I think her name was Christine. She went on a buisness trip with her husband. He said she left her id at home and went back to get and flew out on a later flight and he says last time he saw her was when was in the hotel and took a shower. There was a sighting in a diffret state of her shopping a store and then years later her remains were found at camp sight with back pack and sunglasses that were not hers and wearing unfamilar clothes. Apparently she was stabbed. They apparently found her ring and money still there. They have just aired that case and i think it was down freaky hoe ends up so far away from home.

I think her name was Christine. She went on a buisness trip with her husband. He said she left her id at home and went back to get and flew out on a later flight and he says last time he saw her was when was in the hotel and took a shower. There was a sighting in a diffret state of her shopping a store and then years later her remains were found at camp sight with back pack and sunglasses that were not hers and wearing unfamilar clothes. Apparently she was stabbed. They apparently found her ring and money still there. They have just aired that case and i think it was down freaky hoe ends up so far away from home.
That's the case of Judy Smith and still unsolved, sadly. There's a theory that she was fighting with her husband and purposely left her ID at home so they could be apart for a while. However, she did fly out on a later flight and seemed just fine and happy when they reunited. I find this case incredibly bizarre. Even if she was quarreling with her husband, for her to decide to fly out and then wind up in a different state is crazy. They think she planned her disappearance and then met with foul play, but I find it kind of incredulous that she would do that, particularly since she had a daughter she was so close to. I think it's possible she went to the other state to cool off and enjoy herself after an argument with full intentions of returning, but that she met with the killer shortly after disappearing. I think I recall the segment saying she was very friendly and trusting and that perhaps that's how this terrible crime came about.

http://unsolvedmysteries.wikia.com/wiki/Judith_Smith

I haven't seen the Robert Stack version of Judith Smith's case in many years but the Farina version was on TV awhile back. It was interesting to note that she was wearing a different outfit at the time her remains were discovered, and weren't the clothes she was last seen alive in. Some think she had been hiking in the area where she was killed at as to explain the change of clothes.

As WishfulDreamer pointed out, Judith may have wanted to cool down and get away from her husband for awhile and figured since she was already on vacation, that she decided to go to another state and explore around, and met foul play with someone because she was so trusting of people. It's a very sad case and I hope it's solved someday.

I haven't seen the Robert Stack version of Judith Smith's case in many years but the Farina version was on TV awhile back. It was interesting to note that she was wearing a different outfit at the time her remains were discovered, and weren't the clothes she was last seen alive in. Some think she had been hiking in the area where she was killed at as to explain the change of clothes.

As WishfulDreamer pointed out, Judith may have wanted to cool down and get away from her husband for awhile and figured since she was already on vacation, that she decided to go to another state and explore around, and met foul play with someone because she was so trusting of people. It's a very sad case and I hope it's solved someday.


This thing is creepy. She also had a different back pack found with her remains . not her red one.

The Judy Smith case is definitely bizarre in every sense of the word. The husband was ruled out as a suspect, IIRC. I seem to remember the husband saying that they weren't fighting the last time he saw her and that they had made plans to meet up after he attended some business meetings that day. No one knows why she just up and left and went to a different state. Maybe she was bored, figured she'd go on a road trip but met with foul play. The different clothes is just weird. I have no explanation for that one.

http://articles.philly.com/1997-10-05/news/25540618_1_detectives-medical-examiner-crime-scene

http://archives.citypaper.net/articles/073098/om1.shtml

a bunch of articles here: http://s2.excoboard.com/Courthouse_Steps_Mavens/122599/1695938

While one of the witnesses claimed that they saw Judy with another individual around Asheville, I don't discount that she may have randomly encountered a local or even another hiker. The Biltmore estate and Pisgah Forest are regularly visited by tourists and backpackers, so it's not a big deal that she may have had an interest in traveling there, rather than milling around in Philadelphia. Gary Hilton has been mentioned as a potential suspect, due to similar murders he committed in North Carolina (of a couple in the Nantahala and Pisgah forests), Georgia and Florida, but it very well could have been someone from the area.

In one of the above articles, the police mentioned that the site where her body was located wasn't an area one could just easily come across. From the nearest road, it's a 20 minute walk up a steep incline through the woods. Judy was wearing thermal underwear when she was found and winter clothing was also discovered in the bag, so it's possible she had plans to do some hiking or camping and encountered someone around there, or someone forced her to go to the area. Her jewelry, some cash and other possessions were found buried nearby, but her red backpack and her wallet were never located.

Why she didn't mention her plans to her husband is another question. Judy was described as being independent and assertive, as well as being an experienced solo traveler, so she may simply have been more impulsive about going off without mentioning her itinerary.

http://articles.philly.com/1997-10-05/news/25540618_1_detectives-medical-examiner-crime-scene

http://archives.citypaper.net/articles/073098/om1.shtml

a bunch of articles here: http://s2.excoboard.com/Courthouse_Steps_Mavens/122599/1695938

While one of the witnesses claimed that they saw Judy with another individual around Asheville, I don't discount that she may have randomly encountered a local or even another hiker. The Biltmore estate and Pisgah Forest are regularly visited by tourists and backpackers, so it's not a big deal that she may have had an interest in traveling there, rather than milling around in Philadelphia. Gary Hilton has been mentioned as a potential suspect, due to similar murders he committed in North Carolina (of a couple in the Nantahala and Pisgah forests), Georgia and Florida, but it very well could have been someone from the area.

In one of the above articles, the police mentioned that the site where her body was located wasn't an area one could just easily come across. From the nearest road, it's a 20 minute walk up a steep incline through the woods. Judy was wearing thermal underwear when she was found and winter clothing was also discovered in the bag, so it's possible she had plans to do some hiking or camping and encountered someone around there, or someone forced her to go to the area. Her jewelry, some cash and other possessions were found buried nearby, but her red backpack and her wallet were never located.

Why she didn't mention her plans to her husband is another question. Judy was described as being independent and assertive, as well as being an experienced solo traveler, so she may simply have been more impulsive about going off without mentioning her itinerary.


Als otheyr said there was money found scattered and her weding ring , and a pair sunglasses that wer not hers and they said the back pack there was not hers. And she died of a stab wound.

Als otheyr said there was money found scattered and her weding ring , and a pair sunglasses that wer not hers and they said the back pack there was not hers. And she died of a stab wound.

The sunglasses are interesting, since they were a reasonably expensive brand that Judy's family or friends believed she had never owned. However, it's likely that the blue backpack was Judy's, since it had cash in it (some articles mention $80) and warmer clothing. Clothing alternately described in various articles as either a shirt or a winter jacket also had around $87 in the pocket, however her wallet and identification have never been found. She was found with a blanket, and I don't think it's impossible that she may have been planning on camping overnight (while it would have been reasonably warm during the day in April, the temperatures would have dropped up in the mountains in the evening). She may have been hiking on a trail when she encountered someone.

As far as the red backpack, either it was stolen when Judy was killed or Judy replaced it with the blue one for some unknown reason - possibly she felt that her red one was in too worn of a condition for the trip. One of the mysteries here is her mode of transportation - there's been no discovery of a paper trail of her taking a bus, flight, train, or renting a car from Philadelphia to Asheville, which would have been well over 600 miles.

The sunglasses are interesting, since they were a reasonably expensive brand that Judy's family or friends believed she had never owned. However, it's likely that the blue backpack was Judy's, since it had cash in it (some articles mention $80) and warmer clothing. Clothing alternately described in various articles as either a shirt or a winter jacket also had around $87 in the pocket, however her wallet and identification have never been found. She was found with a blanket, and I don't think it's impossible that she may have been planning on camping overnight (while it would have been reasonably warm during the day in April, the temperatures would have dropped up in the mountains in the evening). She may have been hiking on a trail when she encountered someone.

As far as the red backpack, either it was stolen when Judy was killed or Judy replaced it with the blue one for some unknown reason - possibly she felt that her red one was in too worn of a condition for the trip. One of the mysteries here is her mode of transportation - there's been no discovery of a paper trail of her taking a bus, flight, train, or renting a car from Philadelphia to Asheville, which would have been well over 600 miles.

I seem to remember therm saying the money was found scattered round her not in the back pack. And the unsolved mysteries segment seemed to think the killer took the red back pack and left his.

What I find interesting about this case is the fact that she had only been married for 5 month yet investigators said that she may have planned her disappearance.
So therefore she cannot have been happy with her marriage if this was the case? Could the husband of had something to do with this?
He has a perfect alibi & hires a killer to find his wife who he knows has left for a camping/hiking trip. It seems strange to me that obviously money was not the goal of the attack, there is no mention of a sexual motive so I believe it may have something to do with the husband

does anyone else see my point ?

If anyone wants to "bump it up" posted a thread with my feeling/opinion on this case a couple years back, yes; a strange case indeed!

What I find interesting about this case is the fact that she had only been married for 5 month yet investigators said that she may have planned her disappearance.
So therefore she cannot have been happy with her marriage if this was the case? Could the husband of had something to do with this?
He has a perfect alibi & hires a killer to find his wife who he knows has left for a camping/hiking trip. It seems strange to me that obviously money was not the goal of the attack, there is no mention of a sexual motive so I believe it may have something to do with the husband

does anyone else see my point ?

