Do you think that Ellen got to gay? That's what many people blame the ratings decrease on the show becoming to gay. I really don't think it became to gay.

No way!! It never got to gay. I think the show originally had a different type of viewers and then when they changed the whole concept of the show the viewers left.

I agree at that point in time people who were gay only had one foot out of the closet, you didn't see as wide spread in tv. One show that comes to mind is the Golden Girls, now i know what you are thinking how is teh golden Girls gay? They aren't but the first episode showed they had a gay house man. After 1 episode he disappears. One episode deals directly on the subject, the one with Dorothy's friend Jean has teh hots for Rose. I don't know why but apparently at that point in time most networks, still were hesitant and only touching on teh subject. Just my opinion. i enjoy Will and Grace, I like Rosie, and I think these people have a multitude of talent.

Hey everyone :)

I'm new to this board and just wanted to say hi and add a few posts!

I don't think Ellen became too gay at all, she struck a happy medium. It was great to see a programme on TV at the time that dealt with the whole business of being gay as what it is - something that is now a part of everyday life.

I agree that Ellen did pave the way for programmes such as Will and Grace, and I think it's a great shame that Ellen was axed when it was, just as it started to become a programme that could have a big impact on peoples lives.

Still... I guess it just wasn't to be.

Originally posted by LUCILLE BALL
I agree at that point in time people who were gay only had one foot out of the closet, you didn't see as wide spread in tv. One show that comes to mind is the Golden Girls, now i know what you are thinking how is teh golden Girls gay? They aren't but the first episode showed they had a gay house man. After 1 episode he disappears. One episode deals directly on the subject, the one with Dorothy's friend Jean has teh hots for Rose. I don't know why but apparently at that point in time most networks, still were hesitant and only touching on teh subject. Just my opinion. i enjoy Will and Grace, I like Rosie, and I think these people have a multitude of talent.


I know this was posted a while ago, but I felt the need to reply. I just wanted to say that the housekeeper on the Golden Girls wasn't written off because he was gay. Not that you were saying that, but I know a lot of people think that.

Originally posted by LUCILLE BALL
I agree at that point in time people who were gay only had one foot out of the closet, you didn't see as wide spread in tv. One show that comes to mind is the Golden Girls, now i know what you are thinking how is teh golden Girls gay? They aren't but the first episode showed they had a gay house man. After 1 episode he disappears. One episode deals directly on the subject, the one with Dorothy's friend Jean has teh hots for Rose. I don't know why but apparently at that point in time most networks, still were hesitant and only touching on teh subject. Just my opinion. i enjoy Will and Grace, I like Rosie, and I think these people have a multitude of talent.


Coco (the gay housekeeper on The Golden Girls) was written out of the show because Sophia was a strong character and the more stronger scenes between the girls were in the kitchen and having an outside energy ruins it.

Besides the episode where Dorothy's friend Jean comes and falls in love with Rose, there were 2 more episodes involving homosexuality. In one Blanche's brother Clayton comes to tell Blanche hes gay. Blanche has a hard time accepting it, but finds out she loves her brother and will support him in anything. In the other, Blanches brother comes again, but this time he has a lover and is going to get married to him. Blanche squirms again.... and learns again and everything is back to normal.

I, being gay, didn't care about Coco being axed on the golden girls.... he wasnt a great character.

this is why i think viewers turned away from Ellen: she offered a too realistic view of being gay, and many people weren't comfortable with it. Nothing against "Will & Grace," but it's not really realistic in dealing with homosexuality, and that's why it's a mainstream hit. I identify with nothing on "W&G," but it's funny, which is why I watch.

Ellen, on the other hand, I identified alot with because it was so realistic. On the other hand, I can also see how that turned alot of people off.

I don;t really think Ellen turned "too gay" though. I mean, it was no gayer than "Friends" is straight. Much of what the "Friends" do is talk about and have hetero relationships, so to speak. In the same respect, the same happened to Ellen.

Originally posted by db108108
this is why i think viewers turned away from Ellen: she offered a too realistic view of being gay, and many people weren't comfortable with it. Nothing against "Will & Grace," but it's not really realistic in dealing with homosexuality, and that's why it's a mainstream hit. I identify with nothing on "W&G," but it's funny, which is why I watch.

I agree. A friend put it bluntly (and before anyone gets offended, WE'RE NOT COMPARING STRUGGLES), W&G is to gay tv what Cosby Show was to black tv. I mean, I have encountered a lot of people who are semi-racist, but yet they loved watching The Cosby Show, same as I know a lot of people who are more conservative and closedminded about homosexuality, but yet they have no beef with Will And Grace. I think W&G is funny and well-written, but I don't think it's any more a realistic depiction of homosexuality than Scrubs (which I also find funny) is a realistic depiction of a hospital

We need another Ellen type of show to come out. I know we have Queer As Folk, but that show is WAAAAAAAAAY too soap operaesque. Way too sensational to be looked at as anything more than a gay soap.

I watch QAF too, but like you said, it';s not because I identify with it. It's just an entertainging gay soap. I mean, what hasn't happened to those characters? My life just isn't that eventfull.

Originally posted by db108108
I watch QAF too, but like you said, it';s not because I identify with it. It's just an entertainging gay soap. I mean, what hasn't happened to those characters? My life just isn't that eventfull.

