From the Clinton, Missouri Police Dept. Facebook Page:

NEW PUBLIC DETAILS ON 30TH ANNIVERSARY OF THE ANGELA HAMMOND ABDUCTION
April 4 marks the 30th anniversary of the disappearance of Angela Hammond. Known as “Angie” to her family and friends, she was a recent graduate of Clinton High School and was well known and popular in the small community of Clinton, MO. Angie was abducted from a pay telephone booth at the corner of Second and Jefferson Streets. There has been no sign of her since.
On this anniversary, we reiterate that Angela Hammond’s family is still in our prayers. We refuse to classify this case as “cold” because we continue to search for investigative leads daily. A day barely escapes us without work or discussion on the case being held.
Early in the investigation, a description of a suspect vehicle was developed based on the recollections of the person Angie was talking with on the phone at the time of being abducted. That was a 1970’s model Ford pickup truck with a fishing scene in the rear glass. Much of the early parts of the investigation centered around that vehicle description. Hundreds of leads involving vehicles matching that description were followed up on, but never produced any significant evidence.
As the investigation progressed over the years, investigators decided to expand investigative possibilities that did not necessarily include the specific vehicle description. This opened new theories and produced legs of the investigation that had yet to be thoroughly explored. As each of these leads were investigated, many were satisfactorily eliminated for one reason or another. A lead is never dismissed in whole or in part until there is enough contrary evidence. There are still several active and open leads being considered.
One of those leads originates from the Lake of the Ozarks region. A confidential informant played a crucial role in disrupting a significant illegal narcotics operation by testifying in a court proceeding. When the informant’s identity was disclosed during the case, he received a cryptic letter composed of cut and paste characters in the style of a ransom letter one might see in a movie about a kidnapping. The letter addresses the informant by the number that had been assigned to him to protect his identity before the court proceeding. It also mentions the informant’s estranged wife by first name. The letter was postmarked April 4, 1991, the exact date that Angela Hammond was abducted late that evening. The informant’s wife and his daughter- also named Angela- were living in Clinton, MO at that time.
After speaking with several people of interest and potential witnesses, the theory developed by investigators is that, in retribution for the informant providing information that led to the prosecution and disruption of this criminal enterprise, a person or persons involved in the criminal enterprise planned and executed the kidnapping of the informant’s daughter. Some mistake was made as to the identity of the targeted “Angie”, who had some physical resemblance to Angela Hammond, resulting in Hammond’s abduction.
While the theory seems incredible, investigators have come across information that lends credibility to it and have so far been unable to refute it. This information is being publicly provided, in part, now with a plea. If you have heard a story like this one, or you have any information that could be related to this leg of the investigation, please get in contact with Clinton Police Investigators. A photo of a copy of the letter has been added to this post with the wife’s name and the confidential informant number redacted to protect the privacy of that family.
Very recently, a person left an anonymous telephone message for us regarding the Angela Hammond case. That person specifically mentioned two names. You did not provide a means for us to recontact you. If that person is reading this message, please re-contact us so that we can speak with you in real time. We will protect your identity or assure your anonymity.

Ugh, I'd love to believe there is a glimmer of hope in finding out what happened. That story sounds bizarre. I've been to Clinton and it is EXTREMELY small and this sounds like high level mob behavior.

So....Rob still didn't do it.

So....Rob still didn't do it.

Even this won't convince some people.

Ugh, I'd love to believe there is a glimmer of hope in finding out what happened. That story sounds bizarre. I've been to Clinton and it is EXTREMELY small and this sounds like high level mob behavior.

^^^^

The odds that they went to Clinton and abducted a pregnant teenager talking to her boyfriend on the pay phone at night as they mistake her for someone else is extremely slim. According to Rob it was nighttime when they were talking on the phone, and she was at a phone booth near a store. How did they know where to find her and if she looked identical if it was dark outside?

Rob did it

So....Rob still didn't do it.

Wait... This happened near the Ozarks? Maybe Rob asked Marty Byrde do to him a favor and off Angela so he could help Marty launder money.

(That is probably about as likely as Rob doing it, so yeah...)

Ugh, I'd love to believe there is a glimmer of hope in finding out what happened. That story sounds bizarre. I've been to Clinton and it is EXTREMELY small and this sounds like high level mob behavior.

Not really. Just think about what happened to Wendy Camp, Cynthia Britto, and Lis Kreager.

Even this won't convince some people.

Even what? They state themselves this is a theory, this isn't proof of what did or didn't happen. It is hard to work out quite what they are saying-one would think there would have to have been a corrupt individual in the justice system they could track down if his informant number was quoted. Why has it taken 30 years to connect the two events or make that link public? We need some more details on all of this. The phone call could easily be a hoax from somebody with a grudge against somebody, or who wants to torment the family/waste police time after seeing publicity/appeals as we neared the 30th anniversary. Interesting for sure, but there is a hell of a lot of work to be done before this is solved, regardless of whether some people think Rob did it or not.

Ugh, I'd love to believe there is a glimmer of hope in finding out what happened. That story sounds bizarre. I've been to Clinton and it is EXTREMELY small and this sounds like high level mob behavior.

That kinda makes sense though for it being a good place to stash an informant.

If she called saying "This is Angela, can I speak to Rob?" and it's dark and she's about the same age and looks similar to the other Angela...seems legit to me.

It wasn't even known she was pregnant until YEARS after it happened - and most women don't look visibly pregnant until 5/6 months.

From the Clinton, Missouri Police Dept. Facebook Page:

NEW PUBLIC DETAILS ON 30TH ANNIVERSARY OF THE ANGELA HAMMOND ABDUCTION
April 4 marks the 30th anniversary of the disappearance of Angela Hammond. Known as “Angie” to her family and friends, she was a recent graduate of Clinton High School and was well known and popular in the small community of Clinton, MO. Angie was abducted from a pay telephone booth at the corner of Second and Jefferson Streets. There has been no sign of her since.
On this anniversary, we reiterate that Angela Hammond’s family is still in our prayers. We refuse to classify this case as “cold” because we continue to search for investigative leads daily. A day barely escapes us without work or discussion on the case being held.
Early in the investigation, a description of a suspect vehicle was developed based on the recollections of the person Angie was talking with on the phone at the time of being abducted. That was a 1970’s model Ford pickup truck with a fishing scene in the rear glass. Much of the early parts of the investigation centered around that vehicle description. Hundreds of leads involving vehicles matching that description were followed up on, but never produced any significant evidence.
As the investigation progressed over the years, investigators decided to expand investigative possibilities that did not necessarily include the specific vehicle description. This opened new theories and produced legs of the investigation that had yet to be thoroughly explored. As each of these leads were investigated, many were satisfactorily eliminated for one reason or another. A lead is never dismissed in whole or in part until there is enough contrary evidence. There are still several active and open leads being considered.
One of those leads originates from the Lake of the Ozarks region. A confidential informant played a crucial role in disrupting a significant illegal narcotics operation by testifying in a court proceeding. When the informant’s identity was disclosed during the case, he received a cryptic letter composed of cut and paste characters in the style of a ransom letter one might see in a movie about a kidnapping. The letter addresses the informant by the number that had been assigned to him to protect his identity before the court proceeding. It also mentions the informant’s estranged wife by first name. The letter was postmarked April 4, 1991, the exact date that Angela Hammond was abducted late that evening. The informant’s wife and his daughter- also named Angela- were living in Clinton, MO at that time.
After speaking with several people of interest and potential witnesses, the theory developed by investigators is that, in retribution for the informant providing information that led to the prosecution and disruption of this criminal enterprise, a person or persons involved in the criminal enterprise planned and executed the kidnapping of the informant’s daughter. Some mistake was made as to the identity of the targeted “Angie”, who had some physical resemblance to Angela Hammond, resulting in Hammond’s abduction.
While the theory seems incredible, investigators have come across information that lends credibility to it and have so far been unable to refute it. This information is being publicly provided, in part, now with a plea. If you have heard a story like this one, or you have any information that could be related to this leg of the investigation, please get in contact with Clinton Police Investigators. A photo of a copy of the letter has been added to this post with the wife’s name and the confidential informant number redacted to protect the privacy of that family.
Very recently, a person left an anonymous telephone message for us regarding the Angela Hammond case. That person specifically mentioned two names. You did not provide a means for us to recontact you. If that person is reading this message, please re-contact us so that we can speak with you in real time. We will protect your identity or assure your anonymity.

Meh...... This seems pretty far fetched. Anything is possible I suppose, but I think this is a prime example of a case that's been on the books so long and there is so much desperation to solve it that people start coming up with wild theories.

I still think this was the work of a plain sex offender who saw a sick opportunity and was just either smart or lucky enough to get away with it. From his supposedly unkept appearance he probably was a drifter who lived off the grid and survived by doing odd jobs, possibly on farms or ranches for under the table pay. Someone like that who leaves no paper trail would be hard to find, especially with so little physical evidence left behind.

Of course that's sheer speculation on my part. Hell Angie's abductor could be a big shot lawyer too. We won't know unless its solved, and at this point I'd have to say its unlikely.

I bet my left nut that Rob did it and this "breaking news" is hogwash

I bet my left nut that Rob did it and this "breaking news" is hogwash

While I don't rule him out totally I think the chances are like the woman at the car wash & many others on the show she was just an easy target for a predator-being a lone female on her own out late at night, at a remote location.

I certainly think the letter needs to be checked out & cannot understand why it hasn't been, or if it was why they haven't got to the bottom of who leaked his identity, but the phone call we have seen so many of them over the years & chances are it is just some crank with a grudge, or a time-waster/troll has seen publicity about the 30th anniversary with appeals being made & decided to torment the family &/or waste police time & resources.

It may have been a serial killer that happened to be in the area. Someone who's already in jail for another murder. Maybe already dead.

Okay, so I do not believe this new theory. Like at all. We are to believe that this person knew the informant's estranged wife by first name, as well as what ID number was assigned to the informant, but doesn't know the type of vehicle his daughter drives or what she looks like? That (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.3688262,-93.7741472,3a,75y,97.92h,78.83t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sXIZliNcetgRLSbXqbjtalQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656) is the parking lot where she was abducted shortly before midnight. This was a crime of opportunity. If someone was there to abduct her as retaliation of some sort, they wouldn't have done it while she was on the phone.

While I don't rule him out totally I think the chances are like the woman at the car wash & many others on the show she was just an easy target for a predator-being a lone female on her own out late at night, at a remote location.

Yeah possibly


That (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.3688262,-93.7741472,3a,75y,97.92h,78.83t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sXIZliNcetgRLSbXqbjtalQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656) is the parking lot where she was abducted shortly before midnight. This was a crime of opportunity. If someone was there to abduct her as retaliation of some sort, they wouldn't have done it while she was on the phone.

Agreed. Way too sloppy

What a nightmare for Rob. Hope he’s been able to reclaim somewhat of a normal life.

What a nightmare for Rob. Hope he’s been able to reclaim somewhat of a normal life.

Yes, he has a wife & kids now.

Clearly, the police have more information than they're releasing. This lead is pushed publicly with the hopes that someone will provide the final pieces of connective tissue that can help them make an arrest or announce a suspect.

All the folks here poo-pooing on the police's theory should adopt a wait-and-see approach.

The police would be stupid to divulge their ace card.

Clearly, the police have more information than they're releasing. This lead is pushed publicly with the hopes that someone will provide the final pieces of connective tissue that can help them make an arrest or announce a suspect.

All the folks here poo-pooing on the police's theory should adopt a wait-and-see approach.

The police would be stupid to divulge their ace card.

Police have jumped the gun and have been wrong before. The problem with this new police theory is that Angie have witnesses that say that she was out that night, and then was talking on the payphone.

How did these people know where to find her? According to Rob she was talking to him on a payphone late at night infront of a store. How did they know what she looked like it while it was nighttime with a phone up to her face? Unless someone is lying.

I'm sure since this is the 30th anniversary that the police are pulling anything out their ass to make it stick. This is the same police department that followed a bunk vehicle description for damn near 30 years.

Police have jumped the gun and have been wrong before. The problem with this new police theory is that Angie have witnesses that say that she was out that night, and then was talking on the payphone.

How did these people know where to find her? According to Rob she was talking to him on a payphone late at night infront of a store. How did they know what she looked like it while it was nighttime with a phone up to her face? Unless someone is lying.

I'm sure since this is the 30th anniversary that the police are pulling anything out their ass to make it stick. This is the same police department that followed a bunk vehicle description for damn near 30 years.

Jumping the gun? It's been 30 years....

And they could have been following her for while. Not saying I think that's what happened, but it's a small town. It's not that hard to to find someone if you really want to.

Police have jumped the gun and have been wrong before. The problem with this new police theory is that Angie have witnesses that say that she was out that night, and then was talking on the payphone.

How did these people know where to find her? According to Rob she was talking to him on a payphone late at night infront of a store. How did they know what she looked like it while it was nighttime with a phone up to her face? Unless someone is lying.

I'm sure since this is the 30th anniversary that the police are pulling anything out their ass to make it stick. This is the same police department that followed a bunk vehicle description for damn near 30 years.

