Anyone going to watch NBC's "The Matthew Shepard Story" Starring Stockard Channing, Sam Waterston, and Shane Meier?

A B S L U T E L Y

[COLOR=purple]Kill homophobia, not people.

Is that on tonight, or when? :happyface :happyface :happyface

yep its on tonight on NBC at 9pm. im watching it to thats a sad story though. i have a book on him to. im all for gay rights gay people are equal people and should be treated with dignity etc. i love gay people

Originally posted by SitcomFan
yep its on tonight on NBC at 9pm. im watching it to thats a sad story though. i have a book on him to. im all for gay rights gay people are equal people and should be treated with dignity etc. i love gay people I do, too. I cannot believe I didn't know about this movie until now. I mean, I had heard of it, but I didn't know when it would be on. Gay individuals are people too! Everyone needs to realize that. They are as human as everyone else. They don't choose to be homosexual. Quite honestly, who would? :happyface :happyface :happyface

I feel strongly that gay people deserve the same rights and opportunities as straight people and I think Matthew Shepard's death was a sad tragedy, but I do feel that people give him way too much attention. It's not like he was the first person who died as a result of a hate crime. Personally, I think ANY crime committed against ANY person is a hate crime.

I am not ashamed of ANY of my beliefs and how dare you say I should be. Yes, homosexuality is a sin, but the bible (if you want to go the religious route) says that everyone commits sins and that all we have to do is ask forgiveness for our sins. And I also believe that Matthew Shepard does not get too much attention. True, he is not the first gay individual to die as a result of a hate crime, but this was quite likely the most publicized story of them all, which is obviously why it grabs so much attention. People who say that supporters of homosexuality should be ashamed should be ashamed of themselves because, in a sense, they are saying that these people are not people. God does not hate '***s,' as so many unfairly refer to them as. Just because a person is gay does not mean they go to hell. What is a shame is that people who believe that would have more sympathy for rapists and serial killers.

***And as for the movie, it was an excellent piece of work. I would be lying if I told you that I did not shed a few tears periodically throughout the movie. This is a film that perfectly details how ignorant, intollerant, cruel, unfair, and prejudiced people can be, and we must not let hate overpower ourselves. I taped it and am planning to bring it to the Gay-Straight Alliance group at my school because I believe that it is important that people watch this movie. Perhaps it can make an impact in someone's life. :happyface :happyface :happyface

Jordan:

You're fairly open about homosexuality (although you believe that they are doing something that they need to be forgiven for) but you absolutely condemn women who sleep around. Just wondering how you come to what I would see as conflicting logic.

I didn't catch this, but I saw Laramie Project, it was amazing.

I don't understand why some people still have such a problem with homosexuality (like the guy who made that post about how it's a sin, without stating it's his opinion), of everything that is wrong out there in the world, are gays really the worst thing? I mean, can you say Boy George or RuPaul has inflicted more evil o te world than Osama Bin Laden?

and to the person who is getting on the guy who is pro-gay but anti-prostitute? what's the logic. Comparing homosexuality with prostitution is as wrong as some fundamentalists claim being gay is

Originally posted by Johnny McBeal
Iand to the person who is getting on the guy who is pro-gay but anti-prostitute? what's the logic. Comparing homosexuality with prostitution is as wrong as some fundamentalists claim being gay is You read what I wrote out of context and consequently missed the point completely. In a reply in another thread about abortion Jordan said women that sleep around should suffer the pain of child birth, and because of that they would then think twice about sleeping around. I don't know where you got the prostitution idea from. In that thread I told Jordan that was, in my view, a ludicrous condemnation of women. So in this thread, when he showed a much less condemning attitude toward gays, I asked him to please explain the logic of his double standard morality. I see no reason why gay or straight should is an issue myself.

Originally posted by kittflynn
You read what I wrote out of context and consequently missed the point completely. In a reply in another thread about abortion Jordan said women that sleep around should suffer the pain of child birth, and because of that they would then think twice about sleeping around. I don't know where you got the prostitution idea from. In that thread I told Jordan that was, in my view, a ludicrous condemnation of women. So in this thread, when he showed a much less condemning attitude toward gays, I asked him to please explain the logic of his double standard morality. I see no reason why gay or straight should is an issue myself.

oh ok, but I still don';t understand the analogy. I don't see hypocrisy about not really agreeing with loose women but yet thinking that gays deserve equal rights as human beings. I am gay and have hardly "slept around", so I don't really see the comparison. There are tramps in both the gay and straight community, I don't think one is more "right" than another. I don't respect a gay guy who pries around the clubs looking for sex every night and not using any protection any more than I respect a woman who does the same thing. I'm not ultramoralistic about the "sex outside of marriage" deal because I'm never getting married, and I don't think marriage is right for everyone who is straight. But I do think sex should be special, between two people who actually care about each other and actually see a future, as opposed to a one-night-stand. Yet I still love SEX AND THE CITY and QUEER AS FOLK and root for Samantha and Brian, oh well, guess it'sdifferent when it's a tv character, LOL!!!

