Good Times Boned the Fish When... [Archive] - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

TMC

02-25-2014, 05:38 PM

https://web.archive.org/web/20070225141752/http://jumptheshark.com/

Other Thoughts:

one word: Dynooomite!!
When James takes the job in Alaska on the pipeline, and the tone of the show turns "serious"
First of all, James did not die of a heart attack -- he died in an off-screen car crash in Mississippi! Although Esther Rolle is an Emmy award-winning actress, she will always be remembered for her reaction to James' passing -- "DAMN, DAMN, DAMN!" The show jumped shark when James died; however, it did a reversal for a brief period but jumped again when Florida married Carl and moved to Arizona. By the time she returned for Thelma's wedding to Keith, it was time to pull the plug.
When James died, the show went downhill overnight. James was THE MAN, the ornery guy who was angry at the system that "screwed" him, and a lot of the show's humor came from that. Florida provided the "heart" of the show by reminding James of his morals and principles, without getting bogged down in heavy-handed lecturing. After James' demise, it became the "J. J. Show" to the same degree that the Fonz dominated Happy Days. But at least Henry Winkler could act. Jimmie Walker was, and still is, a STAND-UP COMIC. Period. HOW MANY TIMES does he have to do those obnoxious catch phrases before the writers realize that it is NOT FUNNY? And why were they always writing scripts that required Jimmie to ACT? Big mistake.
Let's put as many black stereotypes in the same room as we can and see what happens. Ever wondered where the Good Times Virus Hoax got its name? Well now you know. "Dynomite!!" Sheesh! Last time I saw Jimmy Walker he finally got off the drugs, gained some weight, and he was judging beauty pageants with Jamie Farr. Now that's progress!
Ok not really a baby, but the character of Penny (as played by the pre-fierce miss janet jackson). Ouch, the way her mother approached her with the iron. The audience in typical Good Times Style reacted big time with an overwhelming collective 'whoooooo'. We knew tough times were coming for our poor Penny. up to this point it was ok - standard moral/social issue stuff we'd expect from All in the Family in the projects. But when Wilona adopts Penny and she becomes a happy, well-adjusted cast member (with no hint of her abused past) this is where it all goes wrong. Once a show adopts a new, rather cuddly new character, cf The Brady Bunch, the drainspout is at hand...I kinda thought when James Evans Snr. died and Florida smashed the punchbowl exclaiming 'Damn, damn, damn' it was rather touching. What an emotional catharsis.
Where the hell was Florida? Probably _IN_ Florida, but then she came back.
Good Times was to me the greatest show of all time. You had JJ, Themla, Michael and the gang cracking me up every week with their plots. BEst of all the relationship with James and the kids was realistic. Then the stupid producers start steryotyping the show and James was killed. It was ok, but adding Penny made the whole thing seem phoney.
The episode after the famous, "mama, no mama!" shout of Janet, a.k.a., Penny, Jackson when Malona adopted her and she became a regular cast member.
"Good Times" was right up there with "All in the Family", and the other Norman Lear classics during the first seasons, but at some point, they decided that J.J.'s wacky antics, and, let's not forget, hilarious catch-phrases, would be a better focus for the show than the trials of a ghetto family trying to get by. Jimmie Walker was the Jim Carrey of the 70's. The show also suffers from insufferable brat syndrome in the form of adorable little Janet Jackson as Penny during the episodes where Esther Rolle had wisely decided to jump ship. (Forcing the writers to have Willona inexplicably hang around the Evans apartment for no good reason and deliver Florida's lines ("Right on, Willona!") It almost qualifies under the death category- while James' death did result in some very powerful episodes, the show lost something without him...and then without Florida. And finally, the hollow, all-too sugary last episode where everyone instantly became rich and happy. A nice thought, but maybe they went a bit overboard between J.J. starting his own comic book and Thelma's dull hubby miraculously recovering from his leg injury and getting a football contract.
Good Times jumped when James Evans Sr. died. He really was the heart of the family.
Every time I see those huge, blocky projects buildings in any city I hear that gospel piano start up and the gospel choir start to singin' "Aint we lucky we got 'em...Good Times!"
This may be hard for people to believe, but when John Amos was on, this show was actually good.
WHEN CBS SAID THE SHOW WAS MOVING TO SATURDAY WHAT WERE THEY THINKING THE SHOW HAD IT NOT MOVED TO THE GRAVEYARD COULD HAVE LASTED TIL 1989. JIMMIE WALKERS TALENTS SHOULD NOT BE CONFINED TO SATURDAY NIGHTS. ESTHER ROLLE PROBABLY TOOK A FIT WHEN SHE FOUND OUT ABOUT THE MOVE.
A great show. I know it wasn't an accurate portrayal of the projects, but they came closer than any TV show before. With the exception of Jimmie Walker (God was he annoying!), all the acting was good, the writing on target and dealt with real, serious issues. The show came REAL Close to jumping when Esther Rolle left. Good thing they toned down JJ's idiotic character and got her back. One of the best black shows ever put on TV.
Damn Damn Damn Damn!! Why did they even consider leaving good times on the tube after James Died? He dies then they bring new characters such as Sweets the gangster? Then J J leaves the show & CBS still refuses to get the hint. But it REALLY jts when willona, who was single & lived in the projects, was able to ADOPT a child. Does this happen in real life? EVER!!
Damn, damn, damn Thelma was fine!!
James (the father dies) It went from a show about a family living life in the projects with humor to a piece of garbage looking for excuses to get JJ to clap his hands and yell "Dyn-o-mite!"
While I personally think it really jumped the second time JJ said dy-no-mite and the t-shirts started showing up, I can make a better case for the first talent show. Was that before or after James died and/or Florida moved to Arizona?
After James's death, they had Florida get romanced by Carl Dixon and she accepted his proposal but Esther Rolle left the show. .so, they had it that she and Carl had married and moved to Arizona for his health! THEN when she came back for Thelma's Wedding, she gave a gift that 'Carl and I 'wanted Thelma to have. .the VERY last reference EVER made to Carl Dixon. She not only permanently stays in Chicago but doesn't even bother to explain to Carl or anyone else why she's NOT returning to him in Arizona. .and, in fact, from that point on, reverts to being 'Mrs. Evans' - pretending as though she's STILL a widow who did NOT remarry after her first husband's death! The writers REALLY dropped the ball on Florida's character as well as the rest of the show!
All in all, this was a great show. It showed how the "other half", the half that no one liked talking about, lived. My only criticism was the last season or so. I didn't even mind when they killed off James because it showed Florida in a positive light in regards to how she and the rest of the family dealt with this loss. When J.J. suddenly became a success, however, the show lost its edge.
It jumped when Esther Rolle(d)on in 1977. Leaving J.J. in charge was a recipe for trouble. It just fed his big ego. Jimmie Walker was the reason that James and Florida left. Plus adding Janet Jackson to the cast was stupid. They needed a child to fill in for Michael, now that he was growing up. When Thelma's boyfriend came to live there it was over. They had this guy try to be like James. Bad move.I think it should have ended after the '76-'77 season. Remember, at the end of that season, Florida was supposed to marry Carl. Norman Lear always stuck with a show too long. Just look at "All In The Family", "Maude", and "The Jeffersons"
This was a phenomenal show the first season when it was about the family. When the focused on getting by, how they got by, when they didn't, and all the good things about being a family even if you are just getting by. Then they turned it into Step and Fetchit. The characters were dumbed down and the depth of the stories disappeared. DY-NO-MITE everything after the first season and a half. It needs to be destroyed.
When they killed off the character of James Evans (John Amos). The show went downhill immediately following that. It really took a turn for the cemetery when it added Keith (Thelma's husband) to the cast. He was suppose to be a famous football player but when he tripped over JJ and broke his leg, leaving him unable to play professional football again (which itself was totally and completely unbelieveable and to this day I don't know why they even went with that plot), he moved into the projects with the rest of the family, making him, in my book, a BUM!!
The thanksgiving episode when the daughter discovered that her cousin was an alcoholic. We were treated to this long monotonous lecture on how the kids in the projects were dying because of booze. Complete snore.
Yallg gonna make me lose my mind up in here.
When Bookman the janitor joined the cast, it was over!
this show was great for a while, but it took the shark jump when james sr died, and it took an even bigger jump when florida left and it became the wilona and jj show...by the time florida returned, this show had long been eaten by the shark...
When you realized that James Evans senior wore the same friggin' pair of off-white cordouroys for every friggin' episode.
Of course James Sr. wore the same cordouroys in every episode -- they were POOR, remember? This was quite a contrast to Bernadette Stanis demanding that she wear different expensive clothes in every episode because she couldn't stand looking poor on TV. As I grew up in a middle class white family where there wasn't a Black person within two hundred miles, this was a fascinating show to watch. I knew nothing about what "projects" were or anything about poverty or unemployment. Good Times didn't deal with these topics as bluntly as All in the Family dealt with prejudice, but even the watered down issues were eye-opening. John Amos and Esther Rolle were true actors dedicated to giving the series some realism while every other actor on the show was waiting for their agents to put them on the big screen. When both Amos and Rolle were gone the show was a joke and it showed how little the rest of the cast cared about the show. Example: J.J. gets shot on the street and Florida holds him in complete horror. I will never forget the freeze-framed look on her face over the "To Be Continued" was on the screen. But just before that the audiences was laughing. Why? Because Jimmie Walker said "Oh mama, I've been shot!" like it was the punchline to another one of his jokes. I'm surprised "Mama I've been shot" didn't replace "dy-no-mite" as the next Good Times catch phrase.
When James Died! The show was much more realistic while at the same time hilarious when John Amos was still on the cast. After James died, the show went downhill, the writing became just plain silly and not funny at all. Does anyone else think that Selma was really really hot?
The constant yelling from James and the was J.J. tried to smooth him over left me in stitches. James was the reason I watched the show. At least his death gave us one of the most memorable lines in TV history - DAMN! DAMN! DAMN!
Good Times jumps the shark every time the audience goes "woooooooooo!!" I watch the reruns just so I can hear the audience's reactions.
Good Times jumped after James died. He left to do "ROOTS" in which he gave a great performance.
When James, the husband died.... You know the famous DAYUM DAYUM DAYUM scene
Good Times first jumped the shark when James Sr. died, or actually left the show when he saw it becoming the JJ Show. Then when Janet Jackson aka Penny arrived. Then when Florida married Carl and skipped town. And when Thelma's jock husband arrives and breaks his leg. Why did he and Thelma have to stay living in projects anyway--they should have at least gotten their own apartment. They all should have left when they got jobs anyway. I could see them having to live there when James was supporting all of them on $2.50 an hour at the car wash. And why was Wallona living there at all? She was single with a decent job, and dressed like a fancy ho. If she dipped into her clothing budget a little bit, she could have gotten a decent place to live.
I understand that Good Times was supposed to be a cutting edged program, focusing on the hard knock life led by blacks in the Cabrini Green Projects in Chicago, but it sucked from day one. Like most Norman Lear programs the characters possessed an enormous amount of knowledge and insight, but were limited by society or their own indifference. I just don't understand. Why is it that Florida was so intelligent and hard working but couldn't find regular employment? Why is it that even after Thelma went to college (didn't she go to Northwestern?) she still remained at home? and to top it off her boyfriend Keith went from being a college student living on campus to living in a two bedroom apartment in the projects. I mean I understand that times are rough sometimes, but this show made not one bit of damn sense in regards to the undue hardships that they experienced. This was Chicago in the mid-seventies, not Nashville in 1956.