How do you know its bunk? So far as any of us know, they haven't come up with enough info to debunk anything. The only way they could debunk the vehicle description is if they had good info that another kind of vehicle was involved in her abduction. and so far as I know that hasn't happened.

In all honesty, I don't think they have a damn thing. This latest theory reeks of desperation to me. To much time has passed, and there is to little physical evidence. If there is any at all.

Like I said, I think this was just some perverted creep possibly living off the grid doing odd jobs for a living. He saw a sick opportunity and just lucked out and got away with it. Its unfortunate and tragic for Angela's family, but it happens. I hope I'm wrong and they get him. Just have my doubts.

Jumping the gun? It's been 30 years....

And they could have been following her for while. Not saying I think that's what happened, but it's a small town. It's not that hard to to find someone if you really want to.

jumping the gun was the wrong term, but it doesn't seem like they have enough to go on but was desperate to say something because the 30th anniversary is coming up

Clearly, the police have more information than they're releasing. This lead is pushed publicly with the hopes that someone will provide the final pieces of connective tissue that can help them make an arrest or announce a suspect.

All the folks here poo-pooing on the police's theory should adopt a wait-and-see approach.

The police would be stupid to divulge their ace card.

Or like the Tara Calico case they have a theory & are throwing things out there hoping somebody will cough or make a mistake.

I think people want answers but aren’t expecting the police to just make something up that still leads nowhere. It’s a random abduction cold case. It’s probably never going to be solved.

I think people want answers but aren’t expecting the police to just make something up that still leads nowhere. It’s a random abduction cold case. It’s probably never going to be solved.

Bingo

The reason why this has grown cold and is virtually unsolvable is because of the randomness of it. Naturally the police want to check every lead and it seems like this release was them trying to get the person who contacted them recently to reach back out to them.

I think that Rob did it. Why would she call him on the payphone right after she dropped him off. If he didn't do it he was involved. She probably was pregnant and he didn't want the child.

I think that Rob did it. Why would she call him on the payphone right after she dropped him off. If he didn't do it he was involved. She probably was pregnant and he didn't want the child.

Yep. But after Angie dropped Rob off at home she went to a party with a friend, and then called Rob from the payphone after she returned home from the party.

I wonder if Angie, or someone else told Rob that Angie did something at the party that Rob didn't like and a fight broke out? They went to a barbeque earlier, and made plans to hang out later that night but things went grey while they were talking on the phone. I bet a fight broke out about something that happened at the party and Rob drove up to the payphone area in a rage

Or perhaps her "being too tired" to meet up later made him angry and caused a fight. Either way I'm sure he did it. He's the last to speak to her and see her then the "kidnapper" has the most common looking description and vehicle for the area

Yep. But after Angie dropped Rob off at home she went to a party with a friend, and then called Rob from the payphone after she returned home from the party.

I wonder if Angie, or someone else told Rob that Angie did something at the party that Rob didn't like and a fight broke out? They went to a barbeque earlier, and made plans to hang out later that night but things went grey while they were talking on the phone. I bet a fight broke out about something that happened at the party and Rob drove up to the payphone area in a rage

Or perhaps her "being too tired" to meet up later made him angry and caused a fight. Either way I'm sure he did it. He's the last to speak to her and see her then the "kidnapper" has the most common looking description and vehicle for the area

I'm fairly certain there were witnesses who said they saw Angela at the phone booth and observed the 'green' truck in the area. Rob's brother testified that everything happened the way he said, phone records check out as well.

Paging RobinW...

I'm fairly certain there were witnesses who said they saw Angela at the phone booth and observed the 'green' truck in the area. Rob's brother testified that everything happened the way he said, phone records check out as well.

I'm fairly certain that witnesses lie for people that they know who they think/want to be innocent all the time. There has been multiple cases where witness "sightings" have been false. I never recalled anyone saying that they saw Angela at the phone booth, though I never denied that. Some "witnesses" said that they saw the truck Rob described earlier in the day at different times.

And yeah, I never denied that Angela was on the phone, in fact that's part of my theory. That Rob and Angela were arguing over the phone and that Rob drove to the phone booth in the midst of their fight

I'm fairly certain that witnesses lie for people that they know who they think/want to be innocent all the time. There has been multiple cases where witness "sightings" have been false. I never recalled anyone saying that they saw Angela at the phone booth, though I never denied that. Some "witnesses" said that they saw the truck Rob described earlier in the day at different times.

And yeah, I never denied that Angela was on the phone, in fact that's part of my theory. That Rob and Angela were arguing over the phone and that Rob drove to the phone booth in the midst of their fight

I don't really get upset over people that don't want to rule Rob out like some do, but those who want to cling to it like grim dead like it is a personal thing is frankly a little creepy. Rob has stuck to his story and it checked out in multiple ways in addition to eyewitness testimony including phone records and the damage to his car. there was nothing to suggest he had a violent temper to the point where he'd go out and murder his girlfriend after an argument over the phone, and the police are always quick to blame family or friends if they have any evidence at all it may be them.

I personally don't think he did it because I don't think he had time to kill her, hide the body, and concoct this elaborate story from the time they were known to be on the phone to the time he reported the kidnapping, especially not if he went out and killed her in a fit of rage over an argument like you suggested.

For starters on your theory, if Angie knew Rob was coming down there and they had a fight bad enough on the phone to where he was mad enough to go down there and kill her, then why would she hang around there and wait for him to come down? If they had a fight that bad it stands to reason she would have told him goodnight then went to a friend's house or maybe family's house and give him a chance to cool down. And again, nothing to suggest he had a violent temper or anything like that at all.

There is just nothing to suggest Rob did it except he was the last known person to talk to her and happened to be the boyfriend. That's not enough to convict or even try someone, especially when the rest of his story checked out. To be investigated? Sure. But they did that and cleared him relatively quick.

I'm open minded enough to say that there is a slight chance Rob did it, because I wasn't there and none of us know for sure except him or possibly the kidnapper assuming he existed. But to say he is guilty for sure is just disingenuous and not supported by any known facts. And I don't have a big enough dog in this fight to defend Rob to the death, I don't even know the guy, nor does anyone on here. If I thought he did it, I'd say so.

I personally don't think he did it because I don't think he had time to kill her, hide the body, and concoct this elaborate story from the time they were known to be on the phone to the time he reported the kidnapping, especially not if he went out and killed her in a fit of rage over an argument like you suggested.

For starters on your theory, if Angie knew Rob was coming down there and they had a fight bad enough on the phone to where he was mad enough to go down there and kill her, then why would she hang around there and wait for him to come down? If they had a fight that bad it stands to reason she would have told him goodnight then went to a friend's house or maybe family's house and give him a chance to cool down. And again, nothing to suggest he had a violent temper or anything like that at all.

If Rob lied about how long he was on the phone with her, then that gives him enough time to hide her body. You're viewing this case as Rob had told the truth, but what if he didn't? Then that would change the time of events.

What if Angie didn't know Rob was coming down there? What if they were arguing and he dropped the phone and just drove up there without telling her? Also Rob's mother house was extremely close to the payphone, so I doubt she had that much time to get away.

And how would we know if he didn't have a temper from a 2-minute interview on UM? None of saw him in his everyday life to deduce if he had a temper or not. Some people can appear calm and still have raging tempers.

If Rob lied about how long he was on the phone with her, then that gives him enough time to hide her body. You're viewing this case as Rob had told the truth, but what if he didn't? Then that would change the time of events.

What if Angie didn't know Rob was coming down there? What if they were arguing and he dropped the phone and just drove up there without telling her? Also Rob's mother house was extremely close to the payphone, so I doubt she had that much time to get away.

And how would we know if he didn't have a temper from a 2-minute interview on UM? None of saw him in his everyday life to deduce if he had a temper or not. Some people can appear calm and still have raging tempers.

Pretty sure phone company records said how long he was on the phone with her. And yeah his mother's house was close, but not THAT close. All Angela had to do was walk thirty feet to her car and drive off, which would have taken less than a minute. and even if she didn't know Rob was coming why would she hang around there anyway?

As to how we know Rob didn't have a violent temper, I simply said nothing had surfaced whatsoever to indicate he did from anyone who knew him. Maybe he did, but if he did it would involve a lot of people either lying or not saying anything about it. Some of them Angela's family who are obviously not going to lie for him.

You also have to believe that Rob deliberately damaged his car in an effort to support a concocted story about being involved in a chase. I'd have to say that's unlikely for a relatively young man with no criminal experience to dream that up. Least of all one who had committed a murder in a fit of anger. I could be wrong.

Like I said, I cannot say definitively Rob was not involved. But you have to grasp at a lot of straws to believe it like it is a fact, which I think you are doing.

You're viewing this case as Rob had told the truth, but what if he didn't?

Then I doubt that the investigators would have spent years investigating the case as a crime of opportunity stranger abduction, to suddenly about face and posit that it could have been a case of mistaken identity...neither of which scenario has Rob's involvement.

Pretty sure phone company records said how long he was on the phone with her. And yeah his mother's house was close, but not THAT close. All Angela had to do was walk thirty feet to her car and drive off, which would have taken less than a minute. and even if she didn't know Rob was coming why would she hang around there anyway?

As to how we know Rob didn't have a violent temper, I simply said nothing had surfaced whatsoever to indicate he did from anyone who knew him. Maybe he did, but if he did it would involve a lot of people either lying or not saying anything about it. Some of them Angela's family who are obviously not going to lie for him.

You also have to believe that Rob deliberately damaged his car in an effort to support a concocted story about being involved in a chase. I'd have to say that's unlikely for a relatively young man with no criminal experience to dream that up. Least of all one who had committed a murder in a fit of anger. I could be wrong.

Like I said, I cannot say definitively Rob was not involved. But you have to grasp at a lot of straws to believe it like it is a fact, which I think you are doing.

The phone records show how long the phones were connected, but if one or both people dropped the phone without hanging it up then the time would've continued to count even without them talking.

You say I'm grasping at straws, but you're really grasping at straws. Rob and Angie lived together close to the payphone, let's say Angie didn't decide to wait and went home. Then Rob could've easily just found her at home as they lived together. There are many variables in which Rob could've went up there and met Angie at home or at the payphone

And why would everyone know if Rob had a temper? He could've hid his temper well. Maybe he only showed his temper when he got really upset. Maybe he didn't have a temper but whatever they were fighting about caused him to get mad. People are way more complex than what you make them out to be. You can't say he did or didn't have a temper based on a 2-minute interview on UM. All of his family and friends weren't interviewed about his behavior, only Angie's mother.

Who said he deliberately damaged his car? Why would he have to deliberately damage his car? What if he damaged his vehicle by dumping Angie's body somewhere on rough terrain and his car got damaged in the process and he made-up the story of him chasing the kidnapper to fit in with his busted vehicle to concoct a believable story?

Then I doubt that the investigators would have spent years investigating the case as a crime of opportunity stranger abduction

based on Rob's story. which led them nowhere. I wonder why?

to suddenly about face and posit that it could have been a case of mistaken identity...neither of which scenario has Rob's involvement.

if it comes out that this story is correct, then I'll gladly admit that I was wrong. I'll wear a "Rob is innocent" shirt every single day for a year

based on Rob's story. which led them nowhere. I wonder why?

Because stranger abductions are statistically rare and are therefore more difficult to solve, especially when you take into account the area where this abduction occurred and the limited resources that the police department had at the time?

Then when you factor in that Angela was last seen alive by her friend at 11:15 p.m. that night, and that Rob Shafer was picked up by a passing motorist who took him to the police station just shy of midnight, meaning he would have had no more than 45 minutes to kill Angela, hide her body in an area that has never been discovered, cause the damage to his truck's transmission, plant Angela's truck at the payphone in the middle of town, make up a fake abduction story, and then get lucky enough to have a passing good Samaritan pick him up and take him to the police station to report what had just happened...I think it's safe to say that the Rob did it theory is total fantasy that is not supported by any evidence just like the Charles Holden segment.

I think it's safe to say that the Rob did it theory is total fantasy that is not supported by any evidence just like the Charles Holden segment.

Not a fantasy at all. I totally think Rob did it, but we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Bringing up Charles Holden is interesting. I thought about that case when thinking about this one, which made me question if Rob was innocent or not, but I do think he's guilty. I'll be happy to be wrong if it turns out he had nothing to do with it

I think it unlikely Rob is responsible. Can you imagine if you are innocent not only seeing your partner who is carrying your child taken away to her & the unborn child's death & unable to prevent it & then have 30 years of people saying you did it? He probably had to move out of that area due to accusations.

I don't think Rob did this. His story was credible, and and I'm glad he wasn't arrested/accused of the crime. There have been many cases of people being unjustly arrested and/or accused of crimes against loved ones/family members - when they had nothing to do with them. Just because the first person to be suspected (is the person closest to the victim) doesn't mean that person is guilty.

As I've said, I do believe this was a crime of opportunity. Small town late at night when the businesses around had shut down; isolated pay-phone, etc. I do believe the perp. was someone just passing through & didn't live in the town/area.

This reminds me somewhat of the Christi Nichols case - the only difference being Rob doesn't come off as a 'good ol' boy' like Mark Nichols did. I would think, that in a small town too, with a guy like Rob - if he did do it, either he'd slip up by now, or someone (not necessarily the authorities) would connect him to it.

