that matches the earlier show, sometimes you have to wonder if someone wanted out of their contract and tried to tank the friggen show!

I also just remembered that Tony "solved" Sam and Hank's residency troubles by having them move into Mona's garage apartment while Mona would move into Sam's old room. But it would've been pretty out of character for Mona to go along with it after the initial shock wore off.

I mean, why would such a self-indulgent and vain person like Mona Robinson be so willing to let her freeloading, surrogate granddaughter and her dorky, loser of a husband take her apartment without a fight?

This goes back to how much the writing seemed to deteriorate in the last few years of the show. They never really wanted to go deep into the consequences that Sam had to face for wanting to get married at such a young age.

TMC
08-12-2022, 12:43 AM
I think he was the best bf as well, I always thought it was like them refining Mason into a more interesting b/f with all the dorky stuff removed. I hate it when shows break up couples this way, where it's like "hi, it's over, credits roll" after getting to know the character. Like the infamous Julie episode ditching Mike at the altar (Growing Pains)... because of what happened there I always wonder if it was a similar situation when the same thing happens on another show. Did Jesse (the actor) do something wrong, maybe the writers thought he wasn't right for her, whatever it is - it's so weird when they just ditch someone that quickly after building them up so much.

Sometimes you can even sense the actor being happy about it, like that Mike/Julie thing, I feel like I'm watching a guy get dumped by a girl he can't stand but is acting sad about it because that's what you're supposed to do.

I could've also realistically seen Sam end up with Scott, her classmate who she helped on their French test in the "In Sam We Trust" (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/in-sam-we-trust/id1528039547?i=1000538187470) episode (http://reviewingeverytvshowiown.blogspot.com/2017/03/whos-boss-in-sam-we-trust.html). Even though you could say that they helped each other cheat, Scott still seemed like a realistic, down-to-earth, well intended but flawed person. That was much different than a goofy himbo (https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Himbo) in Hank. And Alyssa Milano I believe, did have a decent amount of chemistry (no pun intended for those who have seen the episode) Jim Calvert, who played (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0747760/) Scott.

TMC
09-02-2022, 04:26 AM
I just saw the "Sam Accelerates" episode yesterday on GAC Family, and the whole thing just comes straight out of the blue. They do try to explain that Sam worked hard to become a better student, but I don't think that the explanation is that good enough.

You're basically insulting the audience's intelligence to make us want to believe that a girl like Samantha Micelli, who not to long ago, got a D on her chemistry test (and could've gotten an F for bringing a crib sheet into the classroom) is suddenly good enough to graduate from high school a year ahead of schedule.

Again, what was exactly there to gain by moving Samantha up and ahead in grade and get her in to college earlier than expected? It's like the writers figured that they couldn't mine anymore stories about Sam in high school and being a teenager even though Alyssa Milano still was one in real life.

This goes back to one of the biggest issues and problems with the later seasons of Who's the Boss? Why was there such an urgency to make Sam's character grow up?

A big reason why I think that so many young people resonated and connected with the character that Alyssa Milano played because she just seemed like a normal, everyday, imperfect, down-to-earth girl. Why would you all of a sudden want to junk all of that relatability out of the window?

TMC
09-13-2022, 12:09 AM
Romance/Marriage with Hank was Sam’s very worst during Season 8

I hate to repeat myself, but I was watching Who's the Boss? today on GAC Family, and it reminded me just how horribly rushed Hank's introduction and his wedding to Sam was. Hank is first seen for a brief scene in Sam's dorm room in the episode "Who's the Boss?" (http://reviewingeverytvshowiown.blogspot.com/2017/06/whos-boss-whos-boss.html) (yes, that's the actual name of the episode). That was the 14th episode in Season 8, the final one.

We don't see or hear from or about Hank again until the 17th episode of that year, "Better Off Wed". If anything, you would be forgiven if you completely forgot that Sam had been dating this guy from her college. As a matter of fact, Hank's character isn't really established until the first part of "Better Off Wed" (http://reviewingeverytvshowiown.blogspot.com/2017/07/whos-boss-better-off-wed-part-1.html) even though we had seen him once before and Tony had already met him.