NEVER JUMPED! I TRYYY to remember that everyone has their own opinion here (smile), but, I must admit, it's VERY HARD for me to do so regarding criticism of one of my favorite all-time TV shows, "Good Times." OK, so the show went through some cast changes. It STILL CONSISTENTLY AND SUCCESSFULLY balanced social issues/commentary with comedy throughout it's long, very successful run----without being PREACHY!!!! Not many shows can do this well (see "Roc" or, at times, "Designing Women" to get my point). A lot of this had to go to the actors. Esther Rolle and John Amos were excellent in their portrayals as James and Florida Evans. This was one family sitcom where the children knew who were the authority figures (there are so many sitcoms where the kids talk to their parents anyway they want to!). I don't think Jimmie Walker's "J.J." character was the buffoon/Steppin Fetchit (sp??) that critics have tried to make him. I never took his character that seriously or gave the role that much power to get offended or upset about it. I've got less problems with the J.J. character than I do with some of the characters found on some (not all) of the UPN or WB shows of today (but that's another story, so why digress?). Anyway, when Mr. Amos left the show, it did lose the voice of a very strong fatherly figure, but I wouldn't say that the show jumped the shark after he left. There were MANY many strong episodes after he left [examples: Willona's ex-husband Ray comes back and accosts Thelma (GREAT ending when Willona socks Ray in the face!); Michael is bullied into joining a street gang; Florida throws J.J. out the house after he starts working for some hustlers; after winning a lottery prize, the family is held at gunpoint by a student that Thelma is tutoring (guest star Shirley Hemphill from another funny show, "What's Happening!!"; Thelma gets engaged to an African exchange student, etc, etc, etc]. I thought the talent shows were good (at least the actors on "Good Times" actually had talent---how many "talent show" episodes have you seen on other sitcoms where you wanna throw up!). I thought the child abuse episodes with Penny (Janet Jackson) were great television. When Penny's birth mother returned (played by Chip Fields, who is Kim "Facts of Life" Fields' mother) to reclaim Penny, was also a GREAT episode (who didn't cheer when Willona pins Penny's birth mother against the wall when she tried to strike at Penny when her "old ways" came out???). I LOVED this show! And most of it's characters. About the only character that got on my nerves at times was Bookman the janitor. He could really be obnoxious, but just when I had enough of him, Willona or J.J. would always diss him with a great comeback and shut him up! Finally, this show had one of the best themes in the history of television ("keeping your head above water, making a way when we can . . . "). OK, I'm done. :-)
When they replaced the P*I*T*S Films logo with Columbia-Tristar Television on the TBS reruns
When James Jr. died, Esther Rolle left, and Winona "adopted" Penny. So it jumped the shark three times.
The moment the creators of the show actually tried to make viewers believe that a handsome muscular guy like John Amos could POSSIBLY be married to probably the UGLIEST sitcom mother/wife EVER in the history of television. I mean, Esther Rolle had no neck for Christ's sake? But hey, she was a damn damn damn good actress...
When Penny joined the show. Winona just wasn't fun anymore.
A travesty...the homosexual rape of Bookman by Ned the Whino.....how could they????
JTS definitely when James died. I can't tell you how many batches I rubbed out to the thought of Thelma's big cans. I also especially enjoyed the episode where JJ's chick is shooting up in the bathroom! He should have stuck with Henrietta.
When James Died, of course AND when JJ supposedly was a talent agent AND when Thelma married that Keith Anderson fellow AND when Florida married Carl, then he somehow disappeared without a trace (talk about a silent divorce, LOL)
I totally agreed with the poster who said that even though these were smart, hard working people they couldn't find good employment. Hokey! Please answer me this, I swear Sinbad was on this show - only that wasn't his name at the time. Any help?
When Florida Evans dropped the punch bowl and screamed that memorable phrase, "DAMN!, DAMN!, DAMN!"
Keith, a former football star, is forced to live on the Evans' couch. Why couldn't they get their own apartment??
First off, in the episode of James' funeral, DAMN DAMN DAMN!, Esther Rolle gives one of the best performances ever on tv. I still think back on it. And remember, the show was originally hers! The death of James, for me, was a chance for even greater realism for the show because many ghetto families have no father. But Mother left...and seemingly in a panic and to now give a new reason for Willona's existence on the show, bratty Penny shows up. She black and blue long enough for Willona to rescue her but never shows characteristics of having been abused ever again.
This was very good until James died in the car accident. I used to laugh myself silly when James would threatened to whip JJ. The final nail in the coffin was when the mom moved away and married Carl. Winona then took over the show and it really sucked.All she would ever do was to tell off Intentionally Stupid white characters to the hoots and hollers of the audience."TELL EM' WINONA!!! I remember one episode when Winona got a job at a department store and was told by the fat white lady to watch people in the dressing room to catch them stealing. Winona then told the lady off. "TELL EM WINONA!!!" The audience would yell. It was because of crap like this i stopped watching the show. And i was only 8 at the time!! Oh yeah, why did she always have to screw with Bookman? He was one of the better characters in the later seasons.
Good Times jumped the shark when Eric Monte (the creator) left the show. He was the inspiration of the show in the first place; just compare the movie "Cooley High" to the earlier GT episodes. I believe he left shortly after completing "Cooley High" and was tired of all the bickering between both sides. When Monte left, there's a shift in episodes about nothing (other than a few - which John Amos suggested himself.) Then Amos gets kicked off, Jimmie Walker lets the powers take advantage of him and his "star status", and Michael gets demoted from "Militant Midget" to somebody just taking up space.
When the American public decided J.J. was "Good Times". Too bad, the cast was pretty decent.
Someone has to say it what good times did they have on "Good Times"? It was a very depressing show, funny at times, but generally it ended on a sad note. Why not make a show that takes place in Rbt. Taylor Homes entitled "Living in the Garden of Eden"? Stateway? Rockwell? Projects are not fun.
Jumped when the producers decided to take advantage of Jimmie Walker's growing popularity and expand his role at the expense of the other actors. This angered John Amos and led to his leaving the show. Similar occurrence: Happy Days and Fonzie.
This is TOO EASY...when James Amos left. It became the J.J. comedy routine show (ARRRRGH). James and Florida relationship was the heart of that show (remember it came from Maude, although I think James was called Hank.) Still his funeral show ( DAMN!DAMN!!DAMN!!!) is one of the greatest moments in TV history.
This show definitely jumped as soon as John Amos left the show, rightfully disgusted that a poignant show laced with humor became an attempt at a catchphrase-laden laugh fest with some feeble poignancy.
When all of a sudden, the black power rhetoric disappeared in Michael's character. Wouldn't want to upset the tighty whitey producers.
This was just another sad show where the Black actors had to do what the white writers thought Black people should act like. PLEASE!! I would rather see a Spike Lee film where the dialog is more real.
When James Evans (the father) died. Also, when they start putting on benefit shows to help the "less fortunate". They lived in the supposedly worst public housing projects in the country. And by the way, why did Winona have all those fancy clothes, and decorated apartment, and live in the projects, when she was single?
Of all the liberal tripe served up by Norman Lear in the 1970s, this was perhaps his most hypocritical effort. "Good Times" was a sitcom that was also pushed by its producers as an accurate portrayal of Black family life in a Chicago housing project. Yeah, right. As another contributor pointed out, everyone in front of the camera was Black, everyone behind the camera was White. I'll admit that I'm no expert on Black family life, but I don't think African American families spend their time dancing around the house, and "doin' the dozens" with one another. Esther Rolle, a woman of integrity, left the show at one point because she could no longer tolerate the negative images projected by the show's characters. When John Amos expressed similar objections, he was fired from the show because he was a "disruptive factor". Good Times? For who? Norman Lear and his bank account?
Good Times is my favorite show but they really reached by the third season. When John Amos died at the final moments of the third season. Esther Rolle soon followed (even though she came back). The show sank downward afterward. The only positive thing after John Amos died was Janet Jackson getting her start in the business.
Losing James was just the start. When the daughter (can't remember her name) meets the potential #1 football draft pick--and he has a career-ending injury after the wedding ceremony. Then Florida meets and falls for Carl--and he then gets cancer. I felt like saying "Stay away from the Evans family--they are cursed". Maybe it was supposed to show how hard life was to be black and in the Projects (which I would never know about myself), but bad karma like this on a continuous basis, you got to be kidding me.
I like Penny, but did she have to be on every other episode of the last two seasons with Bookman (although his appearances are less frequent)?
Maybe I was wrong about "Good Times" completly jumping the shark with Penny on every episode in the last two seasons. The episode where J.J. has a dream and thinks he's white goes a little too far. Not only does the white guy who plays J.J. in the dream is scary (asking for eggs benedict in a black household and calling yourself the Evans' "Great White Hope"?), but Janet Jackson saying, "Whatever happened to (clap) Dyn-o-mite!" is just as creepy. I'm amazed at how Janet's career has completely recovered from her acting days on "Good Times" and "Diff'rent Strokes" because frankly, I still don't believe it.
I am amazed while reading the responses of other viewers that there was been only one previous "day one" vote. Really, how can so many people have found this show so good? I have seen several episodes of this show (before AND after the death of the father. This was because this show was created by Norman Lear, who created the immortal "All in the Family." However, I cannot really say anything positive, other than the fact that the daughter who was the middle child was very good looking and that Esther Rolle is a fine actress. As far as this thing of the father's death being the shark jump, IMHO he was one of the MOST UNLIKEABLE REGULAR CHARACTERS IN THE HISTORY OF TV. I cannot remember him saying ONE KIND WORD. He would get way out of line VERY FAST. As far as J.J. goes, he was NOT very funny, did not act well, and how old was he suppose to be? He looked like he was about 25 at the BEGINNING of this show. Also, there were way TOO MANY bad things that happened to this family. I mean father's death, mother leaves to stay with new husband, daughter's boyfriend's WHOLE CAREER is ruined just by tripping once (and over J.J. of all people) a gangster holds up the apartment every few weeks(?!?), etc. This show was in with a whimper, out with a whimper. Norman Lear did a much better job with "All in The Family" and "The Jeffersons".
You people are crazy indeed. This show never jumped! Sure, there were some unfunny episodes here and there, but the show remained rock solid until the end. In fact, the funniest episode I remember was in the final season. The couch had caught on fire and Wilona demanded to know how it happened. JJ, Thelma, Penny, and Michael all gave differing accounts of what happened and of course each one of them made it seem like *THEY* were the hero in putting the fire out...LOL. The other funny episode was when Gerdie, Thelma's voice instructor, came over for dinner at the Evans' house. she brought a meat dish and the whole family thought it was cat food. They kept passing the dish around the table going "No, you first!"...LOL. And I'll never forget that doggie impression that Wilona did right before she left the apartment!
Seriously I watched show after show just waiting for James to change out of them nasty tight off white pants. Maybe he couldn't afford new pants? Then why did the kids always have different clothes?
The Good times Jumped from the first episode when they didn't make Thelma (Bernadette Stanis) the star. I believe 99.9% of the male viewers were and in my case still in love with one of the most beautiful women ever to grace the television screen. Still I enjoyed every moment, and thank TBS for re-broadcasting the show (and Thelma my childhood sweetheart). I only wish they would change the 5:00 am (EST) to a more appropriate time.
The always seemed so depressing with the family always ending up poorer and deeper in debt. When James died and Florida married the ugliest guy alive who soon was diagnosed with Cancer, and became the ugliest dead guy around, and goes on a honeymoon and LEAVES the family to fend for themselves for a whole season. In the last season, she returns with not even a mention of Mr. UGGGLY (who actually could have been JJs biological father in the looks department) and things start looking up JJ gets a job and in the last episode everybody's movin on up with money jobs (Keiths back in football) and everybody's headin fer better goodtimes, Yea in yer dreams. Thelma shouda tricked with JJ pimping Even Michael and Bookman could have been pimpin or selling their cakes to give themselves a better life
It jumped when James Sr. was killed but I've always wondered why their door was never locked. Wilona just turned the knob and voila! she's in the Evans household while it seemed everyone else knocked. Excuse me, they live in the PROJECTS, where you NEVER leave your door open. I wasn't raised in the projects, I have relatives who live there. They had some crazy lady living upstairs who threw fits (I think she was on crack) but they still locked their door! Willona should have knocked and/or had a key, not just barge in like that. Unfortunately, this ain't the only show to have made the same mistake. What's the problem: is it TOO EXPENSIVE for the producers to spring for a lock?!