With no tangible evidence, those are the only two things that could possibly implicate him (beyond all the supposition presented here)

With no tangible evidence

There were two eyewitnesses who also saw the fish decal truck in the parking lot around 11:30 a.m. that night, as well as Rob's truck with a damaged transmission being found on the outskirts of town are tangible evidence that he had nothing to do with it.

Rob is a victim in all this as well. He lost his fiancé and his unborn child.
He has been ruled out based on concrete evidence decades ago.

Blaming him is just cruel.

Delete

I will say that I do think there is a possibilty that he is innocent. My other theory is that Rob was talking on the phone with Angela and she either screamed or dropped the phone and when he went up there she was gone and he dont know what happened. He couldve made up the story about the truck and kidnapper and the overly detailed description Angie gave so he wouldnt be a suspect.

I just dont buy his overly dramatic "so close but so far" teenage hollywood romp sad coming of age movie script story.

If hes actually innocent or not? Who knows

This reminds me somewhat of the Christi Nichols case - the only difference being Rob doesn't come off as a 'good ol' boy' like Mark Nichols did. I would think, that in a small town too, with a guy like Rob - if he did do it, either he'd slip up by now, or someone (not necessarily the authorities) would connect him to it.

With no tangible evidence, those are the only two things that could possibly implicate him (beyond all the supposition presented here)

Not sure how long ago he left, but he was not living in that town as of a few years back as per his social media. This actually reminds me more of the case where the guy gave a lift to that crazy guy outside the supermarket, he turned crazy on him in the car-he managed to get away from him & then later saw him near his mothers house, when he went there the guy had killed her & it took something like 15 years before they finally traced the guy through DNA-he was deemed guilty by many for quite a while after.

Rob is a victim in all this as well. He lost his fiancé and his unborn child.
He has been ruled out based on concrete evidence decades ago.

Blaming him is just cruel.

Interestingly enough, I did stumble across an old article years ago which mentioned that Angela's ex-boyfriend, who was thought to be the possible father of the unborn child, was looked at as more of a serious suspect after the police cleared Rob. The ex-boyfriend too was eventually cleared, but it didn't seem like these cops bought into the stranger abduction theory initially, which probably hurt the chances of solving it.

The phone records show how long the phones were connected, but if one or both people dropped the phone without hanging it up then the time would've continued to count even without them talking.

You say I'm grasping at straws, but you're really grasping at straws. Rob and Angie lived together close to the payphone, let's say Angie didn't decide to wait and went home. Then Rob could've easily just found her at home as they lived together. There are many variables in which Rob could've went up there and met Angie at home or at the payphone

And why would everyone know if Rob had a temper? He could've hid his temper well. Maybe he only showed his temper when he got really upset. Maybe he didn't have a temper but whatever they were fighting about caused him to get mad. People are way more complex than what you make them out to be. You can't say he did or didn't have a temper based on a 2-minute interview on UM. All of his family and friends weren't interviewed about his behavior, only Angie's mother.

Who said he deliberately damaged his car? Why would he have to deliberately damage his car? What if he damaged his vehicle by dumping Angie's body somewhere on rough terrain and his car got damaged in the process and he made-up the story of him chasing the kidnapper to fit in with his busted vehicle to concoct a believable story?

Angie's car was still at the parking lot where she was supposed to have been abducted, so she couldn't have gone home. If Rob did anything to her, he would basically have to have abducted her from the parking lot like he claims the bearded man did, because its unlikely she would have went anywhere on foot.

Also, I would think that the police verified with a local mechanic the damage to Rob's car was likely consistent with what he said he did, throwing the car in reverse trying to turn around quickly. Taking the car over rough terrain like you suggest would have likely had different kind of damage, and there likely would have been mud in the tires or some such thing. Can't imagine that the police did not verify that element of his story. Had it proven to be false, a cloud of suspicion would have hovered over him a lot longer than it did.

Again, yes Rob could have had a terrible temper. He might be the dirtiest SOB who ever lived. There is simply nothing to indicate that.

Angie's car was still at the parking lot where she was supposed to have been abducted, so she couldn't have gone home. If Rob did anything to her, he would basically have to have abducted her from the parking lot like he claims the bearded man did, because its unlikely she would have went anywhere on foot.

Also, I would think that the police verified with a local mechanic the damage to Rob's car was likely consistent with what he said he did, throwing the car in reverse trying to turn around quickly. Taking the car over rough terrain like you suggest would have likely had different kind of damage, and there likely would have been mud in the tires or some such thing. Can't imagine that the police did not verify that element of his story. Had it proven to be false, a cloud of suspicion would have hovered over him a lot longer than it did.

Again, yes Rob could have had a terrible temper. He might be the dirtiest SOB who ever lived. There is simply nothing to indicate that.

Hopefully this case will be solved with this recent news. I wonder if I'll be proven wrong? We'll see.

Anyone care to make a bet? I got $10 that Rob did it

I just dont buy his overly dramatic "so close but so far" teenage hollywood romp sad coming of age movie script story.

I completely agree.

I don't want to suspect Rob's involvement because he seems like a genuine guy. But I just have too many issues with his story of the kidnapping.

As Freak says, there are just too many details he gave that sound too unusual and too melodramatic for real life:

- The dramatic scream into the phone. This is one of my more minor nits, but nonetheless it sounds overly dramatic and something from a movie.

- Just so happening to pass the kidnapper and Angie on the main drag and hearing, "Robbie!!!" This sounds unrealistic and unlikely. I don't think it's likely anyone can make out anything anyone screams at them when vehicles pass in opposite directions.

- The car gave out just as he made that last turn. Again, this sounds like bad melodrama from TV and the movies. Of course this really could have happened, but I just don't have a good gut feeling about it, especially with all these other items on the list.

-"All I saw was brake lights and dust." Again, this sounds like things from a movie, not real life. It sounds exactly like what someone would make up if they were gonna put themselves into a dramatic story in which they failed to stop a kidnapping.

-No witnesses. I can't believe that this happened on a main drag in Clinton, Mo, yet not a one person witnessed the abduction and/or car chase. Late at night or not late at night. But yet, that's what we have here, according to Rob.

-"I didn't have to use the phone anyway." This, I think, is the biggest giveaway that Rob knows more than he's telling. This little gem is so unlikely and unbelievable it's laughable. No kidnapper no matter how nefarious would actually take a few seconds out of his abduction to speak these insipid and useless words into the telephone receiver. Every second you spend on the crime is an extra second you could get caught. I'm sorry, but this little mic drop from the kidnapper isn't the least bit believable -- but yet again, it smacks of someone who is much more involved than they're letting on. It's the ultimate in made up details to make one's story sound intense and dramatic.

Now, of course I don't know for sure that Rob was involved in Angie's disappearance. But I think there's a very good chance that he was.

I completely agree.

I don't want to suspect Rob's involvement because he seems like a genuine guy. But I just have too many issues with his story of the kidnapping.

As Freak says, there are just too many details he gave that sound too unusual and too melodramatic for real life:

- The dramatic scream into the phone. This is one of my more minor nits, but nonetheless it sounds overly dramatic and something from a movie.

- Just so happening to pass the kidnapper and Angie on the main drag and hearing, "Robbie!!!" This sounds unrealistic and unlikely. I don't think it's likely anyone can make out anything anyone screams at them when vehicles pass in opposite directions.

- The car gave out just as he made that last turn. Again, this sounds like bad melodrama from TV and the movies. Of course this really could have happened, but I just don't have a good gut feeling about it, especially with all these other items on the list.

-"All I saw was brake lights and dust." Again, this sounds like things from a movie, not real life. It sounds exactly like what someone would make up if they were gonna put themselves into a dramatic story in which they failed to stop a kidnapping.

-No witnesses. I can't believe that this happened on a main drag in Clinton, Mo, yet not a one person witnessed the abduction and/or car chase. Late at night or not late at night. But yet, that's what we have here, according to Rob.

-"I didn't have to use the phone anyway." This, I think, is the biggest giveaway that Rob knows more than he's telling. This little gem is so unlikely and unbelievable it's laughable. No kidnapper no matter how nefarious would actually take a few seconds out of his abduction to speak these insipid and useless words into the telephone receiver. Every second you spend on the crime is an extra second you could get caught. I'm sorry, but this little mic drop from the kidnapper isn't the least bit believable -- but yet again, it smacks of someone who is much more involved than they're letting on. It's the ultimate in made up details to make one's story sound intense and dramatic.

Now, of course I don't know for sure that Rob was involved in Angie's disappearance. But I think there's a very good chance that he was.

It was too perfect. Not one other soul was downtown--not one?? Then I read that she was pregnant. Rob was a young guy with his entire life ahead of him--maybe he didn't want a kid. Why would she call him if they just left each other---sounds stupid to me. My guy is telling me that Rob did it or had something to do with it. That clean cut american boy crap doesn't fly with me.

I completely agree.

I don't want to suspect Rob's involvement because he seems like a genuine guy. But I just have too many issues with his story of the kidnapping.

As Freak says, there are just too many details he gave that sound too unusual and too melodramatic for real life:

- The dramatic scream into the phone. This is one of my more minor nits, but nonetheless it sounds overly dramatic and something from a movie.

- Just so happening to pass the kidnapper and Angie on the main drag and hearing, "Robbie!!!" This sounds unrealistic and unlikely. I don't think it's likely anyone can make out anything anyone screams at them when vehicles pass in opposite directions.

- The car gave out just as he made that last turn. Again, this sounds like bad melodrama from TV and the movies. Of course this really could have happened, but I just don't have a good gut feeling about it, especially with all these other items on the list.

-"All I saw was brake lights and dust." Again, this sounds like things from a movie, not real life. It sounds exactly like what someone would make up if they were gonna put themselves into a dramatic story in which they failed to stop a kidnapping.

-No witnesses. I can't believe that this happened on a main drag in Clinton, Mo, yet not a one person witnessed the abduction and/or car chase. Late at night or not late at night. But yet, that's what we have here, according to Rob.

-"I didn't have to use the phone anyway." This, I think, is the biggest giveaway that Rob knows more than he's telling. This little gem is so unlikely and unbelievable it's laughable. No kidnapper no matter how nefarious would actually take a few seconds out of his abduction to speak these insipid and useless words into the telephone receiver. Every second you spend on the crime is an extra second you could get caught. I'm sorry, but this little mic drop from the kidnapper isn't the least bit believable -- but yet again, it smacks of someone who is much more involved than they're letting on. It's the ultimate in made up details to make one's story sound intense and dramatic.

Now, of course I don't know for sure that Rob was involved in Angie's disappearance. But I think there's a very good chance that he was.

There were witnesses at the time who came forward that saw the truck circling the phone booth. Police did a thorough investigation of Rob because the story sounded very unlikely and he was cleared. Phone records and his brothers testimony also helped.

There were witnesses at the time who came forward that saw the truck circling the phone booth. Police did a thorough investigation of Rob because the story sounded very unlikely and he was cleared. Phone records and his brothers testimony also helped.

I wouldn't bet my last dollar on those "witnesses". Probably friends or family of Rob's who didn't want him locked up.

These witnesses saw the vehicle, but no one else outside of that town could identify it? According to the police they went through a deep search for the vehicle, but turned up absolutely nothing. No one in the kidnapper's neighborhood couldn't identify a big ass pick-up truck with a fish decal on the back?

It's funny how these witnesses remembered seeing the vehicle, but not one glanced at the license plate? Even Rob who not only chased it, but sat behind while he watched him drive off didn't even look at it?

Rob was only cleared because there was no evidence or body. It's important to keep in mind that he wasn't cleared because of forensics or anything damning. They were able to see that a call did come from his mother's house to the payphone, and his brother backed that up. So again, he wasn't cleared because of anything critical

I think previous posters are so hellbent on blaming Rob that they're looking for something that isn't there and making the classic investigative mistake of twisting facts to fit theories. To use the points against Rob made in a post above:

- The dramatic scream into the phone. This is one of my more minor nits, but nonetheless it sounds overly dramatic and something from a movie.

So let me get this straight. You're telling me that if you're chatting with someone on the phone and you're suddenly attacked...you're just going to be totally silent and take it? You won't yell in surprise and/or start fighting back?

- Just so happening to pass the kidnapper and Angie on the main drag and hearing, "Robbie!!!" This sounds unrealistic and unlikely. I don't think it's likely anyone can make out anything anyone screams at them when vehicles pass in opposite directions.

If it's a warm night and assuming Rob's window is open it's certainly possible this could happen. UM even proved it was possible because they showed that exact moment in the reenactment.

- The car gave out just as he made that last turn. Again, this sounds like bad melodrama from TV and the movies. Of course this really could have happened, but I just don't have a good gut feeling about it, especially with all these other items on the list.

What "Last turn" are you talking about? Are you saying the killer took her just up the road beyond Rob's sight and killed her there? I'm pretty sure there were at least a few more turns before the killer arrived wherever he was going. There was no "last turn" in this, it just happened to be that turn (and Rob's mangling of the gears trying to turn around when he spotted the truck) that killed the car.