I been reading about this case. The husband had hired three investigators to find her and they found nothing. The policce said he co-operated with them. except he had never taken a polygraph test. I thought I read that north carolina city were she was found was somewhat familair to her and her husband.

The husband had hired three investigators to find her and they found nothing. The policce said he co-operated with them. except he had never taken a polygraph test.

That information makes it appear to me that Judy's husband had nothing to do with it (the polygraph test notwithstanding, as it's a wise legal move in many cases to refuse one).

I don't think it would make sense for him to hire anyone to murder her. They'd been married for less than six months--it probably would have been far less expensive to divorce, and Judy's death would have to be the most ridiculous attempted life insurance fraud case there ever was. I think it's highly unlikely he was involved.

Asheville is a pretty popular tourist destination. There is no telling who Judy could have encountered during her time there.

There's so much about this case that makes zero sense.

That information makes it appear to me that Judy's husband had nothing to do with it (the polygraph test notwithstanding, as it's a wise legal move in many cases to refuse one).

I don't think it would make sense for him to hire anyone to murder her. They'd been married for less than six months--it probably would have been far less expensive to divorce, and Judy's death would have to be the most ridiculous attempted life insurance fraud case there ever was. I think it's highly unlikely he was involved.

Asheville is a pretty popular tourist destination. There is no telling who Judy could have encountered during her time there.

There's so much about this case that makes zero sense.

I totally see your point that it's cheaper to divorce however what if Judy wanted a divorce & the husband could not live with the humiliation of his wife leaving him after such a short period of time.
I find it very interesting that the couple were familia with the area she was found and did not know this previous. Maybe they had a favourite secluded spot that he knew she would be.
To refuse a polygraph to me speaks a 1000 words all pointing to some involvement. Personally if I was innocent I would take it. He hired 3 PI well it's a good way to make him look innocent.

If this was the case maybe the story isn't as strange as it seems!

Does any one know if there was any record of a sexual motive?

There are only 2 possible scenarios I can think of in this case:

-On a whim, Judy just decided out of the blue to go on a trip to a place she had never been before. She met someone in or around the Asheville area and was killed by a random stranger.
-Judy planned on meeting someone in Asheville, who unfortunately killed her.

The random trip theory could be plausible, but wouldn't that mean that Judy and her husband would have most likely gotten into a fight over her trip once she got back to Philly? Considering Judy's friend described the marriage as rocky in the segment, it seems likely that her husband wouldn't have appreciated her taking a trip to NC without telling him. Plus there really was no reason for her to take a random trip, since she was in Philly already where there was plenty of sightseeing to be done.

The possible affair angle seems slightly more believable because of the comment Judy's friend had made in the segment about how Judy and her husband's marriage was rocky at that point. She may have been talking to someone online with plans of meeting them at some point. The trip to Philadelphia proved a perfect opportunity. I may be reading too much into it, but the segment says once Judy and her husband got to the airport she forgot her license so her husband went on without her. I have no idea if this is true or not, but suppose she figured her husband would say something along the lines of "oh don't worry you don't have to come with me", so he would be away while she remained home. Perhaps he insisted she take a later flight which altered her plans. That could account for her "random" trek from Philly to Asheville. I know it seems far out there, but with all of the things that make no sense in this case it's the only one I could think up.

Does any one know if there was any record of a sexual motive?

Judy was fully dressed when she was found, and there is no mention that there was evidence of an sexual assault. As far as the theory that robbery wasn't the motive, while there was cash in the shirt pocket and in a compartment of the blue backpack, her wallet was missing. Attempted robberies and rapes don't always go to plan, and most criminals aren't masterminds. Judy's family and friends stated that she wasn't computer literate, and although it's not impossible, there's never been any evidence that she was specifically meeting up with someone around Asheville. Just my take, but she may have been targeted for a crime, like Dexter Stefonek, simply because she was in a particular location and came across someone.

As far as her husband, they had both previously been to Raleigh, but there doesn't seem to be anything connecting either of them to the Asheville area before her visit, or that he even had knowledge beforehand of her plans. Definitely one of the bigger mysteries that UM featured, in part because the motive for the crime and her reasons for visiting that location, while omitting that information from her husband, don't seem to be connected.

It could well be that she was in the wrong place at the wrong time.
If there was a sexual preditor scouring for a victim they happened to come across judy, stabbed her but never commuted any further acts seem strange! The killer must have been prepared for murder as he carried a knife.

Even a robber with a weapon to threaten, if judy fought back and thus end up being stabbed, still the robber would have taken the money & valuables.

Neither seemed to happen in this case. Where they disterbed?

Affair ? Hmmm I didn't know about this possibility.

IMO the killer was in a 'heavily' populated area there for gun shot will have drawn attention. Knives are silent killers providing they are used correctly.

Did the killer know what he was doing? Professional like

Did the killer know what he was doing? Professional like

Her remains were described as skeletal, so there was difficulty in determining what caused her death. From this article: http://archives.citypaper.net/articles/073098/om1.shtml

Though the North Carolina chief medical examiner's report failed to list a specific cause of death, Constance says that cut marks found on her clothing may be indicative of a stab-type wound.

In this article it states that she was seen with at lease 1 other person but the witness will not say if it was male or female

Have I just read that right? I am currently trying to entertain a 10 month old lol

Yeah, it seems that a tip about a woman who resembled Judy being with a companion came into the show America's Most Wanted after they profiled her case. Her friend on UM said that there were problems in the marriage, but that there wasn't a "mystery man". From what I've previously read, the sighting that investigators find the most credible is the one at the Christmas/gift shop at the Biltmore estate (I believe it's the sighting discussed on UM). The woman who came into the store mentioned that she was from Boston and that her husband was at a convention in Pennsylvania.

I am curious why the investigator on UM believed that the blue backpack potentially belonged to the suspect, rather than Judy, and what, if any, information is being withheld.

I am curious why the investigator on UM believed that the blue backpack potentially belonged to the suspect, rather than Judy, and what, if any, information is being withheld.

There must have been stuff inside the backpack that belonged to someone else? Possibly male clothing ? which the police are withholding incase they want to clear a suspect? Otherwise it just seems bizarre that they are not letting the public know what is inside.
I can live with the fact that people have previously mentioned that maybe her red back pack was broken or too damaged and had to get a new one. That can be understood totally, however if was her bag and her stuff then surely would be of no jeopardy to the investigation to tell the public its contents.
I wonder if her red back pack was stolen with her wallet in it and therefore she had to replace the back and most of her items kept init, including sunglasses and that’s why no one could identify her stuff and thought it could belong to someone else?

Some of the articles mention that the blue backpack had winter clothing and the $80 cash; we don't know why it was theorized that the backpack may have been the suspect's. The absence of the red backpack doesn't necessarily mean that it was stolen or that the blue one didn't belong to Judy. Her family and friends also didn't believe she would have purchased the Bolles sunglasses or that she would go off to a trip without telling anyone, but it seems that Judy could and did chose to omit information on occasion.

This site has a couple of articles that can no longer be linked from the original news source. http://s2.excoboard.com/Courthouse_Steps_Mavens/122599/1695938 From when Judy was still considered a missing person:

She is believed to have been carrying as much as $200 in cash, but she left about $500 in the hotel room. Neither the American Express Gold Card nor the phone charge card she also carried has been used since her trip to Philadelphia. (Sweeney says the credit card has been "red-flagged" — if it's used, investigators will be contacted immediately.) There have been no attempts to tap the couple's bank accounts.

Apologies for posting so much on this thread, but it's a really unusual case that rarely gets discussed.

do you think the killer took the back pack away as a trophy? Or even the wallet?

Sex killers and murderers often do this?
Hit men also do this as proof that they have done the crime?

What do you think?

do you think the killer took the back pack away as a trophy? Or even the wallet?

Sex killers and murderers often do this?
Hit men also do this as proof that they have done the crime?

What do you think?


There were two back packs at the scene. The blue one winter clothes and money. A blue and black one , and pair sunglasses that are said to be the killers. You would think DNA would found on the sunglasses seeing is howe clothes they are to the face, and men usually have them hanging on their shirt collar orwear them on top of her head. Her wedding rings and paper back book were also found. Her body was covered in a blue blanket and half buried. Marks on the remains suggest she was stabbed. Very creepy.

The pattern of her sightings suggest she had the bag till the very last.

The first sighting was at a Macy's in a mall near were her husbands meeting was and were she told him she would shop. The sale's clerk decribed her down to her red back pack and said she was looking for dresses for her daughter. And when she left she got confused and mistaken some other woman for her daughter . Her husband said that did sound like Judy. but he said the next sighting in a New Jersey casino does not sound like her . A woman with red back pack was scene wondering the casino disoriented. Her husband said she hatted gambling and would not go there. The next sighting were at ther docks in connetcicut I think it was. A homeless person told the family she was wondering around there with the red back pack. Come to find out he was mistaking Judy for a homeles woman that frequinted the area.