The day James died, that was it for me. Too too sad to continue to watch. How could JJ ever say, "Dynamite!" ever again?
When Bernadette Stanis became Bern Nadette Stanis and then Bern Nadette in the opening credits.
I love the show Good Times but it definately JTS when Keith ( Ben Powers ) joined the cast. How unrealistic was it having him live in the same project apartment with the rest of the family. Other than this reach by the writers and producers this is my all-time favorite show.
Plus Ralph Cater has no business singing anywhere least of all on tv
Michael with that sad doo-wap group. It gives me the heaves to think about that talent contest show. As a literate black man, I am still wincing over the stereotypes here.
James's death further brought down the quality of this which was suffering when the focus of the show shifted on J.J. who constantly pulled one stupid stunt after the other. The worst being when J.J. sabotaged Thelma's wedding and ruined her husband's football career because he paid for the wedding with money J.J. borrowed from loan shark Sweet Daddy.
Florida Evans with a job. Why couldn't she do that when she was married to someone who couldn't stand to see his wife with a better education that himself?
Never was crazy about this show, but I will agree that it didn't totally suck while the Dad was still around. Even then, about 2/3 of the show seemed to consist of JJ and Thelma insulting each other and the audience just eating it up. After Dad's mysterious death in Mississippi (did he have a sweetie on the side down there, or what?), JJ and Thelma insult-fest completely dominated the show. And Bookman was just so stupid and unlikable. Who thought that was a good idea? BTW, they lived in the Robert Taylor homes (as one poster stated), NOT Cabrini Green. Right across the expressway from where the White Sox play.
"Good times" was hard to take from the start. How did Florida, who was Maude's housekeeper, go from Tuckahoe, NY, to Chicago? How did her husband go from "Henry" to "James"? When the show really jumped the shark was the first time J.J. opened his big mouth. Click.
1) When on-the-lam convict Cousin Lam showed up at the Evans' door to a chorus of audience "Oohhh.." 2) When Shirley from Whats Happenin helped hold up Florida and almost robbed her 3) When JJ and Florida started their own line of greetings cards. WTF?!? 4) Post-Flo when the kids held a yard sale to raise rent money and sold irregular clothing including a bra with 3 cups
This show had the potential of being something special. Esther Rolle and John Amos envisioned a show that depicted a hard working, honest two parent black family struggling to get by. Instead, Jimmy Walker found a signature line that the writers grabbed on to and whatever social value the show might have had was discarded. John Amos and Esther Rolle tried to keep the show focused but I do not think they were successful. As valuable as Amos was, however, I think his permanent departure actually gave the writers an opportunity to redirect the show back in the direction of where it should have been in the first place -- only this time the show could have focused on the struggles of a widowed mother struggling to make ends meet for her three children. Again, the writers missed the opportunity. I do not blame Jimmy Walker for capitalizing on his star status. He found a niche and ran with it for all that it was worth. I hope he invested well because his past-Good Times career was not anything but dynamite!
I have to say when James died. I can admit that I cried my eyes out when I saw the episode. It's always sad to see such a strong rock of the family taken away. And he (John Amos) and Ester Rolle had such amazing chemistry with each other. And I've always wondered....why wasn't JJ killed off instead?!?! Not to sound callous but the boy was ignorant and painfully annoying! But it was unfortunate that the writers/producers (as well as society) saw that ridiculous bag of bones as the star! I think JJ should have blown himself up from that "dynomite" of his!
This is one of the easiest Jump The Shark decisions of all time...when James Evans Sr. died. Yes, the funeral episode was excellent, but the show lost a lot of it's steam after that, not to mention losing it's heart & a lot comedy as well. Then Good Times really got wacky with the introduction of Keith & Carl. James was just as important to this show as J.J. The writers should have realized that.
Good Times bit the big one when James Evans Sr died. I really think the show JTS, when J.J. went to the clinic thinking he had an STD. The next thing you know, you had an afro headed Jay Leno spouting off statistics about sexually transmitted diseases.
Who told Michael Evans he can sing? When he sang "When Your Young And In Love" at the rent party, I could have slapped the **** out of him. Also when the Militant Midget sang with the doo wop group at the Evans's living room it made me sick to my stomach. Michaels little gay ass need to just stick with acting.
Three words: MANGO CREAM SODA!!! This is where JJ's sister was to marry the guy from Africa (Nigeria or somewhere) and several items were in front of them when they all were sitting on the floor. When asked what was in the bowl of water, JJ responded with those three immortal words...
United we stand, divided we fall, we are tighter than panty hoes two sizes small. JJ, Cool Breeze, Popo,Head, we are the awesome foursome until we are dead. Classic tv moment.
Jimmie Walker is not and has never been funny without David Letterman writing for him. When they decided that they were going to do a show with Jimmie Walker as the lead, it jumped.
Good Times jumped the shark when the father gets killed. Many thought that JJ was the hit of the show but I thought that John Amos did a fabulous acting job as the father. I thought since he was no longer part of the show JJ was forced into the limelight as head of the house and for the show he had to produce the most funny moments as the show's top star ,especially during the years that Florida wasn't there. JJ was great when he was a supporting player and his Dy-no-mite phrases and physical comedy were memorable, but when he was thrust into the starring spotlight when Amos left I thought that moment made the show jump the shark.
This show is easy as everyone has pretty much stated when James Sr. died and Esther Rolle does her famous albeit "damn, damn, damn" scene eloquently. I met her in person before she died and she was just like you would imagine. She was very vocal. I did not see anyone mention on my favorite occasional characters, Lennie, "you know if he ain't got it there ain't any." I loved Michael the Militant Midget. We haven't had a voice like that on tv in awhile. I, too wish TBS would show it in the afternoon/evening so I could watch it. Also Debbie Allen played the dope addict needing her purse leaving JJ when she jumped out of the bathroom window! I miss the laughs. I think it tried to do a good job and it was entertaining as well. There are people in some people's family that say certain sayings over and over and play the dozens. And having been poor myself as a child the "making a way when you can" was true to life. It all depends on how you try to survive.
Good Times did, indeed, JTS when the father died. One earlier post states that he was a horrible character and never uttered a kind word. To the contrary, James was a loving, devoted father and husband. This character was 1)crazy about his wife, 2)crazy about, albeit stern with, his kids, and 3)worked his behind off to make ends meet for his family. As for James' harsh demeanor, you would be a grouch too if you had to work several lousy jobs --sometimes washing dishes, other times at a car wash--making at most, $2.50 an hour. This was meager cash flow, even in the mid-70's. Another earlier post talks about how supposedly, "ugly," the mother's character was, and how a handsome, muscular guy like James could marry her. This comment shows us how backward we all are in U.S. culture about what beauty is. Florida was a beautiful character, both inside and out. She was devoutly Christian. And she was quite regal with her afro and beautifully flawless sepia-toned skin. Finally, she had a million-watt smile -- just gorgeous. How could you be so short-sighted, and ANGLO-centric in your view of what's beautiful and what's not? The sad part is, those comments were probably made by an African-American female.... I surmise this from this writer's comments about James' muscular build and handsomeness. Get a clue, whoever you are!
I read everyone's comments and I must say first of all, if you are going to comment....get your facts straight. First, Keith was not a college student living on campus...he was a pro football player. Second and most importantly...her name is WILLONA, not Winona. She aint a Judd. Some people say it jumped when James died, but it still had life left. The show completely jumped with the introduction of Keith. Didnt he have any money. He played pro football. He was a loser and she never should have married him. BTW..was Thelma really a sex symbol?
It was very important for this family to have a dad. Being the first black family on primetime, it needed a father (This statement was stated by most of the cast on the E True Hollywood Story special), and when they killed him, just because they didn't get along with the actor who played him, so went the show. There were small peaks and valleys afterwards, but someone or something, Booker getting more screen time, Keith, making Michael "sexy", always torpedoed it. I remember my mom and I were once watching the episode after the funeral when Florida threw the punch bowl (not very smart considering the breadwinner just died) and my mom clicked off the tv and said, "enough of this ****" and walked out of the room.
Good Times definitely wasn't the same after James died. But my question is, why did they inform the family through a TELEGRAM!! Was the phone really not working? By the time they got it, he was probably already dead for a couple of days...DAMN, DAMN, DAMN
The opposite of what someone else said: when Michael became a little militant agitator, using every imagined injustice as a pretext to speechify on behalf of The Brothers. Shut up and do your homework. By the way, I think JJ was secretly relieved when the old Pony Express brought that "very special" telegram. James and his flaring nostrils used to scare the hell out of me, and I didn't have to live with the hothead.
The poster above is perfect. Why did they notify the family by telegram? Everything this person said is true. BTW, there was another poster who stated that Keith played pro football. He didn't. He was a college student who "almost won the Heisman", according to Michael. Keith's career ending injury by tripping over JJ was the single most stupidest excuse for an injury that I have ever seen. If any pro athlete would've been living in the projects with in-laws, I'll smack the living hell out of the personally, LOL. My God, the Evans could never catch a break, now the poor son-in-law is starting out just like 'em.
This show took a nosedive after John Amos left the show. After that it was just painful to watch, ESPECIALLY when JJ takes the job in the advertising firm. UGGGGGGGGGG! And BTW I echo the complaints of everyone who states James could have done a lot better than Florida. Florida was a blimp that only needed "GOODYEAR" stamped on her butt. And to whomever was practically drooling over Florida and accusing everyone else of being "Anglocentric", get a life.
The Christmas/ "talent" show they have at Keith's cabyard. Incredibly bad. Michael's (Ralph Carter) rendition of a little ditty called "Rockin' You Down To Your Socks" has to be heard to be believed. They even had old "Buffalo Butt" Bookman performing! Plus, these actors basically left the planet after this show except for John Amos, the best actor in the bunch.
The show jumped when the phrase "Dynomite" became a household phrase. Everyone started saying it and it even became a disco hit for Bazuka.
"Good Times" jumped the shark when they killed off James Evans Sr.. John Amos was fired due to philosophical differences he had about the show, of which adversely conflicted with the direction the producers wanted to take with the show. Esther Rolle also had similar philosophical differences that coincided with John Amos & this is the reason she walked for awhile. Both John Amos & Esther Rolle knew full well that the exec.'s & writers were abandoning the harsh realities of ghetto life in a tasteful comedic sense & turning the show into a spectacle of a circus with Jimmy Walker as the jesterous clown. In the early days with John Amos aboard, the show had meaning, substance, & social significance. It was real & humorous all at the same time. Jimmy Walker's character was much more enjoyable & fairly realistic during the John Amos era. The theme was great & it was always a pleasure to listen to Ja'net Dubois' voice. Growing up with "Good Times" in the 70's, I was very fond of Bernadette Stanis & thought she was beautiful. The one & only positive event that came out of John Amos' getting the boot was the two part episode based on his character's death & funeral. When Florida stared at the rose on top of the refrigerator, dropped the punch bowl on the kitchen floor & finally let loose with grief, it made out for one of the most touching & emotional moments ever in the history of television. I can't even watch this without getting tears in my eyes, it was a powerful & moving moment. I know Bookman was referred to as Buffalo Butt & Rhino Rump. Did they ever call him Antelope Ass???
you damn right SINBAD was on this show. he was KEITH! thelma's athlete fiancee. damn, i'm glad somebody else caught that besides me. thelma had some real characters. how about 'ebae.' the misogynist african who swept her off her feet. or wilona's funky ex-husband that tried to hit on her. he shouldve gotten an emmy, because he looked TERRIBLE. and i hated him. with the same hate women still carry around for 'Mr.' from the color purple...regardless, we all know this show jumped after damN, daMN, DAMN! which proves one thing - james evans is a helluva fine actor. he never got his props. we still see him today in various cameos (cosby, fresh prince) and even movies (roots, coming to america). til this day, no matter what role he is playing, he will and always will be 'james evans.' p.s. what in the hell are the lyrics that come after 'keeping your head over water/making a way when you can/temporary layoffs!/goodtimes.../easy cradle ripoffs/scratching and survivin'/goodtimes.../YADDA YADDA YA-DA/good times...
after the last poster's comments: the lyrics continue as "evening crime reports, good times, scratching and surviving" i dont think this show really ever JTS...yes, it was a very different show after james died...i remember being a little girl and crying so hard during his death episode(i am tearing up now!)...after his death it did provide itself as a lightweight, silly comedy and marketing enterprise for "dynomite/jj merchandise"...i do remember having good times trading cards(you know the kind that come in packs with gum...damn, if i had them now, i could sell em for a fortune on ebay! did anyone save theirs?) question please: didnt the actor who played bookman show up as a minor character on "martin" in the 90s?
