I tried to use it with my sister and she heard me a little bit and that was it, she went back to her eating habits and she dealt with MS. She died 5 yrs ago and I believe had she kicked her food "habit, she could be alive. She listened to all her specialists and their drugs and she is gone at 68. She was addicted to sugars and carbs and these foods are a no no in so much health and MS for sure.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tough_love

Tough love is an expression used when someone treats another person harshly or sternly with the intent to help them in the long run.

I tried to use ToughLove on my father and his lifetime of alcohol and sent him a letter and my mother got it and tore it up, said she "didn't want to hurt his feelings"...she was not into ToughLove. She really had no clue. A tough marriage, thou.

Just feel like bringing this topic up here. Not to debate, please.

Personally, I feel that giving up all the foods you cherish, in order to "live right", is a fate worse than Death

If I keel over tomorrow, so long as my gut is full of red meat, my arteries full of real butter, and an $8 cigar in my hand, I'm sure that I'll die with a smile on my face.....what more can I ask?

Personally, I feel that giving up all the foods you cherish, in order to "live right", is a fate worse than Death

If I keel over tomorrow, so long as my gut is full of red meat, my arteries full of real butter, and an $8 cigar in my hand, I'm sure that I'll die with a smile on my face.....what more can I ask?

Your choices.:)

She listened to all her specialists and their drugs and she is gone at 68.
This thread, purportedly about “tough love,” seems more like a sneaky means of posting even more garbage anti-doctor, anti-pharmaceutical, pro-snake oil propaganda.

Some of us need our specialists and our drugs to y’know, live. Grapeseed oil won’t save you, but science might.

This thread, purportedly about “tough love,” seems more like a sneaky means of posting even more garbage anti-doctor, anti-pharmaceutical, pro-snake oil propaganda.

Some of us need our specialists and our drugs to y’know, live. Grapeseed oil won’t save you, but science might.

It's about the principles of ToughLove!!!! I'm talking about a couple family members in my life. Does not appeal to you , ignore. You know how that goes.

A good thread Carole!!!!!

I grew up with a guy who was a heavy boozer.
Everybody was always on his case, trying to make him feel bad for being irresponsible. He moved away to Texas, and about 8 years later I found myself driving through his little town, so I tracked him down through family contacts.

8 AM on a Saturday morning, coffee table full of empty bottles, and there he sat on the couch, already closing one eye to keep from seeing double.....with a wife and 5 kids. We had a nice little visit.

After a few hours his wife asked me "you've known him for years, what does it take to get him to take and keep a job?"

I looked at his 5 kids and told her "I think you've already got more work out of him than anyone thought he had in him"

Sometimes it's worthwhile to choose your battles carefully, not all wars want to be won. That's kind of the opposite side of the "tough love" coin. Sometimes it hurts to see people destroy themselves. BUT, if that's te only thing that makes them happy, what gives us the right to insist that they give it up?

I grew up with a guy who was a heavy boozer.
Everybody was always on his case, trying to make him feel bad for being irresponsible. He moved away to Texas, and about 8 years later I found myself driving through his little town, so I tracked him down through family contacts.

8 AM on a Saturday morning, coffee table full of empty bottles, and there he sat on the couch, already closing one eye to keep from seeing double.....with a wife and 5 kids. We had a nice little visit.

After a few hours his wife asked me "you've known him for years, what does it take to get him to take and keep a job?"

I looked at his 5 kids and told her "I think you've already got more work out of him than anyone thought he had in him"

Sometimes it's worthwhile to choose your battles carefully, not all wars want to be won. That's kind of the opposite side of the "tough love" coin. Sometimes it hurts to see people destroy themselves. BUT, if that's te only thing that makes them happy, what gives us the right to insist that they give it up?

My father was a functioning alcoholic, hardly ever missed work, but hurt a lot of people in our family, his wife, and we 3 kids.

He never smoked so I'm sure this saved his long lasting heart.

My father was a functioning alcoholic, hardly ever missed work, but hurt a lot of people in our family, his wife, and we 3 kids.

He never smoked so I'm sure this saved his long lasting heart.

The thing of it is, when they really don't see any need for "help", all efforts trying to help them are seen as a nuisance. "Why is everybody trying to ruin my fun?" is their perspective.