The next sighting were in North Carolina , after her body was found. The cops found a woman who ran a Christmas Store in a near by town to location of the remains. She said Judy came in was fine and talked about her husbands buisness trip and everythng. Red back pack and all. The next sighting was at a near buy camping sight. Judy was scene driving up in car , red bag with her asking if she could sleep in her car at the camp sight and they owners said know and she drove away. Third sighting she droive to near by sandwhich shop paid with money out of a red back pack ,bought 20 sandwhiches and a toy car. The cops found that her body was near buy to a horse farm and hotel and sugest she staid there before going off to were she was found. She loved horses and are sertain she was there. Though nothing was ever said about her name beging on the register.

The only connection she had with that area was she had ben up there with a patient for s short time.

well that is a lot of new information that i did not know previous.
it does make you wonder why DNA had not been found on the sunglasses. Surely this case would of been solved if happened today.

Now this is very intresting that there were 2 back packs? one must have defo belonged to the kille.

This case is giving me a head ache just trying to think of possibilites.

TBH I still think that the husband was involved in some way shape or form.

It would be intresting to know if he remarried, came into any money after Judy deid.

I think she arrived in Philadelphia, then decided to visit Asheville for some unknown reason. Possibly she was planning on returning to Philadelphia in a day or so.

-She encountered someone on or near one of the trails or the picnic shelter where she was found, and was killed in a random attack. (This is what I lean towards).
-She met someone around Asheville who offered to show her the sites or, far less likely, she had prearranged a meeting there with an acquaintance who then killed her.
-She met someone in Philadelphia, who then accompanied her to Asheville and harmed her.

Any scenario involving a professional hit seems implausible. Most hired killers aren't "professional" in any manner and why kill her in the boondocks of Pisgah National Forest, when she was at home by herself after her husband left on his trip? The husband doesn't seem to be a strong suspect either - the relationship might have been tenuous, but he reported her missing, hired private investigators and even tried to get the FBI to investigate her case. http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=rU8lAAAAIBAJ&sjid=TOYFAAAAIBAJ&pg=5714,106324&dq=judith+smith&hl=en

Whoever killed her probably took her wallet because it was easy to find or she handed it to them; in their haste to hide her body, they might have overlooked the cash in the shirt/jacket and in the backpack. Unless there were specific articles in the backpack that obviously weren't things that Judy would possess, I'd say that she purchased the backpack at some point to replace the red one.

There were two back packs at the scene.

No offense, but where did you get that information? As far as I can recall, I've only read that they found the blue and black backpack.

I read it was possible there was a sighting of her with companion in North Carolina. Not know if they were male or female. Or if it was true. I was considered a possible sighting at one point.

As for the backpacks, one of the news articles states the word backpacks in refuyring to objects found near the remains. And I have scene both bl ue back pack and blue and black back pack discriptions. Taken that there must have been two there. Only the cops know.

I just find it difficult to believe that some one can just randomly stab a poor old lady & dump her like that.
But it does happen thousands of time around the world. Your possiblility could very well of happened. I just hate thinking that some one was killed for nothing.
I like to understand the motive weather it be rape, robbery, affair ect ect.

Then again if they did take the wallet & the motive was robbery they didn't nessicerly have to stab her. She was a shy woman apparently not likely to fight back IMO. Why stab her? Unless robbery wasnt the motive and that's just how the killer got his rocks off.

If the sighting of her with a companion is legit, I have a hard time believing that just out of the blue she decides to leave her husband, travel hundreds of miles down south to a random town that she's never been before, and then link up with some stranger who offers to show her around town. I don't buy that for a second. If she was with a companion, IMO, she planned on meeting him/her there. That's the only reasonable explanation as to why she would have been in Asheville in the first place.

If the sighting of her with a companion is legit, I have a hard time believing that just out of the blue she decides to leave her husband, travel hundreds of miles down south to a random town that she's never been before, and then link up with some stranger who offers to show her around town. I don't buy that for a second. If she was with a companion, IMO, she planned on meeting him/her there. That's the only reasonable explanation as to why she would have been in Asheville in the first place.


I wonder if any other bodies were killed in that area, aroiund that time? Wonder if this was lure by a serial killer or something? Just sounds like a preditor. I can see a killer taking her back pack and wallet so know won can identify the body. He could have dumped her other stuff in their bag and scattered it around out there in their haste to leave the scene. Still you think the sunglasses would have some DNA on them. Not forget a paper bak book was found their so cops said it seemed she was planing on camping out their.

One thing her family did say was she was known to go off alone camping. She had been to North Carolina before but not Ashville. Doesn't mean she was not told of the area why she was at North Carolina before or heard of it.

I wonder if any other bodies were killed in that area, aroiund that time? Wonder if this was lure by a serial killer or something? Just sounds like a preditor. I can see a killer taking her back pack and wallet so know won can identify the body. He could have dumped her other stuff in their bag and scattered it around out there in their haste to leave the scene. Still you think the sunglasses would have some DNA on them. Not forget a paper bak book was found their so cops said it seemed she was planing on camping out their.

One thing her family did say was she was known to go off alone camping. She had been to North Carolina before but not Ashville. Doesn't mean she was not told of the area why she was at North Carolina before or heard of it.

I still don't see any reasonable, logical explanation as to why Judy would all of a sudden up and leave her husband (without telling him and/or lying to him) to go to a random road trip for no apparent reason. The only way this makes sense is if she planned on meeting someone in Asheville.

I still don't see any reasonable, logical explanation as to why Judy would all of a sudden up and leave her husband (without telling him and/or lying to him) to go to a random road trip for no apparent reason. The only way this makes sense is if she planned on meeting someone in Asheville.

Well the family said it usualy for her to do things like camping out by herself. Doesn't mean she does them out letting some one know first. Sounds like lure to me.

Well the family said it usualy for her to do things like camping out by herself. Doesn't mean she does them out letting some one know first. Sounds like lure to me.

But she told her husband she would be sightseeing in Philadelphia and that she would meet him back in their room at 5 p.m. She left at 9 a.m. according to her husband. That's not enough time to simply drive to Asheville and turn around and come back. She went there for a reason, IMO.

But she told her husband she would be sightseeing in Philadelphia and that she would meet him back in their room at 5 p.m. She left at 9 a.m. according to her husband. That's not enough time to simply drive to Asheville and turn around and come back. She went there for a reason, IMO.

Yeah she was lured into doing so.

Yeah she was lured into doing so.

What do you mean?

I wonder if they've looked into Gary Hilton

What do you mean?

Lure: To tempt or entice away. Means she connected with some one who talked her into going with him to that campground. As for were they connected I don't know. Another thing we have to realise is those east coast states are rather small. Rhode Island, Pennsylvania, Maryland, Virginia New York, New Jersey , New Hampshire , so samll in fact you can get a train from on to the other in a matter of hours. Ashville is on the border of north carolina near virginia. She could have changed her mind and decided to take a train to any one of these near by states and thought she would back in time to meet her husband. But apparently she connected with some one and wound up were she did.

Lure: To tempt or entice away. Means she connected with some one who talked her into going with him to that campground. As for were they connected I don't know. Another thing we have to realise is those east coast states are rather small. Rhode Island, Pennsylvania, Maryland, Virginia New York, New Jersey , New Hampshire , so samll in fact you can get a train from on to the other in a matter of hours. Ashville is on the border of north carolina near virginia. She could have changed her mind and decided to take a train to any one of these near by states and thought she would back in time to meet her husband. But apparently she connected with some one and wound up were she did.

I knew the definition of lure, what I was asking was whether or not you believed she went to Asheville to meet someone. Because that's what I believe happeend. I live in Maryland. The state might appear small, but it still takes approximately 2 hours to get out of the state. Driving from MD to South Carolina took approximately 8.5 hours. Driving (or catching a train) from Philly to Asheville would probably take the same amount of time or a little more. There's no way she would have been back in time for 5 o'clock.

I knew the definition of lure, what I was asking was whether or not you believed she went to Asheville to meet someone. Because that's what I believe happeend. I live in Maryland. The state might appear small, but it still takes approximately 2 hours to get out of the state. Driving from MD to South Carolina took approximately 8.5 hours. Driving (or catching a train) from Philly to Asheville would probably take the same amount of time or a little more. There's no way she would have been back in time for 5 o'clock.


How about from Philladelphia to Ashville. She was in Philedelpnia when this started. I think it would be bit less time. Two hours from small state to state is true on that east coast. And it Means she probably met who ever it was before she got there and he got to her to go there with him.

How about from Philladelphia to Ashville. She was in Philedelpnia when this started. I think it would be bit less time. Two hours from small state to state is true on that east coast. And it Means she probably met who ever it was before she got there and he got to her to go there with him.

Philadelphia is north of Maryland.

Philadelphia is north of Maryland.

At least someone understood my point.

At least someone understood my point.

Well you did not understand mine. You were calculating from maryland to ashville. I was stating that she left philedelphia and ended up in ashville . meaning the distance being a bit shorter and taking less time. But this is beside the point someone she met up with oviusly lured her into going were she went and then killed her.

Well you did not understand mine. You were calculating from maryland to ashville. I was stating that she left philedelphia and ended up in ashville . meaning the distance being a bit shorter and taking less time. But this is beside the point someone she met up with oviusly lured her into going were she went and then killed her.

It's roughly a seven-hour drive from Hagerstown, MD to Asheville, NC. Hagerstown is northwest of Baltimore, the state's largest city. (I chose Hagerstown because it is one of Maryland's northernmost cities.)