Actually, I think the missing lyric is "easy- credit ripoffs"... at least that's what I heard. Jumpwise, the quality REALLY went downhill when John Amos died: it went from being a family show to just a bunch of disjointed people in the same building listening to Jimmie Walker do his same old tired schtick, especially after Esther Rolle left. (Never mind that my OWN father died right around the same time "James" did...) And to the idiots above who describe Esther Rolle as "homely" or "ugly": you've never looked in a mirror YOURSELVES, have you...?!?
Day One- it’s one of the worst television shows of all time. I don’t mind watching a show about down-trodden African American families struggling for survival, but this show played to almost every horrible stereotype that existed. This also has to be the most depressing show on television, ironically titled “Good Times”. Every horrible thing happened to the family and then some (James' death, Janet Jackson getting abused, JJ getting arrested so many times, Michael gets caught in some black power gang, Thelma’s husband gets an injury and winds up broke, people trying to kill themselves in Evens’ home....I could go on and on). And when the show wasn’t preachy enough (like “Maude”), the acting was dumbed down to silly catchphrases and “clever” insults to a hooting and hollering audience. JJ Walker, Henry Winkler, and Jaleel White should never work on TV ever again!
the standard for the jumped shark John AMOS is brilliant the show never was the same when he left
When James Evans, Jr. left the series. The writing became forced and some of the stories were too outlandish to be real. He had a magnificent presence on the show, and he's the only one who truly put JJ (and anyone else, for that matter) in his place!
Good Times is one of those shows that need constant plight in order to be on the air. Hence,99 people living in that apartment and they can't get out of the projects by working? And when J.J. grows up and gets a job at ad agency or whatever, they STILL can't get out? And yes, James and those tight assed corduroys that he wore show after show after show (which he probably was wearing when he died)Oddly enough, for some reason I found it comforting to see him in them.Like when you're a kid and you get that warm feeling from having that familiar teddy bear or blankie that you know will always be there, that's what jame's corduroys did for me. Each character brought something to the show.Florida was smart,spiritual and seemed to not mind the fact that James couldn't keep a job to save his life. James was the back bone of the family and when upset,watch out for those flaring nostrils.J.J. was funny at times but in the later seasons he just became stale. Thelma was, well Thelma was--she was just Thelma. Michael was cute and loveable, but boy did he have some pipes on HIM! I don't know about anybody else but it seemed like he spoke outrageously loud, especially when he was younger.Wilona,a single woman,no kids, seemed misplace in the projects. Was she on disability? Bookman was a filler. Penny, with her ever present "bun" hair style, was a distraction from the increasingly tired J.J. Now THIS is what made the show jump the shark, KIETH.Why, oh why did they add Kieth to the already declining sitcom? The whole premise was wacked. A football star marries ghetto girl and moves to the projects to live with ghetto family.Whatever. Oh yeah, when he shows up he's unfunny.When the show went from bad to worse the only thing that would keep me tuned in was to hear that catchy theme song and see the ghetto life scenes of the opening credits. If you get passed that, you're involuntarily locked into the rest of the show.damn,DAMN,DAYUMMM!
Good Times jumped with John Amos's departure. This show was rather entertaining as a kid in the 70s but I caught a few episodes recently very early sat mornings and it's funny how the passage of time changes the way you view things. Such as with all those people why couldn't they all get job's and bust there ass to get out of that ghetto? Maybe someone should have stuck some DYN-O-MITE under JJ's lazy ass!! As for Florida she had a good job as a maid (on Maude) why couldn't she get another one? And the dad could have been a laborer in construction or something. Also why was the apartment so filthy? As in the refridgerator door it's disgusting just because your poor does not mean you can't be clean. But one thing didn't change and that's Thelma man was she cute!!
No doubt about it, this show jumped when James Sr. died ... all because the producers didn't want to pay the actor more money. Bastards.
The shark jump that sticks out in my mind was when Thelma, Florida and Willona performed as The Supremes in the rent party talent show. Florida wore a ratty wig and her voice sounded like an off-key bass TRYING to sing. Absolutely frightening!
Yeah it jumped when james died, even though some of the funniest episodes involving sweet daddy and "balderman davis" aired long after that. but the heart and soul of the show gave way to typical sitcom fair and stupid catch phrases, most of jj's being written by a young leno and letterman...don't believe me? check out the NBC letterman show when they were still friends and leno brought on his book of rejected one-liners for walker and embarrassed dave on the air! sadly, they weren't any worse than those that were accepted. still, i can watch this show any times 'cos, my god! was thelma the hottest piece of ass on TV at the time! my uncle, a physician's assistant, actually got to see her nude when she injured herself in a play and still hasn't gotten over that experience!
Good Times never jumped! Florida and J.J. were entertaining up until the end. The interactions between Bookman and Willona were priceless! Keith came across as a jerk. Maybe this was intentional on the part of the writers? Lootin’ Lenny (or whatever his name was) and Sweet Daddy Williams were great recurring characters. Carl, Florida’s significant other, was all right. I can’t remember if they ever got married. My all-time favorite, though, was Wanda the professional crier. She’d be the center of attention at every funeral.
The episode in which JJ confronts a possible case of -{insert jarring chord here}- venereal disease! Full of fear, he has to go to the clinic. There he is consoled by a young Jay Leno, who tells him that VD is not that bad, and that he's gonna be as big as Johnny Carson someday.
when john amos left the show jumped. that's that. but c'mon, jimmie walker was damn funny. if anything, funny looking. when he had that chicken hat on. whenever he walked onto the set, the audience would go wild, just because he was so strange looking, patheticlly so but in a classic sense. the best episode was where jimmie walker joined, or tried to join, the army. the priest from MASH played the recruiter, and made jokes about walker's body. also, one of the best show's was when john amos and florida found that book about sex in the ghetto in the house, and john amos was happy when he thought it was j.j.'s, but then got angry when he realized it was thelma's, or whatever her name was.
God I loved this show when it first started--a *fairly* honest, gritty look at a working class Black family. TWO strong, involved, strict, but loving parents,(I've known MANY families like this) subtle social messages (at first) and FUNNY! And then--cue R & B version of 'Jaws' music-- James (John Amos') departure. Jump # 1. The show NEVER recovered from it. It was like driving a car with 3 wheels. The emergence of no talent Jimmie Walker (who is amazingly BITTER at the industry--gee, Jims, have you ever considered the fact that you SUCK and just got a lucky break with this show? you AIN'T Richard Pryor, Eddie Murphy or Redd Foxx--sure they all made horrible career choices but they had CHOPS!). Then--turn up volume of R & B 'Jaws'music to an ear-shattering decibel level-- Florida (the late Esther Rolle) left. That was really the end for me. Boycott bigtime. Once in a while, I've caught a post-James & Florida rerun and realize that--aside from the fact that Janet was pretty good for a little kid--I missed NOTHING. Sad. Like family members you were once close to but lost touch with. (fantasy episode: I always wanted to see one where Maude visits and she and James get into it)
Good Times was a good Norman Lear spinoff at first. It was fairly funny with John Amos being the best character on the show. But I could never understand how Florida went from being a maid working for Maude (where was Maude supposed to live..I thought she was in New York). But I distinctly remember that on one episode of Maude, we were introduced to Florida's husband and his name was "Henry" but the character was played by John Amos. So how da hail did he become "James" living in some roody poo projects with Florida on Good Times? Just an observation...and I agree wholeheartedly with the other posters that the show went the way of the toilet when they killed off James. I think I even shed a tear that day. He clearly was the more talented ( over Jive Azz JJ) and went on to prove that with roles in Roots and other projects.
When James died, the show somewhat died. I still watched, hoping he would come back, but no, it just grew abysmally worse.
For years it drove me crazy that I couldn't figure out all the lyrics to the theme song, but I was lucky enough to find them in an old book on TV Themes. Here goes:"Good times, any time you need a payment, good times, any time you feel free, good times, any time your out from under not getting hassled, not getting hustled; Keeping your head over water, making a wave when you can; Temporary layoffs, good times, easy credit rip-offs, good times, scratchin' and surviviv', good times, hangin' and a-jivin', good times, ain't we lucky we got 'em, good ti-i-i-i-i-i-mes" (one of the best themes in sitcom history!) There was en episode where Esther Rolle's earrings kept falling off. In one shot she'd have only the left one on, in the next she'd both, then only the right, back and forth, back and forth! It was hilarious.
I really don't think that this show ever JTS. However, I do agree that when James Evans Sr died the quality of the show went down some. In my opinion, he and Esther Rolle did excellent jobs playing the parents. I think that James Evans, Sr was a strong father figure and a good husband who would do anything necessary to make sure that his family was taken care of and had whatever they needed. More of our african american males should be this way.
When James died, the show jumped. Also, when Thelma got married and she and her husband moved in with Flo and the boys...cue the theme music from "Jaws".