Jordan didn't just "not really agree with loose women," as you put it, he condemned them to what ever fate might befall them due to what, in his opinion, is immoral behavior. More than a simple tsk, tsk. Generally when someone is that judgemental and uptight about promiscuity, it usually follows that they disapprove of homosexuality. Also, as you said, there is, of course, promiscuity among gays and I wondered if Jordan was overlooking that fact. I was trying to flesh out his thinking. My question may have gotten jumbled in the process. If you'd care to take the time, look at the abortion thread and see what he said and my reply to that. Maybe you would then better understand what I was getting at here.

GBScott you need to rethink ur opinions on homosexuality. i feel that all people are created equally even if there gay so its not a sin either. people get on my last nerves who say that homosexuality is a sin.

Poor Matthew Shepard died because he was homosexual that is terrible. the movie was a great piece of work

IMO, I think being gay is just fine! It's not a sin! It's a....preference! My grandpa says that "gay is too nice of a word to use to describe thos people. They're nothing but perverts" I TOTALLY disagree with that! And perverts?? He's got something wrong there! On Primetime with Rosie O'Donnel and those two guys who adopted those kids with AIDS....That took courage to stand up for them like that.

This just may be my own opinion. Anyway I feel if a person is Homosexual or Lesbian it's nobodys business. Except theirs
& their partners. As for their everlasting eternal life that is between them & God.
That goes for everyone straight or gay. If some one tells you you will go to hell don't listen to them because nobody knows where anybody goes in the after life.

It just makes me sad and disgusted that many people refuse to deny basic human rights, opportunities, and respect to human beings just because of their race, religion, sexual orientation, ethnic bsackground, disability, age, or gender or whatever. We are all created by God in God's image. Wouldn't this world just suck if we were all young, able-bodied, white, heterosexual Christians?

I was brought up in a strict Catholic household and I was always told that homosexuals were evil, disgusting perverts and I shouldn't have anything to do with them, ever! I'm ashamed to say that for the longest time, I believed it. When I started college back in the fall of 1999, I met some really nice people who I later found out were gay. They weren't evil, disgusting perverts at all. They happened to be some of the nicest, kindest, most gentle people I ever met. I've come to the conclusion that Jesus wants us to love ALL human beings and treat them with respect, regardless of our differences. I think all sins were forgiven when Jesus died on the cross for us.

Being born with multiple physical disabilities, i can sorta feel how gay people must feel: knowing that there are people out there who hate you because of something you have no control over. It's not a nice feeling at all :crying: :crying: :crying:

Wingsfan:
That was a very thoughtful and heartfelt reply. It's good to see someone speak out in such an honest way.

Originally posted by gbscott1954


Homosexuality is immoral and a sin. You should be ashamed to
support people who are participating in such evil. The murder of
Matthew Sheppard was wrong, there is no doubt whatsoever
about that-murder is murder. But, at the same time gays and
lesbians should not be looked up to as folk heroes. I believe
that Lisa Whelchel would agree with me strongly on this point.

Ooh, so because miss goddess Lisa Whelchel believes that it's wrong, that makes it true?

You shouldn't drag her into this to prove your point. I'm sure she probably does think it's wrong, as she's a very strong conservative type of Christian.
This is another thing I have strong opinions about.

First of all, I know that the bible says it's wrong, but I happen to think that following the bible exactly is ridicules.

I would certainly hope that the ways of the world have improved since it was written. I'll make this short, to me, there is nothing wrong with homosexuality.
I know a lot of gays and lesbians, they are like anyone else.
Some of them have bad attitudes, others are as sweet as can be. Just like straights.
Lets try this,
those of you who are against it, can you explain what you find wrong with it without bringing the bible into it?