My dad died at 43 of a heart attack, his dad at 55, also a heart attack. My moms dad at 60 (heart attack). If ever there was someone who never expected to reach old age, that would be me. And from 1978 to 2004 I had about every bad habit there is, severe in some instances. Yet here I am at 63, with no apparent end in sight.

Perhaps I am a living embodiment of "whatever doesn't kill you only makes you stronger"?

And, there really isn't a thing that anyone could have done during my self destructive era, that was gonna change me, I was too self assured that I had it all "right". Eventually, I just grew bored with it all, concluded that there were no horizons left to conquer, and decided to give reality a shot. lol.

This thread, purportedly about “tough love,” seems more like a sneaky means of posting even more garbage anti-doctor, anti-pharmaceutical, pro-snake oil propaganda.

Some of us need our specialists and our drugs to y’know, live. Grapeseed oil won’t save you, but science might.

Yep, I bet you are 100% correct. Caroline is a sneak and this phony "tough love" thread is really her way of creating an anti-doctor, holistic weirdo thread. She's bored since she's been banned from the politics site. This is all she has so she has to come up with creative ways to MASK what she really wants to post about.

Millions of stories out there, GJ, my son in law checked out at 55, decades of cigs and his booze, missed seeing his kids graduate high school, one grad college and the son in college now, once covid ever leaves, he'll finish. He was 1 of 5 boys and all are gone but 2, then my daughter ended up with the "gene" and close to death a couple times from opiod addiction. She had to end up in the gutter, lose her kids for some months to get her life back But she's back and HOPE she stays strong from here on out.

Yep, I bet you are 100% correct. Caroline is a sneak and this phony "tough love" thread is really her way of creating an anti-doctor, holistic weirdo thread. She's bored since she's been banned from the politics site. This is all she has so she has to come up with creative ways to MASK what she really wants to post about.

You are 1000% incorrect...it's mostly about addiction as it's unfolding, and also nutrition. Foods that heal, and the foods than kill.

It's about the principles of ToughLove!!!! I'm talking about a couple family members in my life. Does not appeal to you , ignore. You know how that goes.

No Caroline, it's your usual "I am the queen of all things healthy" nonsense. You were booted from the Politics Board and are trying to backdoor your agenda on this board. Only Dude is fooled by your little schemes.

The thing of it is, when they really don't see any need for "help", all efforts trying to help them are seen as a nuisance. "Why is everybody trying to ruin my fun?" is their perspective.
yep. that's exactly it.
i always had a number of people close to me with behavioral health problems, including addiction, that ran too deep for "tough love" to mean anything to them. maybe that's why i feel like there's no such thing. at least no such thing as it working. if gentle love doesn't do it, you're going to need to step away.

I posted this ToughLove thread in 3 other forums and one person just posted....on the T.L. "shower them with love and kick their a$$ when needed" and of course the other groups have no comments like you folks..... unbelievable how others accept this info. And all those on the 3 forums know manner of posting info. They are open minded.

yep. that's exactly it.
i always had a number of people close to me with behavioral health problems, including addiction, that ran too deep for "tough love" to mean anything to them. maybe that's why i feel like there's no such thing. at least no such thing as it working. if gentle love doesn't do it, you're going to need to step away.

So many have to hit rock bottom to hopefully come up. Many make it, AA's rooms are filled with successes. And many don't get there.

I posted this ToughLove thread in 3 other forums and one person just posted....on the T.L. "shower them with love and kick their a$$ when needed" and of course the other groups have no comments like you folks..... unbelievable how others accept this info. And all those on the 3 forums know manner of posting info. They are open minded.

If you don't like the atmosphere here, then why do you stay?

Most forums are not 100% to one's total liking. Life is full of pluses and minuses.

No Caroline, it's your usual "I am the queen of all things healthy" nonsense. You were booted from the Politics Board and are trying to backdoor your agenda on this board. Only Dude is fooled by your little schemes.This thread has nothing to do with politics and you know it. You and the other haters who are still ganging up on Caroline slamming every cheap shot you can need to get a life. If you can't stand her that much, then don't read her threads and leave her alone.

Only Dude is fooled by your little schemes.

This thread has nothing to do with politics and you know it. You and the other haters who are still ganging up on Caroline slamming every cheap shot you can need to get a life. If you can't stand her that much, then don't read her threads and leave her alone.

Ok, make that two people…..

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Haters who keep ganging up on a member they are trying to drive away permanently is not ok. That is cyberbullying and needs to stop. It would be a lot kinder for Caroline's haters to put her on their ignore lists than keep harassing her in threads.