Okay time to clear up a few misconceptions 1) Of course James' death on the show was a clear JTS moment. James showed that black families are not always headed by single mom's on welfare, and in the projects. Yes they lived in the projects, but the Evans' parents tried to instill in their kids that it was not where they lived, but how they lived. James (John Amos) left the show probably because he wanted more money and the producers did not recognize just what a powerful presence he was on the show. He wasn't just an angry black guy, he was a father that was trying to make a better life for him, his wife and their kids. I guess they thought JJ (Jimmy Walker) could carry the show on his own. Yes they lived in the projects because no matter what time frame the show took place(1946, 56, 66, 76, 86 or 96) they were poor, blacks with limited education. They may have seemed intelligent but James only had a 6th Grade education. Where the hell were they suppose to live in Beverly Hills? 2) James worked two jobs, he was a dishwasher and he worked at the carwash. It wasn't that Florida could not find a job, she was a stay at home mom. However, since they could barely come up with the rent money $100, she should have been working and they could have really been working together to keep their head above water. Let's not forget that Good Times is a spin-off of Maude. Florida was Maude's maid, so that proves the theory that she could be gainfully employed. But when James died instead of sitting on her ass and collecting her check from Uncle Sam she was a Bus Driver. 3) They were poor. It's not so hard to believe that someone making minimum wage back then (What $2.00/hr) trying to feed a family of 5 and pay bills could not survive. **** I have a decent paying job, 2 kids and I have a hard time making it too! 4) Thelma and Keith were married. He was not her boyfriend living there. Even in Arizona you knew Florida was not going for them shacking up! 5) Someone mentioned that Keith was a bum because after he broke his leg at the wedding (a career ending break ) he had to move in the apartment that the Evan's had with his new bride. How does that make him a bum? He was poor and from the ghetto too. What the hell was he suppose to do be a Commentator. I'm sure he would have given Howard Cosell a run for his money. Sorry to break it to you but quite a few people live paycheck to paycheck. So it's not so unbelievable that Keith would be dead broke and need to drive a cab to make ends meet. It is also not so unrealistic that someone with minimal education would suffer a career ending injury and have to "come home". I see one of these such people every time I go to my Fiances house. The guy use to play college ball for UBA, he hurt his knee and now he stands on the street corner doing nothing but smoking weed. Now that's reality! 6) If they (Michael, JJ, and Thelma) could barely scrap together the rent, how the hell would they (Thelma and Keith) survive if they moved out? Use your brains now. 7) Someone said that Good Times did not accurately depict Ghetto Life? I say it may not have shown every angle of the hood, but I'll be damn if it did not show the family as being poor and that is a huge part of ghetto life. They had rent parties, talent shows, and people hustling to make money, gangs, violence, drugs, alcohol and of course poverty. Why else would JJ, James and Florida have the same winter coat, season after season and JJ wore them same damn ass long pajamas.. Of course James wore the same clothes (except when he wore a tie) $2.00 an hour don't buy too much. Watch the show, they ate oatmeal damn near everyday they ate breakfast, but that is what happens when you are P-----O----Poe. 8) A couple posters wondered why Willona lived there since she was single and had a decent (for the 70's) wardrobe. You can't be seriously asking that. Am I to believe that only people with children live in the hood or projects? That single people are not poor people too? And they should use the money they spend on clothing and getting a better place to live. Come on. Willona worked at a clothing store (Boutique) and probably got a discount (I'm speaking like the characters are real for a second) or she could have shopped at Goodwill or maybe she bought a lot of cheap clothes. My closet is full of clothes because I like clothes. But that doesn't make me rich. It just makes me shallow. After all until Penny came she didn't have no kids to buy for so she could spend her money on clothes if she wanted to. **** I know people with nice cars and clothes and pull up to the projects daily, because they would rather look good. I hate to play the race card here because I am a black female, but here goes...I have known white people four in particular that I can think of that not only drove a car until the **** practically fell apart, they wore the same damn clothes week in and week out and they were laughed at and ridiculed for it (these are four white people on 3 different jobs). But everyday they pulled that ragged piece of **** car to a nice ass $250.00 plus or more house. Because they would rather have a nice place to live than nice clothes to show off. Finally I have to say that overall Good Times was a great show with an important message when it first began. Michael was the militant, JJ was the artist, Thelma was baby girl, Florida was the caring godfearing woman, James the hard working non-educated father. Willona the next door neighbor pest. When it ended in true Hollywood Fashion everyone finds a better way of living and moves out the ghetto what a crock of ****!
What are the lyrics during the closing credits of Good Times? It starts out:"Just lookin' out of the window, watchin' the asphalt grow, thinkin' how it all looks..." Can someone help out?
Definitely jumped when James Sr. died. John Amos and Esther Rolle were skilled and accomplished actors. The "Damn, Damn, Damn" line after appearing to be unmoved at the death of her husband, and letting her emotions out after everyone had left was moving. Brilliant episode, but unfortunately the last good one. P.S., is it true that Bookman the janitor was raped by Ned the wino as posted earlier? If so, this is just one of the things that whetted the sharks appetite. Penny and the child abuse episode was also pretty lame. This show lost it's edge when it got preachy. It was good when it depicted the struggles (not that their struggles were a good thing) of a black family in the projects, and how they stayed together and fought to survive. After James died, it became another in a long list of shows made to satisfy the comedic desires of the un-intelligent. Once this was an acceptable show that could almost be considered sociologically pertinent. But after James died, it died!!!!!!
For me it jumped the shark when Esther Rolle left then returned. It felt empty without here when she was gone since she was the foundation of the family. When she returned at the end of that one episode you heard the explosive jubilation from the studio audience when she walked through the door; nice tv moment. When James died it didn't "jump" but the show became more interesting just to see how they'd cope although John Amos rocked as James Evans. He definitely was the man of the family no doubt.
John Amos was such an integral part of the show. To me he was even more of a center than Esther Rolle was. Unfortunately, he was fired for making comments about how things really were backstage (allegedly there were lots of arguments about the direction of the show). When he left, it was downhill from there.
Good Times is one of my all-time favorite sitcoms. If you think about it, it's probably one of the first sitcoms where there was real audience participation. I mean, the audience was always yelling crap up to the actors, reacting to the scenes as they were being played out. Case in point: When Thelma married Keith and he blew out his knee tripping over JJ as they were walking down the aisle to leave the church. That ends Keith's professional football career and now Thelma and Keith are forced to live in the projects with Thelma's family until they can get their poop in a group. Well, Keith develops a drinking problem. He's hiding vodka in the back of the toilet. Keith gets ****faced and smacks Thelma. Thelma turns around, goes into the bedroom and starts packing a suitcase. Keith comes in, all contrite and says, "Honey, honey, I'm so sorry. Please don't leave." to which Thelma replies "Oh these are YOUR things!" The audience roared its approval. I mean, you want to talk about a "You Go Girl!" moment if there ever was one. The audience was always doing stuff like that. Shouting out its approval or disapproval for certain characters or situations. Like how they would boo when Sweets, the project pimp would come into a scene. This is top notch sitcom stuff. It never gets old. And me and my friends still do the ole "DAMN, DAMN, DAMN!" to this day. I hope Esther Rolle is getting residuals for that line. Every time someone says "Damn, Damn, Damn!", Esther Rolle should get an automatic $100.
What most fail to remember is that Keith while injured and unable to make the money playing Pro Football was nonetheless not a stereotypical illiterate uneducated student athlete. I recall one program where he discussed studying in England possibly on a Rhodes Scholarship. Did this black man have zero prospects? He did graduate from the University of Illinois. You would think someone would give him a job. While James Evans may have been forced to dry cars because of a lack of education, Keith did have a degree. Should we just assume then that blacks in the 70's should not have bothered with post secondary education unless they were majoring in advanced car washing. A poor message to send out to our children. Only go to college if you have a shot at the Pro's. Damn, Damn, Damn!!!
Definitely lost its luster after James Sr. "died" in a car crash im Mississippi. It was never the same. J.J.'s ignorant ass was still obnoxious, Thelma was still a good two shoes chicken head with her head in the clouds, and the new characters (Bookman, Keith and Penny) are were one dimensional, stupid characters that were as funny as colon cancer. Although it is one of my favorite childhood shows of all time, I still have some questions about it. 1: Why did Wilona ONLY show up for about two minutes braying at the top of her lungs her infamous "Hey Yall" greeting, crack a stupid joke about some loser she went on a date with and then exit stage left? Same crap every episode, especially in the first and second season. 2: Why did they always want to make us believe that Wilona and Florida were the same age and that James found her desirable? Please! I am a black woman. I respected Ester Rolle as an activist and an actress but she in no way was attractive. Sorry for all of you who will say I am "Jaded" by what white america deems beautiful. She is ghastly ugly, IMHO. 3: Why did they want us to believe that females actually found that emaciated ugh-mo Jimmie Walker was attractive? I'd sooner take a swig out of an old man's colostomy bag than to have kissed J.J.'s mu-fugly face/ass (as you cannot tell the difference). 4: Why didn't Florida take her fat ass to work? Hell she was Maude's maid, couldn't she keep that job or find another? And why was Thelma "clean" every episode and the others looked liked ragamuffins (especially the men folk)? She always wore something nice and it was either purple or blue. Florida always wore orange. I guess they powers-that-be thought those colors complimented their skin tones. At any rate, after James died, the show lost credibility. The character J.J. became every black stereotype known to man.
I'm very surprised to see only one vote for Keith. It was over big time by the time he joined the cast. There were still lotsa funny moments after James died. Florida's new bf, (I forget the actor's name now), but he was pretty funny himself. But *Keith* the crippled football player?? Yeeshh!
Anybody remember Jay Leno's appearance? J.J. goes to clinic because he thinks he caught gonorrhea or something. Some guy (Jay Leno) comes up to him and asks why he's there...he coughs and says "Er, uh...a cold." and Jay Leno says. "Really. Most of us are here because of VD."
This show definitely jumped with the departure of John Amos. When he was on, he pretty much was the strong father figure that the show needed. Unfortunately, after he left, that made J.J. the man of the house and he was too busy chasing women to be taken seriously.
When James, Sr. died, so did the strong, Black family unit that was so needed in television.
Good times was still tolerable after James died. Then Florida left and Willona became the star of the show, bringing on little Janet Jackson. The show was still tolerable to watch. But what really made this show jump the shark was the last season when they brought Keith on the show. No.1 Keith sucked, he was not funny at all. No 2. the whole premise of Keith was totally ridiculous: He was a professional football player who marries Thelma but trips over JJ and breaks his leg thus forced to live in the projects with the rest of the broke ass family. How much sense does that make? Nothing like that would ever happen in real life. Even the cast members knew that it was a dumb plot because if you notice, both JJ and Michael were only seen in only some of the episodes in the last season. And of course in the last episode everyone all of a sudden gets out of the ghetto. This show was on one season too many
I would like to say that it is a good thing that this site was named after something that happened on "Happy Days" and not "Good Times",otherwise they would probably have called this site www:killedthedad.com.But then again,there are people out there that could argue that jumping the shark was the greatest moment in the history of "Happy Days"(I'm not one of them,though.),while for me, the most powerful moment in "Good Times",is also the one that most went against the shows title-DAAAAMN-DAAAAMN-DAMMMN!
James was supposedly due to receive a promotion, Florida, Willona and the kids spent close to $50, their remaining money left in their budget, on food, decorations, drinks etc, for a celebration of James's rise to economic heights: Instead he was laid off and the family was beyond broke. I was in Junior High @ the time, my mother used that as a lesson for me to never spend money I can't see.
Good Times never JTS because ever character in everyway played a certain part that meant something special to the show. Of course things went different when James the father (John Amos) died. His death only made the show seem even more realistic. The way the show went on afterwards to me was a lot more entertaining than before but still delt with serious issues only in a "J.J." fashion.
Clearly, this show jumped the shark when James died. The show just fell apart. J.J. became far more annoying than funny as the lead character on the show, and each idea after that seemed to fall apart. No one felt comfortable with Florida dating other men. Thelma and Keith had no chemistry. They tried to go the "cute kid" route by bringing in Penny (Janet Jackson) to eventually be adopted by Willona (I think that's how you spell it). That storyline had legs for about 4 episodes. Then, there's Michael. Enough said.
When Esther Rolle and John Amos left. When adults can't resolve their disputes, they have two options: accept it and move on or accept it and part ways. I respect Esther and John for doing what they believed to be right and were willing to make the sacrifice. Unfortunately, "Good Times" is what was sacrificed. The children obviously couldn't carry the show themselves. So with Ja'net DuBois now receiving top billing, writers now had to have Willona hanging around in the Evans' apartment for no apparent reason (in the context of art imitating life, of course.) Even though Florida would return the following season, the damage was done. Although Rolle was welcomed back with open arms, "Good Times" had lost what made it special. When Amos and producers were not able to resolve their differences, the death of tough-love patriarch James Evans should have marked the end of the show. The decline of "Good Times," like that of so many other shows, was painful to watch. Fans of the show missed everything that Rolle and Amos gave to their characters. Also, the contrast between Amos' two trademark characters, James Evans and Gordy the Weather Man on "The Mary Tyler Moore Show," was intriguing. Hats off to these two fine performers for standing up to the Lear brain trust. In a perfect world, "Good Times" wouldn't have suffered for it. But as the show continually indicated, ours is far from a perfect world.
I think Florida spoke for all GT fans when she blubbered: "Damn, Damn, Damn, James..." Once John Amos ('James Evans') left the show, the 'times' were no longer 'good.' And, consequently, the laughs were few and far between.
Dude, when Micheal got older and grew the shoplifter stash and joined the black falcons this show was over.
When ******** Penny said-"DYNOMITE", that was it for me.
It jumped when James died!! And when Willona was over there 24/7 , it got a little annoying. And adding the two most useless characters in the world Keith and Penny, brought the whole show down. And what in the world ever happened to Carl? Did he die or what?? Well, he was ugly, but then again so was Florida. James coulda done a lot better. I guess every time he woke up in the morning and saw her face he must have been thinkin "damn damn damn!!!!!"