I'd be very interested to see what you have to say. :) ~Jessi

I didnt see the Matthew Sheppard film, was there any mention
of the Rev. Fred Phelps in the movie? He is the Kansas Baptist minister who felt that Sheppard's murder was a "good thing" and that the 2 guys who murdered him should've got off the hook becuase Sheppard would have died of AIDS anyway ( only gays get AIDS anyway ) , in fact these 2 guys did Sheppard a favor by murdering him. THese are some of the things I heard him say on various radio shows just after the Sheppard murder. He was also the one ( and his flock ) who traveled to Wyoming to protest the funeral of Sheppard.

I too grew up thanks to my parents believing that homosexuals were sick, ect.. I was told for example that if a man isnt married by the time he is 23 or at least have a kid by age 23 then he must be gay. But I grew up unlike others in my hometown as right now as I speak they are in the process of trying to pass a law banning same sex roomates thinking that will stop homosexual acts plus one of the local Chevy dealerships here refuses to work on cars from customers they "feel could be gay". Dont want to catch the AIDS!!! THis goes to show that the problem of homophobia is quite bad.

What gets me about this issue, over the years I met other so-called Christians who go one and on about how sick and perverted gays are and that they will go to hell and such. Yet some of these same people have sexual relations outside of marriage, lie all the time, steal, sex with minors ect... Yet the sin of the homosexual lifestyle is the only sin. That I dont get it. Just like my neighbor. He is 27 years old while his girlfriend is 14, they live together and he goes on about how sick "dem queers are" and will be going to hell. We'll what about a 27 year old and 14 year old having sexual relations? Thats sick too in my opinion.

Just like the church I went to as a child with my parents, being told by the pastor that woman/girls who wear pants were "whores" and will be going to hell. Having a tv in your home, listen to rock and country music, go to the movies, drink soda, smoke cigarettes ,eating shrimp will send you to hell. And some of these same "preachers" say AIDS was sent by God to kill the gays and that straight persons cant get AIDS. All this I was told was in the Bible. Oh...do you own a cat ? We'll you better kill it right now, according to my old church a cat is a product of satan ( only animal not mentioned in the Bible says them ) and a cat will send you straight to hell. Guess a lot of us well be on our way to hell. What kind of church did I attend as a child? It was a Baptist Chruch.

Isnt any wonder why we have so many confused folks out there as well as a huge number of people catching HIV/AIDS in reocrd numbers?

My beloved gal Anna showed me this the other day.
She's been reading the good book, she's religious you know, and we are going to try and follow all of those pesky rules. Here are some I never knew about. Look 'em up.

1. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15:19-24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

4. Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an
abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we
just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev.20:14)

http://winkwilliams.blogspot.com/

Brilliant post, WinkWilliams!

Originally posted by joan davis fan
But I grew up unlike others in my hometown as right now as I speak they are in the process of trying to pass a law banning same sex roomates thinking that will stop homosexual acts plus one of the local Chevy dealerships here refuses to work on cars from customers they "feel could be gay". Dont want to catch the AIDS!!! THis goes to show that the problem of homophobia is quite bad.


:eek: :eek: That is seriously whacked out, especially that whole "no same sex roommates" thing. But then aren't they going to get their pants in a twist when they realize different sex roommates could be promoting sex outside of marriage? What's next, a law saying you can't live with roommates? :eek:

And winkwilliams, that post of yours was absolutely hilarious and also brilliant, as WingsFan said. I absolutely hate how people go running to the Bible to defend their hateful views on gays, but they choose to ignore the other parts of the Bible that promote outdated ideas about women and slavery.

It really bugs me when people hide behind the Bible to defend their racist, sexist, or homophobic views. Christianity is supposed to be about loving God and His Children and accepting the fact that Jesus died on the cross to save us all from Hell, not about condemning people.

it's nice to see so many people standing up to the fundamentalist about homosexuality.

This is 2002, times have changed, we're not going away, deal with it. Will And Grace is must-see TV, Queer As Folk is one of tv's biggest cult shows. Sir Ian McKellen gets nominated for an Oscar and hosted SNL. Rosie O'Donnell even came out.

So who cares what Lisa Whelchel thinks? She is good as Blair, but that's about it. I admit to not being a fan of her as a person (even tho as Blair I always liked the role) because I think she is way too preachy about things. It's nice that she doesn't believe in sex outside of marriage, but not doing an episode of the show where she has sex outside of marriage is not going to stop premarital sex no matter how you slice it. Now I do love The Facts Of Life and hope it comes back to Nick, but while I am happy that Lisa has a happy life and family (and I thought she looked amazing on the FOL reunion movie), I don't agree with a lot of the things she stands for and hope when her kids get older, they will be able to come to their own conclusions about things instead of what's engrained in their head.