It's roughly an eleven-hour drive from Philadelphia, PA to Asheville, NC. It's close to a 630-mile trip.

There is no way the distance between Philadelphia and Asheville, NC is shorter than that between Asheville and any given city in Maryland, as Pennsylvania is northeast of Maryland.

Check it yourself:

http://www.mapquest.com/

It's roughly a seven-hour drive from Hagerstown, MD to Asheville, NC. Hagerstown is northwest of Baltimore, the state's largest city. (I chose Hagerstown because it is one of Maryland's northernmost cities.)

It's roughly an eleven-hour drive from Philadelphia, PA to Asheville, NC. It's close to a 630-mile trip.

There is no way the distance between Philadelphia and Asheville, NC is shorter than that between Asheville and any given city in Maryland, as Pennsylvania is northeast of Maryland.

Check it yourself:

http://www.mapquest.com/

thanks. I wonder if they know if she ever made it to the liberty bell?

thanks. I wonder if they know if she ever made it to the liberty bell?

I've never been to Philadelphia (well, ok, I've been to the airport) myself, so I have no idea if that and Independence Hall are ticketed attractions. If they were, she may have still had the ticket stubs if she had actually visited them.

Well you did not understand mine. You were calculating from maryland to ashville. I was stating that she left philedelphia and ended up in ashville . meaning the distance being a bit shorter and taking less time. But this is beside the point someone she met up with oviusly lured her into going were she went and then killed her.

I said Maryland to South Carolina (Asheville is in North Carolina). Being that Philly is north of Maryland and Asheville is north of South Carolina, I was approximating that the distances would not be that far apart. Roughly 8.5 hours or more.

thanks. I wonder if they know if she ever made it to the liberty bell?

I doubt it. The UM segment says that there were four witnesses who placed Judy in Asheville "days" after she was supposed to meet back up with her husband in Philadelphia.

Being that Philly is north of Maryland and Asheville is north of South Carolina, I was approximating that the distances would not be that far apart. Roughly 8.5 hours or more.

I input a number of Maryland cities into Mapquest and found that it's just about eight-and-a-half hours from Baltimore to Asheville for almost all routes (which is actually MORE time than the further Hagerstown, but it makes sense--I don't know if there's any way to escape the Beltway and/or its residual traffic on that trip without really going out of the way), so you were pretty dead-on. Which I suppose shouldn't be surprising--you live in Maryland. :p

I input a number of Maryland cities into Mapquest and found that it's just about eight-and-a-half hours from Baltimore to Asheville for almost all routes (which is actually MORE time than the further Hagerstown, but it makes sense--I don't know if there's any way to escape the Beltway and/or its residual traffic on that trip without really going out of the way), so you were pretty dead-on. Which I suppose shouldn't be surprising--you live in Maryland. :p

I'm actually shocked that my "man GPS" actually worked for a change!

So there was no video footage of her at the liberty bell or any witnesses. Sounds like she came into contact with the person in philedelphia and went with him to Ashville. Course she was not scene with anyone in ashville except possibly one time. If the sightings are all leget.

So there was no video footage of her at the liberty bell or any witnesses. Sounds like she came into contact with the person in philedelphia and went with him to Ashville. Course she was not scene with anyone in ashville except possibly one time. If the sightings are all leget.

There's no doubt that the one sighting in the store was legit, IMO. The eyewitness described Judy's red backpack, and how she said she was from Boston and described certain details about her daughter. I believe law enforcement believes it's legit too. Which would make the other sightings in Asheville credible too.

I'm actually shocked that my "man GPS" actually worked for a change!

:lol:

There's no doubt that the one sighting in the store was legit, IMO. The eyewitness described Judy's red backpack, and how she said she was from Boston and described certain details about her daughter. I believe law enforcement believes it's legit too. Which would make the other sightings in Asheville credible too.

Cops also turn around and say sightings arn't credible after they think they are all the time. I never said they were or were not. I said if. That is inbetween.

Cops also turn around and say sightings arn't credible after they think they are all the time. I never said they were or were not. I said if. That is inbetween.

Which is why I said they were credible, "IMO" (in my opinion).

Hello all I'm new to this thread. I'm a huge fan of the show Unsolved Mysteries. I wanted to share my opinion about this case. Ok Judy and her husband was having problems in their marriage. Perhaps she was having second thoughts about making the trip (hence she "forgot" her identification), reluctantly decided to go. How do we know for sure that her husband made the conference or stayed in it's entirety?? Because it makes absolutely no sense for her to travel to NC alone. I personally don't believe the sighting of Judy at the campground & asked if she could sleep in her car when she had money and could have stayed at a hotel. The other sighting of her at the Antique Shop I do believe and she was accompanied by someone. I think that person was her husband and that would explain why she didn't call to let someone know where she was because she was with him all along.The only thing the police have to go by is his account of what happened that day. Also one thing I've noticed that hasn't been mentioned here is that when they found her remains they were partially burned. So that says to me that the person who killed her went through a lot of trouble to conceal the crime and was trying to make it difficult to i.d. her that's why her wallet was taken. Robbery was definitely not the motive and she wasn't sexually assaulted. Her husband business there in NC, maybe not that particular city, but he had some type of business there. Her body being found so far away would lead police away from her husband and again the police only had HIS timeline of the events that occurred that day. As far as hiring 3 P.I. and Faxing flyers...theirs many stories where the spouse appeared to be assisting police in an investigation, but was guilty of actually committing the crime. Well anyways that's just my thoughts about this case.

Hello all I'm new to this thread. I'm a huge fan of the show Unsolved Mysteries. I wanted to share my opinion about this case. Ok Judy and her husband was having problems in their marriage. Perhaps she was having second thoughts about making the trip (hence she "forgot" her identification), reluctantly decided to go. How do we know for sure that her husband made the conference or stayed in it's entirety?? Because it makes absolutely no sense for her to travel to NC alone. I personally don't believe the sighting of Judy at the campground & asked if she could sleep in her car when she had money and could have stayed at a hotel. The other sighting of her at the Antique Shop I do believe and she was accompanied by someone. I think that person was her husband and that would explain why she didn't call to let someone know where she was because she was with him all along.The only thing the police have to go by is his account of what happened that day. Also one thing I've noticed that hasn't been mentioned here is that when they found her remains they were partially burned. So that says to me that the person who killed her went through a lot of trouble to conceal the crime and was trying to make it difficult to i.d. her that's why her wallet was taken. Robbery was definitely not the motive and she wasn't sexually assaulted. Her husband business there in NC, maybe not that particular city, but he had some type of business there. Her body being found so far away would lead police away from her husband and again the police only had HIS timeline of the events that occurred that day. As far as hiring 3 P.I. and Faxing flyers...theirs many stories where the spouse appeared to be assisting police in an investigation, but was guilty of actually committing the crime. Well anyways that's just my thoughts about this case.

I love your theory!! I also think the husband had something to do with it. Its so strange how a mother and wife had the habit of just taking off without letting anyone know. I have 3 kids and a fella and tell them all if I'm going to the toilet lols okay bad example but I would say if I was going to shop or town ect. As her friends stated marriage was ROCKY! I find it hard to believe they were a happy couple. And I apps agree with the point of playing the heartbroken husband willing to do anything. I have seen this happen on many cases were the person injects them selves into the case and being as helpful as possible. It does happen a lot.

However if he is totally innocent then I would feel terrible for saying so. But we all have opinions and have our right to say them. If it was not him I then believe he hired some one to do the job or that it was some one that Judy was having an affair with.

I never heard anywhere were the cops doubted her husbands story as far as being at the meeting. They surely checked with the others in attendance to back it up. As far as Judy camping out her daughter said on the Unsolved Mysteries segment that Judy was known to go off buy herself for awhile away from family , she was very independent. So the camp sight sighting is possible. And both Judy and her husband had previous business in North Carolina but never went their together.

As far as Judy camping out her daughter said on the Unsolved Mysteries segment that Judy was known to go off buy herself for awhile away from family , she was very independent.

Still that is hardly normal behavior for a wife and a mother??? If she keeps going off at random times to 'camp' could that be not going off to meet up with a secret lover?

Maybe she wanted to leave her husband to be with him and he got scared and murdered her. Perhaps if he had a wife is well and didnt want the secret to get out.

I suppose there are many theory's to this case. Any one of them could be right.

Still that is hardly normal behavior for a wife and a mother??? If she keeps going off at random times to 'camp' could that be not going off to meet up with a secret lover?

Maybe she wanted to leave her husband to be with him and he got scared and murdered her. Perhaps if he had a wife is well and didnt want the secret to get out.