-"All I saw was brake lights and dust." Again, this sounds like things from a movie, not real life. It sounds exactly like what someone would make up if they were gonna put themselves into a dramatic story in which they failed to stop a kidnapping.

If it's a dusty road and/or a dirty vehicle, that's EXACTLY when you would see if you watched the back of a truck driving away. As for the license plate...If this was a serial killer or hitman I would say there's a very good chance it was removed or caked with mud to make it illegible. If there was one, it probably would've been one pulled from another vehicle.

-No witnesses. I can't believe that this happened on a main drag in Clinton, Mo, yet not a one person witnessed the abduction and/or car chase. Late at night or not late at night. But yet, that's what we have here, according to Rob.

I know in my area there are spots that are busy during the day but very quiet in the middle of the night. This is totally believable. As mentioned, they did in fact have witnesses to seeing the truck. This means that according to your theory, Rob's little brother (young enough to need babysitting), these random witnesses, and the mechanic that verified the damage all entered a conspiracy that involved lying to police and covering up a murder. THAT'S what I'd call melodramatic.

-"I didn't have to use the phone anyway." This, I think, is the biggest giveaway that Rob knows more than he's telling. This little gem is so unlikely and unbelievable it's laughable. No kidnapper no matter how nefarious would actually take a few seconds out of his abduction to speak these insipid and useless words into the telephone receiver. Every second you spend on the crime is an extra second you could get caught. I'm sorry, but this little mic drop from the kidnapper isn't the least bit believable -- but yet again, it smacks of someone who is much more involved than they're letting on. It's the ultimate in made up details to make one's story sound intense and dramatic.

Of course the killer didn't take the time to talk into the receiver. He was taunting Angela as he was subduing her. Rob just happened to hear it through the phone. Angela had asked the guy if he wanted the phone because she was becoming concerned about him hanging around. This is actually a point toward the offender being a serial killer as these types of killers often take pleasure in taunting their victims.


The bottom line is that the evidence points to a third party abduction, possibly the result of a mistaken identity hit as has been the main theory in recent years.

I've said it before and I'll say it again -- I don't think Rob did it...but I find it highly unusual that Angela decided to give Rob a highly detailed description of the kidnapper - seriously...head to toe including the color make and model of his truck..before that person kidnapped her.

The police were probably taken back by the details they were given, because that is basically the single most detailed eyewitness description of a criminal, maybe ever. They either thought they would catch this guy in 20 minutes...

OR maybe they thought -- this statement by the boyfriend of the pregnant missing girl sounds a little too prepared and a little too detailed?

Again, I don't think Rob did it but I can see why a skeptic would lean towards him.

I think previous posters are so hellbent on blaming Rob that they're looking for something that isn't there and making the classic investigative mistake of twisting facts to fit theories. To use the points against Rob made in a post above:

- The dramatic scream into the phone. This is one of my more minor nits, but nonetheless it sounds overly dramatic and something from a movie.

So let me get this straight. You're telling me that if you're chatting with someone on the phone and you're suddenly attacked...you're just going to be totally silent and take it? You won't yell in surprise and/or start fighting back?

- Just so happening to pass the kidnapper and Angie on the main drag and hearing, "Robbie!!!" This sounds unrealistic and unlikely. I don't think it's likely anyone can make out anything anyone screams at them when vehicles pass in opposite directions.

If it's a warm night and assuming Rob's window is open it's certainly possible this could happen. UM even proved it was possible because they showed that exact moment in the reenactment.

- The car gave out just as he made that last turn. Again, this sounds like bad melodrama from TV and the movies. Of course this really could have happened, but I just don't have a good gut feeling about it, especially with all these other items on the list.

What "Last turn" are you talking about? Are you saying the killer took her just up the road beyond Rob's sight and killed her there? I'm pretty sure there were at least a few more turns before the killer arrived wherever he was going. There was no "last turn" in this, it just happened to be that turn (and Rob's mangling of the gears trying to turn around when he spotted the truck) that killed the car.

-"All I saw was brake lights and dust." Again, this sounds like things from a movie, not real life. It sounds exactly like what someone would make up if they were gonna put themselves into a dramatic story in which they failed to stop a kidnapping.

If it's a dusty road and/or a dirty vehicle, that's EXACTLY when you would see if you watched the back of a truck driving away. As for the license plate...If this was a serial killer or hitman I would say there's a very good chance it was removed or caked with mud to make it illegible. If there was one, it probably would've been one pulled from another vehicle.

-No witnesses. I can't believe that this happened on a main drag in Clinton, Mo, yet not a one person witnessed the abduction and/or car chase. Late at night or not late at night. But yet, that's what we have here, according to Rob.

I know in my area there are spots that are busy during the day but very quiet in the middle of the night. This is totally believable. As mentioned, they did in fact have witnesses to seeing the truck. This means that according to your theory, Rob's little brother (young enough to need babysitting), these random witnesses, and the mechanic that verified the damage all entered a conspiracy that involved lying to police and covering up a murder. THAT'S what I'd call melodramatic.

-"I didn't have to use the phone anyway." This, I think, is the biggest giveaway that Rob knows more than he's telling. This little gem is so unlikely and unbelievable it's laughable. No kidnapper no matter how nefarious would actually take a few seconds out of his abduction to speak these insipid and useless words into the telephone receiver. Every second you spend on the crime is an extra second you could get caught. I'm sorry, but this little mic drop from the kidnapper isn't the least bit believable -- but yet again, it smacks of someone who is much more involved than they're letting on. It's the ultimate in made up details to make one's story sound intense and dramatic.

Of course the killer didn't take the time to talk into the receiver. He was taunting Angela as he was subduing her. Rob just happened to hear it through the phone. Angela had asked the guy if he wanted the phone because she was becoming concerned about him hanging around. This is actually a point toward the offender being a serial killer as these types of killers often take pleasure in taunting their victims.


The bottom line is that the evidence points to a third party abduction, possibly the result of a mistaken identity hit as has been the main theory in recent years.

Exactly this.

I've said it before and I'll say it again -- I don't think Rob did it...but I find it highly unusual that Angela decided to give Rob a highly detailed description of the kidnapper - seriously...head to toe including the color make and model of his truck..before that person kidnapped her.

The police were probably taken back by the details they were given, because that is basically the single most detailed eyewitness description of a criminal, maybe ever. They either thought they would catch this guy in 20 minutes...

OR maybe they thought -- this statement by the boyfriend of the pregnant missing girl sounds a little too prepared and a little too detailed?

Again, I don't think Rob did it but I can see why a skeptic would lean towards him.

Without context, I would agree with this. However, Clinton has been described as a very small and rural town. Back when this happened, IIRC, Angela did not have a phone in her home. She was chatting with Rob on the payphone and told him about the guy pulling up. Rob probably asked her to describe him to see if he knew who it was. Something mundane and normal has morphed into this detail that seems so unusual.

Without context, I would agree with this. However, Clinton has been described as a very small and rural town. Back when this happened, IIRC, Angela did not have a phone in her home. She was chatting with Rob on the payphone and told him about the guy pulling up. Rob probably asked her to describe him to see if he knew who it was. Something mundane and normal has morphed into this detail that seems so unusual.

What do you think about Angie calling Rob's name from the truck? Do you think that actually happened?

I'm seriously asking. Not asking as an argument

.

What do you think about Angie calling Rob's name from the truck? Do you think that actually happened?

I'm seriously asking. Not asking as an argument

I think Rob believes he heard her yell his name. Whether or not she was screaming and he misheard it or she legitimately saw his vehicle and screamed for him are equally plausible to me.

The bottom line is that the evidence points to a third party abduction, possibly the result of a mistaken identity hit as has been the main theory in recent years.

Is this a theory on the boards or an actual theory that LE is following?

Hopefully this case will be solved with this recent news. I wonder if I'll be proven wrong? We'll see.

Anyone care to make a bet? I got $10 that Rob did it

I will take you up on that offer, if it's still on the table...;)

Is this a theory on the boards or an actual theory that LE is following?

That is the new theory that LE is pushing. They think Angela was mistaken as the daughter of a drug informant who was going to testify against this massive drug dealing ring. They also now think that Rob got the description (color IIRC) of the truck wrong.

I will take you up on that offer, if it's still on the table...;)

Yes. I'll send you my paypal address in PM

That is the new theory that LE is pushing. They think Angela was mistaken as the daughter of a drug informant who was going to testify against this massive drug dealing ring. They also now think that Rob got the description (color IIRC) of the truck wrong.

Still don't believe this for one minute. I think its just a desperate far fetched theory they are coming up with to try and solve an unsolvable case. Unsolvable because to much time has passed and there is simply no physical evidence or suspects.

I still think this case is exactly what it looks like, some perverted loser like a Dale Wayne Eaton (the Lil Miss killer) saw a sick opportunity, got lucky and got away with it. Probably because he lives off the grid and does odd jobs on farms or some such thing and comes into contact with a limited number of people so few people know who he is. The shabby appearance and old truck make that the most likely theory. Angie is probably buried on a piddlin piece of land he might have owned just like Eaton in some obscure place that no one has ever found.

Still don't believe this for one minute. I think its just a desperate far fetched theory they are coming up with to try and solve an unsolvable case. Unsolvable because to much time has passed and there is simply no physical evidence or suspects.

I still think this case is exactly what it looks like, some perverted loser like a Dale Wayne Eaton (the Lil Miss killer) saw a sick opportunity, got lucky and got away with it. Probably because he lives off the grid and does odd jobs on farms or some such thing and comes into contact with a limited number of people so few people know who he is. The shabby appearance and old truck make that the most likely theory. Angie is probably buried on a piddlin piece of land he might have owned just like Eaton in some obscure place that no one has ever found.

I don't disagree. I think some creep spotted Angela talking on the phone and decided to abduct her. A crime of opportunity. The one thing that has always nagged me about this case: Clinton was a very small, rural town. Why was this guy, if this was indeed a stranger abduction, passing through downtown Clinton? And if he was semi-local, how did no one recognize a guy driving a similar truck in the area?

I don't disagree. I think some creep spotted Angela talking on the phone and decided to abduct her. A crime of opportunity. The one thing that has always nagged me about this case: Clinton was a very small, rural town. Why was this guy, if this was indeed a stranger abduction, passing through downtown Clinton? And if he was semi-local, how did no one recognize a guy driving a similar truck in the area?

The truck part has always bothered me. Assuming Rob is innocent which most of us believe he is, then the description, especially that of the fish decal, was very specific. How has NO ONE ever come forward seeing that decal, making that decal, selling that decal in a store, etc.? It's just crazy to me that there have been no known leads on the decal.

The truck part has always bothered me. Assuming Rob is innocent which most of us believe he is, then the description, especially that of the fish decal, was very specific. How has NO ONE ever come forward seeing that decal, making that decal, selling that decal in a store, etc.? It's just crazy to me that there have been no known leads on the decal.

I am still convinced that the decal was removed after the abduction. The truck could have been otherwise modified (i.e. painted a different color, rims or tires replaced) too. Someone with the right tools and skill could do this privately without going to a shop.

Also with this whole "Rob did it" crap I've seen coming up again lately, I think two things cannot be faked: 1) the phone call from the phone booth (presumably the police checked phone records to verify the call), and, 2) while I suppose it is possible, it would be nearly impossible for Rob to fake his car's transmission failure at that time and at that place on the road.

I am still convinced that the decal was removed after the abduction. The truck could have been otherwise modified (i.e. painted a different color, rims or tires replaced) too. Someone with the right tools and skill could do this privately without going to a shop.

I agree, but that decal was still either sold at some shop or installed professionally by someone. I'm just surprised that nothing ever came of it as far as leads go.

I am still convinced that the decal was removed after the abduction. The truck could have been otherwise modified (i.e. painted a different color, rims or tires replaced) too. Someone with the right tools and skill could do this privately without going to a shop.

My problem is beforehand. Even if the decal was taken off afterwards, there should've been someone who seen it before. A neighbor, family member, mailman, there should've been someone who could've identified the truck.

It literally turned up no leads

The truck part has always bothered me. Assuming Rob is innocent which most of us believe he is, then the description, especially that of the fish decal, was very specific. How has NO ONE ever come forward seeing that decal, making that decal, selling that decal in a store, etc.? It's just crazy to me that there have been no known leads on the decal.

Angela's case reminds me of the Elizabeth Campbell disappearance, more than it does the other two women mentioned on the broadcast. Both women were last seen talking on a payphone. Elizabeth's boyfriend was quickly cleared by law enforcement, just like Rob. And just like Angela's disappearance, the police held on vital information for years before releasing it with the hopes of someone coming forward: Elizabeth was last seen getting into a white vehicle with a maroon top...something they never revealed publicly until about 2018 or so. Which is also what they did with Angela: they now thing Rob may have gotten the make or color wrong of the truck.

Angela's case reminds me of the Elizabeth Campbell disappearance, more than it does the other two women mentioned on the broadcast. Both women were last seen talking on a payphone. Elizabeth's boyfriend was quickly cleared by law enforcement, just like Rob. And just like Angela's disappearance, the police held on vital information for years before releasing it with the hopes of someone coming forward: Elizabeth was last seen getting into a white vehicle with a maroon top...something they never revealed publicly until about 2018 or so. Which is also what they did with Angela: they now thing Rob may have gotten the make or color wrong of the truck.