Gays are just trying to make it through in life. And all these so-called Christians are out to get us. They claim "hate the sin, love the sinner", but it seems like it's more "hate the sin, hate the sinner even worse".

Is there anyone else in here who knows who Anita Bryant is? The only reason she doesn't rank up there with Barbra Streisand, Bette Midler, Cher, Diana Ross and other all-time divas is the fact that she treated the gay community like garbage (she was a big pop singer in the 60's, then she became a Christian fundamentalist and spoke out against the gay fans who supported her, and even went as far as doing hate campaigns against us... but it all backfired on her and her career is long over).

I'm not saying gay people aren't sinners, because EVERYONE is a sinner. But I'm sick of gays being hate scapegoats for everyone. CHRISTIANS mean you should live your life like Christ did. The fact that Jesus befriended Mary Magdalaine, a prostitute who was the victim of scorn by everyone, shows that he was a much better man than the fundies who claim to be his followers.

About gay adoption. People carry on and on about how a kid needs a mom AND a dad. Most kids wind up in divorced homes anyways, so what's the deal? I'd rather see a kid being raised by two loving lesbians or gay men than a neglegent (sp?) straight man or woman.

Originally posted by kittflynn
You read what I wrote out of context and consequently missed the point completely. In a reply in another thread about abortion Jordan said women that sleep around should suffer the pain of child birth, and because of that they would then think twice about sleeping around. I don't know where you got the prostitution idea from. In that thread I told Jordan that was, in my view, a ludicrous condemnation of women. So in this thread, when he showed a much less condemning attitude toward gays, I asked him to please explain the logic of his double standard morality. I see no reason why gay or straight should is an issue myself.
Okay, here are the vibes I am getting from you. According to you, you say that I am fairly open to homosexuality and that I condemn women who sleep around. Yes, I do condemn women AND men who sleep around and no I am not fairly open to homosexuality -- I'm VERY open. And another thing I get from what you say is that all gay people sleep around. HELLO? No, not all gay people sleep around, just like all straight people don't sleep around, just like all men don't sleep around, and just like all women don't sleep around. Yes, I am a Republican who is all for gay rights. Yes, people, there is such a thing! So you are saying that I confuse you? You confuse me. :happyface :happyface :happyface

Originally posted by Johnny McBeal
it's nice to see so many people standing up to the fundamentalist about homosexuality.

This is 2002, times have changed, we're not going away, deal with it. Will And Grace is must-see TV, Queer As Folk is one of tv's biggest cult shows. Sir Ian McKellen gets nominated for an Oscar and hosted SNL. Rosie O'Donnell even came out.

Gays are just trying to make it through in life. And all these so-called Christians are out to get us. They claim "hate the sin, love the sinner", but it seems like it's more "hate the sin, hate the sinner even worse".

About gay adoption. People carry on and on about how a kid needs a mom AND a dad. Most kids wind up in divorced homes anyways, so what's the deal? I'd rather see a kid being raised by two loving lesbians or gay men than a neglegent (sp?) straight man or woman.

You saud it perfectly! Thank you! :happyface :happyface :happyface

Originally posted by Jordan

Okay, here are the vibes I am getting from you. According to you, you say that I am fairly open to homosexuality and that I condemn women who sleep around. Yes, I do condemn women AND men who sleep around and no I am not fairly open to homosexuality -- I'm VERY open. And another thing I get from what you say is that all gay people sleep around. HELLO? No, not all gay people sleep around, just like all straight people don't sleep around, just like all men don't sleep around, and just like all women don't sleep around. Yes, I am a Republican who is all for gay rights. Yes, people, there is such a thing! So you are saying that I confuse you? You confuse me. :happyface :happyface :happyface
You won't find anywhere that Isaid all gay people sleep around. I said that there is promiscuity among gays just as there is among straights. You said that gays need forgivness (another one of your facts, I assume) I would hardly call that being VERY open to homosexuality, I would call that insultingly tolerant. Are you just making this s*** up as to what I supposedly said as you go along, or can you not read?

Okay, you're pissing me off. Let's get this clear: I respect your opinion, as I respect everyone elses. Everyone has the right to one. Homosexuality is considered a sin and sins need to be forgiven. Now, I am not religious, so don't think that I am preaching anything. I am not insultingly tolerant because you are just putting words into my mouth. I don't want to have heated battles between you because that's just not me.