I suppose there are many theory's to this case. Any one of them could be right.
I've read a lot of the theories, having said that I don't think she was having an affair because if that's the case your husband is going away for a conference so why even make the trip? I personally have attended conference's & there's so much activity also a lot of people it's not unusual to NOT stay in it's entirety. It just doesn't make sense for Judy to go on vacation with her husband then turn around and travel that far south. When the witness from the Antique Shop came forward she stated that was upbeat and spoke about BOTH her husband and her daughter. So it seems to mean that this "acquaintance" she was with was someone who she was comfortable with....her husband. There's times when I ask my husband to stop somewhere and because he knows how long I might be in that store, he'll go someplace else while I shop. It just seems to me that she was very comfortable. As far as where her remains were found none of us know how much knowledge her husband had about that area. Considering the fact that she liked to hike. I understand that the police holds certain information as to not jeopardize the integrity of the case since it's an ongoing investigation. Sometimes when you hear about certain cases and you're perplexed or can't make sense of it....it just may be that the answer is right in front of you. IJS

Maybe the husband was insistent that she went so they could work on things? Why would he even need her there? So he must of had a motive to get her to come with him? Some plans. Otherwise he would of just went on his own. Maybe once she got there he wasn't doing the 'Im sorry, we can work on this' or what she thought it would be and decided to bugger off.

If she was having an affair I would think it is highly unlikely that just because your husband is away you would stay in the marital home with them. Risk any family members walking in or neighbors seeing him! No you would arrange to meet them somewhere no one knew either of you and you can hold hands and kiss and people think your a normal couple. (Not speaking on experience here!)

The whole story seems to shifty to me. I do think if he was totally innocent he would do a lie detector! That always makes me think guilt. I know they are not 100% and can give false reading but its just the question I'm interested in not the actually results. The fact if they are willing makes me think they have nothing to hide. When they come up with excuses it makes me think that their is something dodgy. Personally I would never commit a crime but if it came to the opportunity were I had to take the test I defo would.

According to the segment, Judy forgot her ID when she and her husband were supposed to board the plane. She had to take a different flight while her husband went ahead without her. It could be a coincidence, but it could have also been Judy trying to avoid making the trip with her husband in the first place.

Apparently she did return to the airport and use the flight she said she was going to take.

If the husband did it, he must be a master manipulator for everything to work out the way it did. I don't think most human beings have that level of foresight to schedule goings and landings in foreign places and manage a perfect alibi to land back home in a nice cushion of time. Even if he hired someone, it seems too coincidental that it would work out that way.

Sort of like Mike Reimer shooting his wife and then himself, then disposing of his weapon after already being dead. There are pieces missing.

I just don't think that's what happened.

I just don't think that's what happened.

What do you think happened ?

The husband was in conferences all day long. I don't see how he would have been able to kill her, drive all the way to North Carolina and get rid of her body, and then be back in Philly in time for his conferences. There were also legitimate sightings of her in North Carolina while her husband was still in Philadelphia. It's impossible for him to have been involved.

It's impossible for him to have been involved.

Nothing is IMPOSSIBLE ... unlikely you might say, but anything can happen. And stranger things have happened!

Nothing is IMPOSSIBLE ... unlikely you might say, but anything can happen. And stranger things have happened!

It is impossible. People saw Judith Smith in Asheville, NC on the day Jeff was in Philadelphia attending work conferences. Judith's remains were later found in Asheville. Jeff's movements on the day she disappeared were well documented because he was in Philly at the conferences. Even after the day she went missing, he searched Philadelphia by taxi, called hospitals and police departments, and even reported her missing to the Philadelphia police. All of these things were verified. Jeff's conference was over at 5:00 p.m. on the night she went missing, and then he reported her missing to Philly PD the next day. That gives him roughly less than 12-14 hours (and that's giving him the benefit of the doubt that he didn't report Judy missing until the next evening after she vanished) to travel from Philadelphia to Asheville, find Judy, kill Judy, hide her body, and then drive all the way back to Philly to report her missing (all the while calling hospitals and other police departments along the way). It's impossible.

The whole story seems to shifty to me. I do think if he was totally innocent he would do a lie detector! That always makes me think guilt. I know they are not 100% and can give false reading but its just the question I'm interested in not the actually results. The fact if they are willing makes me think they have nothing to hide. When they come up with excuses it makes me think that their is something dodgy. Personally I would never commit a crime but if it came to the opportunity were I had to take the test I defo would.

I wouldn't if the polygraph was administered by the lowest investigatory agency. I'd agree to one administered by the FBI or maybe even the state, but never the local police.

I wouldn't if the polygraph was administered by the lowest investigatory agency. I'd agree to one administered by the FBI or maybe even the state, but never the local police.


Then your GUILTY of something!!!
... Was it you ? =D

Then your GUILTY of something!!!
... Was it you ? =D

If you mean guilty of not wanting a person who either A) isn't well-trained to administer a polygraph, or B) does not maintain his or her administration skills that works for an agency with an absolute vested interest in finding a suspect as his or her career (or the next election) depends on it, then you're absolutely correct. I would rather Billy Joe down at the Swamp County Sheriff's Department NOT be the one giving me a polygraph exam, thanks anyway.

I absolutely support the police, but I'm not about to give all agencies the thumbs-up for purity and correctness in practice.

I don't think the wife planned to go to Philadelphia with her husband. I think that there were problems in the marriage and she originally planned to spend the time that her husband was in Philadelphia with her lover in Asheville. Sometime before the conferences in Philadelphia, I think her husband (or her) started to initiate the healing process. The two had probably worked on the marriage in the days leading up to the Philadelphia trip. When the husband asked her to go to Philadelphia, I think she was caught off-guard, but this is her husband and it would have been difficult for her to say no since she didn't have anything planned.

I think the wife wanted the marriage to work out. I don't think she was having an affair because she wanted out of her marriage or because she was just an adulterer. I think she needed emotional support and all she had been getting from her husband was neglect or abuse.

So the wife is planning to go to Asheville for a rendezvous with her lover and her husband springs the idea of her going to Philadelphia with him at the last minute. She has a choice to make, but since she wants the relationship to work, she goes to Philadelphia. I think she had every intention of never going to Asheville and working on her marriage with her husband in Philadelphia once he brought up the idea of her going to Philadelphia with him.

Once she arrived in Philadelphia, however, I think things changed. I don't think the husband showed much enthusiasm for working on the marriage while there, or at the very least he told her that he would not have much time for her. It's possible that his schedule became much more full upon arriving and there was nothing he could do. I think this upset his wife and sent her into a downward spiral. Just as before, she retreated into the arms of another man who was waiting to provide her with the emotional support she needed.

Once in Asheville, I think she had a change of heart completely. I think she's dead in the woods because she went on a walk with her lover and explained to him that she wanted her marriage to work and that this would be the last get-together that the two of them would be having. At that point, I think her lover killed her, buried some of her items (because he does "care" for her, remember) and disembarked back to his hometown. It's possible that he was from the same area as the married couple and simply returned like nothing had happened.

I don't think the wife planned to go to Philadelphia with her husband. I think that there were problems in the marriage and she originally planned to spend the time that her husband was in Philadelphia with her lover in Asheville. Sometime before the conferences in Philadelphia, I think her husband (or her) started to initiate the healing process. The two had probably worked on the marriage in the days leading up to the Philadelphia trip. When the husband asked her to go to Philadelphia, I think she was caught off-guard, but this is her husband and it would have been difficult for her to say no since she didn't have anything planned.

I think the wife wanted the marriage to work out. I don't think she was having an affair because she wanted out of her marriage or because she was just an adulterer. I think she needed emotional support and all she had been getting from her husband was neglect or abuse.

So the wife is planning to go to Asheville for a rendezvous with her lover and her husband springs the idea of her going to Philadelphia with him at the last minute. She has a choice to make, but since she wants the relationship to work, she goes to Philadelphia. I think she had every intention of never going to Asheville and working on her marriage with her husband in Philadelphia once he brought up the idea of her going to Philadelphia with him.

Once she arrived in Philadelphia, however, I think things changed. I don't think the husband showed much enthusiasm for working on the marriage while there, or at the very least he told her that he would not have much time for her. It's possible that his schedule became much more full upon arriving and there was nothing he could do. I think this upset his wife and sent her into a downward spiral. Just as before, she retreated into the arms of another man who was waiting to provide her with the emotional support she needed.

Once in Asheville, I think she had a change of heart completely. I think she's dead in the woods because she went on a walk with her lover and explained to him that she wanted her marriage to work and that this would be the last get-together that the two of them would be having. At that point, I think her lover killed her, buried some of her items (because he does "care" for her, remember) and disembarked back to his hometown. It's possible that he was from the same area as the married couple and simply returned like nothing had happened.

Excellent theory. I agree that she went to Asheville with a specific purpose, to meet someone.

Excellent theory. I agree that she went to Asheville with a specific purpose, to meet someone.
I am brand new to this, I see that it is quite old, but I came across it after 2 murders in Oregon and I was researching the name Judith Smith. After reading the complete string, I think you ladies hit the nail on the head. Only married 5 months, trouble in paradise, no I D taken to airport to catch a plane(deliberate), different back pack, stabbing is a crime of passion and anger. Ex or someone she was taking to online while she was dating her husband. They started fighting again, missed the plane on purpose, went to break it off, other man was very angry he was being led on. Killed her, got his blood on her back pack, didn't think anyone would remember color or her sunglasses, my husband of 25 years wouldn't. Left all money etc which was a mistake because then it for sure want a robbery or abduction. Police should search her journals, emails, online dating sites. This man probably feels really guilty and wants th be caught.

I think you ladies hit the nail on the head.

:eek: I've been a woman this whole time?!

You know what I thought was strange? That they got married after 10 years and three kids. Why get married then? Especially when things couldn't have been that great between them if they were on the verge of divorce after five months.