Rob was likely in a state of pure panic. Kind of like what some witnesses and victims experience with what is known as weapon focus. So, I'll grant that the abductor's truck information may not be completely accurate.

Still - explain the phone call (again, I am assuming the PD verified this with the phone company), and, the transmission breakdown of Rob's own car in that moment, at that place. The man is innocent and apparently has spent decades beating himself up for "not getting the job done."

I don't disagree. I think some creep spotted Angela talking on the phone and decided to abduct her. A crime of opportunity. The one thing that has always nagged me about this case: Clinton was a very small, rural town. Why was this guy, if this was indeed a stranger abduction, passing through downtown Clinton? And if he was semi-local, how did no one recognize a guy driving a similar truck in the area?

Clinton is only about an hour or so from Kansas City, which is basically a hub for interstates going several directions as are several areas in that part of the country. Not terribly hard to get various places he could have come from any of the surrounding states: Kansas, Iowa, somewhere else in Missouri, or Illinois.

Like I said, I think he could very well have been a transient who did odd jobs on farms or ranches (maybe landscaping or fixing farm equipment or some such thing), and was on his way to jobs on one or more places. Its just a guess of course, I base the farm theory mostly on the part of the country, the old work truck, and the shabby overalls he supposedly wore. He might have had a small piece of property and a home base somewhere but was mostly transient and on the road a lot, possibly sleeping in his truck.

His comment about not needing to use the phone anyway also strikes me as someone who might not have dealt a lot with technology which formulated the off the grid theory.

I mentioned Dale Wayne Eaton because I just think he's in the same mold. A creep from a rural area not many people know who saw a chance to satisfy his own sick needs and jumped on it. Its always possible he might be in jail somewhere for another crime he wasn't so lucky to get away with and has never been connected with Angie's abduction. With no physical evidence simply no way of knowing.

Of course this is all speculation, just base it on what little we know about the individual from descriptions. Despite the fact Rob was in a panic that night, my gut feeling is his description of the truck and Angie's description of the man is fairly accurate since she was obviously aware of and concerned enough about the individual to look closely at him and his vehicle. Remember she was not in a panic yet when she described the vehicle so was probably calm enough to be fairly accurate. And the police saying they think they got it wrong is merely a product of frustration of trying to wrap up a case where there is simply no physical evidence and nothing to go on. And they are trying to fit a far fetched theory into the case that is likely not true.

I once thought it might have been Kenneth McDuff or Larry Hall. But McDuff was still living in Texas at the time and Hall was known to use a van rather than a truck. Its still possible it could have been Hall because he was known to procure other older vehicles, was known to travel around the country going to civil war reenactments, and abducted girls similar to Angela. Like I said just a theory and no way of knowing though.

Still - explain the phone call (again, I am assuming the PD verified this with the phone company), and, the transmission breakdown of Rob's own car in that moment, at that place. The man is innocent and apparently has spent decades beating himself up for "not getting the job done."

I think you are under the impression that I think Rob is somehow responsible for this? I have never once doubted any part of Rob's story except maybe the details of the truck.

I don't know if this has been posted, but there's a interview with Angie's bestfriend Kyla Engeman on a podcast. It was two years ago, so excuse me if it's already been posted.

At 47:07 she tells a story of Rob coming to a friend's house after Angie's disappearance saying "THEY took her" multiple times. She also mentions other inconsistences with his story

https://youtu.be/P6A_MsfU0b4

I'm still liking Ken McDuff for this.

I don't know if this has been posted, but there's a interview with Angie's bestfriend Kyla Engeman on a podcast. It was two years ago, so excuse me if it's already been posted.

At 47:07 she tells a story of Rob coming to a friend's house after Angie's disappearance saying "THEY took her" multiple times. She also mentions other inconsistences with his story

https://youtu.be/P6A_MsfU0b4

Just listened to this in a couple segments and it's fairly sympathetic to Rob. It's certainly not accusatory from either the guest or hosts.
Of course there's the one person in the YouTube comments who keeps pushing the "Rob did it" theory. As is the case here, the vast majority there feel he did nothing wrong.

Just listened to this in a couple segments and it's fairly sympathetic to Rob. It's certainly not accusatory from either the guest or hosts.
Of course there's the one person in the YouTube comments who keeps pushing the "Rob did it" theory. As is the case here, the vast majority there feel he did nothing wrong.

Yes, it's sympathetic towards Rob, but she and the hosts have questioned his story in spots and even brought up contradictions in his statement. She said something to the effect of "after talking about it now and looking back some things don't add up". It also sounded like she was trying to choose her words carefully. Now of course this doesn't mean that she thinks Rob did it, but it brought somethings to light. A few things she said that stood out to me

1.) She said that from the phone booth there was another way the abductor could've gone to get out of town. She said that if the abductor had gone the other way then there was no way that Rob would've saw the truck. She said the other way was a straight shot to the highway.

She mentions the way that the abductor had gone was longer and more intricate to get out of. She said that way not only had a stop light, but was a longer route in which you would've had to been familiar with the area to get out of with such ease, so she thinks the abductor was local and familiar with the area.

How convenient for Rob that the abductor went the longer way in which he only would've passed by Rob's truck, not the easier way which would've led him straight to the highway

2.) She talked about the two eye witnesses that claimed that they saw the truck that abducted Angela. She said that the two eye witnesses were two women who had "gone to get lunch" at the supermarket that the payphone was at. They said that it was around 11:30-11:45 p.m. in which they had gone to the store, but she mentions this as odd because the supermarket was in the process of shutting down and wasn't in business (who also goes to get lunch close to midnight?). She said that they had undergone hypnosis to try to get more information to no avail.

3.) She mentions that Angela's ex-boyfriend, Bill, was still very much in her life. She said that Angela had still loved Bill, but she doesn't think that Rob knew. So basically she was dating both of them at the same time.

4.) Shortly after Angela was abducted, Rob had somehow gotten to his friends Larry place where Kyla was (she wasn't sure how he got there as his truck was broken down) and was frantically banging on his door saying that "THEY took her" over and over. She mentions that looking back how odd that statement and a few other things were

5.) Kyla mentioned that Rob has a new younger girlfriend who was trash talking Angela on one of her facebook posts about Angela. She had posted a tribute to Angela on facebook and Rob's new girlfriend was talking bad about Angie (who she never knew) which caused her and Rob to fall out.

Years ago, I worked evenings. I got off at 3:00 am and I went to lunch between 10-12 in the evening.

FWIW, one of the Springfield Three, Suzie Streeter, was very good friends with a girl named Nigel Holderby who was one of the last people to have seen Suzie and her mother Sherill alive. In a really bizarre twist, Nigel's aunt was Cheryl Kenney who went missing approximately a year and a half before the Springfield Three. What are the odds that your aunt, best friend, and best friend's mom go missing in a 16 month span?!

Years ago, I worked evenings. I got off at 3:00 am and I went to lunch between 10-12 in the evening.

Understandable. But she said it was already shut down. And unless it's a 24/7 type store, I doubt a grocery store in a small rural area would be open that late

Also with such a small town I'm sure everyone knew it was already closed

FWIW, one of the Springfield Three, Suzie Streeter, was very good friends with a girl named Nigel Holderby who was one of the last people to have seen Suzie and her mother Sherill alive. In a really bizarre twist, Nigel's aunt was Cheryl Kenney who went missing approximately a year and a half before the Springfield Three. What are the odds that your aunt, best friend, and best friend's mom go missing in a 16 month span?!

Wow. That's crazy.

I'm still shocked that the Springfield 3 was never featured on Unsolved Mysteries.

Wow. That's crazy.

I'm still shocked that the Springfield 3 was never featured on Unsolved Mysteries.

I'm shocked that it's never been solved, or at least generated actual serious suspects. And I'm not talking about some random serial killer who may or may not have been in that area at the time. Someone known to at least one of them did them harm.

I'm shocked that it's never been solved, or at least generated actual serious suspects. And I'm not talking about some random serial killer who may or may not have been in that area at the time. Someone known to at least one of them did them harm.

I hear you. This case deeply disturbs me. And I feel for the family and friends who have no evidence to go by, other than a broken light bulb cover on the front porch.

Understandable. But she said it was already shut down. And unless it's a 24/7 type store, I doubt a grocery store in a small rural area would be open that late

Also with such a small town I'm sure everyone knew it was already closed

I’m not making a statement about whether the store was closed or whether it wasn’t, only stating that there was a time that I did indeed have a lunch break at this time of night. While it’s not common, it does happen.

I’m not making a statement about whether the store was closed or whether it wasn’t, only stating that there was a time that I did indeed have a lunch break at this time of night. While it’s not common, it does happen.

Ah gotcha. My mistake

Years ago, I worked evenings. I got off at 3:00 am and I went to lunch between 10-12 in the evening.

Yeah. My mom worked the night shift. Rolled in at 10 and got out at 7. She went to lunch around 3 am. Imagine that!!! :eek:

But you know what was a legitimate, real shock to me? Her lunch break was a whole hour! :eek::eek::eek:

Of course there's the one person in the YouTube comments who keeps pushing the "Rob did it" theory. As is the case here, the vast majority there feel he did nothing wrong.

Like, it's SOOOOOO hard for people to stomach the fact that serial killers killed people in the middle of the night in small towns, randomly or otherwise. No. It's gotta be the boyfriend who was at home. Ridiculous.

I remember reading people not buying the "his car broke down in the middle of the chase" story. This happened in 1991. Cars back then were much easier to accidentally throw into reverse from drive and ruin/destroy the tranny. He was probably driving something built in the 1980's He was NOT driving a car made post 2000. Really not an impossible story to believe.

Like, it's SOOOOOO hard for people to stomach the fact that serial killers killed people in the middle of the night in small towns, randomly or otherwise. No. It's gotta be the boyfriend who was at home. Ridiculous.

I remember reading people not buying the "his car broke down in the middle of the chase" story. This happened in 1991. Cars back then were much easier to accidentally throw into reverse from drive and ruin/destroy the tranny. He was probably driving something built in the 1980's He was NOT driving a car made post 2000. Really not an impossible story to believe.

No, I have no problems thinking a serial killer did it, and I'm not accusing Rob just because he was the boyfriend. I want to clarify that I am not biased to anyone on this show. I don't personally know these people, so I'm not against or for them in anyway shape or form. I'm only following logic based on the information given. It's 100% possible that Rob is innocent. However, given the circumstances I think otherwise.

- Rob's mother house was less than five minutes from the phone booth. Which means he could've gotten there fast.

- If you think about it their entire conversation on the payphone according to Rob was basically his alibi. It consisted of the kidnapper's description, vehicle, the kidnapper speaking into the phone so of course this establishes his existence, etc

- Incredibly sketchy story that was very convenient in Rob establishing the kidnapper's existence and the fact that he had Angie (screaming his name), but inconvenient enough that he couldn't catch up with him or get something useful to track him down like a license plate

- Rob was the first on the scene. Before police or anyone else he was the first one in the area following their phone call, so it's hard to say what was or wasn't tampered with

- While there's evidence that they talked on the phone due to phone records, we don't know what the actual conversation was about or how long the phone call actually lasted

There's more but you catch my drift. If I'm wrong I'll humbly accept it. Again, I have no personal vendetta against Rob, but his story is sketchy to me. This may very well be a Charles Holden kind of case. But until proven otherwise, he's the most likely suspect

A few years ago the police let slip that they received a tip that focused on a local guy in the Clinton area, one of whom they investigated before but ultimately ruled them out based on the vehicle description. Which I always felt was interesting because in the chase, the guy turned right here (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.3525853,-93.7754559,3a,75y,183.59h,88.2t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sPV4GcpPh1AtQV8D1EQtIew!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DPV4GcpPh1AtQV8D1EQtIew%26cb_client%3Dsearch.revgeo_and_fetch.gps%26w%3D96%26h%3D64%26yaw%3D176.99304%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu) instead of left, which would have led to a highway. Going right can either lead you back into town, or take a much more secluded and rural route going south. To me, this is not a direction that someone unfamiliar with Clinton would have gone.

This was the segment that stood out the most in my memory from back in the day. I saw it on Filmrise the other day and found my way here.

So being that I am old let me give a bit of insight into the rear window decal.

Back in the day when you mainly ordered things via catalog there was a company called JC Whitney that sold a huge amount of stuff from different vendors and they carried these. You ordered by truck make/model/year like with the Ford F-150 the rear window would have been the same for many model years. This decal was probably pretty popular I am guessing since it was the most prominently featured of the choices. The other one I remember was a desert/sunset scene,kinda a Southwest thing. Now that I think of it one may have had forest/deer scene. Anyway there were probably like 6-10 designs.

I also seem to recall at some point they were selling them at Kmart.

I offer this so people understand that they weren't custom and were pretty common in rural areas where you would find more pickups. At that time one didn't find people in more urban areas driving pickups for the most part, they were more for utility use. My HOA founded in the early 1970s still bans them from being parked outside (all not just commercial) since they were considered downscale even though now you have ones that are like 75K.