How did JJ (who looks like an ugly turtle) get so many beautiful girlfriends and was the ladies' man? What the hell were the writers smoking?
The show jumped when James Evans died. How dare they take a strong father figue and make JJ the man of the house. The show really jumped when JJ dyed his hair and got a perm. Peew. Then Florida left and married that guy (Carl). What happened to him anyway? Did he die from the cancer he had. They never mentioned him again after Florida returned home for Thelma's wedding.
How about these JTS moments: Bookman doing his "really funny" celebrity impersonations OVER AND OVER AGAIN... Lenn-ayyy, the stereotypical jive-ass twelve-watches-on-one-arm sales pimp... JJ's painting of Ned the Wino as Black Jesus (CLASSIC!)... Thaouuuma's magnificent bosom (okay, so that's a plus)... Keith (nuff said)... and some of these classic JJ bits: his various ensemble wardrobes, including the red longjohns/denim Gilligan hat combo... that cowboy hat with the plastic chicken on a spring he wore while working at the Chicken Shack (or whatever it was called)... answering the phone with a limp wrist and saying "schelleauuuu..." which was actually pretty damn funny now that I think about it... his unending rubbery-faced reaction shots... and of course, the ever popular "daaaaamn, daaaaamnnn DAAAAMMMNNN!" moment, after which it was a fast slide into oblivion.
1) The obvious situation: when James died 2) When they used to have those rent parties/talent shows every season--I couldn't stand listening to Michael sing "You Don't Have to be a Star (To Be in My Show)" and "You and I". 3) MICHAEL GROWS UP. The minute he hit puberty and was no longer the cute little "militant midget" it was all over for him. 4)Keith. That whole storyline just really sucked. They could have kept him off the cast.
This show went the way of the shark when they killed off John Amos' character, until then it was one of the best comedies of it's time. Amos' serious intensity was a perfect foil to Jimmy Walker's buffoonery. He was also a terrific actor. Amos' character also provided strength and backbone to the family, and as we all know, he had a wickedly pointed, if not pessimistic, sense of humor. At times I thought he was even FUNNIER than Walker, who tended to use his one line schtick - DY-NO-MYYYYTE - ad nauseum! This show also jumped when they introduced Janet Jackson, who's syrupy performances left me reaching for the barf bag. Hey, where's Bookman?
I agree with everyone else that the show's downfall was when it became the JJ show you lost the father you lost the everything about what this show set out to do. And Despite the Buffoonery he did on the show Jimmie Walker became a "conservative radio host" for I time. Too bad Mad Dogg and his gang didn't do a drive by on him considering he help set black people back 10 years with his antics on GOOD TIMES. Also to address previous posters, SINBAD did NOT I repeat NOT portray Keith form GT the actor who portrayed him is named Ben Powers SINBAD's real last name is Adkins. Don't believe me? Check out imdb.com and do a Search and see for yourself. I know the old stereotype "We All Look Alike" but c'mon people these two don't even SOUND alike. Also to the other poster who said that Willona could still live in the projects b/c she could also been struggling. WRONG and I know because I grew up in the PJ's Willona was a single woman I don't care if she was living in the street during the inception of public housing in the late 40's through the 70's. A single person could not live in the PJ. WHY it was for FAMILIES. Willona had no children unless she was on someone's lease. Ms Willona would have been booted out the building faster than you can say Damn Damn Damn.
Yes, this show could've jumped when Esther Rolle left, but she should have left sooner! Not only was she right about it becoming cartoonish and not setting a good example, but the father was a horrible "role model". This show gets credit for having a "strong black man" at the head of the household, but does "strong" have to mean "violent and threatening". I don't care how buffoonish J.J. was, that's no excuse to shoot him threatening looks all the time and verbally harass him with threatsof being punched out. (Especially since he's so skinny.) And don't tell me it was all in good fun or it's a black thing. Please. That's an insult, and the show certainly wasn't funny enough to balance it out! This show may have been popular, but it is bad in hindsight.
I never quite understood the whole story of Florida leaving with Carl for Arizona. Why would Florida leave her kids in the slums of Chicago to go off and live with Carl in Arizona, whom she still barely knows when she marries him? If they could afford to move to Arizona, why didn't the rest of them get the hell out of dodge, too? I very, very much doubt there are any all-black high-rise tenements in Phoenix that Florida and Carl moved to - anywhere in Arizona would have been better than the hell hole Florida was coming from. And then a year later Florida just returns to Chicago without Carl like nothing had ever happened to begin with!
When Keith joined the show it lost ANY remaining appeal as a realistic comedy. How the hell does a first round NFL Draft pick break his leg and end up in the hood with his wife's family. This guy had a degree and never once attempted rehab. Being a sports fan an a professional athlete myself I can not believe the he did not sign a guaranteed contract. And who the hell was his agent? That is the real question.
When first James, then Florida left the show. Most of the posts are correct on why they left, and let's be clear: Jimmy "JJ" Walker could very well have stepped in and told the producers that he wanted to keep his tv dad (and then mom)on the show. With the clout he had gained, he could have done so, but it was his ego and excitement of getting even MORE screen time that prevented him. GT was up until James' death, one of the arguably best A/A sitcoms on planet Earth! It was gritty and real, reflective of the recession under both the Ford and Carter presidencies, in which life as a working poor person was not the greatest. It also was a counterpoint to the then-popular portrayals of minorities as drugged-out, welfare-collecting, single-parent families on film and tv. also, i too, met Ms. Rolle as a little girl and i must say, she is a fine actress and human being and i LOVED watching her and John Amos as the Evanses. She was fierce, wise, motherly--AND sexy! Whomever thought she was ugly obviously doesn't know what it's like to be loved both inside and out. Whether people wonder why James would be with someone not defined as "beautiful" according to European standards, is really irrelevant, since James obviously LOVED what he saw in his rubenesque wife. Besides beauty fades and when a bimbo loses her looks, she becomes not only ugly, but STUPID!
I have to admit that I never saw Good Times in the 1970s when it was originally on, since I was born in 1980. I did enjoy watching the show on TBS reruns when I was up late studying. That is until the episode where the youngest son was having some sort of problem with his history teacher because the teacher didn't teach anything about black history. Anyway, word gets back to James and he starts going on and on about how he's gonna give the kid a "whoopin." So he goes into the kid's room and takes off his belt. The kid talks James out of giving him the whoopin, but the point is that through the episode, the other kids are telling him how to withstand the whoopin, and the audience laughed as though receiving a whoopin is completely normal. Admittedly, I am a white guy from Western Canada, and I was never disciplined with a belt, and if I were, my dad would have been hauled off to jail and I would have been sent to a foster home. After that episode, James became less of a stern father character, and more of a criminal. I stopped watching after that - it took all the good times out of Good Times.
This show jumped twice. James dies in a car crash in Miss. J.J. dumb ass catch phrase. People in real life do not have catch phrases. I don't walk around sayin catch phrases. Does anyone remember that commercial for an upcoming Good Times ep. Where JJ has a stick of dynamite and only the crew knew it was real and lite it. They counted to five and blew his ass up! Also on a sad note Esther Rolle is the only African American woman to win a emmy for best actress. She deserved it too. Even Claire Huxtable couldn't win that. Tv sucks now days.
It was obvious this show was going to jump the shark in season 2, episode 5. If you recall, this is the episode where the family is out in the lobby, waiting for the elevator. And as always, specifically JUST LIKE in season 1, episode 4 - the elevator is all beat to hell and covered in grafitti. This show could have done better if they had given the elevator a good cleaning, and maybe a few lines in the script. How long can you expect an elevator to carry a show, let alone a beaten and abused one? Sometime I wonder what the producers were smoking.
No question, GOOD TIMES jumped the shark when they killed of John Amos' character. Amos brought a humorous but sophisticated dignity to the show that made Jimmie Walker's hyperkinetic JJ almost bearable. With Amos gone, the focus shifted to Walker, whose JJ worked better as a supporting character. Even when the brought Esther Rolle back married to the extremely talented Moses Gunn, it just wasn't the shame. Amos' departure killed this show, no doubt about it.
This show jumped the second that the producers hired lip-smacking, eye-rolling, jive-talking walking stereotype Jimmie Walker to play the oldest son, J.J. Solid characterizations by an otherwise talented cast (John Amos and Esther Rolle were both superb) and a '70s attempt at a believable portrayal of a black family living in the projects were undermined by the bizarre casting choice of a Stepin Fetchit throwback to play the oldest son. Not for one minute did the audience believe that this preening, strutting jackass was a serious artist (as he was supposed to be in the script), nor did it seem possible that stalwart and loving (if stern) parents James and Florida could have produced such an idiot. Not only was "J.J" and his moronic catch phrase "Dy-no-mite!" an embarrassment to this show, but to society as a whole.
"Good Times" definitely jumped when John Amos left. Leave it to Norman Lear to create another single parent household (wasn't there one already with "One Day At A Time"?). The famous scene when Esther Rolle slams the punch bowl on the floor & shrieks "DAMN, DAMN, DAMN!" belongs in a time capsule with other well-known sitcom scenes (Sammy Davis Jr. kissing Archie Bunker, Mary Tyler Moore getting a case of the giggles during Chuckles The Clown's funeral). That scene still gives me the chills. After that, it was all downhill.
The show absolutely jumped the shark when James Sr.'s character died. That's definite. My problem is with posters on this site who write comments about shows and use 21st century thinking to down the characters, actors, writers, etc. Norman Lear was the ultimate innovator in TV history. He took chances no one in Hollywood took, and Good Times was no exception. It was a great comedy for its time, and people watched it(and enjoyed it). As a black male growing up in the 70's, I can tell you there weren't many choices on TV to see anyone or anything you could relate to. Everyone I knew loved this show, despite what would now be called bufoonery. Back then it was just funny.
To us, 'Good Times' was a great show with a terrific cast. Even some of the slower episodes were'nt too bad. But it REALLY jumped the shark when J.J. started wearing a press & curl on his head. (or was it a perm?) Either way it was horrible. Speaking of which, did they ever have a hairdresser on the show for anyone other than Thelma or Willona. I mean in the early seasons it would look like James Sr. & Michael just came to work 2 minutes before the taping of the show began.
When James died. He held things together. After his death all the otehr characters personality changed. JJ was the (weak man of the house), Michael was no longer the edgy Militant Midget and Thelma became more bossy. James kept everyone in check. It could have recovered but when the show was no longer about "the ghetto" & associated realities it lost its pulling power and became just another jokey sitcome. The final blow came when "devoutly religious" mama married the athiest Carl, how stupid. JJ still made things interesting but it was a totally different show the last season
I could say that when James Sr. died, he took the show with him, but the remainder of that season (1976-77) was actually pretty decent. I think the plotline regarding his death made helped tie into the whole "struggle" that the Evans endured. Notice I said decent, compared to the first two-and-a-half seasons, which were good. After Florida left for the 1977 season, and Willona became the guardian, the show really went downhill. This was right around the time the audience applauded every character's entrance (automatic jump-point). Hell, even Penny got applause! Willona's wisecracks were no match for Florida Evans' dynamic acting. Other than DAMN! DAMN! DAMN! I remember another episode where J.J. gets involved with some shady people (as usual), and Florida yells "Get the HELL out of my house!" Great stuff.
This show jumped the shark after John Amos left the show. At the beginning, it was a somewhat realistic depiction of a struggling black family, painted in a positive light. After the death of the father, the show descended into a bunch of stereotypes. It was particularly ridiculous to think that a woman depicted as Esther Rolle's character Florida Evans was would run off with a man and leave her children behind. Florida was not the type of woman who would do this, and this story line was simply not believable. By that point, the show was unwatchable
Jumped about the same time that the painting seen behind the end credits changed from the tacky one of the family to the horrific one of the bald guys dancing.