So approximately, it's about four weeks in-between Hank's introduction and Hank and Sam going off to elope. Can you see just how the whole thing was rushed and felt like it came together at the last minute? To the viewers' eyes, Sam had only been seeing Hank for an episode and a half before they decided that it was time to get married.

Clayton Endicott III
09-16-2022, 11:53 PM
They were throwing a lot of new ideas into the mix in those last couple of seasons.

I did, however, enjoy the Hank-Sam-Tony relationship. I liked the absurdity of all of the puppets. They were attempting to give Tony a new foil, and Hank was an artistic type who Tony just didn't get.

TMC
09-18-2022, 10:48 PM
They were throwing a lot of new ideas into the mix in those last couple of seasons.

I did, however, enjoy the Hank-Sam-Tony relationship. I liked the absurdity of all of the puppets. They were attempting to give Tony a new foil, and Hank was an artistic type who Tony just didn't get.

Maybe they were trying to go for a Nick-Mallory-Steven type of dynamic as seen on Family Ties, where the father (Steven/Tony) doesn't get his daughter's (Mallory/Samantha) quirky, sensitive artist of a boyfriend (Nick/Hank).

TMC
10-05-2022, 12:07 AM
I think he was the best bf as well, I always thought it was like them refining Mason into a more interesting b/f with all the dorky stuff removed. I hate it when shows break up couples this way, where it's like "hi, it's over, credits roll" after getting to know the character. Like the infamous Julie episode ditching Mike at the altar (Growing Pains)... because of what happened there I always wonder if it was a similar situation when the same thing happens on another show. Did Jesse (the actor) do something wrong, maybe the writers thought he wasn't right for her, whatever it is - it's so weird when they just ditch someone that quickly after building them up so much.

Sometimes you can even sense the actor being happy about it, like that Mike/Julie thing, I feel like I'm watching a guy get dumped by a girl he can't stand but is acting sad about it because that's what you're supposed to do.

To tell you the truth, I never really thought too deeply of the exact reasons why Scott Bloom (Jesse's actor) left the series following the "Double Dump" episode in Season 5. And I thus far, can't find any reputable information online that could lend some insight for why Jesse's character was abruptly written out.

If or when the Who's the Boss? sequel series finally gets off the ground, Jesse is admittedly, one of the characters that I wouldn't mind seeing them revisit.

TMC
10-06-2022, 11:55 PM
Maybe they were trying to go for a Nick-Mallory-Steven type of dynamic as seen on Family Ties, where the father (Steven/Tony) doesn't get his daughter's (Mallory/Samantha) quirky, sensitive artist of a boyfriend (Nick/Hank).

Then again, the key differences between Family Ties and Who's the Boss? is that the whole Hank-Sam-Tony relationship came along, way, way, way too late in the series' run to truly get invested in. Nick wasn't first introduced (https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/family-ties-scott-valentine-felt-bad-about-role.html/) on Family Ties until the third episode of the fourth season (https://jacksonupperco.com/2021/12/14/the-ten-best-family-ties-episodes-of-season-four/). And keep in mind that Family Ties, would run for three additional years.

Also, unlike Hank on Who's the Boss?, Nick on Family Ties was actually a genuinely interesting character (https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/family-ties-why-3-separate-nick-moore-spinoffs-failed.html/) and not merely an extension of Mallory's character unlike was arguably the case with Sam.

TMC
10-19-2022, 12:18 AM
Romance/Marriage with Hank was Sam’s very worst during Season 8

I was watching the first part of the "Better Off Wed" episode again today GAC Family, and I'm still dumbstruck at how rushed and poorly constructed the entire arc is. I don't want to repeat what I had previously said, but it really does feel like one of those last minute, random ideas that the producers and writers had.

What exactly did Sam see in Hank that would make her want to marry him so badly? We don't really know anything about her and Hank's relationship to get a full context about why they're in love with each other. All that we know is that Hank is some guy who is going to college with Sam.