A few years ago the police let slip that they received a tip that focused on a local guy in the Clinton area, one of whom they investigated before but ultimately ruled them out based on the vehicle description. Which I always felt was interesting because in the chase, the guy turned right here (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.3525853,-93.7754559,3a,75y,183.59h,88.2t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sPV4GcpPh1AtQV8D1EQtIew!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DPV4GcpPh1AtQV8D1EQtIew%26cb_client%3Dsearch.revgeo_and_fetch.gps%26w%3D96%26h%3D64%26yaw%3D176.99304%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu) instead of left, which would have led to a highway. Going right can either lead you back into town, or take a much more secluded and rural route going south. To me, this is not a direction that someone unfamiliar with Clinton would have gone.

I agree with you. She said that if he had went the opposite way out of the supermarket parking lot it would've led straight to the highway as well. So it would seem more like a stranger than someone familiar with the area. But she also said that if he had gone the other way then he wouldn't have encountered Rob, so that's another "convenient" point for Rob.

On another note I decided to watch this segment again today and just now realized that Paul Rudd played Rob. I know this is serious, but when the actress yells Robbie, and he stops and yells "ANGIIIIIEEEE!!" I lost it

This was the segment that stood out the most in my memory from back in the day. I saw it on Filmrise the other day and found my way here.

So being that I am old let me give a bit of insight into the rear window decal.

Back in the day when you mainly ordered things via catalog there was a company called JC Whitney that sold a huge amount of stuff from different vendors and they carried these. You ordered by truck make/model/year like with the Ford F-150 the rear window would have been the same for many model years. This decal was probably pretty popular I am guessing since it was the most prominently featured of the choices. The other one I remember was a desert/sunset scene,kinda a Southwest thing. Now that I think of it one may have had forest/deer scene. Anyway there were probably like 6-10 designs.

I also seem to recall at some point they were selling them at Kmart.

I offer this so people understand that they weren't custom and were pretty common in rural areas where you would find more pickups. At that time one didn't find people in more urban areas driving pickups for the most part, they were more for utility use. My HOA founded in the early 1970s still bans them from being parked outside (all not just commercial) since they were considered downscale even though now you have ones that are like 75K.

Ah, interesting to know. Thanks for that info.

Welcome btw! :wave:

I agree with you. She said that if he had went the opposite way out of the supermarket parking lot it would've led straight to the highway as well. So it would seem more like a stranger than someone familiar with the area. But she also said that if he had gone the other way then he wouldn't have encountered Rob, so that's another "convenient" point for Rob.

The motorist who gave Rob a ride to the police station also saw the truck speeding past them before they encountered Rob walking back to the town.

The motorist who gave Rob a ride to the police station also saw the truck speeding past them before they encountered Rob walking back to the town.

First time I'm hearing about the motorist seeing the truck. Is there a source for this?

5.) Kyla mentioned that Rob has a new younger girlfriend who was trash talking Angela on one of her facebook posts about Angela. She had posted a tribute to Angela on facebook and Rob's new girlfriend was talking bad about Angie (who she never knew) which caused her and Rob to fall out.

Well, that's about the creepiest part. Not that he has a new girlfriend, not that she is younger.. But that whoever that was would comment at all on a facebook post. I mean, it's a 30+ year old case at this point.

Rob would be.. What? About 52 or 53 now? I'd certainly hope he's moved on.

As for coincidences.. What's the coincidence that Rob's vehicle would break down right at that time? I know he screwed the tranny up doing the U-Turn, or that's the story, but..

I've always kinda wondered here.. Why did she call him from the pay phone in the first place? She had been with her friend at the friends house as I recall.. Why not call him from there? She was planning to meet him later.. He was watching his younger brother.. Why not just go there? I mean, if you're engaged (and pregnant) I don't think his parents would have objected. Or why not wait until she got home to call him? She was a couple of miles, at most, away from his parents house.. Seeing as she dropped him off there earlier, she had a vehicle..

Everything says.. Look at Rob. But.. He's apparently been looked at, over and over.. And how do you argue with that? His story just seems.. You look at it and go "Oh, COME ON!" .. But.. all things told, it seems it's been looked at and is legit.

First time I'm hearing about the motorist seeing the truck. Is there a source for this?

I know I have seen (or heard in a podcast) that Rob was trying to get the motorist (a woman) to follow the truck but she refused and offered to take him to the police station. This (https://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showpost.php?p=3487582&postcount=68) old article mentions the ride by the passing motorist. This (https://www.reddit.com/r/UnresolvedMysteries/comments/gbnnr8/angela_hammond_was_abducted_while_using_a/) reddit thread mentions this little tidbit as well, which makes me think it was mentioned on the same podcast that mentioned the two friends who mistook Angela for someone else that night and turned in to talk to her before realizing it wasn't their friend. These are the two witnesses who also saw the dirty bearded man with a baseball hat sitting in the truck, IIRC. It also could have been a portion from this (https://www.google.com/books/edition/Missing_or_Murdered_in_Missouri_Unsolved/_bxGHWjPdDgC?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=angela+hammond+rob+shaffer&pg=PA33&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q=angela%20hammond%20rob%20shaffer&f=false) book.

She had been with her friend at the friends house as I recall.. Why not call him from there? She was planning to meet him later.. He was watching his younger brother.. Why not just go there? I mean, if you're engaged (and pregnant) I don't think his parents would have objected. Or why not wait until she got home to call him? She was a couple of miles, at most, away from his parents house.. Seeing as she dropped him off there earlier, she had a vehicle..

They lived together about 20 minutes outside of Clinton. She dropped her friend off at 11:15 p.m. that night; so probably didn't want to go in and wake people who were probably sleeping. They did not have a phone at their home, so she used the pay phone in town to call Rob to let him know she was tired and wanted to go home. I think Rob kept talking to her with the hopes that his mother would come home (supposed to be home at 11:30 IIRC) and then Angela could come pick him up there and they could go home together.

Well, that's about the creepiest part. Not that he has a new girlfriend, not that she is younger.. But that whoever that was would comment at all on a facebook post. I mean, it's a 30+ year old case at this point.

Rob would be.. What? About 52 or 53 now? I'd certainly hope he's moved on.

As for coincidences.. What's the coincidence that Rob's vehicle would break down right at that time? I know he screwed the tranny up doing the U-Turn, or that's the story, but..

I've always kinda wondered here.. Why did she call him from the pay phone in the first place? She had been with her friend at the friends house as I recall.. Why not call him from there? She was planning to meet him later.. He was watching his younger brother.. Why not just go there? I mean, if you're engaged (and pregnant) I don't think his parents would have objected. Or why not wait until she got home to call him? She was a couple of miles, at most, away from his parents house.. Seeing as she dropped him off there earlier, she had a vehicle..

Everything says.. Look at Rob. But.. He's apparently been looked at, over and over.. And how do you argue with that? His story just seems.. You look at it and go "Oh, COME ON!" .. But.. all things told, it seems it's been looked at and is legit.

Yeah, I have no idea about the Facebook posts. It doesn't make any sense to be, what I assume, jealous of an ex-girlfriend from over 30 years ago who was possibly murdered while pregnant.

His car breaking down isn't necessarily a coincidence, it's the other things that happened before it that also makes it coincidental.

The reason she called him from the payphone is because she and Rob lived together, but didn't have a phone of their own. he was babysitting his brother at his mother's house, so I guess she called real quick before going in instead of going over there. In the interview with Angela's best friend, Kyla, she said that her and Angela would scam both of their mother's phone cards and would just talk forever without paying.

I know I have seen (or heard in a podcast) that Rob was trying to get the motorist (a woman) to follow the truck but she refused and offered to take him to the police station. This (https://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showpost.php?p=3487582&postcount=68) old article mentions the ride by the passing motorist. This (https://www.reddit.com/r/UnresolvedMysteries/comments/gbnnr8/angela_hammond_was_abducted_while_using_a/) reddit thread mentions this little tidbit as well, which makes me think it was mentioned on the same podcast that mentioned the two friends who mistook Angela for someone else that night and turned in to talk to her before realizing it wasn't their friend. These are the two witnesses who also saw the dirty bearded man with a baseball hat sitting in the truck, IIRC. It also could have been a portion from this (https://www.google.com/books/edition/Missing_or_Murdered_in_Missouri_Unsolved/_bxGHWjPdDgC?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=angela+hammond+rob+shaffer&pg=PA33&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q=angela%20hammond%20rob%20shaffer&f=false) book.

Oh cool, thanks for that. Never heard that part

The reason she called him from the payphone is because she and Rob lived together, but didn't have a phone of their own. he was babysitting his brother at his mother's house, so I guess she called real quick before going in instead of going over there. In the interview with Angela's best friend, Kyla, she said that her and Angela would scam both of their mother's phone cards and would just talk forever without paying.

ok.. I had never heard that part of it. Or, if I did.. I don't remember it.

There's probably someone who's about 20 years old reading this and going "What's a pay phone"...any idea on how old his brother was? I picture him as being 11-13 or so.. Considering Rob was 21-ish. Older than that.. Probably wouldn't need a 'sitter'.. Younger.. Well.. I've got a sister 20 years younger than me, so, it happens.. But it's not overly common.

It still doesn't overly sit right with me that she wouldn't go to his parents house. Perhaps just another example of the change in times. They could have sat on the porch and talked..

ok.. I had never heard that part of it. Or, if I did.. I don't remember it.

There's probably someone who's about 20 years old reading this and going "What's a pay phone"...any idea on how old his brother was? I picture him as being 11-13 or so.. Considering Rob was 21-ish. Older than that.. Probably wouldn't need a 'sitter'.. Younger.. Well.. I've got a sister 20 years younger than me, so, it happens.. But it's not overly common.

It still doesn't overly sit right with me that she wouldn't go to his parents house. Perhaps just another example of the change in times. They could have sat on the porch and talked..

No clue about the age of the brother. I don't remember anything else being mentioned about him

And multiple people feel the same way as you about her calling instead of going over there. Tbh, I kind of understand why she would call. If she went then maybe she'd have to talk to his brother, and possibly mother and Rob might try to keep her there. Where as she probably wanted to call for a second and just go home

First time I'm hearing about the motorist seeing the truck. Is there a source for this?

I found the podcast (https://www.podcastone.com/episode/Angela-Marie-Hammond) where it was mentioned. Starts at around the 23 minute mark.

He was given a voice stress test and a polygraph test and he passed both of them. He ended up being fully cleared after police were able to fully corroborate his story. The woman who brought him to the police station said she actually saw the truck while it was parked next to Angela's mustang.

The hosts go on to say that in addition to the other two witnesses who described the same truck and general description of the guy, multiple other witnesses claim to have seen the same truck driving around town that night, but they claim the driver had long hair but no beard.

No, I have no problems thinking a serial killer did it, and I'm not accusing Rob just because he was the boyfriend. I want to clarify that I am not biased to anyone on this show. I don't personally know these people, so I'm not against or for them in anyway shape or form. I'm only following logic based on the information given. It's 100% possible that Rob is innocent. However, given the circumstances I think otherwise.

- Rob's mother house was less than five minutes from the phone booth. Which means he could've gotten there fast.

- If you think about it their entire conversation on the payphone according to Rob was basically his alibi. It consisted of the kidnapper's description, vehicle, the kidnapper speaking into the phone so of course this establishes his existence, etc

- Incredibly sketchy story that was very convenient in Rob establishing the kidnapper's existence and the fact that he had Angie (screaming his name), but inconvenient enough that he couldn't catch up with him or get something useful to track him down like a license plate

- Rob was the first on the scene. Before police or anyone else he was the first one in the area following their phone call, so it's hard to say what was or wasn't tampered with

- While there's evidence that they talked on the phone due to phone records, we don't know what the actual conversation was about or how long the phone call actually lasted

There's more but you catch my drift. If I'm wrong I'll humbly accept it. Again, I have no personal vendetta against Rob, but his story is sketchy to me. This may very well be a Charles Holden kind of case. But until proven otherwise, he's the most likely suspect

Yeah...

Maybe it wasn't a serial killer. Maybe it was a one off. Like that who killed Lisa Ziegert.

His car breaking down isn't necessarily a coincidence, it's the other things that happened before it that also makes it coincidental.


I forgot to reply to this part and i meant to.. Now, I'm stealing this quote, so.. Always remember.. You steal from me, you're stealing from three.

I believe in coincidence. Coincidences happen every day. But I don't trust coincidences.

For those who doubt Rob's story about chasing the car, do you also doubt Larry Laundreau's story about randomly coming across Lucie Turmel's cab at the exact moment he drove to her last known location, seeing a man driving the cab, and then proceeding to chase this man all around town before cornering him on a dead end street before he dashed off into the night? Because that's exactly what happened. Lucie's killer was eventually caught (largely because he left behind blood and DNA). The 'unbelievable' story about chasing the killer turned out to be correct.

For those who doubt Rob's story about chasing the car, do you also doubt Larry Laundreau's story about randomly coming across Lucie Turmel's cab at the exact moment he drove to her last known location, seeing a man driving the cab, and then proceeding to chase this man all around town before cornering him on a dead end street before he dashed off into the night? Because that's exactly what happened. Lucie's killer was eventually caught (largely because he left behind blood and DNA). The 'unbelievable' story about chasing the killer turned out to be correct.