Everyone sins and therefore we all need forgiveness, not just gay people.

***by the way, don't insult me like that again.***

Originally posted by Jordan
***by the way, don't insult me like that again.***
Your words in these threads speak for themselves. If you're insuted by my opinion of what you say, so be it.

Okay, if anyone else can clearly define my contridictions, I will step down. Likewise, if anyone sees anything odd about Kittflynn's, say so. I'm not a mean person here -- I would like to get along, honestly. But I'm not going to be polite to someone who is uncaring as to if someone is insulted and someone who says I am too stupid to read.

Originally posted by Bootsy Whoosh


:eek: :eek: That is seriously whacked out, especially that whole "no same sex roommates" thing. But then aren't they going to get their pants in a twist when they realize different sex roommates could be promoting sex outside of marriage? What's next, a law saying you can't live with roommates? :eek:

And winkwilliams, that post of yours was absolutely hilarious and also brilliant, as WingsFan said. I absolutely hate how people go running to the Bible to defend their hateful views on gays, but they choose to ignore the other parts of the Bible that promote outdated ideas about women and slavery.

My hometown is whacked out period !!! Thats why I moved from there. Not long ago there was a push to have Anne Heche come to my hometown so they could give her the key of the city and declair an "Ann Heche Day" or something. Reason: " because Anne Heche learned that being a lesbian was disgusting and promotes bad morals. Anne had the courage to shed her lesbian life to find a man to marry and have a baby with. She learned to be straight and should be considered a role model for gays/lesbians who wish to be straight so they can go to heaven".

Ok, what about all those things Heche has said since she had gotten married like "...just because I got married doesnt mean I'm straight" and the comment she made I believe to Barbara Walters that the best sex she ever had was with...Ellen. Really sounds like she "gave up" her lesbian life.

About Anita Bryant, it is true that her views on homosexuals killed her career ( though I heard she doesnt share them now ). Its one thing to disapprove of something but some of the comments I remember her saying , well they were disgusting as well as stupid. Another "Anita Bryant" is Baseball's John Rocker. When the Atlanta Braves sent him to play for their farm team, the Richmond Braves I remember hearing that not only does he hate gays but he would quit a team that have a gay on its staff nor would he play against a team that "has a queer" or even play in a stadium that allows gay fans. What does he do? Scan the seats, looking at other players- make sure they are not gay? Does he have some kind of "gay-dar" or something!!! When I saw that on tv I was both, mad and laughing at this. Its hard to keep a straight face when you have a baseball player out there is more concern if the man seating in section 4F is gay than homeruns.

Anita Bryant was talked about in other thread here recently. After talking to a friend of mine who runs a tv station yesterday, Bryant's views on homosexuals have led to a rule in broadcasting that to this day is still enforced. On tv shows and movies that features homosexual characters the name of the character cannot be named "Bruce". Even on Queer As Folk , none of the characters there are named Bruce. Anita Bryant kept using "gay bruce " jokes back in the 70s and saying that all men named Bruce were gay ( thats how whacked out she was !!! ) , fearing a lawsuit the networks have since made the naming a gay character on tv "Bruce" taboo. In that aspect Anita Bryant will always be there, think I'll have a glass of cold Florida Orange juice now !!!

Originally posted by joan davis fan

Not long ago there was a push to have Anne Heche come to my hometown so they could give her the key of the city and declair an "Ann Heche Day" or something. Reason: " because Anne Heche learned that being a lesbian was disgusting and promotes bad morals. Anne had the courage to shed her lesbian life to find a man to marry and have a baby with. She learned to be straight and should be considered a role model for gays/lesbians who wish to be straight so they can go to heaven".
Ok, what about all those things Heche has said since she had gotten married like "...just because I got married doesnt mean I'm straight" and the comment she made I believe to Barbara Walters that the best sex she ever had was with...Ellen. Really sounds like she "gave up" her lesbian life.


I have this strange feeling that Anne wasn't even gay to begin with. She really creeps me out for some reason. I think she's a good actress, but she seems like a complete wacko to me. I'll let Marilyn Manson move in with me before I let her in.

I don't know for sure if she really is or isn't, but she does give me a really strange feeling and I don't like to believe stuff she says.

Originally posted by WingsFan

I have this strange feeling that Anne wasn't even gay to begin with.
You've got that strange feeling, too? :happyface :happyface :happyface