There are so many JTS moments with this show (Penny, James' death, Bookman), but the one that really bugged me is the way no one kept their doors locked. I MEAN THIS WAS THE HOOD! They were always talking about how bad the neighborhood was, but people (Wilona in particular) just barged in and out of the Evans' apartment without knocking all of the time! And the door was NEVER LOCKED!! I grew up in the projects and we would have been dead if we had the "open door policy" people in that housing project had
Death of James Sr.? Yes and Yes. The death of James Sr.? How about more like John Amos leaving the show! When John Amos left the show, there were still some pretty good eps. left of that particular season in which he left the show. But once the 1977-78 season came, Florida: "DAMN! DAMN! DAMN! DAMN!" it jumped not once, but several times. 1). Why the hell Florida (Esther Rolle) leave the kids behind. In actuality, Esther Rolle, too became to fed up with the way J.J.'s is constantly acting like a total ass (he's a total ass to begin with) and not maturing himself. 2). Wilona as surrogate mother to the kids? At least this season gave us a young Janet Jackson. 3). The last season, the 1978-79 season. Florida returning and leaving constantly and Thelma marrying that wuss she calls a husband. I liked this show when it was just a black family going through struggling times during the first several seasons, but after John Amos left, J.J. became increasingly annoying and unbearable. Someday, I wished that James Evans, sr. would knock his lanky, pencil ass and shout "DYNOMITE!"
When Janet Jackson joined the cast - obviously her gratuitous casting not only served to further capitalize on the 70s Jacksons popularity, but also was a feeble attempt to keep GT afloat. GT proved Janet cannot act her way out of a paper bag and should stick to singing like the rest of the Jacksons. All Janet (Penny) would do was stand there like a grinning idiot and pretend like she had a mad crush on that eyesore JJ of ALL people! Michael and Keith were HOT and Penny would make eyes at JJ??!! Uhuh, yeah right!
This was one of my favorite shows as a kid, because of the women. I was a white girl from the 'burbs and thought Florida, Thelma, Willona and Penny were so cool!!! Who wouldn't want to have those women in their family, regardless of your color? JJ and Michael were tolerable. Plus, James was the best dad on TV. He was strict but really loved his family. I loved the episode when he refused to let Flo go back to work as a maid. He said it was his responsibility to provide for his family, and that's that! Even if it did mean he only had two pairs of pants (the other pair was brown). But, alas, my man James fell from the pedestal during the episode where we see what life's really like in that house. Michael had a friend staying over for the weekend. James tells them to do their homework and the friend mouths off that James isn't his dad & he's not going to study. James yanks off his belt and drags the kid into the bedroom. The rest of the family stands there staring at the floor while you hear whacks and screams. Sick, sick, sick!!! The worst part is when the kid comes back out and can't sit down. He's suddenly all respectful and kissy-a*** to James and says he admires him and wishes he could be part of that family. Yeah, right. Well, I guess that's one way to control your kids. Maybe this was so shocking to me because I wasn't used to family violence. I haven't been able to look at James the same way since. And don't start in about kids needing a good beating now and then. No one in my family was ever beaten, and my own kids never have been and we are all successful, prosperous people. Still, John Amos is one of may favorite actors. He should have had the sense to refuse to do this episode, IMHO.
Why did the producers change the characters? In Maude, James was a fireman who got a good promotion. Now if James was a fireman why would he move to Chicago to live in the projects. I don't believe firemen get paid what they should but would one really get paid so badly that he and his family have to live in the projects. Plus the show never mentions New York and numerous times Wilona mentions that she remembers the kids when they were babies
Definitely when James Evans, Sr. died. He was the foundation of the family, and the only strong black father on TV at the time. One other note, a previous poster commented that Keith (Thelma's husband) had minimal education. In the episode where Michael brings home a white study parter/prospective roommate and her parents, Keith mentions that he spent time at Oxford. Therefore, he's very educated. I don't know why he didn't find a job, perhaps he was focusing on his rehab in order to get back into the NFL.
GT jumped when James died. Does anyone know what was behind that door in the kitchen? And why did it have a chain lock on it? Why was Willona's apartment so nice and the Evan's looked all grimey?
James' death was blood in the water! Where was the GI Benefits?? I mean James did serve in Korea. The JJ character sickened me to no end. I realize that in most families there is ONE sibling that makes wisecracks, jokes around and attempts to put a smile on the other family members faces; but he just worked my LAST nerve all the time. Thelma's character should have been beefed up more, the writer's allowed her funny lines only every now and then "..just like when your mama took one look at you and named you Mad Dog". Ralph (Michael) was gayer than Paris in the springtime. I love the James and Florida marriage as played on the show. The show when Thelma found James' long lost father was one of the best on TV.
When Keith married Thelma, the show totally jumped. What kind of football star was this guy if he sustains a career-ending injury by tripping over someone at his own wedding?? Just imagine what would have happened on the field! He's probably lucky he never played a down in the NFL or else he'd be doing the Joe Theissman shuffle.
Lazy writers, picture this James and Florida are about to eat dinner, but who walks in on them, Willona. I thought they live in a ghetto high-rise on the South Side of Chicago, and they don’t lock the front door. That was one of the reasons the shark jump in and got them.
After really sitting down and seeing episodes from all 5 seasons of the series in a recent TV Land marathon- the whole premise of the show seemed to go downhill following James' death (and by telegram no less). Nothing from this point on made sense. James wasnt even cold in the ground, and Florida begins to date Carl Dixon. Carl and Florida get married, and go to Arizona, because Carl has lung cancer and apparently the oxygen in Arizona is healthier than the oxygen in Chicago. Then the opening credits state "starring Ja'net DuBois", which right there is prime indicator of JTS status. The show was NEVER created nor did they ever intend for Wilona to have star billing. With Florida and James out of the picture, the entire point of the series was lost. Bookman, Keith and Penny didn't help the cause.
The first sign that a show will be exiting television is when everyone grows up and producers feel if we add a child, it will be more funnier. The show brought Janet Jackson, known as Penny. She was from the Jackson 5 family and that alone should have brought ratings. Well, it did, only while she was getting her azz beat otherwise, no talent= no lines. Janet's appearance didn't help the show at all. They needed James back plain and simple!!
The JTS moment for me was the corny Christmas talent show they put on at Keith's cab garage.Where did the Evans family get the money for all those fancy costumes, and that scary rendition of "Steam Heat"done by the ladies...EEK!!! Yes,I agree that losing John Amos and Esther Rolle were tragedies,although the latter came back after a season's absence MINUS her "new husband" or any word of his whereabouts.Still, there were many good episodes that happened, in spite of these two(or three)losses.As a 10-year old, I loved this series-it's one of my guilty pleasures as an adult, even though the show is like a gospel play-bad acting, silly catch-phrases,overly loud audience reactions and one character always rolling her eyes heavenward and asking "The Lord" to give her strength.Willona Woods, as a character, is straight out of one of these plays(you know, the ones that have titles like"A Woman's Revenge","God Don't Like Ugly" and "Mister Right Now!"),the way she always pops in with her"Hi,y'all",new outfits,and ever-changing hairstyles.(I saw one of these plays at the Beacon, and CeCe Wynans had a role just like Willona!Oh yeah, I think BernNadette Stanis acted in some of these shows recently..the more things change,the more they stay the same.)
It definitely jumped the shark when James died, but there were still good episodes here and there. I too have wondered where the door in the kitchen leads. It has a chain lock on it as if it goes out of the apartment. Strange.Does anyone else remember wondering this?
Good Times jumped the shark when James died but it died a thousand deaths when the show took a turn for the worse in a slew of 'message' episodes. One of the worst was when Keith became a bi-polar drunk. He became moody because he could not find work and we are supposed to believe that he got blotto in the bathroom with a bottle of vodka that he found in the toilet tank. Did nobody smell it on his breath? When Wilona brought the blueberry muffins, I would have thunk that the little busybody would have detected it (Didn't she discover Penny's bruises?). Well, Thelma was ******** in love with Keith because she brushed off his behavior until the cliche slap that sends her running from the room. It's strange how slaps look rather tame on television but the audience goes wild like she got a Mike Tyson Punch Out (remember Nintendo) fist to the face. Well it happily wraps up at the end when Thelma convinces Keith to dump is boozing ways. Hooray for thirty-minute solutions! Too bad the show went waaaaaay down but at least it provided 'Blossom' with a template for stinking things up with 'special' episodes. P.S. - The creators must have a bathroom fetish. Didn't JJ's gal try to shoot up in the john?
This show was decent when John Amos was in it, and I always assumed that both him and Esther Rolle had some integrity because they bailed when it became the "JJ Show", with him going first, and Esther Rolle making the mistake of coming back. Another Norman Lear show that should have stopped when it was still good(I don't count Maude, that show sucked from day one, sorry Bea Arthur). Since it's a Norman Lear show, you have to accept that on it's face it is left-wing and preachy from the start, but sadly, it seemed to devolve into dumbed-down stereotypes and embarrassingly bad acting by Jimmie Walker after the James character was gone. At least Lear tried to make shows about subjects that were never done at the time. The ironic thing is the show is conceived by a rich white guy and filmed/produced by a bunch of white people in Hollywood, about a poor black family trying to get out of Cabrini Green(that's where it was supposed to be, right?). Sure sounds like the elements you need for a realistic portrayal of black poverty!
I just didnt care for the show after John Amos and Ester Rolles departure, that made JJ the man of the house and you really didnt hear much of his stupid rhymes or see his weirdo strut after that. But one thing that never has changed was Thelma. I seen something on TV land recently where they had the cast of Good Times on some award show and Thelma is still very much of a hottie.
A show can't always help cast members leaving. But as long as it TRIES to stay with its original premise, things may be forgiven. Good Times real problem was Florida's return after a year long absense. I mean the kids were making it on their own, the mother comes back and takes over. What the hell? And who moves BACK to the ghetto anyhow?
First off who would buy the fact that the girlfriend of the star of the football team was also sleeping with JJ? And then when it turns out he is "clean" she gets upset as she doesn't know who gave it to her then or she realize that the football player was also cheating on her. I also found this episode funny or jump worthy when Michael knew all about VD from health class and was talking about it with JJ. Seeing Jay Leno as a young actor in the show was pretty funny too as he talked about the risks and humor of VD. I am thinking that Jimmie Walker got him the part while they worked the comedy club scene together. Just think Good Times might have started the road to the Tonight Show for Leno.
The episode where James buys a gun and brings it into the house because of all the crime that has been happening in the projects. They have lived in the ghetto for that long and are now just getting around to buying a gun for protection? Then Florida getting too emotional about having the gun around. As the episode goes on they here about some kid being shot by a gun and then what a shock their gun is missing and everyone panics that the gun that shot the kid could be their gun. First off that would mean someone walked into their apartment and stole the gun. Well then again they never locked the door. But it turns out Michael moved the gun because he was afraid someone would fine the gun or James might try and shot the wrong person. Then when the family tells Michael that he shouldn't play with a loaded gun, he says its not loaded and pulls the trigger while pointing the gun straight up to the ceiling and the gun goes off. You hear the audience react just like they always did in these episodes but we never see any ceiling fall down from the gun shot. Anyway it was a special episode about gun safety even in the projects
One Word: KEITH!!!!! Trust me, Thelma could do better!!!!
The show really jts when James died. he was a really strong character. It make me sick to think that they took what could have been a profound black television program, and turned it into a stereotypical clownfest. JJ made me sick every time he said "dynomite". By the way the lyrics go " temporary lay offs/ good times/ easy credit rip offs/ good times / scracthin and surviving/ good times/ Hangin in a chow line/ good times.