Left all money etc which was a mistake because then it for sure want a robbery or abduction. Police should search her journals, emails, online dating sites.

Judy's wallet, with her ID, credit and phone cards, and possibly a small amount of cash, was missing, as well as the jewelry she was wearing, which included her wedding and diamond engagement rings. The cash that was located with her body was concealed in two places. One article mentions that Judy was not computer literate, but that she and her husband did have separate phone lines.

Certainly the other man theory isn't impossible, but there's been no evidence discovered that lends credence to it. I'd expect phone records, bank/credit card statements or Judy's friends to have confirmed or at least had suspicions if there was an ongoing extramarital affair. The lack of any kind of evidence indicating an affair partner doesn't seem typical for a crime of passion, but then nothing strikes me as typical about this case. The friend interviewed on UM had her opinion of the marriage, but Judy's daughter believed that Judy and Jeff were very happy together. Similar to Su Ya Kim's homicide, Judy might have been a completely random target, with her location, isolation and possibly her gender being the principal factors in her becoming a victim.

:eek: I've been a woman this whole time?!
Mystery solved! :lol:

Judy's wallet, with her ID, credit and phone cards, and possibly a small amount of cash, was missing, as well as the jewelry she was wearing, which included her wedding and diamond engagement rings. The cash that was located with her body was concealed in two places. One article mentions that Judy was not computer literate, but that she and her husband did have separate phone lines.

Certainly the other man theory isn't impossible, but there's been no evidence discovered that lends credence to it. I'd expect phone records, bank/credit card statements or Judy's friends to have confirmed or at least had suspicions if there was an ongoing extramarital affair. The lack of any kind of evidence indicating an affair partner doesn't seem typical for a crime of passion, but then nothing strikes me as typical about this case. The friend interviewed on UM had her opinion of the marriage, but Judy's daughter believed that Judy and Jeff were very happy together. Similar to Su Ya Kim's homicide, Judy might have been a completely random target, with her location, isolation and possibly her gender being the principal factors in her becoming a victim.

But it doesn't necessarily have to be an ongoing affair. She could have met this person online, and her trip to Asheville could have been their very first encounter.

But it doesn't necessarily have to be an ongoing affair. She could have met this person online, and her trip to Asheville could have been their very first encounter.

I'd be more open to the meet up theory if family or friends had mentioned suspicions about Judy interacting with other men, or evidence was found in her accounts that suggested she was hiding a friendship from her family, but this doesn't seem to have been the case. Certainly some people can be pretty adept at hiding their extramarital behaviors initially, but all that we know for certain is that Judy's loved ones did not believe she was computer literate and her friend, who didn't have rosy notions about the marriage, mentioned that there was not a mystery man. Nor have the investigators ever stated that they found evidence of interactions, online or otherwise, between Judy and other men.

Going off on a trip without notifying her spouse first, while not the most considerate behavior, doesn't automatically default to her rendezvousing with another man. As an assertive, self reliant woman who had hiked and traveled solo (her family's description), it wouldn't be that terribly out of character for her to decide to strike off on her own, rather than hang around in Philadelphia. Of course, she may have been more open to chatting with strangers that she encountered on her trip.

I'd be more open to the meet up theory if family or friends had mentioned suspicions about Judy interacting with other men, or evidence was found in her accounts that suggested she was hiding a friendship from her family, but this doesn't seem to have been the case. Certainly some people can be pretty adept at hiding their extramarital behaviors initially, but all that we know for certain is that Judy's loved ones did not believe she was computer literate and her friend, who didn't have rosy notions about the marriage, mentioned that there was not a mystery man. Nor have the investigators ever stated that they found evidence of interactions, online or otherwise, between Judy and other men.

I thought the segment only had her friend mention that their relationship was rocky, and that she hinted around that she didn't like Jeff. I don't remember any mention of her saying their wasn't a mystery man. And if there was, it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility for her friend not to have known.

Going off on a trip without notifying her spouse first, while not the most considerate behavior, doesn't automatically default to her rendezvousing with another man. As an assertive, self reliant woman who had hiked and traveled solo (her family's description), it wouldn't be that terribly out of character for her to decide to strike off on her own, rather than hang around in Philadelphia. Of course, she may have been more open to chatting with strangers that she encountered on her trip.

But that is highly unusual behavior. She told her husband she was going to take a bus tour through Philadelphia while he was attending his conferences. He even took a taxi cab on the bus route she was supposed to take when she didn't return to the motel room. Sure she could have went hiking and traveled solo on her own, but she at least notified someone where she was going. She flat out lied to her husband. Had she changed her mind for whatever reason, she could have left a note. Nothing was left behind to let Jeff know where she took off to. That's very suspicious behavior.

Does anyone have more info on this? Was Gary Hilton the serial killer they thought may have had something to do with Judy's killer?

Found this article: http://articles.philly.com/1997-10-05/news/25540618_1_detectives-medical-examiner-crime-scene

Interesting tidbits:

-Asheville has a large gay population. The detectives actually thought that might have been a reason as to why Judy would've traveled there. Some believe it to be a red herring in the case.
-The Philadelphia PD could not find anyone besides Jeff who could verify that Judy was ever in Philadelphia. This is not that unusual, considering she took a later flight to the city, and would have been there for roughly 8-10 hours before leaving the city.
-Jeff and Judy had visited Durham, NC earlier that year. Jeff fell in love with the city, and applied for two teaching jobs in NC. So there is a connection to Judy and NC it seems.

This article is also interesting: http://citypaper.net/articles/100997/cb.buncombe.shtml

The NC detectives did not consider Jeff a suspect at the time, but the Philadelphia police actually did, which I found pretty shocking. The NC detectives believe that Judy came to Asheville on her own, and that was why they do not consider Jeff a suspect.

And this article: http://citypaper.net/articles/071797/article010.shtml

Seems to suggest that there was a credible sighting of Judy in New Jersey at a clothing store. Judy was acting strange, and was sighted wearing her red backpack. Jeff hired a private investigator who looked into the sighting, and he believed it was credible. If credible, this sighting would put the theory of her driving to Asheville with a purpose to bed...if she was seen acting disoriented in NJ, she was probably not in the right frame of mind to go to Asheville and meet someone on her own.

bump

Genuinely curious as to how she traveled all the way to NC. Did her killer pick her up in Philly, or somewhere in between?

Genuinely curious as to how she traveled all the way to NC. Did her killer pick her up in Philly, or somewhere in between?

You would think if she took a bus, train or plane down there, there would have been a credit card or other trail, videotape from a terminal, etc. I would like to think the police and/or private investigator explored this angle but do not recall if it was mentioned in the segment. Anyone remember?

You would think if she took a bus, train or plane down there, there would have been a credit card or other trail, videotape from a terminal, etc. I would like to think the police and/or private investigator explored this angle but do not recall if it was mentioned in the segment. Anyone remember?

From what I remember, they were unable to find a paper trail that took her outside of Philly.

You would think if she took a bus, train or plane down there, there would have been a credit card or other trail, videotape from a terminal, etc. I would like to think the police and/or private investigator explored this angle but do not recall if it was mentioned in the segment. Anyone remember?

There's been no evidence of how Judy traveled to Asheville. Her American Express card wasn't used after her trip to Philadelphia, there were no withdrawals from her bank accounts and she had around $200 in cash with her (some money was found in clothing and in the blue/blue-black backpack). What's interesting is that she allegedly left around $500 in cash in Jeff's hotel room; possibly she planned on returning within a few days.

Was listening to a true crime podcast that did an episode on Gary Hilton. Honestly, as soon as they reached the part of the story where it became evident that he was a serial killer, my mind IMMEDIATELY went to the case of Judy Smith. According to Judy Smith's wiki page, Gary Hilton was considered because he "had left one of his victims in a similar condition near where Smith's body was discovered."

That seems pretty damning to me, but further down in the article, it states:
"It has also been suggested that she might have encountered a local serial killer who had less than a year earlier left the raped and murdered body of one of his victims tied to a tree not far away. However, that killer, Gary Michael Hilton, was later arrested and convicted of that crime as well as several other killings on hiking trails in national forests in the southern Appalachian Mountains during the 2000s, and has not been linked to Smith's killing"

Isn't it extremely unlikely for there to be a serial killer walking around and committing crimes in an area, let alone 2? Using the same dumping area??

Hilton killed Irene and John Bryant in 2007 and left Irene's body in Pisgah forest. The only nearby homicide that I could find that mentions the body being tied to a tree is Karen Styles. (https://www.citizen-times.com/story/news/local/2014/12/23/from-the-archives-retrial-in-karen-styles-killing-ordered/20821597/) In 1994, she was assaulted, murdered and left tied to a tree near the Bent Creek recreation area by Richard Jackson, who was convicted of the murder.


Isn't it extremely unlikely for there to be a serial killer walking around and committing crimes in an area, let alone 2? Using the same dumping area??

Not really. Hilton is still a good suspect for Smith's murder, but any number of murders and disappearances were occurring in the region before and after her homicide. Someone has a google map (https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1v-4PyOHDjE17GhkF6ofEvFWtLes&gl=us&ie=UTF8&oe=UTF8&msa=0&ll=35.58281676706828%2C-82.30815242187498&z=5) of both known victims of Hilton and unsolved murders and disappearances. Hilton probably committed more murders than any one knows about but I doubt he was the only serial murderer around there.