Also Sam by her own admission along with Hank, didn't have any real money, or jobs, or their own house. Did Hank think that everything was going to work out since his parents were bankrolling his education? Of course, that was under the pretense that he was studying to become a doctor, not a puppeteer.

And I didn't like how Tony was painted as the villain just because he doesn't immediately accept Hank's career choices or the notion of his daughter wanting to get married in such a rush. To be brutally honest, if I were in Tony's shoes, I would've likely felt the same way.

I am too of the opinion that Sam was way too young and immature to get married. But they almost brush it off as if it's no big deal in the grand scheme of things, since Hank's parents got married when they were really young and Tony eloped with Sam's mother.

The whole "Sam gets married" arc, is probably the most infuriating storyline that Who's the Boss? ever concocted. Hank was such a bland, awkward, cheesy character to begin with. And the whole thing just makes Sam look really reckless and arrogant. Why would you get married without a concrete plan for your life going forward?

TMC
07-01-2023, 02:31 AM
What I hated about the Hank storyline was that she was never an outdoorsy type (other than expensive skiing trips) and it felt so artificial. Seriously what were the writers thinking "Lets have the show's bombshell teen turn into a librarian look and marry an outdoor kinda dorky cowboy" Like none of that matches the earlier show, sometimes you have to wonder if someone wanted out of their contract and tried to tank the friggen show!

Maybe it's just me, but now that I've thought about it some more, they really didn't appear to have much of a clear plan or vision for Sam's character in the final two seasons. It's like, we've put her into college ahead of schedule so now what? One of the criticisms that I've read about the last two seasons of Who's the Boss? is that Samantha developed a really awful taste in men. I don't think it was so much just that her taste in men were awful, it's that Sam seemed to become really codependent and clingy in regards to her boyfriends, especially by the time that Hank got involved.

Matt the cowboy however, was actually, an interesting character and he would've made for a nice foil for a blue collar "city slicker" like Tony Micelli. But they completely drop that arc without any proper resolution. To be brutally honest with you, if they had to marry Sam off, I would've preferred for her to marry Matt instead of Hank because at least Matt had a genuine charm and charisma about him independent of Sam. Hank always seemed nothing more than a plot point instead of an actual character.

TMC
11-03-2023, 04:22 AM
IFC just started airing Season 8 as part of its latest cycle, and it just reminded me that back in 1992 when this first aired, the writers/producers/network (https://www.tampabay.com/archive/1992/04/14/abc-s-view-of-the-1991-92-season/) seemed to misunderstand (https://web.archive.org/web/20140406114445/http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/topic/2874131-whos-the-boss/page-11#entry13353994) what exactly the audience wanted. They wanted some sort of resolution to Tony and Angela's relationship, not just any old wedding ceremony. To tell you the truth, the whole "Sam gets married episode" just feels like in cynical February sweeps stunt. In other words, let's just trot out this big event even though it makes little sense in the grander scheme of things.

TMC
04-04-2024, 02:07 AM
What I hated about the Hank storyline was that she was never an outdoorsy type (other than expensive skiing trips) and it felt so artificial. Seriously what were the writers thinking "Lets have the show's bombshell teen turn into a librarian look and marry an outdoor kinda dorky cowboy" Like none of that matches the earlier show, sometimes you have to wonder if someone wanted out of their contract and tried to tank the friggen show!

And as others have said (https://www.reddit.com/r/WhosTheBossSitcom/comments/1auyvfg/samantha_and_hank/), Sam's marriage to Hank was so weird, rushed, and out of character. By the end, it just lingers there.

TMC
06-08-2025, 12:28 AM
And as others have said (https://www.reddit.com/r/WhosTheBossSitcom/comments/1auyvfg/samantha_and_hank/), Sam's marriage to Hank was so weird, rushed, and out of character. By the end, it just lingers there.

Also as others have pointed out (https://www.reddit.com/r/WhosTheBossSitcom/comments/1iugqvd/comment/me02sbi/), it was really annoying how they kept trying to marry Sam off, starting with that ranch guy (Matt) before she even went to college. She could have had so many different story lines beyond "get boyfriend, get married".