Good Times JTS with the death of James Sr. The show was suppose to be about James & Florida (could they have thought up a weirder name for someone?) raising their kids right against all odds in the ghetto and when James died, the premise died too. I agree with above posters that the acting of Jimmy Walker (JJ Evans) was embarassingly bad. I don't think anyone bought JJ growing up and being somewhat mature and Jimmy's acting chops weren't made for anything heavier than one liners. I also agree that Ja'net DuBois's character Willona was not well rounded enough to be the focal point. That being said, this show is so bad, it's damn right good! The overacting (or underacting, however you wanna look at it) and topics are just a hoot! My personal favorites are when the Evans put on talent (using that word loosely) shows to raise money for the problem of the week. I swear, the producers made up any reason in the world to get Michael to sing! He even sang some weird song at Thelma & Keith's wedding for some odd reason. Classic ****! I also love the weird, never explained things on the show such as why Willona's apartment seemed so much better than the Evans when they lived in the same building and why the Evans had a door that locked to nowhere in their kitchen. Like pretty much every Norman Lear show, it stayed on way past its' prime to cash in resulting in totally camp, horrible yet funny to watch for all the wrong reasons TV.
how come the evans family never bought a tv set? i know they were a poor family living in the projects but come on, whats a small black & white tv set in the 70's cost? 25 or 30 dollars? you mean to tell me james evans could'nt come up with that! jj was able to afford art supplies but the family never bought a tv set. come to think of it! i dont think they ever had even a radio! what a double jump the shark period!
Good Times jumped the shark with the introduction with the Mama and the Daddy. If you notice, when James and Florida was on the show that apartment they lived in was run down. The kitchn walls were stained. The front door was dirty on the outside and inside. The entire apartment was really drab. The entire family was always broke. James couldn't keep a job to save his life and Florida simply didn't even try to work. (Well maybe one time in that episode when she went out to a Japanese resturant with her "boss." Whatever became of that job anyway?) But then if you notice when the Daddy was killed and the Mama went to Arizona on that bogus azz "honeymoon" with that athiest dude, the apartment and the Evans kids had a complete makeover. All of a sudden they had a brand new couch, actually refered to by J.J. as the "comfy, cozy, conture couch." Over by where the jesus photo was hanging, now was a really cool plant stand with lush green plants. The front door wasn't stained with nasty black marks. All of a sudden the kitchen walls and refridgerator was clean. They even had some carpet and throw pillows. Oh yeah, I almost forgot. What about the super cool lazy boy recliner they had. And I think it was pleather too. Also, J.J. became a advertising artist making good money. They didn't really have any financial problems. Then when Florida comes back on the scene, here we go again. The apartment kept it's make over but everybody started having bad luck again. J.J. lost his really good job and he was constantly looking for work. It just seemed that the parents brought the family down instead of up. What a bummer. I think the show should have begun with Willona raising the orphaned Evans kids, WITHOUT the bad luck bad news parents. comments: Did you notice the ridiculous ending to Good Times? The very last episode had it where everyone suddenly is struck with is great good fortune. Willona becomes the head buyer at the boutique and gets a house out of the ghetto. Keith signs a lucrative football contract with the Chicago Bears and gets a house for pregnant Thelma and the tag along Mama. Okay here's the really bogus part when I said, "YEAH, RIGHT!!!" J.J. comes in the apartment and tells his good news first, that he sold his Dyno Woman comic book idea. He becomes rich. He announces that he is moving out of the projects. Mind you, he says that he's moving out BEFORE he here's of Keith's good news about being an NFL player and taking Thelma and the Mom out of the ghetto. For all J.J. knows, he's rich and HE'S getting out of the ghetto. He never mentions that he's gonna get them out too. That was wacked!! So after all those years of "scatchin' and sur-vive-in", J.J.'s just gonna announce that's he's rich and moving OUT?---and leave the rest of his family in ghetto hell? But wait it get's worse. Then Keith tells of his good news of moving out of the ghetto, suddenly Michael announces that he's not gonna move in with Keith, Thelma and the Mama. He says, "No thank you brother in-law. I'm tired of sleeping on the couch. I'm gonna live on campus in one of the dormitories." WHAAAAAAT??!!!! Why in the heck didn't Michael do that in the FIRST place?! Please, the minuite I turned 17 and was gonna go to college, if I had a CHOICE to live in pissville in the ghetto or live in a crisp clean dorm room, you think I would go? I wouldn't be able to get to that college dorm fast enough. What the heck was Michael waiting for? He could have left along time ago. It's not like they needed him to stay in the projects with them. He wasn't really working anyways. They didn't NEED him to stay in that apartment. So J.J. and Keith strikes it rich, NOOOOWW he decides to live in the dorm. Wrong answer. That's when you WANT to be around the family is when they're loaded!! Bogus ending.
Have you notice that the mama and daddy brought nothing but bad luck to the family? First of all, the apartment was filthy. The kitchen walls, that mysterious kitchen door with the lock, the refrigerator door, the front door and the living room walls were dirty. The only time they fixed up that pig sty of an apartment was when the building committee were having a apartment decorating contest and Florida and Thelma put throw pillows and matching couch covers on the couch and so forth. Then curiously after the contest was over, the apartment went back to it's old filthy self again. Did you notice that when the parents were there, they always had severe financial problems? When the daddy died and the mama went off to Arizona on that bogus honeymoon, all of a sudden J.J. landed a job at an ad agency, the apartment had a severe make-over (plants, brand new furniture, carpeting, clean walls, etc). Everyone was happy and doing well. Then the sorry ass mama comes back to Chicago and all of sudden J.J. looses his job and they're struggling again. I say the show jumped the shark with the parents. The show should have started out with the orphaned Evans kids being looked after by the vivacious and illustrious Willona Woods.
Same dude, different character. Good Times did this ALOT! The show jumped many times with this mishap. Here are some examples: 1.) Sweet Daddy Williams was played by the same actor for many episodes over a period of years. But remember that episode where J.J. books his comedian client to do a stand up act at a night club? The client gets stage fright and backs down from performing, so J.J. has to do the act. Well the guy that plays the night club owner is the SAME dude that's been playing the Sweet Daddy Williams character for years. The night club owner had a completely different name, wardrobe and personality...it wasn't like Sweet Daddy Williams owned a night club. It was a totally different character played by that same dude. Did the producers think that we wouldn't clearly see this? 2.) Remember that episode where James' friend comes to stay with the Evans family for the night, but because he's a compulsive gambler he ends up stealing their prized silver salt and pepper shakers? Remember that dude? Well that same guy ends up playing the character of Florida's boss. (Apparently she had a job for a hot second.) It's the episode where her boss takes her out for lunch at a Japanese restaurant and she gets tipsy off of sake rice wine. 3.) There's this one character actress that shows up playing bit parts on Good Times. First she's in a episode where she plays the cocktail waitress at a night club when Florida and Willona have a girls night out. Then that same actress shows up in the episode where she plays a waitress at a restaurant where J.J. is dressed in a hat and trench coat trying to spy on Thelma and her mysterious date. Then she shows up in another episode where J.J. files for unemployment. She plays the worker behind the desk. Now each role is a speaking role, so she is clearly recognizable and she wears the same afro wig or maybe that's her hair, who knows. Same chick different characters. 4.) Oh yeah, I all most forgot this one. Remember that episode where J.J. gets arrested for mistaken identity for a liquor store robbery? Well at the police station there was this pimp/loan shark dude with a mustache and maroon pimp hat on. He offered to lend James the money to bail J.J. out. Well that SAME dude shows up in another episode where he pays Willona a visit at the boutique. He played a clothing merchandiser. Yet again that SAME dude also plays the role of a desk sergeant at a army induction facility where J.J. attempts to join the army. 5.)And what about that episode where the blind encyclopedia sales man comes to the Evans house hold and tries to rip them off (clear example of one of those pesky easy credit rip offs). Well that guy that played that role was the SAME dude that played the role of Michael's principle, the episode where Michael didn't want to get bussed to a white school. (by the way, the dude that played these roles was the black dude from Barney Miller) 6.) Remember the episode where J.J. was pressured into joining the Satan Knights? One of the gang members was a short dude with a light mustache, evidently in J.J.'s age group. Well that SAME dude later on played a bully and class mate of 12 year old Michael. He's the dude that came over and smart mouthed the Daddy and the Daddy tagged that ass with the belt. How can that dude be 18 and 12 all in the same year? Yeah right!!! JUMPED, JUMPED, JUMPED.
LOL at the above poster! True, Good Times used the same character 50 times.
There are many odd episodes of Good Times. But truly one of the most bizarre stories was when JJ decides to manage a singing act. At first the audience is led to believe that JJ is going to manage a group that consisted of Michael and 3 back-up singers. Florida gets in a tizzy when she learns the group is singing in a nightclub. So halfway through the episode, JJ is left with no act. That is until she (it) arrives. JJ meets this homely, elephantine white woman (in a club on the South side of Chicago?!) with no self-confidence, someone the audience has never seen before much less cares about. JJ agrees to manage this cow without even hearing her. Back at the nightclub, this whining eyesore croaks out an absolutely horrendous version of "Send in the Clowns". She unbelievably wows the (again mostly black) audience to the point of not only winning the singing contest, but having JJ and 2(!) other managers FIGHT over her cuz she is really going to go places! Sheez!!! Well, this was the 70s - perhaps the writers were smoking reefer that day.
Good Times definitely jumped when they recycled and rehashed the same joke in 3 different episodes....the "one for each direction" punch line. Here goes, remember that episode when James was going to get a very high paying job..but of course didn't get it. But Florida and Willona was imagining all the money the Evans family was going to have. Florida pretends like she's rich and says that she's going to buy 4 yachts. Willona says, "Four yachts? Whatever for?" And Florida says, "One for every direction." The audience laughs. The same joke is used in another episode. J.J. either says it about Sweet Daddy Williams having 4 Cadillacs, "One for each direction" or he says it about himself one day getting 4 Cadillacs, "One for each direction." At any rate, J.J. used that same joke. The audience laughed. Then it was used again in the episode when Willona's long distant flame, Frank Mason, comes to Chicago to propose to Willona. This dude is some kind of contractor that travels the world and has big bucks. Well that dude says, "I have 4 Cadillacs. One for each direction." The audience laughed, but I sure didn't. Come on Good Times writers...what happened?! What is the problem? For this shark jump, Fonzie definitely needs 4 jet skis, "one for each direction."
I used to view John Amos and Esther Rolle as a couple of uppity snobs when they voiced their objections about the J.J. character because at the time, I was 11-12 years old and I thought he was the funniest thing on TV. But viewing things now with 40-something eyes, I have to admit they were both dead right about what a buffoonish and annoying character J.J. was, and I respect them both for it now. I can’t believe I thought the whole “Dy-No-Mite” thing was cool 30 years ago! Did anyone notice how they 86’ed “Dy-No-Mite” in the sixth and final season? J.J. never uttered it once during that last year. And that whole jive-ass “ladies man” schtick he tried to put on was pure B.S.—he was about as successful with women as Anna Nicole Smith would have been as a contestant on “Jeopardy!”…As for the rest of the show, it was kind of a mixed bag. Overall, I thought the show had great main characters (except J.J.) that helped sustain it, in spite of some pretty lame plot lines most of the time. I always had trouble buying the whole “Militant Midget” bit, though, especially in the early years when Michael was younger. Come on, a 10-year-old kid in the projects isn’t going to go out of his way to look for racism at every turn! It would have made more sense for Michael to worry about that as he got a little older and became more socially aware. If anything, Michael should have been more offended by the jive stereotypical side characters on the show like Sweet Daddy and Lennay (sp?)--if I were a black, I would’ve been embarrassed as hell by these pimped-out fools! I tend to agree that the final season was fairly weak, and the show got rather heavy-handed and preachy at times. I didn’t think the Keith character was all that bad really, except he had this irritating habit of often lapsing into this lame Bill Cosby impression for no particular reason. I have to agree with the rank-and-file, too—Thelma was quite the hottie back then (and still is), as was Willona.