Or this guy-who cops thought murdered his mother for 13 years. Bizarre set of circumstances led to the crazy he gave a lift to that turned violent & he escaped from, had killed his mother with a screwdriver he stole from the truck!

https://unsolvedmysteries.fandom.com/wiki/Dorothy_Donovan

For those who doubt Rob's story about chasing the car, do you also doubt Larry Laundreau's story about randomly coming across Lucie Turmel's cab at the exact moment he drove to her last known location, seeing a man driving the cab, and then proceeding to chase this man all around town before cornering him on a dead end street before he dashed off into the night? Because that's exactly what happened. Lucie's killer was eventually caught (largely because he left behind blood and DNA). The 'unbelievable' story about chasing the killer turned out to be correct.

Larry's story has nothing to do with this one. Just because it turned out Larry was telling the truth doesn't mean that Rob was.

True, but this has basically become a one-person crusade trying to convince everyone that Rob is guilty when he was essentially exonerated over 30 years ago. Unless you have some personal stake in this case, it doesn't make much sense. The discussion is basically going in circles.

True, but this has basically become a one-person crusade trying to convince everyone that Rob is guilty when he was essentially exonerated over 30 years ago. Unless you have some personal stake in this case, it doesn't make much sense. The discussion is basically going in circles.

This isn't a one-person crusade, it's my opinion. People reply to me, and I reply back. It's a discussion. You're only framing it as a "crusade" because I have the minority opinion. And why does me having a different opinion doesn't make much sense? Rob wasn't exonerated on anything substantial. He was basically exonerated because there wasn't enough evidence or clues to get him either way.

I know there's a huge chance that Rob is innocent. But based on the information provided in the segment he seems like the most likely suspect to me. I respect your opinion, but to keep calling me a one man crusade because we don't share the same theory is ridiculous.

My opinion is my opinion. If this discussion is going in circles, then stop replying. Simple, eh?

Or this guy-who cops thought murdered his mother for 13 years. Bizarre set of circumstances led to the crazy he gave a lift to that turned violent & he escaped from, had killed his mother with a screwdriver he stole from the truck!

https://unsolvedmysteries.fandom.com/wiki/Dorothy_Donovan

Jeff Oberholtzer's business card was found in Annette Schnee's backpack next to her dead body. Bizarre coincidences were a hallmark of Unsolved Mysteries.

I think the sketch of Angie abductor needs to be redone i think it’s more likely that her abductor looked more like Rebecca Kathleen Reid abductor who vanished from Oregon in 1997. https://charleyproject.org/case/rebecca-kathleen-reid

I think the sketch of Angie abductor needs to be redone i think it’s more likely that her abductor looked more like Rebecca Kathleen Reid abductor who vanished from Oregon in 1997. https://charleyproject.org/case/rebecca-kathleen-reid

Why? Six years later & nearly two thousand miles away-what is the connection?

I think the sketch of Angie abductor needs to be redone i think it’s more likely that her abductor looked more like Rebecca Kathleen Reid abductor who vanished from Oregon in 1997. https://charleyproject.org/case/rebecca-kathleen-reid

Yeah, I don't think eyewitness memories get better after 32 years.

Jeff Oberholtzer's business card was found in Annette Schnee's backpack next to her dead body. Bizarre coincidences were a hallmark of Unsolved Mysteries.

I don't even know why this was brought up on UM. I own a side business and part of getting clients is giving out my business card to everyone remotely interested in my work. Just over half of them are *gasp* women.

I don't even know why this was brought up on UM. I own a side business and part of getting clients is giving out my business card to everyone remotely interested in my work. Just over half of them are *gasp* women.

Because it was a bizarre coincidence. Same thing with Rob actually seeing Angela in the truck with her abductor.

I don't even know why this was brought up on UM. I own a side business and part of getting clients is giving out my business card to everyone remotely interested in my work. Just over half of them are *gasp* women.

Seems logical that UM would point it out, seeing that Jeff was married to the other victim in this case. And the police zeroed in on him from the start and spent years following and harassing him, even going so far as to warn any woman he had any contact with.

But in the end, it was just a coincidence that, looking back with logic, was capable of happening. Both Bobbi and Annette worked in Breckenridge and both routinely hitchhiked to and from work regularly, as most locals did in those days.

I think Rob coming across Angela in the truck is even less of a coincidence because she had already told him over the phone earlier where she was calling from (which phone records proved) and his family home wasn't that far away.

Larry's story has nothing to do with this one. Just because it turned out Larry was telling the truth doesn't mean that Rob was.
The issue with YOUR opinion is the police ruled it out and it's clear as day Rob didnt do it!!! No man would damage his own transmission and have to spend thousands of dollars fixing it so they could use that as their story!!

Also time frame!! im sure the police did their homework and saw the time frame and the phone records. Rob didn't do it, my guess is it was a sicko who saw an opportunity and took it.

This isn't a one-person crusade, it's my opinion. People reply to me, and I reply back. It's a discussion. You're only framing it as a "crusade" because I have the minority opinion. And why does me having a different opinion doesn't make much sense? Rob wasn't exonerated on anything substantial. He was basically exonerated because there wasn't enough evidence or clues to get him either way.

I know there's a huge chance that Rob is innocent. But based on the information provided in the segment he seems like the most likely suspect to me. I respect your opinion, but to keep calling me a one man crusade because we don't share the same theory is ridiculous.

My opinion is my opinion. If this discussion is going in circles, then stop replying. Simple, eh?



I respectfully disagree with you about Rob's guilt. I just wanted to say y time I read one of your posts, I hear it in the voice of the lady in the SCA costume from your avatar. She had a fairly distinct voice I can still hear when disclaiming McFall's death had anything to do with the SCA.

I just wanted to say y time I read one of your posts, I hear it in the voice of the lady in the SCA costume from your avatar. She had a fairly distinct voice I can still hear when disclaiming McFall's death had anything to do with the SCA.

haha that was funny. I agree, and IMO Rob has to be one of the most obvious from the entire show that did not have anything to do with his significant other being abducted. I mean he could of went on a 2 min "I didn't do it" ramble like Wayne Hecker and like Wayne he would still be innocent.

The issue with YOUR opinion is the police ruled it out and it's clear as day Rob didnt do it!!! No man would damage his own transmission and have to spend thousands of dollars fixing it so they could use that as their story!!

Also time frame!! im sure the police did their homework and saw the time frame and the phone records. Rob didn't do it, my guess is it was a sicko who saw an opportunity and took it.

I respectfully disagree with you about Rob's guilt. I just wanted to say y time I read one of your posts, I hear it in the voice of the lady in the SCA costume from your avatar. She had a fairly distinct voice I can still hear when disclaiming McFall's death had anything to do with the SCA.

Perhaps ya'll are correct. Hopefully we'll see in time

Perhaps ya'll are correct. Hopefully we'll see in time
I usually don't like to say i'm right, but in this case, i feel i'm 100% right that he didn't do it. To me, i don't see a good motive. I don't see why someone would destroy their own transmission just to make an alibi. Trust me, you arent the first person I have argued this with, but to me, there's cheaper ways to set up an alibi.


haha that was funny. I agree, and IMO Rob has to be one of the most obvious from the entire show that did not have anything to do with his significant other being abducted. I mean he could of went on a 2 min "I didn't do it" ramble like Wayne Hecker and like Wayne he would still be innocent.
Hahaha!! he could've been Paul Pollis living in his "clean" house and i would've belived his was innocent because his story comes off as legit and his car was found with a destroyed transmission. I believe the police investigated Rob and left no stone unturned. The reason this case isn't solved to me is because the guy is a drifter who found Angela alone and took his opportunity.

I usually don't like to say i'm right, but in this case, i feel i'm 100% right that he didn't do it. To me, i don't see a good motive. I don't see why someone would destroy their own transmission just to make an alibi. Trust me, you arent the first person I have argued this with, but to me, there's cheaper ways to set up an alibi.

Rob had the motive, means and opportunity: remember he just learned his (young) girlfriend is pregnant and this could derail his life. He also had nobody who could corroborate his alibi. A couple of thousand bucks is also a small price to pay to get out of jail free.

Having said all that, I agree with his innocence and 100% believe his story but boy the double standards I see on this case. If Rob wasn't so clean-cut and likeable I wonder if the same people would jump to his defense so quickly?

Having said all that, I agree with his innocence and 100% believe his story but boy the double standards I see on this case. If Rob wasn't so clean-cut and likeable I wonder if the same people would jump to his defense so quickly?

Charles Holden's story (prior to the DNA results) was generally believed and didn't get the same type of scrutiny that Rob has gotten over the years IMO.

As much as eyewitness testimony is (rightfully) taken with a grain of salt in many scenarios, I think in this case and Charles Holden's, it was a big help to them.

Other people came forward and said they saw the truck with the decal that Rob described; the police were dubious about Charles Holden's story until other people at the fast food restaurant corroborated his story about the man asking for a ride. It helped prove that they weren't just conjuring this random perpetrator to cover their tracks.

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Rob had the motive, means and opportunity: remember he just learned his (young) girlfriend is pregnant and this could derail his life. He also had nobody who could corroborate his alibi. A couple of thousand bucks is also a small price to pay to get out of jail free.

Having said all that, I agree with his innocence and 100% believe his story but boy the double standards I see on this case. If Rob wasn't so clean-cut and likeable I wonder if the same people would jump to his defense so quickly?

A couple of problems with this. The baby was not going to derail his life so to speak, because it wasn't his. So if he didn't want it all he had to do was break up with her. That's one issue. Not as if he needed to kill her to get out of child support or anything like that.

Secondly, his brother did corroborate his alibi so not as if no one did. As did the phone company records.

I suspect the police eliminated him as a suspect simply because his story checked out and he did not appear to have had time to do something to Angie and concoct an alibi and this story. Not because he was a clean cut white boy.

But its not surprising woke-sters have come in and invaded this conversation. No I don't think Rob would have been convicted of anything regardless of his skin color.

Charles Holden's story (prior to the DNA results) was generally believed and didn't get the same type of scrutiny that Rob has gotten over the years IMO.

Seems like I remember people were kind of suspicious of Charles Holden. But if not as much as Rob, my theory is its because Charles Holden was kinda slow and a rather simple man. I don't think people thought he was smart or mean enough to pull it off. He came off as pretty harmless and I just don't think he was someone who would generate general dislike.

Rob on the other hand was a star athlete, beginning a career in the military, probably pretty popular, and in general considered to be a much more formidable individual. Or a more polarizing figure at least. Someone most people would either love or hate. So in this case the fact that people in Clinton in general including Angie's family seem to believe Rob was innocent, it leads me to think he was probably a genuinely nice guy, enough so to win over even people who were naturally suspicious of athletic military types.

That's why I think its a logical fallacy to believe most people would not want to believe Rob was guilty. Of course some wouldn't, but you'd be surprised how many people do see a stigma with popular athletic types like Rob that are borne out of envy and actually would want to think he was guilty. Case in point the Alex Kelly case, the wrestler accused of rape. And the O.J. Simpson case of course. Of course this was a few years before the O.J case. But still you can see the point. Star athletes have often done really bad things to significant others and it has created something of a stigma with some people, even back then.

A couple of problems with this. The baby was not going to derail his life so to speak, because it wasn't his.

Where's the proof/source that Rob was aware that the child wasn't his? From what I read, it was said that Angela was still talking to her ex while she was with Rob, and there was a possibility that the baby could've been her ex's, but it was never said that it was factual and that Rob knew about it.

And let's say for argument that Rob found out that the baby was her ex's and not his, then jealousy would be a potential motive.

Where's the proof/source that Rob was aware that the child wasn't his? From what I read, it was said that Angela was still talking to her ex while she was with Rob, and there was a possibility that the baby could've been her ex's, but it was never said that it was factual and that Rob knew about it.

And let's say for argument that Rob found out that the baby was her ex's and not his, then jealousy would be a potential motive.

well yeah, that would be a motive. But he was implying that Rob might have killed her due to not wanting to be saddled with a child. Which doesn't seem likely given the circumstances.

I just think Rob is innocent based on the fact that the police by all accounts did take a serious look at him and his story and determined that it just wasn't feasible for him to have done it given the timeline and circumstances. In most cases police departments are not as afflicted with the hometown sports hero could not have done such a thing syndrome as much as the general public is and would have put this off on the boyfriend if they could have as it would have been much easier than trying to find some random creep or serial killer, and my gut feeling is in the end they had legitimate and good enough reason to clear him. That's the main reason I think he's innocent, not because he had no potential motive.

Although I will admit another guy being in the picture does make the whole thing a little more murky. I personally have hovered back and forth between 80-90% sure Rob didn't do it, but I still am open to the possibility if new info surfaces.

Although I will admit another guy being in the picture does make the whole thing a little more murky. I personally have hovered back and forth between 80-90% sure Rob didn't do it, but I still am open to the possibility if new info surfaces.