Your choices.:)

No need to be insulting toward someone just because of their opinion

No need to be insulting toward someone just because of their opinionCaroline wasn't being insulting in the post you quoted...

This thread has nothing to do with politics and you know it. You and the other haters who are still ganging up on Caroline slamming every cheap shot you can need to get a life. If you can't stand her that much, then don't read her threads and leave her alone.

Thank you icecream and I could say more, but you know my feelings and words...c:)

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Haters who keep ganging up on a member they are trying to drive away permanently is not ok. That is cyberbullying and needs to stop. It would be a lot kinder for Caroline's haters to put her on their ignore lists than keep harassing her in threads.

Maybe you should put me on *your* ignore list? It would be a lot kinder.

Maybe you should put me on *your* ignore list? It would be a lot kinder.I am not going into a thread you started and attacking the thread starter like you and others have done with Caroline. No one is ganging up on you...

The epitome, IMO, was when they recently had an otherwise benign thread moved to the political forum, just to prevent Caroline from commenting in it.

Maybe you should put me on *your* ignore list? It would be a lot kinder.

Maybe I should start forcing people on to ignore lists. It would eliminate a lot of the fighting and problems.

I suggested you add Dude111 to your ignore list, but it seems like you didn't follow my advice. He actually got upset at me for even suggesting it to you. He just wants people to like him and interact with him. It seems like he's willing to put up with the insults and people ganging up on him. He's told me that he doesn't let anything said with a keyboard bother him. It's just text on a screen.

People should just ignore Dude111 and Caroline 13. The constant cyberbullying and attacks need to stop. We need people to start acting like adults.

Maybe you should put me on *your* ignore list? It would be a lot kinder.
icecream is raising a perfectly valid point. You may not agree with Caroline, but I don't see what is accomplished by saying that in every one of her threads. It's completely within your power to ignore threads you dislike.

The epitome, IMO, was when they recently had an otherwise benign thread moved to the political forum, just to prevent Caroline from commenting in it.
It was a COVID thread, for Pete’s sake. The forum is called CHIT CHAT. How does COVID fit with CHIT CHAT? So it was moved to the Politics/COVID-19 board, key word COVID, in fact, the board was RENAMED to Politics/COVID-19 after “The Caroline era”. Did you not read the title of the thread nor did you respond to it AT ALL?

It was a COVID thread, for Pete’s sake. The forum is called CHIT CHAT. How does COVID fit with CHIT CHAT? So it was moved to the Politics/COVID-19 board, key word COVID, in fact, the board was RENAMED to Politics/COVID-19 after “The Caroline era”. Did you not read the title of the thread nor did you respond to it AT ALL?Covid doesn't fit in with Chit Chat because yes, it can get highly political. But that is true regardless of whether Caroline was here or not, it was not because of your "Caroline era" claim.

It was a COVID thread, for Pete’s sake. The forum is called CHIT CHAT. How does COVID fit with CHIT CHAT? So it was moved to the Politics/COVID-19 board, key word COVID, in fact, the board was RENAMED to Politics/COVID-19 after “The Caroline era”. Did you not read the title of the thread nor did you respond to it AT ALL?

The "cyberbullying" as TJ put it, is blatantly obvious. So was the driving motive in getting the thread moved.

Not a doubt in my mind that if that thread's only participants had been from the self-enamored Carolyn haters, no call for it to be moved would have been made.

Haters who keep ganging up on a member they are trying to drive away permanently is not ok. That is cyberbullying and needs to stop....They used to do that to me like crazy on imforums.com . They were also trying to drive me away,admin didnt care..... It went on for a few weeks and then they realised it wasnt working so they stopped....

People are very mean and cold now.. Probably for good reason. WE HAVE ALL HAD ENOUGH!!1

After 2000 stuff started getting worse and worse......

Thank you TJ for your comments..... No it doesnt really bother me buddy,just words on my screen and they mean nothing...... (No tone,no anger to hear,etc)

I didnt invite Carole here to be abused........ They are being mean to her on city-data,a place she has been for years with no problems until the last couple years... Carole has been the same there ever since,the same as she ever was.. The staff there who is mean anyway,just keeps getting meaner.......

THEY SHOULDNT BE ABLE TO TREAT PEOPLE LIKE THIS!!!!!