I think the first season of that show was great, but then everything got sensationalized in season 2. I mean, Ted becoming a web-porn master with Emmett as his top star? I did think the first season was good, but then it started getting more and more asinine as it went on.

Its all gay, cuz shes gay in the first place

I don't think the show was too gay, I think it changed its focus too much and too fast, one week it is a show about a straight single woman and her trials and tribulations as a straight single woman, the next she is gay and in a committed relationship with a woman.

I would have preferred seeing her date women, have all these dating disasters and show that it is no different dating when your straight then when your gay.

I also would have liked the supporting cast to be more involved.

I also remember hearing that ABC had parental discretion warnings at the start of every episode, that can't have helped.

The parental warning still amaze me, because Will & Grace premiered the very next season with no warnings whatsoever.

IMHO, W&G should have the warnings as it deals with gay issues in a very distasteful way, while Ellen was much more classy and realistic about it.

I guess that's still the double standard. It's okay to poke fun as gay people, but not okay to treat them as one would treat straight people.

It still amazes me that its actually okay to make fun of gay people-while some may whince, it won't get you in any trouble. But say the same things about any ethnic group, and the boom will fall.
Why is this stereotype still okay? Why is it okay for people to say "I know being gay is wrong" (which I've read countless times on mainstream websites), but not okay to say "I know being Chinese is wrong." When will this crap ever end?

Originally posted by db108108
It still amazes me that its actually okay to make fun of gay people-while some may whince, it won't get you in any trouble. But say the same things about any ethnic group, and the boom will fall.
Why is this stereotype still okay? Why is it okay for people to say "I know being gay is wrong" (which I've read countless times on mainstream websites), but not okay to say "I know being Chinese is wrong." When will this crap ever end? I think the difference is that there are a lot of people who believe that a person is gay or lesbian by choice, and therefore not entitled to the same consideration as people who are born into a minority group. If that changes, then maybe we'll see gays being treated with the same respect and afforded the same basic human dignity as everyone else, but I don't believe that will happen any time soon, if ever.

Originally posted by db108108
It still amazes me that its actually okay to make fun of gay people-while some may whince, it won't get you in any trouble. But say the same things about any ethnic group, and the boom will fall.
Why is this stereotype still okay? Why is it okay for people to say "I know being gay is wrong" (which I've read countless times on mainstream websites), but not okay to say "I know being Chinese is wrong." When will this crap ever end?

I agree. That is why I dislike a few people on here (nobody on this board). Like one of these people (a devout Biblethumper brimstone type) said on a thread about Matthew Shepard... "I know he was a gay man but....". That kinda stuff just irks me. The gay community has made so much progress in the last 10 years yet there are still people out there who hate us and want us to die of AIDS and go to hell.

I agree. A friend put it bluntly (and before anyone gets offended, WE'RE NOT COMPARING STRUGGLES), W&G is to gay tv what Cosby Show was to black tv. I mean, I have encountered a lot of people who are semi-racist, but yet they loved watching The Cosby Show, same as I know a lot of people who are more conservative and closedminded about homosexuality, but yet they have no beef with Will And Grace. I think W&G is funny and well-written, but I don't think it's any more a realistic depiction of homosexuality than Scrubs (which I also find funny) is a realistic depiction of a hospital

We need another Ellen type of show to come out. I know we have Queer As Folk, but that show is WAAAAAAAAAY too soap operaesque. Way too sensational to be looked at as anything more than a gay soap.
I agree (btw im bi, so im sometimes gay)
BS79 you have some great opinions and ideas :)

I agree. That is why I dislike a few people on here (nobody on this board). Like one of these people (a devout Biblethumper brimstone type) said on a thread about Matthew Shepard... "I know he was a gay man but....". That kinda stuff just irks me. The gay community has made so much progress in the last 10 years yet there are still people out there who hate us and want us to die of AIDS and go to hell.

Personaly I really dont care about people who say things like that and think things like that. Because no matter what you are there are always gonna be pole who hate you for somethin. No matter if your gay bi straight white black short tall have black hair there is just always gonna be somethin

with me i see throught sexual stuff,if something is comforting funny etc ill watch it gay or not etc..

I Don't Personally Know Anyone Who Is Openly Gay, and I Don't Personally Have Anything Against A Person Who Is Gay. What I and A Lot Of People Protest Is When Homosexuals Push It In The General Public's Face and then Try To Pass Being Gay Off As If It Were NORMAL. That's Where The Problem Arises. Keep What Goes On In Your Bedroom IN YOUR BEDROOM, and NOT in MY FACE.

http://www.fame10.com/entertainment/5-gay-celebrities-who-claim-coming-out-ruined-their-careers/4/

2. Ellen Degeneres

Ellen Degeneres publically came out in 1997 on the cover of Time magazine. Being television’s first openly gay star wasn’t easy. When her television persona came out on her self-titled sitcom, 42 million people tuned in; however, ratings fell soon after and the show was cancelled the following year. “I tried to incorporate educational things about what people actually go through when they’re coming out, and it wasn’t funny,” she told the New York Times. “Because it’s not funny.” Ellen took a long hiatus after her show was cancelled but managed to revive her career several years later. Today, she’s known as one of the most successful talk show hosts and businesswomen on TV.