The wikipedia page for Judy mentions how she would sometimes travel to visit former patients of hers. Brings a new possibility to the reason as to why she went to Asheville and was found to be wearing hiking clothing.

Hilton killed Irene and John Bryant in 2007 and left Irene's body in Pisgah forest. The only nearby homicide that I could find that mentions the body being tied to a tree is Karen Styles. (https://www.citizen-times.com/story/news/local/2014/12/23/from-the-archives-retrial-in-karen-styles-killing-ordered/20821597/) In 1994, she was assaulted, murdered and left tied to a tree near the Bent Creek recreation area by Richard Jackson, who was convicted of the murder.



Not really. Hilton is still a good suspect for Smith's murder, but any number of murders and disappearances were occurring in the region before and after her homicide. Someone has a google map (https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1v-4PyOHDjE17GhkF6ofEvFWtLes&gl=us&ie=UTF8&oe=UTF8&msa=0&ll=35.58281676706828%2C-82.30815242187498&z=5) of both known victims of Hilton and unsolved murders and disappearances. Hilton probably committed more murders than any one knows about but I doubt he was the only serial murderer around there.

That map is really helpful! Thanks!

Take this with a grain of salt, but I was reading a thread over on reddit and this case was mentioned by someone theorizing that Judy may have experienced a medical condition (like early dementia) and that was the reason as to why she traveled to North Carolina seemingly on a whim. But one of the comments mentioned a possible tryst with a male lover, and someone said that if she was in Asheville for a tryst, it would have been with a woman, because Asheville has a large gay population (which was also mentioned in one of the articles linked a few pages back). Multiple witnesses place her driving around in a gray colored sedan in the Asheville area shortly after she was last seen by Jeff in Philadelphia. Who's car was this? It had to have been whoever she was meeting, IMO. Also, Judy was wearing thermal underwear and hiking boots and was found near a hiking trail. How did she get to this trail and where did the car go?

One of the pieces of evidence that the NC police used to rule out Jeff as a suspect was the location of where her body was found. It was said to have been found down a steep hill in the Pisgah National Forest, and that Jeff was in no shape to have moved her body there. They also said that they doubt someone fit could have moved her body through that rough of a terrain, so that makes me think that whoever killed her did it very close to where her remains were eventually found. One other odd tidbit that LE released seemingly randomly: they mention that the closest house to where Judy's remains were found was once a "haven for lesbians".

One other aspect of this case which has always been in the back of my mind:

What if they misidentified the body? Dental records have been wrong (https://wgntv.com/news/after-40-years-dna-results-show-michael-marino-is-not-gacy-victim/) before, and to my knowledge, they have never ran a DNA test on the remains. I know it's a far out there theory, but it would explain why this woman (who the ME initially believed was there for 2 years) had a different backpack and different articles of clothing than Judy did at the time of her disappearance.

Hilton killed Irene and John Bryant in 2007 and left Irene's body in Pisgah forest. The only nearby homicide that I could find that mentions the body being tied to a tree is Karen Styles. (https://www.citizen-times.com/story/news/local/2014/12/23/from-the-archives-retrial-in-karen-styles-killing-ordered/20821597/) In 1994, she was assaulted, murdered and left tied to a tree near the Bent Creek recreation area by Richard Jackson, who was convicted of the murder.



Not really. Hilton is still a good suspect for Smith's murder, but any number of murders and disappearances were occurring in the region before and after her homicide. Someone has a google map (https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1v-4PyOHDjE17GhkF6ofEvFWtLes&gl=us&ie=UTF8&oe=UTF8&msa=0&ll=35.58281676706828%2C-82.30815242187498&z=5) of both known victims of Hilton and unsolved murders and disappearances. Hilton probably committed more murders than any one knows about but I doubt he was the only serial murderer around there.

I think Hilton is a strong suspect for the Judy smith case. he was a monster, an outdoors person that hung around national forrest areas, and he terrorized many people. a lot of them lived to tell about their creepy encounters with him, and it's unknown how many others did not. But there are a lot more questions to be answered. Like why did Judy go there without telling anyone? That is one mystery. The other mystery is who did this to her? I believe Hilton also took money and other belongings from his victims, although his main motive seemed to be to confront and terrorize people. Judy would have been an easy victim for him. what is odd is that her red backpack was never found and her Identification wasn't found either. it appears that some of the contents in the blue backpack that were found might not have belonged to her.

One other aspect of this case which has always been in the back of my mind:

What if they misidentified the body? Dental records have been wrong (https://wgntv.com/news/after-40-years-dna-results-show-michael-marino-is-not-gacy-victim/) before, and to my knowledge, they have never ran a DNA test on the remains. I know it's a far out there theory, but it would explain why this woman (who the ME initially believed was there for 2 years) had a different backpack and different articles of clothing than Judy did at the time of her disappearance.

On one hand I have a hard time believing that they misidentified her. It all kind of lines up for it to be her if you believe the dental records and the eyewitness accounts in the local area where she was found. it would also line up with the fact that no one locally was immediately looking for her. if it were a local person or someone in that area had a reason to look for her, her body might have been found a lot sooner. so it kind of checks out that there was a delay in finding her body because no one would have thought to look for her in that area.

but where it would make sense to want to further substantiate the identity of the remains: If it is mistaken identity, it would eliminate the question of why she went to North Carolina, which still doesn't make complete sense. Asheville is a nice place to visit so I don't find it odd that someone would want to go there especially if they are into hiking and touristic activities. It would be odd that she did not tell anyone about it though.

One other aspect of this case which has always been in the back of my mind:

What if they misidentified the body? Dental records have been wrong (https://wgntv.com/news/after-40-years-dna-results-show-michael-marino-is-not-gacy-victim/) before, and to my knowledge, they have never ran a DNA test on the remains. I know it's a far out there theory, but it would explain why this woman (who the ME initially believed was there for 2 years) had a different backpack and different articles of clothing than Judy did at the time of her disappearance.

This is my assessment as well. The most obvious explanation is the body was misidentified.

As for going to Asheville for some hot Sapphic love, Boston is in between two gay hotspots: Northampton and Provincetown. She didn’t have to travel that far.

This is my assessment as well. The most obvious explanation is the body was misidentified.

As for going to Asheville for some hot Sapphic love, Boston is in between two gay hotspots: Northampton and Provincetown. She didn’t have to travel that far.

I don't think she was misidentified, although it is possible. I think she went there to hike and probably was out of her element. she would have made an easy victim for a murderer, but there is also a chance that she could have been in over her head and died on the trail. those things happen to hikers when there is poor planning and when they don't tell others of their location.

I never really bought into her hiking anywhere. Didn't look like someone who would relish physical activity.

Also, if you're married to Jeff Smith and your hobbies include hiking, your relationship isn't going to last a decade. I'm sorry to state the obvious, but this thread has gone on for over a decade and 7 pages without anyone mentioning some pretty harsh realities.

I never really bought into her hiking anywhere. Didn't look like someone who would relish physical activity.

Also, if you're married to Jeff Smith and your hobbies include hiking, your relationship isn't going to last a decade. I'm sorry to state the obvious, but this thread has gone on for over a decade and 7 pages without anyone mentioning some pretty harsh realities.

No one is ignoring those realities, although, I know plenty of couples who have individual hobbies and I know plenty of fat people who hike. Those realities were even covered in the segment.

No one is ignoring those realities, although, I know plenty of couples who have individual hobbies and I know plenty of fat people who hike. Those realities were even covered in the segment.
I agree. You can indeed be overweight and still hike. It is actually a lot more common than people realize. Asheville is an attractive destination in the Appalachia. there is hiking, shopping, and other attractions that make it a unique place. It is kind of known as a hipster town nowadays. It would make sense for her to go there as a get away trip, but still doesn't explain why she did not tell anyone. My guess is she wanted to get away and if she mentioned it to her family they would all have discouraged her from going alone because of the danger. Most hiking disappearances have one thing in common: people don't tell anyone where they are going so no one knows where to look for them. Lone hiking can be very dangerous. the one thing you should do before a hike is tell someone where you are going and give them your trail information if possible.

I also go back to the dental recognition. could that have been mistaken? dental identification seemed to be a common method of ID. what are the chances of mistaken ID?

After thinking about this case for years, the only conclusion that makes sense is that the remains found in Asheville were not Judy's. The Phildelphia police never ruled out her husband as a suspect, and the clothing and backpack found with the remains identified as Judy's were not something that she had previously owned or wore.

One odd aspect of the story is the doctor who claims that he connected a missing persons flyer of Judy to the remains found in Asheville; but this doctor was based out of Franklin, NC. If Jeff distributed the flyers in NC, this would tell me that he believed there was a possibility that she would have traveled there. The only problem is that there is no paper trail of her after Jeff's last sighting in their hotel room in Philadelphia. There are two witnesses, one says she asked him about catching a bus and the other was a bus driver who claimed to have dropped her off near the hotel at around 3:00 the same afternoon Jeff claims to have last seen her alive. If these sightings are credible, IMO, she never left the Philadelphia area voluntarily.