I linked it in this thread or another one, but there was a interview with Angela's best friend at the time and she admitted that Angela was seeing both Rob and her ex, and that Angela still had strong feelings for her ex. Her ex was also questioned and given a polygraph test.

She also said that Rob came to her house on the night of the disappearance after his car broke down and was shouting that "THEY" took her, which she thought was odd looking back. Of course all of this was alleged by her so I can't count it as fact

That's why I think there's more to Rob and Angela than what we're hearing. Apparently there was some love triangle going on, but I'm not sure how much Rob knew

Interesting that some now feel Rob has to be involved. I assume that police heavily investigated him and cleared him as a suspect so I just don’t see the reason to go down that angle

Oh come on, not this Rob did it stuff again. I'll admit most of what happened that night in his account could be fabricated. Difficult, but could be done. Two things that could not, though, and would confirm his account:

1) If they did any kind of phone trace. I know that may not have been an option then.

Most importantly, 2) unless he was a criminal mastermind to exceed Zodiac-cubed, the transmission breakdown and presumed location of his car where it did break down. That's going to be hard to fake.

Possible involvement? Sure. Many things are possible. I'd say it's one in a million at most. Poor guy (and families).

Let's be real here. If everything in this case stayed exactly the same, with the only exception that Rob was black, would people still think he was innocent?

Niqui McCown's fiance was black and as far as I know, no one believes he had anything to do with her disappearance.

But its not surprising woke-sters have come in and invaded this conversation. No I don't think Rob would have been convicted of anything regardless of his skin color.
I hope this comment isn't directed at me: I am the furthest thing from "woke" and never once mentioned skin color, both on this post and on this board as a whole. I only pointed out that I know plenty of "clean" guys similar to Rob that get away with a lot because nobody wants to believe a popular athlete is capable of doing bad things. I also see the same thing in reverse with a few *ahem* not so clean suspects: Tim McClure comes to mind in particular.

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True, but Niqui was black and Angela was white. My point was if Rob was black, and Angela was white in the same town then would everyone still think he was innocent?

I get where you are coming from because people have been wrongfully accused and there are disproportional incarcerations in our country. I just don't think it has anything to do with Rob's alleged involvement in Angela's disappearance. I don't see rob being involved. the only problem that could implicate Rob is that he was the last one to talk to her on the phone. his car broke down relatively near the phone booth which means it would have been nearly impossible for him to have abduct her and escape the area. His story seems to be very believable.

But its not surprising woke-sters have come in and invaded this conversation.color.

I understand that race is an uncomfortable topic and I don't think it is relevant in this particular segment. With Rob being the last one to talk to Angela it only makes sense that he would be a suspect. With that said we can have healthy debates on here without making it personal and calling people out like that. There is a striking difference between having an opinion that other people disagree with and derogatory name calling.

True, but Niqui was black and Angela was white. My point was if Rob was black, and Angela was white in the same town then would everyone still think he was innocent?



Yes, i would still think Rob is innocent. It's a lazy argument. Frankly, it's offensive to try to throw race into this case in any way.

Yes, i would still think Rob is innocent. It's a lazy argument. Frankly, it's offensive to try to throw race into this case in any way.

that's a fair opinion, personally I don't find it offensive, but it is irrelevant. Race is a sensitive topic and there is no need to go down that road with this thread. Rob just didn't do it, regardless of his skin color. RDDI, put it on a bracelet! If Rob's guilty then Dale Kertesetter took the platinum!

Yes, i would still think Rob is innocent. It's a lazy argument. Frankly, it's offensive to try to throw race into this case in any way.

yeah, you're right. my bad

Rob had the motive, means and opportunity: remember he just learned his (young) girlfriend is pregnant and this could derail his life. He also had nobody who could corroborate his alibi. A couple of thousand bucks is also a small price to pay to get out of jail free.
True, but arent there better ways of making an alibi other than destroying your own car's transmission?? As for the motive, yes its a motive, but from all accounts he wasn't upset about it and even the segment didn't mention her pregnacy.

Having said all that, I agree with his innocence and 100% believe his story but boy the double standards I see on this case. If Rob wasn't so clean-cut and likeable I wonder if the same people would jump to his defense so quickly?
At least your smart though which is why i'm not bashing you because you do believe he's innocent like most smart people should. I dont think he was cleared because of double standard, i think the police investigated him, saw phone records, saw the car, did interviews and ruled him out.

Oh come on, not this Rob did it stuff again. I'll admit most of what happened that night in his account could be fabricated. Difficult, but could be done. Two things that could not, though, and would confirm his account:

1) If they did any kind of phone trace. I know that may not have been an option then.

Most importantly, 2) unless he was a criminal mastermind to exceed Zodiac-cubed, the transmission breakdown and presumed location of his car where it did break down. That's going to be hard to fake.

Possible involvement? Sure. Many things are possible. I'd say it's one in a million at most. Poor guy (and families).
Sadly though some people who THINK they are better as solving crimes than the police keep saying he did it. I had someone on youtube basically insult me for believing Rob's story, BUT i agree with you. As for number 1, i'm sure they were able to check phone records and see Rob was on the phone and your number 2 point is why i believe Rob. Unless he's the perfect criminal, i dont see how he could've done it.

Sadly though some people who THINK they are better as solving crimes than the police keep saying he did it. I had someone on youtube basically insult me for believing Rob's story, BUT i agree with you. As for number 1, i'm sure they were able to check phone records and see Rob was on the phone and your number 2 point is why i believe Rob. Unless he's the perfect criminal, i dont see how he could've done it.

and it can be substantiated that he drove to where he said that he did and blew his transmission. he would have had to walk home from there or walk to call for a ride. that would have taken time away from him having the ability/time to kidnap her and take her out of the area.

and it can be substantiated that he drove to where he said that he did and blew his transmission. he would have had to walk home from there or walk to call for a ride. that would have taken time away from him having the ability/time to kidnap her and take her out of the area.
Exactly!!! its why i dont understand why people think Rob could've done it. He'd have to be the perfect criminal with Sonic-like speed to do this crime. Thats why i feel his story is legit and i still feel whoever kidnapped her was a drifter type who was "hunting" and found the perfect target for his sick crime.

No, I have no problems thinking a serial killer did it, and I'm not accusing Rob just because he was the boyfriend. I want to clarify that I am not biased to anyone on this show. I don't personally know these people, so I'm not against or for them in anyway shape or form. I'm only following logic based on the information given. It's 100% possible that Rob is innocent. However, given the circumstances I think otherwise.

- Rob's mother house was less than five minutes from the phone booth. Which means he could've gotten there fast.

- If you think about it their entire conversation on the payphone according to Rob was basically his alibi. It consisted of the kidnapper's description, vehicle, the kidnapper speaking into the phone so of course this establishes his existence, etc

- Incredibly sketchy story that was very convenient in Rob establishing the kidnapper's existence and the fact that he had Angie (screaming his name), but inconvenient enough that he couldn't catch up with him or get something useful to track him down like a license plate

- Rob was the first on the scene. Before police or anyone else he was the first one in the area following their phone call, so it's hard to say what was or wasn't tampered with

- While there's evidence that they talked on the phone due to phone records, we don't know what the actual conversation was about or how long the phone call actually lasted

There's more but you catch my drift. If I'm wrong I'll humbly accept it. Again, I have no personal vendetta against Rob, but his story is sketchy to me. This may very well be a Charles Holden kind of case. But until proven otherwise, he's the most likely suspect

Well said. I feel exactly the same way. I feel Rob was responsible only because his story seems fishy and he appears to be a good suspect. No other reason.

Well said. I feel exactly the same way. I feel Rob was responsible only because his story seems fishy .

Well, fish decal-y...

Well, fish decal-y...

Touche!!!

Well said. I feel exactly the same way. I feel Rob was responsible only because his story seems fishy and he appears to be a good suspect. No other reason.
How does he “appear to be a good suspect.”?? The police have witnesses who 1) saw the truck and 2) saw Rob and his broke down car. The police ruled him out for a reason so unless he somehow hired a hit man which also makes NO sense to me. I don’t believe he did it.
I always said I feel it’s an out of towner type guy, someone you won’t find in Clinton because he doesn’t live there. He likely raped and killed her and dumped her somewhere near where he lives.
If Rob did it, she would’ve been found and he would’ve been caught

I'm sure I have said it on this board before but from 30k feet Rob's story is too "neat" and I would bet a detective would think the same thing.

Assuming his story is how UM depicted it, Rob, thru Angela, got the most detailed and complete description of a suspect and vehicle that were never found, possibly of all time. I would think a cop would feel that extensive of a description from someone who didn't even see the person first hand would seem "fishy" or too obviously planned out.

With that said, I guess they did find Rob's car broken down in the road, so ultimately I do not think he did it. But I can definitely see why people would question him. It's just wild to me that they never found the guy or the truck with such detail. The truck decal alone should have been enough.

I'm sure I have said it on this board before but from 30k feet Rob's story is too "neat" and I would bet a detective would think the same thing.

Assuming his story is how UM depicted it, Rob, thru Angela, got the most detailed and complete description of a suspect and vehicle that were never found, possibly of all time. I would think a cop would feel that extensive of a description from someone who didn't even see the person first hand would seem "fishy" or too obviously planned out.

With that said, I guess they did find Rob's car broken down in the road, so ultimately I do not think he did it. But I can definitely see why people would question him. It's just wild to me that they never found the guy or the truck with such detail. The truck decal alone should have been enough.

I agree with you that at first blush he appears to be the most likely suspect, however, the police cleared him pretty quickly IIRC. Never finding the guy or the truck decal is a mystery, but there are so many UM cases that you would think could have been solved by now that haven't been.

The YouTube channel Lore Lodge covered this case about a month ago. It's about an hour long but he states some interesting factoids about the case. Even random little things I never knew like the name of the person who picked Rob up within minutes of his truck breaking down. Apparently she was on a late night run to get some food from Hardee's and drove past Rob. She drove him to the police station within minutes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgOMty2pzj4&t=2962s

I'm sure I have said it on this board before but from 30k feet Rob's story is too "neat" and I would bet a detective would think the same thing.

Assuming his story is how UM depicted it, Rob, thru Angela, got the most detailed and complete description of a suspect and vehicle that were never found, possibly of all time. I would think a cop would feel that extensive of a description from someone who didn't even see the person first hand would seem "fishy" or too obviously planned out.

With that said, I guess they did find Rob's car broken down in the road, so ultimately I do not think he did it. But I can definitely see why people would question him. It's just wild to me that they never found the guy or the truck with such detail. The truck decal alone should have been enough.
I get EARLY suspicion from the police, but when the police, family believe him and his story (while insane and almost a like a movie) can be backed up with witnesses (people saw the truck and some saw the guy who DUCKED DOWN!), it makes me eliminate Rob. Add to it the time and broke down car

The YouTube channel Lore Lodge covered this case about a month ago. It's about an hour long but he states some interesting factoids about the case. Even random little things I never knew like the name of the person who picked Rob up within minutes of his truck breaking down. Apparently she was on a late night run to get some food from Hardee's and drove past Rob. She drove him to the police station within minutes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgOMty2pzj4&t=2962s

Interesting watch, thanks for posting. Several new fresh thoughts.

I get EARLY suspicion from the police, but when the police, family believe him and his story (while insane and almost a like a movie) can be backed up with witnesses (people saw the truck and some saw the guy who DUCKED DOWN!), it makes me eliminate Rob. Add to it the time and broke down car

I agree. As I said in another thread, I understand that there are people, including on this board, that still pin the blame on Rob Shafer. I just can't. It doesn't make sense to me. Paul Pollis, on the other hand....

I get the skepticism of Rob's story. The cops were clearly skeptical because for the first few weeks after Angela's disappearance, they were investigating him. They eventually cleared him, but this notion that the cops should've done more or that they gave Rob some sort of a pass is ridiculous. IMO, the investigators focused too much on Rob and then Angela's ex-boyfriend in the early stages of the investigation, which is why it's remained unsolved for so much time.

I agree. As I said in another thread, I understand that there are people, including on this board, that still pin the blame on Rob Shafer. I just can't. It doesn't make sense to me. Paul Pollis, on the other hand....
Agreed!! No sense to me and even the guy who made the podcast didn’t blame Rob, just threw out the suspicious behavior of Angela and gave a reason why some think Rob did it, but when he and others use their brain, it’s easy to see why we don’t believe he did anything. My main issue is time. He didn’t have the time to do this. If he killed her, he’d need an accomplice.

Agreed!! Paul Pollis killed Charlotte!! My only thing I don’t agree with is his daughter witnessing it. I think that’s coaching.

I get the skepticism of Rob's story. The cops were clearly skeptical because for the first few weeks after Angela's disappearance, they were investigating him. They eventually cleared him, but this notion that the cops should've done more or that they gave Rob some sort of a pass is ridiculous. IMO, the investigators focused too much on Rob and then Angela's ex-boyfriend in the early stages of the investigation, which is why it's remained unsolved for so much time.
Agreed!!! Maybe you should go on YouTube and talk to these morons, I got one guy thinking Rob somehow hired a hit man. I just don’t see how (if Rob hired a hit man) that he wouldn’t be caught. I fully believe his story which while insane can happen