One other aspect of this case which has always been in the back of my mind:

What if they misidentified the body? Dental records have been wrong (https://wgntv.com/news/after-40-years-dna-results-show-michael-marino-is-not-gacy-victim/) before, and to my knowledge, they have never ran a DNA test on the remains. I know it's a far out there theory, but it would explain why this woman (who the ME initially believed was there for 2 years) had a different backpack and different articles of clothing than Judy did at the time of her disappearance.

Back on June 7, 2016, I posted the following in this (https://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=210252&highlight=judy+smith) thread:

I listened to RobinW's podcast about this case (The Trail Went Cold). Always been one of the most perplexing.

What is most intriguing about this case has always been: what was she doing there? There is no apparent record of her travel there, and no reason has ever been discovered as to why she would have been where she was found. Maybe it's because I was listening to a description of what was found, rather than watching something on the case, but what struck me in RobinW's retelling was that the backpack found with her was not the famous "red" backpack, but a blue one. I know she was also found with a wedding ring.

The thought I had listening to the podcast, which I'd never had before, is: what if this isn't Judy Smith at all? I know it's a long shot, but bear with me. I thought it was an episode of Forensic Files I'd "listened" to in my car once, but if it was I can't find it - in any case, I once listened to some case wherein dental records were either used inappropriately or were not properly read or something. In the case in question, a body was misidentified.

I wonder if a second, independent look at the dental records might be warranted in this case. I say this because there is no earthly reason anyone can think of why Judy should have been where she was. And, aside from those dental records, how could she be identified? I know there was a wedding ring, but if you asked me to ID my wife's wedding band out of context from among several, I might have a hard time myself, and I bought that one. Could I swear if I saw it by itself that it was DEFINITELY the one I bought her? Maybe, and my wife's is fairly distinctive. If it were even slightly more generic, I might have a hard time.

I know there is the fairly credible-sounding eyewitness who purported to have a conversation with a woman from Boston near to where Judy's body was found - but I wonder if there might not have been some confirmation bias involved. It would depend on how the question was asked. For example, it strikes me as possible this conversation did indeed take place - and that it was NOT with the woman found on the mountain. That there was, in other words, some Judy from Boston in the area, and this had nothing to do with the body found up the hiking trail. I can also think of lots of other possibilities about how that story may deconstruct, even if it is Judy's body that was found. Eyewitnesses and all.

It was the absence of the red backpack that got me to thinking - if she did leave on her own, as the story as it stands suggests she did, at least to a point - that backpack would have been the only thing she had with her, it would have contained all of her valuables. What happened to it? Why was a blue one there instead? With money in it? The presence of the blue one suggests no robbery, but then where is the red backpack? And was Judy much of a hiker? Would she have even been inclined to go to this remote location where she was found? I don't get much of an indication from the segment she would have.

It's a long shot, that had never occurred to me before listening to RobinW's segment, but I do wonder if it might not be worth just taking a second, independent look at the dentals to see if it can be independently confirmed that it really was her up there. Honestly, the case in many ways would make more sense if it wasn't.

RobinW even responded. So you're not alone, TheCars1986!

You guys are definitely not alone. I doubt it was Judy as well.

The remains were conveniently cremated, so there's not even a way of checking for DNA evidence. I would love to know why this was not done back then. Yes, DNA was fairly new at the time, but far from brand new. It would have been so simple to pull a sample from the remains to come to a definite conclusion as opposed to the antiquated, inexact method of comparing dental records.

I can't believe the reasoning used by the people on Reddit who stand on the side of the body being Judy's. "The body had evidence of an arthritic knee!". How common is that?! "She was carrying cash!". When were these people born, 2010? Everybody carried cash up until a few years ago. Many still do. I even believe that some said, "Jeff confirmed the amount of cash was correct!". OK, that just makes no sense whatsoever. There's no way a person in 1997 traveling a great distance over a period of many days would have a similar amount of cash on their person as when they were last seen. The only way for that ridiculous notion to be valid would be if she either had a separate stash of money on her person and solely took from it (why?!) or withdrew money from ATMs along her route (again, inexplicably not touching the money she left Philly with?!). If the latter, there would have been an electronic record. Also, how/why would Jeff know the amount of money she had on her person to be so certain, and who says, "Yup, it's got to be her! She had $147 in her wallet!"?

Who ordered the remains cremated? Were these Judy's explicit wishes in the event of her death, or did Jeff order this to be done on his own request? That would be interesting to know. While I never suspected Jeff initially, I have started to wonder over time. I still feel that he was too morbidly mammoth of a man to be able to dispose of a body on his own.

If it wasn't Jeff, then I wonder if he had reached a point of exhaustion and simply needed to accept a non-definitive conclusion as a means to move on, much like John Walsh and his wife seemed to do with Adam.

I just want to know why a doctor 65 miles away from Asheville heard about the remains being found and jumped to the conclusion that maybe they were Judy's because of a missing persons poster he saw. A reddit post says he saw the missing poster flyer come over on a fax and he saw the detail about the arthritic knee and made the possible connection to the remains found in Asheville. I wish the remains were never cremated so we could get a definitive answer, but if the woman found in Asheville wasn't Judy, who was this person?

Though I had never previously considered it, I have to agree with you all that there is serious doubt these remains are actually Judy’s.

It doesn't surprise me that a physician in Franklin would be aware of a body found near Asheville since Franklin is definitely in the Asheville media market and the area around Asheville to the TN border in western NC is kind of one big gaggle of fairly connected communities despite the physical distance they might have from one another. What I do find intriguing is how that physician came across a missing poster for Judy Smith in the first place. Were the posters distributed all over the east coast or nationally? Had the doctor recently traveled? That part of the story seems kind of strange to me. I read that it wasn't that the poster was faxed to the doctor, but that he/she first came across the poster at some point and then faxed the Philadelphia Police a news article about the body being found in Buncombe Co.

Meg,

If you recall, Jeff spoke of sending out thousands of them, so a copy finding its way practically anywhere wouldn't be at all surprising. I'm remembering him using the number 5,000 (without going back to verify). If you wished to revisit the segment, he gave further details on distribution.

Meg,

If you recall, Jeff spoke of sending out thousands of them, so a copy finding its way practically anywhere wouldn't be at all surprising. I'm remembering him using the number 5,000 (without going back to verify). If you wished to revisit the segment, he gave further details on distribution.

Thanks, I hadn't seen the segment in a while so I appreciate the refresher.

So that part's not so mysterious. Maybe the found body was fresh on the doc's mind and the detail about the right knee arthritis was what prompted the contact with Philly. But it's so true--arthritic knees are a dime a dozen, especially if you're in the healthcare business.

It's such a weird case.

It doesn't surprise me that a physician in Franklin would be aware of a body found near Asheville since Franklin is definitely in the Asheville media market and the area around Asheville to the TN border in western NC is kind of one big gaggle of fairly connected communities despite the physical distance they might have from one another. What I do find intriguing is how that physician came across a missing poster for Judy Smith in the first place. Were the posters distributed all over the east coast or nationally? Had the doctor recently traveled? That part of the story seems kind of strange to me. I read that it wasn't that the poster was faxed to the doctor, but that he/she first came across the poster at some point and then faxed the Philadelphia Police a news article about the body being found in Buncombe Co.

The UM segment says that Judy's family believed she suffered some sort of an accident and was wandering around not aware of who she was or where she was and also that some friends thought she ditched her old life to start a new one. The segment says that Jeff created 9,000 flyers and mailed/faxed them "from Maine to Florida", so that's probably where the doctor in Franklin would have seen it.

What is still bizarre to me is that all of the witnesses who claim to have seen Judy in or around Asheville all say she was wearing her red backpack (and IIRC one of the witnesses had a conversation with her about being from Boston and how her husband was an attorney at a convention in Philadelphia), but the remains were found with a blue backpack and thermal underwear. Judy's friend in the segment makes a cryptic remark about there not being another man in her life, but that she could see why Judy would up and leave Philadelphia and travel to get away from Jeff (Judy's daughter is adamant that she would have never done this).

I could see a realistic scenario where Judy is annoyed with Jeff or felt pressured into going to Philadelphia with him and on a whim she decides to travel down to North Carolina where she's seen at various shops interracting with people. What I can't wrap my head around is while she was there, she became acquainted with someone to the point where she would have bought hiking gear and gone for a hike with this person who ultimately murdered her for reasons unknown. The victim was stabbed multiple times, which usually indicates a crime of passion.

I was thinking about this case today and was wondering if there were any missing people closer to the area where the remains were found and came across this (https://namus.nij.ojp.gov/case/MP2524) woman named Diane Marie Kennedy, who lived about 30 miles west of Asheville. She went missing on New Year's Eve in 1996 and has never been seen again. There's virtually nothing online about this woman but I did find it to be a remarkable coincidence that the remains that were identified as Judy's had "extensive dental work" and Diane had worked in the dental field as a technician her entire career. Diane also lived in Massachusetts at one point, and is 1" off in height and her weight (145-175 lbs.) is within Judy's range (155 lbs. is shown on the missing persons poster in the UM segment).

I'm not saying that this woman was the remains of those identified as Judy's, but I still find it weird that the remains were cremated to where we'll never know 100% for sure if they were hers.